Losing Xanders will hurt more than hiring Caldwell. I would fire Mayhew and Tom Lewand right now to keep Xanders.Was jammed up in meetings & didn't hit the innerwebs all day
So we hired Caldwell and might lose Xanders?
Christ this is starting to remind of the Russ Thomas era....
un####ingbelievable
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I would too but we know that won't happen. Best case we get 1 more good draft out of Xanders before he flys the coop for a GM job. The salary cap being tied up with all those former high picks makes FA pickups almost impossible while draft picks are pretty much slotted money.I would fire Mayhew and Tom Lewand right now to keep Xanders.
First of all I never knew an NFL player had died during a game. - So basically the Lions go 9-4-1 (essentially 10-4), 10-4 and then that year they were 7-3-1 right after that tragic Bears game (basically 8-3) - so in 4 years Schmidt more or less goes 28-11. Then after that tragic game they go 0-3 to finish the playoffs and then narrowly miss the playoffs the next two years.IIn 1969, his playing career was honored when he was selected the "Greatest Lion Ever" in conjunction with the NFL's 50th anniversary, and his team also showed strong improvement, finishing 9–4–1 on the campaign. Just hours after the team defeated the 11–2 Rams 28–0 on December 14, Schmidt's celebrating caught up with him when he was arrested for driving while intoxicated.
Schmidt's best season came the following year when the Lions were 10–4 to make the playoffs for the first time in 13 years. ...The playoff run was short, however, as the Dallas Cowboys won a defensive battle, 5–0, on December 26.
In 1971, the team slipped to a 7–6–1 record, but the decline paled in comparison to the death of Lions wide receiver Chuck Hughes in the waning moments of the October 24 game against the Chicago Bears. The following year, the team improved by one game, but with one game left, team owner William Clay Ford, unleashed a barrage of criticism on the squad as a whole.
The end result was that Schmidt resigned on January 12, 1973, saying that, "coaching isn't fun anymore." His mood brightened somewhat three weeks later when he was elected to the Hall of Fame, but Schmidt never again coached and spent the next three decades as a manufacturer's representative.
Joe Schmidt's career mark as a coach was 43-35-7. With the exception of Gary Moeller (who coached just seven games, winning four), he is the most recent Lions coach with a winning record.
Schmidt's personality was that of a perfectionist, perhaps one reason why his coaching was not as successful as his playing. He once stated, "I expect everyone to be like me. I guess that's a mistake."
Chuck Hughes had a massive heart attack and died on the field.SaintsInDome2006 said:It was mentioned in the Caldwell thread that since they took over in 1964 the Fords have never had one of their head coaches rehired.
I thought, what about those good defensive teams in the early 70s? Wasn't that Joe Schmidt? He was coach 1967-72, he got them to 4 straight winning seasons, including a classic 5-0 loss in the playoffs to the Cowboys, and then he was canned. Why?
Then I read this and thought, wow the Fords are some real piece of work.
First of all I never knew an NFL player had died during a game. - So basically the Lions go 9-4-1 (essentially 10-4), 10-4 and then that year they were 7-3-1 right after that tragic Bears game (basically 8-3) - so in 4 years Schmidt more or less goes 28-11. Then after that tragic game they go 0-3 to finish the playoffs and then narrowly miss the playoffs the next two years.IIn 1969, his playing career was honored when he was selected the "Greatest Lion Ever" in conjunction with the NFL's 50th anniversary, and his team also showed strong improvement, finishing 9–4–1 on the campaign. Just hours after the team defeated the 11–2 Rams 28–0 on December 14, Schmidt's celebrating caught up with him when he was arrested for driving while intoxicated.
Schmidt's best season came the following year when the Lions were 10–4 to make the playoffs for the first time in 13 years. ...The playoff run was short, however, as the Dallas Cowboys won a defensive battle, 5–0, on December 26.
In 1971, the team slipped to a 7–6–1 record, but the decline paled in comparison to the death of Lions wide receiver Chuck Hughes in the waning moments of the October 24 game against the Chicago Bears. The following year, the team improved by one game, but with one game left, team owner William Clay Ford, unleashed a barrage of criticism on the squad as a whole.
