Going paycheck to paycheck....... (2 Viewers)

[Fishboy]

Fishboy - ftr - I didnt take it as you were in a pissing match - I was just stating many still wont notice because many are still working without pay.

That was all.   And I agree there is obvious some waste but some of the effects might not bubble to much later

all good!  I was just asking the question and that obviously turned the whole nature of this thread, which wasn't the intention.  For me, living in suburban Milwaukee, I can state that it has minimally impacted me, which I think can be said for a majority of America at this point. 

ChemX asks a good question.  I know that I wouldn't be impacted as I've been saving like a mother to get 2 daughters through college.  They are currently a sophomore in college and HS senior, so I probably have a larger fund to draw from than most.  But that will all be spent in the coming years, but even then it wouldn't be doom and gloom before I missed even my first paycheck. 

But I also work in the credit card (private label) industry and it floors me that my company exists all based on the fees/interest charges to the merchant and customer. 

 

[culdeus]

I do a lot of credit card churning. I subscribe to some services that give you some interesting data on the credit of other consumers.  

Some things that just stun me is that only 34% of Americans do not carry a balance on their credit cards.  The majority of those are not because they are disciplined, it's that they simply don't have one or are banned for a foreclosure.

 I consider carrying a CC balance about the dumbest thing you can do assuming there is no life emergency.  So no, this doesn't shock me that so many are already either maxed or near maxed and have no bandwidth to expand their liquidity.  

 

[GroveDiesel]

I think there is a story in CareerBuilder.com from 2017 indicating 78% live paycheck to paycheck.

And the average American family has close to $6,000 in credit card debt as well.

Housing costs and college costs are extremely high and place a tremendous burden on people. There are plenty of reasons for that and some of them are definitely self-inflicted (buying a bigger/nicer house than you can afford).

 Some of it is non-controllable costs, a lot of it is simply living above ones means.

 

[NutterButter]

MasterCard will allow mortgage payments but Visa/Discover/Amex won't.  

Whoa.   Not to go on a tangent, but how do I pay my mortgage with a MC?  I don't have that option from the mortgage payment screen.   

 

[Gottabesweet]

Whoa.   Not to go on a tangent, but how do I pay my mortgage with a MC?  I don't have that option from the mortgage payment screen.   

Right? I'd take those points every month if I had that option.

 

[Dedfin]

I moved the goal posts, as TSA was brought to the forefront immediately and repeatedly. 

My question still stands though on how many people outside of those in government would have actually noticed the (full/partial) shutdown w/o the constant news coverage?  I can only speak for myself, but if lived in a bubble with no media coverage that I wouldn't have known, as it hasn't affected me in the past 3 weeks.  Obviously if you live in DC it was immediately evident, but that's a small sample size when you factor in that I was asking the greater question. 

Ironic part is that I agree with many of those that were quick to pile on my question. 

FAA too. Plus the NTSB. How about all the however many people that work for the NIH and FDA? Or the CDC? Plus a million other people that we take for granted. People talk about how bloated government is, but the reality is that these people do important jobs. We need them to have the society we have. People look at a soldier and say "thank you for your service" which is awesome; well most federal workers could also find a better paycheck in the private sector. They could hear "thanks for your service" once in a while too.

sorry for rant

 

[Dedfin]

Whoa.   Not to go on a tangent, but how do I pay my mortgage with a MC?  I don't have that option from the mortgage payment screen.   

Yeah wow... can you get points for this?

 

[[scooter]]

I know several people who work for the government, and they all live paycheck-to-paycheck. Why? Because they know that their healthcare and their retirement is paid for. And they know that they're not at risk of losing their job, so there's no point in having a "rainy day fund". From their point of view, there's no need to ever save money. So they spend every single dime of their check, every single week.  If they ever have an unexpected expense, they'll just put it on their credit card or go down to the credit union and take out a loan.

 

[fantasycurse42]

I thought about this too when I saw some of these stories, good topic. 

