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Gocong/Sheldon Brown traded (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Marino13
- Start date
sounds right to me...
munchkin
Footballguy
Good move with all the draft picks they have.
boonesfarm4me
Footballguy
i thought the same thing...hopefully they do were thin at CB now...
Warpig
Footballguy
What the hell is Holmgren thinking? How many subpar LB's does this team need? Let's tally them up shall we?
LB's:
Gocong
Roth
Benard
Veikune
Harrison
Maiava
Costanzo
Bowens
Trusnik
Fujita
Barton
Jackson
Then they bring in Sheldon Brown who had a surprise season last year but is 31 and looking for a new contract. We all know what happens to players after they get "paid".
Brandon McDonald is young and talented. He had some issues last year with consistency but that's because Mangini is an idiot and plays head games with his players.
They must not have much faith in their scouting department to be tossing in those draft picks. That team needs to rebuild and they appear to be spinning their wheels.
I thought Holmgren was supposed to be a genius? They currently sit with no starting caliber QB, no veteran presence at WR...just a bunch of young guys. Question marks surrounding their running game.
I'm just amazed at this. I wanna know how I can get to be an NFL GM!
LB's:
Gocong
Roth
Benard
Veikune
Harrison
Maiava
Costanzo
Bowens
Trusnik
Fujita
Barton
Jackson
Then they bring in Sheldon Brown who had a surprise season last year but is 31 and looking for a new contract. We all know what happens to players after they get "paid".
Brandon McDonald is young and talented. He had some issues last year with consistency but that's because Mangini is an idiot and plays head games with his players.
They must not have much faith in their scouting department to be tossing in those draft picks. That team needs to rebuild and they appear to be spinning their wheels.
I thought Holmgren was supposed to be a genius? They currently sit with no starting caliber QB, no veteran presence at WR...just a bunch of young guys. Question marks surrounding their running game.
I'm just amazed at this. I wanna know how I can get to be an NFL GM!
PizzaDeliveryGuy
extra sausage
Snotbubbles
Footballguy
Good, not great cover guy.Hard hitter.Good tackler.Stone hands so not many INTs.Solid starter, should have made a few Pro Bowls.Could probably be converted to safety as he slows down.
McDonald is absolutely terrible, save the game that Kolb made him look like an All-Pro.Great trade by the Browns.
smashingsilver
Footballguy
I agree with you that they have a large group of mediocre LBs, but please don't be including D'Qwell Jackson in that list. Jackson is a stud and is one of the few top talents the Browns have on the roster.
On top of that - a lot of them are young and still developing. No reason to draft more young LBs to "rebuild".
Demian
Footballguy
My view of Sheldon (not much different, he's a good pick up):100% Team playerExcellent TacklerGood cover guyOne of the hardest hitting CBs in the gameNot many turnovers but can make plays
Fire the Fat Man
Footballguy
In no way shape or form are the Eagles getting Asomugha. They will not pay him his $16 million salary for 1 year.
Why anyone would think this organization would do something like that is beyond me.
Why anyone would think this organization would do something like that is beyond me.
BoltThrower
Footballguy
they have the same # of LB's they had before the trade ( -Hall, +Gocong)McDonald is not talented, he's a nickel back at bestthey still have 10 draft picks, 5 in the first 3 rounds. pretty sure Brown and Gocong are more likely to make the roster than 4th and 5th round picks.the QB's they have now are better than what they did have, even if that's not saying a lot. what "starting caliber" QB should they have gotten? McNabb? Remember, they can't give up draft picks or they would be admitting that they have no faith in their scouting dept.between Harrison, Davis, Hillis, Vickers, Cribbs, and a decent line, running game is not one of their bigger question mark areas. Defensive backfield is far and away their biggest problem area. oh look, they got a starting DB in the trade.Other than that, you're pretty much spot on..
daveR
Footballguy
In an uncapped year, why wouldn't they?
Inspiration
Footballguy
Because teams still have budgets.
Fire the Fat Man
Footballguy
Exactly, it was being reported before free agent started that a lot of teams were going to stick to a budget this season.If a salary cap was in place this year the Eagles would be under it by $45 million after the trade today
People keep saying this, am I missing something? Couldn't the Eagles just restructure/extend the contract to have >16 mill guaranteed money but be spread out over many years?