The end result was that Schmidt resigned on January 12, 1973, saying that, "coaching isn't fun anymore." His mood brightened somewhat three weeks later when he was elected to the Hall of Fame, but Schmidt never again coached and spent the next three decades as a manufacturer's representative.
Joe Schmidt's career mark as a coach was 43-35-7. With the exception of Gary Moeller (who coached just seven games, winning four), he is the most recent Lions coach with a winning record.
Schmidt's personality was that of a perfectionist, perhaps one reason why his coaching was not as successful as his playing. He once stated, "I expect everyone to be like me. I guess that's a mistake."
At which point Joe Schmidt becomes a manufacturer's rep.
Secondly the whole thing sounds kind of tragic but apparently the Fords did not help the situation much.
**** JauronSaintsInDome2006 said:It was mentioned in the Caldwell thread that since they took over in 1964 the Fords have never had one of their head coaches rehired.
I thought, what about those good defensive teams in the early 70s? Wasn't that Joe Schmidt? He was coach 1967-72, he got them to 4 straight winning seasons, including a classic 5-0 loss in the playoffs to the Cowboys, and then he was canned. Why?
Then I read this and thought, wow the Fords are some real piece of work.
Wayne Fontes got busted with cocaine in his car while drunk and blamed it on his son. The a Lion assistant was arrested while driving naked through a Wendys drive through."Joe Schmidt's career mark as a coach was 43-35-7. With the exception of Gary Moeller (who coached just seven games, winning four), he is the most recent Lions coach with a winning record."
Their 2 best guys in terms of win % both got caught with DWIs, guess with the Lions job you gotta turn into a drunk in order to win.
He was hot and he was hungry!Wayne Fontes got busted with cocaine in his car while drunk and blamed it on his son. The a Lion assistant was arrested while driving naked through a Wendys drive through."Joe Schmidt's career mark as a coach was 43-35-7. With the exception of Gary Moeller (who coached just seven games, winning four), he is the most recent Lions coach with a winning record."
Their 2 best guys in terms of win % both got caught with DWIs, guess with the Lions job you gotta turn into a drunk in order to win.
Wayne Fontes just a few years ago sat on an anthill and had to be taken to the hospital for severe butt-bites.Wayne Fontes got busted with cocaine in his car while drunk and blamed it on his son. The a Lion assistant was arrested while driving naked through a Wendys drive through."Joe Schmidt's career mark as a coach was 43-35-7. With the exception of Gary Moeller (who coached just seven games, winning four), he is the most recent Lions coach with a winning record."
Their 2 best guys in terms of win % both got caught with DWIs, guess with the Lions job you gotta turn into a drunk in order to win.
We almost forgot about team President Tom Lewand getting busted up north driving while hammered. The Lions drive employees to drink.Wayne Fontes just a few years ago sat on an anthill and had to be taken to the hospital for severe butt-bites.Wayne Fontes got busted with cocaine in his car while drunk and blamed it on his son. The a Lion assistant was arrested while driving naked through a Wendys drive through."Joe Schmidt's career mark as a coach was 43-35-7. With the exception of Gary Moeller (who coached just seven games, winning four), he is the most recent Lions coach with a winning record."
Their 2 best guys in terms of win % both got caught with DWIs, guess with the Lions job you gotta turn into a drunk in order to win.
Yes to the first, and no to the second. They gave WC the Lions so he would not screw up the main family biz.So do the Fords still run, you know, Ford Motor co.? Is it William Clay Ford still, and does he call the shots at Ford Motor?
moronsHeard Bill Ford Jr in an interview last night saying "He was shocked and dismayed" at the poor reaction of Lion fans to the Jim Caldwell hire. Are they really that detached?
Stole a Lombardi from Green Bay.What do people think of the Lombardi hire?
OC at Mercyhurst?? Is that a community college? Who knows, in 6 years with the Saints he had to learn something and he can`t be worse than Linehan.What do people think of the Lombardi hire?
Lions hired Saints QBs coach Joe Lombardi as offensive coordinator.
Lombardi is the grandson of Vince Lombardi. He's been with the Saints since 2007, spending the past five seasons as QBs coach working with Drew Brees. Prior to that, Lombardi worked as an offensive assistant for the Falcons for one season and coordinated the offense at Mercyhurst College for four years. He played tight end at Air Force. Lombardi interviewed for the Jets OC opening last winter. He'll be another quality mind for Matthew Stafford to work with.
