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Can we at least admit that Palmer is an upgrade over Campbell? (1 Viewer)

LawFitz

LawFitz

Footballguy
I'm not sure of anything, especially of whether Palmer will prove to be worth two high picks, but at minimum this has to be considered an upgrade for the Oakland offense that could have fantasy ramifications very soon. If you believe in Hue Jackson, and are desperate for either QB or WR help, you might want to consider scooping and squatting on Palmer, DHB, Ford or Moore, as some or all of these four should be available in most leagues.

Under Hue Jackson, the Raiders have had a top ten NFL offense in yards and scoring, dating back to his hiring as play caller/OC before last season. He has done this with a boatload of Al Davis "busts" and has slowly replaced or developed each of them into a formidable group of talented and productive units at OL, RB and WR. The main weakness of the Raiders offense the last two seasons has been QB with Campbell and Gradkowski on the field. Palmer has to be better than those bums. If he is at or close to 100% healthy, Hue Jax could have just created a monster in Oakland.

Let that simmer for a bit after you're done laughing at the two picks the Raiders gave up. Who do you believe in more? Your eyes and perception as a couch potato GM while watching Palmer the last couple seasons in crappy Cincy or the eyes of the coach (and now interim GM) of a team that has been quietly and meaningfully on the rise since he joined them. Hue Jackson thought Palmer was worth two high draft picks. Not Al Davis. Hue Jackson. That alone should be worth the small gamble you might take to get some Raiders on your team for the stretch run THIS YEAR. Hue Jackson = Huge Action!!!

 
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"Can we at least admit that Palmer is an upgrade over Campbell?"

Not without seeing Palmer in action. The name does not produce results

"That much I think is going to be proven true"

Maybe....maybe not....let's see and not presume

 
Campbell seemed like a good fit for their offense. He limited turnovers and allowed their running game to fuel the offense.

 
'Captain Hook said:
"Can we at least admit that Palmer is an upgrade over Campbell?"

Not without seeing Palmer in action. The name does not produce results

"That much I think is going to be proven true"

Maybe....maybe not....let's see and not presume
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Well my faith in Jackson has me upgrading the Oakland offense now rather than later when it'll be much more expensive to get them. Today, the shock of the compensation has most people writing off this trade as a total joke. But I have a sneaky suspicion that Palmer was in Hue's plans all along if Campbell did not work out this year. That plan was just accelerated due to the collar bone injury. If Hue is right that Palmer is not done, this could be anywhere from a minor to a major upgrade at QB for an already very talented offense. Campbell was a game manager at best. Hue basically put his reputation and job on the line today with this trade and endorsement of Palmer as a dare I say it, franchize NFL QB.
 
'sports_fan said:
Campbell seemed like a good fit for their offense. He limited turnovers and allowed their running game to fuel the offense.
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The guy could not make downfield throws. Mostly a good decision maker and a nice guy, but not fiery at all and not confident in his own abilities. Long ball accuracy was pathetic for NFL standards; maybe that was the reason why he looked like he had all the tools to be a dynamic NFL QB, but instead played like captain checkdown. The Raiders want to be a downfield passing offense and JCamp couldn't do it. Palmer will be given the opportunity. You don't spend two high picks unless you have some fantastic aspirations for how a guy can impact your team.
 
'FavreCo said:
If you are driving a pinto, anything is an upgrade.
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I don't like this poster at all, but :goodposting: Campbell is a nice guy, but he couldn't take advantage of what the Raiders have, 3 WRs that all have great speed and can get deep. No way Palmer doesn't improve the 20+ yard completions. I see a nice bump for Moore, Ford, and DHB.
 
In general, I will assume Palmer is still better than Campbell.

However, I'm not sure its good for the Raiders team. From the little I know about them, I think they can get by best with a game manager who doesn't turn the ball over. Carson is far, far from that. He's something between a bad and horrible decision maker who used to, and sometimes still does, get away with it with arm strength.

ETA: For fantasy, its still probably good for Oak WRs regardless of what mistakes he makes.

 
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Palmer is a big upgrade over Campbell. No doubt about it. Campbell is a marginal talent at best. Palmer has a better resume and has had more success at the nfl level. I am betting he does well in oak, arm rested, supported by a solid running game, and speedy young talented wrs. Better than Campbell did.

 
Ive considered Campbell better than Noodle-arm since he came back from his injury. Hes just not the same, I hope hes been doing some work because if hes still as inaccurate as hes been the Raiders are in worse not better shape.