We're a world fueled by debt, that debt continues to grow and grow. The country with the 3rd biggest economy in the world has more debt than they'll ever realistically be able to pay back (and somehow we haven't learned a lesson from their 30 years of easy money policies). In about 20 years when they won't even be able to pay the interest on their debt, then you'll see a financial crisis, one that will make 2008 look like a runny nose. 

A painful recession, one that isn't solved by simply handing out more debt, is what the entire world needs to get out of these boom & bust cycles we're now in. These cycles don't erode wealth, they just condense it to fewer hands. 

I gotta be honest, any employee with a 6 figure income that cannot pay their bills bc of one or two missed paychecks has made their own bed. 

Now, if you're talking about a $20 an hour employee, they have my sympathy. 

 

[Chaka]

People look at a soldier and say "thank you for your service" which is awesome; well most federal workers could also find a better paycheck in the private sector. They could hear "thanks for your service" once in a while too.

Link

 

[fantasycurse42]

FAA too. Plus the NTSB. How about all the however many people that work for the NIH and FDA? Or the CDC? Plus a million other people that we take for granted. People talk about how bloated government is, but the reality is that these people do important jobs. We need them to have the society we have. People look at a soldier and say "thank you for your service" which is awesome; well most federal workers could also find a better paycheck in the private sector. They could hear "thanks for your service" once in a while too.

sorry for rant

Seems like a good reason to take govt job  

Because they know that their healthcare and their retirement is paid for. And they know that they're not at risk of losing their job, so there's no point in having a "rainy day fund". From their point of view, there's no need to ever save money. 

 

[Northern Voice]

People spend what they make. My wife and I spend what's in our bank account every month for the most part but we know that, so we payroll deduct/automatically transfer a decent amount to savings/travel/whatever accounts and bought a second property that we lose money on in the short term  (because her parents live in it) for the hopeful long term benefits.

But if you were to look at my primary bank account you would think I had no money and like someone else said, most of the "worth" we have/money we have access to, isn't particularly liquid.

 

[fantasycurse42]

People spend what they make. My wife and I spend what's in our bank account every month for the most part but we know that, so we payroll deduct/automatically transfer a decent amount to savings/travel/whatever accounts and bought a second property that we lose money on in the short term  (because her parents live in it) for the hopeful long term benefits.

But if you were to look at my primary bank account you would think I had no money and like someone else said, most of the "worth" we have/money we have access to, isn't particularly liquid.

If you have a 2nd house, and you have savings retirement accounts, you do have access to money. Also, in being financially responsible, in the above situation you describe, you should also have very quick access to credit beyond what might be a slightly lengthier process like a HELOC. 

Under no circumstance should a person with 2 properties and a savings account face financial ruin bc of one or two missed paychecks. 

 

[Northern Voice]

If you have a 2nd house, and you have savings retirement accounts, you do have access to money. Also, in being financially responsible, in the above situation you describe, you should also have very quick access to credit beyond what might be a slightly lengthier process like a HELOC. 

Under no circumstance should a person with 2 properties and a savings account face financial ruin bc of one or two missed paychecks. 

Sure, my point was more people have a tendency to see the money they have and spend it and I do/did too unless I do things to make myself not do it.

 

[fantasycurse42]

Sure, my point was more people have a tendency to see the money they have and spend it and I do/did too unless I do things to make myself not do it.

I understand your point. Not specific to the government shutdown, my point was more along the lines that people who aren't financially responsible might have to learn a hard lesson, they have nobody to blame but themselves. 

Regarding the shutdown, it sucks for all govt employees, but my deepest sympathy falls for those earning like $20 an hour, they are paycheck to paycheck, and it isn't their fault they have minimal credit or no savings, that is what their income dictates - they're the ones with no outs and completely ####ed. While it is bull#### that any govt employee would be locked out right now, I'd hope any higher earner has avenues to tap without facing real danger. 

 

[Dinsy Ejotuz]

There's a ton of stuff that doesn't seem important today, or at any random point in time, but will seem really important when some #### you've taken for granted for the last few generations suddenly stops working because no one's been watching it.  It might take months or even years, but there's a lot of that stuff.

