Anyone else had it with MJD? (1 Viewer)

[krugoh]

looking to trade MJD and wallace for shady mccoy and orton

 

[FantasyTrader]

There are some VERY short sighted approaches going on in this thread. At this point and with how much he has struggled, I would say it is extremely unlikely he lives up to his draft position or finishes within a few spots of it. That being said, I think it is equally unlikely he continues to perform at RB 22-25 levels. The most likely outcome, in my opinion, is that he finishes on the fringe of the top 10 or just inside the top 10, somewhere int he 8-15 range.For those that spent high draft picks on him, this obviously isn't what you were expecting. However, to say you are done with him is a huge mistake and a vast overreaction. I may be accused of being slow to react and too patient at times, but in the end talent generally shows up and will allow a player to perform. MJD didn't suddenly lose his talent and I'm betting he has some big performances in him yet this year...or at least enough of them to get him back into top 10 range.

Moving away from him in week 7 is not an overreaction. It's common sense. If anything, waiting until now to bench him based on the way he's played displays the patience of Job. Nobody's saying you bench him for dog meat. But if you have another legit top-20 option you need to make the switch. The back I saw this weekend is not the home run threat we know and love. The only thing he's capable of housing right now is the family pack at KFC.

 

[Herm23]

There are some VERY short sighted approaches going on in this thread. At this point and with how much he has struggled, I would say it is extremely unlikely he lives up to his draft position or finishes within a few spots of it. That being said, I think it is equally unlikely he continues to perform at RB 22-25 levels. The most likely outcome, in my opinion, is that he finishes on the fringe of the top 10 or just inside the top 10, somewhere int he 8-15 range.For those that spent high draft picks on him, this obviously isn't what you were expecting. However, to say you are done with him is a huge mistake and a vast overreaction. I may be accused of being slow to react and too patient at times, but in the end talent generally shows up and will allow a player to perform. MJD didn't suddenly lose his talent and I'm betting he has some big performances in him yet this year...or at least enough of them to get him back into top 10 range.

Moving away from him in week 7 is not an overreaction. It's common sense. If anything, waiting until now to bench him based on the way he's played displays the patience of Job. Nobody's saying you bench him for dog meat. But if you have another legit top-20 option you need to make the switch. The back I saw this weekend is not the home run threat we know and love. The only thing he's capable of housing right now is the family pack at KFC.

He is 1 big performance away from immediately becoming a top 15 RB again and 2 big performances from suddenly becoming a top 10 RB. Even as bad as he and the team looked on Monday, he had 2 chances inside the 5. Sure he didn't convert, but some of that was due to factors outside of MJD's control (botched snap count on the first series and game pace and needing to throw on the 2nd series). Had he converted one or both of those chances, we wouldn't be having this discussion and this thread would never have appeared, even as poor as both he and the team looked. That is my entire point- in the blink of an eye, he can instantly make up for lost ground and return to elite status and performance.I would completely and totally disagree with the statement that if you have another top 20 option that you bench MJD for that person regularly. On an occassionally basis, if the matchup for said top 20 option is very sweet? Yes, I can see that. However, there are VERY few running backs capable of putting up the big performances MJD is. Not many players are the true, every down running backs for their team AND the goal line backs. Those that are almost always end up putting up points, especially when they have talent to back it up. Has MJD started fairly slow and been generally dissapointing thus far? Yes. Is it unheard of for a player to start slow and then come on like wildfire over the 2nd half of the season? Heck no. Is MJD more talented than most of the players who have done that in the past? I would say yes. Using 6 weeks of performance (really 4 weeks, because he HAS had 2 good games this year) to override multiple years of stud performance is the very definition of short term. All the injuries he has sustained are of the minor, nagging variety and something a bye week can do wonders to help.

 

[FantasyTrader]

There are some VERY short sighted approaches going on in this thread. At this point and with how much he has struggled, I would say it is extremely unlikely he lives up to his draft position or finishes within a few spots of it. That being said, I think it is equally unlikely he continues to perform at RB 22-25 levels. The most likely outcome, in my opinion, is that he finishes on the fringe of the top 10 or just inside the top 10, somewhere int he 8-15 range.For those that spent high draft picks on him, this obviously isn't what you were expecting. However, to say you are done with him is a huge mistake and a vast overreaction. I may be accused of being slow to react and too patient at times, but in the end talent generally shows up and will allow a player to perform. MJD didn't suddenly lose his talent and I'm betting he has some big performances in him yet this year...or at least enough of them to get him back into top 10 range.

