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Are we better as a country if we lose California? (1 Viewer)

Should we?

  • Won't miss you

    Votes: 53 45.3%

  • Please Stay

    Votes: 64 54.7%
  • Total voters
    117
I support both the California and Oregon secession proposals.  

Lots of Conservatives are calling them sore losers, but allowing them to secede can be a win-win situation.

First, on a philosophical level, I'm against forcing people to continue to live in a nation they object to.

We're such a polarized nation, and that polarization is increasingly manifesting itself in riots and attacks.  A peaceful separation is far better than what the future may hold by continuing to force people together who no longer want to be together.  The ongoing riots are a harbinger of a future that potentially could include a civil war.

I support all freedom movements so long as the goal is to minimize conflict and violence, not maximize it.  Allowing California and Oregon to secede would minimize conflict and violence for all parties.

Second, Conservatives should gladly let California go because it will be exceedingly difficult for the Democrats to win Presidential elections without the slew of electoral votes they automatically receive from California.

Seems like a win-win to me.  Let's get this done.

 
Otis said:
You're nothing without New York. 
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New York is awesome, most awesome city in the country. Arguing otherwise is a waste of time even if like me weather is very very important. I love LA, spend as much time there as I can. Combined with an amazing cosmopolitan city like San Francisco, California is more than fine for meeting big city goodness (and great weather). But we get to slip San Diego into the deck (maybe the best weather on earth). Sorry, not a chance I trade Cali's three for NY's NYC. 

 
Chaos Commish said:
New York is awesome, most awesome city in the country. Arguing otherwise is a waste of time even if like me weather is very very important. I love LA, spend as much time there as I can. Combined with an amazing cosmopolitan city like San Francisco, California is more than fine for meeting big city goodness (and great weather). But we get to slip San Diego into the deck (maybe the best weather on earth). Sorry, not a chance I trade Cali's three for NY's NYC. 
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And it would be nice to be able to say I live in a country where we dont fold our pizza slices.

 
Eephus said:
Lee is no radical.  He's unpopular with the local left for favoring downtown business interests.  But even the local right is firmly anti-Trump.  He only won 9.8% of the vote in the city.

I guess we can raise soda and paper bag taxes to make up for the shortfall.  To the barricades.
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Lee, the LA Mayor, de Blasio in NYC, the Berkeley mayor, the Seattle mayor, and the Philly mayor are all out now saying we won't violate the 4th amendment.  Bravo to them.  I hope they all remain strong and force Donald to take a position here.  If he really does cut off funding, he'll sabotage the economy from the start and be mired in court cases for the rest of his term.  

 
Immigration is a hot button issue that helped Trump win the nomination but it remains to be seen how much the GOP will prioritize this.  Defunding major cities and/or threatening officials with arrest would be a hugely controversial escalation in policy.  I don't see Trump pressing this issue immediately and risking whatever honeymoon period he has.  The INS and Justice Department have been able to deport millions of aliens without full cooperation of law enforcement in sanctuary cities. 

ETA: but I've been wrong as recently as Tuesday

 
Last edited by a moderator:
Eephus said:
Immigration is a hot button issue that helped Trump win the nomination but it remains to be seen how much the GOP will prioritize this.  Defunding major cities and/or threatening officials with arrest would be a hugely controversial escalation in policy.  I don't see Trump pressing this issue immediately and risking whatever honeymoon period he has.  The INS and Justice Department have been able to deport millions of aliens without full cooperation of law enforcement in sanctuary cities. 

ETA: but I've been wrong as recently as Tuesday
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I'd agree except that I think the immigration issue is one of the three big issues he really believes in (bad trade deals and reforming the tax code being the others...for instance he's already walked back some of the repeal Obamacare rhetoric today) and he's surrounded himself with people that really believe in that like Sessions.   My guess is he'll bloviate about it, get a minor concession and call it a win, but he really doesn't like De Blasio. 

 
Sammy3469 said:
I'd agree except that I think the immigration issue is one of the three big issues he really believes in (bad trade deals and reforming the tax code being the others...for instance he's already walked back some of the repeal Obamacare rhetoric today) and he's surrounded himself with people that really believe in that like Sessions.   My guess is he'll bloviate about it, get a minor concession and call it a win, but he really doesn't like De Blasio. 
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True but the move would be a direct shot across the bow of the bluest parts of the blue states.  I think the potential risks for the administration exceed the benefits.  It would motivate the opposition like few other actions and make it more difficult to achieve their aims on trade, foreign policy and tax reform.  The INS can still step up border controls and deportations without engaging in symbolic conflict with sanctuary cities.

