Blinker etiquette (1 Viewer)

[Terminalxylem]

Riding shotgun with my friend yesterday, we encountered unexpected highway traffic. As we later discovered, a car had flipped over, and was obstructing multiple lanes about a half mile away. Interestingly, it’s the second upside down car I’ve seen in the last week, but that’s not the issue.

Approaching the wreck, my friend needed to merge. The lanes to his right were still moving fairly quickly, with occasional gaps between vehicles. He waited patiently to merge, but didn’t immediately engage the blinker. Instead, when he identified a big enough area, he blinked and merged simultaneously.

This process repeated itself a couple times, as we migrated to the far right lane. Each merge, I could see the frustration as he waited to pick his spot. So I asked, “why don’t you signal early, so other drivers might slow down, to facilitate a merge?”

Irritated by my question, he responded “well, they probably won’t let me in, so what’s the point?”

Then I realized, this is exactly how my wife uses her blinker. It’s just a perfunctory signal for a predetermined action, rather than communication with other drivers. And it’s not just for fear of a-hole drivers “closing the gap”. It’s almost as if she thinks the blinker imposes on others, forcing them to alter their driving in response.

Needless to say, I disagree. A-holes are gonna be a-holes, blinker or not. But there’s nothing wrong letting people know your intentions in advance, and often it makes changing lanes easier. Plus it’s safer, and arguably reduces traffic.

How/when do you blink, and when do you abstain?

 

[NutterButter]

That's the way I do it too under those circumstances. Early blinker if I'm flowing with desired lane. I do understand your point. That's just my style. I'm not gonna try and explain it. Always blinker especially now that the vehicle has the blindside detection when blinkering.

 

[Chadstroma]

I use the blinker as soon as I know I am moving over.... sometimes in the scenario you mention it would not be an odd event for me to quickly move over and hit the blinker at the same time but that is really because I see an opportunity to make that quick move over as there is space afforded and it is safe.... I am not cutting anyone off.

If you are that close that they won't let you in if you put your blinker on then you are a jerk that is basically cutting people off. Using the blinker is just trying to make you feel better that you aren't the jerk cutting people off (but you are.).

 

[gianmarco]

I find this is similar to stacking menus. The earlier the better.

 

[Drunken knight]

I almost always turn on the blinker before the lane change. My behavior may change based on speeds of lanes involved and space available.

 

[Terminalxylem]

To be clear, I’m not cutting people off. I signal when I realize I need to change lanes or turn. If adequate space, I will change lanes almost immediately thereafter.

If there isn’t space, it’s up to other drivers to let me in, at their discretion.

FTR, I’m far more likely to slow to allow a close merge if the driver signals. Admittedly, I have sped up when someone tries to unnecessarily shoehorn into too small a space, even if they flash a gratuitous blinker.

When there’s a wreck/construction necessitating merging, I err on letting people in.

 

[Terminalxylem]

If you are that close that they won't let you in if you put your blinker on then you are a jerk that is basically cutting people off. Using the blinker is just trying to make you feel better that you aren't the jerk cutting people off (but you are.).

This makes no sense at all.

Cutting someone off requires pulling in front of them. Signaling a need to move over doesn’t mandate an immediate response; it’s up to the other driver to decide. If they let you in, great, you should acknowledge them with a friendly wave. If not, maybe the next guy will let you in. But even if they don't, it’s not an invitation to force your way in, or slam on the brakes to impede vehicles behind you.

Moreover, there's no way to know how they’ll respond to the blinker, unless you actually use it.

 

[Mitchie]

hadn't really thought about it but i probably do something similar. if you put your blinker on and noone lets you in then you just feel like a loser and noone wants that.

 

[NutterButter]

hadn't really thought about it but i probably do something similar. if you put your blinker on and noone lets you in then you just feel like a loser and noone wants that.

U got to be aggressive in that situation otherwise you'll be stuck there.

 

[Chadstroma]

If you are that close that they won't let you in if you put your blinker on then you are a jerk that is basically cutting people off. Using the blinker is just trying to make you feel better that you aren't the jerk cutting people off (but you are.).

This makes no sense at all.

Cutting someone off requires pulling in front of them. Signaling a need to move over doesn’t mandate an immediate response; it’s up to the other driver to decide. If they let you in, great, you should acknowledge them with a friendly wave. If not, maybe the next guy will let you in. But even if they don't, it’s not an invitation to force your way in, or slam on the brakes to impede vehicles behind you.

Moreover, there's no way to know how they’ll respond to the blinker, unless you actually use it.

It makes sense since your friend said if he signaled, they wouldn't let them in... that means they are close enough to close the gap which should also mean a quick lane change (with blinker on at the same time or no blinker at all) is cutting them off.