Moving away from him in week 7 is not an overreaction. It's common sense. If anything, waiting until now to bench him based on the way he's played displays the patience of Job. Nobody's saying you bench him for dog meat. But if you have another legit top-20 option you need to make the switch. The back I saw this weekend is not the home run threat we know and love. The only thing he's capable of housing right now is the family pack at KFC.

He is 1 big performance away from immediately becoming a top 15 RB again and 2 big performances from suddenly becoming a top 10 RB. Even as bad as he and the team looked on Monday, he had 2 chances inside the 5. Sure he didn't convert, but some of that was due to factors outside of MJD's control (botched snap count on the first series and game pace and needing to throw on the 2nd series). Had he converted one or both of those chances, we wouldn't be having this discussion and this thread would never have appeared, even as poor as both he and the team looked. That is my entire point- in the blink of an eye, he can instantly make up for lost ground and return to elite status and performance.I would completely and totally disagree with the statement that if you have another top 20 option that you bench MJD for that person regularly. On an occassionally basis, if the matchup for said top 20 option is very sweet? Yes, I can see that. However, there are VERY few running backs capable of putting up the big performances MJD is. Not many players are the true, every down running backs for their team AND the goal line backs. Those that are almost always end up putting up points, especially when they have talent to back it up. Has MJD started fairly slow and been generally dissapointing thus far? Yes. Is it unheard of for a player to start slow and then come on like wildfire over the 2nd half of the season? Heck yes. Is MJD more talented than most of the players who have done that in the past? I woudl say yes. Using 6 weeks of performance (really 4 weeks, because he HAS had 2 good games this year) to override multiple years of stud performance is the very definition of short term. All the injuries he has sustained are of the minor, nagging variety and something a bye week can do wonders to help.

Okay, discussion over. You're using historical factors for the basis of your argument and I'm using the Jones-Drew I saw Monday night. We'll agree to disagree.

 

[Herm23]

There are some VERY short sighted approaches going on in this thread. At this point and with how much he has struggled, I would say it is extremely unlikely he lives up to his draft position or finishes within a few spots of it. That being said, I think it is equally unlikely he continues to perform at RB 22-25 levels. The most likely outcome, in my opinion, is that he finishes on the fringe of the top 10 or just inside the top 10, somewhere int he 8-15 range.For those that spent high draft picks on him, this obviously isn't what you were expecting. However, to say you are done with him is a huge mistake and a vast overreaction. I may be accused of being slow to react and too patient at times, but in the end talent generally shows up and will allow a player to perform. MJD didn't suddenly lose his talent and I'm betting he has some big performances in him yet this year...or at least enough of them to get him back into top 10 range.

Moving away from him in week 7 is not an overreaction. It's common sense. If anything, waiting until now to bench him based on the way he's played displays the patience of Job. Nobody's saying you bench him for dog meat. But if you have another legit top-20 option you need to make the switch. The back I saw this weekend is not the home run threat we know and love. The only thing he's capable of housing right now is the family pack at KFC.

He is 1 big performance away from immediately becoming a top 15 RB again and 2 big performances from suddenly becoming a top 10 RB. Even as bad as he and the team looked on Monday, he had 2 chances inside the 5. Sure he didn't convert, but some of that was due to factors outside of MJD's control (botched snap count on the first series and game pace and needing to throw on the 2nd series). Had he converted one or both of those chances, we wouldn't be having this discussion and this thread would never have appeared, even as poor as both he and the team looked. That is my entire point- in the blink of an eye, he can instantly make up for lost ground and return to elite status and performance.I would completely and totally disagree with the statement that if you have another top 20 option that you bench MJD for that person regularly. On an occassionally basis, if the matchup for said top 20 option is very sweet? Yes, I can see that. However, there are VERY few running backs capable of putting up the big performances MJD is. Not many players are the true, every down running backs for their team AND the goal line backs. Those that are almost always end up putting up points, especially when they have talent to back it up. Has MJD started fairly slow and been generally dissapointing thus far? Yes. Is it unheard of for a player to start slow and then come on like wildfire over the 2nd half of the season? Heck yes. Is MJD more talented than most of the players who have done that in the past? I woudl say yes. Using 6 weeks of performance (really 4 weeks, because he HAS had 2 good games this year) to override multiple years of stud performance is the very definition of short term. All the injuries he has sustained are of the minor, nagging variety and something a bye week can do wonders to help.

