***David Wilson Bandwagon*** (1 Viewer)

[T with T]

hopefully wilson gets a majority of the 28 snaps Scott left on the field... Jacobs seemed to almost be phased out.

 

[sangreal]

13 carries on 45 % of the snaps tells me that he ran almost every time in game.... way to telegraph that one, they should just send over the playbook.

wut?

He is saying that they only put David Wilson in for running plays, so if you saw David Wilson you knew what was coming

 

[B-Deep]

So, more looks for Wilson appears in the cards. What if he fumbles again?

At this point, they're 0-4 and just cut Scott. They KNOW with 100% fact that Jacobs isn't any actual type of RB anymore. Hasn't been for years.I feel like at 0-4 this is ride or die for them and Wilson. I think regardless of his production or fumbles they're rolling with him for at least the next 2-3 games with confidence.

Someone mentioned this above and the thought did cross my mind. I wonder if the Front Office stepped in here in the cutting if Wilson. No GM wants to see their 1st Round pick being criminally under utilized for ridiculous reasons such as fumbles. I wouldn't be completely shocked if at 0-4 and the Giants still using Scott who is a borderline NFL talent at best, just as much as Wilson pissed the front office off. And Jerry Resse stepped in and cut him.

There could be some validity to this. I guess you have to figure, if you're not going to get anything from your Running Game. You might as well give it to a guy who has the potentially to break it for a 50 - 60 yard score; 14+ times a game.

Again, Wilson's fantasy value is going to rely on those "big plays". The more times he touches the ball, the more likely he is to break said plays.

Then again, Scott only had 6 touches last-week. But assuming Wilson inherits those 6 touches at the 4.2 YPC he had last game, he easily could have had a statline of about 85 Yards. Which wouldn't be terrible for Fantasy Purposes.

2 things.1. I thought he had no talent?

2. many of the best RBs in the NFL rely on big plays. Take away Petersons huge runs this season and his stat line is pathetic. Take away Charles and Spillers huge runs from last year same story. The truly "elite" RBs are almost never people who average 4.5ypc for real. They usually average 2.5ypc on 18 carries and then like 25ypc on two other carries.

1.) Quote me where I said, "David Wilson has no talent".

2.) Yeah, but Peterson uses an arsenal of moves to make his big plays. David Wilson uses perfect blocking to just run past everyone. The nature of their big plays are EXTREMELY different. In my opinion, Adrian Peterson is the kind of player who makes his own yards. David Wilson is not, his big plays are usually a product of perfect blocking where he goes 50+ yards untouchded.

What I'm trying to say is that I can more reasonable expect big plays from Peterson because he wills his way down the field. With someone like David Wilson, I have to hope the conditions are just right and the blocking is perfect. Obviously it's not a negative to have that kind of burst that David Wilson has.

But it's not something that I want to "rely on" for Fantasy Purposes. I'd be much happier if he'd juke a guy out; ran with patience; etc.

I still would love to be in your head to be able to see what you see. Every single professional fantasy and nfl analyst sees Wilson's running talent as elite. His speed, balance, agility and power are all on an elite level. I'd love to know how you and like 5 others in this thread are the only people who see him as a mediocre running talent.

how about a link to specific people calling him elite

give me

shefty

jaworski

theisman

dungy

ian rappaport

http://www.profootballweekly.com/prospects/player/david-wilson-4/

http://www.nfl.com/combine/profiles/david-wilson?id=2533035

http://hamptonroads.com/2012/04/what-theyre-saying-about-giants-pick-david-wilson-plus-more-draft-nuggets

i didn't see any of the guys i asked for

i was illustrating, again, the hyperbole

if EVERY SINGLE professional fantasy and NFL analyst says he is an elite talent, show me those ones please

had you said some, or many, you may be safe

you said every, because this thread is the place hyperbole come to dance and sing with each other

if the gist of this thread was just that Wilson has shown some ability, has talent some consider elite, and is struggling currently for many reasons and may turn it around I'd agree! I'd also say there's a chance he does not turn it around.

too often in trying to get some people to that level people are falling back on exaggeration to make their point, or make it look inevitable that he'll fit some preseason projections

he's a young RB, he has shown some flashes last year, he and his team are struggling, but he has a great matchup this week. That's the reality

 

[Khy]

13 carries on 45 % of the snaps tells me that he ran almost every time in game.... way to telegraph that one, they should just send over the playbook.

wut?

I mean I'm not mathematician but he ran 13 times on 29 snaps... 13/29 44.82% so he ran 44.82% of the time, 'most' of should at least be more than 50% of the time. That's still a rather large % of his snaps being runs. Most 'lead' RBs average I want to say around 30% or so of there overall snaps are running plays.

 

[Kool-Aid Larry]

13 carries on 45 % of the snaps tells me that he ran almost every time in game.... way to telegraph that one, they should just send over the playbook.

wut?

He is saying that they only put David Wilson in for running plays, so if you saw David Wilson you knew what was coming

I know their offense is shyte, but I'm pretty sure they manage more than 29 plays.

 

[MoveToSkypager]

" [barry Sanders} didn't make ankle breaking cuts..."

Maybe he meant literally, like Barry Sanders isn't an orthopedic surgeon

 

[lbouchard]

This post is hidden because you have chosen to ignore posts by T with T. View it anyway?

Makes this thread somewhat bearable.

 

[FlapJacks]

45 percent of the snaps scares me.... All this brandon jacobs role to increase sucks to.... Maybe wilson isn't gonna be featured... at least if wilson can play 3rd down and get 15-18 touches could be relevant... Gl would be nice inside 3 ... maybe at 1 put in jacobs.

Do you honestly think Jacobs role will increase substantially? Honestly?

If anything, I see Jacobs getting the goal line work, which I think will be short lived as well. There's no way of knowing though because the Giants never get to the goal line.

I can see Jacobs getting 3rd down work

Scott was only getting 1-5 carries most weeks anyway. They could easily add that to Jacobs' workload...

 

[Khy]

So, more looks for Wilson appears in the cards. What if he fumbles again?

At this point, they're 0-4 and just cut Scott. They KNOW with 100% fact that Jacobs isn't any actual type of RB anymore. Hasn't been for years.I feel like at 0-4 this is ride or die for them and Wilson. I think regardless of his production or fumbles they're rolling with him for at least the next 2-3 games with confidence.

Someone mentioned this above and the thought did cross my mind. I wonder if the Front Office stepped in here in the cutting if Wilson. No GM wants to see their 1st Round pick being criminally under utilized for ridiculous reasons such as fumbles. I wouldn't be completely shocked if at 0-4 and the Giants still using Scott who is a borderline NFL talent at best, just as much as Wilson pissed the front office off. And Jerry Resse stepped in and cut him.

There could be some validity to this. I guess you have to figure, if you're not going to get anything from your Running Game. You might as well give it to a guy who has the potentially to break it for a 50 - 60 yard score; 14+ times a game.

Again, Wilson's fantasy value is going to rely on those "big plays". The more times he touches the ball, the more likely he is to break said plays.

Then again, Scott only had 6 touches last-week. But assuming Wilson inherits those 6 touches at the 4.2 YPC he had last game, he easily could have had a statline of about 85 Yards. Which wouldn't be terrible for Fantasy Purposes.

2 things.1. I thought he had no talent?

2. many of the best RBs in the NFL rely on big plays. Take away Petersons huge runs this season and his stat line is pathetic. Take away Charles and Spillers huge runs from last year same story. The truly "elite" RBs are almost never people who average 4.5ypc for real. They usually average 2.5ypc on 18 carries and then like 25ypc on two other carries.

1.) Quote me where I said, "David Wilson has no talent".

2.) Yeah, but Peterson uses an arsenal of moves to make his big plays. David Wilson uses perfect blocking to just run past everyone. The nature of their big plays are EXTREMELY different. In my opinion, Adrian Peterson is the kind of player who makes his own yards. David Wilson is not, his big plays are usually a product of perfect blocking where he goes 50+ yards untouchded.

What I'm trying to say is that I can more reasonable expect big plays from Peterson because he wills his way down the field. With someone like David Wilson, I have to hope the conditions are just right and the blocking is perfect. Obviously it's not a negative to have that kind of burst that David Wilson has.

But it's not something that I want to "rely on" for Fantasy Purposes. I'd be much happier if he'd juke a guy out; ran with patience; etc.

