anyone have the kahona's to take Megatron over Moss? (1 Viewer)

[Largie]

Doing some mocks to prep for my 10 team homer league draft, non PPR. After my keepers Brees and Rice, I'll be looking for a WR with my first overall pick (2nd round). Only AJ should be off the board and I'll be left to decide between Moss and Calvin.

Some say no brainer, but I'm not feeling too excited about NE's new balanced attack (as mentioned by several), and brutal schedule. Hear very little from camp reports on Moss other than he's there and 100%....and beating CB's in practice all day.

In Detroit, Calvin is the center piece of the Lions offense much like AJ in Houston. His targets and redzone looks should equal if not surpass Moss this year. I know it's preseason, but the Lions attacked from shotgun a lot on the weekend which bodes well for Stafford and CJ.....and Staffords confidence in 81 seems very high, perhaps higher than Brady's in Moss this year. I see 90-1350-13 (or more).

Chime in, anyone else willing to roll the dice?

 

[RushHour]

I did.

 

[LawFitz]

Beware the end around.

 

[jurb26]

Doing some mocks to prep for my 10 team homer league draft, non PPR. After my keepers Brees and Rice, I'll be looking for a WR with my first overall pick (2nd round). Only AJ should be off the board and I'll be left to decide between Moss and Calvin.

Some say no brainer, but I'm not feeling too excited about NE's new balanced attack (as mentioned by several), and brutal schedule. Hear very little from camp reports on Moss other than he's there and 100%....and beating CB's in practice all day.

In Detroit, Calvin is the center piece of the Lions offense much like AJ in Houston. His targets and redzone looks should equal if not surpass Moss this year. I know it's preseason, but the Lions attacked from shotgun a lot on the weekend which bodes well for Stafford and CJ.....and Staffords confidence in 81 seems very high, perhaps higher than Brady's in Moss this year. I see 90-1350-13 (or more).

Chime in, anyone else willing to roll the dice?

Aren't those pretty much the same numbers Moss put up last year, playing injured 90% of the season and with Brady missing him on several occasions?

 

[cr8f]

Sure in a keeper but not in a re draft. It's a contract year and Moss has a lot to prove.

 

[Todem]

Take the HOF player Moss is money.

 

[Happy Ragnarok]

When your "best case scenario" for one guy is about the same as your "reasonable expectation" for the other, it's not about cajones.

 

[rizzler]

Sure in a keeper but not in a re draft. It's a contract year and Moss has a lot to prove.

a lot to prove? the guy is goin in the HOF, what exactly does he have to prove?

 

[cr8f]

That he can score 2 touchdowns a game?

Seriously that he is still a top WR right now. That he deserves another top contract.

And are you sure you want to keep Rice?

Very worrisome news out of the Vikings. We've been telling you about WR Sidney Rice's hip troubles. Now Judd Zulgad of the Minneapolis Star-Tribune is reporting that Rice could have surgery that would cost him half the season.

Link: http://www.startribune.com/sports/vikings/...y9cP3DieyckcUsI

Clipped from the Judd Zulgad article:

We still don't have confirmation that Javon Walker agreed to a deal with the Vikings on Monday, but no one is going to be surprised if the veteran does come to terms.

That's because it appears the Vikings could be without Pro Bowl wide receiver Sidney Rice for the first half of the season. Rice, who has been sidelined since the start of training camp because of a hip injury, was at the Steadman Clinic (think Marian Gaborik) on Monday and it appears likely he will end up having surgery, according to people with knowledge of the situation.

[[[[[[[[ OUR VIEW ]]]]]]]]]

Zulgad is an excellent source for Vikings news so this is clearly from a guy you want to listen to. If this happens, QB Brett Favre takes a significant hit. Especially with the uncertainty with WR Percy Harvin. You can see how we had all the Vikings projected here for every stat before this news. http://subscribers.footballguys.com/2010/currentproj-min.php

As Zulgad said, this isn't official yet. But it's definitely something that's a big concern. If I were drafting tonight, I'd bump Favre down a good bit on this news. Stay tuned for more.

