How Did Carolina Beat Minnesota? (1 Viewer)

[SaintsInDome2006]

Lead = 7-6

3rd Quarter:

1-10-MIN41 (14:56) B.Favre pass incomplete short left to C.Taylor.

2-10-MIN41 (14:52) B.Favre pass short left to B.Berrian to MIN 46 for 5 yards (R.Marshall) [D.Lewis].

3-5-MIN46 (14:12) (Shotgun) B.Favre pass incomplete deep right to V.Shiancoe (D.Wesley).

4-5-MIN46 (14:03) C.Kluwe punts 54 yards to end zone, Center-C.Loeffler, Touchback.

1-10-MIN20 (11:22) B.Favre pass short right to S.Rice to MIN 45 for 25 yards (C.Gamble) [J.Beason].

1-10-MIN45 (10:48) (Shotgun) B.Favre pass short middle to V.Shiancoe to CAR 47 for 8 yards (J.Beason).

2-2-CAR47 (10:17) B.Favre pass incomplete short middle to A.Peterson.

PENALTY on MIN, Illegal Formation, 5 yards, enforced at CAR 47 - No Play.

2-7-MIN48 (10:11) (Shotgun) B.Favre pass incomplete short middle to A.Peterson [J.Peppers].

3-7-MIN48 (10:07) (Shotgun) B.Favre sacked at MIN 43 for -5 yards (D.Wesley).

4-12-MIN43 (10:02) C.Kluwe punts 57 yards to end zone, Center-C.Loeffler, Touchback.

1-10-MIN36 (8:24) A.Peterson up the middle to MIN 40 for 4 yards (R.Marshall).

2-6-MIN40 (7:49) B.Favre pass short right to V.Shiancoe to MIN 48 for 8 yards (C.Gamble).

1-10-MIN48 (7:16) A.Peterson right tackle to 50 for 2 yards (J.Anderson).

2-8-50 (6:37) B.Favre pass short middle to P.Harvin to CAR 44 for 6 yards (C.Harris).

PENALTY on MIN-B.McKinnie, Offensive Holding, 10 yards, enforced at 50 - No Play.

2-18-MIN40 (6:07) B.Favre pass short right to S.Rice to CAR 37 for 23 yards (C.Godfrey). FUMBLES (C.Godfrey), RECOVERED by CAR-C.Harris at CAR 37. C.Harris to CAR 37 for no gain (P.Harvin).

1-10-MIN11 (3:20) B.Favre pass short left to B.Berrian to MIN 14 for 3 yards (R.Marshall).

2-7-MIN14 (3:02) B.Favre pass incomplete short left to C.Taylor (J.Anderson).

3-7-MIN14 (2:56) (Shotgun) B.Favre sacked at MIN 8 for -6 yards (J.Peppers).

4-13-MIN8 (2:34) C.Kluwe punts 48 yards to CAR 44, Center-C.Loeffler. C.Munnerlyn to MIN 49 for 7 yards (C.Loeffler).

4th Quarter:

1-10-MIN15 (14:44) A.Peterson right end to MIN 16 for 1 yard (C.Johnson, D.Lewis).

2-9-MIN16 (14:06) B.Favre pass short middle to B.Berrian to MIN 33 for 17 yards (C.Munnerlyn).

1-10-MIN33 (13:23) B.Favre pass incomplete short right to P.Harvin.

PENALTY on MIN-B.Berrian, Offensive Pass Interference, 10 yards, enforced at MIN 33 - No Play.

1-20-MIN23 (13:17) (Shotgun) B.Favre pass short right to V.Shiancoe to MIN 31 for 8 yards (J.Anderson).

2-12-MIN31 (12:41) (Shotgun) B.Favre pass incomplete deep left to B.Berrian.

3-12-MIN31 (12:36) (Shotgun) B.Favre pass incomplete deep middle to V.Shiancoe [E.Brown].

4-12-MIN31 (12:26) C.Kluwe punts 36 yards to CAR 33, Center-C.Loeffler, downed by MIN-C.Loeffler.

PENALTY on CAR-J.Senn, Offensive Holding, 10 yards, enforced at CAR 33.

1-10-MIN20 (9:18) (Shotgun) B.Favre pass short left to P.Harvin to MIN 30 for 10 yards (C.Munnerlyn; R.Marshall).

1-10-MIN30 (8:50) (No Huddle, Shotgun) B.Favre pass to A.Peterson to MIN 35 for 5 yards (J.Beason).

2-5-MIN35 (8:28) (No Huddle, Shotgun) B.Favre pass incomplete short middle to P.Harvin [J.Peppers].

3-5-MIN35 (8:24) (Shotgun) B.Favre pass incomplete short right to P.Harvin.