I still would love to be in your head to be able to see what you see. Every single professional fantasy and nfl analyst sees Wilson's running talent as elite. His speed, balance, agility and power are all on an elite level. I'd love to know how you and like 5 others in this thread are the only people who see him as a mediocre running talent.

how about a link to specific people calling him elite

give me

shefty

jaworski

theisman

dungy

ian rappaport

http://www.profootballweekly.com/prospects/player/david-wilson-4/

http://www.nfl.com/combine/profiles/david-wilson?id=2533035

http://hamptonroads.com/2012/04/what-theyre-saying-about-giants-pick-david-wilson-plus-more-draft-nuggets

i didn't see any of the guys i asked for

i was illustrating, again, the hyperbole

if EVERY SINGLE professional fantasy and NFL analyst says he is an elite talent, show me those ones please

had you said some, or many, you may be safe

you said every, because this thread is the place hyperbole come to dance and sing with each other

if the gist of this thread was just that Wilson has shown some ability, has talent some consider elite, and is struggling currently for many reasons and may turn it around I'd agree! I'd also say there's a chance he does not turn it around.

too often in trying to get some people to that level people are falling back on exaggeration to make their point, or make it look inevitable that he'll fit some preseason projections

he's a young RB, he has shown some flashes last year, he and his team are struggling, but he has a great matchup this week. That's the reality

I've said several times that nobody knows what Wilson's future holds. That doesn't mean his skillsets and measurables aren't elite. A lot of players have elite skillsets and measurables and never amount to anything for so many reasons. Whether it be they can't keep themselves out of off the field trouble, they can't fix the small intangibles of the game (for Wilson an example would be his pass blocking), they can't stay healthy (thinking Jonathan Stewart types here), they get into the NFL and just can't adjust to the speed or they just can't get past the mental part of the game to push themselves past mediocre and into elite (Think Jay Cutler).

What we know of Wilson so far though is that he doesn't have off the field issues, so we can check that one off as a success.

He, at least till this point in his college and professional career hasn't had any real injury history so for now check that one off.

We could probably say with about 80%+ accuracy that he's not having issues adjusting to the speed of the game, he show a lot of flashes last season that he has that under control.

We're unsure of his small intangibles issues... he has a few of them: Pass blocking looks like it's improving but we need more data points to be sure. He seems to be getting better at keeping runs on their designed path and not bouncing to the outside as much. He seems to also be getting better at not trying to make every 1-2 yard run into a TD and just taking what he can get. Again with these we need more data points on all of them, but he's definitely shown improvement

These are the things we know... besides the Giants all around issues, things seem to be pointing in the right direction for Wilson. What we really need is more data points to really know how he's going to turn out. He's had a rough start to the season but if you're actually watching the games, watching his snaps and evaluating them with a clean head you can see that things ARE improving. He just needs to keep the improvements coming. Keep building that confidence and keep making the most of his playing time, which he's been doing these past few weeks (even if some people don't think the stat lines show it).

 

[Kool-Aid Larry]

45 percent of the snaps scares me.... All this brandon jacobs role to increase sucks to.... Maybe wilson isn't gonna be featured... at least if wilson can play 3rd down and get 15-18 touches could be relevant... Gl would be nice inside 3 ... maybe at 1 put in jacobs.

Do you honestly think Jacobs role will increase substantially? Honestly?

If anything, I see Jacobs getting the goal line work, which I think will be short lived as well. There's no way of knowing though because the Giants never get to the goal line.

I can see Jacobs getting 3rd down work

Scott was only getting 1-5 carries most weeks anyway. They could easily add that to Jacobs' workload...

yeah, I doubt he's tired from the 5 yds he's running now.

 

[B-Deep]

So, more looks for Wilson appears in the cards. What if he fumbles again?

At this point, they're 0-4 and just cut Scott. They KNOW with 100% fact that Jacobs isn't any actual type of RB anymore. Hasn't been for years.I feel like at 0-4 this is ride or die for them and Wilson. I think regardless of his production or fumbles they're rolling with him for at least the next 2-3 games with confidence.

Someone mentioned this above and the thought did cross my mind. I wonder if the Front Office stepped in here in the cutting if Wilson. No GM wants to see their 1st Round pick being criminally under utilized for ridiculous reasons such as fumbles. I wouldn't be completely shocked if at 0-4 and the Giants still using Scott who is a borderline NFL talent at best, just as much as Wilson pissed the front office off. And Jerry Resse stepped in and cut him.

There could be some validity to this. I guess you have to figure, if you're not going to get anything from your Running Game. You might as well give it to a guy who has the potentially to break it for a 50 - 60 yard score; 14+ times a game.

Again, Wilson's fantasy value is going to rely on those "big plays". The more times he touches the ball, the more likely he is to break said plays.

Then again, Scott only had 6 touches last-week. But assuming Wilson inherits those 6 touches at the 4.2 YPC he had last game, he easily could have had a statline of about 85 Yards. Which wouldn't be terrible for Fantasy Purposes.

2 things.1. I thought he had no talent?

2. many of the best RBs in the NFL rely on big plays. Take away Petersons huge runs this season and his stat line is pathetic. Take away Charles and Spillers huge runs from last year same story. The truly "elite" RBs are almost never people who average 4.5ypc for real. They usually average 2.5ypc on 18 carries and then like 25ypc on two other carries.

1.) Quote me where I said, "David Wilson has no talent".

2.) Yeah, but Peterson uses an arsenal of moves to make his big plays. David Wilson uses perfect blocking to just run past everyone. The nature of their big plays are EXTREMELY different. In my opinion, Adrian Peterson is the kind of player who makes his own yards. David Wilson is not, his big plays are usually a product of perfect blocking where he goes 50+ yards untouchded.

What I'm trying to say is that I can more reasonable expect big plays from Peterson because he wills his way down the field. With someone like David Wilson, I have to hope the conditions are just right and the blocking is perfect. Obviously it's not a negative to have that kind of burst that David Wilson has.

But it's not something that I want to "rely on" for Fantasy Purposes. I'd be much happier if he'd juke a guy out; ran with patience; etc.

I still would love to be in your head to be able to see what you see. Every single professional fantasy and nfl analyst sees Wilson's running talent as elite. His speed, balance, agility and power are all on an elite level. I'd love to know how you and like 5 others in this thread are the only people who see him as a mediocre running talent.

how about a link to specific people calling him elite

give me

shefty

jaworski

theisman

dungy

ian rappaport

http://www.profootballweekly.com/prospects/player/david-wilson-4/

http://www.nfl.com/combine/profiles/david-wilson?id=2533035

http://hamptonroads.com/2012/04/what-theyre-saying-about-giants-pick-david-wilson-plus-more-draft-nuggets

i didn't see any of the guys i asked for

i was illustrating, again, the hyperbole

if EVERY SINGLE professional fantasy and NFL analyst says he is an elite talent, show me those ones please

had you said some, or many, you may be safe

you said every, because this thread is the place hyperbole come to dance and sing with each other

if the gist of this thread was just that Wilson has shown some ability, has talent some consider elite, and is struggling currently for many reasons and may turn it around I'd agree! I'd also say there's a chance he does not turn it around.

too often in trying to get some people to that level people are falling back on exaggeration to make their point, or make it look inevitable that he'll fit some preseason projections

he's a young RB, he has shown some flashes last year, he and his team are struggling, but he has a great matchup this week. That's the reality

I've said several times that nobody knows what Wilson's future holds. That doesn't mean his skillsets and measurables aren't elite. A lot of players have elite skillsets and measurables and never amount to anything for so many reasons. Whether it be they can't keep themselves out of off the field trouble, they can't fix the small intangibles of the game (for Wilson an example would be his pass blocking), they can't stay healthy (thinking Jonathan Stewart types here), they get into the NFL and just can't adjust to the speed or they just can't get past the mental part of the game to push themselves past mediocre and into elite (Think Jay Cutler).

What we know of Wilson so far though is that he doesn't have off the field issues, so we can check that one off as a success.

He, at least till this point in his college and professional career hasn't had any real injury history so for now check that one off.

We could probably say with about 80%+ accuracy that he's not having issues adjusting to the speed of the game, he show a lot of flashes last season that he has that under control.

We're unsure of his small intangibles issues... he has a few of them: Pass blocking looks like it's improving but we need more data points to be sure. He seems to be getting better at keeping runs on their designed path and not bouncing to the outside as much. He seems to also be getting better at not trying to make every 1-2 yard run into a TD and just taking what he can get. Again with these we need more data points on all of them, but he's definitely shown improvement

These are the things we know... besides the Giants all around issues, things seem to be pointing in the right direction for Wilson. What we really need is more data points to really know how he's going to turn out. He's had a rough start to the season but if you're actually watching the games, watching his snaps and evaluating them with a clean head you can see that things ARE improving. He just needs to keep the improvements coming. Keep building that confidence and keep making the most of his playing time, which he's been doing these past few weeks (even if some people don't think the stat lines show it).

in other words

Wilson has shown some ability, has talent some consider elite, and is struggling currently for many reasons and may turn it around .

or

he's a young RB, he has shown some flashes last year, he and his team are struggling, but he has a great matchup this week

and sure he is trending up, he kind of had to. And the Scott release coupled with a pourous defense in the eagles gives himm a real chance. And if he does well I'll come in and say he looked good, and we know he has games against soft defenses so his chances of turning things around are improving.

Conversely, if he rushes for 53 yards on 19 carries with no TDs and no receptions some people's positions that he is destined for uberstudness would not waiver.

 

[FlapJacks]

So, more looks for Wilson appears in the cards. What if he fumbles again?

