2021-22 NBA Thread: Bill Simmons furiously recording 2.5 hour long pod about how Boston is still better than Golden State (1 Viewer)

[rockaction]

Not really game has involved and more stuff happens. Some guys aren't comfortable talking about stuff they don't understand. I'd rather some one be quiet instead of acting like they know stuff on something they clearly don't. 

Jordan is the missing link between basketball capitalism and China. Perhaps you need to study your nineties Nike to understand that. It went from Jordan to Yao Ming and the Chinese were basketball starved. Jordan's arrival in China is epic in terms of basketball marketing history. It is, in one web site's opinion, like Nixon establishing diplomatic relations with China during his presidency, it's that big. 

Jordan not only knew the conditions, he oversaw Nike's foray into China. He is LeBron's father when it comes to that. Amazing the stuff that comes out of a person's mouth when they know not one iota better. Jordan is responsible for ChiCom's relentless pursuit of hybrid capitalism when it comes to sports marketing and basketball development. Know your history. 

 

[DJackson10]

He is not a better passer than Bird, Lebron, Webber or Nash just to name a few. 

He is also not a great defender. 

You forgot Vlade Divac in Conversations and Noah wasn't a slouch himself. one of the more underrated parts of his game in his Prime was Noah's ability to facilitate to others. Got over looked by the character he played on the court and other stuff he did defensively and his weird tornado shot. Divac is especially underrated as a passer. Divac and CWebb together was just unfair with their ability to facilitate as Bigs.  

 

[GordonGekko]

Enes Kanter Freedom is a breath of fresh air on the NBA. No one is off limits. Today he called out Jeremy Lin for not speaking out the China Government Dictatorship and called him a traitor for leaving his people out to dry when he could be making a difference rather then stay silent. 

Lin has relatives in Asia that the CCP can still reach. People who aren't under the protection of being a US citizen. Point to note, Kanter waited until he was a US citizen before he truly started unloading on everyone. Kanter is on record saying he blames himself for his father being thrown in prison for speaking out.

I can't really knock Lin here for wanting to protect his extended family. Point to note, the Uighurs are being forcibly sterilized and having their organs harvested. If Lin doesn't want some distant cousin waking up in a bathtub full of ice in some random concentration camp, I can't quite blame him here.

I'm always a little leery of purity tests demanding what a person "should" say out loud. LeBron James is a different matter. He's being held to the fire for things he's spoken out loud and has done so often by his own choice.

 

[DJackson10]

Lin has relatives in Asia that the CCP can still reach. People who aren't under the protection of being a US citizen. Point to note, Kanter waited until he was a US citizen before he truly started unloading on everyone. Kanter is on record saying he blames himself for his father being thrown in prison for speaking out.

I can't really knock Lin here for wanting to protect his extended family. Point to note, the Uighurs are being forcibly sterilized and having their organs harvested. If Lin doesn't want some distant cousin waking up in a bathtub full of ice in some random concentration camp, I can't quite blame him here.

I'm always a little leery of purity tests demanding what a person "should" say out loud. LeBron James is a different matter. He's being held to the fire for things he's spoken out loud and has done so often by his own choice.

Good point on Lin and one of the articles I read mentioned that as well. 

 

[jvdesigns2002]

You just described a spot up shooter. Exactly like his dad and Reggie Miller, only shorter. 

I guess that depends on what your definition of a “spot up” shooter is.  I’ve played basketball for a couple decades—and in my experience—calling somebody a “spot up shooter” basically means that they are the type of shooter that typically needs their feet set—or they are just good at shooting a jump shot in a relatively standard shooting position.  I wouldn’t call Steph a “spot up” shooter. I’d probably describe him as an elite scorer that has lethal range. He can shoot off of the run, off the dribble, he can shoot a step back, he has a nice tear drop—he also has pretty solid handles.  In any case—my only point is this: there is no reason to believe that his shooting touch, his quick release, his movement off of the ball, his handles, his general quickness, are all dynamics that wouldn’t translate well on the basketball court in previous eras. 

