Chaka
Footballguy
It concerns me how pervasive this attitude has become. As if being an a#####e is okay simply because it's 2007. Terrible justification.
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"Belichick has track record of classlessness" (5 Viewers)
- Thread starter BigSteelThrill
- Start date
parrot
Footballguy
Yeah, if only they had had four guys down there instead of a measly three the outcome probably would have been a lot different.Or - they plan on all out blitzing from the left side on this play so have Randy run right where there will be no defender and Tom will throw it there....."Hey Randy, they're to trying and bump you at the line, get underneath help from the linebacker, and then over the top help from the safety... but just go ahead and run by them all and Tom will chuck it down to you, it'll be easy!" And it was.
GroveDiesel
Footballguy
The Patriots have been doing that same exact thing for years. I may be wrong, but I seem to recall that they were the team that actually pioneered that particular ploy. In fact, I'm pretty sure that they brought in a guy that the Jets had cut as well.And the Jets management's bringing in players recently released by the Pats for secret consultations is okay?in here
The Jerk
Footballguy
I don't agree with Davej626 overall, but I think his post might refer to the success of Noll, Gibbs, Walsh, and Landry and the comparative lack of media scrutiny, rather than excusing BB's behavior because it's 2007.However, I don't believe less media scrutiny had anything to do with the widespread view that these coaches are still considered as extremely classy and professional, in addition to being highly successful.
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AnonymousBob
Footballguy
I heard Belichick kills kittens and steals candy from babies.
Kiddnets
Footballguy
are you serious - you don't think its an unfair advantage if you know a run blitz is coming while you are in the huddle calling the play?Yeah, if only they had had four guys down there instead of a measly three the outcome probably would have been a lot different.Or - they plan on all out blitzing from the left side on this play so have Randy run right where there will be no defender and Tom will throw it there.....
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Insoxicated
Breaking the rules: NFL
Information, paranoia rule thoughts of many in NFL
Posted: Wednesday July 25, 2007 12:07PM; Updated: Wednesday July 25, 2007 2:03PM
Cheating in the NFL isn't what it once was. The league's institution of the K-ball program in recent years addressed the doctoring of footballs that was a routine practice of kickers and punters everywhere. And the pregame pat-down the officiating crew now gives offensive and defensive linemen eliminated the ability to grease up one's jersey in order to become too slick to contain.
But there are still some more subtle examples of surreptitious behavior going on in Roger Goodell's kingdom, if you know where to look. In talking with league sources, here are several areas where teams tend to go just over the line that separates strategy from subterfuge in seeking a competitive advantage:
1. Pictures are worth a thousand words: The "stealing'' of signs -- both on offense and defense -- is the area that's most often cited as fertile ground for cheating. The most common practice is for a team to videotape an opponent's signal-givers on the sideline, and later marry up those indications to the game tape in order to identify tendencies or patterns.
Though no disciplinary action by the league ever resulted, the Patriots last year were reportedly the impetus of a sternly written letter from the league office to all teams, reminding them that it was illegal for an advance scout or personnel official to bring a video recording device of any kind into the press box for the purposes of taping a potential opponent's signals or play-calling gestures from the sideline.
Teams have also been chastised for having a second camera in the press box-area video box, with one camera shooting the game action and the other one being trained on the opposing team's signal-givers. On offense, that's why coaches have taken to holding their play-calling charts in front of their mouths when they're sending in the play to the quarterback via the radio headset system.
On defense, teams have gone to having two different signal callers, with one being a dummy signaler and other being responsible for the "hot,'' or real, call. Other teams use different color wrist bands during a game, with the defensive captain switching to a different color before each series, and the defensive signal-caller calling formations and blitzes from a list that corresponds with that color.
"That type of sign-stealing goes on a ton in the league,'' said one NFL source who was both a former coach and player in the league. "From a coaching standpoint, you know who's signaling in the personnel on the opposing sideline, and then there's another guy making the play calls on the headset. Defenses used to watch the play-caller, and if a guy spoke for a real long time, that was usually a pass, because the calls take longer. A run is always a shorter call. So coaches shield their mouths when they're calling plays now. If you make your calls out in the open, the other team will steal your signals and your tendencies.''
2. De-briefing the former enemy: With the advent of free agency and coaching tenures getting shorter all the time, the movement of players and coaches from team to team is more prevalent than ever. And that means more information about an opponent's tendencies and play-calling is readily available and waiting to be mined.