At this point, they're 0-4 and just cut Scott. They KNOW with 100% fact that Jacobs isn't any actual type of RB anymore. Hasn't been for years.I feel like at 0-4 this is ride or die for them and Wilson. I think regardless of his production or fumbles they're rolling with him for at least the next 2-3 games with confidence.

Someone mentioned this above and the thought did cross my mind. I wonder if the Front Office stepped in here in the cutting if Wilson. No GM wants to see their 1st Round pick being criminally under utilized for ridiculous reasons such as fumbles. I wouldn't be completely shocked if at 0-4 and the Giants still using Scott who is a borderline NFL talent at best, just as much as Wilson pissed the front office off. And Jerry Resse stepped in and cut him.

There could be some validity to this. I guess you have to figure, if you're not going to get anything from your Running Game. You might as well give it to a guy who has the potentially to break it for a 50 - 60 yard score; 14+ times a game.

Again, Wilson's fantasy value is going to rely on those "big plays". The more times he touches the ball, the more likely he is to break said plays.

Then again, Scott only had 6 touches last-week. But assuming Wilson inherits those 6 touches at the 4.2 YPC he had last game, he easily could have had a statline of about 85 Yards. Which wouldn't be terrible for Fantasy Purposes.

2 things.1. I thought he had no talent?

2. many of the best RBs in the NFL rely on big plays. Take away Petersons huge runs this season and his stat line is pathetic. Take away Charles and Spillers huge runs from last year same story. The truly "elite" RBs are almost never people who average 4.5ypc for real. They usually average 2.5ypc on 18 carries and then like 25ypc on two other carries.

1.) Quote me where I said, "David Wilson has no talent".

2.) Yeah, but Peterson uses an arsenal of moves to make his big plays. David Wilson uses perfect blocking to just run past everyone. The nature of their big plays are EXTREMELY different. In my opinion, Adrian Peterson is the kind of player who makes his own yards. David Wilson is not, his big plays are usually a product of perfect blocking where he goes 50+ yards untouchded.

What I'm trying to say is that I can more reasonable expect big plays from Peterson because he wills his way down the field. With someone like David Wilson, I have to hope the conditions are just right and the blocking is perfect. Obviously it's not a negative to have that kind of burst that David Wilson has.

But it's not something that I want to "rely on" for Fantasy Purposes. I'd be much happier if he'd juke a guy out; ran with patience; etc.

I still would love to be in your head to be able to see what you see. Every single professional fantasy and nfl analyst sees Wilson's running talent as elite. His speed, balance, agility and power are all on an elite level. I'd love to know how you and like 5 others in this thread are the only people who see him as a mediocre running talent.

how about a link to specific people calling him elite

give me

shefty

jaworski

theisman

dungy

ian rappaport

http://www.profootballweekly.com/prospects/player/david-wilson-4/

http://www.nfl.com/combine/profiles/david-wilson?id=2533035

http://hamptonroads.com/2012/04/what-theyre-saying-about-giants-pick-david-wilson-plus-more-draft-nuggets

i didn't see any of the guys i asked for

i was illustrating, again, the hyperbole

if EVERY SINGLE professional fantasy and NFL analyst says he is an elite talent, show me those ones please

had you said some, or many, you may be safe

you said every, because this thread is the place hyperbole come to dance and sing with each other

if the gist of this thread was just that Wilson has shown some ability, has talent some consider elite, and is struggling currently for many reasons and may turn it around I'd agree! I'd also say there's a chance he does not turn it around.

too often in trying to get some people to that level people are falling back on exaggeration to make their point, or make it look inevitable that he'll fit some preseason projections

he's a young RB, he has shown some flashes last year, he and his team are struggling, but he has a great matchup this week. That's the reality

To be fair, none of the links provided describe him as "elite"

 

[Coeur de Lion]

This post is hidden because you have chosen to ignore posts by T with T. View it anyway?

Makes this thread somewhat bearable.

Big mistake IMO. hes weigh to funy too egnore CHOO CHOO!?$&!!!!!!

 

[TheFanatic]

So, more looks for Wilson appears in the cards. What if he fumbles again?

At this point, they're 0-4 and just cut Scott. They KNOW with 100% fact that Jacobs isn't any actual type of RB anymore. Hasn't been for years.I feel like at 0-4 this is ride or die for them and Wilson. I think regardless of his production or fumbles they're rolling with him for at least the next 2-3 games with confidence.

Someone mentioned this above and the thought did cross my mind. I wonder if the Front Office stepped in here in the cutting if Wilson. No GM wants to see their 1st Round pick being criminally under utilized for ridiculous reasons such as fumbles. I wouldn't be completely shocked if at 0-4 and the Giants still using Scott who is a borderline NFL talent at best, just as much as Wilson pissed the front office off. And Jerry Resse stepped in and cut him.

There could be some validity to this. I guess you have to figure, if you're not going to get anything from your Running Game. You might as well give it to a guy who has the potentially to break it for a 50 - 60 yard score; 14+ times a game.

Again, Wilson's fantasy value is going to rely on those "big plays". The more times he touches the ball, the more likely he is to break said plays.

Then again, Scott only had 6 touches last-week. But assuming Wilson inherits those 6 touches at the 4.2 YPC he had last game, he easily could have had a statline of about 85 Yards. Which wouldn't be terrible for Fantasy Purposes.

2 things.1. I thought he had no talent?

2. many of the best RBs in the NFL rely on big plays. Take away Petersons huge runs this season and his stat line is pathetic. Take away Charles and Spillers huge runs from last year same story. The truly "elite" RBs are almost never people who average 4.5ypc for real. They usually average 2.5ypc on 18 carries and then like 25ypc on two other carries.

1.) Quote me where I said, "David Wilson has no talent".

2.) Yeah, but Peterson uses an arsenal of moves to make his big plays. David Wilson uses perfect blocking to just run past everyone. The nature of their big plays are EXTREMELY different. In my opinion, Adrian Peterson is the kind of player who makes his own yards. David Wilson is not, his big plays are usually a product of perfect blocking where he goes 50+ yards untouchded.

What I'm trying to say is that I can more reasonable expect big plays from Peterson because he wills his way down the field. With someone like David Wilson, I have to hope the conditions are just right and the blocking is perfect. Obviously it's not a negative to have that kind of burst that David Wilson has.

But it's not something that I want to "rely on" for Fantasy Purposes. I'd be much happier if he'd juke a guy out; ran with patience; etc.

I still would love to be in your head to be able to see what you see. Every single professional fantasy and nfl analyst sees Wilson's running talent as elite. His speed, balance, agility and power are all on an elite level. I'd love to know how you and like 5 others in this thread are the only people who see him as a mediocre running talent.

how about a link to specific people calling him elite

give me

shefty

jaworski

theisman

dungy

ian rappaport

http://www.profootballweekly.com/prospects/player/david-wilson-4/

http://www.nfl.com/combine/profiles/david-wilson?id=2533035

http://hamptonroads.com/2012/04/what-theyre-saying-about-giants-pick-david-wilson-plus-more-draft-nuggets

i didn't see any of the guys i asked for

i was illustrating, again, the hyperbole

if EVERY SINGLE professional fantasy and NFL analyst says he is an elite talent, show me those ones please

had you said some, or many, you may be safe

you said every, because this thread is the place hyperbole come to dance and sing with each other

if the gist of this thread was just that Wilson has shown some ability, has talent some consider elite, and is struggling currently for many reasons and may turn it around I'd agree! I'd also say there's a chance he does not turn it around.

too often in trying to get some people to that level people are falling back on exaggeration to make their point, or make it look inevitable that he'll fit some preseason projections

he's a young RB, he has shown some flashes last year, he and his team are struggling, but he has a great matchup this week. That's the reality

Oh, that's what you wanted? You asked for Schefty which is a reporter for the NFL. He's not a talent evaluator.

Rapoprt is pretty much the same as Schefter. They both report what other people say.

Jaworski pretty much only comments on QB's.

Theisman is an idiot.

Dungy isn't a writer. He's a commentator on SNF, and halftime at that, and thus he is only going to comment on Wilson if Wilson is in the game and then it will only be in video.

But this tells me a lot if this is who you rely on to get your fantasy information about RB's. Theisman, really? Rely on Schefty and Rapoport to tell you that someone else says Wilson is great. They are media insiders, not talent scouts. And I have to say it again, Theisman?

I showed something from Sports Illustrated that actually used the word Elite. Msudaisy lists Pro Football Weekly AND NFL.com.

Here's something from the BleacherReport:

"He adds a whole new element to New York’s offense. A playmaker who only needs one play to take it to the house demands special attention from a defense."

Here's a quote from Yahoo Sports where the writer uses the word elite not once but twice:

"Purely in terms of running skill set, I believe David Wilson has the physical tools to develop into an elite NFL back. And I'm not using "elite" lightly. Wilson has a highly explosive first step, and runs with velocity both between the tackles and in high-traffic perimeter areas. He is vertically and laterally dangerous, possessing natural elusiveness, an outstanding ability to beat first contact, and breakaway long speed. Wilson measured only 5-foot-9 5/8 and 206 pounds at the Combine, but flashes genuine power. Wilson has a powerful lower body and can run with leg drive. He is capable of moving a pile. Wilson plays fast and physical and is an extremely competitive back."