 

[STEADYMOBBIN 22]

I guess that depends on what your definition of a “spot up” shooter is.  I’ve played basketball for a couple decades—and in my experience—calling somebody a “spot up shooter” basically means that they are the type of shooter that typically needs their feet set—or they are just good at shooting a jump shot in a relatively standard shooting position.  I wouldn’t call Steph a “spot up” shooter. I’d probably describe him as an elite scorer that has lethal range. He can shoot off of the run, off the dribble, he can shoot a step back, he has a nice tear drop—he also has pretty solid handles.  In any case—my only point is this: there is no reason to believe that his shooting touch, his quick release, his movement off of the ball, his handles, his general quickness, are all dynamics that wouldn’t translate well on the basketball court in previous eras. 

I agree with most of this but if the discussion is how Steph would fair in prior eras he’s not running free throwing up tear drops or driving through the lane without taking contact. The refs aren’t letting him get indignant and the larger PGs would post him up. The shear wear and tear would sap him of a lot more energy. He’s still a lethal shooter obviously. 
 

All the things I mentioned are valid reasons why so many in this thread say the game is better today and I reluctantly admit they might be right. (I think us old curmudgeons loath the complaining more than the changes to the game) Removing the (excess) physicality really does free up guys like Curry. I still contend that in prior eras we get to see a slightly lesser Reggie Miller like career where as in today’s game he’s a legit super star. 

 

[identikit]

Not really game has involved and more stuff happens. Some guys aren't comfortable talking about stuff they don't understand. I'd rather some one be quiet instead of acting like they know stuff on something they clearly don't. 

So now Jordan is a dummy....

 

[wikkidpissah]

So now Jordan is a dummy....

*Redd Foxx voice* you a dummy, dummy!!

 

[identikit]

*Redd Foxx voice* you a dummy, dummy!!

My sister calls one of her sons a 'dumb dummy'

Always reminds me of Redd

 

[Alex P Keaton]

I agree with most of this but if the discussion is how Steph would fair in prior eras he’s not running free throwing up tear drops or driving through the lane without taking contact. The refs aren’t letting him get indignant and the larger PGs would post him up. The shear wear and tear would sap him of a lot more energy. He’s still a lethal shooter obviously. 
 

All the things I mentioned are valid reasons why so many in this thread say the game is better today and I reluctantly admit they might be right. (I think us old curmudgeons loath the complaining more than the changes to the game) Removing the (excess) physicality really does free up guys like Curry. I still contend that in prior eras we get to see a slightly lesser Reggie Miller like career where as in today’s game he’s a legit super star. 

That seems like a mostly fair take.  If his floor would be a poor man’s Reggie Miller, that seems rational. 

 

[Jayrod]

The problem with putting Curry in some kind of category or trying to compare him to guys of yesteryear of player is failing to fully understand his entire package.

He learned to shoot 30 foot bombs because it was an edge he found, honed it and became the first to ever do it well.  Now guys like Dame and Trae Young are copying that.  He is a great passer and ball handler as well....as good as just about anyone not named Magic or Stockton because he is relentless in his practice and honing of skills.  He's not just a shooter who lucked into playing in the right era, like many of you are trying to argue.

He's got basically 3 advantages that would translate to any era:

1. Skilled - call it touch or feel or whatever you want, but the ball in his hand is simply an extension of his mind and body.  While it is something that he has honed over the years, it is something both his dad and brother have so there is a certain innate ability that is much greater than the average NBA player.  Probably the greatest ever in this regard would be Bird (another guy who despite some physical limitations is in the conversation for all-time greatness), but Curry is right there with Larry.
   
2. Quickness - He's not AI/Ja Morant level quick, but he's got extremely agile feet and it is what makes him much better than both his father or brother.  Steph has maybe the greatest footwork of any perimeter player in history.  His ability to get his feet set in a shooting posture after cutting at full speed is all-time elite and it is the foundation for everything he does.  His shooting release is also probably the quickest ever as was mentioned earlier.  The pace of his game and getting in and out of breaks is faster than anyone I've ever watched play.  Probably the best comp in this regard is Jerry Rice's route running.  Guy wasn't the fastest receiver ever, but he had impeccable footwork that put him in an advantageous position on a consistent basis. 
   
3. Work Ethic/Growth Mindset - Curry has never been content to rest on what he did before.  He has grown his game each and every year with nuances and skills and new techniques.  This is something that will ALWAYS translate to every level and is the #1 reason why it doesn't matter what era he is playing in, he will find a way to use the advantages #1 & #2 above to make him the most effective player he can be.  I'm no fanboy here, but you cannot deny his elite level of preparedness and training.  It's MJ level stuff and it will always translate to the court.
   

