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Fair trade? (1 Viewer)

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Brother Mouzone

Footballguy
PPR 1qb 2rb 3wr/te 1k 1d

Standard scoring otherwise

Team A -

QB : Leinart, Losman

RB : S.Jax, C.Williams, Norwood, M.Bell

WR : Harrisson, R.Williams, Evans, B. Edwards, Kennison, D. Hester, K.Curtis

K : Gostkowski

D : Dallas, Oakland

Team B -

QB : Eli Manning, Ben Roethlisberger, Jay Cutler

RB : Rudi Johnson, MJD, Deuce, A. Green

WR: Chambers, Glenn, Mason, Gonzalez, B. Jones, D.Bowe

K : Graham

D : Panthers

Trade offered is Edwards + Caddilac for Rudi

any oppinions??

 
If there is disagreement on its fairness, then by definition it's fair. Only if all owners are sure its unfair should it be voided.

I agree, you should not let some owners con you into micro managing. I would not play in a league that vetoed such a square trade.

 
quit the league! vetoes are for collusion... only.. NOT deciding whether a trade is "fair" obviously the two of them do believe it is fair...

 
In ppr, just use very average projections and have Braylon Edwards with 80 receptions, 1000 yards, and 6 td's. That's 80 pts. + 1000 pts. + 36 pts. = 216 points.

Cadillac use very average projections of 300 rushes for 1000 yards. 30 receptions for 250 yards, and 6 td's (BTW, I think these are conservative for Caddy) 100 + 30 + 25 + 36 = 191 points. 216 + 191 = 407 points.

Rudi give 350 rushes for 1400, 25 rec. for 200 yards, 10 total td's. = 140 + 25 + 20 + 60 = 245 total points.

So now you have 407 points v. 245 points.

These are always tough calls because in some regard. On one hand, you want to let bad fantasy players be bad. The trade objection rules are tough if Commissioners have to decide. League rules that result in a micro managing of teams is bad, especially if both teams truly feel that both are getting what they want and both think its value.

But clearly, even with rough projections, there is no equal value here. I would not make this trade in a million years, because I can see that it clearly hurts team A.

As such, if your league's concept is trades should be evaluated on basis of fairness, then I think you can have a justification to veto it. But be prepared for morale to plummet on the two teams who are trading if they really both like this trade. Again, my guess is that Team A is the guppy and Team B is the shark.

 
Team A obviously thinks he is solidifying his #2 RB position at the expense of his #4 WR. Whether you agree or not it makes sense for him having to offer more than just a player picked after Johnson was selected and Edwards does still have to prove he can produce over an entire season.

Why are others in the league getting bent out of shape over this deal?

 
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Obvious collusion. How much is that guy paying the other guy to give up his team like that?
No kidding that team getting Rudi is getting a steal I mean ripped off.. no, I mean a steal... no really, he's getting er taking that guy to the cleaners...:headexplodes:

 
In ppr, just use very average projections and have Braylon Edwards with 80 receptions, 1000 yards, and 6 td's. That's 80 pts. + 1000 pts. + 36 pts. = 216 points.Cadillac use very average projections of 300 rushes for 1000 yards. 30 receptions for 250 yards, and 6 td's (BTW, I think these are conservative for Caddy) 100 + 30 + 25 + 36 = 191 points. 216 + 191 = 407 points.Rudi give 350 rushes for 1400, 25 rec. for 200 yards, 10 total td's. = 140 + 25 + 20 + 60 = 245 total points.So now you have 407 points v. 245 points. These are always tough calls because in some regard. On one hand, you want to let bad fantasy players be bad. The trade objection rules are tough if Commissioners have to decide. League rules that result in a micro managing of teams is bad, especially if both teams truly feel that both are getting what they want and both think its value. But clearly, even with rough projections, there is no equal value here. I would not make this trade in a million years, because I can see that it clearly hurts team A. As such, if your league's concept is trades should be evaluated on basis of fairness, then I think you can have a justification to veto it. But be prepared for morale to plummet on the two teams who are trading if they really both like this trade. Again, my guess is that Team A is the guppy and Team B is the shark.
This philosophy is wrong. The team gained 54 pts because they got the better projected RB. Edwards did not start anyways for him and now he can play waivers and pickup points there. You got to give to get the best player in a deal. The one team did.
 
as a general rule, if there is a 2 for 1, the person getting the 1 makes out. to prevent this, be in a league that mandates you must have X amount of players at each position at all times

