if you were going to buy a new gun, what would you get? (1 Viewer)

[Borden]

a 7mm Savage customized for F-Class that was for sale for 4 years but no one respected the smith work, a Savage 110BA in .338lm for anti-aircraft purposes.  

Are you still long range shooting? 

Also, it seems you are missing the 50 in that collection. 

 

[Mad Cow]

If I move to Nevada... 

I currently have 2 old collectible O/U shotties, a Mossy 930 12g w/3 barrels and two stocks, 2 old collectible 1911s and nice newer one, a Colt Detective 38 special acquired via trade, a basic Ruger 10/22 also a trade, a 7mm Savage customized for F-Class that was for sale for 4 years but no one respected the smith work, a Savage 110BA in .338lm for anti-aircraft purposes.  Handed a few down to nephews in better states, sold the rest, still have too many.

This is the one that tells me, yeah, he has a crap load of guns.

 

[KCitons]

Though with Otis money I'd go higher end with an EOTech optic.... but yah, AR pistols are great.    Downside is over-penetration in a home environment... but will be much more accurate/maneuverable than a 12ga. Pistol is nice for convenience... the best gun is the one within your reach when you need it.  But I agree stopping power and range are compromises. 

I went with the 18.5" barrel and the shorter (kids) stock on my mossberg. Its very compact. 

 

[Chaos Commish]

Are you still long range shooting? 

Also, it seems you are missing the 50 in that collection. 

Nah, well a little. But my ears have been ringing for over two years - tinnitus, no cure - so not into things that make it worse. I will probably get some pig tags for Tejon Ranch and use the 7mm this winter... maybe. And Cali banned the 50 cal, of course. Even if I could, not sure I would, but a Barrett is an awful sexy dragonslayer.

 

[Chaos Commish]

This is the one that tells me, yeah, he has a crap load of guns.

Hah. By the count above you've passed me by a few!

 

[bigbottom]

A buddy of mine gave me some great advice a while back. If you are buying a gun for home protection, in most situations you shouldn't ever need to shoot at an intruder. The idea of sneaking up on the intruder and putting a bullet in him is an approach fraught with danger, particularly if you are a novice gun owner with adrenaline coursing through your body. Instead, just fire a couple shots into the baseboard of whatever room you're in. 95% of intruders will hightail it out of there as soon as they hear the gunfire. You don't have to engage the intruder and get yourself shot, and you eliminate the risk of shooting someone you thought was an intruder, but turns out to be your teenage kid sneaking in after curfew. 

 

[Chaos Commish]

A buddy of mine gave me some great advice a while back. If you are buying a gun for home protection, in most situations you shouldn't ever need to shoot at the intruder. The idea of sneaking up on the intruding and putting a bullet in him is an approach fraught with danger, particularly if you are a novice gun owner with adrenaline coursing through your body. Instead, just fire a couple shots into the baseboard of whatever room you're in. 95% of intruders will hightail it out of there as soon as they hear the gunfire. You don't have to engage the intruder and get yourself shot, and you eliminate the risk of shooting someone you thought was an intruder, but turns out to be your teenage kid sneaking in after curfew. 

I have many beliefs contrary to opinions in this thread, have shared them before and no one listens, but with with above, I couldn't agree more. I'm not so sure about the baseboard. Maybe a mattress or a book. I have shot into a fireplace with stupid results, so no need to test that idea. Way better to scare someone than kill him.

 

[Mad Cow]

Hah. By the count above you've passed me by a few!

I don't have an anti-aircraft gun,  so you best me handily. 

 

[Chaos Commish]

I don't have an anti-aircraft gun,  so you best me handily. 

I prefer to think of it as different preparations. If zombies, you. If aliens, me.

 

[Mad Cow]

I prefer to think of it as different preparations. If zombies, you. If aliens, me.

 If those zombies ever come in flying,  we will combine our collections and form a mighty Voltron to fight them off.

 

[[icon]]

I went with the 18.5" barrel and the shorter (kids) stock on my mossberg. Its very compact. 

I have an 870 with 18.5" I keep by the bed. It's pretty short. 

I have a zastava M92. It's about half the length.  

