Has Gruden ever developed a young QB? (1 Viewer)

[Sweet Love]

This is an honest question and not a knock on what he has or has not done. I was reading another thread and started to think that he gets a lot out of his veteran QBs like Gannon, Brad Johnson and Garcia, but when it comes to developing younger ones, he seems to not be strong in that dept. or he loses patience (guys like Bobby Hoying, Tuisosopu, Simms and Gradkowski). Now none of those younger guys were highly touted, yet he managed to turn Gannon into an MVP and Superbowl QB, got Brad Johnson to play above his head and has been great with Garcia thus far.

Anyone have any thoughts on this. he is kind of listed as a QB guru, but I just don't see it with the younger guys.

 

[redman]

Your thread title is phrased wrong. I think you mean to ask "Has Gruden ever developed a young QB?"

I don't know the answer, but I think this issue is the result of what I've observed about the West Coast Offense and coaches who seem to insist upon its implementation despite the talent they're working with. You need a very smart, disciplined QB to run that offense successfully (having equally smart and disciplined WR's is just about as necessary), and those are the areas that young QB's tend to be most lacking in.

Gruden and other WCO adherents seem all too prone to installing a system and then trying to find players to run it rather than adapting to fit their players' talents. We've seen this with Shanny in Denver post-Elway; Reid in Philly shoehorning McNabb into an ill-fitting system IMHO; Mora Jr. in Atlanta with Vick; Shotty in KC and Washington with everyone except for an aging Montana; etc.

I think that's the problem with Gruden more than anything else.

 

[John Mamula]

Rich Gannon.

Jeff George.

 

[D_House]

Where did the QB guru tag come from for Gruden?

 

[TommyGilmore]

Has he ever needed to develop at QB? The guy has had a fairly consistent track record of success by plugging in QBs that were castoffs elsewhere.

How many coaches have had more success with QBs than Gruden?

 

[Sweet Love]

Has he ever needed to develop at QB? The guy has had a fairly consistent track record of success by plugging in QBs that were castoffs elsewhere.

How many coaches have had more success with QBs than Gruden?

Thanks for the insight everyone and I did change the title as it was misleading. TommyG, I guess you stumbled upon the point I am wondering about. Has he taken Vets because he will inevitably have more success or because he is just not good at developing the same rapport with younger guys as he is with the Vets? I do believe he is great with QBs, I just thought it was interesting that he seems to get guys on the tail end of their careers to perform, yet does not have nearly the same success with the younger ones.

 

[redman]

Where did the QB guru tag come from for Gruden?

Rich Gannon went from a low round draftee and journeyman to a league MVP and starter in the Super Bowl for Gruden. Isn't that enough in a world where Norv Turner's still living off of Troy Aikman?

 

[GregR_2]

Some people probably associate him with Favre as he was an offensive coach during Favre's early years, though he wasn't the OC or the QB coach so I don't know that I'd personally give him some credit from Favre's career.

 

[Despyzer]

Where did the QB guru tag come from for Gruden?

Rich Gannon went from a low round draftee and journeyman to a league MVP and starter in the Super Bowl for Gruden. Isn't that enough in a world where Norv Turner's still living off of Troy Aikman, Gus Frerotte, Trent Green, Brad Johnson, Drew Brees, and Alex Smith?

Fixed

 

[Eagle Eye]

He made Hoying look like a starting QB. That's pretty impressive right there. He left and the next year The Hoy Wonder imploded, never to be heard from again.

 

[dgreen]

He made Hoying look like a starting QB. That's pretty impressive right there. He left and the next year The Hoy Wonder imploded, never to be heard from again.

Under Gruden, Hoying posted good numbers: 128-225-1573-11-6 in 7 games. The next year, without Gruden, he plummeted to 114-224-961-0-9 in 8 games.

 

[switz]

Where did the QB guru tag come from for Gruden?

Rich Gannon went from a low round draftee and journeyman to a league MVP and starter in the Super Bowl for Gruden. Isn't that enough in a world where Norv Turner's still living off of Troy Aikman, Gus Frerotte, Trent Green, Brad Johnson, Drew Brees, and Alex Smith?

Fixed

Are you really saying Frerotte, Green, Johnson, and Smith were great QBs with Turner?

 

[GregR_2]

Where did the QB guru tag come from for Gruden?

Rich Gannon went from a low round draftee and journeyman to a league MVP and starter in the Super Bowl for Gruden. Isn't that enough in a world where Norv Turner's still living off of Troy Aikman, Gus Frerotte, Trent Green, Brad Johnson, Drew Brees, and Alex Smith?

Fixed

Are you really saying Frerotte, Green, Johnson, and Smith were great QBs with Turner?

Alex Smith's career:Year TM | G | Comp Att PCT YD Y/A TD INT | Att Yards TD |

+----------+-----+---------------------------------------+-----------------+

| 2005 sfo | 9 | 84 165 50.9 875 5.3 1 11 | 30 103 0 |

| 2006 sfo | 16 | 257 442 58.1 2890 6.5 16 16 | 44 147 2 |

| 2007 sfo | 7 | 94 193 48.7 914 4.7 2 4 | 13 89 0 |

How would you characterize his performance the year he played with Norv Turner compared to the years without him?

 

[Despyzer]

Where did the QB guru tag come from for Gruden?

Rich Gannon went from a low round draftee and journeyman to a league MVP and starter in the Super Bowl for Gruden. Isn't that enough in a world where Norv Turner's still living off of Troy Aikman, Gus Frerotte, Trent Green, Brad Johnson, Drew Brees, and Alex Smith?

Fixed

Are you really saying Frerotte, Green, Johnson, and Smith were great QBs with Turner?

Frerotte was a 7th rounder out of Tulsa that no one had ever heard of. He was never great, but he was a serviceable starter under Turner.Trent Green threw for over 3,000 yards, 23 TDs and only 11 INTs in his first year under Turner. Most franchises will gladly take that.Brad Johnson threw for over 4,000 yards, 24 TDs to 13 INTs while completing almost 61% in his first year under Turner. We have to be bordering on great now.Name me another year where Alex Smith performed better as a pro than he did under Turner.

 

[Neil Beaufort Zod]

Where did the QB guru tag come from for Gruden?

Rich Gannon went from a low round draftee and journeyman to a league MVP and starter in the Super Bowl for Gruden. Isn't that enough in a world where Norv Turner's still living off of Troy Aikman?

Gannon didn't start a Super Bowl for Gruden. Gruden is responsible for his success in the system, but Gruden beat Gannon with Brad Johnson in the SB. Totally agree about Norv. The worst thing that could have happened for the Chargers was for Norv to make the playoffs and save his job. LT will be past his prime before the team wakes up.

 

[redman]

Where did the QB guru tag come from for Gruden?

Rich Gannon went from a low round draftee and journeyman to a league MVP and starter in the Super Bowl for Gruden. Isn't that enough in a world where Norv Turner's still living off of Troy Aikman?

Gannon didn't start a Super Bowl for Gruden. Gruden is responsible for his success in the system, but Gruden beat Gannon with Brad Johnson in the SB. Totally agree about Norv. The worst thing that could have happened for the Chargers was for Norv to make the playoffs and save his job. LT will be past his prime before the team wakes up.

Duh, I knew that about Gannon and Gruden re the Super Bowl.