2013 Hot Stove & Capella's Fabulous Cornhole Thread (2 Viewers)

[Eephus]

Rakuten Eagles President Yozo Tachibana spoke to the media on Thursday and mentioned a few things in relation to the new posting system agreement. Below are quotes taken from various sources.

"We have not received official word about the new agreement."

"Whether this is a fair amount for one pitcher, this is something we need to explain to the stockholders. Is that number fair? Is that methodology right? I think it will be important to make sure the fans understand."

"We are obligated to provide an explanation to stockholders and fans about whether or not this is a fair deal. We have to discuss this, and the methodology, internally."

"There is a chance we will not take the next step."

"There is a range we feel is appropriate. If the fans and everyone feels [the deal is not] reasonable, then there is a chance we can not move on to the next step."

"I will talk [to Tanaka] at least once [before I leave for the winter meetings in the US and he leaves for the championship trip to Hawaii]."

"We will talk to Tanaka once the agreement becomes official."

To clarify the quotes above, the Eagles are planning to hold internal discussions to see if makes sense to post Tanaka under the new rules. They also plan to take fan sentiment into consideration. It is possible they may decide not to post Tanaka.

 

[dparker713]

Yanks now have a 1B and SS that both missed a ton of time last year and a 3B they don't want and no 2B. Good luck with that, not to mention still really needing pitching with a very thin FA market.

Because you just know the Yankees are going to stand pat. No more moves for them now!!!

Well, their entire infield has question marks, some of which they really can't avoid. Their depth had better be stellar.

 

[Da Guru]

Amazing at how the market works. The Yankees overpay for Ellsbury..that in turn will net Choo more money. Omar Infante is sitting at home hoping for a "3-15 to 20" deal somewhere and reads that the Mariners just signed Cano away from the Yankees for 240. Now the Yankees have lots of money but no second baseman. Now that 3-15 could be a 3-25 to 30 type of deal for Omar.

 

[JaxBill]

Curious move by Marlins. Reportedly signing garrett jones....so they can trade LoMo. Not sure what that gets them aside from older....and fewer tweets.

 

[Eephus]

Curious move by Marlins. Reportedly signing garrett jones....so they can trade LoMo. Not sure what that gets them aside from older....and fewer tweets.

Jones and Rafael Furcal are this year's Juan Pierre and Placido Polanco.

I like the Astros' approach much better. If you throw enough cheap minor leaguers against the wall, a couple are likely to stick and be usable assets under team control when their young talent arrives.

 

[guru_007]

Curious move by Marlins. Reportedly signing garrett jones....so they can trade LoMo. Not sure what that gets them aside from older....and fewer tweets.

Jones and Rafael Furcal are this year's Juan Pierre and Placido Polanco.

I like the Astros' approach much better. If you throw enough cheap minor leaguers against the wall, a couple are likely to stick and be usable assets under team control when their young talent arrives.

Astros approach? You mean, deplete your farm system completely, overpay for aged players, make one run to the World Series, and then set franchise record for losses three consecutive years and become the first team in history to have three consecutive #1 picks?yeah, this approach is working wonders.

 

[dparker713]

Curious move by Marlins. Reportedly signing garrett jones....so they can trade LoMo. Not sure what that gets them aside from older....and fewer tweets.

Jones and Rafael Furcal are this year's Juan Pierre and Placido Polanco.

I like the Astros' approach much better. If you throw enough cheap minor leaguers against the wall, a couple are likely to stick and be usable assets under team control when their young talent arrives.

Astros approach? You mean, deplete your farm system completely, overpay for aged players, make one run to the World Series, and then set franchise record for losses three consecutive years and become the first team in history to have three consecutive #1 picks?yeah, this approach is working wonders.

No, that's not what he means at all.

 

[Eephus]

Curious move by Marlins. Reportedly signing garrett jones....so they can trade LoMo. Not sure what that gets them aside from older....and fewer tweets.

Jones and Rafael Furcal are this year's Juan Pierre and Placido Polanco.

I like the Astros' approach much better. If you throw enough cheap minor leaguers against the wall, a couple are likely to stick and be usable assets under team control when their young talent arrives.

Astros approach? You mean, deplete your farm system completely, overpay for aged players, make one run to the World Series, and then set franchise record for losses three consecutive years and become the first team in history to have three consecutive #1 picks?yeah, this approach is working wonders.

I'm talking about the ra

Curious move by Marlins. Reportedly signing garrett jones....so they can trade LoMo. Not sure what that gets them aside from older....and fewer tweets.