 
We could triple the amount Cali has to pay our states for water.  Then they could triple their taxes so that their citizens were working for absolutely nothing.

Sounds good to me to let em go.

 
I think instead of letting Californians vote to leave, the rest of us should vote weather we want to keep them or not.

The election would probably be rigged, though.

 
wormburner said:
I think instead of letting Californians vote to leave, the rest of us should vote weather we want to keep them or not.

The election would probably be rigged, though.
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At this point I think most Californians wouldn't be rigging an election to stay with the red states.

 
This was 75-25 pre-election. We're close to 55-45 now.

Some people are misunderstanding my call...  Cali becomes its own island and we might breed dinosaurs there.  Oregon is a throw in and Washington can be negotiated.

We lost some quality posters in Tim, CSTU and Sqishy.

Elect max in 2020 and I'll nuke that san andreas ####### for everyone.

 
Max Power said:
This was 75-25 pre-election. We're close to 55-45 now.

Some people are misunderstanding my call...  Cali becomes its own island and we might breed dinosaurs there.  Oregon is a throw in and Washington can be negotiated.

We lost some quality posters in Tim, CSTU and Sqishy.

Elect max in 2020 and I'll nuke that san andreas ####### for everyone.
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Sorry but things are more complicated. As a sovereign who has provided more funds to the budget and military than any current state, we are keeping that portion of the military that is within our borders. Without us you cannot afford it anyway, and we feed you, so shut up or lose weight. We have half the Navy's nuclear arsenal on a turret. 300+ Tomahawks and plenty of other goodies we paid for. Come and get them if you think you can. Camp Pendleton is just up the highway and the F35 and F22 programs are at Edwards and China Lake. That's a no fly zone for you now. 6 largest economy on the planet, 2nd most powerful military. Two super powers. One great. One with Florida.

 
Chaos Commish said:
Sorry but things are more complicated. As a sovereign who has provided more funds to the budget and military than any current state, we are keeping that portion of the military that is within our borders. Without us you cannot afford it anyway, and we feed you, so shut up or lose weight. We have half the Navy's nuclear arsenal on a turret. 300+ Tomahawks and plenty of other goodies we paid for. Come and get them if you think you can. Camp Pendleton is just up the highway and the F35 and F22 programs are at Edwards and China Lake. That's a no fly zone for you now. 6 largest economy on the planet, 2nd most powerful military. Two super powers. One great. One with Florida.
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Impressive if slightly thirsty

 
Chaos Commish said:
Sorry but things are more complicated. As a sovereign who has provided more funds to the budget and military than any current state, we are keeping that portion of the military that is within our borders. Without us you cannot afford it anyway, and we feed you, so shut up or lose weight. We have half the Navy's nuclear arsenal on a turret. 300+ Tomahawks and plenty of other goodies we paid for. Come and get them if you think you can. Camp Pendleton is just up the highway and the F35 and F22 programs are at Edwards and China Lake. That's a no fly zone for you now. 6 largest economy on the planet, 2nd most powerful military. Two super powers. One great. One with Florida.
Click to expand...
Now we're definitely breeding Dinosaurs there.  I'll take a real raptor over an F35. 

 
timschochet said:
That was before nuclear weapons. If we really wanted to leave you won't stop us unless you're willing to sustain a nuclear war. 
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Shoot, you hippies and fake-boobed women would still be sipping wine and wearing your birkenstocks when our first strike finished what the San Andreas Fault started!

;)

 
I knew there were lots of jealous pricks in here, but this is ridiculous.  :loco:

I hope CA secedes. There's no need for me to ever visit the rest of this busted country other than Vegas.

 
Chaos Commish said:
Sorry but things are more complicated. As a sovereign who has provided more funds to the budget and military than any current state, we are keeping that portion of the military that is within our borders. Without us you cannot afford it anyway, and we feed you, so shut up or lose weight. We have half the Navy's nuclear arsenal on a turret. 300+ Tomahawks and plenty of other goodies we paid for. Come and get them if you think you can. Camp Pendleton is just up the highway and the F35 and F22 programs are at Edwards and China Lake. That's a no fly zone for you now. 6 largest economy on the planet, 2nd most powerful military. Two super powers. One great. One with Florida.
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You got a problem with Florida all of a sudden?

 
If we actually ranked the states by how much it would help the country if the country dumped that state, California would rank near the bottom. 

 
Missed this the first time around - I see this through the lens of a dynasty league.  I think we can get a second round pick...and maybe a throw in like Turks and Caicos if we send California to Great Britain.  

 
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