 

[Charlie Harper]

I agree with most of this but if the discussion is how Steph would fair in prior eras he’s not running free throwing up tear drops or driving through the lane without taking contact. The refs aren’t letting him get indignant and the larger PGs would post him up. The shear wear and tear would sap him of a lot more energy. He’s still a lethal shooter obviously. 
 

All the things I mentioned are valid reasons why so many in this thread say the game is better today and I reluctantly admit they might be right. (I think us old curmudgeons loath the complaining more than the changes to the game) Removing the (excess) physicality really does free up guys like Curry. I still contend that in prior eras we get to see a slightly lesser Reggie Miller like career where as in today’s game he’s a legit super star. 

Isaiah Thomas 6'1" 180#

John Stockton 6'1" 170#

Reggie Miller 6'7" 185#

Stephen Curry 6'2 185#

I think he'd do just fine in any ERA in regards to physicality. He is probably the one player who refs allow defenders to grab and hold like they played in the 90s.

 

[STEADYMOBBIN 22]

Isaiah Thomas 6'1" 180#

John Stockton 6'1" 170#

Reggie Miller 6'7" 185#

Stephen Curry 6'2 185#

I think he'd do just fine in any ERA in regards to physicality. He is probably the one player who refs allow defenders to grabbed and held like they played in the 90s.

Dayum Charlie! . I cannot argue against that. 
 

I’ll stick to dissing Lebron. 

 

[Charlie Harper]

Also Enes Kanter is bull####.

If he really wanted to make a stand he'd call out Adam Silver, the NBA, and the jersey sponsorship by Nike. 

Why pick on LBJ?

GTFO. I support his message, but kind of hard to take or when there's a Nike logo on his Celtics jersey.

 

[STEADYMOBBIN 22]

Also Enes Kanter is bull####.

If he really wanted to make a stand he'd call out Adam Silver, the NBA, and the jersey sponsorship by Nike. 

Why pick on LBJ?

GTFO. I support his message, but kind of hard to take or when there's a Nike logo on his Celtics jersey.

According to this he did. There are a few other articles that say as much as well. I have no idea I’m just posting information I found.

 

[Yo Mama]

Also Enes Kanter is bull####.

If he really wanted to make a stand he'd call out Adam Silver, the NBA, and the jersey sponsorship by Nike. 

Why pick on LBJ?

GTFO. I support his message, but kind of hard to take or when there's a Nike logo on his Celtics jersey.

Yeah, there’s a reason his media tour with this messaging kicked off on Tucker Carlson’s show. 

 

[Juxtatarot]

Also Enes Kanter is bull####.

If he really wanted to make a stand he'd call out Adam Silver, the NBA, and the jersey sponsorship by Nike. 

Why pick on LBJ?

GTFO. I support his message, but kind of hard to take or when there's a Nike logo on his Celtics jersey.

Enes Freedom.

 

[mr. furley]

"Enes Kanter bashes NBA" doesn't make the same headlines as "Enes Kanter bashes Lebron".

sports media shows might not give "bashes NBA" more than a passing mention.

but they're going to talk about Enes Kanter bashing Lebron, because people want to know what was said and why. 

then they can spin that in to talking about the Lakers and how much Westbrook is destroying the team.  that draws eyes and ears. 

low hanging fruit. smart of Kanter to throw Lebron's name in the mix if only because it draws way more attention to his platform.

 

[wikkidpissah]

i have Enes envy

 

[rockaction]

Before it became a right-wing thing, I was picking up Kanter's message and it seemed really directed more at the NBA and the government of China than a message that was anti-LeBron. Kanter also has skin in the game given the situation in his homeland and his family. It's not just disposable crap, nor is it easy to fit in a political or sociopolitical box. It's a complex issue, one that has to do with living in an industry whose bread is partially buttered by the repulsive and sick. It was a deal Stern and the NBA made with the devil from the beginning, and you don't get to leave those deals. 

I don't envy Kanter, nor do I consider him a hero. He's flawed like all of us, in an unenviable position, trying to make the best of his conscience and use his pulpit as a change for good. So many other athletes are lauded for this when all they do is take a knee at an anthem. He's got some skin. "Do you wanna look in?" is his question, to paraphrase Fugazi. I wish him well. 

 

[Juxtatarot]

Enes Freedom.

 

[rockaction]

Yeah, there’s a reason his media tour with this messaging kicked off on Tucker Carlson’s show. 