Jones and Rafael Furcal are this year's Juan Pierre and Placido Polanco.

I like the Astros' approach much better. If you throw enough cheap minor leaguers against the wall, a couple are likely to stick and be usable assets under team control when their young talent arrives.

Astros approach? You mean, deplete your farm system completely, overpay for aged players, make one run to the World Series, and then set franchise record for losses three consecutive years and become the first team in history to have three consecutive #1 picks?yeah, this approach is working wonders.

No, that's not what he means at all.

I'm talking about the Crane/Luhnow regime

 

[guru_007]

oh, I knew what he meant, geeez

 

[ffldrew]

So who is smarter ? A Roomful of Hooters waitresses or Baseball Owners?

 

[Doctor Detroit]

So who is smarter ? A Roomful of Hooters waitresses or Baseball Owners?

It's all the TV money. Basically if you can spend, why wouldn't you? It's the American way.

 

[ffldrew]

So who is smarter ? A Roomful of Hooters waitresses or Baseball Owners?

It's all the TV money. Basically if you can spend, why wouldn't you? It's the American way.

And in 2 years they'll be crying about the contracts getting out of hand and locking the players out

 

[dparker713]

So who is smarter ? A Roomful of Hooters waitresses or Baseball Owners?

It's all the TV money. Basically if you can spend, why wouldn't you? It's the American way.

And in 2 years they'll be crying about the contracts getting out of hand and locking the players out

I doubt it. The percentage of overall revenue going to players has been going down. Plus the league has secured cost controls on US amateurs, international amateurs, and NPB transfers. I'd be surprised if we didn't see a cap to Cuban signings in the next round of negotiations, but they're a ways off since the league and the MLBPA just signed a CBA extension last season.

Plus, this year each team is receiving $24 million more per year from their national TV deals. MLB is a fairly close second to the NFL in revenue. Teams are awash in cash. Some of that is going to the players.

 

[Billy Bats]

Ellsbury in and Cano out is a net loss for the Yankees IMO. I guess Nick Punto is about to get a gritty 2/24 contract to be their 2Bman!

For the next few years, likely yes downgrade. In years 6/8/9/10 of the Cano contract when the Mariners are paying $24 a year for the type of production the Angels have been getting from Pujols it won't look that way.

Yeah, but he's going to have a HUGE year 7.

Apparently.

HoF talk is back in 2021.

 

[Eephus]

So who is smarter ? A Roomful of Hooters waitresses or Baseball Owners?

It's all the TV money. Basically if you can spend, why wouldn't you? It's the American way.

And in 2 years they'll be crying about the contracts getting out of hand and locking the players out

I doubt it. The percentage of overall revenue going to players has been going down. Plus the league has secured cost controls on US amateurs, international amateurs, and NPB transfers. I'd be surprised if we didn't see a cap to Cuban signings in the next round of negotiations, but they're a ways off since the league and the MLBPA just signed a CBA extension last season.

Plus, this year each team is receiving $24 million more per year from their national TV deals. MLB is a fairly close second to the NFL in revenue. Teams are awash in cash. Some of that is going to the players.

The current CBA protects the status quo pretty well, except the new compensation system hurts mid-level FAs with qualifying offers. It effectively caps salaries of draft picks for at least the first six years of their professional careers. This enables teams to spend the bulk of their payrolls on a smaller number of veteran players. The trend toward teams locking in their homegrown stars through their age 34-36 seasons helps drive the prices up for the smaller number of top players who reach free agency. In retrospect, the Yankees probably should have extended Cano a few years ago but it'll be the Mariners paying for his late 30s seasons.

Everybody is making money now. Even if the owners claim their margins are unacceptable, as long as their franchise values continue to appreciate, they can cash out whenever they choose. I think the system should be sustainable as long as the regional sports networks don't go bankrupt. Teams like the Astros with bad local TV deals are at a disadvantage but revenue sharing from luxury tax clubs will make up some of this.

 

[Billy Bats]

Ken Rosenthal: Sources: #Phillies trying to trade Papelbon.

3:33pm - 6 Dec 13

With 2/26 left plus a vesting year at 13m, yea good luck with that Reuben.

 

[shadyridr]

Feldman to the Stros for 3/30 :shocked:

 

[guru_007]

wtf the Astros doing.

 

[Eephus]

A team like the Astros have to overpay a bit because they suck. Feldman isn't good but he knows how to pitch and is better than anyone else the Astros have. Feldman, Cosart and Oberholtzer could potentially be a decent 3/5ths of a rotation.

