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Probably a top-5 RB. As far as other positions go, really depends on scoring system how highly QBs and WRs are rated.
That's different I'll give you that. I have the same top-8 guys.Personally I have Addai rated 4th at RB, I wouldn't trade him straight up for any non-RB. Frankly, I'd be nervous about trading him away for anything that isn't borderline theft.1.LT2.Westbrook3.Peterson4.Addai5.Lynch6.Gore7.Jackson8.MJD
He also has 1 top-10 finish in 4 years.
Based upon what I've seen in trade negotiations, Portis is valued up there when it comes time to trade even though he might not be ranked that high in fantasy start-up drafts.
He's only been the sole starter for 2 years. Last year he got hurt but put up almost 1000 yards and 5 Tds in the last 8 games. Only guy Jackson's being traded for straight up is ADP in 90% of dynasties. He has more value than any other player from what i've seen.
He's also missed games due to injury in every year but 06'. I'm not saying Jackson is bad(he's a great back) I'm just saying if there is an owner expecting him to have a year like he did in 06' that's probably a guy to trade S-Jax to. I'd need a top-5 pick plus Jackson to part with Addai.
you're in the minority. Jackson's upside far exceeds Addai's.
So does his downside.
I'll join that minority then. Addai is a much safer pick than Jackson, and Jackson's and Addai's ceilings are much closer than their floors. Jackson is just as likely to put up #15 RB points as he is #3. Addai is #3-#7.
You sure about that? Steven Jackson's had 2300 yards in a season. I don't think there's a chance in hell that Joseph Addai can do that. He hasn't even had 1500 yards in a season yet.
Jackson hadn't done that after his second year in the league either.Jackson's 2nd year:
The reason Addai will never hit that is because he's on the Colts and he will never be as big a focus on the offense as would be needed to reach the #'s SJax did. The same reason Addai's floor is so safe is the same reason his ceiling is limited---Peyton and the passing game. Addai will NEVER get enough touches to even approach those #'s and I don't think he's good enough to do it on another team.The reason guys like SJax, Gore, Westbrook, AP, LJ, and LT have the potential to put up monster #'s over the course of a season is because they are the focal points of their offense and touch the ball in such a huge % of plays and can produce with them. Aside from the fact that I don't even think Addai is capable of handling that kind of workload, he'll never see it in Indy.
Because Steven Jackson is a better player than Joseph Addai. I'll repeat. Steven Jackson is a better player than Joseph Addai
This is a horrible comparison as you're leaving out a HUGE part of this, and this part was also the reason Jackson's 3rd year breakout was so mind-numbingly easy to predict.Addai and Jackson put up similar numbers in their second years, but Addai did it in a phenomenal situation while Jackson did it in one of the worst situations we've ever seen.
Let's start off with "Jackson was still splitting time in year 2, while Addai was the bell cow", sprinkle in a healthy dose of "Jackson was playing in a once-great offense sputtering its last dying gasp while Addai only managed similar numbers playing in one of the greatest offenses the sport of football has ever seen playing at its peak", and add a dollop of "My eyes tell me, based on their play on the field, that Jackson is the more talented back".
Wait a minute. Are we debating whether Jackson or Addai is the more talented back? Jackson is more talented than Addai. What I'm suggesting is that the difference in talent is irrelevant because they don't play on the same team. Addai will get significantly more scoring chances and could easily keep up on yards. I view their durability as about equal. The bottom line is when discussing a top-5 RB, I believe its better to have a guy who you know will finish near the top, Jackson doesn't seem like that guy to me, St. Louis did next to nothing to upgrade their offense and they can't use the "well a lot of guys got hurt" excuse because with them it happens every year. If people are willing to buy Jackson as a top-3 RB, I'd sell if I had him. I wouldn't sell Addai unless I was getting a top-3 guy in return.