This is really irrelevant. Glenn Greenwald is a constant presence on that show. I hate that show, but it gives the dispossessed a voice on certain issues that other media won't touch. Good for him to get the word out. Sad that it has to go through that conduit. This should be a media and corporate frenzy that Kantner has set off, much like BLM, but it gets no traction because corporate interests are against it. 

To be right-wing and anti-corporate in one fell swoop is happening more and more often. People ought listen and maybe they'll be less confused by our current political state. 

(Just for common understanding, I've personally left the American right. It no longer argues democracy at the intellectual level of its movement, and I can't abide that. So I have no traditional left/right axe to grind. It is what it is.)

 

[Yo Mama]

This is really irrelevant. Glenn Greenwald is a constant presence on that show. I hate that show, but it gives the dispossessed a voice on certain issues that other media won't touch. Good for him to get the word out. Sad that is has to go through that conduit. This should be a media and corporate frenzy that Kantner has set off, much like BLM, but it gets no traction because corporate interests are against it. 

To be right-wing and anti-corporate in one fell swoop is happening more and more often. People ought listen and maybe they'll be less confused by our current political state. 

(Just for common understanding. I've personally left the American right. It no longer argues democracy at the intellectual level of its movement, and I can't abide that. So I have no traditional left/right axe to grind. It is what it is.)

I hear you, and this is probably better discussed in the politics forum, but we’re here. 
 

My main point (and I’ll leave it at this since I really don’t want to go back to the PSF) is that Enes’ message is just a more detailed/informed version of the “What right does LeBron have to criticize things going on in the African-American community when there is all this injustice going on in China?”

Im not saying you or anyone else in this thread feels this way, but I suspect many people taking this stance don’t necessarily have a sudden concern for the plight of the Chinese worker, but rather use this as pushback to the BLM message. 
 

Again, not saying this is you at all (and definitely not saying what is going on in China is acceptable in any way), but I believe this is why Enes’ message is being amplified and celebrated by the same people saying the players should just “shut up and dribble.”

 

[rockaction]

I hear you, and this is probably better discussed in the politics forum, but we’re here. 
 

My main point (and I’ll leave it at this since I really don’t want to go back to the PSF) is that Enes’ message is just a more detailed/informed version of the “What right does LeBron have to criticize things going on in the African-American community when there is all this injustice going on in China?”

Im not saying you or anyone else in this thread feels this way, but I suspect many people taking this stance don’t necessarily have a sudden concern for the plight of the Chinese worker, but rather use this as pushback to the BLM message. 
 

Again, not saying this is you at all (and definitely not saying what is going on in China is acceptable in any way), but I believe this is why Enes’ message is being amplified and celebrated by the same people saying the players should just “shut up and dribble.”

I tend to agree with all the nuances you've pointed out and agree that the PSF is the best place for it, but I also think the PSF will bring the least reasonable discussion to the fore. But I agree there seems to be a meta-story here, and by "meta," I mean the way in which the story is being disseminated, by which outlets, and what those outlets have typically said about other things. 

We're in agreement, really. 

I just think that in a vacuum, Kanter's message is much more complicated than a left/right issue. It's really a wonder to see an NBA player suffering under the weight of his own league's interests, especially when those interests are so easily torn apart from an ethical/social responsibility PoV, but less so easily picked apart when you think about all the money involved and who will be doing the picking. It's really an issue about huge money and unlimited political power, and how those things interact. It's sad and the interests at play and what is being done at behest of those interests at play are sickening to me, and I'll leave it at that. 

 

[Yo Mama]

I tend to agree with all the nuances you've pointed out and agree that the PSF is the best place for it, but I also think the PSF will bring the least reasonable discussion to the fore. But I agree there seems to be a meta-story here, and by "meta," I mean the way in which the story is being disseminated, by which outlets, and what those outlets have typically said about other things. 

We're in agreement, really. 

I just think that in a vacuum, Kantner's message is much more complicated than a left/right issue. It's really a wonder to see an NBA player suffering under the weight of his own league's interests, especially when those interests are so easily torn apart from an ethical/social responsibility PoV, but less so easily picked apart when you think about all the money involved and who will be doing the picking. It's really an issue about huge money and unlimited political power, and how those things interact. It's sad and the interests at play and what is being done at behest of those interests at play are sickening to me, and I'll leave it at that. 

Thanks - I appreciate the discussion. 