I am not saying using the blinker in all cases is just trying to make you feel better but if you are so close and make a quick lane change in front of them where you put the blinker on right at lane change.... then you are cutting them off and using the blinker is all about making you feel like you are not the villain.

 

[DA RAIDERS]

I am from Los Angeles. most Los angelenos don’t know that the cars come with blinkers. That being said in your situation that you described blinker is constantly on until I’m over where I want to be.

 

[Chadstroma]

I am from Los Angeles. most Los angelenos don’t know that the cars come with blinkers. That being said in your situation that you described blinker is constantly on until I’m over where I want to be.

That is because a quarter of the cars are BMW's.... I don't think I have ever seen a BMW driver use a blinker..... but then I borrowed my buddies BMW to get around for the day when visiting the L.A. area and I found out that those damn German engineered cars take the most simple component of the car aside from the steering wheel and make it ridiculously hard and complicated to use. For the first time ever as a driver, I stopped using the blinker. Then I understood why no BMW drivers use them.

 

[Terminalxylem]

If you are that close that they won't let you in if you put your blinker on then you are a jerk that is basically cutting people off. Using the blinker is just trying to make you feel better that you aren't the jerk cutting people off (but you are.).

This makes no sense at all.

Cutting someone off requires pulling in front of them. Signaling a need to move over doesn’t mandate an immediate response; it’s up to the other driver to decide. If they let you in, great, you should acknowledge them with a friendly wave. If not, maybe the next guy will let you in. But even if they don't, it’s not an invitation to force your way in, or slam on the brakes to impede vehicles behind you.

Moreover, there's no way to know how they’ll respond to the blinker, unless you actually use it.

It makes sense since your friend said if he signaled, they wouldn't let them in... that means they are close enough to close the gap which should also mean a quick lane change (with blinker on at the same time or no blinker at all) is cutting them off.

I am not saying using the blinker in all cases is just trying to make you feel better but if you are so close and make a quick lane change in front of them where you put the blinker on right at lane change.... then you are cutting them off and using the blinker is all about making you feel like you are not the villain.

My friend assumed other drivers wouldn’t let him in. But it’s just an assumption, until you give people the opportunity to respond to the blinker.

You and my friend are completely dismissing the possibility other drivers can be considerate/deferential, and slow down to let people in, when traffic otherwise prohibits a seamless merge.

And no, I’m not advocating a quick blinker before a forced merge. Quite the opposite, actually.

 

[Terminalxylem]

I am from Los Angeles. most Los angelenos don’t know that the cars come with blinkers. That being said in your situation that you described blinker is constantly on until I’m over where I want to be.

This is the way.

 

[Chadstroma]

If you are that close that they won't let you in if you put your blinker on then you are a jerk that is basically cutting people off. Using the blinker is just trying to make you feel better that you aren't the jerk cutting people off (but you are.).

This makes no sense at all.

Cutting someone off requires pulling in front of them. Signaling a need to move over doesn’t mandate an immediate response; it’s up to the other driver to decide. If they let you in, great, you should acknowledge them with a friendly wave. If not, maybe the next guy will let you in. But even if they don't, it’s not an invitation to force your way in, or slam on the brakes to impede vehicles behind you.

Moreover, there's no way to know how they’ll respond to the blinker, unless you actually use it.

It makes sense since your friend said if he signaled, they wouldn't let them in... that means they are close enough to close the gap which should also mean a quick lane change (with blinker on at the same time or no blinker at all) is cutting them off.

I am not saying using the blinker in all cases is just trying to make you feel better but if you are so close and make a quick lane change in front of them where you put the blinker on right at lane change.... then you are cutting them off and using the blinker is all about making you feel like you are not the villain.

My friend assumed other drivers wouldn’t let him in. But it’s just an assumption, until you give them the opportunity to respond to the blinker.

And no, I’m not advocating a quick blinker before a forced merge. Quite the opposite, actually.

That is my point.... if they are that close to not let you in then you are cutting them off otherwise they would really have to accelerate to move up to block you if you gave them the indication you are moving over with sufficient spacing.

 

[Terminalxylem]

I am from Los Angeles. most Los angelenos don’t know that the cars come with blinkers. That being said in your situation that you described blinker is constantly on until I’m over where I want to be.

That is because a quarter of the cars are BMW's.... I don't think I have ever seen a BMW driver use a blinker..... but then I borrowed my buddies BMW to get around for the day when visiting the L.A. area and I found out that those damn German engineered cars take the most simple component of the car aside from the steering wheel and make it ridiculously hard and complicated to use. For the first time ever as a driver, I stopped using the blinker. Then I understood why no BMW drivers use them.

I think it’s more about BMV drivers, than the vehicles themselves.