This from FootballNation.com:

"Wilson has all the tools necessary to become an elite running back in the NFL."

This from the SportingNews and this is after his slow start:

"Wilson was repeatedly hit in the backfield early in the game, before finding something of a late-game rhythm and breaking off several impressive runs between the tackles. He also had a 17-yard touchdown called back on a holding penalty by LT William Beatty. Wilson has elite talent, but he's going to need more help from his teammates and coaching staff before he gets back on track"

And finally, in this article on BigBlueView.com that quotes from an ESPN article (which I won't go find because I'm already being a monkey here doing work you could easily do, but for some reason won't) where they project the top RB's in a couple years and this guy is projected ahead of CJ Spiller and Charles.

I can do this all day. But I won't. I have other things to do. Somehow, I will assume that this won't be enough for you...

 

[Kenny Powers]

Just a thought. There were rumors last week of Nicks being traded to Detroit for LeShoure and a 2nd round pick (I think 2nd). And they were debunked. Maybe they were in talks and now that they are 0-4 and unlikely to resign Nicks they are trading him. And they are releasing Scott to make room for some part of a trade? No proof obviously, but nothing about this release makes sense to me. And a release to make trade room makes more sense.

We can hope. That would be a nice deal for both teams. Too good to be true.

That would be a nice deal for fantasy owners, that move sucks for Detroit

Any chance you were huffing spray paint when you made this post yesterday?

 

[Concept Coop]

Just a thought. There were rumors last week of Nicks being traded to Detroit for LeShoure and a 2nd round pick (I think 2nd). And they were debunked. Maybe they were in talks and now that they are 0-4 and unlikely to resign Nicks they are trading him. And they are releasing Scott to make room for some part of a trade? No proof obviously, but nothing about this release makes sense to me. And a release to make trade room makes more sense.

We can hope. That would be a nice deal for both teams. Too good to be true.

That would be a nice deal for fantasy owners, that move sucks for Detroit

Any chance you were huffing spray paint when you made this post yesterday?

Nicks isn't worth a 2nd round pick right now. Especially as he's not locked up. It would be a bad trade for the Lions.

 

[Pigskin Fanatic]

Theisman is an idiot.

can't argue with this, though some may try.

carry on.

 

[duaneok66]

So, more looks for Wilson appears in the cards. What if he fumbles again?

At this point, they're 0-4 and just cut Scott. They KNOW with 100% fact that Jacobs isn't any actual type of RB anymore. Hasn't been for years.I feel like at 0-4 this is ride or die for them and Wilson. I think regardless of his production or fumbles they're rolling with him for at least the next 2-3 games with confidence.

Someone mentioned this above and the thought did cross my mind. I wonder if the Front Office stepped in here in the cutting if Wilson. No GM wants to see their 1st Round pick being criminally under utilized for ridiculous reasons such as fumbles. I wouldn't be completely shocked if at 0-4 and the Giants still using Scott who is a borderline NFL talent at best, just as much as Wilson pissed the front office off. And Jerry Resse stepped in and cut him.

There could be some validity to this. I guess you have to figure, if you're not going to get anything from your Running Game. You might as well give it to a guy who has the potentially to break it for a 50 - 60 yard score; 14+ times a game.

Again, Wilson's fantasy value is going to rely on those "big plays". The more times he touches the ball, the more likely he is to break said plays.

Then again, Scott only had 6 touches last-week. But assuming Wilson inherits those 6 touches at the 4.2 YPC he had last game, he easily could have had a statline of about 85 Yards. Which wouldn't be terrible for Fantasy Purposes.

2 things.1. I thought he had no talent?

2. many of the best RBs in the NFL rely on big plays. Take away Petersons huge runs this season and his stat line is pathetic. Take away Charles and Spillers huge runs from last year same story. The truly "elite" RBs are almost never people who average 4.5ypc for real. They usually average 2.5ypc on 18 carries and then like 25ypc on two other carries.

1.) Quote me where I said, "David Wilson has no talent".

2.) Yeah, but Peterson uses an arsenal of moves to make his big plays. David Wilson uses perfect blocking to just run past everyone. The nature of their big plays are EXTREMELY different. In my opinion, Adrian Peterson is the kind of player who makes his own yards. David Wilson is not, his big plays are usually a product of perfect blocking where he goes 50+ yards untouchded.

What I'm trying to say is that I can more reasonable expect big plays from Peterson because he wills his way down the field. With someone like David Wilson, I have to hope the conditions are just right and the blocking is perfect. Obviously it's not a negative to have that kind of burst that David Wilson has.

But it's not something that I want to "rely on" for Fantasy Purposes. I'd be much happier if he'd juke a guy out; ran with patience; etc.

I still would love to be in your head to be able to see what you see. Every single professional fantasy and nfl analyst sees Wilson's running talent as elite. His speed, balance, agility and power are all on an elite level. I'd love to know how you and like 5 others in this thread are the only people who see him as a mediocre running talent.

how about a link to specific people calling him elite

give me

shefty

jaworski

theisman

dungy

ian rappaport

http://www.profootballweekly.com/prospects/player/david-wilson-4/

http://www.nfl.com/combine/profiles/david-wilson?id=2533035

http://hamptonroads.com/2012/04/what-theyre-saying-about-giants-pick-david-wilson-plus-more-draft-nuggets

i didn't see any of the guys i asked for

i was illustrating, again, the hyperbole

if EVERY SINGLE professional fantasy and NFL analyst says he is an elite talent, show me those ones please

had you said some, or many, you may be safe

you said every, because this thread is the place hyperbole come to dance and sing with each other

if the gist of this thread was just that Wilson has shown some ability, has talent some consider elite, and is struggling currently for many reasons and may turn it around I'd agree! I'd also say there's a chance he does not turn it around.

too often in trying to get some people to that level people are falling back on exaggeration to make their point, or make it look inevitable that he'll fit some preseason projections

he's a young RB, he has shown some flashes last year, he and his team are struggling, but he has a great matchup this week. That's the reality

Oh, that's what you wanted? You asked for Schefty which is a reporter for the NFL. He's not a talent evaluator.

Rapoprt is pretty much the same as Schefter. They both report what other people say.

Jaworski pretty much only comments on QB's.

Theisman is an idiot.

Dungy isn't a writer. He's a commentator on SNF, and halftime at that, and thus he is only going to comment on Wilson if Wilson is in the game and then it will only be in video.

But this tells me a lot if this is who you rely on to get your fantasy information about RB's. Theisman, really? Rely on Schefty and Rapoport to tell you that someone else says Wilson is great. They are media insiders, not talent scouts. And I have to say it again, Theisman?

I showed something from Sports Illustrated that actually used the word Elite. Msudaisy lists Pro Football Weekly AND NFL.com.

Here's something from the BleacherReport:

"He adds a whole new element to New York’s offense. A playmaker who only needs one play to take it to the house demands special attention from a defense."

Here's a quote from Yahoo Sports where the writer uses the word elite not once but twice:

"Purely in terms of running skill set, I believe David Wilson has the physical tools to develop into an elite NFL back. And I'm not using "elite" lightly. Wilson has a highly explosive first step, and runs with velocity both between the tackles and in high-traffic perimeter areas. He is vertically and laterally dangerous, possessing natural elusiveness, an outstanding ability to beat first contact, and breakaway long speed. Wilson measured only 5-foot-9 5/8 and 206 pounds at the Combine, but flashes genuine power. Wilson has a powerful lower body and can run with leg drive. He is capable of moving a pile. Wilson plays fast and physical and is an extremely competitive back."

This from FootballNation.com:

"Wilson has all the tools necessary to become an elite running back in the NFL."

This from the SportingNews and this is after his slow start:

"Wilson was repeatedly hit in the backfield early in the game, before finding something of a late-game rhythm and breaking off several impressive runs between the tackles. He also had a 17-yard touchdown called back on a holding penalty by LT William Beatty. Wilson has elite talent, but he's going to need more help from his teammates and coaching staff before he gets back on track"

And finally, in this article on BigBlueView.com that quotes from an ESPN article (which I won't go find because I'm already being a monkey here doing work you could easily do, but for some reason won't) where they project the top RB's in a couple years and this guy is projected ahead of CJ Spiller and Charles.

I can do this all day. But I won't. I have other things to do. Somehow, I will assume that this won't be enough for you...

In the sporting world, the word "elite" has been used so much that it's lost a lot of its meaning.

 

[Khy]

i was illustrating, again, the hyperbole

if EVERY SINGLE professional fantasy and NFL analyst says he is an elite talent, show me those ones please

had you said some, or many, you may be safe

you said every, because this thread is the place hyperbole come to dance and sing with each other

if the gist of this thread was just that Wilson has shown some ability, has talent some consider elite, and is struggling currently for many reasons and may turn it around I'd agree! I'd also say there's a chance he does not turn it around.

too often in trying to get some people to that level people are falling back on exaggeration to make their point, or make it look inevitable that he'll fit some preseason projections

he's a young RB, he has shown some flashes last year, he and his team are struggling, but he has a great matchup this week. That's the reality

Oh, that's what you wanted? You asked for Schefty which is a reporter for the NFL. He's not a talent evaluator.