 
In ppr, just use very average projections and have Braylon Edwards with 80 receptions, 1000 yards, and 6 td's. That's 80 pts. + 1000 pts. + 36 pts. = 216 points.Cadillac use very average projections of 300 rushes for 1000 yards. 30 receptions for 250 yards, and 6 td's (BTW, I think these are conservative for Caddy) 100 + 30 + 25 + 36 = 191 points. 216 + 191 = 407 points.Rudi give 350 rushes for 1400, 25 rec. for 200 yards, 10 total td's. = 140 + 25 + 20 + 60 = 245 total points.So now you have 407 points v. 245 points. These are always tough calls because in some regard. On one hand, you want to let bad fantasy players be bad. The trade objection rules are tough if Commissioners have to decide. League rules that result in a micro managing of teams is bad, especially if both teams truly feel that both are getting what they want and both think its value. But clearly, even with rough projections, there is no equal value here. I would not make this trade in a million years, because I can see that it clearly hurts team A. As such, if your league's concept is trades should be evaluated on basis of fairness, then I think you can have a justification to veto it. But be prepared for morale to plummet on the two teams who are trading if they really both like this trade. Again, my guess is that Team A is the guppy and Team B is the shark.
This philosophy is wrong. The team gained 54 pts because they got the better projected RB. Edwards did not start anyways for him and now he can play waivers and pickup points there. You got to give to get the best player in a deal. The one team did.
The subjectivity inherent in playing ffb takes a hit in leagues where veto trade rules are used. Edited to add that tppt has a good point. Both teams get help in this trade. Analyzing fantasy points exchanged is an incomplete approach to use in evaluating.
 
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Obvious collusion. How much is that guy paying the other guy to give up his team like that?
Haven't even played Week #1 games and the guy is giving up his team? C'mon.Just because some of the League doesn't like it, doesn't make it collusion. Tacticalone needs to show some restraint & leadership...let the trade go through and tell everyone else to stop crying.
 
quit the league! vetoes are for collusion... only.. NOT deciding whether a trade is "fair" obviously the two of them do believe it is fair...
This is the correct answer. I don't even see how this trade can be called into question. On what grounds do the owners think it is unfair?One team is trading a FF #2 WR (with upside) and a FF #2/3 RB(with upside) for a solid if unspectacular lower tier FF#1 RB. Both teams are entering into calculated risk .

I can tell you this, if I was an owner in this league(even if not involved in the trade) and this trade was overturned, I would probably not return to this league next year. One of the fun aspects is that the different FF owners bring diferent perspectives of talent evaluation. I have made trades that I was sure that I was getting the better end of the deal only to evaluate the trade in appropriate time manner that it was a poor trade for me to make. I have made trades that a throw-in player just to even out numbers turned out to be the only valuable assett in a trade. All of our FF decisions are at best educated guesses.

There is no collusion here. The trade stands.

 
In ppr, just use very average projections and have Braylon Edwards with 80 receptions, 1000 yards, and 6 td's. That's 80 pts. + 1000 pts. + 36 pts. = 216 points.

Cadillac use very average projections of 300 rushes for 1000 yards. 30 receptions for 250 yards, and 6 td's (BTW, I think these are conservative for Caddy) 100 + 30 + 25 + 36 = 191 points. 216 + 191 = 407 points.

Rudi give 350 rushes for 1400, 25 rec. for 200 yards, 10 total td's. = 140 + 25 + 20 + 60 = 245 total points.

So now you have 407 points v. 245 points.

These are always tough calls because in some regard. On one hand, you want to let bad fantasy players be bad. The trade objection rules are tough if Commissioners have to decide. League rules that result in a micro managing of teams is bad, especially if both teams truly feel that both are getting what they want and both think its value.

But clearly, even with rough projections, there is no equal value here. I would not make this trade in a million years, because I can see that it clearly hurts team A.

As such, if your league's concept is trades should be evaluated on basis of fairness, then I think you can have a justification to veto it. But be prepared for morale to plummet on the two teams who are trading if they really both like this trade. Again, my guess is that Team A is the guppy and Team B is the shark.
This philosophy is wrong. The team gained 54 pts because they got the better projected RB. Edwards did not start anyways for him and now he can play waivers and pickup points there. You got to give to get the best player in a deal. The one team did.
The subjectivity inherent in playing ffb takes a hit in leagues where veto trade rules are used.
Agreed. There should be no vetoing. If you suspect two teams of colluding, be prepared to call them on it and throw them out of the league forever. Otherwise, all trades should go through.