Fire the Fat Man
Footballguy
Why would Asomugha want to do that?? He gets an 8 million roster bonus and his 8 million salary is guaranteed once the season starts. That is an easy $16 million this year he makes.If they were to restructure his deal he would want way more than $16 million guaranteed. Probably in the range what Haynesworth and Peppers got the past 2 years. The Eagles won't do that.
Warpig
Footballguy
I know Jackson is a stud. Since he is one of their many LB's I included his name. My point is, why keep bringing in mediocre talent at best at LB? They haven't really upgraded at the LB spot. They have other areas of need. McDonald has ability. He's a CB...the have inconsistency problems at times. He's young. Young CB's have lots of problems with consistency...even moreso when they play for a boneheaded coach like Mangini. He's had games where he's shut down Andre Johnson, Ocho Stinko, and others...he's proven he can play. But as soon as he makes a mistake, Mangini would bench him. You can't do that! Not sure why you think the QB's they have now are better than what they had. How so? Didn't Delhomme stink it up pretty badly the last few years? He throws more passes to the opposing team...a handful to his WR's and the rest are thrown in the dirt. AND HE'S OLD! Seneca Wallace might be an upgrade. But I don't think they gave Quinn a fair chance either. Did he ever have an offseason where he was given all the starters reps in practice and OTA's and what not? He always had to split reps with someone. Then when he got in a game and started struggling, they'd give him the hook. If Holmgren is supposed to be such a genius, I think I'd rather have those draft picks to bring in rookies that fit my system or maybe polish them up a little...never know when you might find a diamond in the rough. You know what you have in players like Gocong, Fujita, Bowens, etc. Maybe that's just the way I think and I have confidence in my ability to see/find talent. They do have a great O-line so they can get away with sticking a lesser QB back there. But who are they gonna throw to? Mass, Robiskie, and Watson? Their secondary is bad. But their front 7 aren't all that either. And instead of bringing in all these LB's maybe they should be bringing in CB's and Safeties. They just aren't making any sense. Is Mangini still calling all the shots out there? Or has Mangini put a spell on Holmgren?they have the same # of LB's they had before the trade ( -Hall, +Gocong)McDonald is not talented, he's a nickel back at bestthey still have 10 draft picks, 5 in the first 3 rounds. pretty sure Brown and Gocong are more likely to make the roster than 4th and 5th round picks.the QB's they have now are better than what they did have, even if that's not saying a lot. what "starting caliber" QB should they have gotten? McNabb? Remember, they can't give up draft picks or they would be admitting that they have no faith in their scouting dept.between Harrison, Davis, Hillis, Vickers, Cribbs, and a decent line, running game is not one of their bigger question mark areas. Defensive backfield is far and away their biggest problem area. oh look, they got a starting DB in the trade.Other than that, you're pretty much spot on..
abe froman
Footballguy
Some CRAZY statements being made in here:
1. Mcdonald being young and TALENTED.. -No way, he has shown flashes of a great player but he is not a starting caliber CB that any team would want; consistently gets burned by the most avg of WR's..
2. "Jackson is a stud".. NO sorry he's a very CAPABLE LB that benefits by 1. playing for the Browns=getting alot of time on the field, 2. even worse talent around him allowing him stand out.
*I think we upgraded at CB while also getting a veteran leader that is a great locker room assett and possibly also a mentor to a rookie CB if we do draft 1 in first few rounds. Gocong sounds like a level swap from Hall and another MANGINI type character player.. solid move by Browns organization!
1. Mcdonald being young and TALENTED.. -No way, he has shown flashes of a great player but he is not a starting caliber CB that any team would want; consistently gets burned by the most avg of WR's..
2. "Jackson is a stud".. NO sorry he's a very CAPABLE LB that benefits by 1. playing for the Browns=getting alot of time on the field, 2. even worse talent around him allowing him stand out.
*I think we upgraded at CB while also getting a veteran leader that is a great locker room assett and possibly also a mentor to a rookie CB if we do draft 1 in first few rounds. Gocong sounds like a level swap from Hall and another MANGINI type character player.. solid move by Browns organization!
Jason Wood
Zoo York
This is a fair deal. I love Sheldon and hate to see him go, but Gocong would've been released if they hadn't had plans to deal him. He's just not a fit in JJ/McDermott's system, but might flourish in a 3-4. So ultimately we got high 4th and 5th rounders for a solid starting CB. We have good depth at CB so I wouldn't AT ALL bet that this means Aso is coming to town.