Thanks to Footballguy Sigmund Bloom for the headsup on this one.

 

[cr8f]

That he can score 2 touchdowns a game?

Seriously that he is still a top WR right now. That he deserves another top contract.

And are you sure you want to keep Rice?

Very worrisome news out of the Vikings. We've been telling you about WR Sidney Rice's hip troubles. Now Judd Zulgad of the Minneapolis Star-Tribune is reporting that Rice could have surgery that would cost him half the season.

Link: http://www.startribune.com/sports/vikings/...y9cP3DieyckcUsI

Clipped from the Judd Zulgad article:

We still don't have confirmation that Javon Walker agreed to a deal with the Vikings on Monday, but no one is going to be surprised if the veteran does come to terms.

That's because it appears the Vikings could be without Pro Bowl wide receiver Sidney Rice for the first half of the season. Rice, who has been sidelined since the start of training camp because of a hip injury, was at the Steadman Clinic (think Marian Gaborik) on Monday and it appears likely he will end up having surgery, according to people with knowledge of the situation.

[[[[[[[[ OUR VIEW ]]]]]]]]]

Zulgad is an excellent source for Vikings news so this is clearly from a guy you want to listen to. If this happens, QB Brett Favre takes a significant hit. Especially with the uncertainty with WR Percy Harvin. You can see how we had all the Vikings projected here for every stat before this news. http://subscribers.footballguys.com/2010/currentproj-min.php

As Zulgad said, this isn't official yet. But it's definitely something that's a big concern. If I were drafting tonight, I'd bump Favre down a good bit on this news. Stay tuned for more.

Thanks to Footballguy Sigmund Bloom for the headsup on this one.

 

[Stinkin Ref]

I would consider it....watched him this weekend against Denver and dude is a beast.....only thing is that DET schedule is no walk in the park either........

 

[shnikies]

I would consider it....watched him this weekend against Denver and dude is a beast.....only thing is that DET schedule is no walk in the park either........

As long as he gets to play the Bears' secondary twice, he'll be fine.

 

[lionsroar]

I would consider it....watched him this weekend against Denver and dude is a beast.....only thing is that DET schedule is no walk in the park either........

Building off of what stinkin ref said. Moss- #1 receiver in a contract year playing with a hall of fame qb also in a contract year. With a balanced attack and the team has something to prove. Megatron- #1 receiver "freak of nature" talent with and up and coming Qb and offense. Defenses can't focus soley on him anymore. Only problem is their schedule is brutal this year. In the first four weaks they play all of their division rivals on the road. They go to Dallas, then four days later they host NE on Turkey day. Throw in Revis Island, Just brutal. Fast forward till week 9. The Lions are competive but their record is only 2-6 - and they are almost eliminated from the playoffs. Thats when those pesky injuries seem to start popping up. The seasons lost and Ford field isn't selling out- games are blacked out. My point is- Go with the better team that is a superbowl contender

 

[ceo3west]

The question should be do you have the kahona's to take Moss over Megatron.

FWIW, Wood recently took Calvin 7th overall behind A Johnson in the Survivor draft.

 

[Iwannabeacowboybaby!]

I'd have a hard time pulling the trigger of Calvin over Moss. With that said, the writing is on the wall for Calvin to have a monster year. We can all see it, he's a beast, Stafford looks like he's the real deal, the Lions have a running game to help the passing game so if he scores 15 Td's and 1200 yards, we can only blame ourselves.

To me it also looks like New England may go to a more dump and run approach compared to year's past. Couple all this together and I can't blame a guy for saying this is the year someone like a Calvin goes past Moss for good

I should have bought Ford Stock at 2 bucks a share a little over a year ago. I can remember sitting around the lunch table at work saying it but didn't do it. It was obvious to me that Ford would go up but didn't pull that trigger. Like I said, the writing is on the wall, we can see the potential that Calvin and Stafford can have this year but yet many of us including myself probably won't pull that trigger until it's too late. You either get in while the getting's good or pay top price next year, meaning Wr1.

 

[Iwannabeacowboybaby!]

The question should be do you have the kahona's to take Moss over Megatron.