 
'Eastwood said:
'FavreCo said:
If you are driving a pinto, anything is an upgrade.
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I don't like this poster at all, but :goodposting: Campbell is a nice guy, but he couldn't take advantage of what the Raiders have, 3 WRs that all have great speed and can get deep. No way Palmer doesn't improve the 20+ yard completions. I see a nice bump for Moore, Ford, and DHB.
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Palmer wasn't able to effectively throw the deep ball his last few years at Cinci. Why would that change now that he's in Oak.? His arm just hasn't been the same since his injury. Palmer may in fact turn out to be better than Campbell, but I highly doubt that is the reason. His ability to read defenses and get rid of the ball will have to be the difference. Coming in off the street like he is, I don't know that it is all that realistic to expect huge things from him. None the less he is going to be better than what the Raiders have now that Campbell is out.
 
We can only wait and see. From the last I remember of Palmer he was really bad, I mean in the current McNabb bad category. I think he lost like 11 of his last 13, was inaccurate and ineffective at the worst possible times. This seems like a big gamble for sure. So, no, I cannot admit that Palmer is an upgrade over Campbell- who had the team at 4-2.

 
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I think Palmer is very intriguing from a dynasty standpoint as well. He probably has 4 or 5 years of production left in him, if he's at or close to full strength. Whether or not any of them develop into top WRs, the team certainly has a good deal of young athletic talent at the position. And this is a monstrous commitment, even for a QB. It could be misguided, but the organization (Jackson?) obviously has an extraordinary amount of confidence in Palmer.

I'd guess that he really doesn't have much of a ceiling or floor. He could be a spectacular bust that stays on the Raider lowlights for the next couple decades, or he could be the next Rich Gannon.

 
yes Palmer is an upgrade... but man the cost.

2012 Oakland draft picks...

1st rd belongs to Cin

2nd rd belongs to NE

3rd rd gave up for Pryer

4th rd belongs to Was

2013

1st rd belongs to Cin

crazy stuff

 
for FF MAYBE palmer is an upgrade. but like a poster above said, campbell fueled the rushing offense with limited mistakes and helped the team win. IIRC from last year:

palmer had a weak arm

palmer had accuracy problems often throwing behind ochocinco and TO

what sort of football shape is he in?

will he be able to hit Oaklands WRs down field? maybe a bunch of short stuff and dump offs to DMac. i'd upgrade him but wouldn't be so quick to jump on the palmer bandwagon. someone like painter or dalton may prove better in the second half of the season with more experience under their belt

 
He's stepping into a new team with no camp and no practice-time in week seven...I will be very impressed if he is game-ready anytime soon...this seems more like a baseball or hockey move where trade-deadline guys can make an impact right away...long-term he needs to be the answer at QB for a solid four or five years for this to be a productive trade...with their upcoming draft situation he really needs to be at the level he was at pre-injury for Oakland to become legit playoff contenders...

 
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'SacramentoBob said:
I imagine he would be since you're not setting the bar very high.
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Yep that's my sentiments, Campbell to me was a below average to badpassing QB, I firmly believe in whatever shape Palmer is in he willbe better then Campbell could have ever been.I think Campbell only looked halfway decent there was because of thetalent around him, everywhere else he sucked, Palmer should be better.
 
That question is irrelevant. The question should be is he an upgrade over Boller and/or Pryor. And that answer is absolutely. Run DMC is running lights out right now, so this organization needs to do whatever they can RIGHT NOW. You don't fold up the season with Boller or try to break in a rookie when you have a running back doing what he's doing. Those windows are too short. Palmer is the best QB available. They went and did what they had to to get him. Good for the Raiders.

That said, it remains to be seen if Palmer will be an upgrade over Campbell, but my hunch is that yes, he will be.

 
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'Apple Jack said:
That question is irrelevant.
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Not true at all. If Palmer is an upgrade over Campbell, that would imply a bump for all Raiders, especially Raider WR. And if somehow he is a significant upgrade, he could even prove to be one of those missing link type players that causes an already good offense to explode.
 
I'm not a Campbell fan but he managed games where Oakland got the W. Brand new QB to a new system that hasn't played in awhile can be a big gamble imo...

 
I don't know if Palmer will do really well, he might.

But Campbell has been a mediocre to bad QB his whole career,

so I gave the nod to Palmer being better pretty easily here.

 
'kegger said:
I don't know if Palmer will do really well, he might.But Campbell has been a mediocre to bad QB his whole career,so I gave the nod to Palmer being better pretty easily here.
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I have to agree with this. Campbell is the textbook definition of "average".Palmer is a bit more hit and miss. He has proven several times in the past that is capable of monster passing performances.He has also proven many times that he can be wholey inaccurate and throw a few picks at the worst time.So, bit more risk/reward, but I like the move for Oakland. Ballsy team!!Just hand it to DMAC ...........
 