In Dynasty, it's better to bet on talent then situation. The only way Jackson is going to suck next year is if Jackson gets hurt. The only way Addai is going to suck next year is if Addai gets hurt... or if Peyton Manning gets hurt... or if Reggie Wayne gets hurt. The only way Jackson is going to suck 3 years from now is if Jackson gets hurt in the next 3 years. The only way Addai is going to suck 3 years from now is if Addai gets hurt in the next 3 years... or if Manning gets hurt in the next 3 years... or if Wayne gets hurt in the next 3 years... or if Gonzalez doesn't continue to develop and Indy can't find a competent #2... or if Dungy retires and the team falls apart... or if the offensive line regresses to merely "very good"... or if...Jackson in a bad situation produces as well as Addai in a good situation. Jackson in a good situation produces better than Addai in a good situation. I'd be willing to bet that Jackson in a bad situation produces better than Addai in a bad situation. I don't see why this is such a head-scratcher to some people.
Not to mention is Addai is much more in danger of losing carries to a future time share or less than a "full load."Addai's backup(s) can do a very good Addai impression when given a chance at regular work. S-Jax's backups can't hold a candle to his production.
I disagree. 2-3 years from now there's a very real chance that Addai's not on the Colts. He's gonna want a big contract and with the money the colts have tied up in their offense i'm not sure he gets it. He leaves and his value plummets. Jackson leaves and his value either goes up or stays the same.
Oh I'm sorry - their situations are entirely different. Addai was playing on a team with their #1 WR out, their #3 a rookie, their OL in disarray and injured, their HC contemplating retirement, still recovering from his son's suicide. And for god's sake Addai was banged up all season too.You're right - so different
Posts like this remind me that the Addai haters are alive and well on these boards. Addai is not in any danger of losing carriesFear & Loathing said:Not to mention is Addai is much more in danger of losing carries to a future time share or less than a "full load."Addai's backup(s) can do a very good Addai impression when given a chance at regular work. S-Jax's backups can't hold a candle to his production.
People just want to hate on the guy - oh well, your loss 
I'd have a hard time arguing this. Maybe some scoring syetms would drop him a bit, but not many players would leap past him right now. Top seven or eight for sure, and fourth sounds pretty good to me.That is where I have him-
MIKEPosts like this remind me that the Addai haters are alive and well on these boards. Addai is not in any danger of losing carriesPeople just want to hate on the guy - oh well, your loss
baby!!!!! Whoooooooooooooooooooooooooooo yea!VALUE!
I worry about the guy's longevity. He's had some injury problems....That's why I drop him below Addai....
I would think it would lower Hart's value somewhat as well. I agree it wouldn't mean diddly-poo to Addai.
Oh whatever dude. Go back two years and you'll find me pimping the hell out of Addai before the draft. Go forward a few months from there and you'll find essays that I wrote about how good Addai was going to be on the Colts after the draft, and about how underrated his talent was and how big of a deal it was that Bill Polian (who I feel is one of the best talent evaluators in the NFL) drafted him with his first round pick. Hell, I JUST said in this very thread that he's a top 4 dynasty RB. So don't spew that "oh it's fashionable for you to hate the guy" stuff at me, I'm the wrong guy for it.But what I cannot believe, what I cannot fathom being said on any planet is that you just tried to compare the 2007 Colts' offense to the 2005 Rams' offense. Are you kidding me?Oh I'm sorry - their situations are entirely different. Addai was playing on a team with their #1 WR out, their #3 a rookie, their OL in disarray and injured, their HC contemplating retirement, still recovering from his son's suicide. And for god's sake Addai was banged up all season too.You're right - so different
Oh, and BTW for all this talk about how bad the Rams passing O was they had the #4 passing O
I forgot it's fashionable to hate Addai on these boards.
As for Jackson getting more of a workload than Addai, that's shortsighted as well. Considering in Addai's second season he had more carries than Jackson had in his second season. If you go back and look at the players side by side after season #2 - do you honestly think you'd rank Jackson higher? Doubtful.
Yikes.Oh whatever dude. Go back two years and you'll find me pimping the hell out of Addai before the draft. Go forward a few months from there and you'll find essays that I wrote about how good Addai was going to be on the Colts after the draft, and about how underrated his talent was and how big of a deal it was that Bill Polian (who I feel is one of the best talent evaluators in the NFL) drafted him with his first round pick. Hell, I JUST said in this very thread that he's a top 4 dynasty RB. So don't spew that "oh it's fashionable for you to hate the guy" stuff at me, I'm the wrong guy for it.But what I cannot believe, what I cannot fathom being said on any planet is that you just tried to compare the 2007 Colts' offense to the 2005 Rams' offense. Are you kidding me?Oh I'm sorry - their situations are entirely different. Addai was playing on a team with their #1 WR out, their #3 a rookie, their OL in disarray and injured, their HC contemplating retirement, still recovering from his son's suicide. And for god's sake Addai was banged up all season too.You're right - so different
Oh, and BTW for all this talk about how bad the Rams passing O was they had the #4 passing O
I forgot it's fashionable to hate Addai on these boards.
