What's new
Fantasy Football - Footballguys Forums

This is a sample guest message. Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!

Cadillac Williams (1 Viewer)

Otis

Footballguy
I see no reason why this kid cannot break into the top-5 in dynasty RB rankings.

http://cbs.sportsline.com/nfl/story/9588675

Camp tour: Bucs banking Williams has a lot of miles in the chassis

Pete Prisco Aug. 6, 2006

By Pete Prisco

CBS SportsLine.com Senior Writer

LAKE BUENA VISTA, Fla. -- The nickname, though it has stuck since he was in the 11th grade, doesn't fit. Watch Carnell Williams take a swing pass, plant his foot in the ground and explode out of his cut to make a series of defenders miss, and the last thing that comes to mind is a big, powerful car. "Cadillac," which is what his teammates and fans call him, doesn't seem to work.

Even Williams, the dynamic second-year running back for the Tampa Bay Buccaneers, admits the name really doesn't describe his style.

"I'm not a Cadillac," Williams said during a break from Bucs training camp Saturday. "A Cadillac is smooth, big and not fast. I'm more of a Porsche. The name is great, and it has stuck and I'm cool with it, but I'm more like a Porsche because of my speed."

Carnell "Porsche" Williams? Doesn't quite work, either, but you get the idea. At 215 pounds, he is far more of a speed back, a player who can make a defender look silly grabbing for air rather than a plodder who might run over a tackler or two.

It's his size -- he's 5-feet-11 -- that has some worried that Williams might not be able to hold up for the long haul. He burst onto the NFL scene last season as a first-round pick with the idea that he could turn the team's woeful running game around.

In his first three games, he rushed for 434 yards, becoming the first rookie to have three consecutive 100-yard games to open a season. He was the talk of the league, his shoes and gloves from his third game going to the Pro Football Hall of Fame. But then he hurt the arch in his right foot, an injury that had all those doubters whispering the same tune:

We knew he'd break down. The kid isn't big enough.

Williams played out the season, rushing for 1,178 yards to lead all rookies. But the doubters all had their ammunition to fire away: He missed two games and was limited in others. This is what many predicted.

In talking with a defender from another team this summer, he mentioned Williams as a guy he predicts will break down over time, and that the NFL will take a toll on his smaller body.

"He's not big enough," the player said.

Williams laughed when told about that. In fact, he's used to that kind of talk now, and the reality is that he's plenty big for what the Bucs ask him to do. He isn't about to become another Earl Campbell, a guy whose career was shortened by an inordinate number of carries early in his career.

"It motivated me coming into the draft," Williams said. "I heard it then. Guys said I was a smaller back. If you go back and check out the great backs, they weren't big. They were 210 to 215 pounds. Emmitt Smith, Barry Sanders. They weren't big. So the guys who keep saying that type of thing about my size, all that does is keep me motivated to be one of the greats. It keeps me grinding."

At Auburn, Williams was the shifty one, while Ronnie Brown was the bigger, power back. Williams was the more productive of the two with the Tigers, but it was Brown who was taken with the third overall pick by the Miami Dolphins. Williams went fifth to the Bucs.

The two friends then made a wager on who would have the most yards as a rookie.

The smaller, shiftier back won again.

"He had to buy a few dinners here and there during the offseason," Williams said. "But he said he didn't get as many carries because Ricky Williams was there. Now it's fair game. May the best man win."

Don't bet against Williams. Watching him run during the team's training camp here, he appears far more confident in what he's doing. Rather than thinking, he's reacting. And when he reacts, tacklers miss.

He also has that innate ability to pop into a group of defenders and somehow pop out to turn a short gain into a big one. That you can't teach.

"I get into a pile and the first crack I see, I hit," Williams said. "And then I'm gone."

He described his running style as slashing but also quickly noted he isn't about to back away from contact.

"I'm looking to hit you before you hit me," Williams said. "I'm a combination of all things."

Bucs coach Jon Gruden dispels the notion that Williams isn't big enough, pointing to other smaller backs who have had great success.

"How big is Tiki Barber?" Gruden said. "Everybody keeps telling me that he's (Williams) too small. Curtis Martin has done it for 15 years. Is he too small? We're going to be smart with Cadillac. We're not going to hand him the ball every play. We're not going to go out of our way to overwork him. But he's plenty big. His running in the fourth quarter of games should be plenty of an answer for those critics."

The quarter breakdown wasn't available, but, according to Stats Inc., Williams ran for 665 yards in the second half of games, compared to 513 in the first. He had a per-carry average of 4.8 in the second half, compared to 3.4 in the first. All of it shows that he seems to get stronger as the game rolls along.

To help make sure he stays on the field, Williams took a trip to Oregon this summer to have the folks at Nike custom make a shoe for him. Last year, he wore a pair off the shelf. So after experiencing the foot troubles, he decided to go with his own shoe. They arrived last week, and so far Williams loves them.

"They molded a cleat to my foot," Williams said. "It feels a whole lot better. I think it will be a big plus for me."

The Cadillac has new tires. That should make him faster and better, which is scary.

Maybe by December the nickname of Porsche will be the better after all.

Carnell "Porsche" Williams? It doesn't have the ring to it, but the reality is Williams is far more sports car than luxury sedan.

The question now is how many miles can the Bucs put on him?
I just absolutely love this kid in dynasty drafts.He was my pick of the litter last year (with R. Brown a close second and Cedric Benson not even on the map), and I loved every minute of watching him.

Man, this season cannot start soon enough...

 
And, for the record, if I were drafting in any league today (dynasty or otherwise), he is my automatic #5 pick.