Leagues where teams get to vote on trades are even worse than "commissioner veto" versions, since most owners will vote for/against the trade based on how they think it will impact their own teams. I'd bet that your near 50% split on owner sentiment in this case parallels, at least loosely, your league's division/conference setup.

 
I think the big question here is "what does your rule book say?"

Do you have to make a decision based on if the trade is "fair?"

OR

Do you have to make a decision because your league believes that there is collusion?

MY OPINION: The trade has to be approved. Not only is the trade fair in the eyes of the two parties trading, there is no obvious collusion.

Never judge a trade by how it first looks. About 8 years ago, I was sitting pretty at 6-0 and traded 3 solid backups I wasn't playing for Drew Bledsoe (when he was on fire) and two scrubs. I was the commissioner and a few people really threw a fit. I didn't back down and kept the trade in place. Bledsoe subsequently tanked and I limped into the playoffs at 8-5. The other person improved their (at the time) crappy team and made the playoffs riding the players I traded away.

 
I think the big question here is "what does your rule book say?"Do you have to make a decision based on if the trade is "fair?"OR Do you have to make a decision because your league believes that there is collusion?MY OPINION: The trade has to be approved. Not only is the trade fair in the eyes of the two parties trading, there is no obvious collusion.Never judge a trade by how it first looks. About 8 years ago, I was sitting pretty at 6-0 and traded 3 solid backups I wasn't playing for Drew Bledsoe (when he was on fire) and two scrubs. I was the commissioner and a few people really threw a fit. I didn't back down and kept the trade in place. Bledsoe subsequently tanked and I limped into the playoffs at 8-5. The other person improved their (at the time) crappy team and made the playoffs riding the players I traded away.
Good post. Follow the literal intent of the league rule. If veto rule is not clear on what grounds a veto claim is to be made, try and clarify that in the rules language.
 
The above posts are correct. I know there are plenty of leagues that use a league vote or a board vote to review trades. This leads to nothing but trouble as well. The only way you should ever overturn a trade is if there is obvious collusion.

And here is the problem with that, it is very hard to prove collusion anyway. Unless an owner just comes out and admits it.

No one (even the commissioner) should have the right to tell another owner how to manage his team. He paid his money, just like everyone else, what gives anyone the right to determine how he manages his team as well? You can't write rules into your league to cover stupid trades. It's not even week one, so you know the guy is trying to win still. It is not like he is in last place and its late in the season and he just doesn't care any more.

How are you to know that Rudi doesn't blow out his knee in week one and Braylon Edwards and Caddy go on to have stellar seasons? Is that unlikey, yes. But you don't know for sure. How would you guys feel if you didn't allow this trade and the above scenario plays out and you just cost this guy the championship because you stopped this trade in Week 1.

I am a commissioner for 5 leagues and lopsided trades are the biggest headache any commissioner will ever experience. It makes things extremely tough for the commissioner, all the other owners complain to you about it. The owner making the bad deal is getting ridiculed and the owner getting best of the deal is in a defensive position as well. These deals bring out the worst in everyone, especially if there is a decent amount of money on the line.

Committee or league votes are no good either. Everyone looks at trades from a their own perspective. They really do not have a partial view. Let's say the trade is with the 3rd place team and an 8th place team, with the 3rd place team really making out on the deal and you put this up to a league vote. I can already tell you how most of the votes on this kind of trade will play out based on just the standings. The teams at the top will more than likely vote NO to the trade because they do not want to see this playoff team get any stronger, unless their is a truly dominant team already in 1st place that people do not like. If that is the case everyone will vote yes so that this underdog team can bring down the league giant.

If you still really need to get another person to break this tie, there are sites out there like this one, http://www.fantasysportstrophies.com/fantasyjudge.html that act as fantasy football judges for a small fee, usually less than $10 they will look at your issues and make a ruling. There are a few different ones out there, some are a collection of other fantasy league players, some are lawyers who do fantasy football, etc.

FYI - The trade you are asking about isn't even that lopsided a trade, (it may turn out that way but who knows, these things have a way of working out on their own) so if you are already sweating this one, you may want to revisit how trades are going to be handled in your league. Personally, i would get rid of the league vote thing and leave it up to the commissioner, provided the commissioner is a fair and honest person. If he is a little sketchy, i would move to use one of these fantasy judge services and if a questionable trade comes up it goes to this service to decide.

