No way Ginn is a better WR prospect than Johnson. Calvin will be rated as highly as Larry Fitzgerald, if not higher. In my mind, there is no player in this upcoming draft that is more of a sure thing than Calvin Johnson.I'll reiterate what bugs me about Ginn, which is that lack of bread and butter WR skills and polish. Sure, he can outrun a DB, but can he outleap a DB? outmuscle him in close space for a ball? outsmart him with a crisp route (which would be lethal with his quicks and speed) ? In college, he's always five yards beyond the nearest DB, or making them miss and then flying past them on short catches. That's not going to happen very often in the pros. He'll be a one trick pony if he doesn't round out his game (but it's a quite a trick).Maybe to you he does, but to me he looks VERY talented, with both speed and hands. He may be the best WR in the draft, and yes, that includes Mr. Johnson.Ted Ginn Jr right now reminds me of Peter Warrick.I think Adrian Peterson at 5 is too low. Definately top 2, IMO.
Read my previous postNo way Ginn is a better WR prospect than Johnson. Calvin will be rated as highly as Larry Fitzgerald, if not higher. In my mind, there is no player in this upcoming draft that is more of a sure thing than Calvin Johnson.I'll reiterate what bugs me about Ginn, which is that lack of bread and butter WR skills and polish. Sure, he can outrun a DB, but can he outleap a DB? outmuscle him in close space for a ball? outsmart him with a crisp route (which would be lethal with his quicks and speed) ? In college, he's always five yards beyond the nearest DB, or making them miss and then flying past them on short catches. That's not going to happen very often in the pros. He'll be a one trick pony if he doesn't round out his game (but it's a quite a trick).Maybe to you he does, but to me he looks VERY talented, with both speed and hands. He may be the best WR in the draft, and yes, that includes Mr. Johnson.Ted Ginn Jr right now reminds me of Peter Warrick.I think Adrian Peterson at 5 is too low. Definately top 2, IMO.
No use sandbagging because you know I'm just gonna ruin it anywayRead my previous postNo way Ginn is a better WR prospect than Johnson. Calvin will be rated as highly as Larry Fitzgerald, if not higher. In my mind, there is no player in this upcoming draft that is more of a sure thing than Calvin Johnson.I'll reiterate what bugs me about Ginn, which is that lack of bread and butter WR skills and polish. Sure, he can outrun a DB, but can he outleap a DB? outmuscle him in close space for a ball? outsmart him with a crisp route (which would be lethal with his quicks and speed) ? In college, he's always five yards beyond the nearest DB, or making them miss and then flying past them on short catches. That's not going to happen very often in the pros. He'll be a one trick pony if he doesn't round out his game (but it's a quite a trick).Maybe to you he does, but to me he looks VERY talented, with both speed and hands. He may be the best WR in the draft, and yes, that includes Mr. Johnson.Ted Ginn Jr right now reminds me of Peter Warrick.I think Adrian Peterson at 5 is too low. Definately top 2, IMO.![]()
If I had the #1 pick in a dynasty rookie draft, depending on depth at my RB position and age factors, I'd take Johnson over Peterson at this point, but I think AP is slightly overrated.Out of sight out of mind indeed.Peterson is the best player in this draft class and it's not even close.
Exactly.C. Johnson is a thicker and more technically proficient version of Fitzgerald. That's saying something, as Fitzgerald was The second coming at WR coming out of Pitt. Fitzgerald damn near walks on water off the field...SUPER high character kid...and I think C. Johnson fits that mold too. At least that is my understanding and, given the boom/bust at the WR position and need to hit on a Top 10 pick, it is going to matter.No way Ginn is a better WR prospect than Johnson. Calvin will be rated as highly as Larry Fitzgerald, if not higher. In my mind, there is no player in this upcoming draft that is more of a sure thing than Calvin Johnson.I'll reiterate what bugs me about Ginn, which is that lack of bread and butter WR skills and polish. Sure, he can outrun a DB, but can he outleap a DB? outmuscle him in close space for a ball? outsmart him with a crisp route (which would be lethal with his quicks and speed) ? In college, he's always five yards beyond the nearest DB, or making them miss and then flying past them on short catches. That's not going to happen very often in the pros. He'll be a one trick pony if he doesn't round out his game (but it's a quite a trick).Maybe to you he does, but to me he looks VERY talented, with both speed and hands. He may be the best WR in the draft, and yes, that includes Mr. Johnson.Ted Ginn Jr right now reminds me of Peter Warrick.I think Adrian Peterson at 5 is too low. Definately top 2, IMO.