 
So who is it... the Big Old Stone or Cadillac?
I like Ronnie's chances of cracking the top 5 a bit more than Caddy's:1) Miami has an easier run schedule.2) Miami's offense should be better than TB, which means more scoring opportunities.3) Miami has a better O line, under Houck.4) Ronnie should be featured in all situations, whereas Caddy may give way to Pittman on some 3d downs and Alstott on goalines.
 
Fullback Fro said:
Lack of Receptions will hurt his value in PPR Leagues.
His is an excellent receiver but was not used as much in the passing game last year as he should have been. all indications from camps and from Gruden are that they plan to use him more in the passing game. This will boost his numbers big time in PPR leagues.Sleep on him at your own risk kids.
 
doughboydeluxe said:
So who is it... the Big Old Stone or Cadillac?
I still absolutely love the Big Old Stone. Dude was an animal when he had his chance last year. I expect him to be a monster this year.Ultimately, as I said all offseason last year, I would be absolutely thrilled to rely on these guys as my starting backs in any league. Unfortunately it will be too difficult to get them both now.
 
Fullback Fro said:
Lack of Receptions will hurt his value in PPR Leagues.
His is an excellent receiver but was not used as much in the passing game last year as he should have been. all indications from camps and from Gruden are that they plan to use him more in the passing game. This will boost his numbers big time in PPR leagues.Sleep on him at your own risk kids.
Talk is Talk. Let him proove it first one year before I waste 1.5 on him. I'm not arguing that the potential is not there just that there are other guys who less risky with similar upside.
 
Fullback Fro said:
Lack of Receptions will hurt his value in PPR Leagues.
His is an excellent receiver but was not used as much in the passing game last year as he should have been. all indications from camps and from Gruden are that they plan to use him more in the passing game. This will boost his numbers big time in PPR leagues.Sleep on him at your own risk kids.
Talk is Talk. Let him proove it first one year before I waste 1.5 on him. I'm not arguing that the potential is not there just that there are other guys who less risky with similar upside.
That's just it, I don't think guys like Rudi Johnson have the same upside.
 
Fullback Fro said:
Lack of Receptions will hurt his value in PPR Leagues.
His is an excellent receiver but was not used as much in the passing game last year as he should have been. all indications from camps and from Gruden are that they plan to use him more in the passing game. This will boost his numbers big time in PPR leagues.Sleep on him at your own risk kids.
Talk is Talk. Let him proove it first one year before I waste 1.5 on him. I'm not arguing that the potential is not there just that there are other guys who less risky with similar upside.
That's just it, I don't think guys like Rudi Johnson have the same upside.
Steven JacksonRonnie BrownEdgerrin James Brian Westbrook All these guys have proven that they are vital to their teams passing games and are less risky while offering similar upside.
 
Otis said:
I see no reason why this kid cannot break into the top-5 in dynasty RB rankings.

http://cbs.sportsline.com/nfl/story/9588675

Camp tour: Bucs banking Williams has a lot of miles in the chassis

Pete Prisco Aug. 6, 2006

By Pete Prisco

CBS SportsLine.com Senior Writer

LAKE BUENA VISTA, Fla. -- The nickname, though it has stuck since he was in the 11th grade, doesn't fit. Watch Carnell Williams take a swing pass, plant his foot in the ground and explode out of his cut to make a series of defenders miss, and the last thing that comes to mind is a big, powerful car. "Cadillac," which is what his teammates and fans call him, doesn't seem to work.

Even Williams, the dynamic second-year running back for the Tampa Bay Buccaneers, admits the name really doesn't describe his style.

"I'm not a Cadillac," Williams said during a break from Bucs training camp Saturday. "A Cadillac is smooth, big and not fast. I'm more of a Porsche. The name is great, and it has stuck and I'm cool with it, but I'm more like a Porsche because of my speed."

Carnell "Porsche" Williams? Doesn't quite work, either, but you get the idea. At 215 pounds, he is far more of a speed back, a player who can make a defender look silly grabbing for air rather than a plodder who might run over a tackler or two.

It's his size -- he's 5-feet-11 -- that has some worried that Williams might not be able to hold up for the long haul. He burst onto the NFL scene last season as a first-round pick with the idea that he could turn the team's woeful running game around.

In his first three games, he rushed for 434 yards, becoming the first rookie to have three consecutive 100-yard games to open a season. He was the talk of the league, his shoes and gloves from his third game going to the Pro Football Hall of Fame. But then he hurt the arch in his right foot, an injury that had all those doubters whispering the same tune:

We knew he'd break down. The kid isn't big enough.

Williams played out the season, rushing for 1,178 yards to lead all rookies. But the doubters all had their ammunition to fire away: He missed two games and was limited in others. This is what many predicted.

In talking with a defender from another team this summer, he mentioned Williams as a guy he predicts will break down over time, and that the NFL will take a toll on his smaller body.

"He's not big enough," the player said.

Williams laughed when told about that. In fact, he's used to that kind of talk now, and the reality is that he's plenty big for what the Bucs ask him to do. He isn't about to become another Earl Campbell, a guy whose career was shortened by an inordinate number of carries early in his career.

"It motivated me coming into the draft," Williams said. "I heard it then. Guys said I was a smaller back. If you go back and check out the great backs, they weren't big. They were 210 to 215 pounds. Emmitt Smith, Barry Sanders. They weren't big. So the guys who keep saying that type of thing about my size, all that does is keep me motivated to be one of the greats. It keeps me grinding."

At Auburn, Williams was the shifty one, while Ronnie Brown was the bigger, power back. Williams was the more productive of the two with the Tigers, but it was Brown who was taken with the third overall pick by the Miami Dolphins. Williams went fifth to the Bucs.

The two friends then made a wager on who would have the most yards as a rookie.

The smaller, shiftier back won again.