FWIW, Wood recently took Calvin 7th overall behind A Johnson in the Survivor draft.

That's about as high of an ADP you're going to get unless you come here to Detroit and draft in a local league where guy's in Calvin jersey's offer to buy the NO.1 pick from you to get him.In all seriousness, I respect Wood but that is about as high of an ADP as you're going to get and you always don't want to be that guy either.

 

[playin4beer]

The question should be do you have the kahona's to take Moss over Megatron.

FWIW, Wood recently took Calvin 7th overall behind A Johnson in the Survivor draft.

That's about as high of an ADP you're going to get unless you come here to Detroit and draft in a local league where guy's in Calvin jersey's offer to buy the NO.1 pick from you to get him.In all seriousness, I respect Wood but that is about as high of an ADP as you're going to get and you always don't want to be that guy either.

I traded away the #1 overall pick this year for a few different reasons, but one of the main ones was to get Calvin Johnson. I wasn't taking him #1 and he wouldn't be there at #24.Like I said, there were other reasons and extra draft picks, but one factor was getting CJ. And I believe I'll be taking him #11 overall and not taking the chance the #12 guy takes him with one of his 2 picks.

 

[Grid71]

I would easily draft Calvin over Moss except for the fact that I have Moss as #2 and Calvin at #3. They are both well positioned to have a great season and I'd be happy with either guy or *gasp* both if Calvin falls to me in the 2nd.

 

[omally]

And are you sure you want to keep Rice?

He never said it was Sidney Rice. My guess is his keepers were Brees and Ray Rice.

 

[Largie]

Doing some mocks to prep for my 10 team homer league draft, non PPR. After my keepers Brees and Rice, I'll be looking for a WR with my first overall pick (2nd round). Only AJ should be off the board and I'll be left to decide between Moss and Calvin.

Some say no brainer, but I'm not feeling too excited about NE's new balanced attack (as mentioned by several), and brutal schedule. Hear very little from camp reports on Moss other than he's there and 100%....and beating CB's in practice all day.

In Detroit, Calvin is the center piece of the Lions offense much like AJ in Houston. His targets and redzone looks should equal if not surpass Moss this year. I know it's preseason, but the Lions attacked from shotgun a lot on the weekend which bodes well for Stafford and CJ.....and Staffords confidence in 81 seems very high, perhaps higher than Brady's in Moss this year. I see 90-1350-13 (or more).

Chime in, anyone else willing to roll the dice?

Aren't those pretty much the same numbers Moss put up last year, playing injured 90% of the season and with Brady missing him on several occasions?

yes, but the 3 td's in the blow-out win over Jax to me skews the 13td's a tad.....my point is the offense is built around CJ - NE's offense is a "?" weekly to who gets the targets and what's the run-pass ratio.

and it's Ray Rice as the keeper.

 

[Northbound Train]

Not only would I take him over Moss I am thinking about taking him at 7th in a PPR 12 team league and landing a RB in the 2nd round...

Being doing some mocks this way and winding up with:

CJ - Greene

CJ - Matthews

CJ - D.Will

Or...

Turner/Gore - White/Marshall/Austin

Not sure I'd do that but I have been thinking about it...

 

[Dexter Manley]

The only wr I would have the cajones to take over Megatron is Andre Johnson.

IMO, Megatron has a higher ceiling than Moss and is more likely to finish as the #1 scoring wr.

Detroit has added multiple weapons (Best, Burleson, Scheffler) and upgraded their oline. Combine that with the big jump in Stafford's development in his 2nd season (which I'm predicting) and defenses are no longer going to be able to do the box-and-1 thing to Calvin anymore.

 

[Leeroy Jenkins]

I would easily draft Calvin over Moss except for the fact that I have Moss as #2 and Calvin at #3. They are both well positioned to have a great season and I'd be happy with either guy or *gasp* both if Calvin falls to me in the 2nd.

So do I. I've had Calvin at #3 even before the pre-season started. Yesterday I was tempted to move him ahead of Moss, so this thread is quite timely. I didnt have the balls to pull the trigger yesterday, but I'm starting to lean towards moving Calvin up my cheatsheet ahead of Moss.