Okay, discussion over. You're using historical factors for the basis of your argument and I'm using the Jones-Drew I saw Monday night. We'll agree to disagree.

The Jones-Drew I saw Monday night was the feature back during 2 drives inside the 5 yard line AND was the focal point of the offense throughout the game. Both he and the team didn't look great, but the entire point is he doesn't need to look great to be able to convert goal line chances and carry the ball 20+ times. Both of those things do require a certain skill- a skill MJD has clearly shown over time that he has, while many in the top 20 have not. His opportunity for success is MUCH better than a lot of the other top 20 options, which means by default he is a better option from a fantasy football standpoint than a lot of those players as well. 6 weeks does not a season make.

 

[FantasyTrader]

There are some VERY short sighted approaches going on in this thread. At this point and with how much he has struggled, I would say it is extremely unlikely he lives up to his draft position or finishes within a few spots of it. That being said, I think it is equally unlikely he continues to perform at RB 22-25 levels. The most likely outcome, in my opinion, is that he finishes on the fringe of the top 10 or just inside the top 10, somewhere int he 8-15 range.For those that spent high draft picks on him, this obviously isn't what you were expecting. However, to say you are done with him is a huge mistake and a vast overreaction. I may be accused of being slow to react and too patient at times, but in the end talent generally shows up and will allow a player to perform. MJD didn't suddenly lose his talent and I'm betting he has some big performances in him yet this year...or at least enough of them to get him back into top 10 range.

Moving away from him in week 7 is not an overreaction. It's common sense. If anything, waiting until now to bench him based on the way he's played displays the patience of Job. Nobody's saying you bench him for dog meat. But if you have another legit top-20 option you need to make the switch. The back I saw this weekend is not the home run threat we know and love. The only thing he's capable of housing right now is the family pack at KFC.

He is 1 big performance away from immediately becoming a top 15 RB again and 2 big performances from suddenly becoming a top 10 RB. Even as bad as he and the team looked on Monday, he had 2 chances inside the 5. Sure he didn't convert, but some of that was due to factors outside of MJD's control (botched snap count on the first series and game pace and needing to throw on the 2nd series). Had he converted one or both of those chances, we wouldn't be having this discussion and this thread would never have appeared, even as poor as both he and the team looked. That is my entire point- in the blink of an eye, he can instantly make up for lost ground and return to elite status and performance.I would completely and totally disagree with the statement that if you have another top 20 option that you bench MJD for that person regularly. On an occassionally basis, if the matchup for said top 20 option is very sweet? Yes, I can see that. However, there are VERY few running backs capable of putting up the big performances MJD is. Not many players are the true, every down running backs for their team AND the goal line backs. Those that are almost always end up putting up points, especially when they have talent to back it up. Has MJD started fairly slow and been generally dissapointing thus far? Yes. Is it unheard of for a player to start slow and then come on like wildfire over the 2nd half of the season? Heck yes. Is MJD more talented than most of the players who have done that in the past? I woudl say yes. Using 6 weeks of performance (really 4 weeks, because he HAS had 2 good games this year) to override multiple years of stud performance is the very definition of short term. All the injuries he has sustained are of the minor, nagging variety and something a bye week can do wonders to help.

Okay, discussion over. You're using historical factors for the basis of your argument and I'm using the Jones-Drew I saw Monday night. We'll agree to disagree.

The Jones-Drew I saw Monday night was the feature back during 2 drives inside the 5 yard line AND was the focal point of the offense throughout the game. Both he and the team didn't look great, but the entire point is he doesn't need to look great to be able to convert goal line chances and carry the ball 20+ times. Both of those things do require a certain skill- a skill MJD has clearly shown over time that he has, while many in the top 20 have not. His opportunity for success is MUCH better than a lot of the other top 20 options, which means by default he is a better option from a fantasy football standpoint than a lot of those players as well. 6 weeks does not a season make.

