2007 Cleveland Browns Thread (1 Viewer)

[BGP]

Hopefully we don't get a rash of steeler fans in here violating the first post...

And just some ground rules...I don't post in the main main 2007 Steeler thread. I'm not here to tinkle in their threads - so don't do it in mine, thanks. This thread is about Browns football. Let's keep it civil and everything will be fine.

 

[BGP]

You have to love how its week 1, and the game thread with the most posts is browns-steelers. And the game hasn't even started yet!

 

[Peak]

You have to love how its week 1, and the game thread with the most posts is browns-steelers. And the game hasn't even started yet!

 

[3C's]

Steelers -4.5

I think the Browns should be better than they were last year but I think the Steelers are better too. Bottom line, I don't see Charlie Frye and Jamal Lewis making enough plays against the Steelers D to win the game. The Browns will need some turnovers or big special teams plays to shorten the field and pull out a victory here. I don't see it happening.

Steelers 27

Browns 17

The Browns have improved. Joe Thomas and Eric Stienbeck on the left side. JT looks like he will turn into one of the better run blocking offensive linemen. Hank Fraley was signed days before last year's kickoff and now he has a year with the team, he's a solid veteran. The suspension of ORT Ryan Tucker is covered by former starting OLT Shafer who slid over and is a capable fill-in. Last year RB Reuben Droughns was coming off a police blotter filled offseason of a DUI and a domestic disturbance incident and then got injured. Jamal Lewis is an upgrade.

TE Kellen Winslow Jr. was coming off his second consecutive IR season then tied HOF TE Ozzie Newsome's club single season reception record. Joe Thomas will free him up, he won't have to stay in and chip the DE allowing him to get off the LOS clean so he'll split the seam on deeper routes.

WR Braylon Edwards was coming off an ACL injury months before schedule. He has looked sensational this preseason. .

Last year QB Charlie Frye was gifted the starting QB job then ran into all sorts of problems, the line, WR/TE/RB. He played pretty gritty at first but it unravelled and he got injured. He needs to snap his 15 game turnover streak intact from his rookie season. He's getting the ball off quicker and feels pressure better than in the past. He has improved his game.

Last year, the defense had two rookie starting LBers in middle LB D'Qwell Jackson and OLB Kamerion Wimbley. Wimbley had 11 sacks and looks even better now. D'Qwell has bulked up and is filling gaps quicker, he looks very active. He could make a big leap in his play. Free agent acquisition Antwan Peek has flashed pass rush and big play ability. Willie McGhinnest is out so Antwan is starting. Peek played for DC Ted Granthan with the Texans. Leon Williams looked great when D'Qwell Jackson landed on IR the last few games so he provides depth.

The secondary was a MASH unit. Both starting CBs went out on IR and the backup landed on IR. Injuries helped establish depth as Lee Bodden emerged. Rookie CB Eric Wright has been solid in his positioning and made plays but he knows the Steelers will target him. SS Sean Jones emerged as one of the top five SS's in the league last year. FS Brodney Poole helped cover for the corner injuries. He won't have burdensome coverage responsibilities so he'll be freed up to play center field to allow a true deep cover-two defense scheme to be played.

On the Steeler side, Big Ben should improve. He stopped on oncoming windshield with his face and then had his appendix rupture. His QB passer rating was way off. He looked sharper in the preseason and Tomlin wants to air it out. Santiago Homles looks much improved as well and I would imagine Heath Miller will make a big stride this year. I think the Steelers lost something when Cowher and Porter left and I don't see anyone filling those voids. The rookie LBers won't fill Porter's hole right away. Maybe by the end of the season but not out of the gate. Tomlin is still a question mark till he proves himself. I think Romeo and Granthan can coach defense and now they are begining to get talented players to coach.

The QBs will play a huge role. Big Ben will test the rookie CB Eric Wright deep. Will Charlie Frye protect the ball? Will his pass protection hold up and specific to pass protection how will rookie starting OLT Joe Thomas look?

I have no idea what the score will be. The Browns are improved but how much improvement they will show on the field we'll see on Sunday.

One thing I know for certain...

This isn't the same Browns team of last year.

Tomlin>>>>>>>>Crennel

Based on what? I'm not a big Crennel supporter, but what makes you think Tomlin could have done >>>>>>>> better than Crennel given the Browns' talent the past couple of seasons?

Based on the fact that Crennel suxor big time! Savage has done great things via the draft the last 2 yrs, but Romeo is a horrible HC. There is no debating that.

Oh? No debating that? You couldn't make one point to support your stance. And the point on top of your head doesn't count kid. Three Super Bowl trophies says that Crennel can coach. You have what to support your lame claim? Your shouting? Run along kid, people are talking football here.

Three Super Bowl trophies says Crennel is a good coordinator. He's likely like several other highly regarded coordinators who just couldn't cut it as a head coach. But I think in his case the jury is still out.

 

[amnesiac]

damn, Bracie!

maybe irish was drunxors.

 

[Irish]

Steelers -4.5

I think the Browns should be better than they were last year but I think the Steelers are better too. Bottom line, I don't see Charlie Frye and Jamal Lewis making enough plays against the Steelers D to win the game. The Browns will need some turnovers or big special teams plays to shorten the field and pull out a victory here. I don't see it happening.

Steelers 27

Browns 17

The Browns have improved. Joe Thomas and Eric Stienbeck on the left side. JT looks like he will turn into one of the better run blocking offensive linemen. Hank Fraley was signed days before last year's kickoff and now he has a year with the team, he's a solid veteran. The suspension of ORT Ryan Tucker is covered by former starting OLT Shafer who slid over and is a capable fill-in. Last year RB Reuben Droughns was coming off a police blotter filled offseason of a DUI and a domestic disturbance incident and then got injured. Jamal Lewis is an upgrade.

TE Kellen Winslow Jr. was coming off his second consecutive IR season then tied HOF TE Ozzie Newsome's club single season reception record. Joe Thomas will free him up, he won't have to stay in and chip the DE allowing him to get off the LOS clean so he'll split the seam on deeper routes.

WR Braylon Edwards was coming off an ACL injury months before schedule. He has looked sensational this preseason. .

Last year QB Charlie Frye was gifted the starting QB job then ran into all sorts of problems, the line, WR/TE/RB. He played pretty gritty at first but it unravelled and he got injured. He needs to snap his 15 game turnover streak intact from his rookie season. He's getting the ball off quicker and feels pressure better than in the past. He has improved his game.

Last year, the defense had two rookie starting LBers in middle LB D'Qwell Jackson and OLB Kamerion Wimbley. Wimbley had 11 sacks and looks even better now. D'Qwell has bulked up and is filling gaps quicker, he looks very active. He could make a big leap in his play. Free agent acquisition Antwan Peek has flashed pass rush and big play ability. Willie McGhinnest is out so Antwan is starting. Peek played for DC Ted Granthan with the Texans. Leon Williams looked great when D'Qwell Jackson landed on IR the last few games so he provides depth.

The secondary was a MASH unit. Both starting CBs went out on IR and the backup landed on IR. Injuries helped establish depth as Lee Bodden emerged. Rookie CB Eric Wright has been solid in his positioning and made plays but he knows the Steelers will target him. SS Sean Jones emerged as one of the top five SS's in the league last year. FS Brodney Poole helped cover for the corner injuries. He won't have burdensome coverage responsibilities so he'll be freed up to play center field to allow a true deep cover-two defense scheme to be played.

On the Steeler side, Big Ben should improve. He stopped on oncoming windshield with his face and then had his appendix rupture. His QB passer rating was way off. He looked sharper in the preseason and Tomlin wants to air it out. Santiago Homles looks much improved as well and I would imagine Heath Miller will make a big stride this year. I think the Steelers lost something when Cowher and Porter left and I don't see anyone filling those voids. The rookie LBers won't fill Porter's hole right away. Maybe by the end of the season but not out of the gate. Tomlin is still a question mark till he proves himself. I think Romeo and Granthan can coach defense and now they are begining to get talented players to coach.

The QBs will play a huge role. Big Ben will test the rookie CB Eric Wright deep. Will Charlie Frye protect the ball? Will his pass protection hold up and specific to pass protection how will rookie starting OLT Joe Thomas look?

I have no idea what the score will be. The Browns are improved but how much improvement they will show on the field we'll see on Sunday.

One thing I know for certain...

This isn't the same Browns team of last year.

Tomlin>>>>>>>>Crennel

Based on what? I'm not a big Crennel supporter, but what makes you think Tomlin could have done >>>>>>>> better than Crennel given the Browns' talent the past couple of seasons?

Based on the fact that Crennel suxor big time! Savage has done great things via the draft the last 2 yrs, but Romeo is a horrible HC. There is no debating that.

Oh? No debating that? You couldn't make one point to support your stance. And the point on top of your head doesn't count kid. Three Super Bowl trophies says that Crennel can coach. You have what to support your lame claim? Your shouting? Run along kid, people are talking football here.

Do you still want to own your statements that Romeo is not a terrible HC after that debacle in the Browns home opener? 5 digiter nuff said. I don't have to prove that Romeo is a horrible HC, because he does it for me.

 

[Irish]

Steelers -4.5

I think the Browns should be better than they were last year but I think the Steelers are better too. Bottom line, I don't see Charlie Frye and Jamal Lewis making enough plays against the Steelers D to win the game. The Browns will need some turnovers or big special teams plays to shorten the field and pull out a victory here. I don't see it happening.

Steelers 27

Browns 17

The Browns have improved. Joe Thomas and Eric Stienbeck on the left side. JT looks like he will turn into one of the better run blocking offensive linemen. Hank Fraley was signed days before last year's kickoff and now he has a year with the team, he's a solid veteran. The suspension of ORT Ryan Tucker is covered by former starting OLT Shafer who slid over and is a capable fill-in. Last year RB Reuben Droughns was coming off a police blotter filled offseason of a DUI and a domestic disturbance incident and then got injured. Jamal Lewis is an upgrade.

TE Kellen Winslow Jr. was coming off his second consecutive IR season then tied HOF TE Ozzie Newsome's club single season reception record. Joe Thomas will free him up, he won't have to stay in and chip the DE allowing him to get off the LOS clean so he'll split the seam on deeper routes.

WR Braylon Edwards was coming off an ACL injury months before schedule. He has looked sensational this preseason. .

Last year QB Charlie Frye was gifted the starting QB job then ran into all sorts of problems, the line, WR/TE/RB. He played pretty gritty at first but it unravelled and he got injured. He needs to snap his 15 game turnover streak intact from his rookie season. He's getting the ball off quicker and feels pressure better than in the past. He has improved his game.

Last year, the defense had two rookie starting LBers in middle LB D'Qwell Jackson and OLB Kamerion Wimbley. Wimbley had 11 sacks and looks even better now. D'Qwell has bulked up and is filling gaps quicker, he looks very active. He could make a big leap in his play. Free agent acquisition Antwan Peek has flashed pass rush and big play ability. Willie McGhinnest is out so Antwan is starting. Peek played for DC Ted Granthan with the Texans. Leon Williams looked great when D'Qwell Jackson landed on IR the last few games so he provides depth.

The secondary was a MASH unit. Both starting CBs went out on IR and the backup landed on IR. Injuries helped establish depth as Lee Bodden emerged. Rookie CB Eric Wright has been solid in his positioning and made plays but he knows the Steelers will target him. SS Sean Jones emerged as one of the top five SS's in the league last year. FS Brodney Poole helped cover for the corner injuries. He won't have burdensome coverage responsibilities so he'll be freed up to play center field to allow a true deep cover-two defense scheme to be played.

On the Steeler side, Big Ben should improve. He stopped on oncoming windshield with his face and then had his appendix rupture. His QB passer rating was way off. He looked sharper in the preseason and Tomlin wants to air it out. Santiago Homles looks much improved as well and I would imagine Heath Miller will make a big stride this year. I think the Steelers lost something when Cowher and Porter left and I don't see anyone filling those voids. The rookie LBers won't fill Porter's hole right away. Maybe by the end of the season but not out of the gate. Tomlin is still a question mark till he proves himself. I think Romeo and Granthan can coach defense and now they are begining to get talented players to coach.

The QBs will play a huge role. Big Ben will test the rookie CB Eric Wright deep. Will Charlie Frye protect the ball? Will his pass protection hold up and specific to pass protection how will rookie starting OLT Joe Thomas look?

I have no idea what the score will be. The Browns are improved but how much improvement they will show on the field we'll see on Sunday.

One thing I know for certain...

This isn't the same Browns team of last year.

Tomlin>>>>>>>>Crennel

Based on what? I'm not a big Crennel supporter, but what makes you think Tomlin could have done >>>>>>>> better than Crennel given the Browns' talent the past couple of seasons?

Based on the fact that Crennel suxor big time! Savage has done great things via the draft the last 2 yrs, but Romeo is a horrible HC. There is no debating that.