 

[Grid71]

I would easily draft Calvin over Moss except for the fact that I have Moss as #2 and Calvin at #3. They are both well positioned to have a great season and I'd be happy with either guy or *gasp* both if Calvin falls to me in the 2nd.

So do I. I've had Calvin at #3 even before the pre-season started. Yesterday I was tempted to move him ahead of Moss, so this thread is quite timely. I didnt have the balls to pull the trigger yesterday, but I'm starting to lean towards moving Calvin up my cheatsheet ahead of Moss.

I'd only put CJ ahead of Moss in a keeper format. Pure redraft, I like Moss at #2. NE showing the three TE sets and going to the run more behind them will allow them the opportunity to hit Moss deep a few times per game. Writing is on the wall for another big season, especially TD wise for Moss.

 

[Billy Ball Thorton]

I recently traded my 1.12/2.01 for 1.08/2.05 because I was worried Calvin would be gone. Guys that went right after him were Mathews/Wayne/Turner

I really wanted CJ and am glad I landed him.

 

[FavreCo]

Beware the end around.

They can't possibly try that stupid play again. Someone should have been fired after that.

 

[Hipple Long Ware & Peete]

The question should be do you have the kahona's to take Moss over Megatron.

FWIW, Wood recently took Calvin 7th overall behind A Johnson in the Survivor draft.

That's about as high of an ADP you're going to get unless you come here to Detroit and draft in a local league where guy's in Calvin jersey's offer to buy the NO.1 pick from you to get him.In all seriousness, I respect Wood but that is about as high of an ADP as you're going to get and you always don't want to be that guy either.

I traded away the #1 overall pick this year for a few different reasons, but one of the main ones was to get Calvin Johnson. I wasn't taking him #1 and he wouldn't be there at #24.Like I said, there were other reasons and extra draft picks, but one factor was getting CJ. And I believe I'll be taking him #11 overall and not taking the chance the #12 guy takes him with one of his 2 picks.

in the same boat, but i want cj and r mathews. and i so fear the turn guy here.

 

[videoguy505]

kahona's??

 

[Mark Wimer]

Doing some mocks to prep for my 10 team homer league draft, non PPR. After my keepers Brees and Rice, I'll be looking for a WR with my first overall pick (2nd round). Only AJ should be off the board and I'll be left to decide between Moss and Calvin.Some say no brainer, but I'm not feeling too excited about NE's new balanced attack (as mentioned by several), and brutal schedule. Hear very little from camp reports on Moss other than he's there and 100%....and beating CB's in practice all day. In Detroit, Calvin is the center piece of the Lions offense much like AJ in Houston. His targets and redzone looks should equal if not surpass Moss this year. I know it's preseason, but the Lions attacked from shotgun a lot on the weekend which bodes well for Stafford and CJ.....and Staffords confidence in 81 seems very high, perhaps higher than Brady's in Moss this year. I see 90-1350-13 (or more). Chime in, anyone else willing to roll the dice?

 

[karmarooster]

AJ

Moss

Calvin

everyone else, incuding Fitz and Wayne

So no.

 

[wiscstlatlmia]

glad i have both...so i dont have to decide!

 

[karmarooster]

glad i have both...so i dont have to decide!

i tried this last year.... didn't work out.... but this year's another good chance for a combined 25+ TDs

 

[Hipple Long Ware & Peete]

while most are tweaking rankings up on Calvin, Maurile pits him in at 44? I wonder why? hopefully he'll chime in.

 

[Hipple Long Ware & Peete]

Beware the end around.

They can't possibly try that stupid play again. Someone should have been fired after that.

umm these were the guys that tore barrys ACL returning kicks.

 

[PhantomJB]

while most are tweaking rankings up on Calvin, Maurile pits him in at 44? I wonder why? hopefully he'll chime in.

Yes. This will be interesting to see given how bearish he was in the Team projections.

 

[Hipple Long Ware & Peete]

while most are tweaking rankings up on Calvin, Maurile pits him in at 44? I wonder why? hopefully he'll chime in.