 

[rockaction]

Thanks - I appreciate the discussion. 

Thanks, Yo Mama. I'll bow out and let you guys NBA in style for a while. Thanks for reading. Your all-time NBA Draft was epic, by the way, and though I couldn't totally follow, you guys have a passion for this league and its history. Politics is dreary at times, it just happens to be a background of mine, so when I see issues that arise, I feel like I might chime in and give some sort of perspective (?) maybe. I don't know. Like I said to somebody this morning, the coffee is good. Peace. 

 

[thecatch]

I hear you, and this is probably better discussed in the politics forum, but we’re here. 
 

My main point (and I’ll leave it at this since I really don’t want to go back to the PSF) is that Enes’ message is just a more detailed/informed version of the “What right does LeBron have to criticize things going on in the African-American community when there is all this injustice going on in China?”

Im not saying you or anyone else in this thread feels this way, but I suspect many people taking this stance don’t necessarily have a sudden concern for the plight of the Chinese worker, but rather use this as pushback to the BLM message. 
 

Again, not saying this is you at all (and definitely not saying what is going on in China is acceptable in any way), but I believe this is why Enes’ message is being amplified and celebrated by the same people saying the players should just “shut up and dribble.”

Kanter’s/Freedom’s stance may very well have been co-opted by anti BLM folks (I don’t consume cable news so I can’t speak to that) but it doesn’t take away from the fact that he’s right. 

 

[Yo Mama]

Kanter’s/Freedom’s stance may very well have been co-opted by anti BLM folks (I don’t consume cable news so I can’t speak to that) but it doesn’t take away from the fact that he’s right. 

Agreed - I think it’ll ultimately hurt his message that it’s moved in this direction. 

 

[GordonGekko]

Yeah, there’s a reason his media tour with this messaging kicked off on Tucker Carlson’s show. 

The NBA's current TV deal is with ABC, TNT and ESPN.

Anyone related to those networks, either up or down the food chain would have nothing to do with Enes Kanter,  irregardless of whatever political ideology is commonly associated with the power brokers in place.

The gigantic NFL TV contract is with Fox, NBC, CBS and ESPN

If Enes Kanter was a starting linebacker for the Chicago Bears right now, no one on Fox News would go within 100 million miles of him. If Fox Sports was in contention for the NBA TV broadcast rights and were part of the bidding war for that, no one on Fox News would say a single peep about Enes Kanter.

Charles Barkley was one of the few sports pundits who outright criticized LeBron James after The Decision. Finally he just said during a broadcast that he is no longer allowed to criticize LBJ on air anymore. During coverage of an NBA draft class, Bill Simmons began to bring up The Decision and his mic was cut and the show went immediately to commercial.

Follow the money. It always leads to the truth.

Ricky Gervais said something in an interview once, that was chilling but painfully honest, as is his way. He said see who you can't criticize in public, that's the person with real power.

Increasing criticism of LBJ is a reflection of his lowered status as a celebrity icon. He's an older player and he's being phased out of the league's marketing plans. Allen Iverson ended his career begging for a job. These kind of things are not uncommon.

 

[GordonGekko]

My main point (and I’ll leave it at this since I really don’t want to go back to the PSF) is that Enes’ message is just a more detailed/informed version of the “What right does LeBron have to criticize things going on in the African-American community when there is all this injustice going on in China?”

LeBron James: More Than an Athlete

by Mike Trudell Lakers Reporter Jun 12, 2020

https://www.nba.com/lakers/news/061220-lebron-james-more-than-an-athlete

*****

"More Than An Athlete" is a Nike ad campaign built around LBJ's push for "social justice" It was done in partnership with the NBA for overall league marketing.

LBJ built the pathway for Enes Kanter to criticize him. Which is why LBJ can literally say nothing about any of this. He just has to sit there and eat it all.

LBJ saw to the construction of a bridge that crosses outside the bounds of the NBA. Now he's being dragged across it. If he didn't want his face scraping the dirt underneath him, he shouldn't have played pseudo political icon to the masses.

 

[DJackson10]

Also Enes Kanter is bull####.

If he really wanted to make a stand he'd call out Adam Silver, the NBA, and the jersey sponsorship by Nike. 

Why pick on LBJ?

GTFO. I support his message, but kind of hard to take or when there's a Nike logo on his Celtics jersey.