One way that insight can be helpful is in the identifying of an opponent's calls at the line of scrimmage, from a first-hand source who played or coached for that team in the recent past.
"You try to get those false calls that teams like to use at the line,'' said one former player. "Player X or coach X who has been with that team might stop by the offensive or defensive meetings and say, 'Look for this if they say that. Or when the quarterback does this, look for that.' It can be very useful in some cases.''
3. One man's trash is another man's treasure: Head coaches in the NFL are by nature paranoid beings. And they're often control freaks to boot. And when it comes to the potential of giving away a competitive edge of any sort, they're absolutely maniacal about keeping things in house.
One former coach and player told me that many coaches now have their trash segregated and shredded independent of everyone else's at the team complex. Everything that can be controlled, is controlled, from who gets to watch practice to who's cleaning the team's building at night.
"The more money that's at stake, the more it's like spy versus spy,'' a league source said. "Coaches are always looking out for moles. They want to know who's in the building at night, who can see the depth chart on the greaseboard and who's emptying the trash? And you can't just be a mid-level paper-pusher in an organization and expect to come out and watch practice. That guy might have grown up in D.C. and is a lifelong Redskins fan.''
It's not just in their home environments that coaches seek to control the flow of information.
"On road trips, let's say you're going to the west coast and have a walk-through practice at the stadium on Saturday afternoon,'' the source said. "You're told not to leave anything behind. From cheat sheets for the players, to the tests we give players about the game plan on the flight out, to anything that might be of use to the opponent. Because if anything gets dropped, you can expect it will eventually find its way to the other team.
"Coaches don't trust people at the hotel on the road, or the people who pick you up on the bus and take you to the hotel or the stadium. Everything is scrutinized. To some coaches, every little detail matters.''
The bent toward intrigue can be so prevalent at times teams will go to the lengths of leaving a fake game plan or play-calling script behind at times, in order to throw an opponent off the trail and cost it needless time trying to decode a useless document. Teams have been known to run as many meaningless blitzes as possible when they play Tampa Bay in the preseason, because they know ever-thorough Bucs head coach Jon Gruden will feel the need to catalog and prepare for the possibility of seeing every one of them in the future.
4. The playbook's the thing: Since the dawn of time, coaches have been reminding players to keep an eye on their playbooks at all times. But they still occasionally fall into enemy hands, and can sometimes yield a treasure trove of material used for nefarious purposes, at least competitively speaking.
I was told of one recent visiting NFL player who was downstairs at his team's hotel the night before a game in St. Louis, and put his playbook down for a moment to sign an autograph for a kid. He forgot to pick it back up, and it somehow found its way to the Rams before game time.
"The playbook is a big one,'' said one former NFL player. "We were told to not even leave them out in the open in the locker room during the week. You'd get fined big time over a lost playbook. You don't get a mulligan on that one. Coaches harp on that all the time.''
Other league sources I talked to were more dubious about the real value of a playbook should it find its way into an opponent's hands.
"Most good teams don't give out everything in their playbook at the same time, at least not to every player,'' a source said. "I'll bet you the Patriots don't. They give you just what you have to have. And even if you get the playbook, you've got to know the calls. You've got to know what's hot in any particular route. It doesn't really matter if you know the plays. You've got to know the calls. You can hear Peyton Manning's signals at the line, but he changes what they mean all the time.''
0---
Sooo.. everyone does it.... some teams even steal playbooks... the debreifing of former players is also viewed as "cheating" and is also commonplace.... yet we're going to crucify the Pats over this?
You guys need more hobbies.
Information, paranoia rule thoughts of many in NFL
Posted: Wednesday July 25, 2007 12:07PM; Updated: Wednesday July 25, 2007 2:03PM
Cheating in the NFL isn't what it once was. The league's institution of the K-ball program in recent years addressed the doctoring of footballs that was a routine practice of kickers and punters everywhere. And the pregame pat-down the officiating crew now gives offensive and defensive linemen eliminated the ability to grease up one's jersey in order to become too slick to contain.
But there are still some more subtle examples of surreptitious behavior going on in Roger Goodell's kingdom, if you know where to look. In talking with league sources, here are several areas where teams tend to go just over the line that separates strategy from subterfuge in seeking a competitive advantage:
1. Pictures are worth a thousand words: The "stealing'' of signs -- both on offense and defense -- is the area that's most often cited as fertile ground for cheating. The most common practice is for a team to videotape an opponent's signal-givers on the sideline, and later marry up those indications to the game tape in order to identify tendencies or patterns.