4-5-MIN35 (8:17) C.Kluwe punts 46 yards to CAR 19, Center-C.Loeffler. C.Munnerlyn to CAR 20 for 1 yard (E.Frampton).

1-10-MIN21 (3:02) (Shotgun) B.Favre pass short left to A.Peterson to CAR 16 for 63 yards (C.Munnerlyn).

1-10-CAR16 (2:35) (No Huddle, Shotgun) B.Favre pass deep left intended for B.Berrian INTERCEPTED by C.Harris at CAR -3. Touchback.

Final = 7-26

Everything NOT underlined is a Favre pass.

I don't believe Childress called this game plan.

 

[Mr. Yuk]

What about the ones you underlined that are Favre passes?

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

What about the ones you underlined that are Favre passes?

I knew I had stated this poorly.1. Favre almost solely passed. How often does Childress do that?2. Favre had 2 passes to Taylor; 4 to Peterson. I underlined the two completions to Peterson to show often he actually got touches, treating those as runs. Peterson got 4 (run), 2 (run), 1 (run), 5 (pass) and 63 (nearly a 78 yard score) (pass) yards.What I'm asking is this a game that Childress would call?:4 pass targets to ADP, 2 to Taylor?And all but three times, nothing but passes altogether?Until the final drive, I see 11 1st downs, but only 3 runs and 4 touches by Peterson?

 

[bonesman]

So... you're a butthurt ADP owner... right?

 

[Mr. Yuk]

I'm more shuked by how bad our run blocking has been this year. When we can't run worth crap I can see why they abandon it quickly. This zone blocking crap Chilly put in is a terrible fit for the players on our O-line. And I think Sullivan may be the worst run blocking center in the league. Never seen any push there all season. Wish Birk would have stayed, he's 1/2 of what he used to be but he would have helped I think. O-lines take a lot of time to gel.

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

So... you're a butthurt ADP owner... right?

I am, sir.Won my game, and to me Peterson did quite well so I have no complaints.This interests me more as a season ticket holding New Orleans Saints fan above all else.Edit: I'm also looking at the discussions about the Favre/Childress dispute and whether it was over Favre changing plays. To me this shows he was. As a Saints fan, if that's the case, I couldn't be happier.

 

[huskerd911]

I'm more shuked by how bad our run blocking has been this year. When we can't run worth crap I can see why they abandon it quickly. This zone blocking crap Chilly put in is a terrible fit for the players on our O-line. And I think Sullivan may be the worst run blocking center in the league. Never seen any push there all season. Wish Birk would have stayed, he's 1/2 of what he used to be but he would have helped I think. O-lines take a lot of time to gel.

As a Viking fan, I'm convinced the OLine can't block for neither the run nor the pass.

 

[PhilLynott]

How did Carolina beat Minnesota? At the risk of being Cpt Obvious, I would think that Carolina scored more points. Minnesota is a solid team. Too bad they haven't had a head coach since Bud Grant left. Maybe he couldn't win "The Big One", but at least he got them there.

 

[Mr. Yuk]

I'm more shuked by how bad our run blocking has been this year. When we can't run worth crap I can see why they abandon it quickly. This zone blocking crap Chilly put in is a terrible fit for the players on our O-line. And I think Sullivan may be the worst run blocking center in the league. Never seen any push there all season. Wish Birk would have stayed, he's 1/2 of what he used to be but he would have helped I think. O-lines take a lot of time to gel.

As a Viking fan, I'm convinced the OLine can't block for neither the run nor the pass.

They have had a few good stretches pass blocking. Last night was not one of them obviously

 

[Mr. Yuk]

[dennygreen]I would think that Carolina scored more points. [/dennygreen]

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

How did Carolina beat Minnesota? At the risk of being Cpt Obvious, I would think that Carolina scored more points. Minnesota is a solid team. Too bad they haven't had a head coach since Bud Grant left. Maybe he couldn't win "The Big One", but at least he got them there.

Grant was a great coach, not sure how many games he went 90% pass in the 2nd half or let his QB ignore the gameplan but I bet it didn't happen too, too often in all those years.They are a solid team. They are one of the few teams capable of real balance.Which is why it would have made no sense for Childress (or his OC) to make all these calls. I bet he didn't. I realize some QB's get a lot of lattitude, but probably not to this extent.I can remember games where Sean Payton came out and did just this kind of playcalling and got raked for it. But he hasn't done it once in 2009, not once.I'm just wondering if Childress has the kind of rep for going this pass heavy because I'm guessing he doesn't.

 

[Green and Gold]

14 rush attempts, 41 yards for a sub-3 yards per carry, not exactly inspired there either. Favre actually only attempted 27 passes and completed 63% of them, with a pick. Not great, but not exactly Delhomme either.

