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Build Back Better (1 Viewer)

The General

Footballguy
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Didn’t see a BBB thread. 

Passed the House. The insiders are saying the Dems have the votes to get through the Senate with changes that are already agreed upon. We’ll see about that.

There is a lot in here at the moment that will be very popular if the Dems can articulate it, have my doubts on that. 

 
Link

Didn’t see a BBB thread. 

Passed the House. The insiders are saying the Dems have the votes to get through the Senate with changes that are already agreed upon. We’ll see about that.

There is a lot in here at the moment that will be very popular if the Dems can articulate it, have my doubts on that. 


yeah, not good.  Shades of soviet style commie tactics in this thing.  Unbelievable.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/bill-build-back-better-spending-bill-contents/

What's in the Build Back Better Act framework

Fighting climate change 

Combating climate change and slowing the rate at which Earth warms will mean transitioning away from fossil fuels, the major source of greenhouse gas emissions. The new framework unveiled by the White House contains $555 billion for climate and clean energy investments.

As written, the plan would cut more than a gigaton of greenhouse gas emissions by 2030 — a roughly 50% reduction compared to 2005 levels, according to the White House. 

The legislation would provide tax credits to Americans buying new electric vehicles that could provide up to $12,500 in incentives to some families to drop gas-guzzling vehicles. New tax incentives designed to encourage the installation of solar panels on American homes will also be offered.  

Manchin objected to a $150 billion "clean electricity performance program" contained in the original proposal, which would pay utility companies that increase their renewable energy supplies by 4% per year and fine companies that don't hit this benchmark. He has argued that companies are already doing this, so there's no need to incentivize them to augment their use of renewables. However, climate advocates say private enterprise isn't moving quickly enough, and this provision would speed up the transition away from fossil fuels.

Child care and universal pre-K

Mr. Biden's framework includes $400 billion for child care and preschool through programs funded for six years. In addition to expanding access to universal preschool for all 3- and 4-year-olds, the plan also limits child care costs for some families to no more than 7% of income. Parents must adhere to work requirements to qualify.

Medicare expansion

This heavily debated provision would expand Medicare to cover hearing services, but the framework eliminated a proposal for Medicare to also include dental and vision benefits, a key priority for Senator Bernie Sanders.

Manchin believes the program's solvency should be addressed before it is expanded.

Extended child tax credit

Democrats expanded the child tax credit for 2021 in their $1.9 trillion COVID-19 relief plan and wanted to extend it through 2025. But Mr. Biden's updated framework extends the child tax credit for one year, for 2022, which the White House said will provide more than 35 million households up to $3,600 in tax cuts per child.

Under the enhancement, families receive $3,600 per child under age 6, and $3,000 per child ages 6 to 18. Most families receive monthly payments of either $250 or $300 per child.

The full expanded child tax credit is available to individuals making up to $75,000 or married couples making up to $150,000.

4 weeks of paid family and medical leave

It was in the bill, then removed — and it's back in again, for now, in the version that will receive a vote in the House this week. Democrats originally had 12 weeks of paid family and medical leave in the measure but were forced to remove it because it was too costly. But the provision was championed by a number of women lawmakers in the House and Senate, and they succeeded in restoring a more limited version that would give qualifying Americans four weeks of paid leave.

Although Manchin supports paid leave in principle and has even introduced a paid leave bill, he says that this bill, passed under reconciliation with only the votes of Democrats, is the "wrong" way to legislate it. He argues paid leave must be in a separate bill and should be written to attract bipartisan support, which will make it less susceptible to repeal or other challenges.

Immigration

The bill under consideration by the House includes an additional $100 billion to reform the nation's immigration system, which, if included, would raise the price tag from $1.75 trillion to $1.85 trillion. But previous attempts to tuck immigration reform into the package were knocked down by the Senate parliamentarian, who is tasked with ensuring the legislation's provisions comply with the rules governing the reconciliation process.