Direct face of the the NBA who has major influence how the league runs. People are kidding themselves if they don't think Adam Silver like Stern runs things through on the league with Lebron before a decision. 

 

[DJackson10]

Im not saying you or anyone else in this thread feels this way, but I suspect many people taking this stance don’t necessarily have a sudden concern for the plight of the Chinese worker, but rather use this as pushback to the BLM message. 

My take is more of this. You can go for two different issues at once you don't have to chose one to defend. I think the message is good for BLM but I also think it's been highjacked and used in a bad way by some who want some skin in this just to virtue Signal. However what's going on in China is incredible bad too maybe worse do to conditions and such. Unfortunately this nation only follows through when the corporation is at stake AKA Oil and such. With China they aren't at threat of losing something (cheap labor to keep products from being too expensive they outpace their buyers) so Corporate America won't be making any profitable money off of doing anything with China.

I could go way more into this how America profits off wars and such but that's here nor there and discussion for the PSF thread. . 

 

[Charlie Harper]

Direct face of the the NBA who has major influence how the league runs. People are kidding themselves if they don't think Adam Silver like Stern runs things through on the league with Lebron before a decision. 

My main point has less to do with LBJ, but the hypocrisy of getting mad at LeBron for promoting Nike....when he plays for a league that promotes Nike. 

If Kanter Freedom feels so strongly he should quit the league. 

 

[DJackson10]

The NBA's current TV deal is with ABC, TNT and ESPN.

Anyone related to those networks, either up or down the food chain would have nothing to do with Enes Kanter,  irregardless of whatever political ideology is commonly associated with the power brokers in place.

The gigantic NFL TV contract is with Fox, NBC, CBS and ESPN

If Enes Kanter was a starting linebacker for the Chicago Bears right now, no one on Fox News would go within 100 million miles of him. If Fox Sports was in contention for the NBA TV broadcast rights and were part of the bidding war for that, no one on Fox News would say a single peep about Enes Kanter.

Charles Barkley was one of the few sports pundits who outright criticized LeBron James after The Decision. Finally he just said during a broadcast that he is no longer allowed to criticize LBJ on air anymore. During coverage of an NBA draft class, Bill Simmons began to bring up The Decision and his mic was cut and the show went immediately to commercial.

Follow the money. It always leads to the truth.

Ricky Gervais said something in an interview once, that was chilling but painfully honest, as is his way. He said see who you can't criticize in public, that's the person with real power.

Increasing criticism of LBJ is a reflection of his lowered status as a celebrity icon. He's an older player and he's being phased out of the league's marketing plans. Allen Iverson ended his career begging for a job. These kind of things are not uncommon.

AI also had addiction problems with both drinking and gambling. The 76ers for yrs protected him on those issues. At the end of his career AI was on a very steep decline where his off the court issues couldn't be defended by his play anymore. 

 

[DJackson10]

My main point has less to do with LBJ, but the hypocrisy of getting mad at LeBron for promoting Nike....when he plays for a league that promotes Nike. 

If Kanter Freedom feels so strongly he should quit the league. 

Honestly I won't be surprised if Kanter quits or at least teams blackball him which could really happen. Celtics won't flat out release him because Kanter would have a strong case that they cut him do to a political and social justice opinion which they can't do. The NBA just better hope Kanter either shuts up or retires. 

 

[Zigg]

Direct face of the the NBA who has major influence how the league runs. People are kidding themselves if they don't think Adam Silver like Stern runs things through on the league with Lebron before a decision. 

You’re kidding yourself if you think the league give a flying f what Lebron thinks about China. They want every penny, and China has a lot of pennies. I don’t know why billionaires want more, but they do. Owners like your hero are far more culpable than Lebron. 
 

To be clear, Lebron is guilty as well.

 

[Instinctive]

I find Enes World Peace, Freedom, Kanter to be obnoxious. Something about it just smells as self-serving in a weird way. Have some friends who have said that while Kyrie is a wackadoo he truly believes his crap, whereas Kanter seems to have some additional agenda that doesn't feel true. 

 

[GordonGekko]

My main point has less to do with LBJ, but the hypocrisy of getting mad at LeBron for promoting Nike....when he plays for a league that promotes Nike. 

If Kanter Freedom feels so strongly he should quit the league. 

This situation can get a little complicated.

Nike donates quite a bit to provide uniforms for youth sports programs and youth sports teams. There is usually a partnership by Nike endorsed athletes to do this as well.