Oh? No debating that? You couldn't make one point to support your stance. And the point on top of your head doesn't count kid. Three Super Bowl trophies says that Crennel can coach. You have what to support your lame claim? Your shouting? Run along kid, people are talking football here.

Browns just got by the Steelers!

 

[amnesiac]

ok, WTMF?

why didn't Anderson play like that in the preseason?

and will all the Frye apologists please be quiet now? i'm sick of hearing how we need to give him this whole season as he hasn't had a fair chance yet. he's had his chance, and he's proven that he is not a starting NFL qb.

once again i would like to place blame squarely on Savage for not addressing the QB position the last few years. i know they don't want to rush Quinn in, but i really don't see what options they have given themselves at this point.

(as a side note, i still can't figure out why we ran Trent Dilfer out of town, and then fired Carthon the next season...)

so i really don't see what their options are at this point. Anderson seems to have an idea of how to run the offense, but can't make the throws. Frye can't figure out how to run the offense. and they don't want to start Quinn. what a mess.

i don't think they can bring someone in at this point. so i wouldn't be suprised to see Brady in there in the near future.

and if he isn't the next rookie phenom... i think you can kiss this season goodbye.

 

[schaef2k]

What the hell was that?

 

[Bracie Smathers]

Steelers -4.5

I think the Browns should be better than they were last year but I think the Steelers are better too. Bottom line, I don't see Charlie Frye and Jamal Lewis making enough plays against the Steelers D to win the game. The Browns will need some turnovers or big special teams plays to shorten the field and pull out a victory here. I don't see it happening.

Steelers 27

Browns 17

The Browns have improved. Joe Thomas and Eric Stienbeck on the left side. JT looks like he will turn into one of the better run blocking offensive linemen. Hank Fraley was signed days before last year's kickoff and now he has a year with the team, he's a solid veteran. The suspension of ORT Ryan Tucker is covered by former starting OLT Shafer who slid over and is a capable fill-in. Last year RB Reuben Droughns was coming off a police blotter filled offseason of a DUI and a domestic disturbance incident and then got injured. Jamal Lewis is an upgrade.

TE Kellen Winslow Jr. was coming off his second consecutive IR season then tied HOF TE Ozzie Newsome's club single season reception record. Joe Thomas will free him up, he won't have to stay in and chip the DE allowing him to get off the LOS clean so he'll split the seam on deeper routes.

WR Braylon Edwards was coming off an ACL injury months before schedule. He has looked sensational this preseason. .

Last year QB Charlie Frye was gifted the starting QB job then ran into all sorts of problems, the line, WR/TE/RB. He played pretty gritty at first but it unravelled and he got injured. He needs to snap his 15 game turnover streak intact from his rookie season. He's getting the ball off quicker and feels pressure better than in the past. He has improved his game.

Last year, the defense had two rookie starting LBers in middle LB D'Qwell Jackson and OLB Kamerion Wimbley. Wimbley had 11 sacks and looks even better now. D'Qwell has bulked up and is filling gaps quicker, he looks very active. He could make a big leap in his play. Free agent acquisition Antwan Peek has flashed pass rush and big play ability. Willie McGhinnest is out so Antwan is starting. Peek played for DC Ted Granthan with the Texans. Leon Williams looked great when D'Qwell Jackson landed on IR the last few games so he provides depth.

The secondary was a MASH unit. Both starting CBs went out on IR and the backup landed on IR. Injuries helped establish depth as Lee Bodden emerged. Rookie CB Eric Wright has been solid in his positioning and made plays but he knows the Steelers will target him. SS Sean Jones emerged as one of the top five SS's in the league last year. FS Brodney Poole helped cover for the corner injuries. He won't have burdensome coverage responsibilities so he'll be freed up to play center field to allow a true deep cover-two defense scheme to be played.

On the Steeler side, Big Ben should improve. He stopped on oncoming windshield with his face and then had his appendix rupture. His QB passer rating was way off. He looked sharper in the preseason and Tomlin wants to air it out. Santiago Homles looks much improved as well and I would imagine Heath Miller will make a big stride this year. I think the Steelers lost something when Cowher and Porter left and I don't see anyone filling those voids. The rookie LBers won't fill Porter's hole right away. Maybe by the end of the season but not out of the gate. Tomlin is still a question mark till he proves himself. I think Romeo and Granthan can coach defense and now they are begining to get talented players to coach.

The QBs will play a huge role. Big Ben will test the rookie CB Eric Wright deep. Will Charlie Frye protect the ball? Will his pass protection hold up and specific to pass protection how will rookie starting OLT Joe Thomas look?

I have no idea what the score will be. The Browns are improved but how much improvement they will show on the field we'll see on Sunday.

One thing I know for certain...

This isn't the same Browns team of last year.

Tomlin>>>>>>>>Crennel

Based on what? I'm not a big Crennel supporter, but what makes you think Tomlin could have done >>>>>>>> better than Crennel given the Browns' talent the past couple of seasons?

Based on the fact that Crennel suxor big time! Savage has done great things via the draft the last 2 yrs, but Romeo is a horrible HC. There is no debating that.

Oh? No debating that? You couldn't make one point to support your stance. And the point on top of your head doesn't count kid. Three Super Bowl trophies says that Crennel can coach. You have what to support your lame claim? Your shouting? Run along kid, people are talking football here.

Do you still want to own your statements that Romeo is not a terrible HC after that debacle in the Browns home opener? 5 digiter nuff said. I don't have to prove that Romeo is a horrible HC, because he does it for me.

You haven't made a point kid. Show that personnel wasn't the difference but that bad coaching moves by Romeo Crennel lost and good coaching moves made by Tomlin were what decided the outcome of the game. Prove that coaching was what determined the outcome of this game. Own up to your lame smak kid or get lost.

 

[Irish]

Steelers -4.5

I think the Browns should be better than they were last year but I think the Steelers are better too. Bottom line, I don't see Charlie Frye and Jamal Lewis making enough plays against the Steelers D to win the game. The Browns will need some turnovers or big special teams plays to shorten the field and pull out a victory here. I don't see it happening.

Steelers 27

Browns 17

The Browns have improved. Joe Thomas and Eric Stienbeck on the left side. JT looks like he will turn into one of the better run blocking offensive linemen. Hank Fraley was signed days before last year's kickoff and now he has a year with the team, he's a solid veteran. The suspension of ORT Ryan Tucker is covered by former starting OLT Shafer who slid over and is a capable fill-in. Last year RB Reuben Droughns was coming off a police blotter filled offseason of a DUI and a domestic disturbance incident and then got injured. Jamal Lewis is an upgrade.

TE Kellen Winslow Jr. was coming off his second consecutive IR season then tied HOF TE Ozzie Newsome's club single season reception record. Joe Thomas will free him up, he won't have to stay in and chip the DE allowing him to get off the LOS clean so he'll split the seam on deeper routes.

WR Braylon Edwards was coming off an ACL injury months before schedule. He has looked sensational this preseason. .

Last year QB Charlie Frye was gifted the starting QB job then ran into all sorts of problems, the line, WR/TE/RB. He played pretty gritty at first but it unravelled and he got injured. He needs to snap his 15 game turnover streak intact from his rookie season. He's getting the ball off quicker and feels pressure better than in the past. He has improved his game.

Last year, the defense had two rookie starting LBers in middle LB D'Qwell Jackson and OLB Kamerion Wimbley. Wimbley had 11 sacks and looks even better now. D'Qwell has bulked up and is filling gaps quicker, he looks very active. He could make a big leap in his play. Free agent acquisition Antwan Peek has flashed pass rush and big play ability. Willie McGhinnest is out so Antwan is starting. Peek played for DC Ted Granthan with the Texans. Leon Williams looked great when D'Qwell Jackson landed on IR the last few games so he provides depth.

The secondary was a MASH unit. Both starting CBs went out on IR and the backup landed on IR. Injuries helped establish depth as Lee Bodden emerged. Rookie CB Eric Wright has been solid in his positioning and made plays but he knows the Steelers will target him. SS Sean Jones emerged as one of the top five SS's in the league last year. FS Brodney Poole helped cover for the corner injuries. He won't have burdensome coverage responsibilities so he'll be freed up to play center field to allow a true deep cover-two defense scheme to be played.

On the Steeler side, Big Ben should improve. He stopped on oncoming windshield with his face and then had his appendix rupture. His QB passer rating was way off. He looked sharper in the preseason and Tomlin wants to air it out. Santiago Homles looks much improved as well and I would imagine Heath Miller will make a big stride this year. I think the Steelers lost something when Cowher and Porter left and I don't see anyone filling those voids. The rookie LBers won't fill Porter's hole right away. Maybe by the end of the season but not out of the gate. Tomlin is still a question mark till he proves himself. I think Romeo and Granthan can coach defense and now they are begining to get talented players to coach.

The QBs will play a huge role. Big Ben will test the rookie CB Eric Wright deep. Will Charlie Frye protect the ball? Will his pass protection hold up and specific to pass protection how will rookie starting OLT Joe Thomas look?

I have no idea what the score will be. The Browns are improved but how much improvement they will show on the field we'll see on Sunday.

One thing I know for certain...

This isn't the same Browns team of last year.

Tomlin>>>>>>>>Crennel

Based on what? I'm not a big Crennel supporter, but what makes you think Tomlin could have done >>>>>>>> better than Crennel given the Browns' talent the past couple of seasons?

Based on the fact that Crennel suxor big time! Savage has done great things via the draft the last 2 yrs, but Romeo is a horrible HC. There is no debating that.

Oh? No debating that? You couldn't make one point to support your stance. And the point on top of your head doesn't count kid. Three Super Bowl trophies says that Crennel can coach. You have what to support your lame claim? Your shouting? Run along kid, people are talking football here.

Do you still want to own your statements that Romeo is not a terrible HC after that debacle in the Browns home opener? 5 digiter nuff said. I don't have to prove that Romeo is a horrible HC, because he does it for me.

You haven't made a point kid. Show that personnel wasn't the difference but that bad coaching moves by Romeo Crennel lost and good coaching moves made by Tomlin were what decided the outcome of the game. Prove that coaching was what determined the outcome of this game. Own up to your lame smak kid or get lost.

If you still think Romeo is a good HC, well then there is no hope for you. Even the most devoted Browns fans know that he stinks. BGP even knows this. BGP>>>>>Bracie Smathers. Nuff said. Checkmate. I am done gloating in this thread and return you to your previously scheduled programming.

 

[Bracie Smathers]

Steelers -4.5

I think the Browns should be better than they were last year but I think the Steelers are better too. Bottom line, I don't see Charlie Frye and Jamal Lewis making enough plays against the Steelers D to win the game. The Browns will need some turnovers or big special teams plays to shorten the field and pull out a victory here. I don't see it happening.

Steelers 27

Browns 17

The Browns have improved. Joe Thomas and Eric Stienbeck on the left side. JT looks like he will turn into one of the better run blocking offensive linemen. Hank Fraley was signed days before last year's kickoff and now he has a year with the team, he's a solid veteran. The suspension of ORT Ryan Tucker is covered by former starting OLT Shafer who slid over and is a capable fill-in. Last year RB Reuben Droughns was coming off a police blotter filled offseason of a DUI and a domestic disturbance incident and then got injured. Jamal Lewis is an upgrade.

TE Kellen Winslow Jr. was coming off his second consecutive IR season then tied HOF TE Ozzie Newsome's club single season reception record. Joe Thomas will free him up, he won't have to stay in and chip the DE allowing him to get off the LOS clean so he'll split the seam on deeper routes.

WR Braylon Edwards was coming off an ACL injury months before schedule. He has looked sensational this preseason. .

Last year QB Charlie Frye was gifted the starting QB job then ran into all sorts of problems, the line, WR/TE/RB. He played pretty gritty at first but it unravelled and he got injured. He needs to snap his 15 game turnover streak intact from his rookie season. He's getting the ball off quicker and feels pressure better than in the past. He has improved his game.

Last year, the defense had two rookie starting LBers in middle LB D'Qwell Jackson and OLB Kamerion Wimbley. Wimbley had 11 sacks and looks even better now. D'Qwell has bulked up and is filling gaps quicker, he looks very active. He could make a big leap in his play. Free agent acquisition Antwan Peek has flashed pass rush and big play ability. Willie McGhinnest is out so Antwan is starting. Peek played for DC Ted Granthan with the Texans. Leon Williams looked great when D'Qwell Jackson landed on IR the last few games so he provides depth.

The secondary was a MASH unit. Both starting CBs went out on IR and the backup landed on IR. Injuries helped establish depth as Lee Bodden emerged. Rookie CB Eric Wright has been solid in his positioning and made plays but he knows the Steelers will target him. SS Sean Jones emerged as one of the top five SS's in the league last year. FS Brodney Poole helped cover for the corner injuries. He won't have burdensome coverage responsibilities so he'll be freed up to play center field to allow a true deep cover-two defense scheme to be played.