 
I think people in a league who want to veto a trade should have to present rational (not emotional) arguments for why it's unfair. Last year's stats and projections should carry some, but not too much, weight. After all, isn't Turner more valuable to an LT owner than a guy who might compile better stats today?

It would be hard to argue why this particular trade would be unfair. I'm still not sure which team gets the better deal.

 
I don't think you can veto this trade. In my opinon, this could go either way:

Rudy is a top 10 - 12 RB (1300 - 1500 total yards plus 10-13 TD's)

for

Cadillac who is a top 18 - top 22 RB with upside (1100 - 1400 total yards plus 6-9 TD's)

and Braylon is a top 20 - 25 WR with a questionable QB situation (900-1100 yards plus 5-6 TD's)

It appears that the trade may help both teams. Team A (which already looks decent) improves their RB2 (they had some WR depth)

Team B loses RB1 but is left with four backs (MJD, Caddy, Deuce, Ahman) to play matchups (Team B has RB depth)

Braylon may arguably now be team B's WR1 depending on how you rank Braylon vs. Chambers vs. Tony G.

Our league votes out trades due to collusion or there is an activity that undermines the competitiveness of the league. Although people may have different opinions on who is getting what when the dust settles; your league shouldn't shoot this down. In my opinion, it shouldn't even be a close vote.

The league hasn't even started yet. Do you guys think Team B has already given up and trying to juice Team A? No way!

 
Completely fair, especially after you look at both rosters.

Cant even believe this would be a question. You have some dunces for owners.

 
I hate your league. :lmao:

And I think going forward you should all do a better job minding your own business.

 
quit the league! vetoes are for collusion... only.. NOT deciding whether a trade is "fair" obviously the two of them do believe it is fair...
This is the correct answer. I don't even see how this trade can be called into question. On what grounds do the owners think it is unfair?One team is trading a FF #2 WR (with upside) and a FF #2/3 RB(with upside) for a solid if unspectacular lower tier FF#1 RB. Both teams are entering into calculated risk .

I can tell you this, if I was an owner in this league(even if not involved in the trade) and this trade was overturned, I would probably not return to this league next year. One of the fun aspects is that the different FF owners bring diferent perspectives of talent evaluation. I have made trades that I was sure that I was getting the better end of the deal only to evaluate the trade in appropriate time manner that it was a poor trade for me to make. I have made trades that a throw-in player just to even out numbers turned out to be the only valuable assett in a trade. All of our FF decisions are at best educated guesses.

There is no collusion here. The trade stands.
:lmao: Trades should ONLY be vetoed on the basis of suspected collusion and NEVER on whether or not it's fair/even/equal, etc.

 
Nothing more really needs to be said as it's been clearly explained above, but I'll chime in anyway :lmao:

Not only is this not a vetoable (word?) trade, but this is the epitome of what a GOOD trade is. If you're good enough to have depth at WR, then the proper way to use some of that is to package some of that depth (Edwards) with a lower RB (Cadillac) and upgrade to a better RB (Rudi), especially if the team you are trading with is weak at WR. This should be used as an example of how trading should be done in a win-win situation. Ridiculous this is even being brought up, except it's obvious the rest of the league doesn't like the fact that BOTH teams are probably improving.

 
If this is collusion overturn the trade and look for replacement owners. If this is not collusion, then leave it alone and tell the rest of the league to shut up.

 
There is no way this trade should be vetoed. This is a good trade and helps both teams involved. I've commished two leagues for a number of years and would not bat an eye on this one. Caddy was pathetic last year and is a weak RB. He gives him up and Edwards for a marked upgrade at RB. Conversely the other team needs another WR and has extra RBs. It's a no brainer. I'm disappointed in everyone who said this should be vetoed.

