Can we discuss laws and impact on states without getting “politically”? New FL law requiring age verification for adult sites. (1 Viewer)

[General Malaise]

Teens have been using the dark web to buy fake ids and drugs for like 2 decades now. I'm sure a few southern governors will outfox them on accessing pornography.

 

[tymarsas]

Why isn't every liquor cabinet in every house in America required to have a combo lock or age verification?

Because it's the parent's house, the parent's children, and the parent's responsibility. That's why.

I'm not a tech guy, but maybe the fix to this is would be that adult sites can only be accessible through an app and not a website that one can get to easily. Then the app can only be downloaded by using some sort age verification like a drivers license. It's that possible or is the bell already rung?

This is not a bad idea. This is how biometrics verification works already. Your fingerprint/face id are stored in the phone itself and not passed to apps that use it. Apple/Google could easily extend that to include age verification. It would be way better than having to upload your ID to a bunch of random websites. It wouldn't be hard to extend to websites either. It'd be similar to multi-factor authentication.

 

[NewlyRetired]

and in this realm, I know we older people think kids are all tech wizards. They are not. They know how to use Snapchat, filter and edit pictures for IG, have a sick run on Subway Surfers but most don't have a clue what a VPN is yet alone how to use one.

You are correct that the vast majority of kids don't know what or how to use a VPN.

You are incorrect to think it takes being a tech wizard to use a VPN. Using Snapchat and editing pictures (something they also had no idea how to do originally) is FAR FAR more difficult than using a VPN.

All you need is one single kid to know what to do and it will spread like wild fire to his friends and then their friends. It literally is one free download and a maybe two clicks to choose your zone and that is it. Kids will be able to teach other kids in less than 1 minute.

 

[Ilov80s]

Kids will never figure out a way around this. Just like they’re stumped on how to buy booze and weed.

VPN companies are standing by

VPNs are essentially free, right? What's the revenue model for a VPN company?

and in this realm, I know we older people think kids are all tech wizards. They are not. They know how to use Snapchat, filter and edit pictures for IG, have a sick run on Subway Surfers but most don't have a clue what a VPN is yet alone how to use one.

If a free piece of software is all that's needed for a horny teenager to crack the barrier to unlimited pr0n, you really think this will stump them? Kids have been circumventing adult imposed limits since the world started spinning.

Many will but if this barrier can perhaps do a few of the following

• push back the age kids might start encounter porn
• prevent some kids who aren't relentlessly committed to finding porn from "stumbling upon it"
• put some minor consequences in place for kids who circumvent the rules
• initiate conversations in homes about the legality of this

I know kids circumvent adult rules but if I had kids, I would still set rules for them.

 

[Ilov80s]

Kids will never figure out a way around this. Just like they’re stumped on how to buy booze and weed.

VPN companies are standing by

VPNs are essentially free, right? What's the revenue model for a VPN company?

and in this realm, I know we older people think kids are all tech wizards. They are not. They know how to use Snapchat, filter and edit pictures for IG, have a sick run on Subway Surfers but most don't have a clue what a VPN is yet alone how to use one.

Yes they do. Or at least the ones I know

I know many do. Many don't. I know thousands of kids. Most aren't actually very tech savy. But yes there are many kids who do a lot of gaming who know about VPNs and could easily figure this out. And admittedly, they are also likely to strongly correlate with the kids looking at a ton of porn.

 

[Ilov80s]

and in this realm, I know we older people think kids are all tech wizards. They are not. They know how to use Snapchat, filter and edit pictures for IG, have a sick run on Subway Surfers but most don't have a clue what a VPN is yet alone how to use one.

You are correct that the vast majority of kids don't know what or how to use a VPN.

You are incorrect to think it takes being a tech wizard to use a VPN. Using Snapchat and editing pictures (something they also had no idea how to do originally) is FAR FAR more difficult than using a VPN.

All you need is one single kid to know what to do and it will spread like wild fire to his friends and then their friends. It literally is one free download and a maybe two clicks to choose your zone and that is it. Kids will be able to teach other kids in less than 1 minute.

Yeah for sure. This is true. So I guess the idea is if the adult content is behind a password/log-in the the US, they could use the VPN to appear to be from Canada and access it without restriction. Put age restrictions on VPNs then. Only allow adults to be able to download them. Or is that very unreasonable?

Also I don't have an answer or a firm opinion on what needs to be done. Just having a conversation.

 

[Ilov80s]

I think a benefit of laws like these even if they are almost impossible to enforce is forcing a conversation both Nationally and in homes. I don't know, but I wonder how many homes is this something parents are ever discussing with their kids? Are parents monitoring their kids internet use? If not, why not?

 

[Max Power]

I think a benefit of laws like these even if they are almost impossible to enforce is forcing a conversation both Nationally and in homes. I don't know, but I wonder how many homes is this something parents are ever discussing with their kids? Are parents monitoring their kids internet use? If not, why not?

Some parents do and other don't. I feel like my social circle about 75% of the parents are on top of things or at least attempting to be. Some of my children's friends parents don't seem to care at all. I think it comes down to lack of awareness, laziness and technical knowledge to monitor the usage.

I think this issue starts and ends at home.

 

[NewlyRetired]

I don't have a hard stance either way, but this thread has helped me realize that focusing on the porn is probably no where near as important as focusing on the social media.

Year after year after year, we have to read terrible stories where kids (usually girls) are bullied so badly on social media and in extreme cases cause suicide. While I would think there are some downsides to watching porn as a kid, it feels almost insignificant compared to the damage being done across social media to kids.

 

[IvanKaramazov]

I don't have a hard stance either way, but this thread has helped me realize that focusing on the porn is probably no where near as important as focusing on the social media.

Year after year after year, we have to read terrible stories where kids (usually girls) are bullied so badly on social media and in extreme cases cause suicide. While I would think there are some downsides to watching porn as a kid, it feels almost insignificant compared to the damage being done across social media to kids.

Same. I think the porn thing is mainly just a technical issue. I'm sure nobody is actually affirmatively in favor of giving young kids 24/7 access to hardcore pornography, and we're just disagreeing about how to address that issue or if there is a way to do so. The social media angle is a lot more interesting to me because it seems like a more challenging problem. As others have noted, the term "social media" doesn't define itself, and I'm not confident that all of us are even thinking about the same thing here. I'm not sure how I would define that term for the purposes of this discussion.

 

[Ilov80s]

I don't have a hard stance either way, but this thread has helped me realize that focusing on the porn is probably no where near as important as focusing on the social media.

Year after year after year, we have to read terrible stories where kids (usually girls) are bullied so badly on social media and in extreme cases cause suicide. While I would think there are some downsides to watching porn as a kid, it feels almost insignificant compared to the damage being done across social media to kids.