I like the signing enough I picked him up in my ESPN league where

we play an AP category that most all use second QB. I'm hoping he

is an upgrade over Matt Cassel here down the road.

 
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'Bobtender said:
yes Palmer is an upgrade... but man the cost.2012 Oakland draft picks...1st rd belongs to Cin2nd rd belongs to NE3rd rd gave up for Pryer4th rd belongs to Was20131st rd belongs to Cincrazy stuff
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The Raiders should get compensatory picks for the loss of Nnamdi and Gallery probably a 3rd & a 4th or 5th.
 
'Bobtender said:
yes Palmer is an upgrade... but man the cost.

2012 Oakland draft picks...

1st rd belongs to Cin

2nd rd belongs to NE

3rd rd gave up for Pryer

4th rd belongs to Was

2013

1st rd belongs to Cin 2nd rd belongs to Cin

crazy stuff
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They have to make the final 4 for that pick to get upgraded to a 1st-rounder. That ain't happenin'.-QG

 
'QuizGuy66 said:
'Bobtender said:
yes Palmer is an upgrade... but man the cost.

2012 Oakland draft picks...

1st rd belongs to Cin

2nd rd belongs to NE

3rd rd gave up for Pryer

4th rd belongs to Was

2013

1st rd belongs to Cin 2nd rd belongs to Cin

crazy stuff
Click to expand...
They have to make the final 4 for that pick to get upgraded to a 1st-rounder. That ain't happenin'.-QG
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That would make it a horrible trade as the justification for making the move was to 'win now'.
 
I think he'll enjoy having WR's that respect him, will listen to him and run the right routes for the first time in a long time.

I think the trade will turn out to be a great success for the Raiders.

 
Wow. Tough Crowd. I like the move, and like Palmer. Oakland went all in and I'm hoping for the best for them. Also picked up one of their WR's just to hedge my bets--had the space.

 
who knows how this will turn out.

all i know is, the Carson Palmer of recent times has looked very mediocre to bad at times. he just doesnt seem to be the same guy who lit it up years ago.

maybe he can get it back????????

 
I think that Palmer is a definite upgrade over Campbell, he has always been the better QB; now if he is good enough for OAK to go to and win the Superbowl is another question. Besides some unanswered questions of rust, he is absolutely an upgrade over Campbell and should make everyone better for it; at least fantasy-wise.

 
'Short Corner said:
'fantasizing said:
'kegger said:
I don't know if Palmer will do really well, he might.But Campbell has been a mediocre to bad QB his whole career,so I gave the nod to Palmer being better pretty easily here.
Click to expand...
Just hand it to DMAC ...........
Click to expand...
Agree with this, which has me scratching my head as to why a team would give up two high picks and $45 million that could have been used to address other areas.
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Just hand it to DMac isn't gonna get them through the playoffs.
 
'SacramentoBob said:
'Short Corner said:
'fantasizing said:
'kegger said:
I don't know if Palmer will do really well, he might.But Campbell has been a mediocre to bad QB his whole career,so I gave the nod to Palmer being better pretty easily here.
Click to expand...
Just hand it to DMAC ...........
Click to expand...
Agree with this, which has me scratching my head as to why a team would give up two high picks and $45 million that could have been used to address other areas.
Click to expand...
Just hand it to DMac isn't gonna get them through the playoffs.
Click to expand...
It might.
 
'SacramentoBob said:
'Short Corner said:
'fantasizing said:
'kegger said:
I don't know if Palmer will do really well, he might.But Campbell has been a mediocre to bad QB his whole career,so I gave the nod to Palmer being better pretty easily here.
Click to expand...
Just hand it to DMAC ...........
Click to expand...
Agree with this, which has me scratching my head as to why a team would give up two high picks and $45 million that could have been used to address other areas.
Click to expand...
Just hand it to DMac isn't gonna get them through the playoffs.
Click to expand...
It won't get through Baltimore. I think it is enough to give them a shot at any of the other teams in the AFC,
 
'Short Corner said:
'SacramentoBob said:
'Short Corner said:
'fantasizing said:
'kegger said:
I don't know if Palmer will do really well, he might.But Campbell has been a mediocre to bad QB his whole career,so I gave the nod to Palmer being better pretty easily here.
Click to expand...
Just hand it to DMAC ...........
Click to expand...
Agree with this, which has me scratching my head as to why a team would give up two high picks and $45 million that could have been used to address other areas.
Click to expand...
Just hand it to DMac isn't gonna get them through the playoffs.
Click to expand...
It won't get through Baltimore. I think it is enough to give them a shot at any of the other teams in the AFC,
Click to expand...
Well, fortunately they have Carson Palmer and a very fast and competent WR corps, so they won't have to lean entirely on DMC. Palmer and Boss need to establish a relationship for this offense to reach it's potential. Maybe go bowling or take a trip to Vegas together on the bye week. If those two can a rhythm going, I think that's the wildcard that could propel this offense to elite status in the AFC.
 