Also, haven't seen mention of the IRS yet.  They're so important that they're going to be forced back to work ~illegally if this goes on much longer.

 

[DA RAIDERS]

The IRS is a big one. I am currently, waiting on the IRS, to send me some  I guess I’ll be waiting a bit longer.   Plus, tax season is nearly upon us. My CPA appointment is in about a month. 

 

[Fishboy]

Food inspectors.  The deadly romaine lettuce wasn't that long ago.

Do you think the vast majority of people know the FDA is only conducting a fraction of the inspections they normally due as a factor of the gov't shutdown?  I think not.  As long as the supply chain isn't disrupted and the average Joe can still walk into the local grocery store and buy lettuce and it's still available for the sub they order from Jimmy John's, the majority doesn't know as it is not impacting them today. 

Now, if this same lettuce cannot be shipped due to the lack of inspections and there is 30 feet of empty cooler space at the local store, then and only then will people notice. 

 

[Shula-holic]

The IRS is a big one. I am waiting currently on the IRS, to send me some  I guess I’ll be waiting a bit longer.   Plus, tax season is nearly upon us. My CPA appointment is in about a month. 

Took me over a year to get a refund on an amended return with them running at full staff.

 

[DA RAIDERS]

Took me over a year to get a refund on an amended return with them running at full staff.

Yea, we are at about 8 months. Good times. 

 

[culdeus]

Yeah wow... can you get points for this?

It's somewhat offtopic for this thread, there is a credit card thread where I described how to do this using Plastiq.com  There are other providers that offer the same service. 

You will pay the fee, but for meeting minimum spend it can be worth it.  When MasterPass runs a promotion you can pay fee free. Those periods come up about every 6 months, and are a ####### bonanza of points.  

 

[derek245583]

I know several people who work for the government, and they all live paycheck-to-paycheck. Why? Because they know that their healthcare and their retirement is paid for. And they know that they're not at risk of losing their job, so there's no point in having a "rainy day fund". From their point of view, there's no need to ever save money. So they spend every single dime of their check, every single week.  If they ever have an unexpected expense, they'll just put it on their credit card or go down to the credit union and take out a loan.

Interesting observation and one I had never thought of.

First thing I would do as a government employee is build up a savings for when the place does get shut down. Seems simple. 

 

[derek245583]

I am routinely amazed at people's lack of personal finance acumen.

I have a co worker who admitted that he is living "above his means and needs to slow down" (good for him). So his plan? Take a $100 bill out of the bank every Monday. He will pay for food, gas, groceries with that $100 and if he has anything left on Saturday he can grab a beer or 2. If he doesnt then he doesnt. Monday, rinse and repeat.

Not sure that is the greatest plan but at least he realizes he needs to get it fixed. He is a single dude and young so he has time....just thought it was an interesting strategy.

My beef with people is the total chasm between what they want and what they need. If I am up against it financially....I have a pretty small list of needs..and they include, heat, food, WATER, and transportation to get to my job. I have zero sympathy for people who arent making an effort to tighten the belt.

 

[CGRdrJoe]

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.kron4.com/amp/news/bay-area/alameda-food-bank-helping-coast-guard-families-in-need-during-shutdown/1698456137

this really pisses me off, there are countless stories like this spread throughout the US, while I love that the support is there from the community it really shouldn’t have to be for us. We are DHS because our mission is to protect our borders at home and not overseas and so we can’t be DOD as it would constitute an act of war. All that said we get paid the same as DOD, follow the same guidelines and during war are transferred under the Navy and yet our pay will be delayed until a budget is passed. Not one mission has stopped, so there are thousands of ya underway throughout the world leaving spouses to deal with this. After 20 years I’m ####### done with all this BS, I’m glad I’m in a financial position to not be hurt by it but plenty of my coworkers are. Hell we got a 20 year old kid who is 6 months in and supports both his parents on his puny pay check, yeah we sleep in the bed we make but swearing an oath should keep us frlom being used as pawns  I can’t wait to pull in tomorrow night and get drunk