Ron_Mexico
I Love Doggies
I think it was a fantastic deal for Cleveland. Both Brown and Gocong can start from day 1.Sheldon Brown alone is worth more than two mid round picks.Injuries, are a factor with CG, but a healthy Chris Gocong will turn some heads, imo.I think the Eagles sold him early.
LawFitz
Footballguy
If the Raiders aren't going to pay Nnamdi, the Eagles should. He's worth the big contract. You're getting the all around best corner in the game in his prime. And he has the type of character and work ethic that you can feel really good about when making him a huge investment and asset in your organization.
Sad for the Raiders if this comes true. Old man should just give the Eagles the 2nd round pick for McNabb and pay Nnamdi himself. Drafting Asomougha two rounds too early was the best call Al Davis has made in a long time.
Sad for the Raiders if this comes true. Old man should just give the Eagles the 2nd round pick for McNabb and pay Nnamdi himself. Drafting Asomougha two rounds too early was the best call Al Davis has made in a long time.
delusional
Footballguy
They screwed up on here entirely. Wrong defense & wrong position when he was here. He should do well in the 3-4.Brown is a good CB, underrated really, 13th ranked CB in the league last year according to PFF. Should have made pro bowls but was always left out ( not a vocal guy ), leader, never missed a game, played hurt at the end of last season. Overall Browns schooled the Eagles in this trade. Brown was at least a 3rd. Hall won't make the final roster while Gocong will probably be starting. Now the Eagles have a higher priority hole at CB then they had before. ( Hobbs & Hanson are not #2 CBs )Eagles won't pay the 16 mill. Honestly, I got no idea wtf they are doing this offseason. Everyone is giving the wtf face at them for the things they are doing. I don't really care anymore, i disowned them todayedit: Brown is good against the run also.Ron_Mexico said:
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dotman
Footballguy
I can't see why they'd deal Brown without planning on upgrading, and Hobbs would be a huge downgrade IMO. Brown may not have made pro bowls but the guy has been a rock on defense, one of the few guys you could count on lately. It's sad to see him go.
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delusional
Footballguy
Yep. Thats the gold standard for you.Banner gets a 3 year extension while they create more holes on defense.
phthalatemagic
Footballguy
duece2626
Footballguy
veryMcDonald is absolutely terrible
jaybebo
Footballguy
Can't view at the moment...is it the hit Brown laid on Bush...monster hit from any cornerback...
Yessir.
jaybebo
Footballguy
SSSWWWWWEEEEETTTTTT!!!!!!
phthalatemagic
Footballguy
SSSWWWWWEEEEETTTTTT!!!!!!
indeed.This allowed number of quoted blocks of text is for the birds 
jaybebo
Footballguy
I just delete out the one extra quote...like when someone is in a forum talking football and does not know who Sheldon Brown is...SSSWWWWWEEEEETTTTTT!!!!!!
Jason Wood
Zoo York
You're thinking in a vacuum though. Brown was livid LAST offseason and wanted a new deal or a trade, and this year he absolutely wasn't going to play nice without a monster deal. The truth is, he was an effective cog in the wheel but he was nowhere close to elite, and he felt he deserved elite money. We have great depth at CB right now, and there's great depth of the position in the draft.
If they 4 and 5 they got are kept and used on players, that would be disappointing. But if they use them as part of an arsenal of picks to go up and get a few guys they really covet, it was well worth it IMHO.
If they 4 and 5 they got are kept and used on players, that would be disappointing. But if they use them as part of an arsenal of picks to go up and get a few guys they really covet, it was well worth it IMHO.
dickey moe
Fingerpicker
Go, Kong! Cal Poly represent!
JetMaxx
Footballguy
but Hobbs and Hanson are both nickel corners at best. I like what the Eagles are doing by cleaning house, out with all of the old(McNabb to follow shortly) and in with the new. Glad to see Reid and Co. saw the need to purge the system and make some drastic changes to a playoff team. While this may be a down year, it makes for an exciting time for this long time season ticket holder.
