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Brian Westbrook (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter ceo3west
- Start date
Interseptopus
Footballguy
lol time to panic was a long long time ago
Generalnug
Footballguy
Andy Reid's playcalling today was an absolute disgrace.
36's yards per clip wasnt bad at all, but gone are the days when hed get the repeated 15 yard dump offs. Now its just a fricken incomplete bomb to jackson or baskett.
Approx 60 passes from Mcnabb and u get 13 points. No good.
U cant blame 36. Im looking for scapegoats and for me, its the coach and the qub.
36's yards per clip wasnt bad at all, but gone are the days when hed get the repeated 15 yard dump offs. Now its just a fricken incomplete bomb to jackson or baskett.
Approx 60 passes from Mcnabb and u get 13 points. No good.
U cant blame 36. Im looking for scapegoats and for me, its the coach and the qub.
ceo3west
Footballguy
58 passes, and Westbrook has 3 catches for 11 yards. Reid is brilliant.
gonzobill5
Footballguy
mcnabb missed him on at least 2 where he could have run a long way. my concern isn't his production, its what happens when the birds are eliminated from the playoffs. would they shut him down?
Judge Smails
Footballguy
This is the biggest mystery in the NFL right now. McNabb has more weapons to throw to, so you'd think Westbrook would be even more dangerous. The line isn't opening holes. Westbrook has come close but is not breaking them - lots of shoesting tackles righ when he gets to the second levels. And he is a zero in the passing game. He used to be automatic moving the chains. Doesn't help when that idiot McNabb is throwing picks all over the place. Play calling is horrific. How do they not play action off of Westbrook more? He is either getting the handoff, going out and hanging in the middle of the field (decoy), or dropping back in pass protection (most of the time). Having Westbrook as your primary blocker is a total waste. They though they could win just by turning McNabb loose in the passing game. Not working. Reid better have better answers this week.
Pip's Invitation
Footballguy
There are several things at work here.
1. He's not anywhere near 100%. He doesn't have the burst that you normally see from him. However, he's not exactly crippled, either.
2. The O-Line is nowhere near as good, especially in run-blocking, as it was in previous years. This is mainly due to Shawn Andrews being out. He is a real mauler and makes everyone around him better.
3. As others have said, the playcalling is atrocious. Reid seems to think McNabb is his best player on offense, when that hasn't been the case for about five years.
Given all of that, I would definitely sit him against the Ravens, unless your bench is paper-thin.
1. He's not anywhere near 100%. He doesn't have the burst that you normally see from him. However, he's not exactly crippled, either.
2. The O-Line is nowhere near as good, especially in run-blocking, as it was in previous years. This is mainly due to Shawn Andrews being out. He is a real mauler and makes everyone around him better.
3. As others have said, the playcalling is atrocious. Reid seems to think McNabb is his best player on offense, when that hasn't been the case for about five years.
Given all of that, I would definitely sit him against the Ravens, unless your bench is paper-thin.
ddogs24
Footballguy
I am a Westbrook owner, and an Eagles fan. For weeks now (actually for years) fans in Philly have been complaining about Reid's heavy pass play calling. Because the team has not been ahead early recently, Andy sees it as an opportunity to just throw more. In the post-game show today there were numerous analysts saying that Westbrook is just not getting enough touches because Andy refuses to run the ball. I wouldn't panic if you have BWest in a dynasty league, but in a redraft....tough break because the tail end of the schedule looks tough.
I will say though, I am now thinking about moving BWest in the off season because it sounds likely that Donovan may not be back. If Kolb is in next year, teams will stack the line and dare Reid to let the rook throw it around. I don't like that outlook long term.
I will say though, I am now thinking about moving BWest in the off season because it sounds likely that Donovan may not be back. If Kolb is in next year, teams will stack the line and dare Reid to let the rook throw it around. I don't like that outlook long term.
milo66
Footballguy
Giants fan here. The Giants had their hands full with the Bengals (at home), too. I didn't see this game (I was watching the Giants dispatch the Ravens with ease!), but I wasn't surprised to see the Eagles have trouble putting the Bengals away.But I can't believe A) that McNabb threw 58 passes against the BENGALS? Why? Even if you you won't hand the ball to Westbrook (maybe his ribs are worse than we know?), jeez, hand it to Buckhalter. And B) You throw 58 passes and Westbrook gets THREE catches? How does that happen?
Judge Smails
Footballguy
Reid uses "the best RB in the NFL" according to him, as a decoy. I mean, McNabb was razor sharp, not throwing picks or anything, right? That explains it.
Judge Smails
Footballguy
Is Andrews out for the year?
Ron_Mexico
I Love Doggies
I dealt him away about a month ago in my dynasty league.