"He had to buy a few dinners here and there during the offseason," Williams said. "But he said he didn't get as many carries because Ricky Williams was there. Now it's fair game. May the best man win."

Don't bet against Williams. Watching him run during the team's training camp here, he appears far more confident in what he's doing. Rather than thinking, he's reacting. And when he reacts, tacklers miss.

He also has that innate ability to pop into a group of defenders and somehow pop out to turn a short gain into a big one. That you can't teach.

"I get into a pile and the first crack I see, I hit," Williams said. "And then I'm gone."

He described his running style as slashing but also quickly noted he isn't about to back away from contact.

"I'm looking to hit you before you hit me," Williams said. "I'm a combination of all things."

Bucs coach Jon Gruden dispels the notion that Williams isn't big enough, pointing to other smaller backs who have had great success.

"How big is Tiki Barber?" Gruden said. "Everybody keeps telling me that he's (Williams) too small. Curtis Martin has done it for 15 years. Is he too small? We're going to be smart with Cadillac. We're not going to hand him the ball every play. We're not going to go out of our way to overwork him. But he's plenty big. His running in the fourth quarter of games should be plenty of an answer for those critics."

The quarter breakdown wasn't available, but, according to Stats Inc., Williams ran for 665 yards in the second half of games, compared to 513 in the first. He had a per-carry average of 4.8 in the second half, compared to 3.4 in the first. All of it shows that he seems to get stronger as the game rolls along.

To help make sure he stays on the field, Williams took a trip to Oregon this summer to have the folks at Nike custom make a shoe for him. Last year, he wore a pair off the shelf. So after experiencing the foot troubles, he decided to go with his own shoe. They arrived last week, and so far Williams loves them.

"They molded a cleat to my foot," Williams said. "It feels a whole lot better. I think it will be a big plus for me."

The Cadillac has new tires. That should make him faster and better, which is scary.

Maybe by December the nickname of Porsche will be the better after all.

Carnell "Porsche" Williams? It doesn't have the ring to it, but the reality is Williams is far more sports car than luxury sedan.

The question now is how many miles can the Bucs put on him?
I just absolutely love this kid in dynasty drafts.He was my pick of the litter last year (with R. Brown a close second and Cedric Benson not even on the map), and I loved every minute of watching him.

Man, this season cannot start soon enough...
There is no doubt that he has the potential to be a top 5 back. We have to wait about 6 months though to find out. :) I have him and Jackson battling for my #2 (behind Tiki) and while I believe early on S Jax will be better, Caddy will have the better year.

Tom

 
Sonny Lubick Blowup Doll said:
Bailiver said:
Fullback Fro said:
Lack of Receptions will hurt his value in PPR Leagues.
Yep. Cadillac "Hands of Stone" Williams.
I think you mean "Pietros del Mano". This IS America, remember.
I'm pretty sure that translates to "Peters of the hand". Which is pretty funny, but prolly not what you meant. Manos de Piedra = Hands of Stone. hth.Also...

Caddy :wub:

He is RB 7 in my projections (no ppr).

 
Fullback Fro said:
Lack of Receptions will hurt his value in PPR Leagues.
His is an excellent receiver but was not used as much in the passing game last year as he should have been. all indications from camps and from Gruden are that they plan to use him more in the passing game. This will boost his numbers big time in PPR leagues.Sleep on him at your own risk kids.
Talk is Talk. Let him proove it first one year before I waste 1.5 on him. I'm not arguing that the potential is not there just that there are other guys who less risky with similar upside.
That's just it, I don't think guys like Rudi Johnson have the same upside.
Steven JacksonRonnie BrownEdgerrin James Brian Westbrook All these guys have proven that they are vital to their teams passing games and are less risky while offering similar upside.
Ronnie Brown played half as much as Cadillac last year, but you're going to tell me he is more proven in some way? I've got to disagree.We also know nothing about what Edge will be like in AZ. And Westbrook? Over Cadillac? :no:
 
He's in a well run WCO. Think Green Bay with Ahman Green....Settle got a guy...Westbrook....Denver.... He'll probably be top 5.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
#@%&$!? said:
doughboydeluxe said:
So who is it... the Big Old Stone or Cadillac?
I like Ronnie's chances of cracking the top 5 a bit more than Caddy's:1) Miami has an easier run schedule.2) Miami's offense should be better than TB, which means more scoring opportunities.3) Miami has a better O line, under Houck.4) Ronnie should be featured in all situations, whereas Caddy may give way to Pittman on some 3d downs and Alstott on goalines.
You're 0-4 in baseless assumptions, chief.Otis, Cadillac is also my RB5, but behind Barber. (LJ, Portis, LT, Barber, Cadillac)
 
Last edited:
#@%&$!? said:
doughboydeluxe said:
So who is it... the Big Old Stone or Cadillac?
I like Ronnie's chances of cracking the top 5 a bit more than Caddy's:1) Miami has an easier run schedule.2) Miami's offense should be better than TB, which means more scoring opportunities.3) Miami has a better O line, under Houck.4) Ronnie should be featured in all situations, whereas Caddy may give way to Pittman on some 3d downs and Alstott on goalines.
You're 0-4 in baseless assumptions, chief.Otis, Cadillac is also my RB5, but behind Barber. (LJ, Portis, LT, Barber, Cadillac)
I could comfortbaly put him ahead of Alexander, and I like that you did so too.Bravo. :thumbup:
 
Carnell Williams has an injury red flag to me. Not only that, but he worked inferior defenses for his numbers as a rookie, this schedule is the hardest in the NFL.

 
#@%&$!? said:
doughboydeluxe said:
So who is it... the Big Old Stone or Cadillac?
I like Ronnie's chances of cracking the top 5 a bit more than Caddy's:1) Miami has an easier run schedule.