My concern with porn is less that it's out there and more like what is out there. Of course I found Playboys and copies of hardcore porn as a teen. But you go to major por sites now and you are getting some really hardcore things pushed on you from incest to gangbang to rape fantasy. It sure seems like maybe not the best version of sex we want tweens and teens to come into as they are just starting to figure this stuff out.

 

[Ilov80s]

I don't have a hard stance either way, but this thread has helped me realize that focusing on the porn is probably no where near as important as focusing on the social media.

Year after year after year, we have to read terrible stories where kids (usually girls) are bullied so badly on social media and in extreme cases cause suicide. While I would think there are some downsides to watching porn as a kid, it feels almost insignificant compared to the damage being done across social media to kids.

Same. I think the porn thing is mainly just a technical issue. I'm sure nobody is actually affirmatively in favor of giving young kids 24/7 access to hardcore pornography, and we're just disagreeing about how to address that issue or if there is a way to do so. The social media angle is a lot more interesting to me because it seems like a more challenging problem. As others have noted, the term "social media" doesn't define itself, and I'm not confident that all of us are even thinking about the same thing here. I'm not sure how I would define that term for the purposes of this discussion.

Right, what would we count as social media is a good starting point.

 

[Max Power]

I don't have a hard stance either way, but this thread has helped me realize that focusing on the porn is probably no where near as important as focusing on the social media.

Year after year after year, we have to read terrible stories where kids (usually girls) are bullied so badly on social media and in extreme cases cause suicide. While I would think there are some downsides to watching porn as a kid, it feels almost insignificant compared to the damage being done across social media to kids.

I'd also caution that people don't always jump to the negative aspect of social media. Those stories always get the headlines, but I think there are some positive aspects as well. Times are just different now and where kids spend time is changing. Kids are attached to their phones like never before. They don't know life without it.

On one hand I like that my teenage kids are more willing to spend a Friday or Saturday night at home hanging out with their friends on a social media ap vs doing what I was doing at their age. Driving around, hanging out in parking lots, getting into what ever the night unfolds for us.

Flip side is they can be exposed to a lot more and the internet typically brings extra drama. Other kids are more willing to say and do things to other on-line that I don't think they would do or say in person.

Society is changing too. I'd almost feel like a bad parent to take my kid's phone, hand him the keys the car and tell him to go find something to do for 4 hours. Yet that was my teenage years.

 

[Ilov80s]

I think a benefit of laws like these even if they are almost impossible to enforce is forcing a conversation both Nationally and in homes. I don't know, but I wonder how many homes is this something parents are ever discussing with their kids? Are parents monitoring their kids internet use? If not, why not?

Some parents do and other don't. I feel like my social circle about 75% of the parents are on top of things or at least attempting to be. Some of my children's friends parents don't seem to care at all. I think it comes down to lack of awareness, laziness and technical knowledge to monitor the usage.

I think this issue starts and ends at home.

One thing I find pretty interesting is that without a doubt the most recent generation of parents are the most coddling we've ever seen. They are less likely to let theit kids go out by themselves, stay out late, wander farther from home, etc. Much of this is even legally established with curfews, ordinances against minors being in spaces without adults and laws against leaving kids home alone. At the same time, they seem to be generally giving their kids nearly unfettered access to the entirety of the world 24 hours a day with minimal supervision. It seems like their fears should actually be reversed. I think kids are much more likely to encounter something disturbing online than in their neighborhood and the internet exposes them to an entire world of sexual predators.

 

[Max Power]

I think a benefit of laws like these even if they are almost impossible to enforce is forcing a conversation both Nationally and in homes. I don't know, but I wonder how many homes is this something parents are ever discussing with their kids? Are parents monitoring their kids internet use? If not, why not?

Some parents do and other don't. I feel like my social circle about 75% of the parents are on top of things or at least attempting to be. Some of my children's friends parents don't seem to care at all. I think it comes down to lack of awareness, laziness and technical knowledge to monitor the usage.

I think this issue starts and ends at home.

One thing I find pretty interesting is that without a doubt the most recent generation of parents are the most coddling we've ever seen. They are less likely to let theit kids go out by themselves, stay out late, wander farther from home, etc. Much of this is even legally established with curfews, ordinances against minors being in spaces without adults and laws against leaving kids home alone. At the same time, they seem to be generally giving their kids nearly unfettered access to the entirety of the world 24 hours a day with minimal supervision. It seems like their fears should actually be reversed. I think kids are much more likely to encounter something disturbing online than in their neighborhood and the internet exposes them to an entire world of sexual predators.

I get what you're saying and I agree with some aspects. I personally feel more comfortable with my kids being at home than being out and about. There are real world dangers that I've witnessed that scare me more for their sake vs what I think they'll find on-line. I'm also a parent who will stay engaged with their on-line activity although probably not as well as I should.

Are you of the opinion that the internet is more dangerous for kids than the real world?

 

[Kev4029]

Kids will never figure out a way around this. Just like they’re stumped on how to buy booze and weed.

VPN companies are standing by

VPNs are essentially free, right? What's the revenue model for a VPN company?

The free ones have terrible upload/download rates and are probably logging all your data. Most VPNs have a nominal annual cost (I use Private Internet Access and I think it's $40/yr) but don't log data and allow for normal internet up/down speeds.

 

[the moops]

I think a benefit of laws like these even if they are almost impossible to enforce is forcing a conversation both Nationally and in homes. I don't know, but I wonder how many homes is this something parents are ever discussing with their kids? Are parents monitoring their kids internet use? If not, why not?

Some parents do and other don't. I feel like my social circle about 75% of the parents are on top of things or at least attempting to be. Some of my children's friends parents don't seem to care at all. I think it comes down to lack of awareness, laziness and technical knowledge to monitor the usage.

I think this issue starts and ends at home.

Only quibble I have with this is that it isn't just home where it starts and ends. It is your extended family and friends and school and others, for there are ample opportunities for kids to get on devices not just at home

 

[IvanKaramazov]

I don't have a hard stance either way, but this thread has helped me realize that focusing on the porn is probably no where near as important as focusing on the social media.

Year after year after year, we have to read terrible stories where kids (usually girls) are bullied so badly on social media and in extreme cases cause suicide. While I would think there are some downsides to watching porn as a kid, it feels almost insignificant compared to the damage being done across social media to kids.

My concern with porn is less that it's out there and more like what is out there. Of course I found Playboys and copies of hardcore porn as a teen. But you go to major por sites now and you are getting some really hardcore things pushed on you from incest to gangbang to rape fantasy. It sure seems like maybe not the best version of sex we want tweens and teens to come into as they are just starting to figure this stuff out.

And this is why "bans" don't have to be perfect. To the degree that porn and social media are harmful, the amount of harm obviously depends a lot on the degree of exposure.