I think his best days may be behind him, unfortunately.
I think his best days may be behind him, unfortunately.
Neil Beaufort Zod
Footballguy
Since Westbrook owners are constantly dealing with his injuries and him missing games, it's likely they have something serviceable on the bench (unless they did no planning or had further bad injury luck, etc). I think the poster means that, whatever the Westbrook Plan B is, it's time to fire it up. Not sure I agree yet, but the whole team seems to be headed in the wrong direction.Pip said:Unless you're in a smaller league, very few Westbrook owners will have a better option on the bench.
FreeBaGeL
Footballguy
I'm not really buying the "he's lost a step" deal because he's been a stud all year up to the last two games. Likewise with the injury being worse than we thought, as he went for 200/2 the first game back from injury and 100 yards the week after that. Again, it's only the last two weeks he's done poorly.
No, what's REALLY going on here is that I traded for Westbroook two weeks ago. So abandon ship Westbrook owners because I have him now and the trade deadline has passed, so there is no hope for him.
I will make sure and let you all know if I were to for some reason drop him though, so you could all confidently rely on him again.
No, what's REALLY going on here is that I traded for Westbroook two weeks ago. So abandon ship Westbrook owners because I have him now and the trade deadline has passed, so there is no hope for him.
I will make sure and let you all know if I were to for some reason drop him though, so you could all confidently rely on him again.
GroveDiesel
Footballguy
This is a little , but McNabb has been throwing to his TEs a ton over the last 3 games. I saw quite a few plays yesterday where Westbrook looped around and was wide open 6 or 7 yards downfield in the middle of the field, but McNabb chose to throw it to the TE (usually LJ Smith). It felt like they were actively trying to work it to the TEs more. Some of that could be because Reid likes LJ even though the fans hate him. After Celek had the big game, I think they felt like they needed to keep using their TEs more and try to make LJ look better as well.
That, and McNabb just has no touch on his passes. He's always struggled with the short passes, but he's not even close right now. There was a screen pass yesterday to Westbrook where there was nobody even on the same side of the field as Westy in front of him. It would have almost surely been a 60 yard TD reception for him. But McNabb threw it about 4 feet over his head.
, but McNabb has been throwing to his TEs a ton over the last 3 games. I saw quite a few plays yesterday where Westbrook looped around and was wide open 6 or 7 yards downfield in the middle of the field, but McNabb chose to throw it to the TE (usually LJ Smith). It felt like they were actively trying to work it to the TEs more. Some of that could be because Reid likes LJ even though the fans hate him. After Celek had the big game, I think they felt like they needed to keep using their TEs more and try to make LJ look better as well.That, and McNabb just has no touch on his passes. He's always struggled with the short passes, but he's not even close right now. There was a screen pass yesterday to Westbrook where there was nobody even on the same side of the field as Westy in front of him. It would have almost surely been a 60 yard TD reception for him. But McNabb threw it about 4 feet over his head.
Judge Smails
Footballguy
Yeah, the remote went flying into the couch on that one!This is a little, but McNabb has been throwing to his TEs a ton over the last 3 games. I saw quite a few plays yesterday where Westbrook looped around and was wide open 6 or 7 yards downfield in the middle of the field, but McNabb chose to throw it to the TE (usually LJ Smith). It felt like they were actively trying to work it to the TEs more. Some of that could be because Reid likes LJ even though the fans hate him. After Celek had the big game, I think they felt like they needed to keep using their TEs more and try to make LJ look better as well.
That, and McNabb just has no touch on his passes. He's always struggled with the short passes, but he's not even close right now. There was a screen pass yesterday to Westbrook where there was nobody even on the same side of the field as Westy in front of him. It would have almost surely been a 60 yard TD reception for him. But McNabb threw it about 4 feet over his head.
Carter_Can_Fly
Footballguy
I did not watch him the past two weeks so for anyone who has I was wondering how he looks. Does he look like he has lost a step (maybe due to injury)? Or does he look like his same quick shifty self and its just there have been no holes to run through or no places to break a long one.
no big holes is def a factor. oline is not playing as well as in the past... As others have stated though, playcalling and McNabb being off has also been a big factor. Basically, Westbrook is getting no help from anyone.
Cookiemonster
Footballguy
Agree w/ bolded part. Eagles have played some tough team defenses, and the Bengals are not taken seriously right now, but they take themselves seriously and will surprise some people here at the end of the year (disclaimermilo66 said:
). The play calling may be horrid, but it can't get much worse & this offense has been, if nothing else, productive as long as McNabb and Westy have been starters together. I'm not selling low... right now. 