Higher social class predicts increased unethical behavior

Seven studies using experimental and naturalistic methods reveal that upper-class individuals behave more unethically than lower-class individuals. In studies 1 and 2, upper-class individuals were more likely to break the law while driving, relative to lower-class individuals. In follow-up laboratory studies, upper-class individuals were more likely to exhibit unethical decision-making tendencies (study 3), take valued goods from others (study 4), lie in a negotiation (study 5), cheat to increase their chances of winning a prize (study 6), and endorse unethical behavior at work (study 7) than were lower-class individuals. Mediator and moderator data demonstrated that upper-class individuals’ unethical tendencies are accounted for, in part, by their more favorable attitudes toward greed.

 

[Snotbubbles]

I will always let someone who has their blinker on merge. If you don't use the blinker, I'm riding the *** of the car in front of me.

 

[Terminalxylem]

If you are that close that they won't let you in if you put your blinker on then you are a jerk that is basically cutting people off. Using the blinker is just trying to make you feel better that you aren't the jerk cutting people off (but you are.).

This makes no sense at all.

Cutting someone off requires pulling in front of them. Signaling a need to move over doesn’t mandate an immediate response; it’s up to the other driver to decide. If they let you in, great, you should acknowledge them with a friendly wave. If not, maybe the next guy will let you in. But even if they don't, it’s not an invitation to force your way in, or slam on the brakes to impede vehicles behind you.

Moreover, there's no way to know how they’ll respond to the blinker, unless you actually use it.

It makes sense since your friend said if he signaled, they wouldn't let them in... that means they are close enough to close the gap which should also mean a quick lane change (with blinker on at the same time or no blinker at all) is cutting them off.

I am not saying using the blinker in all cases is just trying to make you feel better but if you are so close and make a quick lane change in front of them where you put the blinker on right at lane change.... then you are cutting them off and using the blinker is all about making you feel like you are not the villain.

My friend assumed other drivers wouldn’t let him in. But it’s just an assumption, until you give them the opportunity to respond to the blinker.

And no, I’m not advocating a quick blinker before a forced merge. Quite the opposite, actually.

That is my point.... if they are that close to not let you in then you are cutting them off otherwise they would really have to accelerate to move up to block you if you gave them the indication you are moving over with sufficient spacing.

There is subjectivity inherent to what constitutes too close. Especially at highway speeds.

I see no harm in utilizing turn signals to remove some of the ambiguity.

 

[Terminalxylem]

I will always let someone who has their blinker on merge. If you don't use the blinker, I'm riding the *** of the car in front of me.

Definitely agree on rewarding blinker use. Not a fan of tailgating, in almost any circumstance.

 

[Snotbubbles]

I will always let someone who has their blinker on merge. If you don't use the blinker, I'm riding the *** of the car in front of me.

Definitely agree on rewarding blinker use. Not a fan of tailgating, in almost any circumstance.

It's more dangerous for a driver to just switch lanes without using the blinker or blinking at the last second, than it is to tailgate, especially when traffic is bottlenecking due to an accident. In those situations, the rate of speed is usually much slower. I normally keep a 2 car length distance, but in rush hour or jams, I'm usually pretty close to the car in front of me, it all depends on the rate of speed.

 

[Pip's Invitation]

This could have been an email entry in the pet peeves thread.

 

[DA RAIDERS]

I am from Los Angeles. most Los angelenos don’t know that the cars come with blinkers. That being said in your situation that you described blinker is constantly on until I’m over where I want to be.

That is because a quarter of the cars are BMW's.... I don't think I have ever seen a BMW driver use a blinker..... but then I borrowed my buddies BMW to get around for the day when visiting the L.A. area and I found out that those damn German engineered cars take the most simple component of the car aside from the steering wheel and make it ridiculously hard and complicated to use. For the first time ever as a driver, I stopped using the blinker. Then I understood why no BMW drivers use them.

Wut?

And Tesla is the the new bmw

 

[The Z Machine]

Just leave it on always

 

[Terminalxylem]

I will always let someone who has their blinker on merge. If you don't use the blinker, I'm riding the *** of the car in front of me.

Definitely agree on rewarding blinker use. Not a fan of tailgating, in almost any circumstance.

It's more dangerous for a driver to just switch lanes without using the blinker or blinking at the last second, than it is to tailgate, especially when traffic is bottlenecking due to an accident. In those situations, the rate of speed is usually much slower. I normally keep a 2 car length distance, but in rush hour or jams, I'm usually pretty close to the car in front of me, it all depends on the rate of speed.

You’re correct about tight spacing in slow moving traffic.

But 2 car lengths is too close in all but the worst slow downs. Whatever happened to the 1 car length per 10 mph rule?

ETA I have no idea which behavior is less safe; both tailgating and non/last-second blinking should be avoided.

 

[Terminalxylem]

I am from Los Angeles. most Los angelenos don’t know that the cars come with blinkers. That being said in your situation that you described blinker is constantly on until I’m over where I want to be.

