D. Williams 2006 = JJ Arrington 2005? (1 Viewer)

[LawFitz]

Per KFFL -

Aug 20 The Charlotte Observer reports Carolina Panthers rookie RB DeAngelo Williams has yet to have a "wow" play and he hasn't regularly had head-turning runs in training camp. He gained 7 yards on four carries during the first half running of Saturday's preseason game Aug. 21, behind the starting offensive line. In his first chances as a kickoff returner against the Jaguars, he gained 18 and 23 yards on his first two returns.



I understand it's preseason and way early to make any real judgments, but this is eerily reminiscent to me of Mr. Arrington's reviews from last year. I'm hoping DW proves much more successful in 2006 than JJ, but like a Pavlovian dog, I'm a little weirded out by this quote.

My gut says DW <> JJA based solely on DW's college career, but I need to keep a close eye on this kid. Returns will be somewhat telling if nothing else by showcasing his vision, speed and elusiveness. I like that he wanted to return kicks.

Any homer insight on him? Specifically, is he running hard or tentative and how's his pass protection coming along?

 

[Tillmanisahero]

Interesting thought..... BUMP

 

[beto]

I expected DWilliams to be pretty good in the NFL but his 1st preseason game was underwhelming. He certainly has more talent than Arrington, and his line is much better, so I expect him to show some this season.

 

[J-Co]

Well, the main difference IMO is that JJ Arrington was a projected starter and therefore was going much earlier than you should be able to get Williams this year.

 

[Yardage]

A little homer insight here...

At the beginning of training camp, there was a lot of excitement over Deangelo and talk of him immediately taking the 2nd string job and sharing some carries with Foster. The media was salivating over this guy and I have to admit that I was too. Then there was talk of Deangelo's fumbling problems in practice. Now all the talk is about how much depth Carolina has behind Foster (Eric Shelton, Goins, and Deangelo). Foster is the clear cut number 1 and Deangelo has done nothing to, well he's done nothing. Believe me this is a region where the media latches on to any player that can contibute anything and Deangelo has steadily dropped out of media discussions. If he even had ONE highlight (practices included) the media would be reporting it over and over, but that has not been the case at all.

 

[my man otis]

Well, the main difference IMO is that JJ Arrington was a projected starter and therefore was going much earlier than you should be able to get Williams this year.

good point. ADP plays a huge role. no one is drafting williams as a starter.

 

[Zaphod]

I expected DWilliams to be pretty good in the NFL but his 1st preseason game was underwhelming. He certainly has more talent than Arrington, and his line is much better, so I expect him to show some this season.

I have to say though that word out of camp and the message boards have been lukewarm on DW so far and that bears watching.

 

[BassNBrew]

The current talk around town is that he's tenanative and having trouble adjusting to the speed of the game, partially because he's attempting to line-up homerun plays. However, word is that he has the speed and skills to be sucessful, it's just taking him time to adapt.

As I've stated in numerous threads, DW whould not be on your re-draft roster this year.

 

[LawFitz]

A little homer insight here...

At the beginning of training camp, there was a lot of excitement over Deangelo and talk of him immediately taking the 2nd string job and sharing some carries with Foster. The media was salivating over this guy and I have to admit that I was too. Then there was talk of Deangelo's fumbling problems in practice. Now all the talk is about how much depth Carolina has behind Foster (Eric Shelton, Goins, and Deangelo). Foster is the clear cut number 1 and Deangelo has done nothing to, well he's done nothing. Believe me this is a region where the media latches on to any player that can contibute anything and Deangelo has steadily dropped out of media discussions. If he even had ONE highlight (practices included) the media would be reporting it over and over, but that has not been the case at all.

Wow.It's still early. Problem is I'm also high on Norwood and now with the Duckett trade do I cut D Will for Jerius??? Stinkin rookies!

His highlight reel has me mixed about Deangelo. While I see a small, tough runner with great burst and str8 line speed, I really question his size and his ability to break NFL tackles. Didn't see much of it there but most of the time he would be untouched in a juke or backfield burst. How often will he do that in the pros? Especially if he is skerred. And right now, he sounds a bit skerred.

Plus I see mostly weaker college opponents and not a ton of future NFLers. I also see why he would be a fumbler based on the way he cradles the ball.

The Panthers have a great running tradition, but they definitely value tough runners who can break NFL tackles. And in this video, there's no way he is playing at 217. He definitely doesn't look the same size as Emmitt as some have suggested.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=DWHHiJBURSM

How are his hands? I'd thought good, but now I can't really remember.

