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Garrett Hartley's job in jeopardy? (1 Viewer)

Jason Wood

Zoo York
Garrett Hartley is currently ranked 5th among fantasy kickers:

http://subscribers.footballguys.com/apps/v...amp;howrecent=7

...yet the Saints signed John Carney

http://www.nola.com/saints/index.ssf/2009/...bring_back.html

New Orleans Saints bring back kicker John Carney

by Mike Triplett, The Times-Picayune

Saturday August 15, 2009, 6:11 PM

The New Orleans Saints re-signed veteran kicker John Carney on Saturday, bringing back his reliable 45-year-old leg in the wake of second-year pro Garrett Hartley's struggles in camp.

Hartley, 23, remains on the 80-man roster, however, so the two may compete for a job over the next month, or the strong-legged youngster may stick around for kickoffs and long field goal attempts.

"We're glad to welcome John back to New Orleans," General Manager Mickey Loomis said in a statement. "He is a proven, quality kicker and a quality individual who has made a countless number of big kicks in his career and many of those in a Saints uniform. We're always looking to increase the depth and competition at every position on our roster and bringing John in certainly allows us to do that."

Carney kicked for the Saints from 2001-2006 before the team let him go, attempting to upgrade to the stronger-legged Olindo Mare. That was a move that both Coach Sean Payton and General Manager Mickey Loomis have admittedly regretted ever since, as the Saints shuffled four kickers in and out of the lineup over the past two years.

Carney spent last year with the New York Giants as an injury replacement for veteran Lawrence Tynes, and he had one of the best seasons of his 21-year NFL career. He made 35 of 38 field-goal attempts in the regular season and earned a trip to the Pro Bowl before making just 3 of 5 attempts in a disappointing playoff loss to the Philadelphia Eagles.

Carney made 150 of 180 field-goal attempts (83 percent) during his tenure with the Saints.

Hartley was a perfect 13-for-13 with the Saints last year after signing in midseason, but he had been struggling during training camp. Then he missed a 20-yard field goal in the first quarter of Friday night's preseason victory over the Cincinnati Bengals before bouncing back with a made 54-yard attempt in the second half.

Part of the issue, according to Payton, has been the adjustment with the new snap-hold-kick combination of new long snapper Jason Kyle and new holders Mark Brunell and Joey Harrington.

Terms of Carney's deal were not disclosed.
Normally a PK situation wouldn't be that big a deal, but with Hartley the 5th ranked PK on the board, and his job clearly in jeopardy, I wanted to bring it up. I drafted Hartley in Survivor 8 League earlier this week. :(
 
Oy. Watch his ADP plummet. Read Football Outsider's assessment in the NO Saints section too. Hartley has bust written all over him. Carney was near the top of the K charts last year and now we have to find a place for his geriatric ### on our cheat sheets.

 
:banghead: I dropped Bironas cause I had Hartley on my squad. Thought this kid was gonna be a top 5 kicker for the next few years

wonder if Carney takes his job outright?

 
So a 4-game suspension looms, eh?

Since this is a kicker we're talking about, I don't see how he's draftable then in normal sized leagues.

 
(KFFL) Jeff Duncan, of the New Orleans Times-Picayune, reports New Orleans Saints PK Garrett Hartley was suspended for testing positive for Adderall, an over-the-counter stimulant used to prevent fatigue and sleeping. Hartley said he took the pills while driving from Dallas to New Orleans late at night during the offseason.

 
So a 4-game suspension looms, eh? Since this is a kicker we're talking about, I don't see how he's draftable then in normal sized leagues.
well I was thinking about that and since the Saints seem destined to score a zillion points, (week to week) he seems sure to be a top kicker when he's back. Initially I agree and I'd probably hit the WW in week 3 for him but it seems like everyone knows about this injury(a bit much for a K) so he's probably going to have be a sit at the end of your FF bench for a few weeks type thing. Hartley was perfect last year, in limited work. I think it'd be foolish or the Saints to cut him and not wait the 4 weeks.BTW I've gotten some great feedback and he has been OK in camp despite other reports. The Saints have been concerned with Brunell and Harrington holding the kicks. I'm told one radio announcer even suggested that they cut both of them since that is likely to be their only in-action job this year. Carney was in their camp last year. What was the timeline with that? Mehlhaff beat him out, then Hartley replaced Mehlhaff?That Mehlhaff is with Minny now.
 