Patrick Willis and H.B. Blades stand out as tackle machine LBs, and Gaines Adams is a beast of a DE. I'll have more well-formed opinions on the IDPs during the pre-draft season. The skill players generally make deeper impressions when I watch games during the year. I can say that this year's LB class is not as exciting as last year's terrific LB crop.Bloom any thoughts on the IDP guys in this draft class?
Sounds to me like your 1.01 pick is on the market then, eh?If I had the #1 pick in a dynasty rookie draft, depending on depth at my RB position and age factors, I'd take Johnson over Peterson at this point, but I think AP is slightly overrated.Out of sight out of mind indeed.Peterson is the best player in this draft class and it's not even close.
You conspicuously left Lynch out. I don't think he's as extraordinary as Johnson or Peterson, but he's almost as risk-free. He runs low and powerful, changes direction and makes efficient moves with the best of em, he's a great receiver to boot.I think he's a better RB prospect than Laurence Maroney or DeAngelo Williams.At offensive skill positions A. Peterson and C. Johnson represent the greatest low risk/high return investments in this upcoming class. Everyone else is substantially behind in 3rd place.
It's not in stone yet that I have it, but likely now that KJ is done. Problem is a can't move very far down to get my man.Sounds to me like your 1.01 pick is on the market then, eh?If I had the #1 pick in a dynasty rookie draft, depending on depth at my RB position and age factors, I'd take Johnson over Peterson at this point, but I think AP is slightly overrated.Out of sight out of mind indeed.Peterson is the best player in this draft class and it's not even close.I agree with Otis--I see a big 3 of Calvin, Marshawn and AP, then a big drop to the 2nd tier of guys who will be ranked according to who/where they go to in the draft.
Probably just me but I am not as high on Lynch as other folks. My feeling is that there is a fairly wide margin between Peterson/Johnson and the players rated 3, 4, 5, 6, etc. This is specific to offensive skill position players.You conspicuously left Lynch out. I don't think he's as extraordinary as Johnson or Peterson, but he's almost as risk-free. He runs low and powerful, changes direction and makes efficient moves with the best of em, he's a great receiver to boot.I think he's a better RB prospect than Laurence Maroney or DeAngelo Williams.At offensive skill positions A. Peterson and C. Johnson represent the greatest low risk/high return investments in this upcoming class. Everyone else is substantially behind in 3rd place.
I like this mock draft, but i personally would move Quinn down about 5 slots. I wouldn't take a QB over a nice WR prospect like Rice or Jarrett, or a RB.Based on predicted ADP alone (the orginal poster's question), here's the list I came up with:For Dynasty purposes, non-IDP, TE required...1. Adrian Peterson, RB, OU (Jr)2. Marshawn Lynch, RB, Cal (Jr)3. Calvin Johnson, WR, G Tech (Jr)4. Brady Quinn, QB, ND (Sn)5. Kenny Irons, RB, Auburn (Sn)6. Michael Bush, RB, L'ville (Sn)7. Dwayne Jarrett, WR, USC (Jr)8. Sidney Rice, WR, S.Carolina (So)9. Kenneth Darby, RB, Bama (Sn)10. Ted Ginn Jr, WR, OSU (Jr)11. Brian Brohm, QB, L'ville, (Jr)12. Jeff Samardzija, WR, ND (Sn)13. Antonio Pittman, RB, OSU (Jr)14. Drew Stanton, QB, MSU (Sn)15. Tony Hunt, RB, PSU (Sn)16. Jason Hill, WR, Wash St (Sn)17. Robert Meachem, WR, Tenn (Jr)18. Troy Smith, QB, OSU (Sn)19. Lorenzo Booker, RB, FSU (Sn)20. Greg Olson, TE, Miami (Jr)This list assumes Michael Hart, JaMarcus Russell, Chad Henne and most other unlisted Juniors will stay in college.Obviously alot will change based on the teams these guys go to.
[quote name
10. Brian Brohm QB LOU (Jr)
Lacks ideal size, but has great accuracy and awareness. Great leader as shown by his ability to flat out win.
Granted.....I'm not a Brohm fan, but what makes you think he lacks ideal size? Brohm is listed at 6'4" and 224 lbs. 3 lbs. lighter than Quinn and the same height. I'd rather have Quinn, but Brohm does not lack size.
RB names to become familiar with. I believe any if not all of these will get drafted over more known, but uninspiring talent like Kenneth Darby.