That is because a quarter of the cars are BMW's.... I don't think I have ever seen a BMW driver use a blinker..... but then I borrowed my buddies BMW to get around for the day when visiting the L.A. area and I found out that those damn German engineered cars take the most simple component of the car aside from the steering wheel and make it ridiculously hard and complicated to use. For the first time ever as a driver, I stopped using the blinker. Then I understood why no BMW drivers use them.

Wut?

And Tesla is the the new bmw

It’s all luxury car drivers - read my link upthread.

I suspect most full sized pick up drivers, and certainly anyone in a “performance truck” exhibits similar characteristics. They cost as much as luxury cars, so makes sense.

 

[Ron Swanson]

I learned to drive in Houston. I only recently learned that the blinker is not used to celebrate victory over a vanquished foe but is actually supposed to be used before the act.

 

[Chadstroma]

I am from Los Angeles. most Los angelenos don’t know that the cars come with blinkers. That being said in your situation that you described blinker is constantly on until I’m over where I want to be.

That is because a quarter of the cars are BMW's.... I don't think I have ever seen a BMW driver use a blinker..... but then I borrowed my buddies BMW to get around for the day when visiting the L.A. area and I found out that those damn German engineered cars take the most simple component of the car aside from the steering wheel and make it ridiculously hard and complicated to use. For the first time ever as a driver, I stopped using the blinker. Then I understood why no BMW drivers use them.

I think it’s more about BMV drivers, than the vehicles themselves.

Higher social class predicts increased unethical behavior

Seven studies using experimental and naturalistic methods reveal that upper-class individuals behave more unethically than lower-class individuals. In studies 1 and 2, upper-class individuals were more likely to break the law while driving, relative to lower-class individuals. In follow-up laboratory studies, upper-class individuals were more likely to exhibit unethical decision-making tendencies (study 3), take valued goods from others (study 4), lie in a negotiation (study 5), cheat to increase their chances of winning a prize (study 6), and endorse unethical behavior at work (study 7) than were lower-class individuals. Mediator and moderator data demonstrated that upper-class individuals’ unethical tendencies are accounted for, in part, by their more favorable attitudes toward greed.

I was trying to be nice but if a driver does some real douche move on the road close to 50% chance it is a BMW driver.

 

[Chadstroma]

If you are that close that they won't let you in if you put your blinker on then you are a jerk that is basically cutting people off. Using the blinker is just trying to make you feel better that you aren't the jerk cutting people off (but you are.).

This makes no sense at all.

Cutting someone off requires pulling in front of them. Signaling a need to move over doesn’t mandate an immediate response; it’s up to the other driver to decide. If they let you in, great, you should acknowledge them with a friendly wave. If not, maybe the next guy will let you in. But even if they don't, it’s not an invitation to force your way in, or slam on the brakes to impede vehicles behind you.

Moreover, there's no way to know how they’ll respond to the blinker, unless you actually use it.

It makes sense since your friend said if he signaled, they wouldn't let them in... that means they are close enough to close the gap which should also mean a quick lane change (with blinker on at the same time or no blinker at all) is cutting them off.

I am not saying using the blinker in all cases is just trying to make you feel better but if you are so close and make a quick lane change in front of them where you put the blinker on right at lane change.... then you are cutting them off and using the blinker is all about making you feel like you are not the villain.

My friend assumed other drivers wouldn’t let him in. But it’s just an assumption, until you give them the opportunity to respond to the blinker.

And no, I’m not advocating a quick blinker before a forced merge. Quite the opposite, actually.

That is my point.... if they are that close to not let you in then you are cutting them off otherwise they would really have to accelerate to move up to block you if you gave them the indication you are moving over with sufficient spacing.

There is subjectivity inherent to what constitutes too close. Especially at highway speeds.

I see no harm in utilizing turn signals to remove some of the ambiguity.

You are clearly not understanding what I am trying to state and I am not sure how to say it better for you to get me.

 

[Runkle]

Wait for an appropriately-sized spot, then blink-and-move all in one motion. Nothing else works on LA freeways.

 

[johnnycakes]

The Feds don't have a sense of humor about this stuff. https://www.wbur.org/news/2024/01/16/federal-highway-admin-use-yah-blinkah-boston-mass-signs

 

[jhib]

If you are that close that they won't let you in if you put your blinker on then you are a jerk that is basically cutting people off. Using the blinker is just trying to make you feel better that you aren't the jerk cutting people off (but you are.).

This makes no sense at all.

Cutting someone off requires pulling in front of them. Signaling a need to move over doesn’t mandate an immediate response; it’s up to the other driver to decide. If they let you in, great, you should acknowledge them with a friendly wave. If not, maybe the next guy will let you in. But even if they don't, it’s not an invitation to force your way in, or slam on the brakes to impede vehicles behind you.