2) Miami's offense should be better than TB, which means more scoring opportunities.

3) Miami has a better O line, under Houck.

4) Ronnie should be featured in all situations, whereas Caddy may give way to Pittman on some 3d downs and Alstott on goalines.
You're 0-4 in baseless assumptions, chief.Otis, Cadillac is also my RB5, but behind Barber. (LJ, Portis, LT, Barber, Cadillac)
1) http://www.footballguys.com/06sos_rb_v01.htm2) http://subscribers.footballguys.com/2006/currentproj-tam.php http://subscribers.footballguys.com/2006/currentproj-mia.php

3) http://subscribers.footballguys.com/2006/O...subscribers.php

4) You can dig around the articles section yourself for support on this assumption.

These are assumptions, yes. That's how projections are made. Are they baseless? No. If there is anything you’d like to dispute or add, feel free. Smart ### one liners do not help your credibility in your ranking of caddy.

 
#@%&$!? said:
doughboydeluxe said:
So who is it... the Big Old Stone or Cadillac?
I like Ronnie's chances of cracking the top 5 a bit more than Caddy's:1) Miami has an easier run schedule.2) Miami's offense should be better than TB, which means more scoring opportunities.3) Miami has a better O line, under Houck.4) Ronnie should be featured in all situations, whereas Caddy may give way to Pittman on some 3d downs and Alstott on goalines.
You're 0-4 in baseless assumptions, chief.Otis, Cadillac is also my RB5, but behind Barber. (LJ, Portis, LT, Barber, Cadillac)
I could comfortbaly put him ahead of Alexander, and I like that you did so too.Bravo. :thumbup:
Thats just foolish. Get real
 
#@%&$!? said:
doughboydeluxe said:
So who is it... the Big Old Stone or Cadillac?
I like Ronnie's chances of cracking the top 5 a bit more than Caddy's:1) Miami has an easier run schedule.

2) Miami's offense should be better than TB, which means more scoring opportunities.

3) Miami has a better O line, under Houck.

4) Ronnie should be featured in all situations, whereas Caddy may give way to Pittman on some 3d downs and Alstott on goalines.
You're 0-4 in baseless assumptions, chief.Otis, Cadillac is also my RB5, but behind Barber. (LJ, Portis, LT, Barber, Cadillac)
1) http://www.footballguys.com/06sos_rb_v01.htm2) http://subscribers.footballguys.com/2006/currentproj-tam.php http://subscribers.footballguys.com/2006/currentproj-mia.php

3) http://subscribers.footballguys.com/2006/O...subscribers.php

4) You can dig around the articles section yourself for support on this assumption.

These are assumptions, yes. That's how projections are made. Are they baseless? No. If there is anything you’d like to dispute or add, feel free. Smart ### one liners do not help your credibility in your ranking of caddy.
I don't subscribe to FBGs, as I am capable of making my own projections, thanks.and "smart ### one liners" is my line, you thief.

I just get sick of having to continually refute these misconceptions about how Miami's offense is going to wow everyone when it's below average at best. People are picking them over NE in the East, and I am not sold they can beat out the Jets for 2nd.

If you base your predictions on faulty premises, that doesn't make them legitimate.

TB's run-blocking OL is right up there with best in the league. That said, their pass-blocking has been underwhelming, to say the least. This year looks like they've made some great strides and are in line for another quantum leap.

Have you watched MIA's TC or read reports at all? Because from what I gather, 1) Culpepper still can't scramble, 2) Brown still doesn't outrun defenders, 3) Chambers still can't catch, 4) OL is already banged up.

On the contrary, TB's O looks like vintage Gruden. They might have the most complete WR corps in the NFL. The OL looks very solid, and Cadillac has been running at 400mph.

As to your final incorrect assumption, there's a reason that Pittman is trying to get involved in special teams, Alstott wanted to retire (then changed his mind), and Saban is actively pursuing another back, and it's not because Brown is going to be featured in all situations and Cadillac is going to be pulled out of 3rd downs and short yardage.

Again, think what you want, but the more you trust stats over watching football with your own eyes, the less you will win in FF. Cadillac is a much better running back, is much more durable in games, is not an injury risk, is a premier short-yardage back, and a full-load back.

I would take last year's TB offense over this year's MIA offense in a heartbeat. And while TB's has very obviously improved (as evidenced in camp), MIA's looks to have only improved on paper and in Madden '07.

 
Last edited:
#@%&$!? said:
doughboydeluxe said:
So who is it... the Big Old Stone or Cadillac?
I like Ronnie's chances of cracking the top 5 a bit more than Caddy's:1) Miami has an easier run schedule.

2) Miami's offense should be better than TB, which means more scoring opportunities.

3) Miami has a better O line, under Houck.

4) Ronnie should be featured in all situations, whereas Caddy may give way to Pittman on some 3d downs and Alstott on goalines.
You're 0-4 in baseless assumptions, chief.Otis, Cadillac is also my RB5, but behind Barber. (LJ, Portis, LT, Barber, Cadillac)
1) http://www.footballguys.com/06sos_rb_v01.htm2) http://subscribers.footballguys.com/2006/currentproj-tam.php http://subscribers.footballguys.com/2006/currentproj-mia.php

3) http://subscribers.footballguys.com/2006/O...subscribers.php

4) You can dig around the articles section yourself for support on this assumption.

These are assumptions, yes. That's how projections are made. Are they baseless? No. If there is anything you’d like to dispute or add, feel free. Smart ### one liners do not help your credibility in your ranking of caddy.
I don't subscribe to FBGs, as I am capable of making my own projections, thanks.and "smart ### one liners" is my line, you thief.