Though no disciplinary action by the league ever resulted, the Patriots last year were reportedly the impetus of a sternly written letter from the league office to all teams, reminding them that it was illegal for an advance scout or personnel official to bring a video recording device of any kind into the press box for the purposes of taping a potential opponent's signals or play-calling gestures from the sideline.
Teams have also been chastised for having a second camera in the press box-area video box, with one camera shooting the game action and the other one being trained on the opposing team's signal-givers. On offense, that's why coaches have taken to holding their play-calling charts in front of their mouths when they're sending in the play to the quarterback via the radio headset system.
On defense, teams have gone to having two different signal callers, with one being a dummy signaler and other being responsible for the "hot,'' or real, call. Other teams use different color wrist bands during a game, with the defensive captain switching to a different color before each series, and the defensive signal-caller calling formations and blitzes from a list that corresponds with that color.
"That type of sign-stealing goes on a ton in the league,'' said one NFL source who was both a former coach and player in the league. "From a coaching standpoint, you know who's signaling in the personnel on the opposing sideline, and then there's another guy making the play calls on the headset. Defenses used to watch the play-caller, and if a guy spoke for a real long time, that was usually a pass, because the calls take longer. A run is always a shorter call. So coaches shield their mouths when they're calling plays now. If you make your calls out in the open, the other team will steal your signals and your tendencies.''
2. De-briefing the former enemy: With the advent of free agency and coaching tenures getting shorter all the time, the movement of players and coaches from team to team is more prevalent than ever. And that means more information about an opponent's tendencies and play-calling is readily available and waiting to be mined.
One way that insight can be helpful is in the identifying of an opponent's calls at the line of scrimmage, from a first-hand source who played or coached for that team in the recent past.
"You try to get those false calls that teams like to use at the line,'' said one former player. "Player X or coach X who has been with that team might stop by the offensive or defensive meetings and say, 'Look for this if they say that. Or when the quarterback does this, look for that.' It can be very useful in some cases.''
3. One man's trash is another man's treasure: Head coaches in the NFL are by nature paranoid beings. And they're often control freaks to boot. And when it comes to the potential of giving away a competitive edge of any sort, they're absolutely maniacal about keeping things in house.
One former coach and player told me that many coaches now have their trash segregated and shredded independent of everyone else's at the team complex. Everything that can be controlled, is controlled, from who gets to watch practice to who's cleaning the team's building at night.
"The more money that's at stake, the more it's like spy versus spy,'' a league source said. "Coaches are always looking out for moles. They want to know who's in the building at night, who can see the depth chart on the greaseboard and who's emptying the trash? And you can't just be a mid-level paper-pusher in an organization and expect to come out and watch practice. That guy might have grown up in D.C. and is a lifelong Redskins fan.''
It's not just in their home environments that coaches seek to control the flow of information.
"On road trips, let's say you're going to the west coast and have a walk-through practice at the stadium on Saturday afternoon,'' the source said. "You're told not to leave anything behind. From cheat sheets for the players, to the tests we give players about the game plan on the flight out, to anything that might be of use to the opponent. Because if anything gets dropped, you can expect it will eventually find its way to the other team.
"Coaches don't trust people at the hotel on the road, or the people who pick you up on the bus and take you to the hotel or the stadium. Everything is scrutinized. To some coaches, every little detail matters.''
The bent toward intrigue can be so prevalent at times teams will go to the lengths of leaving a fake game plan or play-calling script behind at times, in order to throw an opponent off the trail and cost it needless time trying to decode a useless document. Teams have been known to run as many meaningless blitzes as possible when they play Tampa Bay in the preseason, because they know ever-thorough Bucs head coach Jon Gruden will feel the need to catalog and prepare for the possibility of seeing every one of them in the future.
4. The playbook's the thing: Since the dawn of time, coaches have been reminding players to keep an eye on their playbooks at all times. But they still occasionally fall into enemy hands, and can sometimes yield a treasure trove of material used for nefarious purposes, at least competitively speaking.
I was told of one recent visiting NFL player who was downstairs at his team's hotel the night before a game in St. Louis, and put his playbook down for a moment to sign an autograph for a kid. He forgot to pick it back up, and it somehow found its way to the Rams before game time.