It would allow the Department of Homeland Security to give an estimated 7 million unauthorized immigrants — including Dreamers, coronavirus-era essential workers and farm workers — work permits and temporary protection from deportation, similar to Deferred Action for Childhood Arrivals (DACA), an Obama-era initiative. The CBO will offer its analysis, and then the provision would be subject to the ruling of the Senate parliamentarian.

Housing and health care provisions

Mr. Biden's framework includes $150 billion to build or improve more than 1 million new affording housing units and help with rental and down payment assistance. 

It also makes investments in maternal health, community violence initiatives, Native communities and supply chain resilience.

For health care, the plan would lower premiums by an average of $600 per person for more than 9 million Americans who purchase insurance through the Affordable Care Act's marketplace, and provide coverage for up to 4 million Americans who are currently uninsured.

What was cut from the bill?

Two free years of community college

While Mr. Biden's domestic policy proposal initially included two years of free community college for all students regardless of income, the plan was dropped from the framework unveiled by the White House.

Instead, the measure increases the maximum Pell Grant for more than 5 million students by $550 and expands access for "Dreamers," the name given to millions of undocumented immigrants who came to the U.S. as children, according to a fact sheet from the White House.

Cutting prescription drug prices

A key provision in a bill from House Democrats was aimed at helping to slash prescription drug prices. Americans on average pay two to three times as much as people in other countries for prescription drugs, according to the White House. Among other things, the legislation would have allowed Medicare to negotiate drug prices, but the new framework did not include this proposal. Medicare is currently prohibited by law from negotiating for the best deal.

The White House believes the taxes in BBB will raise more than $1.99 trillion to cover the $1.75 trillion Build Back Better agenda over 10 years without raising taxes on small businesses or those making less than $400,000 a year. We'll know soon whether the CBO agrees with the administration's assertions when its analysis comes out this week.

How Democrats plan to pay for it

The taxes: Under Mr. Biden's proposal, a 15% minimum tax will be imposed on corporate profits that large corporations report to shareholders, as well as a 1% surcharge on corporate stock buybacks. Those provisions would raise $450 billion in new revenue, according to the White House.

The framework also calls for a global minimum tax and new surtax on the wealthiest Americans' income, as well as bolstered IRS enforcement. The bill would impose a 5% tax rate above those with an income over $10 million, and another 3% surtax on income over $25 million. The White House estimates the new surtax would raise an additional $230 billion from the nation's highest earning taxpayers.

Chasing tax cheats: The biggest revenue-raiser in the bill amounts to more aggressive pursuit by the IRS of tax cheats. The administration wants $80 billion for the IRS to hire more specialized agents to root out tax evasion and modernize the agency's technology. The White House thinks this would help bring in an additional $400 billion over the next ten years. 

SALT tax cap: This provision would actually put a sizable dent in the revenues by partially restoring a generous tax deduction that was reduced by Republicans during the Trump administration. The State and Local Tax deduction (SALT) cap, which limits the amount of state and local taxes that individuals can deduct from their federal taxes, would be raised by the social spending bill being considered by the House. The cap, which largely affects wealthier Americans in coastal Democratic-dominant states, would rise from $10,000 up to $80,000 through 2031 and then drop back to $10,000 after that. Currently, the SALT cap, which was put in place by the Republican tax cut enacted in 2016, is scheduled to expire in 2026.

This would be one of the most expensive provisions in the bill, costing about $400 billion for the five years it would be in effect, and, as the Center on Budget and Policy Priorities points out, it would mostly benefit Americans who make over $200,000 per year. 

 
I get a little annoyed at any article that talks about how Joe Manchin watering down the climate change provisions without mentioning how much of his personal wealth comes from coal
And his family's involvement in the pharmaceutical industry.

To paraphrase a recent meme, Manchin cries out against inflation but didn't say a word when his daughter raised the price of insulin 500%.

