2007 BDP-MBSL Bidding Thread (1 Viewer)

[mustacheman]

I originally thought someone actually valued the 1st pick @ 6.0 because someone actually bet into that spot at that value. Now it is becoming painfully clear that because we were able to trade down spots, being thrust into the #1 will become a repeating cycle initiated by someone over inflating the #1 pick value- whether by design or by chance- only to bid down themselves. I hate to say this but the real exercise in perceived/actual value would only occur if someone put mustacheman back into the #1 slot @ 6.0. If he does not agree to stay in the spot, despite the narrowing gap in value between the #1-#7 slot, then he truly did not believe that the value of the #1 pick is 6.0. Thus ruining this exercise. Maybe LHUCKS was right.

The value of a pick (such as the #1 pick) can only be evaluated RELATIVE TO OTHER PICKS. i.e., the #1 pick has to give up 6.0 points/week, but that number is useless in a vacuum without the context of what the other picks are giving up in points/week. The value of a pick is not "6.0" but rather a more complex calculation involving the relative difference between what other spots are giving up and what players people estimate will be available at those spots in the draft.The #1 pick should actually be MORE attractive to people now as the cost of the pick is less than it was when I originally bid out of the spot due to the cost of other picks going up since then.

 

[mustacheman]

I originally thought someone actually valued the 1st pick @ 6.0 because someone actually bet into that spot at that value. Now it is becoming painfully clear that because we were able to trade down spots, being thrust into the #1 will become a repeating cycle initiated by someone over inflating the #1 pick value- whether by design or by chance- only to bid down themselves. I hate to say this but the real exercise in perceived/actual value would only occur if someone put mustacheman back into the #1 slot @ 6.0. If he does not agree to stay in the spot, despite the narrowing gap in value between the #1-#7 slot, then he truly did not believe that the value of the #1 pick is 6.0. Thus ruining this exercise. Maybe LHUCKS was right.

Or that there's really not as much of a value to having a high spot as Lhucks intially complained about which was the genisis for this league.

 

[LHUCKS]

Or that there's really not as much of a value to having a high spot as Lhucks intially complained about which was the genisis for this league.

If I thought the value was that much greater don't you think I would just stay in the top spot? Perhaps you should come out West for a real education.

 

[LHUCKS]

The value of a pick (such as the #1 pick) can only be evaluated RELATIVE TO OTHER PICKS. i.e., the #1 pick has to give up 6.0 points/week, but that number is useless in a vacuum without the context of what the other picks are giving up in points/week. The value of a pick is not "6.0" but rather a more complex calculation involving the relative difference between what other spots are giving up and what players people estimate will be available at those spots in the draft.

The #1 pick should actually be MORE attractive to people now as the cost of the pick is less than it was when I originally bid out of the spot due to the cost of other picks going up since then.

This is true. I still don't want it, but the #1 pick is woth more now than when mustache put his original bid in.BostonFred and I have already state the problem with this process...it can certainly be improved upon.

I'd suggest a silent bidding process...bidding on each position one at a time, beginning with the top spot and moving down from there.

Yes, I'm smarter than everyone.

 

[LHUCKS]

With that said - I think the loopholes are all now exposed and the powers that be (BnB, Rad, and other organizers around here) will adjust going forward. With a couple of small addendums to the bid process, I think this will play out nicely in the future.Looking forward to drafting vs. you crafty vets and seeing this play out.

Agreed.

 

[mustacheman]

The value of a pick (such as the #1 pick) can only be evaluated RELATIVE TO OTHER PICKS. i.e., the #1 pick has to give up 6.0 points/week, but that number is useless in a vacuum without the context of what the other picks are giving up in points/week. The value of a pick is not "6.0" but rather a more complex calculation involving the relative difference between what other spots are giving up and what players people estimate will be available at those spots in the draft.

The #1 pick should actually be MORE attractive to people now as the cost of the pick is less than it was when I originally bid out of the spot due to the cost of other picks going up since then.

This is true. I still don't want it, but the #1 pick is woth more now than when mustache put his original bid in.BostonFred and I have already state the problem with this process...it can certainly be improved upon.

I'd suggest a silent bidding process...bidding on each position one at a time, beginning with the top spot and moving down from there.

Yes, I'm smarter than everyone.

Bidding on one pick at a time in a linear fashion (as you've suggested) doesn't take into account the dynamic nature of draft pick value. If pick #1 goes for 9 points, pick #2 for 4 points and pick #3 for 1 point, the relative value of picks 4-16 change as each pick goes off the board. You've also eliminated people from the bidding process as they secure picks...is having 2 people bid on the value of pick #15 really efficient? What is the rationale for having 14 people bid on pick #3 vs. only having 3 people bid on pick #14? Does pick #16 automatically go for 0 points?I think there are better processes for gauging the relative (perceived) value of draft picks.