Moreover, there's no way to know how they’ll respond to the blinker, unless you actually use it.

It makes sense since your friend said if he signaled, they wouldn't let them in... that means they are close enough to close the gap which should also mean a quick lane change (with blinker on at the same time or no blinker at all) is cutting them off.

I am not saying using the blinker in all cases is just trying to make you feel better but if you are so close and make a quick lane change in front of them where you put the blinker on right at lane change.... then you are cutting them off and using the blinker is all about making you feel like you are not the villain.

My friend assumed other drivers wouldn’t let him in. But it’s just an assumption, until you give them the opportunity to respond to the blinker.

And no, I’m not advocating a quick blinker before a forced merge. Quite the opposite, actually.

That is my point.... if they are that close to not let you in then you are cutting them off otherwise they would really have to accelerate to move up to block you if you gave them the indication you are moving over with sufficient spacing.

There is subjectivity inherent to what constitutes too close. Especially at highway speeds.

I see no harm in utilizing turn signals to remove some of the ambiguity.

You are clearly not understanding what I am trying to state and I am not sure how to say it better for you to get me.

Let me try to help...

Terminalxylem, Chadstroma agrees with your side of the original post and not with your friend's and wife's side.

 

[jhib]

I also think the friend's / wife's reasoning is lacking. If the driver you are changing lanes in front of is going to speed up to block you as a result of seeing your turn signal, then there's also a good chance they'll be pissed off when you make the change without indicating your intentions first, and then you've got them aggressively tailgating you instead of somewhere safely ahead of you.

 

[Terminalxylem]

If you are that close that they won't let you in if you put your blinker on then you are a jerk that is basically cutting people off. Using the blinker is just trying to make you feel better that you aren't the jerk cutting people off (but you are.).

This makes no sense at all.

Cutting someone off requires pulling in front of them. Signaling a need to move over doesn’t mandate an immediate response; it’s up to the other driver to decide. If they let you in, great, you should acknowledge them with a friendly wave. If not, maybe the next guy will let you in. But even if they don't, it’s not an invitation to force your way in, or slam on the brakes to impede vehicles behind you.

Moreover, there's no way to know how they’ll respond to the blinker, unless you actually use it.

It makes sense since your friend said if he signaled, they wouldn't let them in... that means they are close enough to close the gap which should also mean a quick lane change (with blinker on at the same time or no blinker at all) is cutting them off.

I am not saying using the blinker in all cases is just trying to make you feel better but if you are so close and make a quick lane change in front of them where you put the blinker on right at lane change.... then you are cutting them off and using the blinker is all about making you feel like you are not the villain.

My friend assumed other drivers wouldn’t let him in. But it’s just an assumption, until you give them the opportunity to respond to the blinker.

And no, I’m not advocating a quick blinker before a forced merge. Quite the opposite, actually.

That is my point.... if they are that close to not let you in then you are cutting them off otherwise they would really have to accelerate to move up to block you if you gave them the indication you are moving over with sufficient spacing.

There is subjectivity inherent to what constitutes too close. Especially at highway speeds.

I see no harm in utilizing turn signals to remove some of the ambiguity.

You are clearly not understanding what I am trying to state and I am not sure how to say it better for you to get me.

It would help if you gave me a signal.

 

[Terminalxylem]

Wait for an appropriately-sized spot, then blink-and-move all in one motion. Nothing else works on LA freeways.

if that’s your expectation, why blink at all?

 

[Terminalxylem]

If you are that close that they won't let you in if you put your blinker on then you are a jerk that is basically cutting people off. Using the blinker is just trying to make you feel better that you aren't the jerk cutting people off (but you are.).

This makes no sense at all.

Cutting someone off requires pulling in front of them. Signaling a need to move over doesn’t mandate an immediate response; it’s up to the other driver to decide. If they let you in, great, you should acknowledge them with a friendly wave. If not, maybe the next guy will let you in. But even if they don't, it’s not an invitation to force your way in, or slam on the brakes to impede vehicles behind you.

Moreover, there's no way to know how they’ll respond to the blinker, unless you actually use it.

It makes sense since your friend said if he signaled, they wouldn't let them in... that means they are close enough to close the gap which should also mean a quick lane change (with blinker on at the same time or no blinker at all) is cutting them off.

I am not saying using the blinker in all cases is just trying to make you feel better but if you are so close and make a quick lane change in front of them where you put the blinker on right at lane change.... then you are cutting them off and using the blinker is all about making you feel like you are not the villain.

My friend assumed other drivers wouldn’t let him in. But it’s just an assumption, until you give them the opportunity to respond to the blinker.

And no, I’m not advocating a quick blinker before a forced merge. Quite the opposite, actually.