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Cookiemonster
Footballguy
Each of the last couple games have featured what has likely been McNabb's two worst 1st quarters in his career (not that I watched, but by what I remember seeing from his stat updades). The Philly offense has come out as flat as any offense can. Even the Raiders aspire to play that badly on offense. The were down early to teams they expected to roll on, and that has put a pass-happy playcaller in panic mode from the get-go. You do have to expect Westy to be in a decent amount of pain too. High-ankles don't go away in a few weeks, but linger for a couple months or more. Ribs may still be quite sore too. Panic time is if he plays like this into next year. FFB wise, if redraft - time to sell if you think you can get a more valuable RB for the rest of the season & cash in on his name. Dynasty - don't you dare sell now. To those astute players, his value has already dropped enough that it can only go back up by week 4, '09. If it hasn't by then, somebody will still value his name enough to pay you what you could get now anyways (much like T.O. right now vs week 5).
chocolate bomber
Footballguy
Be careful with this line of thinking. In a PPR dynasty league, I shopped him from the beginning of the season and was only able to finally unload him this week. The perception was that he's brittle, about to celebrate his 30th birthday and he's on a team where the system's made him a star with all those passing attempts. Of course, he and Andrews got banged up early and the Eagles may be switching QB/coach soon. Sure, his value is low right now but it might not get higher if he continues to struggle. That Bengals game didn't help. He got his big extension and his team is all but out of the playoffs. If you can pass him off on his rep, I recommend moving him before things get ugly.
jaybebo
Footballguy
I traded him last season in a dynasty league feeling he had seen his best days...got Jamal Lewis and two firsts out of the deal...one of the first turned into Matt Forte.
Cookiemonster
Footballguy
I doubt his value drops much, if any between now & week 4 next year. I doubt it will improve much either, but it gives you a window to be sure on him. Of course, 1/2 of your league will agree with you and not want him, but it only takes one out of 12 (or 10 or 14) owners to make the deal and get something of value for him. I'm willing to risk a very little amount of value to find out for sure. His value is indeed down, but many still believe he is on more of a Tiki Barber career path and aren't willing to write him off just yet. My point is that you get no less for holding a little longer, under suspicious circumstances.
bicycle_seat_sniffer
Smells like chicken
I just traded him before this week in a dynasty league. Im in total rebuilding mode anyway, but I got decent value
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What kind of decent value did you get, if you don't mind my asking?
FFdork
Footballguy
I have a great backup plan. His name is Buckhalter.Since Westbrook owners are constantly dealing with his injuries and him missing games, it's likely they have something serviceable on the bench (unless they did no planning or had further bad injury luck, etc). I think the poster means that, whatever the Westbrook Plan B is, it's time to fire it up. Not sure I agree yet, but the whole team seems to be headed in the wrong direction.Pip said:Unless you're in a smaller league, very few Westbrook owners will have a better option on the bench.
Looks like I'm going down with the ship. I'm sure I'm not alone.Any word on when/if they're getting Andrews back?Is there any reason for optimism after the Giants ran all over the Ravens or should we assume they're pissed off and Westbrook leaves the game in a body cast?
bicycle_seat_sniffer
Smells like chicken
well some people thought I could have gotten more but I got a top 5 first rounder in 2009, berrian, branch, and m.Bush. for westy, c-buck and ricky williamsTDavi118 said:
Judge Smails
Footballguy
The only way this turns around is that McNabb starts doing his job and torching defenses set up to stop Westbrook. If linebackers are doubling him 5 yards downfield over the middle, then keep beating the seam over them and they'll have to readjust. For now, why should defenses change? Where are the quick out patterns where Westbrook was getting routinely open for 5-10 yard gains on first down that would take the place of a run (similar to how NO uses Bush)? These were automatic. I NEVER see them run that anymore. Westbrook is simply blocking, releasing from the block, and hanging out over the middle, or he's just blocking for other McNabb passes down the field. Sorry, Westy looks quick enough to me. He started doing it yesterday when getting a second gear on runs and just getting caught with shoestring tackles. Maybe Andrews being out is the issue. I know the play calling sucks.
chocolate bomber
Footballguy
For what it's worth I moved him and housh for grant and jennings in my ppr dyno that I have no shot in this season. I'm strong at RB but needed jennings badly.
meanjoegreen
Footballguy
Some of the best play calling the Eagles have done in the last few years is when Jeff Garcia filled in for McNabb. They were more balanced with the play calling with Garcia, and it worked very well for the team. McNabb comes back, and they go back to throwing constantly.ddogs24 said:
renesauz
IBL Representative
I'm seeing many of the same problems in Philly that I am seeing in Arizona. The O-ine is an ELITE pass-blocking unit, but is no longer even marginally effective at opening a running lane. The loss of Andrews is hurting there, but the aged Tackles are part of the problem also. And who's the FB again? They are still savvy and smart and almost impossible to beat on the pass rush, but they are moving NOBODY out of the way on the run plays.