 
Manchin and Sinema will decide what's meat and what's not.
Definitely. Pramila Jayapal who has been kind of serving as a bridge speaker between the progressives and the moderate Dems indicated that the deal isn’t in final form but that the changes have already need agreed upon. 

I’m paraphrasing but that’s what I heard in an interview yesterday. 

We’ll see how it plays out.

 
Definitely. Pramila Jayapal who has been kind of serving as a bridge speaker between the progressives and the moderate Dems indicated that the deal isn’t in final form but that the changes have already need agreed upon. 

I’m paraphrasing but that’s what I heard in an interview yesterday. 

We’ll see how it plays out.
Jayapal may have a small amount of influence in the House but is irrelevant to the Senate. Completely different dynamics there. Nothing has been agreed upon as far as Manchin is concerned.

This thing will drag on well into the spring. 

 
Jayapal may have a small amount of influence in the House but is irrelevant to the Senate. Completely different dynamics there. Nothing has been agreed upon as far as Manchin is concerned.

This thing will drag on well into the spring. 
She knows far more about the process than you or me :lol:  I assume she was speaking this boldly because she knows stuff but we’ll see. She didn’t mention Manchin or Sinema by name but it was pretty clearly implied I thought. 

Could definitely seeing this drag out. These dudes will be on Christmas vacation for a month and a half soon.

 
She knows far more about the process than you or me :lol:  I assume she was speaking this boldly because she knows stuff but we’ll see. She didn’t mention Manchin or Sinema by name but it was pretty clearly implied I thought. 

Could definitely seeing this drag out. These dudes will be on Christmas vacation for a month and a half soon.
Paypal has a habit of speaking boldly and not knowing what she is talking about.

In October, when Manchin threw cold water on the $3.5 trillion, and instead suggested a $1.5 trillion pricetag, Paypal said "that's not going to happen." In the end it's much closer to $1.5 trillion.

So she really doesn't "know stuff."

 
Can you explain what?  In the above posted descriptions it mentions many times "some families "  if you think that's the middle class you're insane.  

Help me find the middle class benefits
$400 billion for universal pre-K

Under the universal preschool plan, parents will be able to send their children to a public school or childcare program of their choice. The effort is part of Biden’s larger plan to ease the financial burdens facing millions of American families, particularly low-income parents with children. Families that earn less than $300,000 annually, for instance, will pay no more than 7% of their income on child care for kids under age six, according to the bill.

$200 billion for child tax credits

The bill grants a one-year extension of the pandemic-era child tax credit, which provides parents with $300 every month per child under age six and $250 every month per child ages six to 17. Families that do not earn enough money to qualify for income tax liability will be eligible to continue receiving the full child tax credit beyond the one-year period.

$200 billion for 4 weeks of paid leave

The bill creates a permanent, comprehensive national paid leave program that gives employed workers—including those who are self-employed—four weeks of paid family and medical leave, which can be used for caregiving or personal illness. If this provision becomes law, workers who request paid leave starting in 2024 will receive a percentage of their income starting at about 90% and scaling down for higher earners.

Currently, the U.S. is one of few industrialized nations without a national paid leave program for new parents. According to the Bureau of Labor Statistics, as of March 2021, just 23% of civilian workers in the U.S. had access to paid family leave and 89% had access to unpaid family leave.

Although the paid leave provision passed the House, it faces an uphill battle in the Senate against Sen. Manchin, a key centrist who said he opposes passing a major policy like this through a spending bill.

$165 billion on healthcare spending

Touted by the White House as the biggest expansion of affordable health care in a decade, the spending bill reduces health care premiums under the Affordable Care Act and expands Medicare coverage to include hearing benefits. Premiums for those who buy insurance through the Affordable Care Act marketplace will be around $600 less per person each year, so that a family of four earning $80,000 annually would save roughly $246 per month on health insurance premiums, the White House says.

Officials hope the savings will make it easier for those who are currently uninsured to gain health insurance. The spending plan also closes the Medicaid coverage gap, allowing uninsured people whose states have locked them out of Medicaid to receive health care coverage without paying a monthly premium.