What is known is that Adam Silver and Kanter had a long one on one meeting about these issues.

Nike has three more years on their current uniform contract with the NBA. Given the situation with China and the Uighurs, and that the NBA had basketball camps in China where Chinese athletes were being beaten in front of US visiting coaches, I can see the NBA owners wanting distance from Nike.

This is speculation, but if I were in Adam Silver's shoes, I would tell Kanter that it's better to talk about the uniform issue in the offseason, and that lots of youth sports right now rely on those Nike uniforms via donations, etc. And that three years from now, the NBA will naturally move on from Nike.

To be fair to Silver, he's probably getting immense pressure from NBA China and Tencent to shut up Kanter or leverage the Celtics to cut him. And they did the same for Morey as well. Silver strikes me as a guy who is in the middle and wants no part of this mess but he's playing the hand and cards he's been dealt.

Nike like all the shoe brands involved in the NBA has created some truly toxic fallout from their greed. ( The corruption of AAU by shoe brands is just one example) But it wouldn't be fair to say Nike has not had some positive impact on the general youth sports culture, even if that motive is simply PR and a giant tax write off.

I would wait the uniform thing out for a while. I agree that wearing the Nike uniforms puts Kanter in a hypocritical light.

 

[GordonGekko]

I find Enes World Peace, Freedom, Kanter to be obnoxious. Something about it just smells as self-serving in a weird way. Have some friends who have said that while Kyrie is a wackadoo he truly believes his crap, whereas Kanter seems to have some additional agenda that doesn't feel true. 

You can be a worthless POS as a person and still be right about something

You can be a worthless POS as a person and be wrong about something but still have a point that should be examined deeply even if you aren't completely right.

You can be a worthless POS as a person and be incorrect/hypocritical/toxic about one issue but being doing the right thing for the right reasons for another

( I've basically described Jose Canseco with the above)

I agree that Kanter does come off as some kind of self absorbed grifter in his own way. However the reality of the situation is speaking up might force some real changes, or even some moderate ones. Maybe the CCP backs off of organ harvesting or forcible sterilization or anything that can create immediate toxic optics. Maybe that means a few people live today whereas they would have died otherwise.

Enes Kanter might have actually saved some lives here. Even if it's for the wrong reasons.

Whatever people might think of Kanter, he's risking his own life here. There is more incentive in place now to have him killed than to let him live. It might be accidental bravery rooted from stupidity but sometimes that still makes a difference for someone.

I am hesitant with removing someone's ability to make a legitimate point because they aren't totally infallible in all aspects of their lives.

 

[facook]

It's Faaaaan-tastic.

 

[rockaction]

It's Faaaaan-tastic.

Lol. Well-played. 

 

[J R]

Also Enes Kanter is bull####.

If he really wanted to make a stand he'd call out Adam Silver, the NBA, and the jersey sponsorship by Nike. 

Why pick on LBJ?

GTFO. I support his message, but kind of hard to take or when there's a Nike logo on his Celtics jersey.

Man, one post you nail it, and the next you lose me.

 

[Leeroy Jenkins]

So, as the trade market starts to open up soon, with recently signed free agents being tradeable, who are the potential difference makers available?

Obviously Ben Simmons is the most available player out there, but I think the play of Maxey and Curry has changed the Sixers needs and calculus.  Unless it is Lillard, Beal, or Harden, they are looking for a small forward, rather than a guard.  What small-forwards could be available?

 

[wikkidpissah]

So, as the trade market starts to open up soon, with recently signed free agents being tradeable, who are the potential difference makers available?

Obviously Ben Simmons is the most available player out there, but I think the play of Maxey and Curry has changed the Sixers needs and calculus.  Unless it is Lillard, Beal, or Harden, they are looking for a small forward, rather than a guard.  What small-forwards could be available?

could be either really. Curry's D & Thybulle's O & Green's  mean they need someone wing-size who can switch & stroke. i could list Hields to Ingrams to Dorts but, if Morey is still looking a king's ransom (especially the pix & swaps that are a GMs natural protection in the wild) for distressed merchandise, it's all moot

 

[GordonGekko]

So, as the trade market starts to open up soon, with recently signed free agents being tradeable, who are the potential difference makers available?

Obviously Ben Simmons is the most available player out there, but I think the play of Maxey and Curry has changed the Sixers needs and calculus.  Unless it is Lillard, Beal, or Harden, they are looking for a small forward, rather than a guard.  What small-forwards could be available?