On the Steeler side, Big Ben should improve. He stopped on oncoming windshield with his face and then had his appendix rupture. His QB passer rating was way off. He looked sharper in the preseason and Tomlin wants to air it out. Santiago Homles looks much improved as well and I would imagine Heath Miller will make a big stride this year. I think the Steelers lost something when Cowher and Porter left and I don't see anyone filling those voids. The rookie LBers won't fill Porter's hole right away. Maybe by the end of the season but not out of the gate. Tomlin is still a question mark till he proves himself. I think Romeo and Granthan can coach defense and now they are begining to get talented players to coach.

The QBs will play a huge role. Big Ben will test the rookie CB Eric Wright deep. Will Charlie Frye protect the ball? Will his pass protection hold up and specific to pass protection how will rookie starting OLT Joe Thomas look?

I have no idea what the score will be. The Browns are improved but how much improvement they will show on the field we'll see on Sunday.

One thing I know for certain...

This isn't the same Browns team of last year.

Tomlin>>>>>>>>Crennel

Based on what? I'm not a big Crennel supporter, but what makes you think Tomlin could have done >>>>>>>> better than Crennel given the Browns' talent the past couple of seasons?

Based on the fact that Crennel suxor big time! Savage has done great things via the draft the last 2 yrs, but Romeo is a horrible HC. There is no debating that.

Oh? No debating that? You couldn't make one point to support your stance. And the point on top of your head doesn't count kid. Three Super Bowl trophies says that Crennel can coach. You have what to support your lame claim? Your shouting? Run along kid, people are talking football here.

Do you still want to own your statements that Romeo is not a terrible HC after that debacle in the Browns home opener? 5 digiter nuff said. I don't have to prove that Romeo is a horrible HC, because he does it for me.

You haven't made a point kid. Show that personnel wasn't the difference but that bad coaching moves by Romeo Crennel lost and good coaching moves made by Tomlin were what decided the outcome of the game. Prove that coaching was what determined the outcome of this game. Own up to your lame smak kid or get lost.

If you still think Romeo is a good HC, well then there is no hope for you. Even the most devoted Browns fans know that he stinks. BGP even knows this. BGP>>>>>Bracie Smathers. Nuff said. Checkmate. I am done gloating in this thread and return you to your previously scheduled programming.

Couldn't come up with a coaching move eh kid? Didn't think so, actually I KNEW you couldn't. I am gloating over your ignorance. Given a simple task to prove coaching rather than personnel decided the outcome of the game and you couldn't. Owned. Can you say exposed? Bwaaaa haaaaa haaaaaaa.

 

[apalmer]

Steelers -4.5

I think the Browns should be better than they were last year but I think the Steelers are better too. Bottom line, I don't see Charlie Frye and Jamal Lewis making enough plays against the Steelers D to win the game. The Browns will need some turnovers or big special teams plays to shorten the field and pull out a victory here. I don't see it happening.

Steelers 27

Browns 17

The Browns have improved. Joe Thomas and Eric Stienbeck on the left side. JT looks like he will turn into one of the better run blocking offensive linemen. Hank Fraley was signed days before last year's kickoff and now he has a year with the team, he's a solid veteran. The suspension of ORT Ryan Tucker is covered by former starting OLT Shafer who slid over and is a capable fill-in. Last year RB Reuben Droughns was coming off a police blotter filled offseason of a DUI and a domestic disturbance incident and then got injured. Jamal Lewis is an upgrade.

TE Kellen Winslow Jr. was coming off his second consecutive IR season then tied HOF TE Ozzie Newsome's club single season reception record. Joe Thomas will free him up, he won't have to stay in and chip the DE allowing him to get off the LOS clean so he'll split the seam on deeper routes.

WR Braylon Edwards was coming off an ACL injury months before schedule. He has looked sensational this preseason. .

Last year QB Charlie Frye was gifted the starting QB job then ran into all sorts of problems, the line, WR/TE/RB. He played pretty gritty at first but it unravelled and he got injured. He needs to snap his 15 game turnover streak intact from his rookie season. He's getting the ball off quicker and feels pressure better than in the past. He has improved his game.

Last year, the defense had two rookie starting LBers in middle LB D'Qwell Jackson and OLB Kamerion Wimbley. Wimbley had 11 sacks and looks even better now. D'Qwell has bulked up and is filling gaps quicker, he looks very active. He could make a big leap in his play. Free agent acquisition Antwan Peek has flashed pass rush and big play ability. Willie McGhinnest is out so Antwan is starting. Peek played for DC Ted Granthan with the Texans. Leon Williams looked great when D'Qwell Jackson landed on IR the last few games so he provides depth.

The secondary was a MASH unit. Both starting CBs went out on IR and the backup landed on IR. Injuries helped establish depth as Lee Bodden emerged. Rookie CB Eric Wright has been solid in his positioning and made plays but he knows the Steelers will target him. SS Sean Jones emerged as one of the top five SS's in the league last year. FS Brodney Poole helped cover for the corner injuries. He won't have burdensome coverage responsibilities so he'll be freed up to play center field to allow a true deep cover-two defense scheme to be played.

On the Steeler side, Big Ben should improve. He stopped on oncoming windshield with his face and then had his appendix rupture. His QB passer rating was way off. He looked sharper in the preseason and Tomlin wants to air it out. Santiago Homles looks much improved as well and I would imagine Heath Miller will make a big stride this year. I think the Steelers lost something when Cowher and Porter left and I don't see anyone filling those voids. The rookie LBers won't fill Porter's hole right away. Maybe by the end of the season but not out of the gate. Tomlin is still a question mark till he proves himself. I think Romeo and Granthan can coach defense and now they are begining to get talented players to coach.

The QBs will play a huge role. Big Ben will test the rookie CB Eric Wright deep. Will Charlie Frye protect the ball? Will his pass protection hold up and specific to pass protection how will rookie starting OLT Joe Thomas look?

I have no idea what the score will be. The Browns are improved but how much improvement they will show on the field we'll see on Sunday.

One thing I know for certain...

This isn't the same Browns team of last year.

Tomlin>>>>>>>>Crennel

Based on what? I'm not a big Crennel supporter, but what makes you think Tomlin could have done >>>>>>>> better than Crennel given the Browns' talent the past couple of seasons?

Based on the fact that Crennel suxor big time! Savage has done great things via the draft the last 2 yrs, but Romeo is a horrible HC. There is no debating that.

Oh? No debating that? You couldn't make one point to support your stance. And the point on top of your head doesn't count kid. Three Super Bowl trophies says that Crennel can coach. You have what to support your lame claim? Your shouting? Run along kid, people are talking football here.

Do you still want to own your statements that Romeo is not a terrible HC after that debacle in the Browns home opener? 5 digiter nuff said. I don't have to prove that Romeo is a horrible HC, because he does it for me.

You haven't made a point kid. Show that personnel wasn't the difference but that bad coaching moves by Romeo Crennel lost and good coaching moves made by Tomlin were what decided the outcome of the game. Prove that coaching was what determined the outcome of this game. Own up to your lame smak kid or get lost.

If you still think Romeo is a good HC, well then there is no hope for you. Even the most devoted Browns fans know that he stinks. BGP even knows this. BGP>>>>>Bracie Smathers. Nuff said. Checkmate. I am done gloating in this thread and return you to your previously scheduled programming.

Couldn't come up with a coaching move eh kid? Didn't think so, actually I KNEW you couldn't. I am gloating over your ignorance. Given a simple task to prove coaching rather than personnel decided the outcome of the game and you couldn't. Owned. Can you say exposed? Bwaaaa haaaaa haaaaaaa.

Not my fight, but I can't resist. Since when does "coaching" begin and end on game day? Who came up with the Browns' game plan? Who decided on the starters? Who decided to run out and get Ernster to handle the punting? Who decided whoat players the Browns would draft since Romeo became coach to provide that personnel? Those aren't coaching decisions?

 

[Godsbrother]

Couldn't come up with a coaching move eh kid? Didn't think so, actually I KNEW you couldn't. I am gloating over your ignorance. Given a simple task to prove coaching rather than personnel decided the outcome of the game and you couldn't. Owned. Can you say exposed? Bwaaaa haaaaa haaaaaaa.

I'll bite.I don't know about X's and O's but Tomlin outcoached Crennel because his team was prepared and Crennel's was not.When you make all of the so-called improvements that you outlined and then get your butt handed to you after 10 days preparation time against a division rival at your home opener you did not do a very good job.

 

[schaef2k]

Couldn't come up with a coaching move eh kid? Didn't think so, actually I KNEW you couldn't. I am gloating over your ignorance. Given a simple task to prove coaching rather than personnel decided the outcome of the game and you couldn't. Owned. Can you say exposed? Bwaaaa haaaaa haaaaaaa.

I'll bite.I don't know about X's and O's but Tomlin outcoached Crennel because his team was prepared and Crennel's was not.When you make all of the so-called improvements that you outlined and then get your butt handed to you after 10 days preparation time against a division rival at your home opener you did not do a very good job.

Bingo! There is no excuse for looking that bad. It has become a common theme with Crennel and IMO he is done already. Just a question of if they wait till the end of the season.

 

[Bracie Smathers]

Couldn't come up with a coaching move eh kid? Didn't think so, actually I KNEW you couldn't. I am gloating over your ignorance. Given a simple task to prove coaching rather than personnel decided the outcome of the game and you couldn't. Owned. Can you say exposed? Bwaaaa haaaaa haaaaaaa.

I'll bite.I don't know about X's and O's but Tomlin outcoached Crennel because his team was prepared and Crennel's was not.When you make all of the so-called improvements that you outlined and then get your butt handed to you after 10 days preparation time against a division rival at your home opener you did not do a very good job.

So if Tomlin was coaching the Browns they would have won eh? You're saying that COACHING was the difference in the game NOT personnel?Improvements have been made in talent. Rookie talent needs to develop and gel. Tomlin VS. Crennel wasn't the deciding factor in the game and even you know that. Give Tomlin the Browns and Romeo the Steelers then say Tomlin beats the Steelers beacuse he's a master motivator.Teams tend to outperform for rookie HCs the first few games to prove themselves and to back the rook HC. It has nothing to do with Tomlin. Also I recall many Steeler fans ripping into Cowher the losing year PRIOR to Bill Cowher winning the Super Bowl. Seems fans wanted to get rid of the HC who coached them to the SB only months after they were screaming for his head so pardon me if I don't think much of fan impressions of who is or isn't a good HC, esp Steeler fans.

 

[mr blond]

Tomlin>>>>>>>>Crennel

Based on what? I'm not a big Crennel supporter, but what makes you think Tomlin could have done >>>>>>>> better than Crennel given the Browns' talent the past couple of seasons?

I sort of started this debate by biting on Irish's "Tomlin>>>>>>>>Crennel" bait. Just to clarify my thoughts, it's impossible to say Tomlin at this point in his career is a better coach than Crennel. You may think he will be better, but it's way too early in his career. One game doesn't make a career, but Tomlin without doubt won the first battle. The Steelers have better players, but Crennel was out coached. Crennel better get his team playing better or there won't be too many more battles to this war.

 

[Godsbrother]

Couldn't come up with a coaching move eh kid? Didn't think so, actually I KNEW you couldn't. I am gloating over your ignorance. Given a simple task to prove coaching rather than personnel decided the outcome of the game and you couldn't. Owned. Can you say exposed? Bwaaaa haaaaa haaaaaaa.

I'll bite.I don't know about X's and O's but Tomlin outcoached Crennel because his team was prepared and Crennel's was not.When you make all of the so-called improvements that you outlined and then get your butt handed to you after 10 days preparation time against a division rival at your home opener you did not do a very good job.

So if Tomlin was coaching the Browns they would have won eh? You're saying that COACHING was the difference in the game NOT personnel?Improvements have been made in talent. Rookie talent needs to develop and gel. Tomlin VS. Crennel wasn't the deciding factor in the game and even you know that. Give Tomlin the Browns and Romeo the Steelers then say Tomlin beats the Steelers beacuse he's a master motivator.Teams tend to outperform for rookie HCs the first few games to prove themselves and to back the rook HC. It has nothing to do with Tomlin. Also I recall many Steeler fans ripping into Cowher the losing year PRIOR to Bill Cowher winning the Super Bowl. Seems fans wanted to get rid of the HC who coached them to the SB only months after they were screaming for his head so pardon me if I don't think much of fan impressions of who is or isn't a good HC, esp Steeler fans.

You are putting words in my mouth. I didn't say the Browns would have won with Tomlin coaching. My point was the Browns were obviously not well prepared. If you think Romeo did a good job then you have an even lower opinion of the Browns talent than I do.As far as teams outperforming for rookie HC's I would like to see data that supports this or did you just make it up?