As for Jackson getting more of a workload than Addai, that's shortsighted as well. Considering in Addai's second season he had more carries than Jackson had in his second season. If you go back and look at the players side by side after season #2 - do you honestly think you'd rank Jackson higher? Doubtful.
This is people's biggest problem with fantasy football. They somehow find a way to make their memory hold grudges forever but have ridiculously short term memories when it comes to everything else. Yay, the Rams threw for the 4th most yards in 2005. That's not difficult to do when your defense is giving up 30 points a game and you go into the 4th quarter of most games down 24 points and giving your RB 0 carries while your passing game works out some garbage yards against a 3rd string secondary playing prevent defense while averaging 37+ passing attempts per game.
I mean really, were you alive in 2005? Watching football? There's no way any human being could have been conscious during 2005 and be comparing that Rams team to this Colts team. The guys around Sjax were the second worst in the last 5 years behind only the 2006 Raiders (which may have been the worst team I've ever seen). Think back to 2005, pretend you're there again. Do you not remember how awful and in disarray that team was? And you're comparing them to the Colts? You take out Peyton Manning AND Jim Sorgi AND two more linemen and you're still looking at a better supporting cast than Jackson had on that god-awful 2005 Rams team.
You claim that people just hate on Addai because it's fashionable, yet you're the won who's stubborn enough in your beliefs to stretch reality and history unconscionable amounts to fit your beliefs.
?
Nice attack, but still not proving anything regarding Addai's situation versus Jackson's.You're saying the offense in '05 looked good for the Rams because of garbage yardage where Jackson didn't get 4th quarter carries. But that happened to Addai too. He was pulled early in a lot of games, and didn't get much work in the 4th quarter.FreeBaGeL said:Oh whatever dude. Go back two years and you'll find me pimping the hell out of Addai before the draft. Go forward a few months from there and you'll find essays that I wrote about how good Addai was going to be on the Colts after the draft, and about how underrated his talent was and how big of a deal it was that Bill Polian (who I feel is one of the best talent evaluators in the NFL) drafted him with his first round pick. Hell, I JUST said in this very thread that he's a top 4 dynasty RB. So don't spew that "oh it's fashionable for you to hate the guy" stuff at me, I'm the wrong guy for it.But what I cannot believe, what I cannot fathom being said on any planet is that you just tried to compare the 2007 Colts' offense to the 2005 Rams' offense. Are you kidding me?Oh I'm sorry - their situations are entirely different. Addai was playing on a team with their #1 WR out, their #3 a rookie, their OL in disarray and injured, their HC contemplating retirement, still recovering from his son's suicide. And for god's sake Addai was banged up all season too.You're right - so different
Oh, and BTW for all this talk about how bad the Rams passing O was they had the #4 passing O
I forgot it's fashionable to hate Addai on these boards.
As for Jackson getting more of a workload than Addai, that's shortsighted as well. Considering in Addai's second season he had more carries than Jackson had in his second season. If you go back and look at the players side by side after season #2 - do you honestly think you'd rank Jackson higher? Doubtful.
This is people's biggest problem with fantasy football. They somehow find a way to make their memory hold grudges forever but have ridiculously short term memories when it comes to everything else. Yay, the Rams threw for the 4th most yards in 2005. That's not difficult to do when your defense is giving up 30 points a game and you go into the 4th quarter of most games down 24 points and giving your RB 0 carries while your passing game works out some garbage yards against a 3rd string secondary playing prevent defense while averaging 37+ passing attempts per game.
I mean really, were you alive in 2005? Watching football? There's no way any human being could have been conscious during 2005 and be comparing that Rams team to this Colts team. The guys around Sjax were the second worst in the last 5 years behind only the 2006 Raiders (which may have been the worst team I've ever seen). Think back to 2005, pretend you're there again. Do you not remember how awful and in disarray that team was? And you're comparing them to the Colts? You take out Peyton Manning AND Jim Sorgi AND two more linemen and you're still looking at a better supporting cast than Jackson had on that god-awful 2005 Rams team.