 

[The Ref]

1. BostonFred or Sub - 6.0

2. radballs - 4.0

3. ShadowMaster - 2.00

4. Valence - 1.95

5. The Ref - 1.40

6. LHUCKS - 1.30

7. Jiggyonthehut - 1.0

8. OldMilwaukee -.75

9. mustacheman - .65

10. wdh76 - 0.50

11. BassNBrew - .40

12. Krazyaero - 0.40

13. joffer - 0.00

14. NorrisB - 0.00

15. Prof Chaos - 0.00

16. jmills - 0.05

 

[BassNBrew]

Or that there's really not as much of a value to having a high spot as Lhucks intially complained about which was the genisis for this league.

If I thought the value was that much greater don't you think I would just stay in the top spot? Perhaps you should come out West for a real education.

Thanks for the invite, but I'll stay back east where we are the ones giving the education.

 

[BassNBrew]

1. BostonFred or Sub - 6.0

2. radballs - 4.0

3. ShadowMaster - 2.00

4. Valence - 1.95

5. The Ref - 1.40

6. LHUCKS - 1.30

7. Jiggyonthehut - 1.0

8. BassNBrew -.80

9. mustacheman - .65

10. wdh76 - 0.50

11. OldMilwaukee - .40

12. Krazyaero - 0.40

13. joffer - 0.00

14. NorrisB - 0.00

15. Prof Chaos - 0.00

16. jmills - 0.05

 

[bostonfred]

1. The Ref - 6.0

2. radballs - 4.0

3. ShadowMaster - 2.00

4. Valence - 1.95

5. BostonFred or Sub - 1.45

6. LHUCKS - 1.30

7. Jiggyonthehut - 1.0

8. BassNBrew -.80

9. mustacheman - .65

10. wdh76 - 0.50

11. OldMilwaukee - .40

12. Krazyaero - 0.40

13. joffer - 0.00

14. NorrisB - 0.00

15. Prof Chaos - 0.00

16. jmills - 0.05

 

[krazyaero]

1. The Ref - 6.0

2. radballs - 4.0

3. ShadowMaster - 2.00

4. Valence - 1.95

5. BostonFred or Sub - 1.45

6. LHUCKS - 1.30

7. Jiggyonthehut - 1.0

8. BassNBrew -.80

9. mustacheman - .65

10. wdh76 - 0.50

11. OldMilwaukee - .40

12. jmills - 0.40

13. joffer - 0.00

14. NorrisB - 0.00

15. Prof Chaos - 0.00

16. krazyaero - 0.10

edited highlights

 

[BassNBrew]

1. The Ref - 6.0

2. radballs - 4.0

3. ShadowMaster - 2.00

4. Valence - 1.95

5. BostonFred or Sub - 1.45

6. LHUCKS - 1.30

7. Jiggyonthehut - 1.0

8. BassNBrew -.80

9. mustacheman - .65

10. wdh76 - 0.50

11. OldMilwaukee - .40

12. jmills - 0.40

13. joffer - 0.00

14. NorrisB - 0.00

15. Prof Chaos - 0.00

16. krazyaero - 0.10

No changes....just a clean copy

 

[BassNBrew]

1. The Ref - 6.02. radballs - 4.03. ShadowMaster - 2.004. Valence - 1.955. BostonFred or Sub - 1.456. LHUCKS - 1.307. Jiggyonthehut - 1.08. BassNBrew -.809. mustacheman - .6510. wdh76 - 0.5011. OldMilwaukee - .4012. jmills - 0.4013. joffer - 0.0014. NorrisB - 0.0015. Prof Chaos - 0.0016. krazyaero - 0.10No changes....just a clean copy

This should be final.

 

[bostonfred]

Sorry, Ref, but I actually wanted the #5 pick most of all. I almost kept #1 because I wouldn't mind starting with Tomlinson, but I really think there's a dropoff just after picks 5 and 28, which gives me the last two players in each of their respective tiers.

 

[radballs]

Let's fire this thing up.

 

[LHUCKS]

Let's fire this thing up.

Although the process was flawed I'm happy with the results...I think spots 3-8 were undervalued a bit but all in all not too bad.

 

[BassNBrew]

Let's fire this thing up.

Although the process was flawed I'm happy with the results...I think spots 3-8 were undervalued a bit but all in all not too bad.

Needed a flawed process so you'd have an excuse for your upcoming flawed draft...of course we're all happy with the results when you're in the league.