That is my point.... if they are that close to not let you in then you are cutting them off otherwise they would really have to accelerate to move up to block you if you gave them the indication you are moving over with sufficient spacing.

There is subjectivity inherent to what constitutes too close. Especially at highway speeds.

I see no harm in utilizing turn signals to remove some of the ambiguity.

You are clearly not understanding what I am trying to state and I am not sure how to say it better for you to get me.

Let me try to help...

Terminalxylem, Chadstroma agrees with your side of the original post and not with your friend's and wife's side.

Really? Seems like he’s calling me a jerk for signaling in close quarters, equating it with cutting someone off.

 

[Terminalxylem]

I also think the friend's / wife's reasoning is lacking. If the driver you are changing lanes in front of is going to speed up to block you as a result of seeing your turn signal, then there's also a good chance they'll be pissed off when you make the change without indicating your intentions first, and then you've got them aggressively tailgating you instead of somewhere safely ahead of you.

This is true, though both my friend and wife are more likely to miss an opportunity to turn than cut someone off. It may be an Asian thing, but they’re both painfully (dangerously?) deferential.

They’re just as concerned about someone feeling obligated to slow down to facilitate their lane change, as they are fearful of an aggro gap-closer. So they only execute a lane change when a huge gap is present, such that nobody is looking at their token blinker anyway. In traffic like to OP, they’re likely to maintain their lane until there is no other option.

 

[the moops]

Wait for an appropriately-sized spot, then blink-and-move all in one motion.

Yea no way I am putting blinker on early and letting people not let me in. Bunch of twats will see someone trying to merge and do their best to not allow it. I wait until there is a spot, and gun it while putting the blinker on

 

[Drunken knight]

Wait for an appropriately-sized spot, then blink-and-move all in one motion.

Yea no way I am putting blinker on early and letting people not let me in. Bunch of twats will see someone trying to merge and do their best to not allow it. I wait until there is a spot, and gun it while putting the blinker on

to me, it is very situational for when i engage my signal:
- normal highway driving
- accident-> forced merging. how much space (variation of speed per lane)
- everyone is slow moving (bumper to bumper for all lanes)

i generally give people the benefit of the doubt to do the right thing by merging properly.

 

[TennesseeJed]

Always use my turn signal in advance of any turns/lane shifts.

The more information the drivers around me have about my intentions, the better. I use it to make my life safer.

Of course, you still run into situations where maybe a car does not let you over - that happens, and when it does, I wait for space to open up to safely move. (I generally try to get in the lane I need to be in well in advance of needing to be there, but if its a closing lane/merge situation, its just signal and wait - I have observed over time that the few seconds you think you save by forcing yourself in, just is not worth the risk.)

 

[Terminalxylem]

Wait for an appropriately-sized spot, then blink-and-move all in one motion.

Yea no way I am putting blinker on early and letting people not let me in. Bunch of twats will see someone trying to merge and do their best to not allow it. I wait until there is a spot, and gun it while putting the blinker on

Seems this strategy is more common than I realized. So I’ll ask again, why blink at all, if you’re “gunning it” to you chosen spot regardless?

What do you think the ratio of twats:considerate drivers is?

Although it’s increasing with time, I think it’s in the neighborhood of 1 to 5, and you can predict who’s gonna be a jerk a good portion of the time. So in my driving universe at least, you’re rewarded for an early blinker more often than not.

 

[Terminalxylem]

Always use my turn signal in advance of any turns/lane shifts.

The more information the drivers around me have about my intentions, the better. I use it to make my life safer.

Of course, you still run into situations where maybe a car does not let you over - that happens, and when it does, I wait for space to open up to safely move. (I generally try to get in the lane I need to be in well in advance of needing to be there, but if its a closing lane/merge situation, its just signal and wait - I have observed over time that the few seconds you think you save by forcing yourself in, just is not worth the risk.)

 

[Drunken knight]

Wait for an appropriately-sized spot, then blink-and-move all in one motion.

Yea no way I am putting blinker on early and letting people not let me in. Bunch of twats will see someone trying to merge and do their best to not allow it. I wait until there is a spot, and gun it while putting the blinker on

What do you think the ratio of twats:considerate drivers is?

from my experience, this goes back to the situation.

Hypothetically, we have a 4 lane hw in each direction.
accident in the left lane and authorities cone 2 of the lanes, but provide a good distance to do so.
Right lane is completely bumper to bumper.
1,2,3 lanes are fairly open

in this scenario, i have my right signal on early, but do not want to slow down too early as i do not want to create a hazard for cars behind me ... so here i slow down with my signal on looking for a reasonable gap to safely merge.

imo there are people in that right lane that are just jerks (small number), but there are also people in there who may perceive the drivers in the lefts lanes being "worms" who may be just fine otherwise.