'Apple Jack said:
'Short Corner said:
'SacramentoBob said:
'Short Corner said:
'fantasizing said:
'kegger said:
I don't know if Palmer will do really well, he might.But Campbell has been a mediocre to bad QB his whole career,so I gave the nod to Palmer being better pretty easily here.
Click to expand...
Just hand it to DMAC ...........
Click to expand...
Agree with this, which has me scratching my head as to why a team would give up two high picks and $45 million that could have been used to address other areas.
Click to expand...
Just hand it to DMac isn't gonna get them through the playoffs.
Click to expand...
It won't get through Baltimore. I think it is enough to give them a shot at any of the other teams in the AFC,
Click to expand...
Well, fortunately they have Carson Palmer and a very fast and competent WR corps, so they won't have to lean entirely on DMC. Palmer and Boss need to establish a relationship for this offense to reach it's potential. Maybe go bowling or take a trip to Vegas together on the bye week. If those two can a rhythm going, I think that's the wildcard that could propel this offense to elite status in the AFC.
Click to expand...
You need a top QB to win in this league in the current era. Trent Dilfer's Ravens are the rare exception. And it took an all time great D to make that happen. And even then, the Raiders might have beaten them if Gannon hadn't gotten hurt. The Raiders were winning despite zero downfield passing ability from Campbell. Palmer is a huge wildcard depending on how healthy and ready he really is. His presence could elevate this entire offense if he's able to make the intermediate to deep throws with accuracy. That's what I'll be looking for first to gauge his impact.
 
'LawFitz said:
You need a top QB to win in this league in the current era. Trent Dilfer's Ravens are the rare exception. And it took an all time great D to make that happen. And even then, the Raiders might have beaten them if Gannon hadn't gotten hurt.
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Tom Brady wasn't a top QB when he won his first Super Bowl. Neither was Eli Manning.
 
'CalBear said:
'LawFitz said:
You need a top QB to win in this league in the current era. Trent Dilfer's Ravens are the rare exception. And it took an all time great D to make that happen. And even then, the Raiders might have beaten them if Gannon hadn't gotten hurt.
Click to expand...
Tom Brady wasn't a top QB when he won his first Super Bowl. Neither was Eli Manning.
Click to expand...
Yes they were. You just didn't know it yet. And by top QB I mean top at that point in time. Guys who elevated their games during the playoff run count. 2nd year Big Ben is the only guy who serves as another recent exception, but he too had a tremendous defense for the first of his two rings.
 
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'LawFitz said:
'CalBear said:
'LawFitz said:
You need a top QB to win in this league in the current era. Trent Dilfer's Ravens are the rare exception. And it took an all time great D to make that happen. And even then, the Raiders might have beaten them if Gannon hadn't gotten hurt.
Click to expand...
Tom Brady wasn't a top QB when he won his first Super Bowl. Neither was Eli Manning.
Click to expand...
Yes they were. You just didn't know it yet. And by top QB I mean top at that point in time. Guys who elevated their games during the playoff run count. 2nd year Big Ben is the only guy who serves as another recent exception, but he too had a tremendous defense for the first of his two rings.
Click to expand...
Tom Brady threw for 145 yards in his 1st Super Bowl. They won because of an elite defense and cheating. Brady didn't carry anything.
 
'IHEARTFF said:
'LawFitz said:
'CalBear said:
'LawFitz said:
You need a top QB to win in this league in the current era. Trent Dilfer's Ravens are the rare exception. And it took an all time great D to make that happen. And even then, the Raiders might have beaten them if Gannon hadn't gotten hurt.
Click to expand...
Tom Brady wasn't a top QB when he won his first Super Bowl. Neither was Eli Manning.
Click to expand...
Yes they were. You just didn't know it yet. And by top QB I mean top at that point in time. Guys who elevated their games during the playoff run count. 2nd year Big Ben is the only guy who serves as another recent exception, but he too had a tremendous defense for the first of his two rings.
Click to expand...
Tom Brady threw for 145 yards in his 1st Super Bowl. They won because of an elite defense and cheating. Brady didn't carry anything.
Click to expand...
Not to mention a kicker who Belichick declared "the best player on the team."Answer to the thread title question is still an emphatic we'll see.
 
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