Rapoprt is pretty much the same as Schefter. They both report what other people say.

Jaworski pretty much only comments on QB's.

Theisman is an idiot.

Dungy isn't a writer. He's a commentator on SNF, and halftime at that, and thus he is only going to comment on Wilson if Wilson is in the game and then it will only be in video.

But this tells me a lot if this is who you rely on to get your fantasy information about RB's. Theisman, really? Rely on Schefty and Rapoport to tell you that someone else says Wilson is great. They are media insiders, not talent scouts. And I have to say it again, Theisman?

I showed something from Sports Illustrated that actually used the word Elite. Msudaisy lists Pro Football Weekly AND NFL.com.

Here's something from the BleacherReport:

"He adds a whole new element to New York’s offense. A playmaker who only needs one play to take it to the house demands special attention from a defense."

Here's a quote from Yahoo Sports where the writer uses the word elite not once but twice:

"Purely in terms of running skill set, I believe David Wilson has the physical tools to develop into an elite NFL back. And I'm not using "elite" lightly. Wilson has a highly explosive first step, and runs with velocity both between the tackles and in high-traffic perimeter areas. He is vertically and laterally dangerous, possessing natural elusiveness, an outstanding ability to beat first contact, and breakaway long speed. Wilson measured only 5-foot-9 5/8 and 206 pounds at the Combine, but flashes genuine power. Wilson has a powerful lower body and can run with leg drive. He is capable of moving a pile. Wilson plays fast and physical and is an extremely competitive back."

This from FootballNation.com:

"Wilson has all the tools necessary to become an elite running back in the NFL."

This from the SportingNews and this is after his slow start:

"Wilson was repeatedly hit in the backfield early in the game, before finding something of a late-game rhythm and breaking off several impressive runs between the tackles. He also had a 17-yard touchdown called back on a holding penalty by LT William Beatty. Wilson has elite talent, but he's going to need more help from his teammates and coaching staff before he gets back on track"

And finally, in this article on BigBlueView.com that quotes from an ESPN article (which I won't go find because I'm already being a monkey here doing work you could easily do, but for some reason won't) where they project the top RB's in a couple years and this guy is projected ahead of CJ Spiller and Charles.

I can do this all day. But I won't. I have other things to do. Somehow, I will assume that this won't be enough for you...

In the sporting world, the word "elite" has been used so much that it's lost a lot of its meaning.

So this actually is happening?

Provide me one link that says Wilson's elite from a reputable talent scout!

> Here's 6 links from reputable talent scouts, 4 use elite and some others give very high praise.

> Yeah well Elite is a stupid term that holds no meaning. So hah!

Are we in third grade?

 

[duaneok66]

at least, point out that you are referring to two different people in the same post - I am well aware that people have referred to him as elite, but I didn't refute that point, someone else did. So people called Wilson elite - he has yet to show it on the field. Heck, I thought that Trent Richardson was "elite", but he has yet to show it either, but he's done a lot more than Wilson.

 

[Johnny Blood]

Anyone else notice that Wilson's value more than quadrupled in the latest top 200 dodds list?

 

[msudaisy26]

Just a thought. There were rumors last week of Nicks being traded to Detroit for LeShoure and a 2nd round pick (I think 2nd). And they were debunked. Maybe they were in talks and now that they are 0-4 and unlikely to resign Nicks they are trading him. And they are releasing Scott to make room for some part of a trade? No proof obviously, but nothing about this release makes sense to me. And a release to make trade room makes more sense.

We can hope. That would be a nice deal for both teams. Too good to be true.

That would be a nice deal for fantasy owners, that move sucks for Detroit

Any chance you were huffing spray paint when you made this post yesterday?

Nope, I stand by what I said, that would be a horrible move for the Lions NFL wise, for fantasy owners it could be great.

 

[FlapJacks]

Anyone else notice that Wilson's value more than quadrupled in the latest top 200 dodds list?

That's pretty poor. It's not like he done anything to justify such a radical move in value...

 

[Kenny Powers]

Just a thought. There were rumors last week of Nicks being traded to Detroit for LeShoure and a 2nd round pick (I think 2nd). And they were debunked. Maybe they were in talks and now that they are 0-4 and unlikely to resign Nicks they are trading him. And they are releasing Scott to make room for some part of a trade? No proof obviously, but nothing about this release makes sense to me. And a release to make trade room makes more sense.

We can hope. That would be a nice deal for both teams. Too good to be true.

That would be a nice deal for fantasy owners, that move sucks for Detroit

Any chance you were huffing spray paint when you made this post yesterday?

Nope, I stand by what I said, that would be a horrible move for the Lions NFL wise, for fantasy owners it could be great.

I think the Lions would make room and sign Nicks longterm if that happened, and with that in mind it would be a great move for them.

That said, this thread is so convoluted, Im going to refrain from posts like this. This is the only thread I give 3 or so days before I click on it again.

 

[Johnny Blood]

Anyone else notice that Wilson's value more than quadrupled in the latest top 200 dodds list?

That's pretty poor. It's not like he done anything to justify such a radical move in value...

I guess the coaching staff and GM moves justify it? Giving him more touches, cutting Scott?

 

[2ksports]

Da'Rel Scott's botched hand-off exchange and key drop on a screen prior to that, in addition to looking pedestrian in the run game getting only what was blocked and nothing more cost him his job.

David Wilson ran angry at the end of the game. On one play near the end he just went HAM on the Chiefs D, demonstrating that nobody else on the team should have any business running the ball but him, in any situation unless he is actually too fatigued to do so.

Wilson will be the feature back this week imo, he was already getting more reps in the passing game already in the Chiefs game.

It begins in Week 5. Last chance to join this train.

Obvious breakout week alert vs the Eagles D.

 

[Khy]

Da'Rel Scott's botched hand-off exchange and key drop on a screen prior to that, in addition to looking pedestrian in the run game getting only what was blocked and nothing more cost him his job.

David Wilson ran angry at the end of the game. On one play near the end he just went HAM on the Chiefs D, demonstrating that nobody else on the team should have any business running the ball but him, in any situation unless he is actually too fatigued to do so.

Wilson will be the feature back this week imo, he was already getting more reps in the passing game already in the Chiefs game.

It begins in Week 5. Last chance to join this train.

Obvious breakout week alert vs the Eagles D.

Honestly, some people are saying this will be like a 15/10 carry split between him and Jacobs this week. At least I'm hearing that a lot on the local radio shows. If that actually happens, I'm going to be starting up a petition to burn the stadium to the ground. That's not as a Wilson supporter, just as a Giants fan period. I liked the Jacobs signing, hell I thought it was a good singing in the offseason back before Brown was even hurt. What I don't like is the sound of Brandon Jacobs seeing 10 carries of a 25 carry split. Because I know what Jacobs is, the Giants know what Jacobs is... he's awful. Has been for the past 3 seasons. If he was on the decline in 2011, didn't play in 2012, it's highly unlikely he's all of a sudden better in 2013 now that he's 31 and hasn't played real downs in 2 years.

I don't really care about David Wilson much this week at all tbh, at least not of his production. Granted I own him in two dynasty leagues and a few of my redrafts. I just want to see him get an actual fighting chance for a few weeks. I'd love for them to just give him 18-20 carries and a few passes/screens for 2-3 games in a row regardless of the outcome. Whether he runs for 20/25/0TDs and a fumble in each game or he runs for 20/200/3 TDs in each game. I just want to see him get an actual shot at being the guy most of the fans and presumably the team thought they were getting when they drafted him as the last pick in the 1st round last season.

He has yet to be given this kind of chance. It seems like he fumbles and Coughlin pulls him for some journeyman backup and abandons the run and just goes with 50 passing attempts a game. Which isn't the Giants game, it's not how their built and it's not even how Coughlin 'claims' to want the gameplan to run. Regardless of whose proven what, Eli can throw 3 INTs a game and Coughlin doesn't even sneeze at him angrily but Wilson puts the ball on the ground once and you'd think Eli was handing off Coughlin's grandchild to Wilson to drop.

 

[T with T]

Da'Rel Scott's botched hand-off exchange and key drop on a screen prior to that, in addition to looking pedestrian in the run game getting only what was blocked and nothing more cost him his job.

David Wilson ran angry at the end of the game. On one play near the end he just went HAM on the Chiefs D, demonstrating that nobody else on the team should have any business running the ball but him, in any situation unless he is actually too fatigued to do so.

Wilson will be the feature back this week imo, he was already getting more reps in the passing game already in the Chiefs game.

It begins in Week 5. Last chance to join this train.

Obvious breakout week alert vs the Eagles D.

