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Another killing at the hands of the Police (21 Viewers)

Biff84 said:
Either you’re drunk or acting incredibly dense. You think that just because they are spray painting those messages that they couldn’t possibly be right-wing protesters pretending to be left-wing to make them look worse? There are several reports stating that it is outside actors from both extremes trying to exploit this situation, cause chaos and discredit the message of the peaceful protests.

It’s quite ridiculous that you think that it couldn’t be right-wing extremists just because they are spray painting F 12 and ACAB.

As far as I’m concerned, the protests that happen during the day and the riots at night are two completely separate entities. There are bad actors that cross between the groups but for the most part they don’t want any part of the other. Rioters care little about the peaceful protests and vise versa.
City after city seems to be the same thing happening...peaceful rallies early and people notice the crowd changing...others coming in as the first crowd leaves and that is when things get violent.  Ive seen ads from multiple cities calling for people to show up to the later parts of these things...its organized and it isn't all just one group.

 
Lol. You used the "other uses" part of wikipedia

Thats suboptimal virtue signaling. 
Sorry that was the first thing that came up?

Are you trying to dispute how that term has been used historically?

Im not virtue signaling, I’m a Jew who has a memory.

 
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To keep claiming it is all extreme leftists does not appear to be supported by a whole lot.  Its also pretty sad to all but cheer on the violence against news media covering these stories.  No, its not a good thing that people are having that much contempt for news reporters.  These are not the opinion talking heads...these are on the ground reporters showing things as they happen.  That isn't fake news...its actual news.  Its sad that a movement to label anything negative about a side is called fake news.  

https://www.justsecurity.org/70497/far-right-infiltrators-and-agitators-in-george-floyd-protests-indicators-of-white-supremacists/

https://www.forbes.com/sites/sergeiklebnikov/2020/05/30/right-wing-conspiracists-pull-from-old-playbook-blame-george-soros-for-riots/#17ad5de54100

And there are more reports out there...that there appear to be both antifa type and the proud boy white nationalist types out there in these cities.  Why?  To create the mess that they have wanted the whole time.
Wow

 
when he said "This entire situation is awful, but it’s time for a change. Is this the answer for change? I’m not sure."  what is the "this" he is referencing though?  Is it protesting or is it violence?
Maybe I’m assuming (and my fault if the assumption is incorrect) but that response reads to be a direst response to the video of the the shopkeepers getting beat (not about the protests or other violence). 

 
Use a different term dude. The rest of that paragraph is the reason why.

You could just call them “criminals” for example, because that’s what they are.

Did you also claim the officer who murdered an innocent man was “subhuman”?
Did you read my post? The very first definition of subhuman is “less than human”. That’s my opinion. I don’t need to go to Wikipedia when the standard definition works fine. 

 
The sentiment may be right...but what do you think their purpose in reporting it like that is?  IMO...its to say, see, the Pandemic isn't that bad or these people wouldn't be out.  Also setting up the scapegoat if cases start rising.

I don't think people forgot...I think people are pissed off at what has been going on for a long time and the death of Mr. Floyd set it off (again, not all because some of this is absolutely organized to cause chaos rather than protest for a reason)
Oh, I know what their motives are. Just like I know what CNN is doing when they go around the country reporting on random cities that reopened and are struggling to deal with coronavirus. I try to watch both sides to at least get a feel for what they're saying. Normally, I can't stand Fox News for more than a few minutes. But now I can't stand CNN either. 

I suppose I am too numbers based. I understand this is about more than one death and a systemic thing so I suppose one can always point back to that. But besides the death, injury and destruction occurring during these protests, how many deaths do you think will come out of this due to the coronavirus? And it is likely to impact the same segment that has already been disproportionately hit. 

That said, if things don't kick back up, I do agree it should make us rethink our response to this virus. If people can loot and protest shoulder to shoulder, than surely I can go out?

 
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No need to look for implications. My post clearly indicates I don’t care what color the person is. 
Sure it does, but having a reasonable dialog is easier when there are simple alternatives to certain words. 

And, for example, Nazi's categorized any number of people as subhuman.

 
Maybe I’m assuming (and my fault if the assumption is incorrect) but that response reads to be a direst response to the video of the the shopkeepers getting beat (not about the protests or other violence). 
Hey Maybe i read it wrong as well.  I assumed it was protest and not violence. 