Dwayne Wright- Fresno State
Jon Cornish- Kansas
Colby Smith- Louisville
I have not seen him play (the others I have), but
alonzo coleman- Hampton
Nice list. Russell should be higher. For fantasy, he might be a better prospect than Quinn (destination will sort that out). Jarrett over Hunt is questionable. Hunt is not a starting quality NFL RB - not that he couldn't be one of the top backups, and a fantasy commodity when he does get to play due to injury or a weak RB corps, but for dynasty, his value is limited. Same with Darby. Honestly the RBs are pretty weak after the big 2 this year - I think Pittman and Hart (and Irons) project better than Hunt or Darby.I think you'll see at least one of Hunt or Darby fall to the second day, and out of first round consideration. I also think Troy Smith will deserve some consideration, and any number of 2nd tier WRs (my favorite being Higgins).Bumping to keep this topic around. Lots of folks will say that we need to wait until the draft to do this, but I like getting some opinions based purely on talent and not opportunity. Assume that Rice, Brohm and Bush stay in school. My Predicted top 12 in Dynasty leagues:1) AP - Top of the line, injury worries are overblown2) Calvin Johnson - Phenomenal talent, fantasy teams with a need at WR should almost take him #1 overall3) Marshawn Lynch - very safe, complete RB4) Brady Quinn - A billion Notre Dame fans out there, so a bunch must play fantasy football5) Ted Ginn - Again, too high in my opinion, but people love speed and he will impress6) Kenny Irons - I'm not sold on him, but RBs usually go earlier than they should7) Robert Meachem - My projected "pre-draft WR super riser due to measurables" guy this year8) JaMarcus Russell - Good value here, he will be a very good fantasy option in the NFL9) Tony Hunt - My projected "post-draft RB super riser due to team/situation" guy this year10) Dwayne Jarrett - BMW fears drop him for fantasy, good value here11) Kenneth Darby - Underwhelming to me, people reach for 2nd round RBs at the end of the 1st every year12) Antonio Pittman - Won't get a ton of love, but could be a very good NFL back
I don't disagree with most of that, but this was more a list of what I think the average draft order will be, not what it should be. I think people will grab Quinn too high, jump on some RB that goes to a team that needs one (Shelton, Arrington) and jump on a WR based on his measurables.Nice list. Russell should be higher. For fantasy, he might be a better prospect than Quinn (destination will sort that out). Jarrett over Hunt is questionable. Hunt is not a starting quality NFL RB - not that he couldn't be one of the top backups, and a fantasy commodity when he does get to play due to injury or a weak RB corps, but for dynasty, his value is limited. Same with Darby. Honestly the RBs are pretty weak after the big 2 this year - I think Pittman and Hart (and Irons) project better than Hunt or Darby.I think you'll see at least one of Hunt or Darby fall to the second day, and out of first round consideration. I also think Troy Smith will deserve some consideration, and any number of 2nd tier WRs (my favorite being Higgins).Bumping to keep this topic around. Lots of folks will say that we need to wait until the draft to do this, but I like getting some opinions based purely on talent and not opportunity. Assume that Rice, Brohm and Bush stay in school. My Predicted top 12 in Dynasty leagues:1) AP - Top of the line, injury worries are overblown2) Calvin Johnson - Phenomenal talent, fantasy teams with a need at WR should almost take him #1 overall3) Marshawn Lynch - very safe, complete RB4) Brady Quinn - A billion Notre Dame fans out there, so a bunch must play fantasy football5) Ted Ginn - Again, too high in my opinion, but people love speed and he will impress6) Kenny Irons - I'm not sold on him, but RBs usually go earlier than they should7) Robert Meachem - My projected "pre-draft WR super riser due to measurables" guy this year8) JaMarcus Russell - Good value here, he will be a very good fantasy option in the NFL9) Tony Hunt - My projected "post-draft RB super riser due to team/situation" guy this year10) Dwayne Jarrett - BMW fears drop him for fantasy, good value here11) Kenneth Darby - Underwhelming to me, people reach for 2nd round RBs at the end of the 1st every year12) Antonio Pittman - Won't get a ton of love, but could be a very good NFL back
Approx. where do you see the top ~ 6 guys getting taken in a start up Dynasty league that includes both veterans and rookies?ConstruxBoy said:Bumping to keep this topic around. Lots of folks will say that we need to wait until the draft to do this, but I like getting some opinions based purely on talent and not opportunity. Assume that Rice, Brohm and Bush stay in school. My Predicted top 12 in Dynasty leagues:1) AP - Top of the line, injury worries are overblown2) Calvin Johnson - Phenomenal talent, fantasy teams with a need at WR should almost take him #1 overall3) Marshawn Lynch - very safe, complete RB4) Brady Quinn - A billion Notre Dame fans out there, so a bunch must play fantasy football5) Ted Ginn - Again, too high in my opinion, but people love speed and he will impress6) Kenny Irons - I'm not sold on him, but RBs usually go earlier than they should7) Robert Meachem - My projected "pre-draft WR super riser due to measurables" guy this year8) JaMarcus Russell - Good value here, he will be a very good fantasy option in the NFL9) Tony Hunt - My projected "post-draft RB super riser due to team/situation" guy this year10) Dwayne Jarrett - BMW fears drop him for fantasy, good value here11) Kenneth Darby - Underwhelming to me, people reach for 2nd round RBs at the end of the 1st every year12) Antonio Pittman - Won't get a ton of love, but could be a very good NFL back