Yes. This will be interesting to see given how bearish he was in the Team projections.

the 44 rankings said it was 8/24but now the 8/24 rankings MT has him at 30.so who knows whats going on. Give ema bit to get the #'s in and see then.

 

[crazylegs1]

To me it also looks like New England may go to a more dump and run approach compared to year's past. Couple all this together and I can't blame a guy for saying this is the year someone like a Calvin goes past Moss for good

This has been my concern. I read recently that New England may move to a shorter passing game as pass protection is not what it once was for Brady. My concern is Moss could end up suffering, much as Jennings did last year due to Rodgers not having enough time to let the deep routes unfold, with more of the passing game going to Welker, etc.

 

[mike303]

It's funny to see this thread because I just had that debate at my draft an hour ago. The league is a 0.5 PPR. It's an 11 year redraft league and we draw draft position from a hat immediately before we pick so you must prepare to pick in all 12 slots. I drew 12 and went for Andre and Calvin. Rodgers and Brees and the top RBs were gone. After much debate, I left Moss out there.

My thinking is that Detroit looks improved with Best, Burleson, Scheffler. Stafford appears to be progressing. They seem to have improved enough to take heat off Calvin, but he will still be the clearcut #1 with no close second. Plus their secondary stinks... I keep thinking of that crazy Cleveland game last year, they should have a few shootouts.

Moss is surrounded by competition. They added Hernandez, Price, Holt, plus Welker is back healthy, Edelman looks good. There is a lot going on there. Moss should match last years numbers, but I can't see a crazy increase. Calvin has a chance to really improve on last year's numbers.

The only fact I didn't know was that Moss was going into a contract year, but I don't know that it would have swayed me.

 

[PahtyTom]

redraft, moss all day. comes down to brady vs stafford

 

[LawFitz]

Beware the end around.

They can't possibly try that stupid play again. Someone should have been fired after that.

They've been using that play for the last three years. Almost once per game it feels like (tho in reality probably a lot less). I am tired of cringing everytime he gets popped low at the end of one of these.Hey Lions, watch tape of how the Vikings used Sid Rice last season. Swish, rinse, REPEAT.

 

[Frenchy Fuqua]

How about Miles Austin over Moss & CJ?

 

[Clifton]

redraft, moss all day. comes down to brady vs stafford

At this stage Cal's got a bit more raw talent but Moss is still a beast. I didn;t notice his speed slowing much last year. Brady > Stafford.Willing to bet even money or even lay some odds moss finishes the season with better numbers....barring injuries to all parties involved.

 

[VaTerp]

It's funny to see this thread because I just had that debate at my draft an hour ago. The league is a 0.5 PPR. It's an 11 year redraft league and we draw draft position from a hat immediately before we pick so you must prepare to pick in all 12 slots. I drew 12 and went for Andre and Calvin. Rodgers and Brees and the top RBs were gone. After much debate, I left Moss out there.My thinking is that Detroit looks improved with Best, Burleson, Scheffler. Stafford appears to be progressing. They seem to have improved enough to take heat off Calvin, but he will still be the clearcut #1 with no close second. Plus their secondary stinks... I keep thinking of that crazy Cleveland game last year, they should have a few shootouts.Moss is surrounded by competition. They added Hernandez, Price, Holt, plus Welker is back healthy, Edelman looks good. There is a lot going on there. Moss should match last years numbers, but I can't see a crazy increase. Calvin has a chance to really improve on last year's numbers. The only fact I didn't know was that Moss was going into a contract year, but I don't know that it would have swayed me.