The Build Back Better bill also delivers a compromise for taking on Big Pharma over rising drug prices: It would restrict how much drugmakers can increase their prices each year and set an annual limit on out-of-pocket spending, but only after those drugs have been on the market for about a decade.

That means drug companies could still charge an enormous amount for new drugs, with price regulation taking effect nine years later for most common medications and 13 years later for more complicated drugs. Out-of-pocket costs for insulin—a protein hormone used to treat diabetes—would be capped at $35 for a 30-day supply, significantly lower than current costs, starting in 2023.

$150 billion to expand affordable home care

The plan provides funding for a Medicaid program that supports in-home health care, helping to reduce a backlog of people waiting to receive subsidized home care and improve wages for providers. Thousands of seniors and disabled Americans have been unable to receive care they need, including more than 800,000 on state Medicaid waiting lists, the White House says. Many home care issues have been exacerbated by the COVID-19 pandemic.

$150 billion for affordable housing

Increased spending on housing affordability will go towards building more than 1 million new rental and single-family homes. The bill aims to reduce cost pressures by providing rental and down payment assistance through an expanded voucher program.

According to the National Low Income Housing Coalition, around 70% of all extremely low income families pay more than half their income on rent, and over 580,000 Americans currently experience homelessness.

 
Paypal has a habit of speaking boldly and not knowing what she is talking about.

In October, when Manchin threw cold water on the $3.5 trillion, and instead suggested a $1.5 trillion pricetag, Paypal said "that's not going to happen." In the end it's much closer to $1.5 trillion.

So she really doesn't "know stuff."
Is BBB addressing much of the stuff cut out of the bill that passed?

We will see what happens when it gets to the Senate. I'll stick with she or pretty much anyone in Congress knows more about how this is playing out than anyone in here.

 
Can you explain what?  In the above posted descriptions it mentions many times "some families "  if you think that's the middle class you're insane.  

Help me find the middle class benefits
Universal pre k, child tax credits, and paid family leave would have impacted us in a meaningful way when our kids were that age. 

 
yeah, not good.  Shades of soviet style commie tactics in this thing.  Unbelievable.
Would be nice if you could explain what you mean. A bill.passing through the house and Senate and people on both sides talking about how it helps their constituents sounds nothing like Soviet style commie tactics. 

Rather than resorting to this overused talk of commie and socialist, explain what you think is in this that comes close to Soviet style anything. 

 
Would be nice if you could explain what you mean. A bill.passing through the house and Senate and people on both sides talking about how it helps their constituents sounds nothing like Soviet style commie tactics. 

Rather than resorting to this overused talk of commie and socialist, explain what you think is in this that comes close to Soviet style anything. 
Both sides?  Did I miss a Republican voting for BBB?

 
Universal pre k, child tax credits, and paid family leave would have impacted us in a meaningful way when our kids were that age. 
These things would be very popular.

Dems will somehow mess up the message or let themselves get painted into some corner on this.

 
Too much in here.  2 years of free community college?  Uh, no.  And no immigration reform.  The Dems have lost me on that with all the shenanigans of letting so many illegals into the country.

 
I personally think it will set inflation on fire.  Had to retype this response.  It irks me that people think this is so great, how could anyone be against it unless they are obstructionist.  
Yep, no concern with how to provide….they just want these things for free, consequences be damned. Hopefully it’s stopped. 

 
I realize math is difficult for many Democrats, but the WSJ exposes the House's budget gimmicks and shows how BBB will really cost closer to $4.5-5.0 trillion. Program by program. 

The Real Biden Bill: At Least $4.6 Trillion

The Congressional Budget Office on Thursday released its “official” cost estimates for the House tax and entitlement bill, but don’t believe it. The CBO gnomes aren’t lying about a 10-year deficit estimate of $367 billion. They’re obliged to score the bill under rules that Democrats have rigged with multiple tricks that disguise the real cost by trillions of dollars.