From whom might actually be useful - Josh Hart, Donte DiVincenzo, Joe Ingles and Harrison Barnes. 

Iffy on what happens with Jerami Grant. Cap considerations make all those guys a tough fit except DD.

The Knicks might blow up it if they can but I don't know if there are any takers. If they could right now, I think they'd dump Randle, Fournier, Kemba Walker, Noel and Mitch Robinson without blinking. They need to get Deuce McBride and Quentin Grimes some minutes here. And while I'm not a fan of Obi Toppin, at least he plays with relentless effort, which Randle is not giving them. Randle doesn't even bother to attempt to move off the ball.

The only way I can see Kevin Knox move is as salary ballast in a large multi team deal where he just helps the numbers balance out. I would like to see him as a flier on a minimum free agent deal after this season though. He's not completely unskilled. His horrible motor though is indefensible.

If I was Morey, I'd really look hard at the Pistons. I don't know if Troy Weaver wants any of the drama that Simmons brings though. But Saddiq Bey would help the 76ers immeasurably.

Simmons might have to start asking himself if trying to get himself to the Knicks might be his best current option. He can play defense, which is what Thibs wants, and he wouldn't actually be going into so many expectations, since Knicks fans have been beaten down from hope for the past two decades.

Josh Hart is just really interesting. He's not going to move the needle as an All Star, but he's very fundamental and he's a nice rotation guy.  Ingles has everything you want in terms of a glue guy.

Guaranteed contracts just ruin the NBA. Salary matching pretty much devastates all the interesting possibilities in actual player movement.

 

[Juxtatarot]

Per Shams, Pacers are entertaining a rebuild and Sabonis, Turner and/or LeVert are on the trading block.
 

 

[Leeroy Jenkins]

Insert Spice Adams yellow suit meme with Darrel Morey superimposed.  

 

[DJackson10]

I find Enes World Peace, Freedom, Kanter to be obnoxious. Something about it just smells as self-serving in a weird way. Have some friends who have said that while Kyrie is a wackadoo he truly believes his crap, whereas Kanter seems to have some additional agenda that doesn't feel true. 

Kanter grew up in a country who tried to mass genocide a whole race (Turkey vs Armenians) that no-one wants to acknowledge ever happened (US congress finally acknowledged it 2 yrs ago btw) so I think banter has every right to speak on the issue going on in China. He's done so putting people in his life in danger as well. Kyrie is just another idiot that shows how poor our education system is in this country. 

 

[DJackson10]

So, as the trade market starts to open up soon, with recently signed free agents being tradeable, who are the potential difference makers available?

Obviously Ben Simmons is the most available player out there, but I think the play of Maxey and Curry has changed the Sixers needs and calculus.  Unless it is Lillard, Beal, or Harden, they are looking for a small forward, rather than a guard.  What small-forwards could be available?

Have to fit contracts in with what they are giving up. Lillard has apparently expressed interest in playing with Simmons (not sure why he wants to commit career suicide here) while also wanting to be the highest paid player in the NBA (For obvious reasons he shouldn't be). So a deal centered around McCollum could still happen. Not a SF but Pacers have made a few of their guys available recently. Whoever the 76ers get people shouldn't expect the level of player you mentioned unless something really big happens last minute.

 

[DJackson10]

From whom might actually be useful - Josh Hart, Donte DiVincenzo, Joe Ingles and Harrison Barnes. 

I don't think Sixers fans would be thrilled but 2 of those three in Hart and DiVencenzo played on Villanova National title teams (have met both with how close I am to the campus when in college) so it'd be a bit of a homecoming and maybe stop some of the sting the eventual trade would create. 

Simmons might have to start asking himself if trying to get himself to the Knicks might be his best current option. He can play defense, which is what Thibs wants, and he wouldn't actually be going into so many expectations, since Knicks fans have been beaten down from hope for the past two decades.

Not the best move if Thibs is there. Yes Ben plays defense but what he absolutely hates is the entire personality of a Ben Simmons. I'd be shocked if Thibs would put up with it. He literally during a playoff game where the Bulls lost to the Celtics and got killed in kept the starters out there when most coaches would've put in the subs. Many in CHI and the reporters saw it as Thibs punishing the starters for not giving enough effort. next game in the series was the famous OT win in Boston. So I don't think personality wise they'd mess well..