I just get sick of having to continually refute these misconceptions about how Miami's offense is going to wow everyone when it's below average at best. People are picking them over NE in the East, and I am not sold they can beat out the Jets for 2nd.

If you base your predictions on faulty premises, that doesn't make them legitimate.

TB's run-blocking OL is right up there with best in the league. That said, their pass-blocking has been underwhelming, to say the least. This year looks like they've made some great strides and are in line for another quantum leap.

Have you watched MIA's TC or read reports at all? Because from what I gather, 1) Culpepper still can't scramble, 2) Brown still doesn't outrun defenders, 3) Chambers still can't catch, 4) OL is already banged up.

On the contrary, TB's O looks like vintage Gruden. They might have the most complete WR corps in the NFL. The OL looks very solid, and Cadillac has been running at 400mph.

As to your final incorrect assumption, there's a reason that Pittman is trying to get involved in special teams, Alstott wanted to retire (then changed his mind), and Saban is actively pursuing another back, and it's not because Brown is going to be featured in all situations and Cadillac is going to be pulled out of 3rd downs and short yardage.

Again, think what you want, but the more you trust stats over watching football with your own eyes, the less you will win in FF. Cadillac is a much better running back, is much more durable in games, is not an injury risk, is a premier short-yardage back, and a full-load back.

I would take last year's TB offense over this year's MIA offense in a heartbeat. And while TB's has very obviously improved (as evidenced in camp), MIA's looks to have only improved on paper and in Madden '07.
Couple of really stupid comments hereThe one about the Tampa receiving corps and the one about Caddy not being an injury risk. Where the hell were you last year?

 
Couple of really stupid comments hereThe one about the Tampa receiving corps and the one about Caddy not being an injury risk. Where the hell were you last year?
KI was in Tampa, working with the Bucs.
 
Last edited:
Fullback Fro said:
Lack of Receptions will hurt his value in PPR Leagues.
His is an excellent receiver but was not used as much in the passing game last year as he should have been. all indications from camps and from Gruden are that they plan to use him more in the passing game. This will boost his numbers big time in PPR leagues.Sleep on him at your own risk kids.
I am a HUGE Buc fan and love Caddy, but he is not a good receiver. Link

RB Cadillac Williams, who caught only 20 passes for 81 yards as a rookie, dropped two balls yesterday, including a simple swing pass out of the backfield.
 
Fullback Fro said:
Lack of Receptions will hurt his value in PPR Leagues.
His is an excellent receiver but was not used as much in the passing game last year as he should have been. all indications from camps and from Gruden are that they plan to use him more in the passing game. This will boost his numbers big time in PPR leagues.Sleep on him at your own risk kids.
I am a HUGE Buc fan and love Caddy, but he is not a good receiver. Link

RB Cadillac Williams, who caught only 20 passes for 81 yards as a rookie, dropped two balls yesterday, including a simple swing pass out of the backfield.
He has been working all offseason on it, and just needs more practice. He may not have made as big of steps as some would like, but he looks head and shoulders (and hands) better than he did last year.Plus, he is out there catching hundreds of balls from all different directions in camp, and so dropping a few is to be expected.

While I haven't been flattened by his receiving skills in camp thusfar, he is certainly getting there.

 
who would you guys rather have, Caddy or Bush in a new dynasty league? I've seen Caddy go around 1.8 in most new dynasty leagues, and Bush go later 1st or early 2nd. But with 1 pt per reception, and Caddy having "stone hands" wouldn't Bush be just as good an option, but with more upside?

 
who would you guys rather have, Caddy or Bush in a new dynasty league? I've seen Caddy go around 1.8 in most new dynasty leagues, and Bush go later 1st or early 2nd. But with 1 pt per reception, and Caddy having "stone hands" wouldn't Bush be just as good an option, but with more upside?
Bush
 
#@%&$!? said:
doughboydeluxe said:
So who is it... the Big Old Stone or Cadillac?
I like Ronnie's chances of cracking the top 5 a bit more than Caddy's:1) Miami has an easier run schedule.

2) Miami's offense should be better than TB, which means more scoring opportunities.

3) Miami has a better O line, under Houck.

4) Ronnie should be featured in all situations, whereas Caddy may give way to Pittman on some 3d downs and Alstott on goalines.
You're 0-4 in baseless assumptions, chief.Otis, Cadillac is also my RB5, but behind Barber. (LJ, Portis, LT, Barber, Cadillac)
1) http://www.footballguys.com/06sos_rb_v01.htm2) http://subscribers.footballguys.com/2006/currentproj-tam.php http://subscribers.footballguys.com/2006/currentproj-mia.php

3) http://subscribers.footballguys.com/2006/O...subscribers.php

4) You can dig around the articles section yourself for support on this assumption.

These are assumptions, yes. That's how projections are made. Are they baseless? No. If there is anything you’d like to dispute or add, feel free. Smart ### one liners do not help your credibility in your ranking of caddy.
I don't subscribe to FBGs, as I am capable of making my own projections, thanks.and "smart ### one liners" is my line, you thief.

I just get sick of having to continually refute these misconceptions about how Miami's offense is going to wow everyone when it's below average at best. People are picking them over NE in the East, and I am not sold they can beat out the Jets for 2nd.

If you base your predictions on faulty premises, that doesn't make them legitimate.

TB's run-blocking OL is right up there with best in the league. That said, their pass-blocking has been underwhelming, to say the least. This year looks like they've made some great strides and are in line for another quantum leap.

Have you watched MIA's TC or read reports at all? Because from what I gather, 1) Culpepper still can't scramble, 2) Brown still doesn't outrun defenders, 3) Chambers still can't catch, 4) OL is already banged up.