 

[The Flying Elvis]

2 years 32 million for Napoli to the Red Sox.

Red Sox obviously kind of shot themselves in the foot with their 3 for 39 contract last year going to the 1 year deal but I'll take this deal.

2 for $32M is big money for Napoli but in this market it is doable to keep the 1B spot occupied until they can develop or find a longterm solution at 1B.

 

[shadyridr]

2 years 32 million for Napoli to the Red Sox.

Red Sox obviously kind of shot themselves in the foot with their 3 for 39 contract last year going to the 1 year deal but I'll take this deal.

2 for $32M is big money for Napoli but in this market it is doable to keep the 1B spot occupied until they can develop or find a longterm solution at 1B.

shot themselves in the foot? Isnt 37 < 39. Im confused

 

[The Flying Elvis]

2 years 32 million for Napoli to the Red Sox.

Red Sox obviously kind of shot themselves in the foot with their 3 for 39 contract last year going to the 1 year deal but I'll take this deal.

2 for $32M is big money for Napoli but in this market it is doable to keep the 1B spot occupied until they can develop or find a longterm solution at 1B.

shot themselves in the foot? Isnt 37 < 39. Im confused

It's not terrible but he made I think $13M total with incentives last year. So basically an original 3 for $39M instead of now what amounts to 3 for $45M. Not a huge deal in the long run to have gain some risk management in the beginning of the deal.

 

[Billy Bats]

Rosenthal: Source: Beltran going to #Yankees. Three-year deal, per @FeinsandNYDN.

9:48pm - 6 Dec 13

 

[East Coast Bias]

Rosenthal: Source: Beltran going to #Yankees. Three-year deal, per @FeinsandNYDN.

9:48pm - 6 Dec 13

Ken Rosenthal ‏@Ken_Rosenthal

59s
Beltran $45 million for three years with #Yankees, per @TBrownYahoo.

 

[The Flying Elvis]

Good deal for Yankees and good for Beltran on getting the 3rd year. Ideally you want him on 2 for 30 but even if he can barely walk in three years it won't be any sort of albatross especially with the DH.

 

[Da Guru]

That is a good signing by the Yankees. Beltran will produce as much or more than Cano at the 3 spot..plus he is 10 million a year cheaper. The last year he can DH. The good part they are not locked into 10 years at 25 a year. Those long term deals with aging players just kill teams.

 

[Michael Brown]

That is a great signing by the Yankees. Beltran will produce as much or more than Cano at the 3 spot..plus he is 10 million a year cheaper. The last year he can DH. Plus they are not locked into 10 years. Those long term deals with aging players just kill teams.

10-year deals are considered bad because of how the players fall off a cliff in their late 30's...which is what Beltran will be for the three years of his Yankee contract. Yankee Stadium should help the numbers, but I'm not entirely sold on this one. And there's no way he produces as much or more than Cano. Cano's OPS was about 70 points higher last year and he's still in his prime. This helps, but it's not like there are no question marks now that we've signed a 37-year-old whose OPS has declined three straight years.

Regarding the Cano contract, the Yanks were in a no-win position. If Cano comes back, it's an awful Yankee contract and they were gonna regret it. If he left, they were losing their best player. I'm glad they didn't go to ten years and nearly a quarter of a billion dollars, but there's also no way they're a better team today than they were yesterday.

 

[Anarchy99]

So basically the Yanks lose Cano and Granderson and replace them with Ellsbury and Beltran. I realize they could still add pieces (maybe even some big ones) and it's not exactly an even exchange, but in the main I think they went backwards.

 

[Da Guru]

Beltran is a professional hitter. Playing at Yankee Stadium will put his OPS on the rise. Health is the key but health is the key to any player. Losing Cano they needed a solid bat in the middle of the order and they got one.

 

[Michael Brown]

So basically the Yanks lose Cano and Granderson and replace them with Ellsbury and Beltran. I realize they could still add pieces (maybe even some big ones) and it's not exactly an even exchange, but in the main I think they went backwards.

They also added McCann to replace Chris Stewart, so it's a net gain so far. And yeah I think they still add at least two pieces from where they're currently at.

 

[Good Posting Judge]

So basically the Yanks lose Cano and Granderson and replace them with Ellsbury and Beltran. I realize they could still add pieces (maybe even some big ones) and it's not exactly an even exchange, but in the main I think they went backwards.

Except Ellsbury and Beltran didn't cost as much AAV, and aren't signed for as long.