Democrats phase out the biggest programs in the bill while paying for them with 10 years of tax increases. They phase-in other programs and off-load costs to the states. The Penn Wharton Budget Model estimates the House bill would cost nearly $4.6 trillion over 10 years if temporary provisions are made permanent, as most will be.

The Committee for a Responsible Federal Budget (CRFB) pegs the cost at $4.9 trillion if temporary tax credits and programs are made permanent through 2031. This would add $1.5 trillion to deficits over the next five years without additional tax offsets. Let’s take a tour of this budget deception.

• Enhanced child allowances ($3,600 for children under age 6 and $3,000 up to age 17). This is the bill’s most expensive provision at about $130 billion a year, which is why Democrats limit it to one year. Does anyone doubt they’ll extend it in the future?

They may get help from Republicans, who won’t want to be attacked for raising taxes on families. CRFB says making the allowances permanent would cost $1.13 trillion. Based on current law, it would cost $1.5 trillion since the $2,000 tax credit from the 2017 GOP tax reform is set to drop back to $1,000 after 2025. So that’s nearly $1.4 trillion in hidden costs alone.

• Earned income tax credit expansion. The bill nearly triples the maximum EITC value for childless adults—but only for one year. Its $15 billion annual cost would be $135 billion if extended over the decade. The kicker: Individuals can qualify based on their previous year’s earnings, so they technically don’t have to work to get it.

• ObamaCare premium subsidies. Democrats in March extended eligibility to Americans making more than 400% of the poverty line and capped their premium payments for benchmark plans at 8.5% of income. Subsidies for lower earners were also increased so people making 150% of the poverty line don’t have to pay a penny toward their premiums, compared to 4.1% before the change.

These sweetened subsidies are set to expire after next year, but the bill extends them through 2025 while also allowing lower-income adults in states that opted out of the ObamaCare Medicaid expansion to qualify. CRFB says these subsidies will cost $530 billion if they are made permanent.

• A new child-care entitlement. Households making up to 250% of their state’s median income would qualify for child-care vouchers, and their payments would be capped at 7% of income—less for lower earners. The bill appropriates about $100 billion through 2024 to states and “such sums as may be necessary” from 2025 to 2027.

Spending on this entitlement like all others can be expected to increase on autopilot, especially as providers raise prices to capture more subsidies. States will have to pick up 5% of the cost from 2025 to 2027, which somewhat reduces federal spending but could lead to state tax hikes down the road.

• Universal pre-K. The bill appropriates about $18 billion to states for universal pre-K through 2024 and then “such sums as may be necessary” through 2027. States would be on the hook for about 5% of the cost starting in 2025 and 37% in 2027.

The pre-K and child care entitlements are estimated to cost only $380 billion because they phase in gradually and expire after six years. But there’s zero chance they will expire in 2027. Once the middle-class gets hooked, the entitlements will be impossible to repeal. CRFB estimates the two programs would cost $800 billion if made permanent.

• The current $10,000 limit on the state-and-local tax (SALT) deduction increases to $80,000 through 2030. In 2031 it would return to $10,000. Penn Wharton says this gimmick would lead to $65 billion in additional tax revenue through 2031 though it would cost about $300 billion through 2025. Confused?

Under current law, the $10,000 SALT cap is set to expire in 2025 with most of the 2017 GOP tax cuts. So raising the cap to $80,000 would add to the deficit through 2025 but subtract from it through 2031. This gimmick will make it harder to extend the other expiring provisions of the 2017 tax reform, such as bonus depreciation for business. CRFB says that if the 2017 tax reforms are extended separately, any savings on paper would be erased and replaced with an additional $340 billion in costs.

In sum, the House bill will cost $2 trillion to $3 trillion more than CBO is estimating because Democrats have camouflaged the costs. Penn Wharton estimates the bill’s tax increases and other revenue will yield about $1.8 trillion, but this doesn’t account for how the tax hikes will change the incentives to work and invest.