On the contrary, TB's O looks like vintage Gruden. They might have the most complete WR corps in the NFL. The OL looks very solid, and Cadillac has been running at 400mph.

As to your final incorrect assumption, there's a reason that Pittman is trying to get involved in special teams, Alstott wanted to retire (then changed his mind), and Saban is actively pursuing another back, and it's not because Brown is going to be featured in all situations and Cadillac is going to be pulled out of 3rd downs and short yardage.

Again, think what you want, but the more you trust stats over watching football with your own eyes, the less you will win in FF. Cadillac is a much better running back, is much more durable in games, is not an injury risk, is a premier short-yardage back, and a full-load back.

I would take last year's TB offense over this year's MIA offense in a heartbeat. And while TB's has very obviously improved (as evidenced in camp), MIA's looks to have only improved on paper and in Madden '07.
Footbal Outsiders also does a pretty good analysis of O lines for this upcoming year. Miami is ranked pretty far ahead of the TB unit. Being a Caddy owner, I remember seeing the TB line struggle against the better D's. And I'm not saying Miami's offense will be top 5. I'm saying they should be more productive than the TB O.

 
#@%&$!? said:
doughboydeluxe said:
So who is it... the Big Old Stone or Cadillac?
I like Ronnie's chances of cracking the top 5 a bit more than Caddy's:1) Miami has an easier run schedule.2) Miami's offense should be better than TB, which means more scoring opportunities.3) Miami has a better O line, under Houck.4) Ronnie should be featured in all situations, whereas Caddy may give way to Pittman on some 3d downs and Alstott on goalines.
You're 0-4 in baseless assumptions, chief.Otis, Cadillac is also my RB5, but behind Barber. (LJ, Portis, LT, Barber, Cadillac)
So your telling me if Shaun Alexander was on the board, you would take Caddy in front of him?
 
#@%&$!? said:
doughboydeluxe said:
So who is it... the Big Old Stone or Cadillac?
I like Ronnie's chances of cracking the top 5 a bit more than Caddy's:1) Miami has an easier run schedule.2) Miami's offense should be better than TB, which means more scoring opportunities.3) Miami has a better O line, under Houck.4) Ronnie should be featured in all situations, whereas Caddy may give way to Pittman on some 3d downs and Alstott on goalines.
You're 0-4 in baseless assumptions, chief.Otis, Cadillac is also my RB5, but behind Barber. (LJ, Portis, LT, Barber, Cadillac)
I could comfortbaly put him ahead of Alexander, and I like that you did so too.Bravo. :thumbup:
Thats just foolish. Get real
:goodposting:
 
#@%&$!? said:
doughboydeluxe said:
So who is it... the Big Old Stone or Cadillac?
I like Ronnie's chances of cracking the top 5 a bit more than Caddy's:1) Miami has an easier run schedule.

2) Miami's offense should be better than TB, which means more scoring opportunities.

3) Miami has a better O line, under Houck.

4) Ronnie should be featured in all situations, whereas Caddy may give way to Pittman on some 3d downs and Alstott on goalines.
You're 0-4 in baseless assumptions, chief.Otis, Cadillac is also my RB5, but behind Barber. (LJ, Portis, LT, Barber, Cadillac)
So your telling me if Shaun Alexander was on the board, you would take Caddy in front of him?
:bag:
 
#@%&$!? said:
doughboydeluxe said:
So who is it... the Big Old Stone or Cadillac?
I like Ronnie's chances of cracking the top 5 a bit more than Caddy's:1) Miami has an easier run schedule.2) Miami's offense should be better than TB, which means more scoring opportunities.3) Miami has a better O line, under Houck.4) Ronnie should be featured in all situations, whereas Caddy may give way to Pittman on some 3d downs and Alstott on goalines.
You're 0-4 in baseless assumptions, chief.Otis, Cadillac is also my RB5, but behind Barber. (LJ, Portis, LT, Barber, Cadillac)
So your telling me if Shaun Alexander was on the board, you would take Caddy in front of him?
I at least consider it -- or I take Alexander, and then trade him to the Caddy owner to get some extra value.Yes, I would do this.
 
#@%&$!? said:
doughboydeluxe said:
So who is it... the Big Old Stone or Cadillac?
I like Ronnie's chances of cracking the top 5 a bit more than Caddy's:1) Miami has an easier run schedule.2) Miami's offense should be better than TB, which means more scoring opportunities.3) Miami has a better O line, under Houck.4) Ronnie should be featured in all situations, whereas Caddy may give way to Pittman on some 3d downs and Alstott on goalines.
You're 0-4 in baseless assumptions, chief.Otis, Cadillac is also my RB5, but behind Barber. (LJ, Portis, LT, Barber, Cadillac)
So your telling me if Shaun Alexander was on the board, you would take Caddy in front of him?
I at least consider it -- or I take Alexander, and then trade him to the Caddy owner to get some extra value.Yes, I would do this.
That said, SA doesn't drop anyway, so it doesn't matter.
 
#@%&$!? said:
doughboydeluxe said:
So who is it... the Big Old Stone or Cadillac?
I like Ronnie's chances of cracking the top 5 a bit more than Caddy's:1) Miami has an easier run schedule.2) Miami's offense should be better than TB, which means more scoring opportunities.3) Miami has a better O line, under Houck.4) Ronnie should be featured in all situations, whereas Caddy may give way to Pittman on some 3d downs and Alstott on goalines.
You're 0-4 in baseless assumptions, chief.Otis, Cadillac is also my RB5, but behind Barber. (LJ, Portis, LT, Barber, Cadillac)
So your telling me if Shaun Alexander was on the board, you would take Caddy in front of him?
I at least consider it -- or I take Alexander, and then trade him to the Caddy owner to get some extra value.Yes, I would do this.
That said, SA doesn't drop anyway, so it doesn't matter.
You know why he doesn't drop.......cause he's really good.He's never gotten injured, like Caddy.He scores all rushing tds, unlike Caddy.He plays in a week division, unlike Caddy.This guy can handle all the hits of a NFL schedule.....UNLIKE CADDY.I don't think Alexander will have a year like last due to 1) superbowl hangover2) losing Hutchinson3) and of course the Madden cursethat being said I'll still take him no later than #4. I might sneek Portis infront of him but that would be it.
 