 
In ppr, just use very average projections and have Braylon Edwards with 80 receptions, 1000 yards, and 6 td's. That's 80 pts. + 1000 pts. + 36 pts. = 216 points.Cadillac use very average projections of 300 rushes for 1000 yards. 30 receptions for 250 yards, and 6 td's (BTW, I think these are conservative for Caddy) 100 + 30 + 25 + 36 = 191 points. 216 + 191 = 407 points.Rudi give 350 rushes for 1400, 25 rec. for 200 yards, 10 total td's. = 140 + 25 + 20 + 60 = 245 total points.So now you have 407 points v. 245 points. These are always tough calls because in some regard. On one hand, you want to let bad fantasy players be bad. The trade objection rules are tough if Commissioners have to decide. League rules that result in a micro managing of teams is bad, especially if both teams truly feel that both are getting what they want and both think its value. But clearly, even with rough projections, there is no equal value here. I would not make this trade in a million years, because I can see that it clearly hurts team A. As such, if your league's concept is trades should be evaluated on basis of fairness, then I think you can have a justification to veto it. But be prepared for morale to plummet on the two teams who are trading if they really both like this trade. Again, my guess is that Team A is the guppy and Team B is the shark.
Good analysis. A guy I know tried to trade LT for Morency, Pittman, Rhodes, Boston and Price. He'd have gained over 100 fantasy points on the trade! good thing his league vetoed it to keep him from ripping off the other guy.Seriously, doesn't the fact that the rest of the teams in the league can't agree whether or not it's a fair trade tell you it's fair enough that it shouldn't be vetoed?
 
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In ppr, just use very average projections and have Braylon Edwards with 80 receptions, 1000 yards, and 6 td's. That's 80 pts. + 1000 pts. + 36 pts. = 216 points.Cadillac use very average projections of 300 rushes for 1000 yards. 30 receptions for 250 yards, and 6 td's (BTW, I think these are conservative for Caddy) 100 + 30 + 25 + 36 = 191 points. 216 + 191 = 407 points.Rudi give 350 rushes for 1400, 25 rec. for 200 yards, 10 total td's. = 140 + 25 + 20 + 60 = 245 total points.So now you have 407 points v. 245 points. These are always tough calls because in some regard. On one hand, you want to let bad fantasy players be bad. The trade objection rules are tough if Commissioners have to decide. League rules that result in a micro managing of teams is bad, especially if both teams truly feel that both are getting what they want and both think its value. But clearly, even with rough projections, there is no equal value here. I would not make this trade in a million years, because I can see that it clearly hurts team A. As such, if your league's concept is trades should be evaluated on basis of fairness, then I think you can have a justification to veto it. But be prepared for morale to plummet on the two teams who are trading if they really both like this trade. Again, my guess is that Team A is the guppy and Team B is the shark.
What an absolutely horrible post. I'm sorry, but you have absolutely no concept of how to evaluate a fair trade.
 
Folks have made better comments already, but as a commish, I can't help chiming in on this one.

The prospect of a veto of this trade is what feels like collusion to me, not the trade. As everyone else has mentioned, the trade is not only within the bounds of reason, but the epitome of a good deal for both sides (Team B really needs Edwards - Chambers sucks, and team A is getting an RB upgrade by giving up depth). The core problem is that team B just isn't very good, and Team A did a kickbutt job of drafting/keeping (how did he get Edwards as his 4th wideout?). Both are pretty clearly improving their starting lineup.

So why are folks upset? My guess is that they are worried that it makes Team A too strong. So half of them are banding together to prevent the owner of Team A from being what they consider to be unfairly strong. They could have prevented Team A from getting that strong by doing a better job of drafting (over the years, if this is a keeper league). Instead, they are basically trying to gang up on him and work together against him through organized trading activity (in this case, vetoing a trade).

That is the definition of collusion.

Quick question: Are the folks voting for the veto perhaps better friends with each other than with the owner of Team A? If so, you're really screwed. (If not, it still stinks.)

I think you should censure the owners who are making noise against this trade, and make sure folks understand how this game works going forward.

And, if I were the guy who had team A, I might just quit the league this year. It's clearly stacked against anyone who knows what they are doing, and there are leagues around that actually work pretty well. If other owners are going to cheat against me (which I believe this is), then I would not feel any obligation toward them. I hope for your league's sake, that isn't what happens.

As commissioner, I've had this situation come up exactly once, where one owner proposed to veto a trade on basically the same grounds - the other owners were quick to beat him down in the forum, and the trade ended up going exactly opposite of the way this guy expected. I saw the other owners' responses as a very healthy sign for the league. It hasn't come up since.

P.S. And for the post regarding total FP as the evaluation, I would love to trade with that guy. I'll give Edwards, Jennings, Porter, and Furrey for LT. You're getting a great bargain - giving up 340 FP & getting 433 FP! It's a steal! (Probably should be vetoed.)

 
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So who is getting the better end of the deal??? I don't get this entire post. I'll never get that 5 minutes of my life back.