The offense was getting destroyed in both the run and pass game. Blame it on the 27 td, 7 int, 3500+ yard guy if you want, I guess. More the power to you.

 

[PhilLynott]

How did Carolina beat Minnesota? At the risk of being Cpt Obvious, I would think that Carolina scored more points. Minnesota is a solid team. Too bad they haven't had a head coach since Bud Grant left. Maybe he couldn't win "The Big One", but at least he got them there.

They are a solid team. They are one of the few teams capable of real balance.Which is why it would have made no sense for Childress (or his OC) to make all these calls. I bet he didn't. I realize some QB's get a lot of lattitude, but probably not to this extent.I can remember games where Sean Payton came out and did just this kind of playcalling and got raked for it. But he hasn't done it once in 2009, not once.I'm just wondering if Childress has the kind of rep for going this pass heavy because I'm guessing he doesn't.

I really can't debate the playcalling but you help to make my point. "Grant was a great coach, not sure how many games he went 90% pass in the 2nd half or let his QB ignore the gameplan but I bet it didn't happen too, too often in all those years." As great as Tarkenton was, I do not think that Grant would let him ignore the gameplan. Favre didn't listen to Ray Rhodes, he didn't listen to Mike Sherman. If Brad Childress is upset that Favre doesn't respect him, he needs to look in the mirror. He did EVERYTHING that Favre wanted. He kissed his tail, he told him that he was the guy, Childress fed his ego just like Favre wanted. Now it's crunch time and Childress can't figure out why he has to ask Brett, "Pretty please, will you run the play I called?"

 

[Mr. Yuk]

Childress is from the Andy Reid coaching tree. He probably prefers to pass all else being equal.

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

Childress is from the Andy Reid coaching tree. He probably prefers to pass all else being equal.

Thank you, really that was what I was wondering, whether this 2nd half pass/run balance was out of character for Childress.Maybe not.

 

[benm3218]

Steve Smith beat the Vikings.

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

Steve Smith beat the Vikings.

Well, here's another point about the play calling:Incomplete Passes leads to clock stoppages. Here are the length of the Vikes' 2nd half drives:1.012.282.270.57{TD by CAR; CAR takes lead}2.26{TD by CAR; CAR takes 2 TD lead}1.10{TD by CAR; CAR takes 3 TD lead}Take away the run, no one respects the pass. But it also means increasing the opponents' chances of scoring and adds to the time in which they can do so. If you're completing passes, little problem; if not, this happens.The Vikes had the lead for FOUR possessions in the 3rd quarter, leading to 4 chances for the Panthers to get their act together.I had thought this was out of character for Childress, but maybe not. Either way it's bad play calling.

 

[Carter_Can_Fly]

Peppers was so good in this game. When Peppers plays like that Carolina is going to be tough to beat. He had Mckinnie benched and was in Favre's face all night. Watch the game again and see how distruptive he was and how Favre could rarely get comfortable in the pocket due to it.

 

[Donnybrook]

Steve Smith beat the Vikings.

I love Winfield but last night he played the worst game of his career. Smith owned him.

 

[MIMN]

What about the ones you underlined that are Favre passes?

Punts qualify as Favre passes too, I guess.

 

[North]

How did Carolina win? The worst coach in the NFL was calling offensive plays for the other team, that's how!

When you come out of the half with the lead, how does your pro bowl RB only get 3 carries in the 2nd half! Against the 26th ranked run D for that matter!

Didn't Chilly know that Carolina was #5 in the NFL against the pass? Seems like when your game planning for this game you would focus on running the ball?

Look, this isn't a surprise to me and it won't be a surprise when they (Minn) loses in the playoffs. I've been saying for years that Childress is a HORRIBLE coach. He gets average production from above average talent. The ownership will regret the day they gave him an extension, based solely on Favres hot start. Guess what, it's December and Favre is colling down. PLUS Favre won't be here next year, what do you think their record will be next year with T. Jax at QB?

 

[FDC]

What I'm asking is this a game that Childress would call?:

No he would not.In fact, ESPN even reported that Childress also tried to pull Favre back in September against Green Bay. Favre audibled out of a run and into a pass. That pass ended up being a 17 yard TOUCHDOWN PASS! ---> And Childress still talked about pulling him even with success .This makes it fairly obvious to me that Favre seems to be calling/audibling more passes than Childress approves of. This was a run first team before Favre, and still should be now. Let us remember that Carolina did not lead until the 4th quarter. That means that Vikings had the lead, had Adrian Peterson, had one of the best defenses in football, and threw it 14 times with 2 Adrian Peterson runs. That is inexplicable, no matter how bad the running game might be that day. If Adrian Peterson had negative running yards, you still give him the ball in that situation.