Neither of these things is like cyanide, where just one tiny dose will kill you. They're more like elevated levels of radiation -- fairly harmless in small doses, but extremely damaging over time. If a young kid watches a porno tape at his buddy's house (I'll bet many of us had that experience -- I sure did), it doesn't matter much. It's not the sort of thing you would recommend of course, but it's not really harmful. That's not comparable to 24/7 access to the most hardcore content imaginable on a device you carry around in your pocket. Those two things are in totally different categories. If we could return pornography back to the pre-internet days of kids being excited to find a cache of nudie mags in the woods (or the online equivalent of that), that would be a big improvement. Obviously there's a cost-benefit tradeoff here that needs further investigation -- I have no interest in stopping adults from consuming this stuff.

Similarly, it doesn't matter if a kid watches some TikTok while she's visiting a friend who worked around age verification. Who cares? Nobody gets harmed by TikTok or Facebook or X or whatever at that level of exposure. What we're trying to prevent is the mental illness that accompanies prolonged exposure to this stuff. Bans can be fairly porous and still achieve that goal.

 

[massraider]

What we're trying to prevent is the mental illness that accompanies prolonged exposure to this stuff.

Who diagnosed this?

 

[Kanil]

I mean, are they asking for photo ID verification or just "yeah, I'm 18 *wink*" dropdown box? Seems pretty unenforceable.

 

[DA RAIDERS]

I think a benefit of laws like these even if they are almost impossible to enforce is forcing a conversation both Nationally and in homes. I don't know, but I wonder how many homes is this something parents are ever discussing with their kids? Are parents monitoring their kids internet use? If not, why not?

I don’t know a parent that isn’t/wasn’t concerned about allowing their kids unfettered access to the internet. Everyone more or less expresses angst about getting their kid a phone. Parenting styles differ, but it was certainly an on going conversation in my house for the first few years of her using it. And I monitored/limited her activity as best as I could.

It is also discussed at school. Every child is given a chrome book. Internet access is limited on them for this very reason.

Your stance is an odd one. Every kid I know is more tech savvy than their previous generation. Which will continue as we head more and more into a digital age. My daughter and her friends, seniors in high school, can run circles around my generation in general functionality of computers and phones. Which is what a VPN is, they are literally child’s play to them. ALL of their schooling and socializing is done through computers/phones. How old are these kids that you know, that aren’t tech savvy?

 

[Ilov80s]

I think a benefit of laws like these even if they are almost impossible to enforce is forcing a conversation both Nationally and in homes. I don't know, but I wonder how many homes is this something parents are ever discussing with their kids? Are parents monitoring their kids internet use? If not, why not?

I don’t know a parent that isn’t/wasn’t concerned about allowing their kids unfettered access to the internet. Everyone more or less expresses angst about getting their kid a phone. Parenting styles differ, but it was certainly an on going conversation in my house for the first few years of her using it. And I monitored/limited her activity as best as I could.

It is also discussed at school. Every child is given a chrome book. Internet access is limited on them for this very reason.

Your stance is an odd one. Every kid I know is more tech savvy than their previous generation. Which will continue as we head more and more into a digital age. My daughter and her friends, seniors in high school, can run circles around my generation in general functionality of computers and phones. Which is what a VPN is, they are literally child’s play to them. ALL of their schooling and socializing is done through computers/phones. How old are these kids that you know, that aren’t tech savvy?

This is a few years old but it’s a good explanation of what I mean

https://www.washingtonpost.com/education/2019/11/16/todays-kids-may-be-digital-natives-new-study-shows-they-arent-close-being-computer-literate/

I teach HS and many of these kids struggle to even understand how Google works. We have Chromebooks for them to use but at both schools I’ve worked at, I’ve only once ever heard of discussion or instruction about inappropriate internet use (a presentation maybe 8 years ago explaining that it’s illegal to take and share nude pictures of minors even if you are a minor). I absolutely do not get the sense that much effective monitoring or communication is happening about this stuff.

 

[Ilov80s]

They are very good at using the AI on Snapchat and just blindly copying whatever it says though. I’ll give them that.

 

[DA RAIDERS]

I think a benefit of laws like these even if they are almost impossible to enforce is forcing a conversation both Nationally and in homes. I don't know, but I wonder how many homes is this something parents are ever discussing with their kids? Are parents monitoring their kids internet use? If not, why not?

I don’t know a parent that isn’t/wasn’t concerned about allowing their kids unfettered access to the internet. Everyone more or less expresses angst about getting their kid a phone. Parenting styles differ, but it was certainly an on going conversation in my house for the first few years of her using it. And I monitored/limited her activity as best as I could.

It is also discussed at school. Every child is given a chrome book. Internet access is limited on them for this very reason.

Your stance is an odd one. Every kid I know is more tech savvy than their previous generation. Which will continue as we head more and more into a digital age. My daughter and her friends, seniors in high school, can run circles around my generation in general functionality of computers and phones. Which is what a VPN is, they are literally child’s play to them. ALL of their schooling and socializing is done through computers/phones. How old are these kids that you know, that aren’t tech savvy?

This is a few years old but it’s a good explanation of what I mean

https://www.washingtonpost.com/education/2019/11/16/todays-kids-may-be-digital-natives-new-study-shows-they-arent-close-being-computer-literate/

I teach HS and many of these kids struggle to even understand how Google works.

I can’t read the article, I’m not giving them an email. My kid would just fabricate one what is their definition of tech savvy? Code writing? And where in the country are you that HS kids don’t know how to use google. And then there’s the joke about kids being unable to grasp the simplest concepts at school yet they know the lore of Star Wars/marvel/hunger games/harry potter verbatim.

 

[Ilov80s]

I think a benefit of laws like these even if they are almost impossible to enforce is forcing a conversation both Nationally and in homes. I don't know, but I wonder how many homes is this something parents are ever discussing with their kids? Are parents monitoring their kids internet use? If not, why not?

I don’t know a parent that isn’t/wasn’t concerned about allowing their kids unfettered access to the internet. Everyone more or less expresses angst about getting their kid a phone. Parenting styles differ, but it was certainly an on going conversation in my house for the first few years of her using it. And I monitored/limited her activity as best as I could.

It is also discussed at school. Every child is given a chrome book. Internet access is limited on them for this very reason.

Your stance is an odd one. Every kid I know is more tech savvy than their previous generation. Which will continue as we head more and more into a digital age. My daughter and her friends, seniors in high school, can run circles around my generation in general functionality of computers and phones. Which is what a VPN is, they are literally child’s play to them. ALL of their schooling and socializing is done through computers/phones. How old are these kids that you know, that aren’t tech savvy?

This is a few years old but it’s a good explanation of what I mean

https://www.washingtonpost.com/education/2019/11/16/todays-kids-may-be-digital-natives-new-study-shows-they-arent-close-being-computer-literate/

I teach HS and many of these kids struggle to even understand how Google works.