Not saying I don't love my shotty... but an "assault" pistol is going to be super compact and ideal for CQB

 

[Otis]

A buddy of mine gave me some great advice a while back. If you are buying a gun for home protection, in most situations you shouldn't ever need to shoot at an intruder. The idea of sneaking up on the intruder and putting a bullet in him is an approach fraught with danger, particularly if you are a novice gun owner with adrenaline coursing through your body. Instead, just fire a couple shots into the baseboard of whatever room you're in. 95% of intruders will hightail it out of there as soon as they hear the gunfire. You don't have to engage the intruder and get yourself shot, and you eliminate the risk of shooting someone you thought was an intruder, but turns out to be your teenage kid sneaking in after curfew. 

This is genius. 

 

[Otis]

A buddy of mine gave me some great advice a while back. If you are buying a gun for home protection, in most situations you shouldn't ever need to shoot at an intruder. The idea of sneaking up on the intruder and putting a bullet in him is an approach fraught with danger, particularly if you are a novice gun owner with adrenaline coursing through your body. Instead, just fire a couple shots into the baseboard of whatever room you're in. 95% of intruders will hightail it out of there as soon as they hear the gunfire. You don't have to engage the intruder and get yourself shot, and you eliminate the risk of shooting someone you thought was an intruder, but turns out to be your teenage kid sneaking in after curfew. 

GB BB, do you have a gun?  You're usually my bellwether of reason. 

 

[bigbottom]

GB BB, do you have a gun?  You're usually my bellwether of reason. 

Funny story. During Hurricane Harvey there were stories going around about looters on the other side of my town. Not sure whether or not it was truth or hysteria, but I suddenly felt very vulnerable given that if I saw someone on my street and called 911 there was a 0% chance that a cop would show up due to everything else that was going on in the city. I don't have a gun so I brought up to my wife that I might call a neighbor and borrow one of his.  My wife's response?  "We have a gun. Several in fact."  Turns out, when her father passed she had kept several of his handguns. No ammo though. So, yes, I have a Smith and Wesson 9mm and a couple others (haven't inspected them but they are revolvers).  I plan to take a class, spend a little time at the range, and use the 9mm for home protection.  But I will employ my buddy's advice above if there is ever an intruder situation. 

 

[Otis]

Funny story. During Hurricane Harvey there were stories going around about looters on the other side of my town. Not sure whether or not it was truth or hysteria, but I suddenly felt very vulnerable given that if I saw someone on my street and called 911 there was a 0% chance that a cop would show up due to everything else that was going on in the city. I don't have a gun so I brought up to my wife that I might call a neighbor and borrow one of his.  My wife's response?  "We have a gun. Several in fact."  Turns out, when her father passed she had kept several of his handguns. No ammo though. So, yes, I have a Smith and Wesson 9mm and a couple others (haven't inspected them but they are revolvers).  I plan to take a class, spend a little time at the range, and use the 9mm for home protection.  But I will employ my buddy's advice above if there is ever an intruder situation. 

I'm kind of where you are. Which means to say I'm warming to the notion that I'd rather have a fun and hope to never have reason to need it, than one day have reason to need it but have nothing but a baseball bat to defend my family. 

But I like your advise, and my first plan would be to rack that sucker and blow a hole in the baseboard than actually shoot someone to kill. Of course if my family is in danger, ninjas be losing heads. 

 

[Otis]

By the way when all you gun nerds talk about 9mm, it always sounds to me like you're just discussing your really smaller peeners. 

 

[Borden]

By the way when all you gun nerds talk about 9mm, it always sounds to me like you're just discussing your really smaller peeners. 

Sooo, you posted a question in a thread about guns then decided to think about guns being our penises? You're a weird guy Ace.

 

[beer 30]

.

 

[Chaos Commish]

Sooo, you posted a question in a thread about guns then decided to think about guns being our penises? You're a weird guy Ace.

Ole Otis is what he is and doesn't bother me. Imagine knowing as little as he does (not an insult, gb). Imagine having  his anti-gun opinions while wanting a gun and hating the tragic aspects of American gun ownership, primarily the yeehaws. Then read what I wrote - which surely is what made him take a shot at my nerd penis:

The .300 BLK is subsonic for cqb so penetration not so bad, but still needs suppression indoors. So I think I'd prefer more capacity in 9mm just to chase off the maximum number of zombies without reloading while having readily available ammo. Didn't you have a 9mm snubby?

blk, subsonic, cqb, penetration, suppression, capacity, zombies, snubby... He has a point.  