"The playbook is a big one,'' said one former NFL player. "We were told to not even leave them out in the open in the locker room during the week. You'd get fined big time over a lost playbook. You don't get a mulligan on that one. Coaches harp on that all the time.''
Other league sources I talked to were more dubious about the real value of a playbook should it find its way into an opponent's hands.
"Most good teams don't give out everything in their playbook at the same time, at least not to every player,'' a source said. "I'll bet you the Patriots don't. They give you just what you have to have. And even if you get the playbook, you've got to know the calls. You've got to know what's hot in any particular route. It doesn't really matter if you know the plays. You've got to know the calls. You can hear Peyton Manning's signals at the line, but he changes what they mean all the time.''
0---
Sooo.. everyone does it.... some teams even steal playbooks... the debreifing of former players is also viewed as "cheating" and is also commonplace.... yet we're going to crucify the Pats over this?
You guys need more hobbies.
BigSteelThrill
Footballguy
link plz
Kiddnets
Footballguy
good to know she covers something!That sounds like a coverage my girlfriend might come up with.Or - they plan on all out blitzing from the left side on this play so have Randy run right where there will be no defender and Tom will throw it there.....
parrot
Footballguy
No I'm not really serious, hence the smilies. But is anyone seriously suggesting that the beating the Pats put on the Jets was due to sign stealing? Please.are you serious - you don't think its an unfair advantage if you know a run blitz is coming while you are in the huddle calling the play?Yeah, if only they had had four guys down there instead of a measly three the outcome probably would have been a lot different.Or - they plan on all out blitzing from the left side on this play so have Randy run right where there will be no defender and Tom will throw it there.....
Kiddnets
Footballguy
It all depends on how much they cheated IMO. Are they a better team than the Jets - absolutely - could they have had a very big unfair advantage that kept the Jets from having a fair chance to win - absolutely.No I'm not really serious, hence the smilies. But is anyone seriously suggesting that the beating the Pats put on the Jets was due to sign stealing? Please.are you serious - you don't think its an unfair advantage if you know a run blitz is coming while you are in the huddle calling the play?Yeah, if only they had had four guys down there instead of a measly three the outcome probably would have been a lot different.Or - they plan on all out blitzing from the left side on this play so have Randy run right where there will be no defender and Tom will throw it there....."Hey Randy, they're to trying and bump you at the line, get underneath help from the linebacker, and then over the top help from the safety... but just go ahead and run by them all and Tom will chuck it down to you, it'll be easy!" And it was.
It was from the article you posted. I missed a set of quote marks -- sorry about that.I never posted that.
People actually pay attention to their star ratings?Posting this article got my star rating attacked by Patriots fans.
Brides Maids
Footballguy
Sportsman ship?!? This isn''t a sport anymore its a business!!! You hear it mentioned alot people will try anything they think they can get away with to win. Professionalism?? Have you heard about some of the issues the players are having lately, and your surprised the coaches are gonna try to get an advantage too.
This game stopped being a game when players started making MILLIONS of dollars a year, my god the money is so important that the players will put their lives on the line to "play" .
Right in line with the corporate world getting to be on their backstabbing double dealing level as well. I'm just waiting for the league to wipe out the players pension funds.
It was a different game when Chuck Noll, Bill Walsh or Joe Gibbs were still coaching and the coaches were different as well. Could you imagine Tom Landry or Lombardi dealing with the players today?? No me either, I think a great deal of the "game today would frankly embarrass them.
So even if this team was stealing signs hey it's all part of the job.........
Browns Rule!
Footballguy
Bellidick has always been a jackass. It all started with him running Bernie Kosar out of Cleveland, I will always dispise the guy.
The Jerk
Footballguy
You apparently missed the part of my post where I mentioned that since players are routinely called out in the media and on this forum for bad behavior, then Belichick can be, too. (just six words after sportsmanship, that you so cleverly bolded, it reads "the same type of behavior that the media and this board often ridicules about players")Also, since you claim sportsmanship is long gone, show me just one other example of a coach who has as many recent unsportsmanlike incidents (as described in the article that triggered this post) as Belichick.Just for the record, Noll was no model of perfect sportsmanship. He had feuds at times with Sam Wyche and especially with Jerry Glanville when he was with the Oilers. However, you didn't see a pattern of behavior like this.
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JohnnyU
Footballguy
...and that "Loverboy" head band has to go.
corpcow
Footballguy
1) You don't need a license to be a journalist in the US. You may be thinking of what's called "journalistic license", which means taking some liberties in quoting, etc.2) Each of these things were factual stories (or discussed as allegations, not fact)
3) It was clearly an opinion piece.