You claim that people just hate on Addai because it's fashionable, yet you're the won who's stubborn enough in your beliefs to stretch reality and history unconscionable amounts to fit your beliefs.
Yep - Jackson had an easier time running in the 4th quarter than Addai.No, Jackson did not have Peyton Manning, but he did have Bulger for 8 games, and Jamie Martin was not that bad (70% completion rate). The 4 games that Fitzpatrick played half of were the worst he had to deal with. No one is ever going to say Jackson's QB situation is as good as Addai's - no RB can really say that. But the QB is only one component of the offense. Addai's OLine was still a TOTAL mess. A TOTAL mess. The Colts were shuffling players around like crazy. They were missing Harrison. They were sending Clark out instead of having him help block. I'm not saying the '05 Rams = '07 Colts. But that from a RB's perspective there were similar challenges to hurdle. Oh, and Addai playing hurt most of the season.
Your analysis is usually more solid than this.The Rams had the #4 passing offense? I'm sure you're measuring by yardage, right? I'm equally sure that that yardage came when the game was completely out of hand and they were passing freely, and either couldn't run, or didn't want to because that would effectively negate the (remote) chance of a comeback. There's a huge difference when discussing RB potential between having a strong enough offense to pass when the game is in doubt early on, and throwing for garbage yards when the game has effectively been decided. The former opens up opportunities for rushing yards; the latter forecloses them (though it can be offset, as it was for SJax, by the RB getting some of those garbage receiving yards). The Colts are the former, and the Rams last year were the latter.Oh I'm sorry - their situations are entirely different. Addai was playing on a team with their #1 WR out, their #3 a rookie, their OL in disarray and injured, their HC contemplating retirement, still recovering from his son's suicide. And for god's sake Addai was banged up all season too.You're right - so different
Oh, and BTW for all this talk about how bad the Rams passing O was they had the #4 passing O
I forgot it's fashionable to hate Addai on these boards.
As for Jackson getting more of a workload than Addai, that's shortsighted as well. Considering in Addai's second season he had more carries than Jackson had in his second season. If you go back and look at the players side by side after season #2 - do you honestly think you'd rank Jackson higher? Doubtful.
Thanks for the compliment
I think people are overrating the Colts offense last year, because Manning did an amazing job of holding it together. But honestly, the statistics simply do not back up what people are saying about Jackson's situation in '05.
I don't doubt Jackson WILL put up better numbers in a perfect season. I just don't think that their numbers will be that far apart. Whether people want to say that's because Addai is in an overall better situation or not, it doesn't matter. In FF, what matters is the results. The '06 Jackson is probably the best he'll EVER be... the '07 Addai is still getting better.Also, how did Jackson put up better numbers last year?? Even in PPG Jackson was #7 and Addai was #5 in my league.
My bad on the SJax stats - I think I was mistakenly thinking about his 2006 stats in discussin the 2007 rankings. As for your overall post, I don't want to fall victim in this discussion to the classic problem of confusing a discussion about NFL talent with a discussion about fantasy value, as the two are not the same (though obviously related). There's no question that the fantasy value of the two is closer than is the actual NFL talent, and the point I've been making is that that's due to the respective situations they find themselves in.Thanks for the compliment
I think people are overrating the Colts offense last year, because Manning did an amazing job of holding it together. But honestly, the statistics simply do not back up what people are saying about Jackson's situation in '05.I don't doubt Jackson WILL put up better numbers in a perfect season. I just don't think that their numbers will be that far apart. Whether people want to say that's because Addai is in an overall better situation or not, it doesn't matter. In FF, what matters is the results. The '06 Jackson is probably the best he'll EVER be... the '07 Addai is still getting better.Also, how did Jackson put up better numbers last year?? Even in PPG Jackson was #7 and Addai was #5 in my league.
And that was all I said in my original post. Their ceilings are closer than their floors. Jackson's situation and health are more risky than Addai's IMO. I know some will think Addai's health is more of a risk, but NFL experience indicates Jackson's is...
That is where I have him-