#@%&$!? said:
doughboydeluxe said:
So who is it... the Big Old Stone or Cadillac?
I like Ronnie's chances of cracking the top 5 a bit more than Caddy's:1) Miami has an easier run schedule.2) Miami's offense should be better than TB, which means more scoring opportunities.3) Miami has a better O line, under Houck.4) Ronnie should be featured in all situations, whereas Caddy may give way to Pittman on some 3d downs and Alstott on goalines.
You're 0-4 in baseless assumptions, chief.Otis, Cadillac is also my RB5, but behind Barber. (LJ, Portis, LT, Barber, Cadillac)
So your telling me if Shaun Alexander was on the board, you would take Caddy in front of him?
I at least consider it -- or I take Alexander, and then trade him to the Caddy owner to get some extra value.Yes, I would do this.
That said, SA doesn't drop anyway, so it doesn't matter.
You know why he doesn't drop.......cause he's really good.He's never gotten injured, like Caddy.He scores all rushing tds, unlike Caddy.He plays in a week division, unlike Caddy.This guy can handle all the hits of a NFL schedule.....UNLIKE CADDY.I don't think Alexander will have a year like last due to 1) superbowl hangover2) losing Hutchinson3) and of course the Madden cursethat being said I'll still take him no later than #4. I might sneek Portis infront of him but that would be it.
I'll take Caddy's rookie season over SA's. If Caddy improves the way that Alexander has, he'll be a force. SA had 430 carries between the regular and post seasons. We'll see how well he can "handle all the hits" the season after. Recent history seems to point to Alexander having a significant drop in production. I'd prefer not to take the other side of that bet.
 
Couple of really stupid comments here

The one about the Tampa receiving corps and the one about Caddy not being an injury risk. Where the hell were you last year?
KI was in Tampa, working with the Bucs.
This may have something to do w/ your optimism...Could Caddy finish top 5? Sure.

There's always a about 50% change in the guard @ the top.

But, he'll need a lot of improvement and help from the line and Simms to sniff elite status. I just don't see it happening w/ ~ the 25th worst rushing SOS in 06.

And taking him over a guy that had 27 rush tds and around 1800 yards is :shock:

 
Cadillac Williams had plenty of touches as a rookie. Now the Bucs want to give him more via the passing game.

By RICK STROUD, Times Staff Writer

Published August 6, 2006

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

LAKE BUENA VISTA

Turns out the Bucs really didn't know how much to give the ball to Cadillac Williams.

Not last year, when he set an NFL rookie rushing record in the first three weeks.

Not when he blew out a wheel and missed two games with a mysterious foot injury, later blamed on his shoes.

Not when they had to take him out on third down because he was either gassed or no factor in the passing game.

In a rare admission of guilt, the Bucs say they misused Williams.

It won't happen again.

"We'd like to get him more involved in the passing game," coach Jon Gruden said. "We'll try to get him the ball a little bit more than we did a year ago.

"He might carry the ball 500 times. I don't know."

It's hard to imagine a better season for Williams, who was named NFL offensive rookie of the year after he rushed for 1,178 yards in 14 games in 2005. That performance included a league-record 434 yards in the first three games.

But what numbers would Williams have racked up if he had stayed healthy?

Not only did he miss two games with a foot injury, he failed to rush for more than 29 yards in five others.

"That's my No. 1 goal, to play all 16 games," said the 5-foot-11, 217-pound Williams. "Stay healthy of course. But we are playing with physical contact. It is what it is. But I feel great about this season.

"I do feel I'm better. I am cutting and sprinting better. I just feel a lot swifter this year. I know that might be because I feel better confidence. I feel like I am going to dominate."

Williams wants to be known as a complete back, which means he must improve as a receiver.

He came out of Auburn with a rap for having bad hands. The Bucs did little to dispel that, completing just 20 passes to him for 81 yards.

"He's one of those guys who wants to be good at everything. He doesn't just want to be known as a runner or a receiver," running backs coach Art Valero said. "He wants to be good at everything."

That's why this offseason, Williams worked hard on his route running and pass protection. Although he is prone to drop a pass or two in practice, the Bucs would like to get him isolated on a linebacker or safety in coverage.

Quarterback Chris Simms says he sees the improvement in Williams every day.

"There's nothing that I see that wouldn't make me predict a better year than last year for Cadillac," Simms said.

Williams admits he is more relaxed and has a better understanding of the offense.

"For me, it's actually a big difference," Williams, 24, said. "Because last year coming in here, I was unsure about a lot of things. I didn't know how much I was going to play, when I was going to play and trying to prove to guys that I'm a capable back to play here. I was trying to win over my teammates and coaches. Last year, I had a successful year. I could just build on that coming into camp this year. It's just concentrating on football and getting better."

Valero said linebacker Derrick Brooks introduced Williams to the film room last season.

"Cadillac would come in and eat breakfast and then go over to the team meeting," Valero said. "Derrick pulled him aside and told him, 'You're playing on ability alone.' He said every day you need to ask Art to get on the (chalkboard). So from that point on, he spends breakfast with me. Tuesdays we talk about run fits. Here's the defense's looks. Here's what their formations are going to be. On Wednesday he comes in and we do all protection work. On Thursdays, we'd watch individual linebackers pass rush and determine what we wanted to key."