I want to hear what Construx says, but I'll give you my take on his top 6Approx. where do you see the top ~ 6 guys getting taken in a start up Dynasty league that includes both veterans and rookies?ConstruxBoy said:Bumping to keep this topic around. Lots of folks will say that we need to wait until the draft to do this, but I like getting some opinions based purely on talent and not opportunity. Assume that Rice, Brohm and Bush stay in school. My Predicted top 12 in Dynasty leagues:1) AP - Top of the line, injury worries are overblown2) Calvin Johnson - Phenomenal talent, fantasy teams with a need at WR should almost take him #1 overall3) Marshawn Lynch - very safe, complete RB4) Brady Quinn - A billion Notre Dame fans out there, so a bunch must play fantasy football5) Ted Ginn - Again, too high in my opinion, but people love speed and he will impress6) Kenny Irons - I'm not sold on him, but RBs usually go earlier than they should7) Robert Meachem - My projected "pre-draft WR super riser due to measurables" guy this year8) JaMarcus Russell - Good value here, he will be a very good fantasy option in the NFL9) Tony Hunt - My projected "post-draft RB super riser due to team/situation" guy this year10) Dwayne Jarrett - BMW fears drop him for fantasy, good value here11) Kenneth Darby - Underwhelming to me, people reach for 2nd round RBs at the end of the 1st every year12) Antonio Pittman - Won't get a ton of love, but could be a very good NFL back
Based on a 14 team league initial Dynasty Draft....Adrian Peterson- late 1st/early 2nd round (top 12-20 overall)Marshawn Lynch- late 2nd round (top 25-30 overall) (goes before Calvin Johnson in an initial draft because always a big run of RB's early so Lynch falls in line)Calvin Johnson- 3rd round (top 35-45 overall)Ted Ginn Jr.- 6th round area (top 75-90 overall)Brady Quinn- 7th/8th round area (top 90-100 overall)Approx. where do you see the top ~ 6 guys getting taken in a start up Dynasty league that includes both veterans and rookies?
I think those are pretty good bets, but I would probably put Quinn down further like 20 - 25 among QBs because I don't think that most owners will take rookie QBs real high in a dynasty league. Just too much evidence that solid QBs can come from later in the draft and be solid starters.I want to hear what Construx says, but I'll give you my take on his top 6Approx. where do you see the top ~ 6 guys getting taken in a start up Dynasty league that includes both veterans and rookies?ConstruxBoy said:Bumping to keep this topic around. Lots of folks will say that we need to wait until the draft to do this, but I like getting some opinions based purely on talent and not opportunity. Assume that Rice, Brohm and Bush stay in school. My Predicted top 12 in Dynasty leagues:1) AP - Top of the line, injury worries are overblown2) Calvin Johnson - Phenomenal talent, fantasy teams with a need at WR should almost take him #1 overall3) Marshawn Lynch - very safe, complete RB4) Brady Quinn - A billion Notre Dame fans out there, so a bunch must play fantasy football5) Ted Ginn - Again, too high in my opinion, but people love speed and he will impress6) Kenny Irons - I'm not sold on him, but RBs usually go earlier than they should7) Robert Meachem - My projected "pre-draft WR super riser due to measurables" guy this year8) JaMarcus Russell - Good value here, he will be a very good fantasy option in the NFL9) Tony Hunt - My projected "post-draft RB super riser due to team/situation" guy this year10) Dwayne Jarrett - BMW fears drop him for fantasy, good value here11) Kenneth Darby - Underwhelming to me, people reach for 2nd round RBs at the end of the 1st every year12) Antonio Pittman - Won't get a ton of love, but could be a very good NFL backeterson - top 12-15 RB, top 20-25 overallJohnson - top 15-20 WR, top 40-50 overallLynch - top 15-20 RB, top 30-40 overallQuinn - top 12-18 QB, top 75-100 overallGinn - top 25-35 WR, top 75-125 overallIrons - top 30-40 RB, top 100-125 overall
I would agree with your general point . Quinn is that high more because of the weakness of the Qbs after 15 or so than because I am high on him - He would probably fall closer to the tail end of the overall rank range.I think those are pretty good bets, but I would probably put Quinn down further like 20 - 25 among QBs because I don't think that most owners will take rookie QBs real high in a dynasty league. Just too much evidence that solid QBs can come from later in the draft and be solid starters.