Honestly, some people are saying this will be like a 15/10 carry split between him and Jacobs this week. At least I'm hearing that a lot on the local radio shows. If that actually happens, I'm going to be starting up a petition to burn the stadium to the ground. That's not as a Wilson supporter, just as a Giants fan period. I liked the Jacobs signing, hell I thought it was a good singing in the offseason back before Brown was even hurt. What I don't like is the sound of Brandon Jacobs seeing 10 carries of a 25 carry split. Because I know what Jacobs is, the Giants know what Jacobs is... he's awful. Has been for the past 3 seasons. If he was on the decline in 2011, didn't play in 2012, it's highly unlikely he's all of a sudden better in 2013 now that he's 31 and hasn't played real downs in 2 years.

I don't really care about David Wilson much this week at all tbh, at least not of his production. Granted I own him in two dynasty leagues and a few of my redrafts. I just want to see him get an actual fighting chance for a few weeks. I'd love for them to just give him 18-20 carries and a few passes/screens for 2-3 games in a row regardless of the outcome. Whether he runs for 20/25/0TDs and a fumble in each game or he runs for 20/200/3 TDs in each game. I just want to see him get an actual shot at being the guy most of the fans and presumably the team thought they were getting when they drafted him as the last pick in the 1st round last season.

He has yet to be given this kind of chance. It seems like he fumbles and Coughlin pulls him for some journeyman backup and abandons the run and just goes with 50 passing attempts a game. Which isn't the Giants game, it's not how their built and it's not even how Coughlin 'claims' to want the gameplan to run. Regardless of whose proven what, Eli can throw 3 INTs a game and Coughlin doesn't even sneeze at him angrily but Wilson puts the ball on the ground once and you'd think Eli was handing off Coughlin's grandchild to Wilson to drop.

great analysis. I agree get him 20 plus touches with some receptions and don't be easy to figure out. Don't play him half the snaps. If the Giants give a 15-10 split to wilson/jacobs then TC and KB need to be fired IMMEDIATELY or get that petition wrote up I will sign it. BURN BABY BURN :IBTL: :IBTL: :IBTL: :IBTL:

 

[T with T]

with him playing 45 percent of the snaps he was probably winded from going in and out of the game so much getting no rhythm in the offense whatsoever. His carries were spread around few and far between, ignored on Gl, 3rd down or any types of passes, In and out of the game like a phone booth. Total mishandling and bad mgmt in my opinion and it's almost criminal... you need to get this guy 15-20 carries and 2-4 catches a game with GL and he could really help that team win... He is super explosive..... missed some blocks, fumbled and ran the wrong way a few times but hey, he's young he is still learning. Get over it he fumbles once in a while TC...

 

[Khy]

Da'Rel Scott's botched hand-off exchange and key drop on a screen prior to that, in addition to looking pedestrian in the run game getting only what was blocked and nothing more cost him his job.

David Wilson ran angry at the end of the game. On one play near the end he just went HAM on the Chiefs D, demonstrating that nobody else on the team should have any business running the ball but him, in any situation unless he is actually too fatigued to do so.

Wilson will be the feature back this week imo, he was already getting more reps in the passing game already in the Chiefs game.

It begins in Week 5. Last chance to join this train.

Obvious breakout week alert vs the Eagles D.

Honestly, some people are saying this will be like a 15/10 carry split between him and Jacobs this week. At least I'm hearing that a lot on the local radio shows. If that actually happens, I'm going to be starting up a petition to burn the stadium to the ground. That's not as a Wilson supporter, just as a Giants fan period. I liked the Jacobs signing, hell I thought it was a good singing in the offseason back before Brown was even hurt. What I don't like is the sound of Brandon Jacobs seeing 10 carries of a 25 carry split. Because I know what Jacobs is, the Giants know what Jacobs is... he's awful. Has been for the past 3 seasons. If he was on the decline in 2011, didn't play in 2012, it's highly unlikely he's all of a sudden better in 2013 now that he's 31 and hasn't played real downs in 2 years.

I don't really care about David Wilson much this week at all tbh, at least not of his production. Granted I own him in two dynasty leagues and a few of my redrafts. I just want to see him get an actual fighting chance for a few weeks. I'd love for them to just give him 18-20 carries and a few passes/screens for 2-3 games in a row regardless of the outcome. Whether he runs for 20/25/0TDs and a fumble in each game or he runs for 20/200/3 TDs in each game. I just want to see him get an actual shot at being the guy most of the fans and presumably the team thought they were getting when they drafted him as the last pick in the 1st round last season.

He has yet to be given this kind of chance. It seems like he fumbles and Coughlin pulls him for some journeyman backup and abandons the run and just goes with 50 passing attempts a game. Which isn't the Giants game, it's not how their built and it's not even how Coughlin 'claims' to want the gameplan to run. Regardless of whose proven what, Eli can throw 3 INTs a game and Coughlin doesn't even sneeze at him angrily but Wilson puts the ball on the ground once and you'd think Eli was handing off Coughlin's grandchild to Wilson to drop.

great analysis. I agree get him 20 plus touches with some receptions and don't be easy to figure out. Don't play him half the snaps. If the Giants give a 15-10 split to wilson/jacobs then TC and KB need to be fired IMMEDIATELY or get that petition wrote up I will sign it. BURN BABY BURN :IBTL: :IBTL: :IBTL: :IBTL:

I don't agree that Coughlin needs to be fired, although I've personally thought that Gilbride was trash since day one. He's really never run a successful offense and has had the opportunity to work with one of the most physically talented groups in the league since 2007. I've constantly felt like his system was holding the Giants offense back and his play calling even more so. I'd really love to know what this team would be like if they had a better offensive mind behind them since 2007

 

[T with T]

exactly gilbride is garbage and has no offensive mind or ability to be creative, get his best players involved. Run's a garbage system and doesn't put best players on the field or give them opportunity to be what they could be. TC is a good coach and has won superbowls but I think NYG just needs a fresh face with an inquisitive offensive coordinator. They would be an NFC powerhouse for years... Jon Gruden or cowher wouldn't be bad replacements.

 

[Soulfly3]

The hyping up of Jacobs is CLEARLY just an ignition for Wilson's fire.

If you can't see that, well.. you're blind

 

[B-Deep]

So, more looks for Wilson appears in the cards. What if he fumbles again?

At this point, they're 0-4 and just cut Scott. They KNOW with 100% fact that Jacobs isn't any actual type of RB anymore. Hasn't been for years.I feel like at 0-4 this is ride or die for them and Wilson. I think regardless of his production or fumbles they're rolling with him for at least the next 2-3 games with confidence.

Someone mentioned this above and the thought did cross my mind. I wonder if the Front Office stepped in here in the cutting if Wilson. No GM wants to see their 1st Round pick being criminally under utilized for ridiculous reasons such as fumbles. I wouldn't be completely shocked if at 0-4 and the Giants still using Scott who is a borderline NFL talent at best, just as much as Wilson pissed the front office off. And Jerry Resse stepped in and cut him.

There could be some validity to this. I guess you have to figure, if you're not going to get anything from your Running Game. You might as well give it to a guy who has the potentially to break it for a 50 - 60 yard score; 14+ times a game.

Again, Wilson's fantasy value is going to rely on those "big plays". The more times he touches the ball, the more likely he is to break said plays.

Then again, Scott only had 6 touches last-week. But assuming Wilson inherits those 6 touches at the 4.2 YPC he had last game, he easily could have had a statline of about 85 Yards. Which wouldn't be terrible for Fantasy Purposes.

2 things.1. I thought he had no talent?

2. many of the best RBs in the NFL rely on big plays. Take away Petersons huge runs this season and his stat line is pathetic. Take away Charles and Spillers huge runs from last year same story. The truly "elite" RBs are almost never people who average 4.5ypc for real. They usually average 2.5ypc on 18 carries and then like 25ypc on two other carries.

1.) Quote me where I said, "David Wilson has no talent".

2.) Yeah, but Peterson uses an arsenal of moves to make his big plays. David Wilson uses perfect blocking to just run past everyone. The nature of their big plays are EXTREMELY different. In my opinion, Adrian Peterson is the kind of player who makes his own yards. David Wilson is not, his big plays are usually a product of perfect blocking where he goes 50+ yards untouchded.

What I'm trying to say is that I can more reasonable expect big plays from Peterson because he wills his way down the field. With someone like David Wilson, I have to hope the conditions are just right and the blocking is perfect. Obviously it's not a negative to have that kind of burst that David Wilson has.

But it's not something that I want to "rely on" for Fantasy Purposes. I'd be much happier if he'd juke a guy out; ran with patience; etc.