 

[radballs]

Here were the numbers from the first draft a few months ago. I think I got a relative bargain at the 2 spot in the one we just completed.

1. Pictus Cat - 9.00

2. Restless Natives - 7.50

3. Duckboy - 4.80

4. Domination - 3.80

5. Blue-Kun - 3.00

6. Jeff Pasquino - 2.20

7. Orgazmo - 1.50

8. Thom Yorke - 1.15

9. Hear-the-Footsteps - 0.65

10. wannabee - 0.50

11. radballs - 0.15

12. Fiddles - 0.10

13. Valence - 0.15

14. Perry Van Hook - 0.05

15. Team Legacy - 0.00

16. Renesauz - 0.00

 

[bostonfred]

Here's what I was doing. First of all, I think the rule that allowed me to hop from bid to bid was ridiculous, and I would suggest against allowing it in the future. But the first thing that happened to me was that the commish, of all people, used that rule to stick me with the #1 pick at a bid of 6. I didn't really want the #1 pick, especially compared to the other cheap prices, so I bounced around setting the other prices higher. I followed Bass at first, but didn't really care about that - I just knew he'd get pissy about it, and that held a certain intrinsic value that can't be expressed in five hundredths of a point increments. Ultimately, my goal was top make all of the middle picks, which I consider to be the most valuable, more expensive. Then I moved on the pick I really wanted, which was #5. I ended up spending a little more for it than I had originally bid, but I think I flew low enough after my initial flurry of activity that I got the spot I wanted at a good price relative to the spots before and after it. I'm happy with one of the Gore/Addai/Westbrook/Alexander tier, and I'm happy with one of the QBs, backs or receivers that fall to my second round pick. After looking at those two picks, and the players available in my third and beyond, I really felt like #5 was the best spot to be in, so I spent what it took to get there. We'll see how that works out.

 

[The Ref]

This is so dumb. I knew that was going to happen to me, but I was up at 11:15 and just couldn't stay up any later.

 

[krazyaero]

Why are you so grumpy? I'm not. I'm happy.

Cause I had to deal with ####### yankees moving into the Queen city all ####### day. Half of you sonna of a #####es gripe about everything...the other half are so ####### corrupt it's scary. Everytime I talk to a Yankee property owner (especially New Yorkers), it's all about how they can turn the screws to someone and stick it to them. Damn life up there must be misirable. The next time I meet an honest New Yorker it will be the first time.

Wow, yet another hill billie that doesn't realize we let you try to develop this area for over 140 years and, aside from someone finding a big GOLD rock to use as a door stop or the railroad just happening to go through this little town, your most significant contribution was textiles, which now is taken care of overseas. A little gratitude please, Mr. Bass, especially from someone reaping the benefits of the overachieving Yankees blessing this fine city of OURS. Of course, you can always move to Gastonia and keep things SIMPLE the way you like em.

 

[LHUCKS]

This is so dumb. I knew that was going to happen to me, but I was up at 11:15 and just couldn't stay up any later.

I still think the person who bid 6.00 should be stuck with that bid.

 

[mustacheman]

This is so dumb. I knew that was going to happen to me, but I was up at 11:15 and just couldn't stay up any later.

I still think the person who bid 6.00 should be stuck with that bid.

I think you should have better familiarized yourself with the rules of the bidding process.

 

[LHUCKS]

This is so dumb. I knew that was going to happen to me, but I was up at 11:15 and just couldn't stay up any later.

I still think the person who bid 6.00 should be stuck with that bid.

I think you should have better familiarized yourself with the rules of the bidding process.

I was very familiar with the rules...I just didn't agree with them because I predicted somebody like "Ref" would get screwed...unfortunately others such as yourself were unable to recognize those flaws.I landed exactly where I wanted to in this draft.

 

[mustacheman]

This is so dumb. I knew that was going to happen to me, but I was up at 11:15 and just couldn't stay up any later.

I still think the person who bid 6.00 should be stuck with that bid.

I think you should have better familiarized yourself with the rules of the bidding process.

I was very familiar with the rules...I just didn't agree with them because I predicted somebody like "Ref" would get screwed...unfortunately others such as yourself were unable to recognize those flaws.I landed exactly where I wanted to in this draft.

If you were familiar enough with the rules to "predict" that somebody would get screwed by the ability to bid out of a draft spot, don't you think the appropriate time to raise that concern would've been before that action could occur?

 

[bostonfred]

This is so dumb. I knew that was going to happen to me, but I was up at 11:15 and just couldn't stay up any later.

I still think the person who bid 6.00 should be stuck with that bid.

I think you should have better familiarized yourself with the rules of the bidding process.