Interesting that Best, Burleson, and Scheffler makes the Lions improve and is a positive for Calvin but Hernandez, Price, Holt, Welker, and Edelman are competition and a negative for Moss.I see what you're getting at but I think it's a false premise. While additional weapons and an improved Stafford should help Calvin I think you are eriously overstating Moss' "competition." Holt is on IR, Hernandez is a rookie TE, Price is another rookie who will have minimal impact as a 5th WR. Welker being healthy, which I still have my doubts about, actually helps Moss as it always has, and Edelman's production is directly tied to how healthy Welker is IMO.In general I'm of the opinion that additional weapons are a good thing for elite WRs because it keeps defenses from rolling the coverage to them as much as they would like. So it will be good for Calvin if the Lions offense improves to give him more opportunity but I don't see it as a negative for Moss .

redraft, moss all day. comes down to brady vs stafford

At the end of the day this is the biggest difference here. A lot of people seem to be convinced on Stafford, but I'm not sold yet. And even if he does improve as most think, I still take my WR1 catching passes from Brady 1 more year removed from his knee surgery over Stafford who I think will be wildly inconsistent.

 

[Iwannabeacowboybaby!]

You know what's funny, I had Calvin in 4 out of 5 of my money leagues last year and this board absolutely blasted him last year. Even during the early summer months most on this board mentioned they wouldn't take him this year for what he did to them last year.

A couple preseason games and some positive hype about the QB and now he's a monster, now he's the NO. 2 guy behind AJ, how things change in such a SHORT time. Like I said, I was one of the guys last year defending him and my teams struggled at times partly due to his lack of success so I don't feel like a guy who's just jumping on this Calvin rush.

My thoughts early on for Calvin is that defenses who are NOT scheming now will still attempt to take Calvin away from the offense UNTIL the other guys on the team prove they are dangerous. They are NOT going to say to themselves, "Hey, let's just single Calvin and now we have to stop Best, Scheffler and Burleson."

No, they are going to still try everything in their power to stop Calvin, like they did last year and Stafford and the Lions are going to have to PROVE they can beat them with those players I mentioned. IF and once this happens, defenses will have to react to that and then and only then will things open wide up for Calvin.

The first game is against the Bears, so that alone should prove a good fantasy matchup for all players included. But in general, the defenses the Lions play early on are tough, so those players will have to step up to loosen things up for Calvin. You can't just say "He's a beast, he's unstoppable" because he was stoppable last year.

 

[VaTerp]

You know what's funny, I had Calvin in 4 out of 5 of my money leagues last year and this board absolutely blasted him last year. Even during the early summer months most on this board mentioned they wouldn't take him this year for what he did to them last year.

A couple preseason games and some positive hype about the QB and now he's a monster, now he's the NO. 2 guy behind AJ, how things change in such a SHORT time. Like I said, I was one of the guys last year defending him and my teams struggled at times partly due to his lack of success so I don't feel like a guy who's just jumping on this Calvin rush.

My thoughts early on for Calvin is that defenses who are NOT scheming now will still attempt to take Calvin away from the offense UNTIL the other guys on the team prove they are dangerous. They are NOT going to say to themselves, "Hey, let's just single Calvin and now we have to stop Best, Scheffler and Burleson."

No, they are going to still try everything in their power to stop Calvin, like they did last year and Stafford and the Lions are going to have to PROVE they can beat them with those players I mentioned. IF and once this happens, defenses will have to react to that and then and only then will things open wide up for Calvin.

The first game is against the Bears, so that alone should prove a good fantasy matchup for all players included. But in general, the defenses the Lions play early on are tough, so those players will have to step up to loosen things up for Calvin. You can't just say "He's a beast, he's unstoppable" because he was stoppable last year.

My thoughts exactly. I owned Calvin in one league last year and watching that Detroit offense was brutal. Yes, they should be improved this year but I'm still not convinced that the overall situation will improve enough for Calvin to put up the numbers many are expecting.

Of course he has a high ceiling but I'm also concerned about his floor which is much lower than Moss' IMO. Love the player but his current ADP is too high for my liking. I constantly see him taken in the 1st in mocks I'm doing and there is just no way. I will be picking 1st or 2nd in my main league and if he is there at the 2/3 turn (a good possibility in this league) I will CONSIDER him but I actually have some other WRs rated higher who are likely to be there as well.

 

[ceo3west]

Winning in FF is about being ahead of the curve. Those passing on Calvin because of last year will be kicking themselves a few weeks into the season. Calvin is primed for his best season yet.