I still would love to be in your head to be able to see what you see. Every single professional fantasy and nfl analyst sees Wilson's running talent as elite. His speed, balance, agility and power are all on an elite level. I'd love to know how you and like 5 others in this thread are the only people who see him as a mediocre running talent.

how about a link to specific people calling him elite

give me

shefty

jaworski

theisman

dungy

ian rappaport

http://www.profootballweekly.com/prospects/player/david-wilson-4/

http://www.nfl.com/combine/profiles/david-wilson?id=2533035

http://hamptonroads.com/2012/04/what-theyre-saying-about-giants-pick-david-wilson-plus-more-draft-nuggets

i didn't see any of the guys i asked for

i was illustrating, again, the hyperbole

if EVERY SINGLE professional fantasy and NFL analyst says he is an elite talent, show me those ones please

had you said some, or many, you may be safe

you said every, because this thread is the place hyperbole come to dance and sing with each other

if the gist of this thread was just that Wilson has shown some ability, has talent some consider elite, and is struggling currently for many reasons and may turn it around I'd agree! I'd also say there's a chance he does not turn it around.

too often in trying to get some people to that level people are falling back on exaggeration to make their point, or make it look inevitable that he'll fit some preseason projections

he's a young RB, he has shown some flashes last year, he and his team are struggling, but he has a great matchup this week. That's the reality

Oh, that's what you wanted? You asked for Schefty which is a reporter for the NFL. He's not a talent evaluator.

Rapoprt is pretty much the same as Schefter. They both report what other people say.

Jaworski pretty much only comments on QB's.

Theisman is an idiot.

Dungy isn't a writer. He's a commentator on SNF, and halftime at that, and thus he is only going to comment on Wilson if Wilson is in the game and then it will only be in video.

But this tells me a lot if this is who you rely on to get your fantasy information about RB's. Theisman, really? Rely on Schefty and Rapoport to tell you that someone else says Wilson is great. They are media insiders, not talent scouts. And I have to say it again, Theisman?

I showed something from Sports Illustrated that actually used the word Elite. Msudaisy lists Pro Football Weekly AND NFL.com.

Here's something from the BleacherReport:

"He adds a whole new element to New York’s offense. A playmaker who only needs one play to take it to the house demands special attention from a defense."

Here's a quote from Yahoo Sports where the writer uses the word elite not once but twice:

"Purely in terms of running skill set, I believe David Wilson has the physical tools to develop into an elite NFL back. And I'm not using "elite" lightly. Wilson has a highly explosive first step, and runs with velocity both between the tackles and in high-traffic perimeter areas. He is vertically and laterally dangerous, possessing natural elusiveness, an outstanding ability to beat first contact, and breakaway long speed. Wilson measured only 5-foot-9 5/8 and 206 pounds at the Combine, but flashes genuine power. Wilson has a powerful lower body and can run with leg drive. He is capable of moving a pile. Wilson plays fast and physical and is an extremely competitive back."

This from FootballNation.com:

"Wilson has all the tools necessary to become an elite running back in the NFL."

This from the SportingNews and this is after his slow start:

"Wilson was repeatedly hit in the backfield early in the game, before finding something of a late-game rhythm and breaking off several impressive runs between the tackles. He also had a 17-yard touchdown called back on a holding penalty by LT William Beatty. Wilson has elite talent, but he's going to need more help from his teammates and coaching staff before he gets back on track"

And finally, in this article on BigBlueView.com that quotes from an ESPN article (which I won't go find because I'm already being a monkey here doing work you could easily do, but for some reason won't) where they project the top RB's in a couple years and this guy is projected ahead of CJ Spiller and Charles.

I can do this all day. But I won't. I have other things to do. Somehow, I will assume that this won't be enough for you...

lol

every single profesional and fantasy football analyst = the people i want to consider analysts

face it, that was an extreme exaggeration

 

[B-Deep]

i was illustrating, again, the hyperbole

if EVERY SINGLE professional fantasy and NFL analyst says he is an elite talent, show me those ones please

had you said some, or many, you may be safe

you said every, because this thread is the place hyperbole come to dance and sing with each other

if the gist of this thread was just that Wilson has shown some ability, has talent some consider elite, and is struggling currently for many reasons and may turn it around I'd agree! I'd also say there's a chance he does not turn it around.

too often in trying to get some people to that level people are falling back on exaggeration to make their point, or make it look inevitable that he'll fit some preseason projections

he's a young RB, he has shown some flashes last year, he and his team are struggling, but he has a great matchup this week. That's the reality

Oh, that's what you wanted? You asked for Schefty which is a reporter for the NFL. He's not a talent evaluator.

Rapoprt is pretty much the same as Schefter. They both report what other people say.

Jaworski pretty much only comments on QB's.

Theisman is an idiot.

Dungy isn't a writer. He's a commentator on SNF, and halftime at that, and thus he is only going to comment on Wilson if Wilson is in the game and then it will only be in video.

But this tells me a lot if this is who you rely on to get your fantasy information about RB's. Theisman, really? Rely on Schefty and Rapoport to tell you that someone else says Wilson is great. They are media insiders, not talent scouts. And I have to say it again, Theisman?

I showed something from Sports Illustrated that actually used the word Elite. Msudaisy lists Pro Football Weekly AND NFL.com.

Here's something from the BleacherReport:

"He adds a whole new element to New York’s offense. A playmaker who only needs one play to take it to the house demands special attention from a defense."

Here's a quote from Yahoo Sports where the writer uses the word elite not once but twice:

"Purely in terms of running skill set, I believe David Wilson has the physical tools to develop into an elite NFL back. And I'm not using "elite" lightly. Wilson has a highly explosive first step, and runs with velocity both between the tackles and in high-traffic perimeter areas. He is vertically and laterally dangerous, possessing natural elusiveness, an outstanding ability to beat first contact, and breakaway long speed. Wilson measured only 5-foot-9 5/8 and 206 pounds at the Combine, but flashes genuine power. Wilson has a powerful lower body and can run with leg drive. He is capable of moving a pile. Wilson plays fast and physical and is an extremely competitive back."

This from FootballNation.com:

"Wilson has all the tools necessary to become an elite running back in the NFL."

This from the SportingNews and this is after his slow start:

"Wilson was repeatedly hit in the backfield early in the game, before finding something of a late-game rhythm and breaking off several impressive runs between the tackles. He also had a 17-yard touchdown called back on a holding penalty by LT William Beatty. Wilson has elite talent, but he's going to need more help from his teammates and coaching staff before he gets back on track"

And finally, in this article on BigBlueView.com that quotes from an ESPN article (which I won't go find because I'm already being a monkey here doing work you could easily do, but for some reason won't) where they project the top RB's in a couple years and this guy is projected ahead of CJ Spiller and Charles.

I can do this all day. But I won't. I have other things to do. Somehow, I will assume that this won't be enough for you...

In the sporting world, the word "elite" has been used so much that it's lost a lot of its meaning.

So this actually is happening?

Provide me one link that says Wilson's elite from a reputable talent scout!

> Here's 6 links from reputable talent scouts, 4 use elite and some others give very high praise.

> Yeah well Elite is a stupid term that holds no meaning. So hah!

Are we in third grade?

actually

1 scout saying anything other than elite proves you were exaggerating

and you KNOW you were exaggerating

but lord knows you cannot admit you resorted to hyperbole in defending wilson

 

[Yenrub]

exactly gilbride is garbage and has no offensive mind or ability to be creative, get his best players involved. Run's a garbage system and doesn't put best players on the field or give them opportunity to be what they could be. TC is a good coach and has won superbowls but I think NYG just needs a fresh face with an inquisitive offensive coordinator. They would be an NFC powerhouse for years... Jon Gruden or cowher wouldn't be bad replacements.

Oh come on!

I haven’t been all that crazy about Gilbride either but it’s hard to argue with his previous results

He hasn’t done a good job adjusting the offense this year to help out the poor offensive line but the offense has been productive under him…head scratching at times but productive

2012 – 14th in yards and 6th in scoring

2011 – 8th in yards and 9th in scoring

2010 – 5th in yards and 7th in scoring

2009 – 8th in yards and 8th in scoring

2008 – 7th in yards and 3rd in scoring

 

[Kool-Aid Larry]

drop wilson for j-cobs?

 

[Coeur de Lion]

exactly gilbride is garbage and has no offensive mind or ability to be creative, get his best players involved. Run's a garbage system and doesn't put best players on the field or give them opportunity to be what they could be. TC is a good coach and has won superbowls but I think NYG just needs a fresh face with an inquisitive offensive coordinator. They would be an NFC powerhouse for years... Jon Gruden or cowher wouldn't be bad replacements.

Oh come on! I havent been all that crazy about Gilbride either but its hard to argue with his previous results

He hasnt done a good job adjusting the offense this year to help out the poor offensive line but the offense has been productive under himhead

scratching at times but productive

2012 14th in yards and 6th in scoring

2011 8th in yards and 9th in scoring

2010 5th in yards and 7th in scoring

2009 8th in yards and 8th in scoring

2008 7th in yards and 3rd in scoring

He's also been flexible enough to adjust his system to reflect the talent NY has had on the roster -- winning with both a thumping top ranked ground game early on and then a pass heavy approach more lately. That's an under-rated asset for an NFL coordinator and pretty rare at this level with the egos created by the success that it takes to rise to the absolute pinnacle of your profession.