As bad as the Miami situation is, what does it say about the Lions that Xander's would want to leave for that mess.OC at Mercyhurst?? Is that a community college? Who knows, in 6 years with the Saints he had to learn something and he can`t be worse than Linehan.
What do people think of the Lombardi hire?
Lions hired Saints QBs coach Joe Lombardi as offensive coordinator.
Lombardi is the grandson of Vince Lombardi. He's been with the Saints since 2007, spending the past five seasons as QBs coach working with Drew Brees. Prior to that, Lombardi worked as an offensive assistant for the Falcons for one season and coordinated the offense at Mercyhurst College for four years. He played tight end at Air Force. Lombardi interviewed for the Jets OC opening last winter. He'll be another quality mind for Matthew Stafford to work with.
On another note it is not looking good for the draft. Xanders has not been at any interviews or scouting and looks like he will be the next Miami GM. Hard to believe the Lions are going to let the first person who knew what they were doing in the front office walk. It would have been nice to see the Lions be proactive for once and fire Mayhew and promote Xanders.
If I'm Xanders and my two best options are sticking with Detroit another year or taking over that mess in Miami, I'd stick with Detroit. If they underperform again next season Mayhew/Lewand have to be the next scapegoats up, right? Maybe he can slide right into the GM chair for a team that's already loaded with talent. Problem is you can't count on the Fords to fire anybody without first giving them 17 chances, so if you're Xanders you have to know that even if they flame out again next year there's no guarantee that Mayhew/Lewand will finally be shown the door.As bad as the Miami situation is, what does it say about the Lions that Xander's would want to leave for that mess.OC at Mercyhurst?? Is that a community college? Who knows, in 6 years with the Saints he had to learn something and he can`t be worse than Linehan.What do people think of the Lombardi hire?
Lions hired Saints QBs coach Joe Lombardi as offensive coordinator.
Lombardi is the grandson of Vince Lombardi. He's been with the Saints since 2007, spending the past five seasons as QBs coach working with Drew Brees. Prior to that, Lombardi worked as an offensive assistant for the Falcons for one season and coordinated the offense at Mercyhurst College for four years. He played tight end at Air Force. Lombardi interviewed for the Jets OC opening last winter. He'll be another quality mind for Matthew Stafford to work with.
On another note it is not looking good for the draft. Xanders has not been at any interviews or scouting and looks like he will be the next Miami GM. Hard to believe the Lions are going to let the first person who knew what they were doing in the front office walk. It would have been nice to see the Lions be proactive for once and fire Mayhew and promote Xanders.
And worst case lions get one more draft out of X.Nice! So there is still a chance Mayhew gets blown out for Xanders eventually.
I'm not sure what to make of it, but I am glad somebody "new" gets a shot instead of an OC retread. It's positive that he worked with Brees for the last 5 seasons, but Caldwell worked with Peyton and I'm pretty sure that's benefited Caldwell infinitely more than it benefited Peyton.What do people think of the Lombardi hire?
Lions hired Saints QBs coach Joe Lombardi as offensive coordinator.
Lombardi is the grandson of Vince Lombardi. He's been with the Saints since 2007, spending the past five seasons as QBs coach working with Drew Brees. Prior to that, Lombardi worked as an offensive assistant for the Falcons for one season and coordinated the offense at Mercyhurst College for four years. He played tight end at Air Force. Lombardi interviewed for the Jets OC opening last winter. He'll be another quality mind for Matthew Stafford to work with.
I'm interested to see how the Lions handle the tough decision here. Gotta let him go and get something for him, but my guess is they won't.Delmas cut.. Burleson cut. Who is next?
This Suh deal is going to kill the Lions. I just read today that next year Calvin counts 20 million against the cap, in 2016 he counts 24 million. The Lions will have 3 players eating up close to 50% of the cap.
Lions really need to trade Suh and hope to get a 1 and 3.