 

[Godsbrother]

I sort of started this debate by biting on Irish's "Tomlin>>>>>>>>Crennel" bait. Just to clarify my thoughts, it's impossible to say Tomlin at this point in his career is a better coach than Crennel. You may think he will be better, but it's way too early in his career. One game doesn't make a career, but Tomlin without doubt won the first battle. The Steelers have better players, but Crennel was out coached. Crennel better get his team playing better or there won't be too many more battles to this war.

Tomlin has the better players but you still have to get your team ready to play. I don't think the Steelers are 27 points better than the Browns, especially on the road. I just think Crennel did not do a good job getting his team ready to play this week.

 

[Frenchy Fuqua]

One more comment on Crennel and Savage, moving forward there is no reason that Brady Quinn shouldn't be on the field or at least the Browns #2 QB. Frye and Anderson have proven that they are just as unproven as Quinn and seem to have considerably less upside. Quinn should at least be the #2 QB so that if/when Frye/DA have another bad half...and they will...Quinn gets some snaps.

Quinn is the Browns only hope for the longterm, why not let him take his lumps now especially when the Browns are taking their lumps with journeymen like Charlie Frye and Derek Anderson anyway. I thought this was the year the Browns would creep closer to .500, it was only one game but I thought they looked even worse than last year.

 

[Frenchy Fuqua]

Excuses getting old for Browns

Frye, Anderson look ready to be replaced

By Patrick McManamon

Published on Monday, Sep 10, 2007

CLEVELAND: It's early in the fourth quarter of Sunday's debacle in Cleveland Browns Stadium.

Time to grab the binoculars and take a long, slow look at the Browns' sideline.

There were a lot of long faces there, but what wasn't there was equally significant.

There was no Butch Davis, no Dwight Clark, no Chris Palmer, no Jeremy Green.

No decision-maker, really, from any previous regime with the Browns.

What was there was a team that remains light-years from being able to compete with the Pittsburgh Steelers, a team with no defined quarterback, with an offense prone to mistakes and a defense that still can't stop the run.

Where to start with Sunday's 34-7 defeat?

How about the first punt of the day, when the Browns were flagged for not one but four penalties?

How about the Steelers' first drive of the second half, when they drove down the field with the greatest of ease to take a 24-0 lead?

How about Charlie Frye being sacked five times in little more than one quarter?

How about Najeh Davenport spinning out of four tackles en route to turning a short pass into a first down in the third quarter?

How about pathetic?

Again.

And how about the Browns, for once against this team from down the turnpike, competing and winning?

Right.

The talking fish in Disney's Finding Nemo are closer to reality.

At this point in the Browns' post-1999 history, two things can be said with certainty: The ''rivalry'' with the Steelers is no longer; Pittsburgh owns the Browns, and that's not a real risky statement given the Steelers have won 14 of the past 15 games. The other fact is the Browns have become masters at blaming the past for present situations.

First it was expansion rules that kept the team from building a winner.

Enter Davis, who lamented the poor drafting of the Clark-Palmer regime.

Nowadays the Browns lament the personnel decisions of Davis, Clark and Green, which forced the roster to be torn apart the past two years and left the team with no starting point.

This might be 100 percent true.

But it's an old and tired refrain.

This Browns regime is in its third year of roster building. Every quarterback on the team was brought in during the past two years. Same with the receivers and the majority of the offensive linemen. Rebuilding and retooling in the NFL is hard, very hard. But it doesn't stop some teams from doing it in a year, New Orleans being the most recent example.

Some facts are irrefutable in the NFL, and one is that any new front office or coaching staff wants its own guys. New leadership rarely, if ever, likes the guys it is left with.

The exception is a team like Pittsburgh, which has a winning and professional tradition. But few teams that have won change coaches, and even new coach Mike Tomlin let Joey Porter go.

If a team has been losing, the new coach or general manager will not like the decisions made before he arrived.

So lamenting the past is like lamenting the weather. It might have been bad, but it doesn't change the outlook for today.

At this point, the Browns should be about nothing but the present, which means winning on Sunday. Which means bringing in good players that fit a system, preparing, playing hard and playing well.

The Steelers, and other teams, seem to understand this concept.

The Browns haven't mastered it yet. They keep saying they are in the process of mastering it, but all that happens is a home opener like Sunday's that sends the fans streaming to the exits early in the fourth quarter. What hope do these fans have?

Consider the past few Browns-Steelers games. A 41-0 loss on Christmas Eve. A 24-20 blown fourth-quarter lead at home last season. A 27-7 thrashing late last year in Pittsburgh. And now a 34-7 home defeat.

Combined scores: 126-34.

Sunday's game was attributed to early turnovers and falling behind. The general consensus from the Steelers was the Browns are better on defense, but the offense is struggling.

The result is the same: A bad loss.

Frye lasted slightly more than one quarter before being pulled. At this point, you figure Derek Anderson will start Sunday against the Bengals, but you don't get the feeling that puts the Browns in any better position to win.

You feel for Frye, a good guy who cares and tries. For whatever reason, he seems to play with no confidence. You have to wonder how many more games Frye will start with the Browns.

Both quarterbacks, actually, are playing like they expect Brady Quinn to take their place, which is pretty much what will happen eventually.

Until then, there is little hope things will change.

The Steelers got some breaks Sunday, but the Browns had a hand in those, visible or invisible.

Browns punter Paul Ernster, signed Saturday, evidently was a bundle of nerves. He dropped his first snap, then got off a 15-yard punt. On the play the Browns committed four penalties. Google ''NFL, one play and four penalties'' and it'd be hard to believe it ever happened before.

Dave Zastudil hurt himself last Monday. The Browns knew he might not punt against the Steelers, but they waited until Saturday to make a move and well let Ernster explain it.

''It was tough to come in and sign on Saturday and play Sunday,'' he said. ''There are a lot of timing issues with a punter and a snapper and if you don't have the reps it's hard.''

That play was just the start of a long, difficult day.

At this point, the circumstances do not matter. The Steelers simply beat the Browns.

Cold weather, hot weather. Early in the season, late in the season. Browns go ahead, Browns fall behind. No matter the Steelers win.

It's past time for the Browns to do something about it.

Just like it's past time to let go of the past.

The fans who keep showing up year after year, game after game, deserve that much.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Patrick McManamon can be reached at pmcmanamon@thebeaconjournal.com.

 

[Frenchy Fuqua]

Porter: Browns are an embarrassment

UPDATE: 8:05 PM, Sunday, September 9, 2007

CLEVELAND If civilization had gotten off to the kind of the start the Browns did Sunday, Adam and Eve still would be lost in the garden.

The creator rested on the seventh day.

The Browns did, too.

Despite a gray overcast sky hovering overhead, optimism and the smell of brats wafted in the air around Cleveland Browns Stadium.

Then the Browns got their hands on the afternoon. Actually, new punter Paul Ernster didn’t get his hands on much, which sent the game and the start of the 2007 season to hell in a handbasket.

“For a home opener, we didn’t do very well,” said Head Coach Romeo Crennel, who might well have said the grass is green. “There is not an explanation I can give for it. ... We felt that we improved as a team and gotten better, then we go out there and you saw the results.”

Sunday’s 34-7 bodycast was a result. It was the consequence of ... a punt.

After a three-and-out series to welcome 2007 — it seemed all too familiar — Ernster dropped a perfect snap. He was signed Saturday afternoon to replace the injured Dave Zastudil, a possibility the team knew of much earlier. Why wait until the day before the game to sign a player?

Still, that’s no reason to drop a punt snap that could have blown a hole in the middle of Ernster’s stomach.

“Totally my fault,” Ernster confessed in a Charles Manson sorta way.

The dropped snap was just the tip of the iceberg.

Cleveland was called for four — yes four — penalties on the play. The tragedy of errors was just a hint of the day ahead. When there are two holding penalties, an illegal man downfield and an illegal formation, that’s a pretty good indication that nothing went right.

Four penalties and the best this team can do is net a 5-yard punt. Commit four crimes in a day, and someone better at least come away with a sack of money.

Pittsburgh scored 17 points in the first quarter, all on drives that started in Browns territory.

“As the game went on, it was like an avalanche,” said Crennel, the man buried under. “A play is a play. You try to recover from it and try to do better on the next play. ... Still, I think we can be a competitive team.”

Where? Mexico?

“Turnovers. Sacks. Drops. Touchdown passes we gave up,” Crennel said, ticking off a list of things that went wrong.

Crennel is on thin ice as things are. A few days ago, General Manager Phil Savage said the Browns would have to lose their first six games 50-0 for Crennel’s job to be in jeopardy. Maybe he shouldn’t have given the players a target to reach for.

Cleveland didn’t resemble an NFL franchise Sunday — unless Moe, Larry and Curly are the team captains.

The new offense turned the ball over five times. New running back Jamal Lewis looked like every back before him and ran for 35 yards. The new offensive line gave up six sacks, but at least three of those were because Charlie Frye treated the football like an anvil and held on to it.

The defense held ground, at times, but it too caved. Special teams were a disaster because of the punt.

“We just made too many mistakes,” receiver Braylon Edwards understated. “We practiced too hard and have come too far. We’re definitely a way better team than we showed today.”

Whew. For a minute there I was getting concerned.

Way better? This opening day loss goes down in Browns history as one of the worst. That’s the good news.

The bad news?

Any time Cleveland loses on opening day by 27 points or more, the Browns go on to have a lousy season. Four other times, the Browns have been blown out to start the season, and four times they failed to win more than five games that season.

Crennel tried to spark his offense by changing quarterbacks. Derek Anderson was modestly better than Frye but quicker in making decisions.

Meanwhile, chants of “BRAY-DEE, BRAY-DEE” echoed through the stadium early in the second quarter.

By that time, Cleveland was down 17-0. It was 24-0, and people were still in their seats.

It took an act of God to get Browns fans to leave. The heavens opened in the third quarter and rain poured. Finally, the masses took a cue from above and went home.

They were disappointed, and worse, embarrassed again.

Reach Repository sports writer Todd Porter at (330) 580-8340 or e-mail: todd.porter@cantonrep.com

 

[Bracie Smathers]

Couldn't come up with a coaching move eh kid? Didn't think so, actually I KNEW you couldn't. I am gloating over your ignorance. Given a simple task to prove coaching rather than personnel decided the outcome of the game and you couldn't. Owned. Can you say exposed? Bwaaaa haaaaa haaaaaaa.

I'll bite.I don't know about X's and O's but Tomlin outcoached Crennel because his team was prepared and Crennel's was not.

When you make all of the so-called improvements that you outlined and then get your butt handed to you after 10 days preparation time against a division rival at your home opener you did not do a very good job.

So if Tomlin was coaching the Browns they would have won eh? You're saying that COACHING was the difference in the game NOT personnel?Improvements have been made in talent. Rookie talent needs to develop and gel. Tomlin VS. Crennel wasn't the deciding factor in the game and even you know that. Give Tomlin the Browns and Romeo the Steelers then say Tomlin beats the Steelers beacuse he's a master motivator.

Teams tend to outperform for rookie HCs the first few games to prove themselves and to back the rook HC. It has nothing to do with Tomlin. Also I recall many Steeler fans ripping into Cowher the losing year PRIOR to Bill Cowher winning the Super Bowl. Seems fans wanted to get rid of the HC who coached them to the SB only months after they were screaming for his head so pardon me if I don't think much of fan impressions of who is or isn't a good HC, esp Steeler fans.

You are putting words in my mouth. I didn't say the Browns would have won with Tomlin coaching. My point was the Browns were obviously not well prepared. If you think Romeo did a good job then you have an even lower opinion of the Browns talent than I do.As far as teams outperforming for rookie HC's I would like to see data that supports this or did you just make it up?

The Browns were prepaired. Preparation comes BEFORE the game, then its up to the players to execute the game plan installed by the coaches.http://www.footballoutsiders.com/2007/09/1.../audibles/5455/

... The Browns have clearly been watching film, though — they’re not falling for any of Pittsburgh’s screens on third-and-long. When not being burned by Santonio Holmes the Cleveland D doesn’t look that bad, actually. Willie Parker has been going nowhere all game. If Cleveland had an offense things would help. Charlie Frye is horribly inaccurate, throwing behind his receivers much of the time.

... One last thought: As Stuart mentioned earlier, the Browns defense actually looked pretty good. As good as you can look giving up 34 points. A lot of that had to do with field position, and the offense going three-and-out, but Kamerion Wimbley was in the backfield all day, and second-year linebacker D’Qwell Jackson was always around the ball. The Browns’ two young safeties, Brodney Pool and Sean Jones, were inconsistent, but playing them is the right move. Rookie cornerback Eric Wright (the Browns traded up to get him in April) started in place of Gary Baxter, and the Steelers targeted him early in the game. He was in coverage on the Hines Ward touchdown, and on several other big plays. New defensive end Antwan Peek also played well, collapsing the pocket and batting down passes at the line of scrimmage. This unit will keep Cleveland in close games, but the problem is finding a quarterback to do that.