 

[DA RAIDERS]

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.kron4.com/amp/news/bay-area/alameda-food-bank-helping-coast-guard-families-in-need-during-shutdown/1698456137

this really pisses me off, there are countless stories like this spread throughout the US, while I love that the support is there from the community it really shouldn’t have to be for us. We are DHS because our mission is to protect our borders at home and not overseas and so we can’t be DOD as it would constitute an act of war. All that said we get paid the same as DOD, follow the same guidelines and during war are transferred under the Navy and yet our pay will be delayed until a budget is passed. Not one mission has stopped, so there are thousands of ya underway throughout the world leaving spouses to deal with this. After 20 years I’m ####### done with all this BS, I’m glad I’m in a financial position to not be hurt by it but plenty of my coworkers are. Hell we got a 20 year old kid who is 6 months in and supports both his parents on his puny pay check, yeah we sleep in the bed we make but swearing an oath should keep us frlom being used as pawns  I can’t wait to pull in tomorrow night and get drunk

Appreciate you 

 

[stbugs]

Yup I was out of work for a good portion of 2017 which just did us in.  Been playing catch-up ever since.

It happens. My wife wasn’t working for about 10 years after kid #1. She’s a spender and she likes to think she worked a bunch of contracting hours but short part time gigs maybe got to max 10-20% of  when she worked. We were barely saving and definitely had credit card debt. Now all three kids are older and she’s been working for 5 years (got a great job with amazing pay, we were in awe of the offer and the stock market helped) and we are in the best position we’ve ever been. As long as one of us is working, we’d wouldn’t dip into savings if we tightened up and if both of us lost our jobs we’d be good for years without touching retirement. That said oldest is a senior in HS so the drain is coming. 10 more years of us both working and I want to be done and hopefully we will be or at least me. Been working since I was 16. I’m thinking about retirement every day.

 

[[scooter]]

My beef with people is the total chasm between what they want and what they need. If I am up against it financially....I have a pretty small list of needs..and they include, heat, food, WATER, and transportation to get to my job. I have zero sympathy for people who arent making an effort to tighten the belt.

I had an ex-girlfriend like this. Actually I've had several exes like this. But one in particular. She would constantly complain about how she never has enough money. So I would say, "If you don't have any money, why did you buy that new outfit yesterday?" And she would respond with "What? You don't want me to wear garbage, do you?"

And she would use the same line every time. (Me: "If you don't have any money, why did you eat at that fancy restaurant last night?" Her: "What? You don't want me to eat garbage, do you?") Luckily she finally found a man who buys her stuff all the time and she's finally happy now. He's miserable, but she's happy.

 

[eoMMan]

Do you think the vast majority of people know the FDA is only conducting a fraction of the inspections they normally due as a factor of the gov't shutdown?  I think not.  As long as the supply chain isn't disrupted and the average Joe can still walk into the local grocery store and buy lettuce and it's still available for the sub they order from Jimmy John's, the majority doesn't know as it is not impacting them today. 

Now, if this same lettuce cannot be shipped due to the lack of inspections and there is 30 feet of empty cooler space at the local store, then and only then will people notice. 

But shouldn't they know? Wouldn't you say these inspections are important?

Sure, life goes on now and Joe Blow can go buy his lettuce at his local grocery store but if people start getting sick and they have a tougher time tracking down the source....whoa nelly.

 

[E Street Brat]

Didn't they just announce they'r currently only inspecting "high risk" foods? What could possible go wrong. 

I work for a beverage production plant. USDA is still on sight.

 

[lod001]

Took me over a year to get a refund on an amended return with them running at full staff.

Shouldn't that tell you to adjust your take home pay to where you end up owing a few bucks to them at the end of the year? I never get $ back and average owing them $500 in April. I use that $ to make more $

 

[Buckna]

My wife switched careers from a steady paycheck to commission based sales. We had a lot of savings when she made the switch so I thought we would be fine, but just as she got established and started getting some nice checks she had to have an unexpected surgery which took a chunk out of our savings, but worse, put her out of commission from earning anything for about 6 months. That hurt a lot until she finally got well and reestablished but we are still digging out from the hole we dug ourselves into. No one will cry a tear for us or play a tiny violin as it was her choice that I supported and some bad timing/luck but just gives another example of how life can throw a wrench in there.