 

[Chadstroma]

If you are that close that they won't let you in if you put your blinker on then you are a jerk that is basically cutting people off. Using the blinker is just trying to make you feel better that you aren't the jerk cutting people off (but you are.).

This makes no sense at all.

Cutting someone off requires pulling in front of them. Signaling a need to move over doesn’t mandate an immediate response; it’s up to the other driver to decide. If they let you in, great, you should acknowledge them with a friendly wave. If not, maybe the next guy will let you in. But even if they don't, it’s not an invitation to force your way in, or slam on the brakes to impede vehicles behind you.

Moreover, there's no way to know how they’ll respond to the blinker, unless you actually use it.

It makes sense since your friend said if he signaled, they wouldn't let them in... that means they are close enough to close the gap which should also mean a quick lane change (with blinker on at the same time or no blinker at all) is cutting them off.

I am not saying using the blinker in all cases is just trying to make you feel better but if you are so close and make a quick lane change in front of them where you put the blinker on right at lane change.... then you are cutting them off and using the blinker is all about making you feel like you are not the villain.

My friend assumed other drivers wouldn’t let him in. But it’s just an assumption, until you give them the opportunity to respond to the blinker.

And no, I’m not advocating a quick blinker before a forced merge. Quite the opposite, actually.

That is my point.... if they are that close to not let you in then you are cutting them off otherwise they would really have to accelerate to move up to block you if you gave them the indication you are moving over with sufficient spacing.

There is subjectivity inherent to what constitutes too close. Especially at highway speeds.

I see no harm in utilizing turn signals to remove some of the ambiguity.

You are clearly not understanding what I am trying to state and I am not sure how to say it better for you to get me.

Let me try to help...

Terminalxylem, Chadstroma agrees with your side of the original post and not with your friend's and wife's side.

Well... damn... that was easier than I thought it was.

 

[Snotbubbles]

I will always let someone who has their blinker on merge. If you don't use the blinker, I'm riding the *** of the car in front of me.

Definitely agree on rewarding blinker use. Not a fan of tailgating, in almost any circumstance.

It's more dangerous for a driver to just switch lanes without using the blinker or blinking at the last second, than it is to tailgate, especially when traffic is bottlenecking due to an accident. In those situations, the rate of speed is usually much slower. I normally keep a 2 car length distance, but in rush hour or jams, I'm usually pretty close to the car in front of me, it all depends on the rate of speed.

You’re correct about tight spacing in slow moving traffic.

But 2 car lengths is too close in all but the worst slow downs. Whatever happened to the 1 car length per 10 mph rule?

ETA I have no idea which behavior is less safe; both tailgating and non/last-second blinking should be avoided.

Never heard of that rule.

 

[Terminalxylem]

I will always let someone who has their blinker on merge. If you don't use the blinker, I'm riding the *** of the car in front of me.

Definitely agree on rewarding blinker use. Not a fan of tailgating, in almost any circumstance.

It's more dangerous for a driver to just switch lanes without using the blinker or blinking at the last second, than it is to tailgate, especially when traffic is bottlenecking due to an accident. In those situations, the rate of speed is usually much slower. I normally keep a 2 car length distance, but in rush hour or jams, I'm usually pretty close to the car in front of me, it all depends on the rate of speed.

You’re correct about tight spacing in slow moving traffic.

But 2 car lengths is too close in all but the worst slow downs. Whatever happened to the 1 car length per 10 mph rule?

ETA I have no idea which behavior is less safe; both tailgating and non/last-second blinking should be avoided.

Never heard of that rule.

It used to be standard teaching in drivers ed. Alternatively, I’ve heard you should leave at least a 3 second gap when traveling at highway speeds.

While it’s not always practical to abide by such rules, I’ve definitely noticed a lot more people tailgating with modern vehicles. And yes, 2 car lengths on the highway certainly qualifies.

FWIW, here’s advice from State Farm

Here are 10 ways to merge safely:​

1. Adjust your speed to match the flow of traffic before entering the roadway.
2. Yield to drivers on the freeway, but avoid stopping unless absolutely necessary.
3. Find a three to four-second gap in traffic to merge. And be looking for the vehicle you want to be behind.
4. Check for cars around your vehicle before entering a lane. And remember to check your blind spot. Your mirrors will only reflect where they are aimed. So be sure to actually turn your head to see if the way is clear.
5. Use your turn signals early, a recommended 100 to 300 feet before merging or changing lanes.
6. Wait for the solid line to end before merging. A solid line indicates that lane changes are prohibited.
7. Cross one lane of traffic at a time.
8. Be prepared for your exit, and maneuver into the far-right lane as you approach it.
9. In general, keep up with the speed of traffic until you exit. However, it's important to adjust your speed depending on the weather conditions and the design of the exit ramp.
10. If you must pass a vehicle, pass on the left and return to your lane once the vehicle is visible in your rearview mirror. Increase this distance when passing larger vehicles. If you're driving a commercial vehicle, be sure to check your side mirrors and blind-spot mirrors as some commercial vehicles don't have a rearview mirror.