(KFFL) Jeff Duncan, of the New Orleans Times-Picayune, reports New Orleans Saints PK Garrett Hartley was suspended for testing positive for Adderall, an over-the-counter stimulant used to prevent fatigue and sleeping. Hartley said he took the pills while driving from Dallas to New Orleans late at night during the offseason.
Is it still customary for players to not get a 4 game suspension until their 2nd positive test for a banned substance? Does this mean he's tested positive before?
 
carney is solid for kicks 40 yards or less. hartley played well last year. he was having a good camp too. i'm not sure carney is anything more than insurance. he'll compete, certainly, for a longer gig but i'm not sure he's going to help given the limitations of his leg.

 
carney is solid for kicks 40 yards or less. hartley played well last year. he was having a good camp too. i'm not sure carney is anything more than insurance. he'll compete, certainly, for a longer gig but i'm not sure he's going to help given the limitations of his leg.
:thumbdown: He was 6/8 from over 40 yards last year, with a long of 51?
 
Oy. Watch his ADP plummet. Read Football Outsider's assessment in the NO Saints section too. Hartley has bust written all over him. Carney was near the top of the K charts last year and now we have to find a place for his geriatric ### on our cheat sheets.
Football Outsiders doesn't seem particularly low on him. They said he missed some XPs in college but that he was good last year, has a great leg, and has the confidence of his coach. (Until this suspension, that is.)
 
HC Sean Payton says:

Can you address the kicking situation?

"We signed John Carney with the idea that there's a probable suspension that's going to happen with Garrett Hartley. Without getting into detail, I know the suspension would revolve around a drug called Adderall. It wasn't steroid related, but nonetheless it's a banned substance that he used to stay awake while driving one night. Once we were made aware of that, then we had to quickly have a plan in place to bring in another kicker. John was the guy that we felt comfortable with. He was the guy last year, to be honest with you, when he was with New York and we were going through the different options at kicker, we were hoping that he would've come off their roster but he never did. We had the opportunity to contact him and get him signed and really that's in the likely event that Garrett ends up missing the first four weeks of the season. It wasn't a result of Garrett's performance. I can understand the speculation as to why but that's really it, there are no underlying factors there. It's the likely suspension to Garrett and we felt like (John) gives us somebody with experience that can come in after the season that he had a year ago and we're obviously familiar with him."

Has there been regret with the release of Carney two years ago?

"We're re-hashing that. It's on record that there has been."

Will Hartley be appealing his suspension?

"I don't think he's going to plan on appealing it."

Will that be the first four games?

"Yes."

Is there any expectation that if Carney performs well in the first four games that he might stick around?

"Look what happened last year in New York. They had an injury, he came in and performed and they weren't going to change what was going good. I think that's the nature of our game and that would be the case for the guys that play at defensive end; that would be the case for the guys that play while someone is injured. John knows that and I'm sure Garrett knows that. We're evaluating every week. That's the nature of our game going all the way back to Wally Pipp - wasn't that his name?"

This will be the sixth suspension on this team in three years for banned substances. Is that an abnormal number?

"I think it's high and we obviously need to look closely at it. We're constantly trying to educate and make sure the players are aware of what's on the banned substance list. The NFL does a great job of handing out posts and educating our players and we have to continue to look at doing a better job ourselves."

How has Hartley performed?

"He has been performing well. It was good to see him the other night hit the second field goal. On the first one, our timing was a little off. He has performed well and I'm happy with the player aside from the fact that now we're sitting here with a suspension - that's disappointing and we should know better."

When were you made aware of Hartley's situation?

"It came to our attention in the past couple of weeks. The question was if he was going to appeal it. Without getting into specifics - it's certainly a league matter - but Mickey and I felt that it was in our best interest to have a plan in place and that plan is John Carney."