Pool looked horrible, Jones was/is a great safety. Wright is a rookie and was target in his FIRST NFL game and had decent position but obviously was not expected to perform like a vet in his first game. Peek and Wimbely did play was as noted and were collapsing the edges all game but their was no push up the gut so Burgher had a small pocket to step into. The major personnel weakness for Cleveland on offense is obviously at quarterback. The Browns drafted Quinn and he would have had a shot to start if he hadn't held out for 16 practices in training camp. Peter King in one of hi MMQBs said Quinn was missing 15 play installments for each practice so he would have missed out on 240 plays in the 16 practices he held out. Browns GM Phil Savage noted that last year's first round pick, OLB Kamerion Wimbley, didn't hold out, didn't miss any practices in training camp when the playbook was being installed, played a far less demanind position, and was given a scaled back job responsibility of being more of a pass rusher rather than all around OLB in the cover two, and that he didn't start his first game so Savage made it clear weeks ago that he felt Quinn had no chance of starting let alone seeing the field the first game.

The major personnel weakness for the Browns on defense is the entire defensive line. The starters are old, really old, and will wear down and their is simply not enough depth to cover for when they will wear down or get injured over the course of the season. Savage was able to sign Robaire Smith and Shuan Smith and they will help and he also took flyers on two later round DL-Men but the Browns simply couldn't fill all holes in one offseason but Savage made HUGE strides in landing, Joe Thomas/Eric Steinbeck/Jamal Lewis/Brady Quinn/Peek/Eric Wright and both of the Smith defensive linemen. IOWs yeah, its still a pesonnel thing until the O-line can get healthy/off steroid suspension, till the QB move to Quinn can take place, till Wright gets up to speed. And then the Browns will still have holes on the D-Line and with Jamal older and now it looks like Pool could be an issue at FS the mention that Savage wanted to move CB Gary Baxter to safety makes much more sense. I didn't realize that Pool was struggling so much. Oh yeah, La Charles Bently is also on the PUP and might just go on IR so he can be ready next year.

So the Browns were as best prepaired as they could be at this time. Charlie Frye is/was a lame duck QB and yesterday proved why the Browns made the move for Quinn. Look for Derek Anderson to be the starter next week and for some coverage changes. I could go on and on but no amount of coaching was going to make Frye play better. No amount of coaching would make Wright look like a veteran CB and the fact that Savage had mentioned he was moving Baxter to safety a few days ago indicates that they had doubts about Pool at FS. Also we knew going into LAST SEASON that our defensive line was old and we needed to replace them but last year Savage revamped the LBing corps with, Wimbley, D'Qwell, Leon Williams, and this year he put a finishing touch with Peek. Next year it will be difficult to target 34 D-Linemen especially since we don't have a first rounder but Quinn should more than make up for not landing a D-lineman next year.

Also the loss of our punter forced the late signing of Ernster who flubbed the snap and got off a 15 yard punt. The Steeler punter kept boxing us inside the 10 yard line. Romeo can only coach the players he has. He doesn't control injuries, he can't be blamed for great plays by the opposition nor blowing rudimentary plays.

Also the quote on rookie HC's getting their players to out or over perform is an old NFL saw. It was repeated either on one of the pregames of NFL Blitz or Sunday Night chatter so no I didn't make that one up but you can look it up if you doubt me.

 

[Irish]

Couldn't come up with a coaching move eh kid? Didn't think so, actually I KNEW you couldn't. I am gloating over your ignorance. Given a simple task to prove coaching rather than personnel decided the outcome of the game and you couldn't. Owned. Can you say exposed? Bwaaaa haaaaa haaaaaaa.

I'll bite.I don't know about X's and O's but Tomlin outcoached Crennel because his team was prepared and Crennel's was not.

When you make all of the so-called improvements that you outlined and then get your butt handed to you after 10 days preparation time against a division rival at your home opener you did not do a very good job.

So if Tomlin was coaching the Browns they would have won eh? You're saying that COACHING was the difference in the game NOT personnel?Improvements have been made in talent. Rookie talent needs to develop and gel. Tomlin VS. Crennel wasn't the deciding factor in the game and even you know that. Give Tomlin the Browns and Romeo the Steelers then say Tomlin beats the Steelers beacuse he's a master motivator.

Teams tend to outperform for rookie HCs the first few games to prove themselves and to back the rook HC. It has nothing to do with Tomlin. Also I recall many Steeler fans ripping into Cowher the losing year PRIOR to Bill Cowher winning the Super Bowl. Seems fans wanted to get rid of the HC who coached them to the SB only months after they were screaming for his head so pardon me if I don't think much of fan impressions of who is or isn't a good HC, esp Steeler fans.

You are putting words in my mouth. I didn't say the Browns would have won with Tomlin coaching. My point was the Browns were obviously not well prepared. If you think Romeo did a good job then you have an even lower opinion of the Browns talent than I do.As far as teams outperforming for rookie HC's I would like to see data that supports this or did you just make it up?

The Browns were prepaired. Preparation comes BEFORE the game, then its up to the players to execute the game plan installed by the coaches.http://www.footballoutsiders.com/2007/09/1.../audibles/5455/

... The Browns have clearly been watching film, though — they’re not falling for any of Pittsburgh’s screens on third-and-long. When not being burned by Santonio Holmes the Cleveland D doesn’t look that bad, actually. Willie Parker has been going nowhere all game. If Cleveland had an offense things would help. Charlie Frye is horribly inaccurate, throwing behind his receivers much of the time.

... One last thought: As Stuart mentioned earlier, the Browns defense actually looked pretty good. As good as you can look giving up 34 points. A lot of that had to do with field position, and the offense going three-and-out, but Kamerion Wimbley was in the backfield all day, and second-year linebacker D’Qwell Jackson was always around the ball. The Browns’ two young safeties, Brodney Pool and Sean Jones, were inconsistent, but playing them is the right move. Rookie cornerback Eric Wright (the Browns traded up to get him in April) started in place of Gary Baxter, and the Steelers targeted him early in the game. He was in coverage on the Hines Ward touchdown, and on several other big plays. New defensive end Antwan Peek also played well, collapsing the pocket and batting down passes at the line of scrimmage. This unit will keep Cleveland in close games, but the problem is finding a quarterback to do that.

Pool looked horrible, Jones was/is a great safety. Wright is a rookie and was target in his FIRST NFL game and had decent position but obviously was not expected to perform like a vet in his first game. Peek and Wimbely did play was as noted and were collapsing the edges all game but their was no push up the gut so Burgher had a small pocket to step into. The major personnel weakness for Cleveland on offense is obviously at quarterback. The Browns drafted Quinn and he would have had a shot to start if he hadn't held out for 16 practices in training camp. Peter King in one of hi MMQBs said Quinn was missing 15 play installments for each practice so he would have missed out on 240 plays in the 16 practices he held out. Browns GM Phil Savage noted that last year's first round pick, OLB Kamerion Wimbley, didn't hold out, didn't miss any practices in training camp when the playbook was being installed, played a far less demanind position, and was given a scaled back job responsibility of being more of a pass rusher rather than all around OLB in the cover two, and that he didn't start his first game so Savage made it clear weeks ago that he felt Quinn had no chance of starting let alone seeing the field the first game.

The major personnel weakness for the Browns on defense is the entire defensive line. The starters are old, really old, and will wear down and their is simply not enough depth to cover for when they will wear down or get injured over the course of the season. Savage was able to sign Robaire Smith and Shuan Smith and they will help and he also took flyers on two later round DL-Men but the Browns simply couldn't fill all holes in one offseason but Savage made HUGE strides in landing, Joe Thomas/Eric Steinbeck/Jamal Lewis/Brady Quinn/Peek/Eric Wright and both of the Smith defensive linemen. IOWs yeah, its still a pesonnel thing until the O-line can get healthy/off steroid suspension, till the QB move to Quinn can take place, till Wright gets up to speed. And then the Browns will still have holes on the D-Line and with Jamal older and now it looks like Pool could be an issue at FS the mention that Savage wanted to move CB Gary Baxter to safety makes much more sense. I didn't realize that Pool was struggling so much. Oh yeah, La Charles Bently is also on the PUP and might just go on IR so he can be ready next year.

So the Browns were as best prepaired as they could be at this time. Charlie Frye is/was a lame duck QB and yesterday proved why the Browns made the move for Quinn. Look for Derek Anderson to be the starter next week and for some coverage changes. I could go on and on but no amount of coaching was going to make Frye play better. No amount of coaching would make Wright look like a veteran CB and the fact that Savage had mentioned he was moving Baxter to safety a few days ago indicates that they had doubts about Pool at FS. Also we knew going into LAST SEASON that our defensive line was old and we needed to replace them but last year Savage revamped the LBing corps with, Wimbley, D'Qwell, Leon Williams, and this year he put a finishing touch with Peek. Next year it will be difficult to target 34 D-Linemen especially since we don't have a first rounder but Quinn should more than make up for not landing a D-lineman next year.

Also the loss of our punter forced the late signing of Ernster who flubbed the snap and got off a 15 yard punt. The Steeler punter kept boxing us inside the 10 yard line. Romeo can only coach the players he has. He doesn't control injuries, he can't be blamed for great plays by the opposition nor blowing rudimentary plays.

Also the quote on rookie HC's getting their players to out or over perform is an old NFL saw. It was repeated either on one of the pregames of NFL Blitz or Sunday Night chatter so no I didn't make that one up but you can look it up if you doubt me.

Yeah Crennel really had the Browns prepared! Yes the Steelers do have more talent than the Browns, but the Browns were not even in this game from the very beginning. Talent wins out over the course of a game. Cleveland was beat right from the kickoff. Four freakin penalties on one play sums it up. Time to take your meds Bracie. I apologize to all Browns fans in this thread that have some common sense. I do not mean to hijack this thread. Carry on.

 

[schaef2k]

Yeah Crennel really had the Browns prepared! Yes the Steelers do have more talent than the Browns, but the Browns were not even in this game from the very beginning. Talent wins out over the course of a game. Cleveland was beat right from the kickoff. Four freakin penalties on one play sums it up. Time to take your meds Bracie. I apologize to all Browns fans in this thread that have some common sense. I do not mean to hijack this thread. Carry on

It's ok there are high expectations this year and some of us need to take a deep breath and see this for what it is.It's one ####### game. Did we look atrocious? certainly. Is Romeo a poor coach? Although the jury may not totally be in all signs point to yes.The team was way off, we are more talented than what we saw sunday. On a bright note the D line was not bad and this is the area I was worried about. Parker is a good back and he hung a c note on a D that was put in no position to win and on the field entirely too long. Pool got toasted and Wright was playing his first game. The DBs not named Bodden and Jones made mistakes but the LBs played a pretty good game. Romeo panicked and ditched the run way to early, lewis needs more to get going and you need to get the o line in some kinda rhythm. This is the first game with the starting front 5 together and they're gona need some time to gel.Lest take a deep breath and relax, this team has talent and will pull it together by the time Quinn is ready to go

 

[BGP]

WTAM 1100 AM drive time host Mike Trivisonno had this to say this afternoon (paraphrased):

Mike had said since last year that Romeo Crennel simply is not a head coach. He's a good defensive coordinator but that's it.
Browns GM Phil Savage is also over-promoted - he is not a GM - he is a scout and has not shown any growth since he took over.
Mike heard that Browns owner Randy Lerner was at the game and at some point, got up, left his booth, walked into the Browns locker room and sat there alone and quiet.
Mike said the Browns offered the head coaching job to two people this past offseason, and both turned them down.
If Romeo is fired in mid-season, Mike said that Browns Defensive Coordinator Todd Grantham would be named interim head coach.
Mike said that no expert predicted that Romeo was not the right choice. No expert predicted that Savage was not the right choice. So how can it be Lerner's fault if he hired the guys he was supposed to hire?
Mike said that if Romeo is fired, and Savage is let go, expect Randy Lerner to put the franchise up for sale.

 

[Frenchy Fuqua]

McManamon: Seattle trade is stunning and baffling

Outsiders see move as act of desperation

http://www.ohio.com/sports/browns/9728857....age=all&c=y

By Patrick McManamon

Published on Tuesday, Sep 11, 2007

Somehow this trade seems good for Charlie Frye.

He gets to go to the Seattle Seahawks, try to piece his career back together for Mike Holmgren, a guy who knows a thing or two about quarterbacking. And he gets away from the dysfunctional mess that is the Browns.

Did we say dysfunctional? That's pretty harsh, but let's take a look at the result of this trade of the opening day starter two days after a dysfunctional opening game.

Frye ''won'' the ''quarterback competition'' of training camp because the Browns felt he gave the team the best chance to win.

He got a quarter and a half to prove himself in the regular season.

He's gone.

Anderson finished second in the competition. In a two-man competition, he lost. He's now the starter.

Brady Quinn, who three weeks ago was not ready to be one play away from being the starter, is now one play away from being the starter.

And Ken Dorsey, who was cut 10 days ago, is back as the veteran mentor to Quinn.