Jason Wood
Zoo York
Hanson played very well when injuries forced him into the starting lineup. I'm not sold on Hobbs, and suspect he's the starter in name only until we do something via trade OR draft someone, but yeah, I think folks are overvaluing Sheldon Brown for 2010 and beyond based on what he did for us in 2009.Let's also consider the irony of how many folks who think the Eagles are silly for holding out for more than a high 2nd on McNabb think we got fleeced by Cleveland for a LB we were going to cut and an aging 2nd tier CB that yielded us 4th and 5ths. Astounding hate for "5" that, until the day I die, I'll never understand.but Hobbs and Hanson are both nickel corners at best. I like what the Eagles are doing by cleaning house, out with all of the old(McNabb to follow shortly) and in with the new. Glad to see Reid and Co. saw the need to purge the system and make some drastic changes to a playoff team. While this may be a down year, it makes for an exciting time for this long time season ticket holder.
JetMaxx
Footballguy
Of course the question is, if McNabb is worth more why isn't someone offering it? A 34 yr old QB with declining skills, approaching FA, and a looming lockout can only command so much in compensation. Not wishing injury on anyone but the best thing that could happen to the Eagles would be a guy like Alex Smith or Leinart(or the like) going down with an injury or Favre suddenly announcing his retirement. While Reid is playing the "I want to send McNabb somewhere better than BUF or OAK" card, IMO he's merely buying time until he's forced to pull the trigger, thinking that something like what I mentioned could possibly present itself and increase the value of 5.Hanson played very well when injuries forced him into the starting lineup. I'm not sold on Hobbs, and suspect he's the starter in name only until we do something via trade OR draft someone, but yeah, I think folks are overvaluing Sheldon Brown for 2010 and beyond based on what he did for us in 2009.Let's also consider the irony of how many folks who think the Eagles are silly for holding out for more than a high 2nd on McNabb think we got fleeced by Cleveland for a LB we were going to cut and an aging 2nd tier CB that yielded us 4th and 5ths. Astounding hate for "5" that, until the day I die, I'll never understand.but Hobbs and Hanson are both nickel corners at best. I like what the Eagles are doing by cleaning house, out with all of the old(McNabb to follow shortly) and in with the new. Glad to see Reid and Co. saw the need to purge the system and make some drastic changes to a playoff team. While this may be a down year, it makes for an exciting time for this long time season ticket holder.
As an Eagles fan I think this was a deal they had to make since they are rebuilding no matter what they say and Brown is 31 and wanted a new deal. The Browns are getting a tough CB in Brown who will give it his all every play and no the contract won't slow him down. I heard others say he can move over to FS once he slows down which is what I wanted the Eagles to do with him but the Eagles are going young. They have one starter who is 30 in Jackson and a back up DE in Parker who is 31 everyone else is under 30. As for Gocong he just doesn't fit this defense so he had to go either this year or next when he hit free agency. I think he will be much better in the 3-4 and I'm really not sure why you said Injuries were a factor with him since he hasn't missed a game in three years and his rookie year was one of those bogus injuries the Eagles always come up with.Ron_Mexico said:
Amused to Death
Footballguy
Per Pro Football Reference among active QBs McNabb is:15th in Passer RatingHanson played very well when injuries forced him into the starting lineup. I'm not sold on Hobbs, and suspect he's the starter in name only until we do something via trade OR draft someone, but yeah, I think folks are overvaluing Sheldon Brown for 2010 and beyond based on what he did for us in 2009.Let's also consider the irony of how many folks who think the Eagles are silly for holding out for more than a high 2nd on McNabb think we got fleeced by Cleveland for a LB we were going to cut and an aging 2nd tier CB that yielded us 4th and 5ths. Astounding hate for "5" that, until the day I die, I'll never understand.
11th in Passing yds/game
18th in Yds/Pass attempt
15th Yds/Pass Cmp
9th Pass Attempts/Game
11th Adj Yds/Pass Att
22nd in net yds/pass attempts
15th in Adj Net Yds/Pass Att
11th Passes Completed/Game
26th in completion %
Hasn't been voted to the Pro Bowl since 2004. Will turn 34 in November.
Played a full 16 games in 4* seasons in his 10 years as a full-time starter (15 games in '04 due to coach's decision in game 16)
Worthy of a 1st round pick?
No hate, just time to turn the page.