In the end it will be worth the financial setback as her old job made her miserable and she loves the new one. The upside in her new job also greatly exceeds what she could have done before so hoping it more than pays for itself in a year or two. That all being said, we aren't paycheck to paycheck and don't carry any credit card balances.

 

[TripItUp]

I know there are some bad luck stories out there, but most Americans are paycheck to paycheck because of poor life decisions.

Decide to have kids?...did you financially prepare for kids?

Lose your job?...what was your backup plan?   Did you financially prepare for being layed off?  

Wife spending all your money or take you to the cleaners in a divorce?....who decided to marry that person?

Your profession doesn't pay enough or provide job security?  Who chose that profession?

As a heads up, there will be another recession and there will be threads in this forum about not having enough money and then many will blame politicians and others.  Don't be one of those persons that blames everything else.  Be happy you live in a country that gives you unemployment to help compensate for your poor life decisions.

:soapbox:

 

[Fishboy]

But shouldn't they know? Wouldn't you say these inspections are important?

Sure, life goes on now and Joe Blow can go buy his lettuce at his local grocery store but if people start getting sick and they have a tougher time tracking down the source....whoa nelly.

I'm just pointing it out as the question I posed was w/o the news coverage how many people would actually know of the shutdown and are affected and actually notice.  I know TSA was also immediately pointed out, but unless you had air travel plans, it's not impacting a majority of the people. 

Totally agree that FDA inspections, FAA, TSA, air traffic controllers are all important and everyone "should" care.  But it's not impacting people directly and immediately, which led to my question in the first place. 

 

[DallasDMac]

I simply asked how many non-government workers would even realize without all the media coverage?  Innocent question that obviously struck a much larger nerve than I anticipated.  Honest question that I didn't expect to turn the topic of the OP into a pissing match.

Really? You threw in the "Just goes to show how much waste and $$ that is packed in government" comment and now your contention is you didn't mean anything by it?

 

[Punxsutawney Phil]

I work for a beverage production plant. USDA is still on sight.

The farm bill covered USDA, nrcs, and some other things for a year.  Everybody saw this shutdown coming, but people still may not be in a position to save much.  Mortgage companies and some may work with people if they can't make payments.

 

[DallasDMac]

The bank where I work has set up special HE Loans for those affected by the shutdown. I felt bad for many of my workmates who had to give up there Christmas plans to work on getting it ready. But it was the right thing to do for our members.

 

[Fishboy]

Really? You threw in the "Just goes to show how much waste and $$ that is packed in government" comment and now your contention is you didn't mean anything by it?

No, I'll stand behind that comment.  I think there is plenty of $$ unnecessarily packed into government.  But that topic is for the political forum and I don't go there. 

 

[Shula-holic]

Shouldn't that tell you to adjust your take home pay to where you end up owing a few bucks to them at the end of the year? I never get $ back and average owing them $500 in April. I use that $ to make more $

It was due to an amended return from a reporting error from one of my brokerage accounts, not a situation of overpaying withholding.  That's likely why it took longer.  They asked for updated schedules, etc.  Any time you go back into a prior tax year it's always more difficult.

 

[KCitons]

I remember one guy on the Mint.com forums was trying to change how his accounts were displayed. Normally, your screen will show your credit card debt as debt, and subtract it from your balances and assets to compute your net worth. So it might show you had a $10,000 car, $3,000 in savings, and owed -$1,000 on your credit card, for a net worth of $12,000. Fine.

This guy, though, wanted it to show his credit limit as part of his net worth, "because that's money that they've given me I have access to." That is, if he has a $10k car, $3k in the bank, and owes -$1,000 on a credit card with an $8,000 limit, he wants his net worth to be displayed as $20,000. 