I can’t read the article, I’m not giving them an email. My kid would just fabricate one what is their definition of tech savvy? Code writing? And where in the country are you that HS kids don’t know how to use google. And then there’s the joke about kids being unable to grasp the simplest concepts at school yet they know the lore of Star Wars/marvel/hunger games/harry potter verbatim.

I work in the US and so many kids use Google like idiots. They know how to use it but they type full questions like it’s a human being and not like it’s just aggregating based on keywords. I promise you so many of these kids are awful with computers. Obviously they are much better with their phones and anything visual, touch based. Anyway the article just said Gen Z’s computer literacy is really bad and trails millennials despite being digital natives.

 

[Don Quixote]

I mean, are they asking for photo ID verification or just "yeah, I'm 18 *wink*" dropdown box? Seems pretty unenforceable.

The law is ID verification. Not just a dropdown box.

 

[DA RAIDERS]

I think a benefit of laws like these even if they are almost impossible to enforce is forcing a conversation both Nationally and in homes. I don't know, but I wonder how many homes is this something parents are ever discussing with their kids? Are parents monitoring their kids internet use? If not, why not?

I don’t know a parent that isn’t/wasn’t concerned about allowing their kids unfettered access to the internet. Everyone more or less expresses angst about getting their kid a phone. Parenting styles differ, but it was certainly an on going conversation in my house for the first few years of her using it. And I monitored/limited her activity as best as I could.

It is also discussed at school. Every child is given a chrome book. Internet access is limited on them for this very reason.

Your stance is an odd one. Every kid I know is more tech savvy than their previous generation. Which will continue as we head more and more into a digital age. My daughter and her friends, seniors in high school, can run circles around my generation in general functionality of computers and phones. Which is what a VPN is, they are literally child’s play to them. ALL of their schooling and socializing is done through computers/phones. How old are these kids that you know, that aren’t tech savvy?

This is a few years old but it’s a good explanation of what I mean

https://www.washingtonpost.com/education/2019/11/16/todays-kids-may-be-digital-natives-new-study-shows-they-arent-close-being-computer-literate/

I teach HS and many of these kids struggle to even understand how Google works.

I can’t read the article, I’m not giving them an email. My kid would just fabricate one what is their definition of tech savvy? Code writing? And where in the country are you that HS kids don’t know how to use google. And then there’s the joke about kids being unable to grasp the simplest concepts at school yet they know the lore of Star Wars/marvel/hunger games/harry potter verbatim.

I work in the US and so many kids use Google like idiots. They know how to use it but they type full questions like it’s a human being and not like it’s just aggregating based on keywords. I promise you so many of these kids are awful with computers. Obviously they are much better with their phones and anything visual, touch based. Anyway the article just said Gen Z’s computer literacy is really bad and trails millennials despite being digital natives.

In the US… where if you don’t mind. I’m in a very good school district in SoCal and I can assure you, these kids learned how to use google during Covid in order to cheat there way through whatever grade they were in for online schooling.

My wife says thank you to Alexa. Which is only in my kids room.

 

[DA RAIDERS]

I mean, are they asking for photo ID verification or just "yeah, I'm 18 *wink*" dropdown box? Seems pretty unenforceable.

The law is ID verification. Not just a dropdown box.

Penalties?

 

[Max Power]

I think a benefit of laws like these even if they are almost impossible to enforce is forcing a conversation both Nationally and in homes. I don't know, but I wonder how many homes is this something parents are ever discussing with their kids? Are parents monitoring their kids internet use? If not, why not?

I don’t know a parent that isn’t/wasn’t concerned about allowing their kids unfettered access to the internet. Everyone more or less expresses angst about getting their kid a phone. Parenting styles differ, but it was certainly an on going conversation in my house for the first few years of her using it. And I monitored/limited her activity as best as I could.

It is also discussed at school. Every child is given a chrome book. Internet access is limited on them for this very reason.

Your stance is an odd one. Every kid I know is more tech savvy than their previous generation. Which will continue as we head more and more into a digital age. My daughter and her friends, seniors in high school, can run circles around my generation in general functionality of computers and phones. Which is what a VPN is, they are literally child’s play to them. ALL of their schooling and socializing is done through computers/phones. How old are these kids that you know, that aren’t tech savvy?

This is a few years old but it’s a good explanation of what I mean

https://www.washingtonpost.com/education/2019/11/16/todays-kids-may-be-digital-natives-new-study-shows-they-arent-close-being-computer-literate/

I teach HS and many of these kids struggle to even understand how Google works.

I can’t read the article, I’m not giving them an email. My kid would just fabricate one what is their definition of tech savvy? Code writing? And where in the country are you that HS kids don’t know how to use google. And then there’s the joke about kids being unable to grasp the simplest concepts at school yet they know the lore of Star Wars/marvel/hunger games/harry potter verbatim.

I work in the US and so many kids use Google like idiots. They know how to use it but they type full questions like it’s a human being and not like it’s just aggregating based on keywords. I promise you so many of these kids are awful with computers. Obviously they are much better with their phones and anything visual, touch based. Anyway the article just said Gen Z’s computer literacy is really bad and trails millennials despite being digital natives.

Along these lines, I work in a place that has touch typing (aka keyboarding) as a requirement to work here. We only require 35 words per minute, but keyboarding is a skill the younger generation doesn't have. I took a keyboarding class in High School. Schools don't teach it anymore.

My daughter can probably text 100 words a minute on her phone, where as I can't even hit the right letter 10% of the time.

 

[Don Quixote]

I mean, are they asking for photo ID verification or just "yeah, I'm 18 *wink*" dropdown box? Seems pretty unenforceable.

The law is ID verification. Not just a dropdown box.

Penalties?

Fines for sites that violate. Here is an article about Texas AG suing some sites that it says violating the law in Texas: https://www.wfaa.com/article/news/p...General Ken,to have age verification measures.

 

[DA RAIDERS]

I think a benefit of laws like these even if they are almost impossible to enforce is forcing a conversation both Nationally and in homes. I don't know, but I wonder how many homes is this something parents are ever discussing with their kids? Are parents monitoring their kids internet use? If not, why not?

I don’t know a parent that isn’t/wasn’t concerned about allowing their kids unfettered access to the internet. Everyone more or less expresses angst about getting their kid a phone. Parenting styles differ, but it was certainly an on going conversation in my house for the first few years of her using it. And I monitored/limited her activity as best as I could.

It is also discussed at school. Every child is given a chrome book. Internet access is limited on them for this very reason.

Your stance is an odd one. Every kid I know is more tech savvy than their previous generation. Which will continue as we head more and more into a digital age. My daughter and her friends, seniors in high school, can run circles around my generation in general functionality of computers and phones. Which is what a VPN is, they are literally child’s play to them. ALL of their schooling and socializing is done through computers/phones. How old are these kids that you know, that aren’t tech savvy?