BigSteelThrill
Footballguy
I see it when I go to my control panel and check my private messages. Evidently Patriot fans are big about it.People actually pay attention to their star ratings?Posting this article got my star rating attacked by Patriots fans.
JohnnyU
Footballguy
...no, but he does screw around on his wife.
redman
Footballguy
Can you point me to the rule that that violates?
fatness
Footballguy
There's accountability in football. But just for the players and assistant coaches, not for head coaches. Just for drugs and arrests, not for cheating.
The Shizzle
Footballguy
Billy likes to drink soda.
The link to the article above is actually posted in the other thread - here It is post #13 and it looks like half the people posting in both threads are totaling ignoring the fact that the quotes I am seeing from NFL insiders indicate that this goes on all the time.I've seen people saying the Bill Parcels believes its common place - someone mentioned an interview on ESPN with him. The article posted above. The reference to the Green Bay guy saying (from this article)-It was from the article you posted. I missed a set of quote marks -- sorry about that.I never posted that.
Asked why the Patriots weren’t reported, a Packers executive suggested there was a code of silence regarding such matters, particularly after a blowout. “It bothers you that it’s cheating,” he said, “but it’s not the reason they kicked our (butt).”
I also think its interesting that the GB guys admits that it is not the reason the Patroits won the game.
That being said - right now its apparent that the Pats are clearly pushing things over the edge (regarding this rule) and if anything they are pretty foolish to get caught this many times - particularily after the NFL issued a written warning to the league. But I really don't think that any team wants Goddell to hit the Patriots too hard. A slap on the wrist so that it stings just enough to get the point across (3 maybe a 4). IMO, this is Mangini or the Jets organization tweaking the Patroits as a bit of gameship. Its a black eye to the franchise, it throws a little disarray into the planning for the game against SD and if the Pats lose a draft pick its a homerun for the Jets.
But if Goddell decides that the penalty is something stiff - say a 1 or a 2 - then things are going to get ugly in the league. The NFL is big business and I'm sure that every team has some skeleton in their closet that they don't want to come out. I'm sure their are other things where the code of silence applies and if you start throwing stones you better not live in a glass house.
kupcho1
Footballguy
kupcho1
Footballguy
The Patriot fans are falling all over themselves to paint this as "pushing the envelope" - it's cheating (assuming the allegation is true).
What I find telling is a member of the fraternity - Childress - basically ratted Belichick out for trying to scheme waivers. That's borderline amazing in my book, particularly given that Childress isn't exactly a household name and hasn't been a head coach all that long.
What I find telling is a member of the fraternity - Childress - basically ratted Belichick out for trying to scheme waivers. That's borderline amazing in my book, particularly given that Childress isn't exactly a household name and hasn't been a head coach all that long.
Kit Fisto
Footballguy
Brides Maids
Footballguy
Just one? How about Parcells and the way he treats reporters during every post game interview? How about Denny Green and his epic melt down?And while I agree that while the some of the coaches of the past are no models of sportsmanship they took the game seriously not because of the financial rewards and cushy commentary gigs a good year could bring but because of a competitive spirit and inner drive to be really good at a sport. I mean look at Joe PA, you think he's doing what he's doing for a paycheck? No it's what he is!!What about Cower and that stupid **** eating grin he was sporting Sunday how priceless was that. Now that I've won a Superbowl I can take a year or two off and really drive up the price someone will pay for me to come back to coach. Its Business.........Show Bidness. PS I wasn't aware that it took cleverness to make something bold.
The Jerk
Footballguy
You're still not reading my entire posts, Lahey.
You gave me singular examples from multiple coaches, none of which were unsportsmanlike toward other coaches or players, I might add. I'm still waiting for a single coach to have multiple incidents in a very short period of time, preferably involving other coaches or players on other teams -- especially when that coach lost the game.