He's counting credit card limits as part of his assets. 

Not only did this guy just not get it, but, he had many people arguing on his side. 

Some people just think that way. They're not right but they do.

Sound like I just increased my net worth.  

 

[Ramblin Wreck]

FAA too. Plus the NTSB. How about all the however many people that work for the NIH and FDA? Or the CDC? Plus a million other people that we take for granted. People talk about how bloated government is, but the reality is that these people do important jobs. We need them to have the society we have. People look at a soldier and say "thank you for your service" which is awesome; well most federal workers could also find a better paycheck in the private sector. They could hear "thanks for your service" once in a while too.

sorry for rant

Most that I have worked with work for the feds because they could hide out with low performance, boss around contractors, and end up with a fantastic pension plan.  Not everyone but a pretty damn good amount were pretty open about it.

 

[dgreen]

Most that I have worked with work for the feds because they could hide out with low performance, boss around contractors, and end up with a fantastic pension plan.  Not everyone but a pretty damn good amount were pretty open about it.

I’ve worked in both situations. The areas that were full of people like you describe was also led by people who were low performers. In areas with good leadership, I’ve been surrounded by good workers. 

 

[belljr]

Most that I have worked with work for the feds because they could hide out with low performance, boss around contractors, and end up with a fantastic pension plan.  Not everyone but a pretty damn good amount were pretty open about it.

We have a few of those but on a whole my team works their butt off.

That being said when I took my oath to serve the country, I didn't consider  forced to work this long .  I don't need thanks simply because most likely I'll never be shot at

 

[NewlyRetired]

My beef with people is the total chasm between what they want and what they need. If I am up against it financially....I have a pretty small list of needs..and they include, heat, food, WATER, and transportation to get to my job. I have zero sympathy for people who arent making an effort to tighten the belt.

I have no data to back this up so it is all just a hunch but I feel like people with children find it much easier to spend above their means than people who are single and with no kids.

I think there is something inherent in our society today  where people with kids sometimes feel pressure to make sure their kids have as many goodies and experiences as they can and that stuff adds up super quickly.

 

[fantasycurse42]

I was curious, there’s no real way to get a definitive accurate answer, but I’d assume a fairly large number percentage wise.

https://www.google.com/search?client=safari&hl=en-us&ei=Fyo9XL-MA-jl_QaVlavIDQ&q=living+paycheck+to+paycheck+statistics+2018&oq=what+percentage+of+americans+live+paycheck+to+paycheck&gs_l=mobile-gws-wiz-serp.1.0.0i71l5.0.0..4116...0.0..0.0.0.......0.fSX4lhvBBuE#ip=1

Depending on the source, I see as low as around 35%, but more of the results point to 70-80%. I’d bet the real answer is closer to the higher end of that, but not at the top.

We’re about 6 months away from the longest expansion on record. How about everyone takes their heads out of their asses? If this expansion has been anything more than a mirage, why are the masses paycheck to paycheck?

The boom/bust cycles just condense wealth to the few at the top. Eventually, we’ll see a debt crisis that will create another Great Depression, probably much worse, if we stay in these cycles.

Let that collapse happen sooner, it’ll be less painful. A lot of bad debt needs to come off the books.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/johnmauldin/2018/11/07/a-worldwide-debt-default-is-a-real-possibility/#7496d66053aa

In 2017, one dollar of non-financial debt generated only 40 cents of GDP in the US. It’s even less elsewhere. This is down from more than four dollars of growth for each dollar of debt 50 years ago.

 

[SHIZNITTTT]

What is the penalty for not working in an essential job?   Prison time?  Getting Fired? 

Has there ever been a time when these "government shutdown" people have not gotten their back pay? 

I can't imagine having to go to work every day hoping to get paid eventually.    I think a lot of people would start calling in "sick." 

MAGA! 

 

[SHIZNITTTT]

When Ronald Reagan fired 11,000 air traffic controllers who didn't show up for work in 1981, they lost their jobs and were barred from ever holding government jobs again (until they were pardoned by Clinton in the mid-90s).

where did they find 11,000 replacements? 