 

[Khy]

exactly gilbride is garbage and has no offensive mind or ability to be creative, get his best players involved. Run's a garbage system and doesn't put best players on the field or give them opportunity to be what they could be. TC is a good coach and has won superbowls but I think NYG just needs a fresh face with an inquisitive offensive coordinator. They would be an NFC powerhouse for years... Jon Gruden or cowher wouldn't be bad replacements.

Oh come on!

I haven’t been all that crazy about Gilbride either but it’s hard to argue with his previous results

He hasn’t done a good job adjusting the offense this year to help out the poor offensive line but the offense has been productive under him…head scratching at times but productive

2012 – 14th in yards and 6th in scoring

2011 – 8th in yards and 9th in scoring

2010 – 5th in yards and 7th in scoring

2009 – 8th in yards and 8th in scoring

2008 – 7th in yards and 3rd in scoring

Sure... but 1, you're forgetting 2007 where they were 2007: 16th in yards and 14th in scoring. 2 I feel like you also have to look at the team before he took over...

2006: 14th in yards and 11th in scoring

2005: 4th in yards and 3rd in scoring

2004: 23rd in yards and 22nd in scoring

I mean... looking at the difference from 2004 - 2006 it's clear this was a team on the rise. John Hufnagel was forced out of town during the 2006 season for the same reason Gilbride is being scrutinized now. Hufnagel took this team from bottom of the barrel offensively to Top 5 in 2005, then had a small drop off in 2006 and was pushed out of town. Gilbride has ALWAYS posted a good stat line with the Giants but one does have to wonder... was a lot of this due to the surrounding talent he had simply being that good?

Gilbride took over for an up and coming QB with one of the top offensive line units in the league. With good young receivers and also happened to have a few good young running backs at his disposal. And he also had the pleasure of a good defense to keep him in games.

I think this season we're starting to see the biggest degrade this team has seen in years. Easily since Coughlin's been around. In 2006, Coughlin saved his job by firing Hufnagel and moving Gilbride from QB coach to OC. That happened mid-season if memory serves me right. Hufnagel was pushed out of town by increasing pressure from fans and ownership about Hufnagel's questionable play calling and failure to commit to the ground game. Shockingly enough, that's literally the exact same thing that's happening now with Gilbride. If he doesn't turn this around soon, Gilbride will be out of town before the end of the season.

EDIT: The big thing right now and a few analysts have mentioned this... specifically Carl Banks was analyzing the past few weeks the other day and was saying what I felt I'd been seeing. The defense has more or less been playing lights out for 3 of the 4 quarters each of the last 4 weeks. They've actually played pretty good all in all and eventually just fell apart in the 4th quarter. Now you can say "Well you have to play all 60 minutes" but that doesn't apply so much here. We're watching an offense that's giving up almost 4 turnovers a game. A defense that is getting almost the same amount of turnovers for the offense then watching said offense go three and out and put no points on the board to help them out. By the time the 4th quarter hits these guys are not only exhausted from having to be on the field so much more than they should have to be, but demoralized because the offense isn't capitalizing on any of the opportunities the defense is giving them.

I'd say 90% of the teams issues right now are offensively and that all should fall back on Gilbride's terribly and unimaginable play calling and player usage to this point.

 

[Loan Sharks]

I think if Wilson has a bad game this thread might go supernova and bring the whole site down.

 

[TartanLion]

Was considering him as he was on WW then my opponent for this week picked him up and put him in the team. The release of their other RB is concerning me now along with Philly D !

Lions signed Ogletree. I'd say that lessens chance of nicks considerably

 

[Concept Coop]

I think if Wilson has a bad game this thread might go supernova and bring the whole site down.

Or a good one.

 

[Khy]

I think if Wilson has a bad game this thread might go supernova and bring the whole site down.

Or a good one.

I think if he has a bad game it'll be more of the same as a lot of people are expecting a game at this point. If he happens to explode for some kind of 200 all purpose yards and 2 TD type of game though? This site will almost certainly go down.

 

[Routilla]

Starting Jacobs over Wilson for the short yardage TDs.

 

[Khy]

Starting Jacobs over Wilson for the short yardage TDs.

The Giants have been in 1, count it... 1 short yardage TD situation all season. This seems like a ballsy move man, hope it works out for you. Oh, and in that one it took Jacobs 5 runs and a penalty to actually get in the end zone. Just saying.

 

[Routilla]

Starting Jacobs over Wilson for the short yardage TDs.

The Giants have been in 1, count it... 1 short yardage TD situation all season. This seems like a ballsy move man, hope it works out for you. Oh, and in that one it took Jacobs 5 runs and a penalty to actually get in the end zone. Just saying.

But this is Philly week, swiss cheese on the d-line.

 

[steveski]

Starting Jacobs over Wilson for the short yardage TDs.

The Giants have been in 1, count it... 1 short yardage TD situation all season. This seems like a ballsy move man, hope it works out for you. Oh, and in that one it took Jacobs 5 runs and a penalty to actually get in the end zone. Just saying.

But this is Philly week, swiss cheese on the d-line.

And which guy on the team has the best chance of breaking one after getting past the 1st line of defense? Jacobs, right?

 

[OG_GF]

I said this before, Giants will miss Jacobs as a pass blocker and as someone who can wear down defenses. It's time to get back to what won the Giants 2 Superbowls.

 

[Yenrub]

exactly gilbride is garbage and has no offensive mind or ability to be creative, get his best players involved. Run's a garbage system and doesn't put best players on the field or give them opportunity to be what they could be. TC is a good coach and has won superbowls but I think NYG just needs a fresh face with an inquisitive offensive coordinator. They would be an NFC powerhouse for years... Jon Gruden or cowher wouldn't be bad replacements.

Oh come on!

I haven’t been all that crazy about Gilbride either but it’s hard to argue with his previous results

He hasn’t done a good job adjusting the offense this year to help out the poor offensive line but the offense has been productive under him…head scratching at times but productive

2012 – 14th in yards and 6th in scoring

2011 – 8th in yards and 9th in scoring

2010 – 5th in yards and 7th in scoring

2009 – 8th in yards and 8th in scoring

2008 – 7th in yards and 3rd in scoring

Sure... but 1, you're forgetting 2007 where they were 2007: 16th in yards and 14th in scoring. 2 I feel like you also have to look at the team before he took over...

2006: 14th in yards and 11th in scoring

2005: 4th in yards and 3rd in scoring

2004: 23rd in yards and 22nd in scoring

I mean... looking at the difference from 2004 - 2006 it's clear this was a team on the rise. John Hufnagel was forced out of town during the 2006 season for the same reason Gilbride is being scrutinized now. Hufnagel took this team from bottom of the barrel offensively to Top 5 in 2005, then had a small drop off in 2006 and was pushed out of town. Gilbride has ALWAYS posted a good stat line with the Giants but one does have to wonder... was a lot of this due to the surrounding talent he had simply being that good?

Gilbride took over for an up and coming QB with one of the top offensive line units in the league. With good young receivers and also happened to have a few good young running backs at his disposal. And he also had the pleasure of a good defense to keep him in games.

I think this season we're starting to see the biggest degrade this team has seen in years. Easily since Coughlin's been around. In 2006, Coughlin saved his job by firing Hufnagel and moving Gilbride from QB coach to OC. That happened mid-season if memory serves me right. Hufnagel was pushed out of town by increasing pressure from fans and ownership about Hufnagel's questionable play calling and failure to commit to the ground game. Shockingly enough, that's literally the exact same thing that's happening now with Gilbride. If he doesn't turn this around soon, Gilbride will be out of town before the end of the season.

EDIT: The big thing right now and a few analysts have mentioned this... specifically Carl Banks was analyzing the past few weeks the other day and was saying what I felt I'd been seeing. The defense has more or less been playing lights out for 3 of the 4 quarters each of the last 4 weeks. They've actually played pretty good all in all and eventually just fell apart in the 4th quarter. Now you can say "Well you have to play all 60 minutes" but that doesn't apply so much here. We're watching an offense that's giving up almost 4 turnovers a game. A defense that is getting almost the same amount of turnovers for the offense then watching said offense go three and out and put no points on the board to help them out. By the time the 4th quarter hits these guys are not only exhausted from having to be on the field so much more than they should have to be, but demoralized because the offense isn't capitalizing on any of the opportunities the defense is giving them.

I'd say 90% of the teams issues right now are offensively and that all should fall back on Gilbride's terribly and unimaginable play calling and player usage to this point.

I figured the last 5 years was a good enough sample size to prove that Gilbride isn’t “garbage” like “T with T” suggested

Of course talent has a lot to do with an offenses success and right now the Giants don’t have enough talent on the offensive line.

I do agree that Gildbride needs to make some adjustments to help the offensive line out a bit

 

[Kool-Aid Larry]

I said this before, Giants will miss Jacobs as a pass blocker and as someone who can wear down defenses. It's time to get back to what won the Giants 2 Superbowls.

stop

 

[OG_GF]

I said this before, Giants will miss Jacobs as a pass blocker and as someone who can wear down defenses. It's time to get back to what won the Giants 2 Superbowls.

stop

No.