He was the focal point on offense throughout a game in which the Jags mustered 3 points. Wonderful. When I get to school tomorrow I'll put a gold star on Maurice's chore chart. He was monumentally uneffective. His long run of the year is 23 yards...I can pace that off in my house. This, despite facing rush defenses of 25th, 6th, 22nd, 27th, 32nd and 8th! Four of the Jags opponents are currently ranked bottom 10 in the NFL. And he's managing 3.9 yards a carry and .18 touchdowns a game. If you want to keep riding those stats, be my guest. His opportunity for success is S**T. And if six games does not a season make, what record would you like a fantasy team to get to before you bench MJD in favor of a guy outperforming him?

 

[THE UNDERCOVER BROTHA]

I gave up on him in my ppr dynasty. And i dont have any other good rb options (Dwill/Dtew/Woodhead/Scott)

Albeit we can start only 1 rb if we like.

Sent MoDrew/R.Jennings and E.Royal packing for A.Johnson and Damien Williams.

Meh, rather take my chances with AJ Nicks Austin and M.Williams going foward.

 

[shortbow]

Just traded (two TE 1PPR league):

Ray Rice

Antonio Gates

Jay Cutler

Michael Bush

for

MJD

A. Bradshaw

H. Nicks

T. Gonzalez

Rice is probably my favorite rb ever in the history of me and football, but I think they will put up comparable numbers by year end and over the next couple of games I expect MJD to do better than he has all year with both of their QBs out.

 

[Black]

I think he gets Todd Bouman this week as QB @KC? Probably riding my bench.

And I picked up the KC DST.

 

[TDavi118]

Does anyone know of MJD's contractract status? In a dynasty league, one must acknowledge this. If Del-Rio and /or Garrard is let go,I really don't know what to think about MJD's situation. As an owner' I'm thinking of trading MJD at his highest value point' whether it be this season or the 2011 off-season.

 

[FantasyTrader]

Does anyone know of MJD's contractract status? In a dynasty league, one must acknowledge this. If Del-Rio and /or Garrard is let go,I really don't know what to think about MJD's situation. As an owner' I'm thinking of trading MJD at his highest value point' whether it be this season or the 2011 off-season.

In dynasty I don't think this changes a thing. Let's keep in mind, he's flourished in this offense until this year and he's only 25 years old! You sell him now, you're not selling at the highest value point. He's a solid HOLD.

 

[Mr. Brownstone]

I've had it with the whole team. Does that count?

 

[Diamond]

It might not be the best week to give up on MJD:

http://blogs.nfl.com/2010/10/20/jags-might...t-took-so-long/

Sure would love to see him running the wildcat all game long.

 

[Hipple Long Ware & Peete]

I think there were a few Hawks who saw this one developing.

a real hawk would've drafted a long snapper in the first. Just to let people know who they are up against.

 

[1rebmun]

just traded MJD and Cutler for Rivers and Bradshaw

Scoring in our league has Bradshaw avg. 3 points more per week and Rivers 6 more.

MJD upcoming schedule kind of scared me off keeping him, and I needed an upgrade at QB

 

[Hipple Long Ware & Peete]

FANTASY

Jags might go run-oriented … what took so long?

Posted: October 20th, 2010 | Adam Rank | Tags: Jacksonville Jaguars, Maurice Jones-Drew, Trent Edwards, Jamaal Charles, David Garrard, Glee, Dirk Koetter

The Jaguars are going to be a more run-oriented team if QBs David Garrard and Trent Edwards are unable to go this week. Noted fantasy enthusiasts — and Jaguars RB — Maurice Jones-Drew spoke for all of us when he said, “It’s about time. Why didn’t it happen sooner?”

Exactly.

Maybe you can file this along with things like Chiefs RB Jamaal Charles not starting, touchdown vultures, and the TV show Glee as things that defy logic and reason.

How does this even happen? Was offensive coordinator Dirk Koetter watching game film and thinking, “forget this diminutive running back, how about we put the ball in Garrard’s hands?” I mean, Koetter realizes that Garrard’s Pro Bowl appearance was a joke, right?

Alright, that might be a little too harsh on Garrard. But man, you have to give the ball to MJD, who has not gained less than 88 yards this season when he has had at least 20 rushing attempts. But we have been fooled by coaches promising big things, then failing to deliver (see Turner, Norv).