 

[BassNBrew]

The Panthers have a great running tradition

And size doesn't matter.Seriously, I hear this year after year and we get the likes of Walls, Rocket, Jeffers, Muhammy, Smith. Compare that to Biakabutka, Lane, Johnson, Foster, etc.

 

[Jeff Pasquino]

The current talk around town is that he's tenanative and having trouble adjusting to the speed of the game, partially because he's attempting to line-up homerun plays. However, word is that he has the speed and skills to be sucessful, it's just taking him time to adapt.As I've stated in numerous threads, DW whould not be on your re-draft roster this year.

So who's the 2, BnB?

 

[BassNBrew]

The current talk around town is that he's tenanative and having trouble adjusting to the speed of the game, partially because he's attempting to line-up homerun plays. However, word is that he has the speed and skills to be sucessful, it's just taking him time to adapt.As I've stated in numerous threads, DW whould not be on your re-draft roster this year.

So who's the 2, BnB?

Goings would start if Foster went down, however I suspect DW will get more touches as a change of pace as long as Foster is healthy.

 

[BassNBrew]

By the way, Foster is currently #11 in my rankings. I suspect he'll remain healthy as I just released him in a keeper for Caddy who I have at #4.

 

[LawFitz]

Watching the kid play this weekend, I definitely think he is better than JJ Arrington.

However, until he learns to play stronger, he won't be a feature back in this league. He definitely has potential though as he matures as a player and as a man. I'm not too concerned about some of the rookie errors other than the pass protection. That needs to and I feel will get better.

Having Deshaun there will be very good for Deangelo. He's not ready yet to shoulder the load. Acually, I'd say that if Deshaun gets hurt early, there's a decent chance that Goings would become #1, with Deangelo continuing a #2 role as a COP/breather guy.

Right now, he's a slightly larger Mo Drew. Which is not a bad thing at all.

Larry Maroney and Mike Bell will be the impact rookies this year ahead of Deangelo. But in future years, D Will could break out to be elite also.

 

[jurb26]

Watching the kid play this weekend, I definitely think he is better than JJ Arrington.However, until he learns to play stronger, he won't be a feature back in this league. He definitely has potential though as he matures as a player and as a man. I'm not too concerned about some of the rookie errors other than the pass protection. That needs to and I feel will get better.Having Deshaun there will be very good for Deangelo. He's not ready yet to shoulder the load. Acually, I'd say that if Deshaun gets hurt early, there's a decent chance that Goings would become #1, with Deangelo continuing a #2 role as a COP/breather guy.Right now, he's a slightly larger Mo Drew. Which is not a bad thing at all.Larry Maroney and Mike Bell will be the impact rookies this year ahead of Deangelo. But in future years, D Will could break out to be elite also.

I'm not sure what you saw in that game, but I thought Williams looked rather good in pass protection and ran with more power than Foster.

 

[The Man With No Name]

Williams was the starter in college at least 3 years. Arrington was behind Adimchinobe Echemandu when he was a junior. He only started 1 year.

Arrington had the starters job in 'zona practically given to him last year, Williams is clearly not the starter in Carolina, or was he expected to be the starter this year.

 

[LawFitz]

I'm not sure what you saw in that game, but I thought Williams looked rather good in pass protection and ran with more power than Foster.

Not me. I saw Foster run a lot harder. He just didn't have the lanes that D Will was creating through some sick cut backs and crazy burst.But D Will got blown back by blitzers a couple of times and clipped his own lineman on one play, causing a sack. He seemed a bit confused, but that's to be expected I guess.I just don't see him taking the job from Foster THIS year unless DF gets hurt. And even if Foster does go down, unless DW earns the trust of Fox in pass protection, he may not be featured.

 

[LawFitz]

Williams was the starter in college at least 3 years. Arrington was behind Adimchinobe Echemandu when he was a junior. He only started 1 year. Arrington had the starters job in 'zona practically given to him last year, Williams is clearly not the starter in Carolina, or was he expected to be the starter this year.

Agreed. It is a poor comparison at best. Other than stature, they are very different on many levels.

 

[jurb26]

I'm not sure what you saw in that game, but I thought Williams looked rather good in pass protection and ran with more power than Foster.

Not me. I saw Foster run a lot harder. He just didn't have the lanes that D Will was creating through some sick cut backs and crazy burst.But D Will got blown back by blitzers a couple of times and clipped his own lineman on one play, causing a sack. He seemed a bit confused, but that's to be expected I guess.I just don't see him taking the job from Foster THIS year unless DF gets hurt. And even if Foster does go down, unless DW earns the trust of Fox in pass protection, he may not be featured.

I have long been on the Foster band wagon. I would be shocked however if Williams did not take that job this year.