 
I haven't read all the responses, so if this has already been said, forgive me.

You are not a good commissioner if you have vested yourself with powers to determine trade fairness. That means that all league decisions are based on your biases, so it is inherently unfair to all the other owners. I would argue that vetoing a trade would be collusion amongst yourself and those owners who would stand in the way of a team or teams improving themselves through a trade.

Add the fact that you can't even come up with your own opinion, but need to ask for message board help, and my advice is to relinquish your duties at once and give them to someone who knows what the role of a commissioner should be.

 
I haven't read all the responses, so if this has already been said, forgive me.You are not a good commissioner if you have vested yourself with powers to determine trade fairness. That means that all league decisions are based on your biases, so it is inherently unfair to all the other owners. I would argue that vetoing a trade would be collusion amongst yourself and those owners who would stand in the way of a team or teams improving themselves through a trade.Add the fact that you can't even come up with your own opinion, but need to ask for message board help, and my advice is to relinquish your duties at once and give them to someone who knows what the role of a commissioner should be.
:thumbup: I personally don't like the trade, but as a commish, I would not Veto it based on how I see the deal.Each owner has the right to make a bad deal. We won't know until the end of the season whether it was a bad deal or not. Maybe they see something behind the player they want and that is the asking price from that owner. A good commish allows the league to make their own deals.
 
In ppr, just use very average projections and have Braylon Edwards with 80 receptions, 1000 yards, and 6 td's. That's 80 pts. + 1000 pts. + 36 pts. = 216 points.

Cadillac use very average projections of 300 rushes for 1000 yards. 30 receptions for 250 yards, and 6 td's (BTW, I think these are conservative for Caddy) 100 + 30 + 25 + 36 = 191 points. 216 + 191 = 407 points.

Rudi give 350 rushes for 1400, 25 rec. for 200 yards, 10 total td's. = 140 + 25 + 20 + 60 = 245 total points.

So now you have 407 points v. 245 points.

These are always tough calls because in some regard. On one hand, you want to let bad fantasy players be bad. The trade objection rules are tough if Commissioners have to decide. League rules that result in a micro managing of teams is bad, especially if both teams truly feel that both are getting what they want and both think its value.

But clearly, even with rough projections, there is no equal value here. I would not make this trade in a million years, because I can see that it clearly hurts team A.

As such, if your league's concept is trades should be evaluated on basis of fairness, then I think you can have a justification to veto it. But be prepared for morale to plummet on the two teams who are trading if they really both like this trade. Again, my guess is that Team A is the guppy and Team B is the shark.
This philosophy is wrong. The team gained 54 pts because they got the better projected RB. Edwards did not start anyways for him and now he can play waivers and pickup points there. You got to give to get the best player in a deal. The one team did.
That is the key to the entire discussion. The guy upgraded his RB by trading depth, is that not one of the reasons that you draft for depth?
 
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This is a perfectly reasonable trade. Your owners are vetoing it because they dont want to see a team with SJAX and Rudi paired together. Approve the trade

 
Pull both owners out of bed and execute them. Obviously this trade is an attempt by one or more teams to steal the championship. No team should eva be allowed to get better via a trade. Attempting to do so harms the league and should be considered treason. The penalty for treason is execution. So do your job as commish as git r done.

 
It has been said in this thread many times already but I will state it again so it is very clear:

YOU ONLY VETO WHEN YOU SUSPECT COLLUSION!!!!

NEVER VETO A TRADE BECAUSE YOU THINK IT IS UNFAIR!!!!

Is there any evidence of collusion in this trade? (Hint: don't look at the players being traded, look at the owners doing the trading)

 
This may be the worst potential of these I have seen yet.

And that's saying something.

Let the owners manage their teams for god's sakes.

:blackdot:

 
If you guys veto this trade, you should probably just disallow trading altogether. It would probably save you a lot of time as I doubt very few trades would go through anyway.

 
This is a fair trade either way, if you find out that people are getting together to basically build 1 team to make it to the championship, ban them, and lock their team. Then add the next highest person to the playoffs.

 
It has been said in this thread many times already but I will state it again so it is very clear:

YOU ONLY VETO WHEN YOU SUSPECT COLLUSION!!!!

NEVER VETO A TRADE BECAUSE YOU THINK IT IS UNFAIR!!!!

Is there any evidence of collusion in this trade? (Hint: don't look at the players being traded, look at the owners doing the trading)
Trying to make it clearer. :goodposting:
 
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