This is a few years old but it’s a good explanation of what I mean

https://www.washingtonpost.com/education/2019/11/16/todays-kids-may-be-digital-natives-new-study-shows-they-arent-close-being-computer-literate/

I teach HS and many of these kids struggle to even understand how Google works.

I can’t read the article, I’m not giving them an email. My kid would just fabricate one what is their definition of tech savvy? Code writing? And where in the country are you that HS kids don’t know how to use google. And then there’s the joke about kids being unable to grasp the simplest concepts at school yet they know the lore of Star Wars/marvel/hunger games/harry potter verbatim.

I work in the US and so many kids use Google like idiots. They know how to use it but they type full questions like it’s a human being and not like it’s just aggregating based on keywords. I promise you so many of these kids are awful with computers. Obviously they are much better with their phones and anything visual, touch based. Anyway the article just said Gen Z’s computer literacy is really bad and trails millennials despite being digital natives.

Along these lines, I work in a place that has touch typing (aka keyboarding) as a requirement to work here. We only require 35 words per minute, but keyboarding is a skill the younger generation doesn't have. I took a keyboarding class in High School. Schools don't teach it anymore.

My daughter can probably text 100 words a minute on her phone, where as I can't even hit the right letter 10% of the time.

Yep. And my kid never took a typing class but can motor through her key board. Auto correct helps

 

[DA RAIDERS]

I mean, are they asking for photo ID verification or just "yeah, I'm 18 *wink*" dropdown box? Seems pretty unenforceable.

The law is ID verification. Not just a dropdown box.

Penalties?

Fines for sites that violate. Here is an article about Texas AG suing some sites that it says violating the law in Texas: https://www.wfaa.com/article/news/politics/texas-attorney-general-ken-paxton-suing-2-more-adult-websites-alleging-they-violated-new-age-verification-law/287-f9428040-6209-4f3b-a0cb-fccc3f17ae10#:~:text=TEXAS, USA — Attorney General Ken,to have age verification measures.

So the sites are penalized? Not the person surfing the web?

 

[General Malaise]

Kids will never figure out a way around this. Just like they’re stumped on how to buy booze and weed.

VPN companies are standing by

VPNs are essentially free, right? What's the revenue model for a VPN company?

and in this realm, I know we older people think kids are all tech wizards. They are not. They know how to use Snapchat, filter and edit pictures for IG, have a sick run on Subway Surfers but most don't have a clue what a VPN is yet alone how to use one.

If a free piece of software is all that's needed for a horny teenager to crack the barrier to unlimited pr0n, you really think this will stump them? Kids have been circumventing adult imposed limits since the world started spinning.

Many will but if this barrier can perhaps do a few of the following

• push back the age kids might start encounter porn
• prevent some kids who aren't relentlessly committed to finding porn from "stumbling upon it"
• put some minor consequences in place for kids who circumvent the rules
• initiate conversations in homes about the legality of this

I know kids circumvent adult rules but if I had kids, I would still set rules for them.

I don't disagree with any of this, but just keep in mind they will have breaches just like age limits for drinking have since before our parents birthed us and long before that. My dad is almost 80. His little brother was using his ID in HS in the 60s. You and I certainly did the same thing as teens only through different channels.

So yes, I'm hopeful guardrails will help in some regards, they are about as effective as past guardrails have been throughout history in attempting to keep kids from accessing 'adult' things.

 

[Ilov80s]

I think a benefit of laws like these even if they are almost impossible to enforce is forcing a conversation both Nationally and in homes. I don't know, but I wonder how many homes is this something parents are ever discussing with their kids? Are parents monitoring their kids internet use? If not, why not?

I don’t know a parent that isn’t/wasn’t concerned about allowing their kids unfettered access to the internet. Everyone more or less expresses angst about getting their kid a phone. Parenting styles differ, but it was certainly an on going conversation in my house for the first few years of her using it. And I monitored/limited her activity as best as I could.

It is also discussed at school. Every child is given a chrome book. Internet access is limited on them for this very reason.

Your stance is an odd one. Every kid I know is more tech savvy than their previous generation. Which will continue as we head more and more into a digital age. My daughter and her friends, seniors in high school, can run circles around my generation in general functionality of computers and phones. Which is what a VPN is, they are literally child’s play to them. ALL of their schooling and socializing is done through computers/phones. How old are these kids that you know, that aren’t tech savvy?

This is a few years old but it’s a good explanation of what I mean

https://www.washingtonpost.com/education/2019/11/16/todays-kids-may-be-digital-natives-new-study-shows-they-arent-close-being-computer-literate/

I teach HS and many of these kids struggle to even understand how Google works.

I can’t read the article, I’m not giving them an email. My kid would just fabricate one what is their definition of tech savvy? Code writing? And where in the country are you that HS kids don’t know how to use google. And then there’s the joke about kids being unable to grasp the simplest concepts at school yet they know the lore of Star Wars/marvel/hunger games/harry potter verbatim.

I work in the US and so many kids use Google like idiots. They know how to use it but they type full questions like it’s a human being and not like it’s just aggregating based on keywords. I promise you so many of these kids are awful with computers. Obviously they are much better with their phones and anything visual, touch based. Anyway the article just said Gen Z’s computer literacy is really bad and trails millennials despite being digital natives.

In the US… where if you don’t mind. I’m in a very good school district in SoCal and I can assure you, these kids learned how to use google during Covid in order to cheat there way through whatever grade they were in for online schooling.

My wife says thank you to Alexa. Which is only in my kids room.

In an upper middle class school in Michigan. There are plenty of very intelligent and tech savvy kids. No doubt. Probably 20-30% of the school. I am talking about the school whole group though. Remember half the kids are going to be below average relative to their peers. Most kids during COVID just avoided work and yeah they used Google to get answers. They weren’t very good answers, were clearly copied and often didn’t really answer the question. I get kids who when they copied answers from Wikipedia didn’t have the skills or sense to remove the hyperlinks and citations.

If you don’t want to believe me, a person who works with hundreds of kids every year or actual studies of thousands of kids, that’s your prerogative.

 

[Ilov80s]

I think a benefit of laws like these even if they are almost impossible to enforce is forcing a conversation both Nationally and in homes. I don't know, but I wonder how many homes is this something parents are ever discussing with their kids? Are parents monitoring their kids internet use? If not, why not?

I don’t know a parent that isn’t/wasn’t concerned about allowing their kids unfettered access to the internet. Everyone more or less expresses angst about getting their kid a phone. Parenting styles differ, but it was certainly an on going conversation in my house for the first few years of her using it. And I monitored/limited her activity as best as I could.

It is also discussed at school. Every child is given a chrome book. Internet access is limited on them for this very reason.