I'd rather someone torn like Otis own firearms than many of the "enthusiasts" out there.

 

[Chaos Commish]

Also I'm surprised those of you with training didn't or haven't engaged the warning shot topic.  Big Bottom, Otis and I lose that one every time. That's why I pointed out my opinion is contrary. It's a pretty good conversation. Educational on the law at least. So for the record - BB and Oat - you attorneys - read up a little on warning shots before being certain of the idea. You are sacrificing some important legal ground by introducing the firearm to the situation. If you're shot, the shooter was clearly acting in self defense. Anyway... had the conversation developed I would include the necessity to always shout verbal warnings before sending the warning. "Get out of my house, I am armed, I've called the police..." And the baseboard is probably a bad idea - ricochet surface angle and all. 

 

[Borden]

Ole Otis is what he is and doesn't bother me. Imagine knowing as little as he does (not an insult, gb). Imagine having  his anti-gun opinions while wanting a gun and hating the tragic aspects of American gun ownership, primarily the yeehaws. Then read what I wrote - which surely is what made him take a shot at my nerd penis:

blk, subsonic, cqb, penetration, suppression, capacity, zombies, snubby... He has a point.  

I'd rather someone torn like Otis own firearms than many of the "enthusiasts" out there.

I wasn't trying implying that Otis shouldn't have a gun or would be irresponsible or anything with that post. Nor did I think the "small peeners" comment was an attack on anyone. Saying "peeners" out loud is funny. Hopefully my reply came off as light hearted. I was hoping the Ace Ventura reference was signaling a joking response.

Let's just hope that the future FFA owner doesn't read a construction thread where they talk about hammers, studs, nuts, pipes, cracks, gaps and so on. 

 

[Chaos Commish]

I wasn't trying implying that Otis shouldn't have a gun or would be irresponsible or anything with that post. Nor did I think the "small peeners" comment was an attack on anyone. Saying "peeners" out loud is funny. Hopefully my reply came off as light hearted. I was hoping the Ace Ventura reference was signaling a joking response.

Let's just hope that the future FFA owner doesn't read a construction thread where they talk about hammers, studs, nuts, pipes, cracks, gaps and so on. 

It was an attack on me! Also the reference made me laugh.

I took my 38 Special and 10/22 out this morning for the first time. This thread has me messing with guns again. I hated both. The Ruger's accuracy is a joke. Came home and verified that with some reading. I thought it could be the ammo, but it isn't. It's a respected little rifle but not with those who need accuracy. Two cheaper ones shoot much better. It came in trade with almost 1000 rounds. I consigned it. Keep the ammo lose the gun. I'm in the market for a 22lr, but going to take my time. Open to suggestions. The 38 is a Detective Special. I felt hosed in the trade because I was thinking 38 Special (cheapo like the 22), but the shop owner insisted I was getting good deal. It shoots like garbage, kicks like a 45 and is just plain uncomfortable. I consigned it and donated 35 remaining rounds. BUT the derned thing is worth a grand. Who knew? At least I don't feel hosed anymore. 2 down, 8 to go.

 

[Harry Manback]

It was an attack on me! Also the reference made me laugh.

I took my 38 Special and 10/22 out this morning for the first time. This thread has me messing with guns again. I hated both. The Ruger's accuracy is a joke. Came home and verified that with some reading. I thought it could be the ammo, but it isn't. It's a respected little rifle but not with those who need accuracy. Two cheaper ones shoot much better. It came in trade with almost 1000 rounds. I consigned it. Keep the ammo lose the gun. I'm in the market for a 22lr, but going to take my time. Open to suggestions. The 38 is a Detective Special. I felt hosed in the trade because I was thinking 38 Special (cheapo like the 22), but the shop owner insisted I was getting good deal. It shoots like garbage, kicks like a 45 and is just plain uncomfortable. I consigned it and donated 35 remaining rounds. BUT the derned thing is worth a grand. Who knew? At least I don't feel hosed anymore. 2 down, 8 to go.

I have a 10/22 ruger and find the accuracy to be outstanding.

How far was the target? I was pinging a small metal target from 100 ft with little problem, and I'm far from a sharpshooter.

 

[Chaos Commish]

I have a 10/22 ruger and find the accuracy to be outstanding.