So the offense is being led by a quarterback who has never won a game, a quarterback who has never played a game and a guy brought in to be a mentor even though the coach said he would only want guys on the roster because they can play.

This trade brings clarity to the quarterback position, General Manager Phil Savage said.

Glad we cleared that up.

In an effort to clarify things, the Browns made a move unprecedented in modern NFL history. Elias Sports Bureau reported that since the AFL/NFL merger in 1970, no quarterback had ever started the first game and been traded before Week 2.

That's only 37 years.

Savage said the move doesn't change the team's plans but adjusts them.

OK.

But it sure seems like a pretty major change at a time when well major changes are not made. These kinds of moves are usually made late in preseason, as part of the building of a roster.

The last time a change like this was made was 1999, when Tim Couch stepped in for Ty Detmer. This is not the same, but we all know how that one worked out.

Words like ''priceless'' and ''flabbergasted'' were used by people in the league. One insider said the image was that the Browns were acting out of ''desperation.'' Time will tell, but Savage said the main job of the team this year is to develop Brady Quinn the right way.

After a brief pause, he added: ''And win.''

Glad we clarified that as well.

Frye clearly has a ways to go to be a dependable NFL quarterback. But the trade comes just less than two weeks after Savage said Frye deserved a chance to play some games with a ''full deck.''

Frye's the one who got dealt after a chance that lasted a little more than 20 minutes.

Make no mistake, this was a bad 20 minutes. Real bad.

Ten passes, five sacks, rating of 10, deer-in-the-headlights look.

Clearly, Frye had lost any confidence he ever had when he joined the Browns.

But maybe coin flips and being given the job before he earned it and being beat up regularly and playing with an injured wrist and trying to learn a new offense while looking over your shoulder at the first-round draft choice all can affect confidence.

Maybe.

What's evident is that everything Frye did in the opener he did in preseason and last season and his rookie season.

The Pittsburgh Steelers gave him fits. He held the ball too long. He depended on running around to make plays like he did at the University of Akron.

This was no great revelation.

Yet he was named the starter, as if he'd be transformed from preseason to the regular season with some pixie dust. Now a third-round pick is traded for a sixth-round pick and that is called ''value.''

Anderson is tabbed to start, and guess what? He probably will do the same things against the Cincinnati Bengals that he did against Pittsburgh. Stand in the pocket, get rid of the ball, make some good throws, make some bad throws and turn the ball over.

It's curious to hear Savage say that Frye was named the starter for the first game, that he had no guarantees at his position. Fair enough.

Frye clearly had problems Sunday. But to think that he was the only problem is shortsighted.

This team has big problems, including with reactions like this that come across as knee-jerk to a bad game.

The Browns say they are an organization that is together and united and focused with a vision for the future.

The problem is they don't show that.

They don't show it on the field or in personnel decisions or when naming an opening day starter and then trading him two days after opening day.

Frye gets to go to Seattle and play in the West Coast offense for Holmgren.

Browns fans? They're left with struggles that never seem to end.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Patrick McManamon can be reached at pmcmanamon@thebeaconjournal.com. Read his blog at http://www.ohiomm.com/blogs/mcmanamon/.

 

[Bracie Smathers]

http://forums.footballguys.com/forum/index...=2&t=299194

... Had Quinn signed on time and not missed 16 practices due to a contract holdout, a trade might have occurred sooner. Savage said he fielded calls throughout the summer — and made some himself — in regard to the availability of Frye and/or Derek Anderson, who now takes over as the starter.

"I think ever since we drafted Brady, everyone in the NFL knew one quarterback would be spun off in a potential trade," Savage said. "I felt like if we were going to make a move, now was the time to do it; get some value for the guy."

Savage said the Browns informed Frye of their plans Monday night. "I think the trade is ultimately good for everybody involved," the GM said.

Seattle needed a third QB after releasing David Greene on the final roster cut. Some think Frye is a good fit for the West Coast offense employed by the Seahawks.

If Quinn was signed on time this trade would have gone down sooner and Savage is right, trading Frye now meant he got some value for the guy. If he tried trading after Quinn ends up starting he'd likely get nothing for him. Also last week proved that Anderson is the better 'filler' QB till Quinn is ready so Frye was going to get benched which would have chopped his trade value down even further. The morons on ESPN and trolls from other teams want to try and say this is bad deal, BWAAA HAAA HAAAAA. Gimme a break. - SIXTEEN consecuative games dating back to his rookie season in 2005 Charlie Frye has turned the ball over either with an INT or fumble, SIXTEEN CONSECUTIVE GAMES!!!!!!!! That may be an all-time NFL record of futility.

- EIGHTEEN SACKS is what Charlie took in 9 quarters of play against the Pittsburgh Steelers, EIGHTEEN SACKS!!!!!!!!!!

- Derek Anderson took ONE SACK in his 7 quarters of play.

Frye 18 sacks in / 9 quarters of play so his sack percentage per quarter is = 200%

Anderson = 1 sack in / 7 quarters of play so his sack percentage per Q is = .14%

The idiots on ESPN say that Quinn will get killed behind the Browns offensive line because the MORONS use sack statistics of CHARLIE FRYE.

FRYE is the reason the line gave up so many sacks. He held the ball too long.

That Savage got a sixth round draft choice is amazing but the smooth craniums at ESPN studios think getting rid of the smoe was a bad move? BWAAAAAA HAAAAAAAA HAAAA.

 

[Evilgrin 72]

Steelers -4.5

I think the Browns should be better than they were last year but I think the Steelers are better too. Bottom line, I don't see Charlie Frye and Jamal Lewis making enough plays against the Steelers D to win the game. The Browns will need some turnovers or big special teams plays to shorten the field and pull out a victory here. I don't see it happening.

Steelers 27

Browns 17

The Browns have improved. Joe Thomas and Eric Stienbeck on the left side. JT looks like he will turn into one of the better run blocking offensive linemen. Hank Fraley was signed days before last year's kickoff and now he has a year with the team, he's a solid veteran. The suspension of ORT Ryan Tucker is covered by former starting OLT Shafer who slid over and is a capable fill-in. Last year RB Reuben Droughns was coming off a police blotter filled offseason of a DUI and a domestic disturbance incident and then got injured. Jamal Lewis is an upgrade.

TE Kellen Winslow Jr. was coming off his second consecutive IR season then tied HOF TE Ozzie Newsome's club single season reception record. Joe Thomas will free him up, he won't have to stay in and chip the DE allowing him to get off the LOS clean so he'll split the seam on deeper routes.

WR Braylon Edwards was coming off an ACL injury months before schedule. He has looked sensational this preseason. .

Last year QB Charlie Frye was gifted the starting QB job then ran into all sorts of problems, the line, WR/TE/RB. He played pretty gritty at first but it unravelled and he got injured. He needs to snap his 15 game turnover streak intact from his rookie season. He's getting the ball off quicker and feels pressure better than in the past. He has improved his game.

Last year, the defense had two rookie starting LBers in middle LB D'Qwell Jackson and OLB Kamerion Wimbley. Wimbley had 11 sacks and looks even better now. D'Qwell has bulked up and is filling gaps quicker, he looks very active. He could make a big leap in his play. Free agent acquisition Antwan Peek has flashed pass rush and big play ability. Willie McGhinnest is out so Antwan is starting. Peek played for DC Ted Granthan with the Texans. Leon Williams looked great when D'Qwell Jackson landed on IR the last few games so he provides depth.

The secondary was a MASH unit. Both starting CBs went out on IR and the backup landed on IR. Injuries helped establish depth as Lee Bodden emerged. Rookie CB Eric Wright has been solid in his positioning and made plays but he knows the Steelers will target him. SS Sean Jones emerged as one of the top five SS's in the league last year. FS Brodney Poole helped cover for the corner injuries. He won't have burdensome coverage responsibilities so he'll be freed up to play center field to allow a true deep cover-two defense scheme to be played.

On the Steeler side, Big Ben should improve. He stopped on oncoming windshield with his face and then had his appendix rupture. His QB passer rating was way off. He looked sharper in the preseason and Tomlin wants to air it out. Santiago Homles looks much improved as well and I would imagine Heath Miller will make a big stride this year. I think the Steelers lost something when Cowher and Porter left and I don't see anyone filling those voids. The rookie LBers won't fill Porter's hole right away. Maybe by the end of the season but not out of the gate. Tomlin is still a question mark till he proves himself. I think Romeo and Granthan can coach defense and now they are begining to get talented players to coach.

The QBs will play a huge role. Big Ben will test the rookie CB Eric Wright deep. Will Charlie Frye protect the ball? Will his pass protection hold up and specific to pass protection how will rookie starting OLT Joe Thomas look?

I have no idea what the score will be. The Browns are improved but how much improvement they will show on the field we'll see on Sunday.

One thing I know for certain...

This isn't the same Browns team of last year.

Tomlin>>>>>>>>Crennel

Based on what? I'm not a big Crennel supporter, but what makes you think Tomlin could have done >>>>>>>> better than Crennel given the Browns' talent the past couple of seasons?

Based on the fact that Crennel suxor big time! Savage has done great things via the draft the last 2 yrs, but Romeo is a horrible HC. There is no debating that.

Oh? No debating that? You couldn't make one point to support your stance. And the point on top of your head doesn't count kid. Three Super Bowl trophies says that Crennel can coach. You have what to support your lame claim? Your shouting? Run along kid, people are talking football here.

Do you still want to own your statements that Romeo is not a terrible HC after that debacle in the Browns home opener? 5 digiter nuff said. I don't have to prove that Romeo is a horrible HC, because he does it for me.

You haven't made a point kid. Show that personnel wasn't the difference but that bad coaching moves by Romeo Crennel lost and good coaching moves made by Tomlin were what decided the outcome of the game. Prove that coaching was what determined the outcome of this game. Own up to your lame smak kid or get lost.

If you still think Romeo is a good HC, well then there is no hope for you. Even the most devoted Browns fans know that he stinks. BGP even knows this. BGP>>>>>Bracie Smathers. Nuff said. Checkmate. I am done gloating in this thread and return you to your previously scheduled programming.

Couldn't come up with a coaching move eh kid? Didn't think so, actually I KNEW you couldn't. I am gloating over your ignorance. Given a simple task to prove coaching rather than personnel decided the outcome of the game and you couldn't. Owned. Can you say exposed? Bwaaaa haaaaa haaaaaaa.

How about determining your starting QB by a coin flip, then yanking the guy after a quarter and a half? I'd say that's about the worst set of decisions I've seen by a HC in my entire life.

 

[Evilgrin 72]

- SIXTEEN consecuative games dating back to his rookie season in 2005 Charlie Frye has turned the ball over either with an INT or fumble, SIXTEEN CONSECUTIVE GAMES!!!!!!!! That may be an all-time NFL record of futility.- EIGHTEEN SACKS is what Charlie took in 9 quarters of play against the Pittsburgh Steelers, EIGHTEEN SACKS!!!!!!!!!!- Derek Anderson took ONE SACK in his 7 quarters of play.Frye 18 sacks in / 9 quarters of play so his sack percentage per quarter is = 200%Anderson = 1 sack in / 7 quarters of play so his sack percentage per Q is = .14%The idiots on ESPN say that Quinn will get killed behind the Browns offensive line because the MORONS use sack statistics of CHARLIE FRYE. FRYE is the reason the line gave up so many sacks. He held the ball too long.

Yet, Crennel chose to start him over Anderson. Why? If you're aware of these statistics, shouldn't the Browns' brass also be? Yet to continue to say Crennel is a good coach and challenge people to point out reasons he isn't? You just did it yourself with this post. Jesus, even BGP knows Crennel sucks and he's the most delusional SOB this side of Walter Mitty.

 

[amnesiac]

WTAM 1100 AM drive time host Mike Trivisonno had this to say this afternoon (paraphrased):

Mike had said since last year that Romeo Crennel simply is not a head coach. He's a good defensive coordinator but that's it.
Browns GM Phil Savage is also over-promoted - he is not a GM - he is a scout and has not shown any growth since he took over.
Mike heard that Browns owner Randy Lerner was at the game and at some point, got up, left his booth, walked into the Browns locker room and sat there alone and quiet.
Mike said the Browns offered the head coaching job to two people this past offseason, and both turned them down.
If Romeo is fired in mid-season, Mike said that Browns Defensive Coordinator Todd Grantham would be named interim head coach.
Mike said that no expert predicted that Romeo was not the right choice. No expert predicted that Savage was not the right choice. So how can it be Lerner's fault if he hired the guys he was supposed to hire?
Mike said that if Romeo is fired, and Savage is let go, expect Randy Lerner to put the franchise up for sale.

OMFG THE SKY IS FALLING!!!