– Adam Rank

 

[Wombat1]

Traded MJD, Big Ben, and Beanie for Mendenhall, Rivers, and Brandon Jacobs. Thought I did well salvaging MJD's name value, the deal was originally without the QB's and I still wouldn't have minded it but getting Rivers also put it over the top for me

 

[Herm23]

I'm bumping this post as reason #3,403 that you NEVER give up on a player of MJD's talent after as small a sample size as 6 games. Rarely will rash decisions like that end well.

Fast forward 2 weeks since we last had this conversation and MJD has posted 2 very solid outings. This has jumped him to being RB #13. I fully expect this number to rise, as I previously stated my belief that I seriously doubt he will finish outside the top 10.

Again, a RB #8-10 finish is still going to be viewed as a dissapointing season for MJD and will not be a thrilling result for those owners who took him with a top 5 pick, however it is still production worthy of being an every week starter.

 

[Wombat1]

I'm bumping this post as reason #3,403 that you NEVER give up on a player of MJD's talent after as small a sample size as 6 games. Rarely will rash decisions like that end well.Fast forward 2 weeks since we last had this conversation and MJD has posted 2 very solid outings. This has jumped him to being RB #13. I fully expect this number to rise, as I previously stated my belief that I seriously doubt he will finish outside the top 10.Again, a RB #8-10 finish is still going to be viewed as a dissapointing season for MJD and will not be a thrilling result for those owners who took him with a top 5 pick, however it is still production worthy of being an every week starter.

I still do not like MJD as a top 10 guy the rest of the way- his big game yesterday still was without a TD, and that is the primary concern with him. The Jags are the most inconsistent team in the league and will be down big in many weeks. And the Cowboys are just a complete joke of a team.His longest run of the year so far is 24 yards... With that said, I would probably put him at about 15 for the rest of the year in terms of RB rankings because there really are so few backs doing well this yearEdit- I was curious and just looked at the RB and you are probably right on second thought- the RB situation is worse than I thought- he is probably more like 10th right now from now forward.

 

[Giants4Life]

6 games isn't a small sample size..Its 38% of the season.

That said, I dont think he is the issue, but his team. That O-Line is horrendous.

 

[Herm23]

6 games isn't a small sample size..Its 38% of the season.That said, I dont think he is the issue, but his team. That O-Line is horrendous.

It is an incredibly small sample size when compared to the body of work for his entire career. That was my point- too many people in this thread were using the tiny 6 game sample size (when compared to a career consisting of more than 50 games) to come to the conclusion that MJD was in for a down year and/or would be a complete bust.

 

[FantasyTrader]

I'm bumping this post as reason #3,403 that you NEVER give up on a player of MJD's talent after as small a sample size as 6 games. Rarely will rash decisions like that end well.Fast forward 2 weeks since we last had this conversation and MJD has posted 2 very solid outings. This has jumped him to being RB #13. I fully expect this number to rise, as I previously stated my belief that I seriously doubt he will finish outside the top 10.Again, a RB #8-10 finish is still going to be viewed as a dissapointing season for MJD and will not be a thrilling result for those owners who took him with a top 5 pick, however it is still production worthy of being an every week starter.

How ironic that 6 games is too small a sample size to move away from MJD, but TWO games is sufficient enough to prove you were right.

 

[Herm23]

I'm bumping this post as reason #3,403 that you NEVER give up on a player of MJD's talent after as small a sample size as 6 games. Rarely will rash decisions like that end well.Fast forward 2 weeks since we last had this conversation and MJD has posted 2 very solid outings. This has jumped him to being RB #13. I fully expect this number to rise, as I previously stated my belief that I seriously doubt he will finish outside the top 10.Again, a RB #8-10 finish is still going to be viewed as a dissapointing season for MJD and will not be a thrilling result for those owners who took him with a top 5 pick, however it is still production worthy of being an every week starter.

How ironic that 6 games is too small a sample size to move away from MJD, but TWO games is sufficient enough to prove you were right.

Again, I'm using the body of his career as my sample size (which is always what you should do when talking about players with elite talent levels who are far more capable of overcoming subpar situations). The last 2 games are simply reinforcement that the previous 50 games in his career are more indicitive of what he is going to do than the first 6 weeks of the season (mind you, he only actually has had 3 "bad" games this year).Your assertion was that 3 bad games out of 6 to start the season meant he was in for a down season and would be a major dissapointment. My assertion was that 50+ games in his career before this season indicated that he would not continue struggling and the last 2 weeks have only reinforced my belief.