 
That was the first thing that came up?

Im not virtue signaling, I’m a Jew who has a memory.
More misinformation from you....here is the actual definition without your attempt to make racist insults to other posters. 
 

ub·hu·man | \ ˌsəb-ˈhyü-mən  , -ˈyü- \

Definition of subhuman

 (Entry 1 of 2)

: less than human: such as

a: failing to attain the level (as of morality or intelligence) associated with normal human beings

From Merriam Webster. 
 

It questions morals and intelligence, nothing to do with race. 
 

 
What does that have to do with my post?

Those people are criminals. Criminals who should be in jail.

Not animals.
Not subhuman.

People.
Just curious, and you don’t have to reply obviously, but why the need to defend these people?

Seems like a really odd place to make  your stand 

 
Did you read my post? The very first definition of subhuman is “less than human”. That’s my opinion. I don’t need to go to Wikipedia when the standard definition works fine. 
Like I said originally, if you wanna defend using that term, have at it.

Just as long as you know where it originated. This is how the Nazis referred to the Jewish people they were attempting to exterminate.

Again, if you think that’s ok, that’s on you.

 
More misinformation from you....here is the actual definition without your attempt to make racist insults to other posters. 
 

ub·hu·man | \ ˌsəb-ˈhyü-mən  , -ˈyü- \

Definition of subhuman

 (Entry 1 of 2)

: less than human: such as

a: failing to attain the level (as of morality or intelligence) associated with normal human beings

From Merriam Webster. 
 

It questions morals and intelligence, nothing to do with race. 
 
Now go look up where the term originated.

 
From Wikipedia:

Subhuman (German: Untermensch), a term from early eugenics and Nazi racial ideology for an "inferior human being" Dehumanization. A measure of progress in artificial intelligence, denoting worse performance than most humans.

You wanna defend the use of that term, have at it. 

I’ll never let that kind of talk slide. 

Ever.
https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/subhuman

Examples of subhuman in a Sentence

Adjective The prisoners suffered subhuman treatment. years of grinding poverty that had reduced them to a subhuman existence

 
Like I said originally, if you wanna defend using that term, have at it.

Just as long as you know where it originated. This is how the Nazis referred to the Jewish people they were attempting to exterminate.

Again, if you think that’s ok, that’s on you.
I’d much rather defend the term than the lowlifes to which the term is being applied.

 
Just curious, and you don’t have to reply obviously, but why the need to defend these people?

Seems like a really odd place to make  your stand 
I’m not defending them. At all.

What I’m doing is coming out against using historically racist terms to describe these people.

And, as I just stated, those particular terms hit home for me personally because of my background.

 
Sorry that was the first thing that came up?

Are you trying to dispute how that term has been used historically?

Im not virtue signaling, I’m a Jew who has a memory.
You are arguing about whether or not people that are running around setting fires should be called nicer words and skipping past main definitions to quote other uses.

Its dumb.

 
I’d much rather defend the term than the lowlifes to which the term is being applied.
Like I said, if you wanna use the same term the Nazis creates to describe the Jews, that’s up to you.

Just don’t go around complaining you get called a racist when you do, lol.

 
Like I said originally, if you wanna defend using that term, have at it.

Just as long as you know where it originated. This is how the Nazis referred to the Jewish people they were attempting to exterminate.

Again, if you think that’s ok, that’s on you.
Either you don’t know what originated means or I need to brush up on my history timeline.

ORIGIN OF SUBHUMAN

First recorded in 1785–95

 
So, now we are worried about the definitions of words. Just a few days ago people were questioning what the word "total" meant, now we're justifying using racist/anti-Semite words. The progress we made in the last couple of days is befuddling.

 
You could call their actions sub human. 

But to call the people sub human sets a context where you could deny them due process for their criminal actions and, I dunno, just summarily execute them (reducing it to the absurd there).

 
But that wasn’t the intent of these protests.  And despite what you see on the news the large majority of the protests were and have been peaceful.  
The protests weren’t what was being discussed in that specific post.  A man/woman getting beaten while trying to defend their business from looters was.   Also, I never disputed large numbers of peaceful protests occurring.