Put me in the minority, but I think Boston's Napoli contract is going to turn out to be a loser. Gauche as it may have been, I think Boston missed out by not getting Abreu.

 

[the moops]

Ichiro, Wells, Soriano, Beltran, Ellsbury, and Gardner

That is a crowded, expensive outfield.

 

[GOB]

I hope the Yankees put Soriano at second.

Would be like Chuck Knoblauch 2.0

But seriously, I like the Yankees decisions thus far. I don't think they are winning the pennant this year anyway but they also aren't crippling themselves

 

[Michael Brown]

Ichiro, Wells, Soriano, Beltran, Ellsbury, and Gardner

That is a crowded, expensive outfield.

True that they make a lot, but the Yanks aren't paying Wells and Soriano anything of substance really

 

[Brady Marino]

It really didn't hit me until he finally signed with another team how much I'm going to miss Beltran not being on the Cards.

When he signed, I thought he was this flake and cripple who got a bit fluky in San Fran after wearing out his welcome with the Mets. I didn't have faith in the guy to meet his end of the deal, whether it be injuries or performance.

But over time, he established himself to be tough by battling through his nagging knee issues. He established himself to be still a solid hitter. He established himself to still be functional in RF (I trust his glove more than Holliday's). But above all else, he really established himself as a true professional. He was a great teammate and he really grew on the fans here, who were still dealing with Post-Pujols Syndrome.

Most Cards fans accepted that Beltran likely wasn't a fit to return between his contract and development of Matt Adams and Oscar Taveras (especially the former). But still, I'll miss the guy. he gave the Cards two solid years and I truly believe he gave a ton of effort to both perform and stay in the lineup. I really respect that.

 

[the moops]

Ichiro, Wells, Soriano, Beltran, Ellsbury, and Gardner

That is a crowded, expensive outfield.

True that they make a lot, but the Yanks aren't paying Wells and Soriano anything of substance really

Yea, looks like Wells salary is mostly subsidized, and Ichiro is pretty small (as is Gardner). But how the hell do they deal with 6 outfielders? One, or two of them have got to go, right?

 

[dparker713]

So basically the Yanks lose Cano and Granderson and replace them with Ellsbury and Beltran. I realize they could still add pieces (maybe even some big ones) and it's not exactly an even exchange, but in the main I think they went backwards.

Except Ellsbury and Beltran didn't cost as much AAV, and aren't signed for as long.

Put me in the minority, but I think Boston's Napoli contract is going to turn out to be a loser. Gauche as it may have been, I think Boston missed out by not getting Abreu.

You realize that the lower cost for those two isn't improving the product elsewhere, it's going into the Steinbrenners' pockets. The Yankees could likely support a $300 million payroll. The Yankees limited resources are entirely self-imposed. This isn't a virtue.

 

[Raider Nation]

So basically the Yanks lose Cano and Granderson and replace them with Ellsbury and Beltran. I realize they could still add pieces (maybe even some big ones) and it's not exactly an even exchange, but in the main I think they went backwards.

Except Ellsbury and Beltran didn't cost as much AAV, and aren't signed for as long.

Put me in the minority, but I think Boston's Napoli contract is going to turn out to be a loser. Gauche as it may have been, I think Boston missed out by not getting Abreu.

You realize that the lower cost for those two isn't improving the product elsewhere, it's going into the Steinbrenners' pockets. The Yankees could likely support a $300 million payroll. The Yankees limited resources are entirely self-imposed. This isn't a virtue.

They aren't allowed to make any more moves? Good to know.

 

[SwampDawg]

Seems like Wells could be moved pretty easy since most of his contract is being paid for by the Angels, unless that changes if they trade him.

 

[Baloney Sandwich]

That is a good signing by the Yankees. Beltran will produce as much or more than Cano at the 3 spot..plus he is 10 million a year cheaper. The

last year he can DH. The good part they are not locked into 10 years at 25 a year. Those long term deals with aging players just kill teams.

He can DH that last year, of course the Yanks will have about 4-5 other players that will be best served at DH at that point. I think this is a good signing for NY but they have a ton of overpaid outfielders in their 30s (and one in their

40s) and only 2 major league legit starters who both happen to have big question marks.

 

[shadyridr]

Ichiro, Wells, Soriano, Beltran, Ellsbury, and Gardner

That is a crowded, expensive outfield.