While #3 isn’t strictly referring to safe following distance, I think it’s interesting they focus on looking at the vehicle you want to be behind. All too often, people fixate on the vehicle they want to be ahead of. Sometimes, it’s easier to slow a bit and merge behind, instead of forcing a pass with too little space.

ETA At 65 mph, a car travels 95 feet per second. So the 3 second rule suggests a ~275 feet cushion on the highway…that’s definitely way more than 2 car lengths (more than 7, too).

 

[Snotbubbles]

I will always let someone who has their blinker on merge. If you don't use the blinker, I'm riding the *** of the car in front of me.

Definitely agree on rewarding blinker use. Not a fan of tailgating, in almost any circumstance.

It's more dangerous for a driver to just switch lanes without using the blinker or blinking at the last second, than it is to tailgate, especially when traffic is bottlenecking due to an accident. In those situations, the rate of speed is usually much slower. I normally keep a 2 car length distance, but in rush hour or jams, I'm usually pretty close to the car in front of me, it all depends on the rate of speed.

You’re correct about tight spacing in slow moving traffic.

But 2 car lengths is too close in all but the worst slow downs. Whatever happened to the 1 car length per 10 mph rule?

ETA I have no idea which behavior is less safe; both tailgating and non/last-second blinking should be avoided.

Never heard of that rule.

It used to be standard teaching in drivers ed. Alternatively, I’ve heard you should leave at least a 3 second gap when traveling at highway speeds.

While it’s not always practical to abide by such rules, I’ve definitely noticed a lot more people tailgating with modern vehicles. And yes, 2 car lengths on the highway certainly qualifies.

FWIW, here’s advice from State Farm

Here are 10 ways to merge safely:​

1. Adjust your speed to match the flow of traffic before entering the roadway.
2. Yield to drivers on the freeway, but avoid stopping unless absolutely necessary.
3. Find a three to four-second gap in traffic to merge. And be looking for the vehicle you want to be behind.
4. Check for cars around your vehicle before entering a lane. And remember to check your blind spot. Your mirrors will only reflect where they are aimed. So be sure to actually turn your head to see if the way is clear.
5. Use your turn signals early, a recommended 100 to 300 feet before merging or changing lanes.
6. Wait for the solid line to end before merging. A solid line indicates that lane changes are prohibited.
7. Cross one lane of traffic at a time.
8. Be prepared for your exit, and maneuver into the far-right lane as you approach it.
9. In general, keep up with the speed of traffic until you exit. However, it's important to adjust your speed depending on the weather conditions and the design of the exit ramp.
10. If you must pass a vehicle, pass on the left and return to your lane once the vehicle is visible in your rearview mirror. Increase this distance when passing larger vehicles. If you're driving a commercial vehicle, be sure to check your side mirrors and blind-spot mirrors as some commercial vehicles don't have a rearview mirror.

While #3 isn’t strictly referring to safe following distance, I think it’s interesting they focus on looking at the vehicle you want to be behind. All too often, people fixate on the vehicle they want to be ahead of. Sometimes, it’s easier to slow a bit and merge behind, instead of forcing a pass with too little space.

ETA At 65 mph, a car travels 95 feet per second. So the 3 second rule suggests a ~275 feet cushion on the highway…that’s definitely way more than 2 car lengths (more than 7, too).

I can tell you right now, I don't think ANYBODY uses #3. I was taught in my drivers ed, 2 car lengths.

 

[TennesseeJed]

I agree that nobody uses 3-4 second gap when merging - but 2 car lengths is insanely close on the highway - and respectfully, I don't believe any reputable driving school would recommend that as a safe driving distance.

 

[TennesseeJed]

PennDOT recommendation:

• To determine your following distance, watch the rear bumper of the vehicle ahead of you. When the bumper passes a road marking or a roadside object like a telephone pole, start counting how many seconds it takes you to reach the same spot on the road. If you pass the marking or object in less than four seconds, you are following too closely.

Managing Space

prddmv.pwpca.pa.gov

Conversely, at 70 MPH, two car lengths would take about 0.4 seconds.

 

[Terminalxylem]

I agree that nobody uses 3-4 second gap when merging - but 2 car lengths is insanely close on the highway - and respectfully, I don't believe any reputable driving school would recommend that as a safe driving distance.

Exactly what I was thinking.

 

[STEADYMOBBIN 22]

During heavy traffic the DMV, if you put your blinker on and dont immediately move over you have outed yourself as a passive driver and nobody will let you in.