 

[scorchy]

My agency isn't shut down so I got the usual direct deposit on Friday.  Wife's agency is shut down, but she's essential, so she's working without a paycheck at the moment.  We're fortunate enough to have quite a bit put away, but not everyone is in the same boat, especially in DC/MD/VA area.  She manages a few 20-somethings where this is their first job out of law school, and they have significant school debt and really high rent, and a missed paycheck really hurts, even if they know (think?) they'll get paid eventually.  Similarly, there were some glitches when my agency recently switched credit card vendors, and one of my newer GS-7s had to travel for work using her personal card to the tune of $2500 right before the holidays.  Thanks to issues with our awful travel management system (thanks, Concur!) she still hasn't gotten all her money, her credit card was maxed, and she had to borrow from her mom to pay off her credit card.  If we had to shut down, she would have been double screwed. Not everyone is a FBG with 7 figures in the bank, and lots of folks living paycheck-to-paycheck haven't necessarily been making terrible decisions.

 

[belljr]

Bosses and supervisors filled the immediate gap while they fast-tracked new hiring and training for replacement workers over the next few years. 

Military controllers also.  

 

[scorchy]

Most that I have worked with work for the feds because they could hide out with low performance, boss around contractors, and end up with a fantastic pension plan.  Not everyone but a pretty damn good amount were pretty open about it.

I've been with the government more than 20 years and I would say the number of legitimately poor performers I've worked with totals less than a dozen, and most of them ended up leaving after poor reviews.  Sure, we've got a couple of Miltons in our 50-person office, but what workplace doesn't?  

I stay with the government despite making less then I could elsewhere because I believe in our mission, like the people I work with, and yes, job security also plays a part.  It's a trade off.  My wife is an attorney who makes probably 40 percent less than she did in Big Law, but at least she now is only working 50 hour weeks instead of 70 and doesn't have a bunch of stuffed shirt old partners breathing down her neck.  Again, tradeoffs.  

As for the fantastic pension, I guess it's "fantastic" compared to the $0 that most companies now offer.  But I'm not sure receiving a pension that equals 30 percent of my salary when I worked at the same place from the time I was 25 to when I'm 62 qualifies as "fantastic." At least when we compare it to what a fantastic pension meant in the past.

 

[fantasycurse42]

My agency isn't shut down so I got the usual direct deposit on Friday.  Wife's agency is shut down, but she's essential, so she's working without a paycheck at the moment.  We're fortunate enough to have quite a bit put away, but not everyone is in the same boat, especially in DC/MD/VA area.  She manages a few 20-somethings where this is their first job out of law school, and they have significant school debt and really high rent, and a missed paycheck really hurts, even if they know (think?) they'll get paid eventually.  Similarly, there were some glitches when my agency recently switched credit card vendors, and one of my newer GS-7s had to travel for work using her personal card to the tune of $2500 right before the holidays.  Thanks to issues with our awful travel management system (thanks, Concur!) she still hasn't gotten all her money, her credit card was maxed, and she had to borrow from her mom to pay off her credit card.  If we had to shut down, she would have been double screwed. Not everyone is a FBG with 7 figures in the bank, and lots of folks living paycheck-to-paycheck haven't necessarily been making terrible decisions.

Not to be a ####, but these youngsters are pretty stupid with money, at least from my anecdotal experiences. Day after day I hear/see one story after the next, just my company alone. 

Whether it is the girl who has $10k of handbags who makes $50k a year, or the group of 4 dudes who live in a $12k a month apartment as roommates, the moron who makes $75k that was so proud to show off his new Rolex Submariner, and I can go on and on and on.

Here’s a crazy thought; get an apartment in Jackson Heights Queens with one roommate and pocket half of that $3k a month you pay on rent. You could max your 401k on that difference, but instead you’ll head over to the bars and watch TNF paying $19 a drink. 

We’re a country of irresponsible morons, and it will catch up one day. My objective is to position my family as best as possible for when it does.