Unlike in Arizona however, McNabb has been hot and cold....more streaky then virtually every other QB n the NFL this year. So when DMac is off, even a little bit, the juggernaut Eagles offense can very quickly become very grounded.
Westbrook has had nowhere to run. I've watched every play of every game this year. With only a few games excepted, his running lanes have been non-existant. AR isn't calling the run anyhwhere near enough...but at least he has a reason for that.
It's time for some of the sharks in here to realize the HUGE differance between run and pass blocking.
Unlike in Arizona however, McNabb has been hot and cold....more streaky then virtually every other QB n the NFL this year. So when DMac is off, even a little bit, the juggernaut Eagles offense can very quickly become very grounded.
Westbrook has had nowhere to run. I've watched every play of every game this year. With only a few games excepted, his running lanes have been non-existant. AR isn't calling the run anyhwhere near enough...but at least he has a reason for that.
It's time for some of the sharks in here to realize the HUGE differance between run and pass blocking.
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BustedKnuckles
Footballguy
What a year ...i own Westy and picked up L.T and FWP in trades and im JUST staying alive in our league....WTF ???? Any other year i would be steam rolling teams with those 3 rb`s...its not right i tell ya
Sputnikv8
Footballguy
Uhh...thats why you got those 3. If it were any other year, they'd be too expensive to obtain!It is crazy though. Changing of the guard.What a year ...i own Westy and picked up L.T and FWP in trades and im JUST staying alive in our league....WTF ???? Any other year i would be steam rolling teams with those 3 rb`s...its not right i tell ya
BustedKnuckles
Footballguy
i agree...i got them from frustrated owners sick of the injury`s...rolled the dice thinking they would heal and be just like they always were...seasons not over yet.Reality: Brian Westbrook isn't the problem in Philadelphia -- the play calling is. The Eagles ran 76 plays from scrimmage Sunday. Westbrook was involved in 17 of them -- 14 rushes and three catches, and eight of those 17 plays were good for at least 4 yards. That tells me that he's still pretty effective. But if he is supposed to be your best offensive weapon, shouldn't he be involved in more than 22 percent of your offensive plays? Additionally, the Philadelphia Daily News had Bengals cornerback Johnathan Joseph on the record calling the Eagles' playcalling "predictable." That's awful. Frankly, the Eagles need to change things up and remember No. 36 is on the team....cbssportslineUhh...thats why you got those 3. If it were any other year, they'd be too expensive to obtain!It is crazy though. Changing of the guard.What a year ...i own Westy and picked up L.T and FWP in trades and im JUST staying alive in our league....WTF ???? Any other year i would be steam rolling teams with those 3 rb`s...its not right i tell ya
I've thought that same comparison, but while McNabb is playing well, Warner is playing at a HOF level. Which is why Arizona sustains more drives than Philly and ultimately scores more points. As for Westbrook, I think he might be a good guy to buy in dynasties, but there is a lot more risk involved than I would have foreseen before the season started. I can't imagine he stays so uninvolved in the passing game.gonzobill5
Footballguy
Westbrook is an all-timer, in a class with Faulk. If you think McNabb has anything to do with the player he is, just look at how he's played with McNabb out. The injuries have some effect, but not much. When they get him in space he has looked just as good as ever. Andrews being out is the major reason for his decline. Which sucks, because I doubt he comes back. Reid still favors the right side, but the right side just isn't that good. Why isn't he catching so many passes? Just watch the games, his catches have been way down because Reid doesn't trust that line and leaves westy in for his blocking. He lays a block and then runs a route. When McNabb does throw to him, he rushes the throw. Reid looks to be designing plays for DeSean but not Westbrook.
All that said, there aren't more than a handful of RB's I'd rather have starting on any given day. That offense still puts up a ton of points, and in the redzone he's their best player.
Pip's Invitation
Footballguy
Yes, that is exactly what I am saying. The team's offense is a mess and things aren't likely to get any better against the Ravens D. I would rank him no higher than RB20 for the coming week. If you have two starting RBs with better matchups, I would play them instead.Since Westbrook owners are constantly dealing with his injuries and him missing games, it's likely they have something serviceable on the bench (unless they did no planning or had further bad injury luck, etc). I think the poster means that, whatever the Westbrook Plan B is, it's time to fire it up. Not sure I agree yet, but the whole team seems to be headed in the wrong direction.Pip said:Unless you're in a smaller league, very few Westbrook owners will have a better option on the bench.
Pip's Invitation
Footballguy
Not officially, but the Eagles have given no timetable for his return, and what few reports have come out about his progress have not been good. I doubt he plays again this year.