 

[FantasyTrader]

I totally agree with you on the first 50 games of his career. You'll find no argument with me about that. And for the record, I'm a long term dynasty owner so I HOPE your prediction proves me wrong. But you're not watching the same games I am if you are looking at the body of work THIS YEAR and thinking everything is right with MJD's world.

He's simply not as explosive as he's been in year's past. You're thinking there's no way he finishes outside the top 10. I'm saying the opposite. We'll see.

 

[Wombat1]

I totally agree with you on the first 50 games of his career. You'll find no argument with me about that. And for the record, I'm a long term dynasty owner so I HOPE your prediction proves me wrong. But you're not watching the same games I am if you are looking at the body of work THIS YEAR and thinking everything is right with MJD's world. He's simply not as explosive as he's been in year's past. You're thinking there's no way he finishes outside the top 10. I'm saying the opposite. We'll see.

longest run of year- 24 yards. He has become a plodder

 

[Herm23]

I'm going to bump this thread one more time, not because I want to gloat over how I was right (trust me, I have been wrong PLENTY enough on other things to know I shouldn't bother gloating when a blind squirrel finds a nut), but rather because I think it is a perfect case study on why you NEVER give up on elite talented players after a very short sample size.

MJD currently stands as the RB #7 and has every possibility to move higher than that. Over the last 5 weeks, only Arian Foster has outscored him. I understand the mentality that had owners saying it was time to give up on him 5 weeks ago. However, when a player is an ultra elite talent, in the prime of his career, has multiple seasons of ultra elite production to his credit, and has not had any significant situaiton changes, then the leash he should be extended for a poor start is significantly longer than for players who lack some or all of those things. Barring injury, top level players generally don't suddenly just start playing bad in the prime of their careers.

I get that Matt Forte started slowly last year and never bounced back, meaning anyone who stuck by him was burned. I get that there have been plenty of examples of players who started slowly and never turned it around. However, Matt Forte was never considered an ultra elite talent and did not have multiple seasons of ultra elite production to back up anyone's belief in him. Most players that start slowly don't have the track record and talent of MJD to warrent continued belief in them even after a slow start. The players that you should consider giving up on after slow starts are the 2nd tier players like Forte, Beanie Wells, Shonn Greene, etc..., not the tier 1, elite level players like MJD.

 

[Wombat1]

I'm going to bump this thread one more time, not because I want to gloat over how I was right (trust me, I have been wrong PLENTY enough on other things to know I shouldn't bother gloating when a blind squirrel finds a nut), but rather because I think it is a perfect case study on why you NEVER give up on elite talented players after a very short sample size.MJD currently stands as the RB #7 and has every possibility to move higher than that. Over the last 4 weeks, only Arian Foster has outscored him. I understand the mentality that had owners saying it was time to give up on him 5 weeks ago. However, when a player is an ultra elite talent, in the prime of his career, has multiple seasons of ultra elite production to his credit, and has not had any significant situaiton changes, then the leash he should be extended for a poor start is significantly longer than for players who lack some or all of those things. Barring injury, top level players generally don't suddenly just start playing bad in the prime of their careers.I get that Matt Forte started slowly last year and never bounced back, meaning anyone who stuck by him was burned. I get that there have been plenty of examples of players who started slowly and never turned it around. However, Matt Forte was never considered an ultra elite talent and did not have multiple seasons of ultra elite production to back up anyone's belief in him. Most players that start slowly don't have the track record and talent of MJD to warrent continued belief in them even after a slow start. The players that you should consider giving up on after slow starts are the 2nd tier players like Forte, Beanie Wells, Shonn Greene, etc..., not the tier 1, elite level players like MJD.

Props, you were right on with MJD. I traded him and like you said the Forte thing was the main reason why I did it, I was burned by Forte 2 years ago and I thought to myself I am not going down again sticking by my under performing first rounder. At the time my concern wasn't so much MJD himself but just how bad the Jags were looking, it seemed like they were headed for a 4-12 season. The trade actually did not kill me because I got Rivers and Mendenhall back so I may actually be better off with it, but still it stings watching MJD light it up after giving up on him.