 
I am late to this discussion, but are there people here actually defending the use of the term subhuman? 
English Language Learners Definition of subhuman

: not having or showing the level of kindness, intelligence, etc., that is expected of normal human beings
 

sorry, but in my opinion , this fits people like Chauvin 

 
My own suspicion is that both of these assertions are wildly overstated. I believe the vast majority of rioters aren’t organized at all; they are simply a minority of protestors who are behaving badly, just as there are a minority of police who are behaving badly. 
I believe its a mix of both far right/left agitating susceptible protestors 

 
Someone sounds embarrassed for defending Nazi terminology.
Your lack of self awareness then is quite worrisome. You have used false “definitions” from Wikipedia to try to justify inaccurate claims of racism. It’s obvious to everyone and very sad to see in here. 

 
A couple of comments from NSA Robert O'Brien:

Zeke Miller @ZekeJMiller

O'Brien on CNN on police forces: "I don't think there's systemic racism...but there are some bad apples in there...There are a few bad apples that are giving law enforcement a bad name...We need to root them out,"

Kelly O'Donnell@KellyO

National Security Adviser, Robert O'Brien says rioters are "using military tactics. It has to be stopped."

Both statements demonstrate a tone-deafness and lack of understanding the situation, and ensures that nothing will be done to address the underlying issues.

 
The protests weren’t what was being discussed in that specific post.  A man/woman getting beaten while trying to defend their business from looters was.   Also, I never disputed large numbers of peaceful protests occurring.
That is good to hear.  Its sad there is more focus on that than the root cause of the incident that led us here. 

 
:shrug: i will call it out wherever i see it.  so since you sound very focused on solving problems what are you actively doing to prevent more injustices from occurring?
Wait, you think “calling out” people on a football message board behind your alias is solving anything? Enough to where you are telling other posters they are part of the problem? I would disagree. 

 
@Gawain I’m looking back and see some quotes but haven’t seen the study or article, so bear with me a bit here. I’m not exactly sure why firing their weapon is any threshold to point at here. While this particular incident is the reason for these protests, it’s a societal problem as much as it’s a police violence problem. It’s Breonna Taylor, Arbery, the lady with the dog off leash calling the police saying “there’s a black man threatening me,” the guy picking trash up around his building that gets guns drawn on him because he doesn’t have ID and was pointing his trash grabber at the police officer, the times a gun is drawn and pointed at someone during a traffic stop. 

 
A couple of comments from NSA Robert O'Brien:

Zeke Miller @ZekeJMiller

O'Brien on CNN on police forces: "I don't think there's systemic racism...but there are some bad apples in there...There are a few bad apples that are giving law enforcement a bad name...We need to root them out,"

Kelly O'Donnell@KellyO

National Security Adviser, Robert O'Brien says rioters are "using military tactics. It has to be stopped."

Both statements demonstrate a tone-deafness and lack of understanding the situation, and ensures that nothing will be done to address the underlying issues.
Military tactics? I wish he would elaborate. Is he implying this is real life Call of Duty or something. Hmm, we need to use the words we mean. The best words.

 
Nah, I think most in here know their basic world history and are decent enough not to refer to other human beings as “subhuman animals”.
 

Good job white-knighting though. Racists need defending too!
Sorry, but using one term based on its actual meaning, does not make me racist.

 
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I’m asking what their thoughts are? Do they have solutions, do they see where the issue lies?
Well i have heard a few acknowledge that the issues are systemic.  some who are current police others who arent.  I would agree.  I do agree that the issue is more systemic than the police.  I dont think most police actively go to work with the goal of being racist and killing blacks.  But they do participate within a system that contributes to this happening.  Acknowledgement is a start.  Doesn't sound like we are fully there yet however.

 
A couple of comments from NSA Robert O'Brien:

Zeke Miller @ZekeJMiller

O'Brien on CNN on police forces: "I don't think there's systemic racism...but there are some bad apples in there...There are a few bad apples that are giving law enforcement a bad name...We need to root them out,"

Kelly O'Donnell@KellyO

National Security Adviser, Robert O'Brien says rioters are "using military tactics. It has to be stopped."

Both statements demonstrate a tone-deafness and lack of understanding the situation, and ensures that nothing will be done to address the underlying issues.


I mean - did you think this Administration was going to do anything to address the underlying issues?

 

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