Your stance is an odd one. Every kid I know is more tech savvy than their previous generation. Which will continue as we head more and more into a digital age. My daughter and her friends, seniors in high school, can run circles around my generation in general functionality of computers and phones. Which is what a VPN is, they are literally child’s play to them. ALL of their schooling and socializing is done through computers/phones. How old are these kids that you know, that aren’t tech savvy?

This is a few years old but it’s a good explanation of what I mean

https://www.washingtonpost.com/education/2019/11/16/todays-kids-may-be-digital-natives-new-study-shows-they-arent-close-being-computer-literate/

I teach HS and many of these kids struggle to even understand how Google works.

I can’t read the article, I’m not giving them an email. My kid would just fabricate one what is their definition of tech savvy? Code writing? And where in the country are you that HS kids don’t know how to use google. And then there’s the joke about kids being unable to grasp the simplest concepts at school yet they know the lore of Star Wars/marvel/hunger games/harry potter verbatim.

I work in the US and so many kids use Google like idiots. They know how to use it but they type full questions like it’s a human being and not like it’s just aggregating based on keywords. I promise you so many of these kids are awful with computers. Obviously they are much better with their phones and anything visual, touch based. Anyway the article just said Gen Z’s computer literacy is really bad and trails millennials despite being digital natives.

Along these lines, I work in a place that has touch typing (aka keyboarding) as a requirement to work here. We only require 35 words per minute, but keyboarding is a skill the younger generation doesn't have. I took a keyboarding class in High School. Schools don't teach it anymore.

My daughter can probably text 100 words a minute on her phone, where as I can't even hit the right letter 10% of the time.

Yep. And my kid never took a typing class but can motor through her key board. Auto correct helps

Your kid sounds like an outlier or in the upper tier. Kids on average are hilariously bad at typing on keyboards.

 

[DA RAIDERS]

I think a benefit of laws like these even if they are almost impossible to enforce is forcing a conversation both Nationally and in homes. I don't know, but I wonder how many homes is this something parents are ever discussing with their kids? Are parents monitoring their kids internet use? If not, why not?

I don’t know a parent that isn’t/wasn’t concerned about allowing their kids unfettered access to the internet. Everyone more or less expresses angst about getting their kid a phone. Parenting styles differ, but it was certainly an on going conversation in my house for the first few years of her using it. And I monitored/limited her activity as best as I could.

It is also discussed at school. Every child is given a chrome book. Internet access is limited on them for this very reason.

Your stance is an odd one. Every kid I know is more tech savvy than their previous generation. Which will continue as we head more and more into a digital age. My daughter and her friends, seniors in high school, can run circles around my generation in general functionality of computers and phones. Which is what a VPN is, they are literally child’s play to them. ALL of their schooling and socializing is done through computers/phones. How old are these kids that you know, that aren’t tech savvy?

This is a few years old but it’s a good explanation of what I mean

https://www.washingtonpost.com/education/2019/11/16/todays-kids-may-be-digital-natives-new-study-shows-they-arent-close-being-computer-literate/

I teach HS and many of these kids struggle to even understand how Google works.

I can’t read the article, I’m not giving them an email. My kid would just fabricate one what is their definition of tech savvy? Code writing? And where in the country are you that HS kids don’t know how to use google. And then there’s the joke about kids being unable to grasp the simplest concepts at school yet they know the lore of Star Wars/marvel/hunger games/harry potter verbatim.

I work in the US and so many kids use Google like idiots. They know how to use it but they type full questions like it’s a human being and not like it’s just aggregating based on keywords. I promise you so many of these kids are awful with computers. Obviously they are much better with their phones and anything visual, touch based. Anyway the article just said Gen Z’s computer literacy is really bad and trails millennials despite being digital natives.

Along these lines, I work in a place that has touch typing (aka keyboarding) as a requirement to work here. We only require 35 words per minute, but keyboarding is a skill the younger generation doesn't have. I took a keyboarding class in High School. Schools don't teach it anymore.

My daughter can probably text 100 words a minute on her phone, where as I can't even hit the right letter 10% of the time.

Yep. And my kid never took a typing class but can motor through her key board. Auto correct helps

Your kid sounds like an outlier or in the upper tier. Kids on average are hilariously bad at typing on keyboards.

Maybe..she’s an outlier with math for sure. Thank god for the calculator on her phone.

 

[Snotbubbles]

I don't have a hard stance either way, but this thread has helped me realize that focusing on the porn is probably no where near as important as focusing on the social media.

Year after year after year, we have to read terrible stories where kids (usually girls) are bullied so badly on social media and in extreme cases cause suicide. While I would think there are some downsides to watching porn as a kid, it feels almost insignificant compared to the damage being done across social media to kids.

I mean, if you're getting bullied on social media, wouldn't the solution be, to not go on social media. It's like a kid playing with matches and then blaming the matches when he gets burned.

 

[Kev4029]

I think a benefit of laws like these even if they are almost impossible to enforce is forcing a conversation both Nationally and in homes. I don't know, but I wonder how many homes is this something parents are ever discussing with their kids? Are parents monitoring their kids internet use? If not, why not?

I don’t know a parent that isn’t/wasn’t concerned about allowing their kids unfettered access to the internet. Everyone more or less expresses angst about getting their kid a phone. Parenting styles differ, but it was certainly an on going conversation in my house for the first few years of her using it. And I monitored/limited her activity as best as I could.

It is also discussed at school. Every child is given a chrome book. Internet access is limited on them for this very reason.

Your stance is an odd one. Every kid I know is more tech savvy than their previous generation. Which will continue as we head more and more into a digital age. My daughter and her friends, seniors in high school, can run circles around my generation in general functionality of computers and phones. Which is what a VPN is, they are literally child’s play to them. ALL of their schooling and socializing is done through computers/phones. How old are these kids that you know, that aren’t tech savvy?

This is a few years old but it’s a good explanation of what I mean

https://www.washingtonpost.com/education/2019/11/16/todays-kids-may-be-digital-natives-new-study-shows-they-arent-close-being-computer-literate/

I teach HS and many of these kids struggle to even understand how Google works.

I can’t read the article, I’m not giving them an email. My kid would just fabricate one what is their definition of tech savvy? Code writing? And where in the country are you that HS kids don’t know how to use google. And then there’s the joke about kids being unable to grasp the simplest concepts at school yet they know the lore of Star Wars/marvel/hunger games/harry potter verbatim.

I work in the US and so many kids use Google like idiots. They know how to use it but they type full questions like it’s a human being and not like it’s just aggregating based on keywords. I promise you so many of these kids are awful with computers. Obviously they are much better with their phones and anything visual, touch based. Anyway the article just said Gen Z’s computer literacy is really bad and trails millennials despite being digital natives.