 

[Frenchy Fuqua]

Think Savage is feeling the heat this week? His "upgraded" O-line may have been the Browns biggest Week 1 disappointment. The Browns tied up Eric Steinbach (7 yrs $49 mill) and Joe Thomas (5 yrs $43 mill) with huge contracts. The two combined to allow 3 of the Steelers 6 sacks (Thomas) (Steinbach) against a revamped D minus Joey Porter. The Browns running attack managed only 46 yards on 16 carries (2.9 AVG).

 

[3C's]

If Quinn was signed on time this trade would have gone down sooner and Savage is right, trading Frye now meant he got some value for the guy. That Savage got a sixth round draft choice is amazing but the smooth craniums at ESPN studios think getting rid of the smoe was a bad move? BWAAAAAA HAAAAAAAA HAAAA.

They were lucky to get something for him. He wasn't a happy camper and might have been a "locker room distraction." But, the Seahawks 6th round pick will be a late 6th. Essentially a nobody, a guy that probably won't make the team.

 

[amnesiac]

Think Savage is feeling the heat this week? His "upgraded" O-line may have been the Browns biggest Week 1 disappointment. The Browns tied up Eric Steinbach (7 yrs $49 mill) and Joe Thomas (5 yrs $43 mill) with huge contracts. The two combined to allow 3 of the Steelers 6 sacks (Thomas) (Steinbach) against a revamped D minus Joey Porter. The Browns running attack managed only 46 yards on 16 carries (2.9 AVG).

1. Thomas is a rookie2. the one sack i distinctly recall Thomas had his guy locked up, and Frye walked around Thomas, right into the defender, who only had to reach out and grab Frye at that point.

3. in general, i blame a lot of Frye's sacks on Frye, but that doesn't mean that the O-Line doesn't need to play better.

 

[schaef2k]

Think Savage is feeling the heat this week? His "upgraded" O-line may have been the Browns biggest Week 1 disappointment. The Browns tied up Eric Steinbach (7 yrs $49 mill) and Joe Thomas (5 yrs $43 mill) with huge contracts. The two combined to allow 3 of the Steelers 6 sacks (Thomas) (Steinbach) against a revamped D minus Joey Porter. The Browns running attack managed only 46 yards on 16 carries (2.9 AVG).

1. Thomas is a rookie2. the one sack i distinctly recall Thomas had his guy locked up, and Frye walked around Thomas, right into the defender, who only had to reach out and grab Frye at that point.

3. in general, i blame a lot of Frye's sacks on Frye, but that doesn't mean that the O-Line doesn't need to play better.

I agree here. Frye 5 sacks in 1 quarter, Anderson 1 sack the rest of the game. The stoolers had 8 or 9 coming the entire game so it doesn't look like it's the line as much as Frye being afraid to throw the ball.

 

[amnesiac]

Think Savage is feeling the heat this week? His "upgraded" O-line may have been the Browns biggest Week 1 disappointment. The Browns tied up Eric Steinbach (7 yrs $49 mill) and Joe Thomas (5 yrs $43 mill) with huge contracts. The two combined to allow 3 of the Steelers 6 sacks (Thomas) (Steinbach) against a revamped D minus Joey Porter. The Browns running attack managed only 46 yards on 16 carries (2.9 AVG).

1. Thomas is a rookie2. the one sack i distinctly recall Thomas had his guy locked up, and Frye walked around Thomas, right into the defender, who only had to reach out and grab Frye at that point.

3. in general, i blame a lot of Frye's sacks on Frye, but that doesn't mean that the O-Line doesn't need to play better.

I agree here. Frye 5 sacks in 1 quarter, Anderson 1 sack the rest of the game. The stoolers had 8 or 9 coming the entire game so it doesn't look like it's the line as much as Frye being afraid to throw the ball.

i lost count on how many times Frye appeared to pump fake as he realized to late where to throw the ball.

 

[Bobcat10]

Think Savage is feeling the heat this week? His "upgraded" O-line may have been the Browns biggest Week 1 disappointment. The Browns tied up Eric Steinbach (7 yrs $49 mill) and Joe Thomas (5 yrs $43 mill) with huge contracts. The two combined to allow 3 of the Steelers 6 sacks (Thomas) (Steinbach) against a revamped D minus Joey Porter. The Browns running attack managed only 46 yards on 16 carries (2.9 AVG).

1. Thomas is a rookie2. the one sack i distinctly recall Thomas had his guy locked up, and Frye walked around Thomas, right into the defender, who only had to reach out and grab Frye at that point.

3. in general, i blame a lot of Frye's sacks on Frye, but that doesn't mean that the O-Line doesn't need to play better.

I agree here. Frye 5 sacks in 1 quarter, Anderson 1 sack the rest of the game. The stoolers had 8 or 9 coming the entire game so it doesn't look like it's the line as much as Frye being afraid to throw the ball.

It's been rumored for a while now, that the OLine feels it's much easier to protect Anderson because you know pretty much where he'll be.

 

[schaef2k]

It's been rumored for a while now, that the OLine feels it's much easier to protect Anderson because you know pretty much where he'll be.

I can believe that. Also Anderson gets rid of the ball quickly (not always to the right team) and from the limited action I've seen from Quinn, he also gets rid of it quick. 3 seconds and it's gone. I think we'll get to see the mighty Quinn by the second half sunday.

 

[amnesiac]

It's been rumored for a while now, that the OLine feels it's much easier to protect Anderson because you know pretty much where he'll be.

I can believe that. Also Anderson gets rid of the ball quickly (not always to the right team) and from the limited action I've seen from Quinn, he also gets rid of it quick. 3 seconds and it's gone. I think we'll get to see the mighty Quinn by the second half sunday.

that's one thing i found really encouraging about his preseason action, Quinn seems to get rid of the ball quickly. of course, once he's facing a real defense, that may change.they are claiming on the radio this morning that Crennell said if Anderson struggles, he won't hesitate to put in Quinn. this seems quite a reversal of what their stance has been up till now.

 

[Bracie Smathers]

How about determining your starting QB by a coin flip, then yanking the guy after a quarter and a half? I'd say that's about the worst set of decisions I've seen by a HC in my entire life.

Lets get this on the record for all to see so they can judge the football IQ of Evil Grin.- a QB start decision

- made in worthless preseason game

- concerning two QBs who have identical QB passer ratings

- team has drafted a 1st rd. QB so either would be lame a lame duck till the kid is ready to take over

- coach understands the situation that it doesn't matter who is named starter

- makes a flippant remark

- MORONS on ESPN make a big deal of it

- MORONS like Evil Grin say ITS THE WORST COACHING DECISION THAT HE'S EVER SEEN IN HIS LIFE



Let me guess, your a POS Steeler troll?

 

[Evilgrin 72]

How about determining your starting QB by a coin flip, then yanking the guy after a quarter and a half? I'd say that's about the worst set of decisions I've seen by a HC in my entire life.

Lets get this on the record for all to see so they can judge the football IQ of Evil Grin.- a QB start decision

- made in worthless preseason game

- concerning two QBs who have identical QB passer ratings

- team has drafted a 1st rd. QB so either would be lame a lame duck till the kid is ready to take over

- coach understands the situation that it doesn't matter who is named starter

- makes a flippant remark

- MORONS on ESPN make a big deal of it

- MORONS like Evil Grin say ITS THE WORST COACHING DECISION THAT HE'S EVER SEEN IN HIS LIFE



Let me guess, your a POS Steeler troll?

Holy cow. OK, so let's review.Crennel determines his starting QB by flipping a coin.

Said QB comes in the game week 1 and stinks the place out. Crennel benches him barely into the second quarter.

Within days after the game, said QB is traded away for a 6th round pick.

And you're defending this. This team is a trainwreck. They were beaten brutally in every facet of the game on Sunday. They committed 4 penalties on one play. The entire team looked beaten from the onset. And you call this good coaching? You posted a manifesto recently on how Frye held the ball too long and how he was sacked non-stop by Pittsburgh, yet you say the decision to start him vs. that Pittsburgh team "doesn't matter"? Are you conceding defeat before the game starts, or are you just horribly inconsistent in your smack talk?

Crennel is 10-23 as a head coach. That's a .303 winning percentage. That's lower than Rich Kotite's career winning percentage. Lower than Ray Handley's. Lower than Butch Davis' in Cleveland. Lower than Dave Campo. He's in Joe Bugle territory. Hey, at least he's better than Chris Palmer, right?

Keep defending him, though. Keep calling people morons and posting lots of smileys and BWAHAHAHAs so your bluster can hopefully distract people from the fact that you have no clue what you're talking about. I guess all the pundits across the country saying that benching Frye in the first quarter and trading him the same week was the worst possible message the Browns could send the players are morons too, huh? I guess morale, job security, support from management, and the concept that the season is salvageable are all completely unimportant too, huh? This is why the Browns are the laughingstock of the AFC and have been for years. But don't worry, you keep showing your "football IQ" by either defending or at least tacitly approving these moves. People who really know football can tell the difference between someone who knows the game and a blind homer that tries to distract people from his idiocy with a lot of and BIG CAPITAL LETTERS. I'd drop this if I were you. You don't want none of me, think it through.

 

[Bobcat10]

How about determining your starting QB by a coin flip, then yanking the guy after a quarter and a half? I'd say that's about the worst set of decisions I've seen by a HC in my entire life.

Lets get this on the record for all to see so they can judge the football IQ of Evil Grin.- a QB start decision

- made in worthless preseason game

- concerning two QBs who have identical QB passer ratings

- team has drafted a 1st rd. QB so either would be lame a lame duck till the kid is ready to take over

- coach understands the situation that it doesn't matter who is named starter

- makes a flippant remark

- MORONS on ESPN make a big deal of it

- MORONS like Evil Grin say ITS THE WORST COACHING DECISION THAT HE'S EVER SEEN IN HIS LIFE



Let me guess, your a POS Steeler troll?

Evil Grin is good people, albeit a Steelers fan, generally the best of his kind (as strange as they are). He has come in here to lay some bombs lately though, I've just decided to stay away. Romeo stinks anyways.

 

[Bobcat10]

How about determining your starting QB by a coin flip, then yanking the guy after a quarter and a half? I'd say that's about the worst set of decisions I've seen by a HC in my entire life.

Lets get this on the record for all to see so they can judge the football IQ of Evil Grin.- a QB start decision

- made in worthless preseason game

- concerning two QBs who have identical QB passer ratings

- team has drafted a 1st rd. QB so either would be lame a lame duck till the kid is ready to take over

- coach understands the situation that it doesn't matter who is named starter

- makes a flippant remark

- MORONS on ESPN make a big deal of it

- MORONS like Evil Grin say ITS THE WORST COACHING DECISION THAT HE'S EVER SEEN IN HIS LIFE



Let me guess, your a POS Steeler troll?

Holy cow. OK, so let's review.Crennel determines his starting QB by flipping a coin.

Said QB comes in the game week 1 and stinks the place out. Crennel benches him barely into the second quarter.

Within days after the game, said QB is traded away for a 6th round pick.

And you're defending this. This team is a trainwreck. They were beaten brutally in every facet of the game on Sunday. They committed 4 penalties on one play. The entire team looked beaten from the onset. And you call this good coaching? You posted a manifesto recently on how Frye held the ball too long and how he was sacked non-stop by Pittsburgh, yet you say the decision to start him vs. that Pittsburgh team "doesn't matter"? Are you conceding defeat before the game starts, or are you just horribly inconsistent in your smack talk?

Crennel is 10-23 as a head coach. That's a .303 winning percentage. That's lower than Rich Kotite's career winning percentage. Lower than Ray Handley's. Lower than Butch Davis' in Cleveland. Lower than Dave Campo. He's in Joe Bugle territory. Hey, at least he's better than Chris Palmer, right?

Keep defending him, though. Keep calling people morons and posting lots of smileys and BWAHAHAHAs so your bluster can hopefully distract people from the fact that you have no clue what you're talking about. I guess all the pundits across the country saying that benching Frye in the first quarter and trading him the same week was the worst possible message the Browns could send the players are morons too, huh? I guess morale, job security, support from management, and the concept that the season is salvageable are all completely unimportant too, huh? This is why the Browns are the laughingstock of the AFC and have been for years. But don't worry, you keep showing your "football IQ" by either defending or at least tacitly approving these moves. People who really know football can tell the difference between someone who knows the game and a blind homer that tries to distract people from his idiocy with a lot of and BIG CAPITAL LETTERS. I'd drop this if I were you. You don't want none of me, think it through.

It's just been one game, and it was a bad one. I agree with some of what you say (Romeo is all but a goner and sucks), but properly prepared this team should not be on laughingstock level.

 

[Bracie Smathers]

How about determining your starting QB by a coin flip, then yanking the guy after a quarter and a half? I'd say that's about the worst set of decisions I've seen by a HC in my entire life.

Lets get this on the record for all to see so they can judge the football IQ of Evil Grin.- a QB start decision

- made in worthless preseason game

- concerning two QBs who have identical QB passer ratings

- team has drafted a 1st rd. QB so either would be lame a lame duck till the kid is ready to take over

- coach understands the situation that it doesn't matter who is named starter

- makes a flippant remark

- MORONS on ESPN make a big deal of it

- MORONS like Evil Grin say ITS THE WORST COACHING DECISION THAT HE'S EVER SEEN IN HIS LIFE



Let me guess, your a POS Steeler troll?