 

[LawFitz]

I have long been on the Foster band wagon. I would be shocked however if Williams did not take that job this year.

You're that high on him, huh? He did look pretty sick on a couple of those cutbacks. Kid's got crazy short range burst.

 

[Sweeper]

Last year there were a lot of expectations surrounding Arrington. He was given the starting role and it was believed that he could handle it so the Cards put all their eggs in that basket. I don't think any of us expected arizona to abandon the run the way they did and for Arrington to flop the way he did.

Williams is an unkown or untested talent. We (at least I <havent seen him play yet&gt haven't seen what he is capable of as a pro but even if he isn't able to perform (to expectations) at this stage of his career, Carolina has other options.

So if Williams breaks out then whoever drafted him ends up with a huge value pick. If he bombs, I don't think it will crush anyones expectations.

 

[KnowledgeReignsSupreme]

The one thing I took away from his preseason play is that he bounced everything to the outside. He took a huge risk bouncing to the outside when the Cats were at their own 1 or 2, but it ended up favorable for him. That could end up a safety a lot of times.

 

[jurb26]

I have long been on the Foster band wagon. I would be shocked however if Williams did not take that job this year.

You're that high on him, huh? He did look pretty sick on a couple of those cutbacks. Kid's got crazy short range burst.

I'm high on him, yes. I think I'm also just soured on Foster after 3 years of underachieving too.

 

[jurb26]

The one thing I took away from his preseason play is that he bounced everything to the outside. He took a huge risk bouncing to the outside when the Cats were at their own 1 or 2, but it ended up favorable for him. That could end up a safety a lot of times.

As stated int he game thread, that play was designed to go outside. He followed his pulling gaurd who turned the defender inside. When the play was up the middle, he took it there.

 

[KnowledgeReignsSupreme]

The one thing I took away from his preseason play is that he bounced everything to the outside. He took a huge risk bouncing to the outside when the Cats were at their own 1 or 2, but it ended up favorable for him. That could end up a safety a lot of times.

As stated int he game thread, that play was designed to go outside. He followed his pulling gaurd who turned the defender inside. When the play was up the middle, he took it there.

I know it was designed to go outside. He bounced to the outside, then bounced it again. Not real smart at your own 2 yard line.

 

[jurb26]

The one thing I took away from his preseason play is that he bounced everything to the outside. He took a huge risk bouncing to the outside when the Cats were at their own 1 or 2, but it ended up favorable for him. That could end up a safety a lot of times.

As stated int he game thread, that play was designed to go outside. He followed his pulling gaurd who turned the defender inside. When the play was up the middle, he took it there.

I know it was designed to go outside. He bounced to the outside, then bounced it again. Not real smart at your own 2 yard line.

He followed his lead blocker. I thought thats what RBs where supposed to do.

 

[LawFitz]

The one thing I took away from his preseason play is that he bounced everything to the outside. He took a huge risk bouncing to the outside when the Cats were at their own 1 or 2, but it ended up favorable for him. That could end up a safety a lot of times.

As stated int he game thread, that play was designed to go outside. He followed his pulling gaurd who turned the defender inside. When the play was up the middle, he took it there.

I know it was designed to go outside. He bounced to the outside, then bounced it again. Not real smart at your own 2 yard line.

He followed his lead blocker. I thought thats what RBs where supposed to do.

The veteran play there is one cut and plow to make sure you keep the ball out of the endzone.But the kid took a chance and had enough bounce and burst to get it done. Not a play you want your guy to try that close to the goal no matter his talent level, but it's a rookie mistake that he'll learn to not make as he plays more.The exciting part was that he actually made the play. Few RBs in this league have that kind of bounce & burst.

 

[FreeBaGeL]

The one thing I took away from his preseason play is that he bounced everything to the outside. He took a huge risk bouncing to the outside when the Cats were at their own 1 or 2, but it ended up favorable for him. That could end up a safety a lot of times.

As stated int he game thread, that play was designed to go outside. He followed his pulling gaurd who turned the defender inside. When the play was up the middle, he took it there.

I know it was designed to go outside. He bounced to the outside, then bounced it again. Not real smart at your own 2 yard line.

He followed his lead blocker. I thought thats what RBs where supposed to do.

The veteran play there is one cut and plow to make sure you keep the ball out of the endzone.But the kid took a chance and had enough bounce and burst to get it done. Not a play you want your guy to try that close to the goal no matter his talent level, but it's a rookie mistake that he'll learn to not make as he plays more.The exciting part was that he actually made the play. Few RBs in this league have that kind of bounce & burst.