Fear The Turtle
Footballguy
Brides Maids
Footballguy
What difference does it make where the guy was unsportsmanlike? Ok maybe those examples were more of a lack of professionalism (which I think you brought up, if not I'm sure you'll correct me and I hope you'll agree in Parcels case was more than one lone incident. ) but it doesn't really matter, this is really a pointless argument. If it seems like there's Sportsmanship out there today, in most cases it's not, it's more like gamesmanship. Those players know those cameras are on them and they pose accordingly. Let's all kneel down and pray together after the game but.............let's wait until there back from commercial to start. It's sad when the media covered "stars" of the game are those who can grab the most attention and camera time. While players like Harrison who one of the best examples I can think of right now of how the game should be played, goes mostly uncelebrated. Who knows, I'm sure that's the way he wants it but man kids out there are getting on the wrong role model band wagon when they jump on Chad Johnson's.I'm way off topic now so like I said it's a moot point this is a Business not a Sport anymore and is treated accordingly. WIN AT ALL COSTS!!!!
The Jerk
Footballguy
I actually agree with most of your sentiments. And you could be right that many of the sportsmanship images are staged and/or perfunctory. Where we may disagree is that I think showing respect to your opponent after a loss is still the right thing to do, and running away angry or upset doesn't show me how much you want to win, just that you don't know how to act when you are beaten. I see very few coaches who continually choose the latter, but one is the topic of this thread. Oh well, time to move on...
ThinGrayLine
Footballguy
Cheating is okay as long as the game isn't close?
gump
Footballguy
At Owner's Meetings, which are typically posh weekend parties at lavish resorts in Hawaii, Orlando, Phoenix, etc., all coaches and owners meet at dinner and loosen up with a few drinks, tell a few stories, mingle with reporters and other NFL partners who go...and generally have a good time.
Belichick dresses sloppily, gets ####-faced, and sits in a corner by himself grumbling.
He's not well-liked by anyone in the league...and he doesn't really seem interested in changing that.
Belichick dresses sloppily, gets ####-faced, and sits in a corner by himself grumbling.
He's not well-liked by anyone in the league...and he doesn't really seem interested in changing that.
phthalatemagic
Footballguy
corpcow
Footballguy
How are they "secret" consultations? Oh, and did we forget that the Pats also brought in Dwight who was recently released by the Jets?
corpcow
Footballguy
I was at the gym before and ESPN reported in the ticker that they were found guilty of the allegations of cheating. That's not quite true, but they claim to have a lot of evidence.
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=3014677
link
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=3014677
link
And this from Schefter...
phthalatemagic
Footballguy
The Jerk
Footballguy
Seems like another journalist needs to "have his license revoked" and this one's from New England:
Jim Donaldson: Accusations make you wonder about Bill Belichick
and this one's from New England:Jim Donaldson: Accusations make you wonder about Bill Belichick
corpcow
Footballguy
My fiance always refused to buy fake designer bags, because she said that if someone found out one of them were fake, they'd think all of them were fake. It's sort of the same thing here. (Bear in mind I'm a Jets fan, and I'm trying to be as impartial as possible).
As that last article suggests, why bother with this stuff given the talent they have? If it looks like they're going to beat us handily, why bother? As much as I love my Jets, and I think we're headed in the right direction, we're not a powerhouse right now. We're good, we're scrappy, we're a division rival with the best chance to challenge, perhaps, but we're not Indy and we're not the Chargers. Why do this to us and Green Bay (I mean at least we're a division rival)? If you're going to take the chance to get caught, why not do it only with the teams that you're most likely to need that advantage with?
It seems like, as with those fake bags, all it does is taint all of their success. People may begin to wonder how much of their past success was the result of supreme talent and coaching and how much was because of cheating. Given how good they really are, it doesn't make sense to take that risk.
This leads me to believe that either 1) this was a rogue thing (though that seems less likely given the supposed history of similar behavior) or 2) the mad scientist really has lost it.
As that last article suggests, why bother with this stuff given the talent they have? If it looks like they're going to beat us handily, why bother? As much as I love my Jets, and I think we're headed in the right direction, we're not a powerhouse right now. We're good, we're scrappy, we're a division rival with the best chance to challenge, perhaps, but we're not Indy and we're not the Chargers. Why do this to us and Green Bay (I mean at least we're a division rival)? If you're going to take the chance to get caught, why not do it only with the teams that you're most likely to need that advantage with?
It seems like, as with those fake bags, all it does is taint all of their success. People may begin to wonder how much of their past success was the result of supreme talent and coaching and how much was because of cheating. Given how good they really are, it doesn't make sense to take that risk.
This leads me to believe that either 1) this was a rogue thing (though that seems less likely given the supposed history of similar behavior) or 2) the mad scientist really has lost it.
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John Maddens Lunchbox
Socialism for Dummies
Don’t know about anyone else, but I'm liking Belichick more and more with each move he makes.
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