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Sunday@1
Footballguy
I found this to be interesting....., so IMHO any trade for Aso would certainly try to void that contract and restructure."Asomugha has a clause in his contract for next season that pays him the average of the top three quarterbacks in the league. That's no mistake --quarterbacks, not cornerbacks. So in 2011 he will be making over $20 million."Fire the Fat Man said:
Kool-Aid Larry
Footballguy
I believe that's an option, so they're free to decline and only retain him for 2010.also, I believe he was due a giant roster bonus in march, so I think oakland has already paid him.
2010: $755,000 (+ $8 million roster bonus due 3/5 + $7.83 million option bonus due 3/19), 2011: $2.105 million (Club Option), 2012: $3.455 million (Voidable Years), 2013: $4.805 million, 2014: $6.155 million, 2015: Free Agent
Kool-Aid Larry
Footballguy
see aboveLawFitz said:
Kool-Aid Larry
Footballguy
see abovescratcher said:
Buddy Ball 2K3
Footballguy
Some people *cough-jw-cough* can not understand that being realistic about McNabb does not equal hate. There is absolutely no reason to keep McNabb for one year when everyone knows he will be gone after this season. The Eagles have been rebuilding since 2007 and nobody has really even cared to acknowledge it.Per Pro Football Reference among active QBs McNabb is:15th in Passer RatingHanson played very well when injuries forced him into the starting lineup. I'm not sold on Hobbs, and suspect he's the starter in name only until we do something via trade OR draft someone, but yeah, I think folks are overvaluing Sheldon Brown for 2010 and beyond based on what he did for us in 2009.Let's also consider the irony of how many folks who think the Eagles are silly for holding out for more than a high 2nd on McNabb think we got fleeced by Cleveland for a LB we were going to cut and an aging 2nd tier CB that yielded us 4th and 5ths. Astounding hate for "5" that, until the day I die, I'll never understand.
11th in Passing yds/game
18th in Yds/Pass attempt
15th Yds/Pass Cmp
9th Pass Attempts/Game
11th Adj Yds/Pass Att
22nd in net yds/pass attempts
15th in Adj Net Yds/Pass Att
11th Passes Completed/Game
26th in completion %
Hasn't been voted to the Pro Bowl since 2004. Will turn 34 in November.
Played a full 16 games in 4* seasons in his 10 years as a full-time starter (15 games in '04 due to coach's decision in game 16)
Worthy of a 1st round pick?
No hate, just time to turn the page.
boonesfarm4me
Footballguy
If Oakland paid him $16 million already for 2010 why would they trade him? just for mcnabb?
Amused to Death
Footballguy
Agree completely. I find it to be somewhat of a double standard when someone calls Jason out about his continued blind support for McNabb (the man-love) yet everyone who disagrees with him is "a knucklehead" or just has blind hate. I'd say a large majority of us just see things the same way as the Eagles front office. Time to clean house and start fresh. No hate.But the continued "hater" label is kinda annoying. That and the notion fans are running him out of town or don't appreciate McNabb because we want to move on. Ignorant statements, imo.Some people *cough-jw-cough* can not understand that being realistic about McNabb does not equal hate. There is absolutely no reason to keep McNabb for one year when everyone knows he will be gone after this season. The Eagles have been rebuilding since 2007 and nobody has really even cared to acknowledge it.Per Pro Football Reference among active QBs McNabb is:15th in Passer RatingHanson played very well when injuries forced him into the starting lineup. I'm not sold on Hobbs, and suspect he's the starter in name only until we do something via trade OR draft someone, but yeah, I think folks are overvaluing Sheldon Brown for 2010 and beyond based on what he did for us in 2009.Let's also consider the irony of how many folks who think the Eagles are silly for holding out for more than a high 2nd on McNabb think we got fleeced by Cleveland for a LB we were going to cut and an aging 2nd tier CB that yielded us 4th and 5ths. Astounding hate for "5" that, until the day I die, I'll never understand.
11th in Passing yds/game
18th in Yds/Pass attempt
15th Yds/Pass Cmp
9th Pass Attempts/Game
11th Adj Yds/Pass Att
22nd in net yds/pass attempts
15th in Adj Net Yds/Pass Att
11th Passes Completed/Game
26th in completion %
Hasn't been voted to the Pro Bowl since 2004. Will turn 34 in November.
Played a full 16 games in 4* seasons in his 10 years as a full-time starter (15 games in '04 due to coach's decision in game 16)
Worthy of a 1st round pick?
No hate, just time to turn the page.
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