It's not like he was standing in the endzone. If he gets tackled on that play it's not a safety, there's this magical thing in the NFL called forward progress.

 

[omally]

I have long been on the Foster band wagon. I would be shocked however if Williams did not take that job this year.

You're that high on him, huh? He did look pretty sick on a couple of those cutbacks. Kid's got crazy short range burst.

I'm high on him, yes. I think I'm also just soured on Foster after 3 years of underachieving too.

Underachieving? He wasn't the starting RB the last 3 years.

 

[Keys Myaths]

Well, the main difference IMO is that JJ Arrington was a projected starter and therefore was going much earlier than you should be able to get Williams this year.

Exactly what I was coming in here to say.

 

[jurb26]

I have long been on the Foster band wagon. I would be shocked however if Williams did not take that job this year.

You're that high on him, huh? He did look pretty sick on a couple of those cutbacks. Kid's got crazy short range burst.

I'm high on him, yes. I think I'm also just soured on Foster after 3 years of underachieving too.

Underachieving? He wasn't the starting RB the last 3 years.

Yes underachieving:

+--------------------------+-------------------------+				 |		  Rushing		 |		Receiving		|+----------+-----+--------------------------+-------------------------+| Year  TM |   G |   Att  Yards	Y/A   TD |   Rec  Yards   Y/R   TD |+----------+-----+--------------------------+-------------------------+| 2003 car |  14 |   113	429	3.8	0 |	26	207   8.0	2 || 2004 car |   4 |	59	255	4.3	2 |	 9	 76   8.4	0 || 2005 car |  15 |   205	879	4.3	2 |	34	372  10.9	1 |+----------+-----+--------------------------+-------------------------+|  TOTAL   |  33 |   377   1563	4.1	4 |	69	655   9.5	3 |

 

[omally]

I have long been on the Foster band wagon. I would be shocked however if Williams did not take that job this year.

You're that high on him, huh? He did look pretty sick on a couple of those cutbacks. Kid's got crazy short range burst.

I'm high on him, yes. I think I'm also just soured on Foster after 3 years of underachieving too.

Underachieving? He wasn't the starting RB the last 3 years.

Yes underachieving:

+--------------------------+-------------------------+				 |		  Rushing		 |		Receiving		|+----------+-----+--------------------------+-------------------------+| Year  TM |   G |   Att  Yards	Y/A   TD |   Rec  Yards   Y/R   TD |+----------+-----+--------------------------+-------------------------+| 2003 car |  14 |   113	429	3.8	0 |	26	207   8.0	2 || 2004 car |   4 |	59	255	4.3	2 |	 9	 76   8.4	0 || 2005 car |  15 |   205	879	4.3	2 |	34	372  10.9	1 |+----------+-----+--------------------------+-------------------------+|  TOTAL   |  33 |   377   1563	4.1	4 |	69	655   9.5	3 |

Those are stats which are misleading. Obviously you know nothing about his last 3 years with the Panthers.

 

[jurb26]

I have long been on the Foster band wagon. I would be shocked however if Williams did not take that job this year.

You're that high on him, huh? He did look pretty sick on a couple of those cutbacks. Kid's got crazy short range burst.

I'm high on him, yes. I think I'm also just soured on Foster after 3 years of underachieving too.

Underachieving? He wasn't the starting RB the last 3 years.

Yes underachieving:

+--------------------------+-------------------------+				 |		  Rushing		 |		Receiving		|+----------+-----+--------------------------+-------------------------+| Year  TM |   G |   Att  Yards	Y/A   TD |   Rec  Yards   Y/R   TD |+----------+-----+--------------------------+-------------------------+| 2003 car |  14 |   113	429	3.8	0 |	26	207   8.0	2 || 2004 car |   4 |	59	255	4.3	2 |	 9	 76   8.4	0 || 2005 car |  15 |   205	879	4.3	2 |	34	372  10.9	1 |+----------+-----+--------------------------+-------------------------+|  TOTAL   |  33 |   377   1563	4.1	4 |	69	655   9.5	3 |

Those are stats which are misleading. Obviously you know nothing about his last 3 years with the Panthers.

I know plenty. But since you seem to know so much more how about sharing.

 

[LawFitz]

It's not like he was standing in the endzone. If he gets tackled on that play it's not a safety, there's this magical thing in the NFL called forward progress.

Forward progress isn't marked if the runner runs backwards on his own. If you watch the play closely you'll see that when he bounced it outside, he pretty much side stepped and bounced backwards a bit onto the goal line. If that LB had tackled him and the bounce, it would've been very close to a safety.Either way, I'm telling my RB to make one cut and plow when we're backed up like that.