Let one of the most dominant defensive players go at the height of his career? What would the people who said the Lions have no shot at becoming a good franchise say then? Salaries can be manipulated and restructured every year. "Gotta let him go?" I wonder if that would make us better just because we could sign a few more bench warmers. We just need to hit in the draft like other teams do, after Mayhew gets fired hopefully we get a better GM who can work the deal and judge talent better.I'm interested to see how the Lions handle the tough decision here. Gotta let him go and get something for him, but my guess is they won't.Delmas cut.. Burleson cut. Who is next?
This Suh deal is going to kill the Lions. I just read today that next year Calvin counts 20 million against the cap, in 2016 he counts 24 million. The Lions will have 3 players eating up close to 50% of the cap.
Lions really need to trade Suh and hope to get a 1 and 3.
With $20 mil + im betting they can get a couple few starters.. along with high round picks. They blew a chunk of their cap on 2 players.. can't pay everyone. Would be great if they can play with the numbers, i just dont see Suh giving them a discount.Let one of the most dominant defensive players go at the height of his career? What would the people who said the Lions have no shot at becoming a good franchise say then? Salaries can be manipulated and restructured every year. "Gotta let him go?" I wonder if that would make us better just because we could sign a few more bench warmers. We just need to hit in the draft like other teams do, after Mayhew gets fired hopefully we get a better GM who can work the deal and judge talent better.I'm interested to see how the Lions handle the tough decision here. Gotta let him go and get something for him, but my guess is they won't.Delmas cut.. Burleson cut. Who is next?
This Suh deal is going to kill the Lions. I just read today that next year Calvin counts 20 million against the cap, in 2016 he counts 24 million. The Lions will have 3 players eating up close to 50% of the cap.
Lions really need to trade Suh and hope to get a 1 and 3.
He wont give them a discount, but they can work the deal so that it gives em cap relief this year. maybe his number this year will be down to 12mill istead of 22.With $20 mil + im betting they can get a couple few starters.. along with high round picks. They blew a chunk of their cap on 2 players.. can't pay everyone. Would be great if they can play with the numbers, i just dont see Suh giving them a discount.Let one of the most dominant defensive players go at the height of his career? What would the people who said the Lions have no shot at becoming a good franchise say then? Salaries can be manipulated and restructured every year. "Gotta let him go?" I wonder if that would make us better just because we could sign a few more bench warmers. We just need to hit in the draft like other teams do, after Mayhew gets fired hopefully we get a better GM who can work the deal and judge talent better.I'm interested to see how the Lions handle the tough decision here. Gotta let him go and get something for him, but my guess is they won't.Delmas cut.. Burleson cut. Who is next?
This Suh deal is going to kill the Lions. I just read today that next year Calvin counts 20 million against the cap, in 2016 he counts 24 million. The Lions will have 3 players eating up close to 50% of the cap.
Lions really need to trade Suh and hope to get a 1 and 3.
Yes, they were some of the last bad rookie contract years, "luck of the lions" once again.He wont give them a discount, but they can work the deal so that it gives em cap relief this year. maybe his number this year will be down to 12mill istead of 22.With $20 mil + im betting they can get a couple few starters.. along with high round picks. They blew a chunk of their cap on 2 players.. can't pay everyone. Would be great if they can play with the numbers, i just dont see Suh giving them a discount.Let one of the most dominant defensive players go at the height of his career? What would the people who said the Lions have no shot at becoming a good franchise say then? Salaries can be manipulated and restructured every year. "Gotta let him go?" I wonder if that would make us better just because we could sign a few more bench warmers. We just need to hit in the draft like other teams do, after Mayhew gets fired hopefully we get a better GM who can work the deal and judge talent better.I'm interested to see how the Lions handle the tough decision here. Gotta let him go and get something for him, but my guess is they won't.Delmas cut.. Burleson cut. Who is next?
This Suh deal is going to kill the Lions. I just read today that next year Calvin counts 20 million against the cap, in 2016 he counts 24 million. The Lions will have 3 players eating up close to 50% of the cap.
Lions really need to trade Suh and hope to get a 1 and 3.
Then next year they re-do Calvin, then next year they re-do Stafford
awful cycle the lions are in, the old CBA contracts and having to pay 3 top tier players is killing them depth wise.