What are some things that you could do different on that education front?

"It starts from the league office that they're constantly trying to make players aware of the responsibilities that they have. This sounds fairly simple, but when it comes to anything that they're taking - whether it's a supplement or medication - we ought to check with team officials and the league office to make sure that what they're putting in is something that's clean to put in. That sounds fairly simple and it ought to be. We just have to keep reminding these guys about that and not get into situations where we're losing players to start the season."

Is Thomas Morstead an option on kickoffs?

"He's a potential option there. We'll see. We really haven't gotten into deciding who will kickoff. John kicked off fine in New York. We're really talking about four weeks from now. We're getting ahead of ourselves but at kicker we're ready to put him in."

 
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Garrett Hartley says:

Garrett Hartley stood in front of the firing squad Sunday morning, ready to answer any question lobbed his way about the sudden revelation that he will be suspended the first four games of the season. And though he has been in the league for only a year, he handled the situation like a wily veteran, accepting responsibility for taking a pill on the banned substance list all while apologizing to the franchise.

Hartley admitted to taking the pill Adderall to help him stay awake for a late night drive back to New Orleans from Dallas just prior to reporting for offseason workouts.

“I didn’t think twice about it, but being naïve is not an excuse,” Hartley said. “The NFL does a good job of telling us what we can and can’t (take) and not knowing is not an excuse. Knowing that, it’s literally a tough pill to swallow.”

Adderall, according to drugs.com, is a central nervous system stimulant that can be used to treat narcolepsy. But it’s banned by the NFL because it is a stimulant.

The Saints signed John Carney to take over kicking duties for at least the first four games.

The second-year kicker said he got the pill, which is prescription only, from a college friend who used it to stay awake and study for tests.

“There wasn’t any doubt in my mind that what I was taking was going to make me test positive for a drug test,” Hartley said. “It’s something I’ve never had to worry about.”

Hartley adds his name to a growing list of Saints players testing positive for a banned substance. In the past three years, Hollis Thomas, Lynell Hamilton, Charles Grant, Will Smith, Deuce McAllister and Jamar Nesbit all have tested positive.

“I think it’s a high number and we obviously have to look closely,” Payton said. “We’re constantly trying to educate and make sure the players are aware of what’s on the list. The NFL does a great job of trying to hand out, post and educate our players and we’ve got to continue to look at doing a better job of ourselves.”

For the opening four games, the Saints will now be missing bookend defensive ends Charles Grant and Will Smith as well as Hartley. Grant and Smith both tested positive late in 2008 for bumetanide, a chemical that was in a pill known as StarCaps, which they took to lose weight.

But whereas Grant and Smith both extensively appealed their suspensions – they took the NFL to court over the ruling, Hartley won’t appeal.

“My sincerest apologies go out,” Hartley said. “There would never be anything I’d do to try to hurt the team or my reputation. I definitely apologize to the Saints and my teammates and definitely to the fans because they support us every day in 100 percent heat.

“Now, what’s done is done and I’ve got to be able to move on.”

Hartley can continue kicking during the preseason and acknowledged that he’ll be able to learn a lot from Carney, a veteran in his 21st NFL season.

 
John Carney says:

Q: Are you shocked to be back here?

A: The last three years I’ve trained in the offseason looking for opportunities in the regular season, so I’m not shocked. I’m excited and delighted that the opportunity rests here in New Orleans.

Q: How have they told you what the opportunity is?

A: I can’t speak for them, but I know the opportunity starts in the regular season. I’m excited about that. We’ll take it from there.

Q: Coach Payton has expressed publicly that he regretted releasing you in 2007. Has he told you the same?

A: He has and so has Mickey Loomis and I appreciate that. That’s part of the game. You make decisions at the time with information given to you and you hope it’s the right decision. I went on and was fortunate to get work with other teams.

Q: When did you first find out that there would be an opportunity to return to New Orleans?

A: Pretty recently as things unfolded. We’ve been in contact to see if it would work for everybody.

Q: Were you and the Saints in touch for a specific time frame?

A: Recently.