As a Millennial that manages a wide age range of staff, it has been very surprising to me that I need to help the Gen Z employees nearly as much as the boomers. Whereas the Millennials and Gen Xers don't typically need anywhere near as much handholding. I generally think the generational stereotypes are blown away out of proportion but wrt computer literacy, there is remarkable consistency. And the people I'm dealing with are engineers or engineering adjacent folks, a demographic that I would assume to be much more computer literate than the average.

 

[Ilov80s]

I don't have a hard stance either way, but this thread has helped me realize that focusing on the porn is probably no where near as important as focusing on the social media.

Year after year after year, we have to read terrible stories where kids (usually girls) are bullied so badly on social media and in extreme cases cause suicide. While I would think there are some downsides to watching porn as a kid, it feels almost insignificant compared to the damage being done across social media to kids.

I mean, if you're getting bullied on social media, wouldn't the solution be, to not go on social media. It's like a kid playing with matches and then blaming the matches when he gets burned.

That’s also cutting them off from their peers and all the things their peers will be doing and talking about. It’s more like telling a kid who plays football and is being picked on by teammates that it’s their own fault for not quitting the team.

 

[FreeBaGeL]

Kids will never figure out a way around this. Just like they’re stumped on how to buy booze and weed.

VPN companies are standing by

VPNs are essentially free, right? What's the revenue model for a VPN company?

As far as revenue models, VPNs weren't traditionally free but the ease to create them has created a ton of competition to the point where prices are nearly free. Like $12/year or $35 for a lifetime access for some of them.

And then there are larger companies with different products that have essentially started including free VPNs as a loss leader. Brave browser for instance, has a VPN built into it that you can use for free. I think some anti-virus companies also have free VPN products so they can try and upsell you on the full anti-virus package.

 

[Ilov80s]

I think a benefit of laws like these even if they are almost impossible to enforce is forcing a conversation both Nationally and in homes. I don't know, but I wonder how many homes is this something parents are ever discussing with their kids? Are parents monitoring their kids internet use? If not, why not?

I don’t know a parent that isn’t/wasn’t concerned about allowing their kids unfettered access to the internet. Everyone more or less expresses angst about getting their kid a phone. Parenting styles differ, but it was certainly an on going conversation in my house for the first few years of her using it. And I monitored/limited her activity as best as I could.

It is also discussed at school. Every child is given a chrome book. Internet access is limited on them for this very reason.

Your stance is an odd one. Every kid I know is more tech savvy than their previous generation. Which will continue as we head more and more into a digital age. My daughter and her friends, seniors in high school, can run circles around my generation in general functionality of computers and phones. Which is what a VPN is, they are literally child’s play to them. ALL of their schooling and socializing is done through computers/phones. How old are these kids that you know, that aren’t tech savvy?

This is a few years old but it’s a good explanation of what I mean

https://www.washingtonpost.com/education/2019/11/16/todays-kids-may-be-digital-natives-new-study-shows-they-arent-close-being-computer-literate/

I teach HS and many of these kids struggle to even understand how Google works.

I can’t read the article, I’m not giving them an email. My kid would just fabricate one what is their definition of tech savvy? Code writing? And where in the country are you that HS kids don’t know how to use google. And then there’s the joke about kids being unable to grasp the simplest concepts at school yet they know the lore of Star Wars/marvel/hunger games/harry potter verbatim.

I work in the US and so many kids use Google like idiots. They know how to use it but they type full questions like it’s a human being and not like it’s just aggregating based on keywords. I promise you so many of these kids are awful with computers. Obviously they are much better with their phones and anything visual, touch based. Anyway the article just said Gen Z’s computer literacy is really bad and trails millennials despite being digital natives.

As a Millennial that manages a wide age range of staff, it has been very surprising to me that I need to help the Gen Z employees nearly as much as the boomers. Whereas the Millennials and Gen Xers don't typically need anywhere near as much handholding. I generally think the generational stereotypes are blown away out of proportion but wrt computer literacy, there is remarkable consistency. And the people I'm dealing with are engineers or engineering adjacent folks, a demographic that I would assume to be much more computer literate than the average.

100%. My parents are in their 70s and have become more adept at using computers than my HS kids. Phones for communication, games, pictures the kids blow them away no contest. But when it comes to doing something productive especially on a computer I think most people would be shocked by how similar those 2 generations are. And there literacy about what’s real, what’s a good source, etc is also shockingly similar.

 

[Snotbubbles]

I don't have a hard stance either way, but this thread has helped me realize that focusing on the porn is probably no where near as important as focusing on the social media.

Year after year after year, we have to read terrible stories where kids (usually girls) are bullied so badly on social media and in extreme cases cause suicide. While I would think there are some downsides to watching porn as a kid, it feels almost insignificant compared to the damage being done across social media to kids.

I mean, if you're getting bullied on social media, wouldn't the solution be, to not go on social media. It's like a kid playing with matches and then blaming the matches when he gets burned.

That’s also cutting them off from their peers and all the things their peers will be doing and talking about. It’s more like telling a kid who plays football and is being picked on by teammates that it’s their own fault for not quitting the team.

Yes, and? It's football. Go play soccer.

 

[Bottomfeeder Sports]

Where this really will apply is to a bigger audience on social media in general. Not just pornography sites.

Some are talking about seriously trying to limit access to social media for children. That's a big and important discussion.

Yeah two different discussions really.

I don't think so. Different subjects but the exact same question. How and if they are able to restrict people here may be totally related to how they restrict people from social media.

How might be the same but whether they should or not sure seems like 2 very different discussions imo.

I think when it comes to porn most people don't really care what kind of barriers the state is going to put in place to prevent access by minors because they don't really care about the adults who are consuming porn (even if it is themselves from time to time). So the "how" part of the discussion is glossed over, it seems irrelevant.

But if we are really talking about defining "adult only" sites and that is both porn and "social media" and ??? then the how begins to impact most people. So the "how" is really the more important discussion before trying to tackle what should be "adult only", or even what is "porn".

But in either case the discussion is the same discussion to me with the questions being

• Is there a state interest to keep minors away from certain sites? While where the "line" is would be a reasonable debate, I think at some level most everyone agrees that this is yes
• What criteria should be used to label a site (or more accurately a category of sites) as being "adult only"? Again reasonable people can disagree on the "line", but this seems like a straight forward "negotiation". An interesting debate, but not really the debate.
• How do you implement this to effectively thwart minors from accessing those sites without overburdening adults legitimately access those sites? Or put adults at risk for things such as identity theft, etc. I think this should be the predominant question. The opposition being "no you cannot" with the majority of the comments on the effectively thwart side, but I think that the real debate seems to me to be how costly is the efforts to adults? It is not that it won't be 100%. It is not that it is "hard". It is that it will impose burdens and risks on legitimate adult users that are not offset by the level that the policy goal is achieved. Collectively I don't think we care too much if that is porn which makes it seem like a different discussion as to when it is about accessing the FFA (and what is in-between).