This is true but he was an interim coach that took over after mooch was fired.**** JauronIt was mentioned in the Caldwell thread that since they took over in 1964 the Fords have never had one of their head coaches rehired.
I thought, what about those good defensive teams in the early 70s? Wasn't that Joe Schmidt? He was coach 1967-72, he got them to 4 straight winning seasons, including a classic 5-0 loss in the playoffs to the Cowboys, and then he was canned. Why?
Then I read this and thought, wow the Fords are some real piece of work.
Suh is a dominant player that commands double teams on almost every play. That being said there is only so much you can do as a DT. The problem is the Lions are paying for being crappy for so long. Calvin, Stafford and Suh were all very high picks under the old agreement. Right now Suh would have made around 60% less and his cap figure would be way more manageable. If the Lions extend Suh their top 3 players will eat up close to 50% of the cap. This past season Seattles top 3 paid players ate up 23%, SF top 3 players 27%. Denver did not have a player that counted more than 7 million against the cap including Manning. The Lions had Stafford, Calvin and Suh all around 15 million. Calvin will be 20 million in 2015, and 24 million in 2016. The future is not bright as far as cap space.What is the perception of Suh in DET. Is he viewed as a dominant player?
He had a sensational Defensive Rookie of the Year, All Pro Season in 2010 with 10 sacks, 1 INT, 1 FF and 48 solo tackles.
Suh was All Pro in 2013, and a three time Pro Bowler (except 2011).
In looking closer at his numbers, he had 8 sacks in 2012 and 36 solo tackles in 2013, but just 4 and 5.5 sacks in 2011 and 2013, and just 26 and 25 solo tackles in 2011-2012. Numbers may not tell the whole story, if he has been generally disruptive and wreaking havoc behind the LOS so his teammates can make plays.
Geno Atkins was the top DT in 2012, is arguably the top DT in the game and signed a five year, $55 million extension in 2013.
How much would it cost to re-sign Suh? Do DET fans think his play merits what it would take? Looking at the stats, his sack numbers were middling in 2011 and 2013?
Thanks for the input, Da Guru.Suh is a dominant player that commands double teams on almost every play. That being said there is only so much you can do as a DT. The problem is the Lions are paying for being crappy for so long. Calvin, Stafford and Suh were all very high picks under the old agreement. Right now Suh would have made around 60% less and his cap figure would be way more manageable. If the Lions extend Suh their top 3 players will eat up close to 50% of the cap. This past season Seattles top 3 paid players ate up 23%, SF top 3 players 27%. Denver did not have a player that counted more than 7 million against the cap including Manning. The Lions had Stafford, Calvin and Suh all around 15 million. Calvin will be 20 million in 2015, and 24 million in 2016. The future is not bright as far as cap space.What is the perception of Suh in DET. Is he viewed as a dominant player?
He had a sensational Defensive Rookie of the Year, All Pro Season in 2010 with 10 sacks, 1 INT, 1 FF and 48 solo tackles.
Suh was All Pro in 2013, and a three time Pro Bowler (except 2011).
In looking closer at his numbers, he had 8 sacks in 2012 and 36 solo tackles in 2013, but just 4 and 5.5 sacks in 2011 and 2013, and just 26 and 25 solo tackles in 2011-2012. Numbers may not tell the whole story, if he has been generally disruptive and wreaking havoc behind the LOS so his teammates can make plays.
Geno Atkins was the top DT in 2012, is arguably the top DT in the game and signed a five year, $55 million extension in 2013.
How much would it cost to re-sign Suh? Do DET fans think his play merits what it would take? Looking at the stats, his sack numbers were middling in 2011 and 2013?
From what I have read this is why Ken Whisenhunt did not take the job.
I would love to see the Lions trade Suh. Suh is a great player, but he will be making twice what the top DTs make. Can`t win in the NFL that way.Bob Magaw said:Thanks for the input, Da Guru.Da Guru said:Suh is a dominant player that commands double teams on almost every play. That being said there is only so much you can do as a DT. The problem is the Lions are paying for being crappy for so long. Calvin, Stafford and Suh were all very high picks under the old agreement. Right now Suh would have made around 60% less and his cap figure would be way more manageable. If the Lions extend Suh their top 3 players will eat up close to 50% of the cap. This past season Seattles top 3 paid players ate up 23%, SF top 3 players 27%. Denver did not have a player that counted more than 7 million against the cap including Manning. The Lions had Stafford, Calvin and Suh all around 15 million. Calvin will be 20 million in 2015, and 24 million in 2016. The future is not bright as far as cap space.What is the perception of Suh in DET. Is he viewed as a dominant player?