 

[sho nuff]

I'm more shuked by how bad our run blocking has been this year. When we can't run worth crap I can see why they abandon it quickly. This zone blocking crap Chilly put in is a terrible fit for the players on our O-line. And I think Sullivan may be the worst run blocking center in the league. Never seen any push there all season. Wish Birk would have stayed, he's 1/2 of what he used to be but he would have helped I think. O-lines take a lot of time to gel.

As a Viking fan, I'm convinced the OLine can't block for neither the run nor the pass.

And as I said about McKinney getting benched...3 of these guys lead the NFC in votes for the pro bowl...just another sign that fans should not be voting on such things.

 

[Man in the yellow hat]

How did Carolina win? The worst coach in the NFL was calling offensive plays for the other team, that's how!When you come out of the half with the lead, how does your pro bowl RB only get 3 carries in the 2nd half! Against the 26th ranked run D for that matter!Didn't Chilly know that Carolina was #5 in the NFL against the pass? Seems like when your game planning for this game you would focus on running the ball?Look, this isn't a surprise to me and it won't be a surprise when they (Minn) loses in the playoffs. I've been saying for years that Childress is a HORRIBLE coach. He gets average production from above average talent. The ownership will regret the day they gave him an extension, based solely on Favres hot start. Guess what, it's December and Favre is colling down. PLUS Favre won't be here next year, what do you think their record will be next year with T. Jax at QB?

I think it's becoming clear that this was not how Childress called the game. I think the guy is an average coach at best. But I've watched Favre try to steamroll coaching staffs before. He did it with Mike Sherman on a consistent basis, and that was a major reason his play slipped a few years back. But, Childress brought this on himself.That said, the season is far from over. And they still have the best back in the league and a solid defense. I think the rumors of the Vikes demise are a little over stated.

 

[sho nuff]

What I'm asking is this a game that Childress would call?:

No he would not.In fact, ESPN even reported that Childress also tried to pull Favre back in September against Green Bay. Favre audibled out of a run and into a pass. That pass ended up being a 17 yard TOUCHDOWN PASS! ---> And Childress still talked about pulling him even with success .This makes it fairly obvious to me that Favre seems to be calling/audibling more passes than Childress approves of. This was a run first team before Favre, and still should be now. Let us remember that Carolina did not lead until the 4th quarter. That means that Vikings had the lead, had Adrian Peterson, had one of the best defenses in football, and threw it 14 times with 2 Adrian Peterson runs. That is inexplicable, no matter how bad the running game might be that day. If Adrian Peterson had negative running yards, you still give him the ball in that situation.

Incorrect...the audible in that game was to a deep ball when the Vikings had a 10 point lead...and the Packers were either out of timeouts or only had one left.It gave the Packers a chance at a late comeback...at least that is the play I read that almost got Favre benched.

 

[sho nuff]

How did Carolina win? The worst coach in the NFL was calling offensive plays for the other team, that's how!When you come out of the half with the lead, how does your pro bowl RB only get 3 carries in the 2nd half! Against the 26th ranked run D for that matter!Didn't Chilly know that Carolina was #5 in the NFL against the pass? Seems like when your game planning for this game you would focus on running the ball?Look, this isn't a surprise to me and it won't be a surprise when they (Minn) loses in the playoffs. I've been saying for years that Childress is a HORRIBLE coach. He gets average production from above average talent. The ownership will regret the day they gave him an extension, based solely on Favres hot start. Guess what, it's December and Favre is colling down. PLUS Favre won't be here next year, what do you think their record will be next year with T. Jax at QB?

I think it's becoming clear that this was not how Childress called the game. I think the guy is an average coach at best. But I've watched Favre try to steamroll coaching staffs before. He did it with Mike Sherman on a consistent basis, and that was a major reason his play slipped a few years back. But, Childress brought this on himself.That said, the season is far from over. And they still have the best back in the league and a solid defense. I think the rumors of the Vikes demise are a little over stated.

Agreed...too much talent still there for them to just be done.But Childress has got to get control.

 

[Big Petey]

14 rush attempts, 41 yards for a sub-3 yards per carry, not exactly inspired there either. Favre actually only attempted 27 passes and completed 63% of them, with a pick. Not great, but not exactly Delhomme either.The offense was getting destroyed in both the run and pass game. Blame it on the 27 td, 7 int, 3500+ yard guy if you want, I guess. More the power to you.

In that 2nd half, there were 25 pass plays called. Plays where there were penalties or sacks do NOT count as pass attempts.So, the pass/run ratio (as far as play-calling goes) is higher than the actual pass attempt number.