Keep in mind that CBO this summer projected that annual deficits will already exceed $1 trillion on average through 2030, causing U.S. debt to swell by $12.8 trillion—and that’s before the infrastructure bill or this House bill. When the spending all kicks in, and the rich are all taxed out, the middle class will be hit with a huge tax increase. This is the most dishonest spending bill in American history.

 
Too much in here.  2 years of free community college?  Uh, no.  And no immigration reform.  The Dems have lost me on that with all the shenanigans of letting so many illegals into the country.


What are you talking about?  This bill allows millions of additional immigrants in to our country.  They want more illegal AND legal immigration.  Screw Americans.  Viva la immigrant!!!!

 
See above. Whine about Trump spending, then endorse this careless giveaway. Who’s shocked? :lmao:
A few things, Trump hadn’t been mentioned. Not sure where the popularity of his tax cuts fell.

Do you think families getting this tax credit will not be popular across large swaths of voters? Or the pre-K, child care? Hearing aides under Medicare? 

For this to pass moderates will demand closer to 0 budget increase than the CBO estimates I would guess. 

 
I personally think it will set inflation on fire.  Had to retype this response.  It irks me that people think this is so great, how could anyone be against it unless they are obstructionist.  
Fiscal conservatism is long dead, man. Americans don't prioritize it and our representation accurately reflects those values.

 
A few things, Trump hadn’t been mentioned. Not sure where the popularity of his tax cuts fell.

Do you think families getting this tax credit will not be popular across large swaths of voters? Or the pre-K, child care? Hearing aides under Medicare? 

For this to pass moderates will demand closer to 0 budget increase than the CBO estimates I would guess. 
Free stuff is popular? Get out of town! :lmao:

Lets hope Manchin hold strong. 

 
A few things, Trump hadn’t been mentioned. Not sure where the popularity of his tax cuts fell.

Do you think families getting this tax credit will not be popular across large swaths of voters? Or the pre-K, child care? Hearing aides under Medicare? 

For this to pass moderates will demand closer to 0 budget increase than the CBO estimates I would guess. 
So fitting that GB was the first to bring him up.   But Trump!!   

 
These things would be very popular.

Dems will somehow mess up the message or let themselves get painted into some corner on this.
Unfortunately, probably true.    Instead of getting out and explaining what was in the bill and how it helps average family, they will probably get into a pissing match about CRT or something.  :lol:  

 
So fitting that GB was the first to bring him up.   But Trump!!   
Your hypocrisy after whining about spending under Trump yet try to disguise the odor on this garbage speaks volumes. Sorry it stings, not shocking though. 

Oh and yes I have kids, yet still don't want the giveaways we can't afford. 

 
Your hypocrisy after whining about spending under Trump yet try to disguise the odor on this garbage speaks volumes. Sorry it stings, not shocking though. 

Oh and yes I have kids, yet still don't want the giveaways we can't afford. 
The most I remember talking about about spending in politics is that I believe that neither side cares and are going to stop, so I vote and think about where I would rather have that overspending go to.  I am not holding my breath for fiscal responsibility anymore.    

Thanks for answering the question, though.  

 
Two years free community college was removed from the latest bill.
Its an interesting thought.  Tennessee already has that program.  My son is considering it as an option next year.  To continue to work , save money while living at home.  And knock out the typical general english, history and the like.

 
Its an interesting thought.  Tennessee already has that program.  My son is considering it as an option next year.  To continue to work , save money while living at home.  And knock out the typical general english, history and the like.
I don't think it is. Historical data overwhelmingly indicates students are more likely to be successful if they have some skin in the game.

 
It's a shame. 2 years of free community college sound incredible to me. Free K-12 is wonderful, we almost all agree with that. A high school diploma does not mean what it used to though. A two year associates degree though would put kids on a footing equal to the high school diploma of last generation

 

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