Q: Had you talked to any other teams recently?

A: No, it’s still really early in training camp, so I think teams are sorting out their personnel. I had my eye on a few teams, but it’s early, so I didn’t think anything would show until the regular season started.

Q: Can you talk about your last season?

A: I played with the Giants and I was fortunate enough to be there. Again I was filling in for an injured kicker who was coming back in Lawrence Tynes, so I knew that the window had closed for the time being. I’m training and hoping that somewhere in 32 teams there would be a need.

Q: Are you still as good as ever?

A: Time will tell.

Q: Do you feel the same?

A: I feel great. I can’t fool myself and think I’m as good as I once was, but you train and you focus your goal on being at your best at least one day a week. You plan on it being on Sunday. During the course of the week, it’s rehab and strengthening and fine-tuning things and getting ready for the next Sunday. When you’re young you can go out and do the same thing everyday, but as you get older you kind of have to pace yourself.

Q: Had you been simulating training camp at home in San Diego the last two weeks?

A: Yes, I wasn’t going out and doing two a days, but I’ve picked up my workload, just as I was in training camp. When you do get a call, especially if it’s in the regular season, it’s go time. You don’t have time to be ready. You have to be ready. August is usually a heavy workload month.

Q: What can you bring this team while you’re here?

A: I raise the average age of the team. I’m looking forward to working with the young punters and Garrett and the coaches have mentioned that my mentorship could help them a lot. I look forward to that. I enjoy working with other specialists and especially the young ones, because when I was coming up I looked to a lot of veterans, stole as much as I could from them. I think all of us will come out of this a lot better.

Q: Have you seen Garrett kick?

A: Not in person. I’ve watched a lot of him on film and I watched how he finished the season last year. He’s a real talented kicker. I know they think a lot of him and I look forward to working with him.

Q: Do you have an age at which you think you will stop kicking?

A: No. The league usually dictates that. As long as I’m healthy and enjoying the game, I’ll keep pushing it. New Orleans’ own Morten Andersen set the bar high for everybody. There are a number of us in John Kasay, Jason Elam, Jason Hanson that are trying to reach that bar.

Q: Some people like Drew Brees and Charles Grant visibly embraced you on the field. Can you talk about the comfort level with a lot of these guys?

A: It helps. The roster has changed quite a bit, but there are quite a few guys that I played with. We went through that magical season in 2006 and came out and won that playoff game against the Eagles. We went through a lot together, so there’s that bond and I look forward to playing with them again.

Q: Have you been back to New Orleans since you were released?

A: I think I was back once just to work on our house a little bit and I came back for Steve Gleason’s wedding, which was quite an event.

Q: When you left the Saints, you crafted a statement for the fans. Do you do that for every team when you leave them?

A: No I don’t. Playing for New Orleans was special and we went through a lot that team and organization with Katrina, playing in Texas coming back and having the magical season in 2006. I felt tied to New Orleans for a number of reasons and I didn’t want to leave the city without expressing what I thought of the city and how I thought the city supported the team and the players.

Q: Has your devotion to your health and your diet changed in the last few years?

A: It’s a challenge. When you’re young, it’s a challenge to take what God’s given you to play in the NFL and refine it. It’s a challenge when you’re older to take that same talent which may be decreasing and challenge yourself to see how far you can push it. Can I get the maximum out of my body and my talent? I’ve been very blessed and fortunate to stay healthy.

Q: Have you changed your diet?

A: I’m not crazy with my diet, but I used to be the fast food king. If they had a drive up window then that was the restaurant for me. I’ve improved my diet somewhat, but this is the land of Popeyes. How can you resist that?

Q: You don’t have any hard feelings or disappointed at being released in 2007?

A: I was disappointed and felt that I had done a good job for the saints in 2006 and I had one year left on my contract, so sure I was disappointed, but it is the game and you make decisions at the time based on the information. I understand their reasoning. Was I disappointed? Yes. I understand the game. I went through this once with San Diego and so I think I was mature enough to handle it, pack it up, go work hard, be successful elsewhere and then get a chance to come back.

 
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