Now my cynical and paranoid side might argue that there are not really any risks or burdens needed to be placed on adults because these sites already have all of the information they need on us to figure out our ages without the need for us to do anything.

 

[Joe Bryant]

How do you implement this to effectively thwart minors from accessing those sites without overburdening adults legitimately access those sites? Or put adults at risk for things such as identity theft, etc. I think this should be the predominant question.

Legal online sportsbooks have been doing this for several years now at tremendous scale. It's a problem that's been solved.

 

[DA RAIDERS]

I think a benefit of laws like these even if they are almost impossible to enforce is forcing a conversation both Nationally and in homes. I don't know, but I wonder how many homes is this something parents are ever discussing with their kids? Are parents monitoring their kids internet use? If not, why not?

I don’t know a parent that isn’t/wasn’t concerned about allowing their kids unfettered access to the internet. Everyone more or less expresses angst about getting their kid a phone. Parenting styles differ, but it was certainly an on going conversation in my house for the first few years of her using it. And I monitored/limited her activity as best as I could.

It is also discussed at school. Every child is given a chrome book. Internet access is limited on them for this very reason.

Your stance is an odd one. Every kid I know is more tech savvy than their previous generation. Which will continue as we head more and more into a digital age. My daughter and her friends, seniors in high school, can run circles around my generation in general functionality of computers and phones. Which is what a VPN is, they are literally child’s play to them. ALL of their schooling and socializing is done through computers/phones. How old are these kids that you know, that aren’t tech savvy?

This is a few years old but it’s a good explanation of what I mean

https://www.washingtonpost.com/education/2019/11/16/todays-kids-may-be-digital-natives-new-study-shows-they-arent-close-being-computer-literate/

I teach HS and many of these kids struggle to even understand how Google works.

I can’t read the article, I’m not giving them an email. My kid would just fabricate one what is their definition of tech savvy? Code writing? And where in the country are you that HS kids don’t know how to use google. And then there’s the joke about kids being unable to grasp the simplest concepts at school yet they know the lore of Star Wars/marvel/hunger games/harry potter verbatim.

I work in the US and so many kids use Google like idiots. They know how to use it but they type full questions like it’s a human being and not like it’s just aggregating based on keywords. I promise you so many of these kids are awful with computers. Obviously they are much better with their phones and anything visual, touch based. Anyway the article just said Gen Z’s computer literacy is really bad and trails millennials despite being digital natives.

As a Millennial that manages a wide age range of staff, it has been very surprising to me that I need to help the Gen Z employees nearly as much as the boomers. Whereas the Millennials and Gen Xers don't typically need anywhere near as much handholding. I generally think the generational stereotypes are blown away out of proportion but wrt computer literacy, there is remarkable consistency. And the people I'm dealing with are engineers or engineering adjacent folks, a demographic that I would assume to be much more computer literate than the average.

100%. My parents are in their 70s and have become more adept at using computers than my HS kids. Phones for communication, games, pictures the kids blow them away no contest. But when it comes to doing something productive especially on a computer I think most people would be shocked by how similar those 2 generations are. And there literacy about what’s real, what’s a good source, etc is also shockingly similar.

100% on the bolded

 

[Ilov80s]

I don't have a hard stance either way, but this thread has helped me realize that focusing on the porn is probably no where near as important as focusing on the social media.

Year after year after year, we have to read terrible stories where kids (usually girls) are bullied so badly on social media and in extreme cases cause suicide. While I would think there are some downsides to watching porn as a kid, it feels almost insignificant compared to the damage being done across social media to kids.

I mean, if you're getting bullied on social media, wouldn't the solution be, to not go on social media. It's like a kid playing with matches and then blaming the matches when he gets burned.

That’s also cutting them off from their peers and all the things their peers will be doing and talking about. It’s more like telling a kid who plays football and is being picked on by teammates that it’s their own fault for not quitting the team.

Yes, and? It's football. Go play soccer.

Yikes. That's a pretty rough answer IMO. Your kid is being picked on instead of addressing that, you just blame your kid and tell them to quit what they are interested in.? You can raise your kids however you want but I really don't like that approach. It has some merit. Like I've worked with kids before who get picked on by kid A and yet they keep trying to talk with kid A in class. At some point that's on them to realize what kid A is best to be avoided. However, that is not at all the same as asking a kid to stop doing activities they enjoy or engaging in normal social activities because they are being picked on.

 

[Ilov80s]

How do you implement this to effectively thwart minors from accessing those sites without overburdening adults legitimately access those sites? Or put adults at risk for things such as identity theft, etc. I think this should be the predominant question.

Legal online sportsbooks have been doing this for several years now at tremendous scale. It's a problem that's been solved.

True although it sure seems like likes of parents are giving their kids access to their sportsbook accounts. I overheard so much sports betting talk in the hallways at HS. There is almost surely a huge (well even bigger than we already have) gambling problem coming a few years down the pipe.

 

[Rich Conway]

How do you implement this to effectively thwart minors from accessing those sites without overburdening adults legitimately access those sites? Or put adults at risk for things such as identity theft, etc. I think this should be the predominant question.

Legal online sportsbooks have been doing this for several years now at tremendous scale. It's a problem that's been solved.

You're thinking of the technical issues as opposed to the privacy issues. Going back to the first couple pages of this thread, the privacy issues have been entirely ignored.

 

[Bottomfeeder Sports]

How do you implement this to effectively thwart minors from accessing those sites without overburdening adults legitimately access those sites? Or put adults at risk for things such as identity theft, etc. I think this should be the predominant question.

Legal online sportsbooks have been doing this for several years now at tremendous scale. It's a problem that's been solved.

First, I don't use these sites so I don't know what is needed to access a sports book site. Would I need to login and do some form of second verification that it is me each time I access the site as well as providing some form of age verification at sign up? How long does that last before timing out?

I think as a society that sports books is more analogous to porn in that society doesn't care about the hurdles involved in signing in. That the ID requirements seem appropriate for Sports Book where the money is made on the bets (at least in theory, I'm guessing that these sites have a lot of the next sentence going on - ). But for social media where the money is made on knowing anything and everything about the user is providing such ID to the database a step too far?

As far as I'm concern, I stated the questions. I don't really know the answer to that last question if I assume that Facebook (for example) doesn't already have my driver's license (or whatever) information.

Finally, I have strong doubts that whatever is in place is working to keep teen bettors away, based on conversation I hear from teens on various prop bets.

 

[Bottomfeeder Sports]

True although it sure seems like likes of parents are giving their kids access to their sportsbook accounts. I overheard so much sports betting talk in the hallways at HS. There is almost surely a huge (well even bigger than we already have) gambling problem coming a few years down the pipe.

I'm not in a high school to hear this everyday like you are, but from my more limited interaction the sports betting talk is certainly there and I have my doubts that this is limited to access to parents' accounts (at least accounts parents actually know exist).