Holy cow. OK, so let's review.Crennel determines his starting QB by flipping a coin.

And EVIL GRIN said it was the worst coaching decision that he's EVER seen in his ENTIRE LIFE.Yeah, you want to stand by those words? No.

Instead you want to change the subject. Thought so.

Unless you want to address what you call the worst coaching decision that you've seen your ENTIRE LIFE then consider yourself...

Busted!

 

[Evilgrin 72]

How about determining your starting QB by a coin flip, then yanking the guy after a quarter and a half? I'd say that's about the worst set of decisions I've seen by a HC in my entire life.

Lets get this on the record for all to see so they can judge the football IQ of Evil Grin.- a QB start decision

- made in worthless preseason game

- concerning two QBs who have identical QB passer ratings

- team has drafted a 1st rd. QB so either would be lame a lame duck till the kid is ready to take over

- coach understands the situation that it doesn't matter who is named starter

- makes a flippant remark

- MORONS on ESPN make a big deal of it

- MORONS like Evil Grin say ITS THE WORST COACHING DECISION THAT HE'S EVER SEEN IN HIS LIFE



Let me guess, your a POS Steeler troll?

Evil Grin is good people, albeit a Steelers fan, generally the best of his kind (as strange as they are). He has come in here to lay some bombs lately though, I've just decided to stay away. Romeo stinks anyways.

See, a voice of reason. I apologize to any of you good Browns fans I may offend with my taunting of BGP and now this fruit-loop. Please know it's directed squarely at them and not the rest of you good folks. I dropped a bomb on BGP because I can't resist. Now this Smathers guy comes along. The rest of you Browns fans should disown these two (I'm looking at you too, wadegarrett and The Gator.) So many of you are good guys and reasonable fans, these two morons are making you look bad with their ridiculousness.

 

[Evilgrin 72]

How about determining your starting QB by a coin flip, then yanking the guy after a quarter and a half? I'd say that's about the worst set of decisions I've seen by a HC in my entire life.

Lets get this on the record for all to see so they can judge the football IQ of Evil Grin.- a QB start decision

- made in worthless preseason game

- concerning two QBs who have identical QB passer ratings

- team has drafted a 1st rd. QB so either would be lame a lame duck till the kid is ready to take over

- coach understands the situation that it doesn't matter who is named starter

- makes a flippant remark

- MORONS on ESPN make a big deal of it

- MORONS like Evil Grin say ITS THE WORST COACHING DECISION THAT HE'S EVER SEEN IN HIS LIFE



Let me guess, your a POS Steeler troll?

Holy cow. OK, so let's review.Crennel determines his starting QB by flipping a coin.

Said QB comes in the game week 1 and stinks the place out. Crennel benches him barely into the second quarter.

Within days after the game, said QB is traded away for a 6th round pick.

And you're defending this. This team is a trainwreck. They were beaten brutally in every facet of the game on Sunday. They committed 4 penalties on one play. The entire team looked beaten from the onset. And you call this good coaching? You posted a manifesto recently on how Frye held the ball too long and how he was sacked non-stop by Pittsburgh, yet you say the decision to start him vs. that Pittsburgh team "doesn't matter"? Are you conceding defeat before the game starts, or are you just horribly inconsistent in your smack talk?

Crennel is 10-23 as a head coach. That's a .303 winning percentage. That's lower than Rich Kotite's career winning percentage. Lower than Ray Handley's. Lower than Butch Davis' in Cleveland. Lower than Dave Campo. He's in Joe Bugle territory. Hey, at least he's better than Chris Palmer, right?

Keep defending him, though. Keep calling people morons and posting lots of smileys and BWAHAHAHAs so your bluster can hopefully distract people from the fact that you have no clue what you're talking about. I guess all the pundits across the country saying that benching Frye in the first quarter and trading him the same week was the worst possible message the Browns could send the players are morons too, huh? I guess morale, job security, support from management, and the concept that the season is salvageable are all completely unimportant too, huh? This is why the Browns are the laughingstock of the AFC and have been for years. But don't worry, you keep showing your "football IQ" by either defending or at least tacitly approving these moves. People who really know football can tell the difference between someone who knows the game and a blind homer that tries to distract people from his idiocy with a lot of and BIG CAPITAL LETTERS. I'd drop this if I were you. You don't want none of me, think it through.

It's just been one game, and it was a bad one. I agree with some of what you say (Romeo is all but a goner and sucks), but properly prepared this team should not be on laughingstock level.

Exactly. They shouldn't be, but they are. Reason is - Crennel's ridiculous decisions surrounding the QB position, and the ensuing trade. Sports radio hosts were openly laughing about this, asking what the hell is wrong with the Browns. That's no good, and that's on Crennel and Savage.

 

[Evilgrin 72]

How about determining your starting QB by a coin flip, then yanking the guy after a quarter and a half? I'd say that's about the worst set of decisions I've seen by a HC in my entire life.

Lets get this on the record for all to see so they can judge the football IQ of Evil Grin.- a QB start decision

- made in worthless preseason game

- concerning two QBs who have identical QB passer ratings

- team has drafted a 1st rd. QB so either would be lame a lame duck till the kid is ready to take over

- coach understands the situation that it doesn't matter who is named starter

- makes a flippant remark

- MORONS on ESPN make a big deal of it

- MORONS like Evil Grin say ITS THE WORST COACHING DECISION THAT HE'S EVER SEEN IN HIS LIFE



Let me guess, your a POS Steeler troll?

Holy cow. OK, so let's review.Crennel determines his starting QB by flipping a coin.

And EVIL GRIN said it was the worst coaching decision that he's EVER seen in his ENTIRE LIFE.Yeah, you want to stand by those words? No.

Instead you want to change the subject. Thought so.

Unless you want to address what you call the worst coaching decision that you've seen your ENTIRE LIFE then consider yourself...

Busted!

Hyperbole down? It was the worst coaching move I've seen in recent memory and I can't think of a worse set of personnel decisions, period. So, yeah, I'll stand by it. And my entire previous post addressed it.#1 - You don't choose your starting QB by coin toss. And if you do, you don't say so. Even if he didn't, saying so made him look like a fool.

#2 - Once you choose a starting QB, stick with him for more than 15 minutes. Not doing so makes you look indecisive and sends a terrible message to the team that the coach has no clue. Justifying it by saying "I wanted the team to know I was doing everything possible to win" is asinine. If Anderson was the guy to beat Pittsburgh (and you yourself made that case earlier) then he should have been starting.

#3 - Trading away your "#1" QB after 1 week to make room for Ken Dorsey also looks absurd. Whether it is or not, it appears as if you've all but given up on the season. This isn't just my opinion, either - this has been the pervading sentiment in the national media. It makes the front office/coaching staff look like they have no idea what they're doing and absolutely deteriorates team morale. Obviously, the front office makes those decisions, but don't tell me Romeo isn't involved.

So, there you go. Not even touching on the awful job he did preparing the team to play, there are three reasons why the QB situation in Cleveland has been mishandled as poorly as anything I've seen. So, go ahead and keep defending it and looking like a clown. Even your fellow Browns fans disagree with you for God's sake.

 

[Bobcat10]

How about determining your starting QB by a coin flip, then yanking the guy after a quarter and a half? I'd say that's about the worst set of decisions I've seen by a HC in my entire life.

Lets get this on the record for all to see so they can judge the football IQ of Evil Grin.- a QB start decision

- made in worthless preseason game

- concerning two QBs who have identical QB passer ratings

- team has drafted a 1st rd. QB so either would be lame a lame duck till the kid is ready to take over

- coach understands the situation that it doesn't matter who is named starter

- makes a flippant remark

- MORONS on ESPN make a big deal of it

- MORONS like Evil Grin say ITS THE WORST COACHING DECISION THAT HE'S EVER SEEN IN HIS LIFE



Let me guess, your a POS Steeler troll?

Holy cow. OK, so let's review.Crennel determines his starting QB by flipping a coin.

Said QB comes in the game week 1 and stinks the place out. Crennel benches him barely into the second quarter.

Within days after the game, said QB is traded away for a 6th round pick.

And you're defending this. This team is a trainwreck. They were beaten brutally in every facet of the game on Sunday. They committed 4 penalties on one play. The entire team looked beaten from the onset. And you call this good coaching? You posted a manifesto recently on how Frye held the ball too long and how he was sacked non-stop by Pittsburgh, yet you say the decision to start him vs. that Pittsburgh team "doesn't matter"? Are you conceding defeat before the game starts, or are you just horribly inconsistent in your smack talk?

Crennel is 10-23 as a head coach. That's a .303 winning percentage. That's lower than Rich Kotite's career winning percentage. Lower than Ray Handley's. Lower than Butch Davis' in Cleveland. Lower than Dave Campo. He's in Joe Bugle territory. Hey, at least he's better than Chris Palmer, right?

Keep defending him, though. Keep calling people morons and posting lots of smileys and BWAHAHAHAs so your bluster can hopefully distract people from the fact that you have no clue what you're talking about. I guess all the pundits across the country saying that benching Frye in the first quarter and trading him the same week was the worst possible message the Browns could send the players are morons too, huh? I guess morale, job security, support from management, and the concept that the season is salvageable are all completely unimportant too, huh? This is why the Browns are the laughingstock of the AFC and have been for years. But don't worry, you keep showing your "football IQ" by either defending or at least tacitly approving these moves. People who really know football can tell the difference between someone who knows the game and a blind homer that tries to distract people from his idiocy with a lot of and BIG CAPITAL LETTERS. I'd drop this if I were you. You don't want none of me, think it through.

It's just been one game, and it was a bad one. I agree with some of what you say (Romeo is all but a goner and sucks), but properly prepared this team should not be on laughingstock level.

Exactly. They shouldn't be, but they are. Reason is - Crennel's ridiculous decisions surrounding the QB position, and the ensuing trade. Sports radio hosts were openly laughing about this, asking what the hell is wrong with the Browns. That's no good, and that's on Crennel and Savage.

Whether it's saving face or not, apparently trading one of Frye/Anderson by this seasons trading deadline was the "plan" all along. I tend to believe this. They were going to do it right after the draft, but decided to hold off in case Quinn held out too long. As soon as Quinn got in, they should have dealt one right there IMO. Instead, Romeo ended up looking like a fool during last Sunday's game.I have no problem with the trade, and to think you could actually get something for Frye/Anderson is remarkable, just looking at all the QB's that hit the market after being dropped by teams unable to trade them.

 

[Evilgrin 72]

As soon as Quinn got in, they should have dealt one right there IMO. Instead, Romeo ended up looking like a fool during last Sunday's game.I have no problem with the trade, and to think you could actually get something for Frye/Anderson is remarkable, just looking at all the QB's that hit the market after being dropped by teams unable to trade them.

Agree 100%. It wasn't the move that was bad, it was the timing. Why not cut/trade both Frye and Anderson and sign Leftwich to a one-year deal to start. Put Dorsey as your #2 and let Quinn learn the ropes as the 3rd QB? Leftwich would likely jump at it because it would be a chance to show people he can still lead a team, Quinn gets a year to learn, and the guy they're likely going to end up starting (Dorsey) sits as a #2 where he belongs.

 

[Bobcat10]

Hyperbole down? It was the worst coaching move I've seen in recent memory and I can't think of a worse set of personnel decisions, period. So, yeah, I'll stand by it. And my entire previous post addressed it.#1 - You don't choose your starting QB by coin toss. And if you do, you don't say so. Even if he didn't, saying so made him look like a fool.#2 - Once you choose a starting QB, stick with him for more than 15 minutes. Not doing so makes you look indecisive and sends a terrible message to the team that the coach has no clue. Justifying it by saying "I wanted the team to know I was doing everything possible to win" is asinine. If Anderson was the guy to beat Pittsburgh (and you yourself made that case earlier) then he should have been starting.#3 - Trading away your "#1" QB after 1 week to make room for Ken Dorsey also looks absurd. Whether it is or not, it appears as if you've all but given up on the season. This isn't just my opinion, either - this has been the pervading sentiment in the national media. It makes the front office/coaching staff look like they have no idea what they're doing and absolutely deteriorates team morale. Obviously, the front office makes those decisions, but don't tell me Romeo isn't involved.So, there you go. Not even touching on the awful job he did preparing the team to play, there are three reasons why the QB situation in Cleveland has been mishandled as poorly as anything I've seen. So, go ahead and keep defending it and looking like a clown. Even your fellow Browns fans disagree with you for God's sake.

#1 - agree#2 - agree#3 - disagree. Quinn IS this teams #1 QB whether it shows up on the depth chart or not. See my other post for other details about the front office/coaching staff in regards to this.