Valero said this offseason he made DVDs of all the runs by the Giants' Tiki Barber, Seattle's Shaun Alexander and San Diego's LaDainian Tomlinson for Williams to study.

What can Williams do for an encore to his record-breaking season?

"Well, he can stay healthy and go wire to wire for 16 games," Gruden said. "That's what Emmitt Smith did. That's what the great backs in this league do. I think he understands that. He had an unfortunate injury.

"I think the injury he had wasn't because of the pounding. It was a simple foot problem that maybe slow wear had something to do with. But the guy is built for the game. He's built to be a running back. And if you check what he did in the fourth quarter, I think it speaks for itself."

Gruden is right. Williams rushed for 449 yards and four touchdowns in the fourth quarter last season.

The Bucs believe he will get stronger as his career gets longer, too.

What's the reviews of the 2006 Cadillac?

"I think it's a new, improved model," Simms said.

 
#@%&$!? said:
doughboydeluxe said:
So who is it... the Big Old Stone or Cadillac?
I like Ronnie's chances of cracking the top 5 a bit more than Caddy's:1) Miami has an easier run schedule.2) Miami's offense should be better than TB, which means more scoring opportunities.3) Miami has a better O line, under Houck.4) Ronnie should be featured in all situations, whereas Caddy may give way to Pittman on some 3d downs and Alstott on goalines.
5) Ronnie is bigger, stronger and faster. 6) Ronnie is durable.
 
Fullback Fro said:
Lack of Receptions will hurt his value in PPR Leagues.
His is an excellent receiver but was not used as much in the passing game last year as he should have been. all indications from camps and from Gruden are that they plan to use him more in the passing game. This will boost his numbers big time in PPR leagues.Sleep on him at your own risk kids.
Talk is Talk. Let him proove it first one year before I waste 1.5 on him. I'm not arguing that the potential is not there just that there are other guys who less risky with similar upside.
That's just it, I don't think guys like Rudi Johnson have the same upside.
Steven JacksonRonnie BrownEdgerrin James Brian Westbrook All these guys have proven that they are vital to their teams passing games and are less risky while offering similar upside.
Ronnie Brown played half as much as Cadillac last year, but you're going to tell me he is more proven in some way? I've got to disagree.We also know nothing about what Edge will be like in AZ. And Westbrook? Over Cadillac? :no:
Yeah I have a hard time with Ronnie Brown as a "proven" quantity in the pass game. Edge also goes to a new team and how the Cards will be this year is one of the biggest question marks in the NFL and in FF. That said i have Cadillac 5th on my list and I think he's gonna be a good one for awhile. Guy has the ability to wear down a defense and then break a 40 yarder. I feel much more comfortable with him also because he's going to play on a good team who loves to run the ball. Rams will be behind so much people better pray St Jackson is a "vital" part of the passing game. Otherwise he might have 6 carries for 7 yards.
 
#@%&$!? said:
doughboydeluxe said:
So who is it... the Big Old Stone or Cadillac?
I like Ronnie's chances of cracking the top 5 a bit more than Caddy's:1) Miami has an easier run schedule.2) Miami's offense should be better than TB, which means more scoring opportunities.3) Miami has a better O line, under Houck.4) Ronnie should be featured in all situations, whereas Caddy may give way to Pittman on some 3d downs and Alstott on goalines.
You're 0-4 in baseless assumptions, chief.Otis, Cadillac is also my RB5, but behind Barber. (LJ, Portis, LT, Barber, Cadillac)
So your telling me if Shaun Alexander was on the board, you would take Caddy in front of him?
I at least consider it -- or I take Alexander, and then trade him to the Caddy owner to get some extra value.Yes, I would do this.
That said, SA doesn't drop anyway, so it doesn't matter.
You know why he doesn't drop.......cause he's really good.He's never gotten injured, like Caddy.He scores all rushing tds, unlike Caddy.He plays in a week division, unlike Caddy.This guy can handle all the hits of a NFL schedule.....UNLIKE CADDY.I don't think Alexander will have a year like last due to 1) superbowl hangover2) losing Hutchinson3) and of course the Madden cursethat being said I'll still take him no later than #4. I might sneek Portis infront of him but that would be it.
I'll take Caddy's rookie season over SA's. If Caddy improves the way that Alexander has, he'll be a force. SA had 430 carries between the regular and post seasons. We'll see how well he can "handle all the hits" the season after. Recent history seems to point to Alexander having a significant drop in production. I'd prefer not to take the other side of that bet.
This is a ridiculious comment. I don't care about anyone's rookie season. I 'm asking who will have a better year this year. Anthony Thomas had a better rookie year than Cadillac...what does that mean...absolutely nothing. I don't know where you were going with that but it didn't make any sense to me. Now the carries on the other do make sense and it is a concern. Even with the carries from last year having an effect on him this year I would guarantee all you that say you rank SA out of the top 5 if he was there at 5 you'd grab him ahead of Caddy. You can say what you want but let's see what you would do at crunch time. He has avg. about 18 td's a year for the last 5 years. Caddy won't get half of that. And all though last year was a career high in rushes it was also a career low in catches. If you add his catches in the mix his touches have been about the same for the last five years as well. Now of course he did play longer in the playoffs as well so I guess thats is your point. The fact is SA has an good as chance as anyone to get hurt cannot be argued with but again WE CANNOT PREDICT INJURIES. I think some are too high on Caddy, way to high, and way to low on one of the best ff rb's of all time. Not a SA owner.
 
I'm high on Caddy's potential, but until I see for sure that he's an every down, every situation RB, I'm tempering my enthusiasm.

 

Users who are viewing this thread

Back
Top