True that they make a lot, but the Yanks aren't paying Wells and Soriano anything of substance really

Yea, looks like Wells salary is mostly subsidized, and Ichiro is pretty small (as is Gardner). But how the hell do they deal with 6 outfielders? One, or two of them have got to go, right?

wells and ichiro both suck. Wells can be easily dropped and ichiro can be 4th OF. That leaves 4 guys for 3 OF spots and DH

 

[Good Posting Judge]

So basically the Yanks lose Cano and Granderson and replace them with Ellsbury and Beltran. I realize they could still add pieces (maybe even some big ones) and it's not exactly an even exchange, but in the main I think they went backwards.

Except Ellsbury and Beltran didn't cost as much AAV, and aren't signed for as long.

Put me in the minority, but I think Boston's Napoli contract is going to turn out to be a loser. Gauche as it may have been, I think Boston missed out by not getting Abreu.

You realize that the lower cost for those two isn't improving the product elsewhere, it's going into the Steinbrenners' pockets. The Yankees could likely support a $300 million payroll. The Yankees limited resources are entirely self-imposed. This isn't a virtue.

Still a lot of time left in the off-season, and they just replaced a catcher making $15/hr with Brian McCann. You don't think they're financially incentivized to field a playoff team? And 300mm break-even is a wee bit steep.

BTW, every owner pockets some money year-after-year. It's a business to them.

 

[dparker713]

Yankees first 200 million payroll was in 2005. Everyone else's revenues and payrolls have exploded since then. Between that and the appreciation on the team, I've no doubt the Yanks can afford a whole lot more than they've been paying.

 

[Good Posting Judge]

Yankees first 200 million payroll was in 2005. Everyone else's revenues and payrolls have exploded since then. Between that and the appreciation on the team, I've no doubt the Yanks can afford a whole lot more than they've been paying.

Not when they're turning out a ####ty team. I know it strains believability, but Yankees fans don't exactly come out in droves through thick and thin.

 

[Paulymaggs]

What exactly is the infatuation with Beltran? The postseason performances?

The guy just finished a 2fWAR season at RF. Assuming the value of being a DH part time offsets the gains he'll have as a LH hitter in Yankee stadium, yanks just paid about 7.5mil per win. Not super value at all.

 

[Eephus]

Yankees first 200 million payroll was in 2005. Everyone else's revenues and payrolls have exploded since then. Between that and the appreciation on the team, I've no doubt the Yanks can afford a whole lot more than they've been paying.

Not when they're turning out a ####ty team. I know it strains believability, but Yankees fans don't exactly come out in droves through thick and thin.

They were fourth in MLB home attendance last year behind LA, St.L and SF. But the Yankees' average ticket price was second highest in the majors ($51.55 trailing only Fenway). They're doing fine in attendance based revenues.

 

[Raider Nation]

Are you sitting down?

Veteran reliever Chad Qualls has signed a two-year deal with the Houston Astros, according to Fox Sports’ Ken Rosenthal.

The deal is worth $6 million with a club option for a third year at $3.5 million.

Qualls, a 10-year veteran, could be Houston’s closer after serving as a setup man for most of his career. The 35-year-old has played for eight teams and started his career with the Astros in 2004-07. He is 45-37 with a 3.79 ERA in 663 appearances with 51 saves in 95 opportunities.

 

[shadyridr]

What exactly is the infatuation with Beltran? The postseason performances?

The guy just finished a 2fWAR season at RF. Assuming the value of being a DH part time offsets the gains he'll have as a LH hitter in Yankee stadium, yanks just paid about 7.5mil per win. Not super value at all.

I saw a sabr guy on mlb tv say a win is worth 7.5m now

 

[Billy Bats]

Are you sitting down?

Veteran reliever Chad Qualls has signed a two-year deal with the Houston Astros, according to Fox Sports Ken Rosenthal.

The deal is worth $6 million with a club option for a third year at $3.5 million.

Qualls, a 10-year veteran, could be Houstons closer after serving as a setup man for most of his career. The 35-year-old has played for eight teams and started his career with the Astros in 2004-07. He is 45-37 with a 3.79 ERA in 663 appearances with 51 saves in 95 opportunities.

Houston, we have a problem.

 

[Eephus]

Are you sitting down?

Veteran reliever Chad Qualls has signed a two-year deal with the Houston Astros, according to Fox Sports Ken Rosenthal.

The deal is worth $6 million with a club option for a third year at $3.5 million.

Qualls, a 10-year veteran, could be Houstons closer after serving as a setup man for most of his career. The 35-year-old has played for eight teams and started his career with the Astros in 2004-07. He is 45-37 with a 3.79 ERA in 663 appearances with 51 saves in 95 opportunities.

Houston, we have a problem.

He was very effective in 2013.