He had a sensational Defensive Rookie of the Year, All Pro Season in 2010 with 10 sacks, 1 INT, 1 FF and 48 solo tackles.
Suh was All Pro in 2013, and a three time Pro Bowler (except 2011).
In looking closer at his numbers, he had 8 sacks in 2012 and 36 solo tackles in 2013, but just 4 and 5.5 sacks in 2011 and 2013, and just 26 and 25 solo tackles in 2011-2012. Numbers may not tell the whole story, if he has been generally disruptive and wreaking havoc behind the LOS so his teammates can make plays.
Geno Atkins was the top DT in 2012, is arguably the top DT in the game and signed a five year, $55 million extension in 2013.
How much would it cost to re-sign Suh? Do DET fans think his play merits what it would take? Looking at the stats, his sack numbers were middling in 2011 and 2013?
From what I have read this is why Ken Whisenhunt did not take the job.
The reason I asked, because I'm aware he is commonly viewed as elite and dominant, is that in half his seasons he has had about 4 and 5 sacks, or averaged only about 1.5 solo tackles per game (maybe scheme-related?). In my recollection, other star DL have also been double teamed, but been more productive despite that. Commanding double teams is no doubt important, but others have done that and still managed to make more plays, too.
Suh is going to be his own agent from what I hear.Da Guru said:^^^ Why were the Ravens going to fire Caldwell after the season? ^^^ Caldwell was gone or demoted. Lions saved Caldwell a trip to the unemployment line.
With a week to go until fee agency Suh still does not have an agent. Tells me Suh is going to drop a contract bomb on the Lions a day or two before free agency and say pay it or I walk. Or that he wants to play out his contract. Right now the Lions are screwed. They can`t even plan on free agents with Suhs contract up in the air. They are supposed to work out a contract that will be one of the biggest ever for an NFL lineman in a couple of days?
Right now I really wish they could trade Suh for a couple of picks, bite the bullet for a year of dead money and move on. If Suh get s huge deal it will handcuff the Lions for the future.
Free agency starts Wed and the Lions and Suh have yet to sit down to talk contract. Are they going to get this done in a couple of days?Suh is going to be his own agent from what I hear.Da Guru said:^^^ Why were the Ravens going to fire Caldwell after the season? ^^^ Caldwell was gone or demoted. Lions saved Caldwell a trip to the unemployment line.
With a week to go until fee agency Suh still does not have an agent. Tells me Suh is going to drop a contract bomb on the Lions a day or two before free agency and say pay it or I walk. Or that he wants to play out his contract. Right now the Lions are screwed. They can`t even plan on free agents with Suhs contract up in the air. They are supposed to work out a contract that will be one of the biggest ever for an NFL lineman in a couple of days?
Right now I really wish they could trade Suh for a couple of picks, bite the bullet for a year of dead money and move on. If Suh get s huge deal it will handcuff the Lions for the future.
He isn't a FA. Here's a nice rundown of his current contract.Free agency starts Wed and the Lions and Suh have yet to sit down to talk contract. Are they going to get this done in a couple of days?Suh is going to be his own agent from what I hear.^^^ Why were the Ravens going to fire Caldwell after the season? ^^^ Caldwell was gone or demoted. Lions saved Caldwell a trip to the unemployment line.
With a week to go until fee agency Suh still does not have an agent. Tells me Suh is going to drop a contract bomb on the Lions a day or two before free agency and say pay it or I walk. Or that he wants to play out his contract. Right now the Lions are screwed. They can`t even plan on free agents with Suhs contract up in the air. They are supposed to work out a contract that will be one of the biggest ever for an NFL lineman in a couple of days?
Right now I really wish they could trade Suh for a couple of picks, bite the bullet for a year of dead money and move on. If Suh get s huge deal it will handcuff the Lions for the future.