ETA: For those taking Moss over him, you will likely be disappointed this year. Moss will likely end up top 5 in WR points, but he will not be consistent enough in head to head. In that offense he will have some monster weeks, but many "decoy" weeks.

 

[Anthony Borbely]

You know what's funny, I had Calvin in 4 out of 5 of my money leagues last year and this board absolutely blasted him last year. Even during the early summer months most on this board mentioned they wouldn't take him this year for what he did to them last year.

A couple preseason games and some positive hype about the QB and now he's a monster, now he's the NO. 2 guy behind AJ, how things change in such a SHORT time. Like I said, I was one of the guys last year defending him and my teams struggled at times partly due to his lack of success so I don't feel like a guy who's just jumping on this Calvin rush.

My thoughts early on for Calvin is that defenses who are NOT scheming now will still attempt to take Calvin away from the offense UNTIL the other guys on the team prove they are dangerous. They are NOT going to say to themselves, "Hey, let's just single Calvin and now we have to stop Best, Scheffler and Burleson."

No, they are going to still try everything in their power to stop Calvin, like they did last year and Stafford and the Lions are going to have to PROVE they can beat them with those players I mentioned. IF and once this happens, defenses will have to react to that and then and only then will things open wide up for Calvin.

The first game is against the Bears, so that alone should prove a good fantasy matchup for all players included. But in general, the defenses the Lions play early on are tough, so those players will have to step up to loosen things up for Calvin. You can't just say "He's a beast, he's unstoppable" because he was stoppable last year.

My thoughts exactly. I owned Calvin in one league last year and watching that Detroit offense was brutal. Yes, they should be improved this year but I'm still not convinced that the overall situation will improve enough for Calvin to put up the numbers many are expecting.

Of course he has a high ceiling but I'm also concerned about his floor which is much lower than Moss' IMO. Love the player but his current ADP is too high for my liking. I constantly see him taken in the 1st in mocks I'm doing and there is just no way. I will be picking 1st or 2nd in my main league and if he is there at the 2/3 turn (a good possibility in this league) I will CONSIDER him but I actually have some other WRs rated higher who are likely to be there as well.

I think you guys are drastically underestimating the effects of Jahvid Best being at RB. He is a gamebreaker and defenses have to be aware of where he is at all times. Those safeties can no longer drop back in deep zones every play. The LBs can no longer drop back in the short zones and defend, another other things, the slant and crossing routes. If they do any of this, Best has the ability to make them pay. This is just the part involving Best. It doesn't even take into effect Burleson and Scheffler, nor does it factor in the expected improvement of Stafford. The bottom line is defenses can no longer double Calvin whenever they feel like it.

 

[billyjohnson]

Not only would I take him over Moss I am thinking about taking him at 7th in a PPR 12 team league and landing a RB in the 2nd round...

Being doing some mocks this way and winding up with:

CJ - Greene

CJ - Matthews

CJ - D.Will

Or...

Turner/Gore - White/Marshall/Austin

Not sure I'd do that but I have been thinking about it...

CJ over A Johnson is the heart talking....not the kahunas...and definitely not the brain.

 

[The Real Hipster Doofus]

Not only would I take him over Moss I am thinking about taking him at 7th in a PPR 12 team league and landing a RB in the 2nd round...

Being doing some mocks this way and winding up with:

CJ - Greene

CJ - Matthews

CJ - D.Will

Or...

Turner/Gore - White/Marshall/Austin

Not sure I'd do that but I have been thinking about it...

CJ over A Johnson is the heart talking....not the kahunas...and definitely not the brain.

Andre Johnson's ADP is 1.05. I don't think he is saying he would take him over Andre.

 

[ffnut]

I picked from the 12 spot in a one player keeper league and I was really hoping Moss would be gone so I wouldn't be the guy passing on him. Lucky for me he went 2 picks ahead of me and I picked CJ and Austin and am happy about it. I've been through this thread and agree with a lot of the points listed on both sides. Guess for me it's my gut telling me that this is not the year for Moss. Sure, he will have some big games but I just don't see it every week like we've seen in the past with him.

Had him last year and I was perfectly happy with him - just not feeling it this year.