I was very familiar with the rules...I just didn't agree with them because I predicted somebody like "Ref" would get screwed...unfortunately others such as yourself were unable to recognize those flaws.I landed exactly where I wanted to in this draft.

If you were familiar enough with the rules to "predict" that somebody would get screwed by the ability to bid out of a draft spot, don't you think the appropriate time to raise that concern would've been before that action could occur?

I can't speak for LHUCKS, but I DID raise that concern before the action could occur, and I strongly reraised it after the action occurred. Bass overruled my objection, and then complained when I stuck him with bids he didn't want. I think everyone now realizes that the ability to stick people with bids, coupled with an explicit end time to the auction, caused the problem that ended up with The Ref getting stuck with a bid he didn't want. I don't feel that bad for him, since he tried to stick me with the #1 spot for 6.0, too, and just didn't bid enough for the 5 spot to make it prohibitively expensive, but nobody should have been stuck with a bid they didn't want. Imagine if the first bid somebody made in this league was 1000.00 for the #1 pick. We'd have two choices - either nobody in the league would be allowed to bid again, or we'd end up with somebody being guaranteed the auto loss each week. Me bouncing from bid to bid actually drove down the effective price of the #1 pick, but there was no way to actually lower the bid. I think that's wrong, and I said so before, during and after the draft.

 

[LHUCKS]

This is so dumb. I knew that was going to happen to me, but I was up at 11:15 and just couldn't stay up any later.

If it makes you feel any better I think the #1 pick value is only about 2 points off.

 

[AB in DC]

Imagine if the first bid somebody made in this league was 1000.00 for the #1 pick. We'd have two choices - either nobody in the league would be allowed to bid again, or we'd end up with somebody being guaranteed the auto loss each week.

Or you could get together with another player and bid up every other slot to 998, 995, 994, etc.I mean, this was already an interesting to watch, imagine how much fun that would have been.

 

[The Ref]

This is so dumb. I knew that was going to happen to me, but I was up at 11:15 and just couldn't stay up any later.

I still think the person who bid 6.00 should be stuck with that bid.

I think you should have better familiarized yourself with the rules of the bidding process.

I was very familiar with the rules...I just didn't agree with them because I predicted somebody like "Ref" would get screwed...unfortunately others such as yourself were unable to recognize those flaws.I landed exactly where I wanted to in this draft.

If you were familiar enough with the rules to "predict" that somebody would get screwed by the ability to bid out of a draft spot, don't you think the appropriate time to raise that concern would've been before that action could occur?

I can't speak for LHUCKS, but I DID raise that concern before the action could occur, and I strongly reraised it after the action occurred. Bass overruled my objection, and then complained when I stuck him with bids he didn't want. I think everyone now realizes that the ability to stick people with bids, coupled with an explicit end time to the auction, caused the problem that ended up with The Ref getting stuck with a bid he didn't want. I don't feel that bad for him, since he tried to stick me with the #1 spot for 6.0, too, and just didn't bid enough for the 5 spot to make it prohibitively expensive, but nobody should have been stuck with a bid they didn't want. Imagine if the first bid somebody made in this league was 1000.00 for the #1 pick. We'd have two choices - either nobody in the league would be allowed to bid again, or we'd end up with somebody being guaranteed the auto loss each week. Me bouncing from bid to bid actually drove down the effective price of the #1 pick, but there was no way to actually lower the bid. I think that's wrong, and I said so before, during and after the draft.

Don't get me wrong, I understood the rules and knew that if I wanted to guarantee my team not getting stuck with the #1 spot at -6 I knew I had to up at midnight last night. My personal feeling after going though this is you should only be able to bid in an upwards direction. That would prevent someone from biding on a spot that they had no intention of keeping.

 

[The Ref]

This is so dumb. I knew that was going to happen to me, but I was up at 11:15 and just couldn't stay up any later.

If it makes you feel any better I think the #1 pick value is only about 2 points off.

I guess there could be worse things in the world then being "stuck" with LT2. I don't plan on owning him in the handful of auction leagues I do as I think he will be overpriced, so this way when he scores 4 TD's in week one I can be happy.

 

[BassNBrew]

LOL at being stuck with a "high" bid....how about being stuck with a low draft spot???

The best way to handle this is to leave bidding open until no one bids for a period of time....that and not having any jackholes in the league.

 

[bostonfred]

LOL at being stuck with a "high" bid....how about being stuck with a low draft spot???The best way to handle this is to leave bidding open until no one bids for a period of time....that and not having any jackholes in the league.

I'm going to assume you're not talking about me swapping bids with you after you did it to me, or swapping out of the #1 pick that I didn't want. So who are the jackholes here, aside from the whiny, crooked commish?

 

[Pictus Cat]