How far was the target? I was pinging a small metal target from 100 ft with little problem, and I'm far from a sharpshooter.

I installed a rail and a $800 scope and tried to zero it at 50 yards from a bench. Moa of human being? Sure, but otherwise not so much. I've always heard good things about it. I had a Ruger ranch rifle I loved for years. The fit finish, quality or hardware, etc. is all better than budget 22s, but if you read about the accuracy you'll find plenty of shooters agreeing with me. The ranch rifles were very individual. Some great, some awful. Maybe the 10/22 is the same?

 

[TheFanatic]

I will leave the 12ga reccomendations to those more versed in 12ga weaponry than I... but I'll go ahead and throw down a highly divisive statement on top of all this: Buy a glock 26 or 19 (depending on if you want to carry or safe-keep) and get some Barnes or Hornady Critical Defense ammo. 

Holy wars have been fought pro/against the Glock platform I just suggested. But if I was ever to tell a friend to buy one pistol that I knew would do what it should do.... with minimal risk of complications: G26 or G19 are simply the best weapons in my personal opinion for what they are designed to do. 

Buy 500 rounds of ammo for the pistol and shotgun. 

Go to a range and shoot them all (over several sessions). 

Then buy 500 more rounds.

Put 100 rounds downrange per month, and replace them. Consider that the bare minimum. 

Not kidding. Learn to shoot. Practice shooting. Practice shooting again. 

And PLEASE Keep your #### locked up safe. 

This, so much this.

If you are going to buy a gun and not take a class and practice with it, you're better off not having the gun at all. In fact you are far safer with out it. Practice. 

As for a recommendation on what to keep for home defense, I would go with a short barrel shotgun. The end of that shotgun is not much farther than the end of a pistol that you have extended to the length of your arms. And why the shotgun? Because a shotgun with pellets is far more forgiving in terms of aim than a pistol. If indeed you are pointing a deadly weapon at someone you are in fear for your life and your body is going to excrete so many chemicals into your body that you are going to be on the highest high of your life. Your hands are going to be shaking and you are going to have a very strong urge to run like hell or fight like hell. Basically, you ain't hitting #### in that situation. 

As far as preparing for the Zombies, get an Ruger 10/22 Take Down. The rifle literally breaks in half and goes into this sweet backpack that can hold 6 30 round mags I believe. Keep a nice optic in the bag. That gun could be used to hunt just about anything with a good enough optic and aim. It's light. The rounds are easily found. The ammo is light. 

If you are going to go with a pistol, I second the Glock 19. It's next on my list to buy.

As far as carbines, the Beretta is nice, but go with ugly, cheap and hella reliable. I bought a Hi-Point 9mm carbine and slapped on a nice little optic and five 20 round mags all for about $510. Shoots like a dream but ugly as sin. Very accurate as well. 

 

[opensourcebeer]

Also I'm surprised those of you with training didn't or haven't engaged the warning shot topic.  Big Bottom, Otis and I lose that one every time. That's why I pointed out my opinion is contrary. It's a pretty good conversation. Educational on the law at least. So for the record - BB and Oat - you attorneys - read up a little on warning shots before being certain of the idea. You are sacrificing some important legal ground by introducing the firearm to the situation. If you're shot, the shooter was clearly acting in self defense. Anyway... had the conversation developed I would include the necessity to always shout verbal warnings before sending the warning. "Get out of my house, I am armed, I've called the police..." And the baseboard is probably a bad idea - ricochet surface angle and all. 

How about this: when looking for someone to give you firearms self defense training, tell them your warning shot idea.  If they think that's a good idea, keep looking for a firearms self defense trainer. 

 

[Borden]

@Chaos Commish Have you tried the CCI Quiet 22 ammo? Seems with your ears if might be a helpful option. I haven't used it so I don't know how well it shoots.

 

[Chaos Commish]

High Road forum discussion on semi auto 22lr accuracy. 

 

[Chaos Commish]

@Chaos Commish Have you tried the CCI Quiet 22 ammo? Seems with your ears if might be a helpful option. I haven't used it so I don't know how well it shoots.

Years ago I tried something similar. I remember thinking it was silly how quiet it was. Ear protection > caliber choice. 

 

[Chaos Commish]

How about this: when looking for someone to give you firearms training, tell them your warning shot idea.  If they think that's a good idea, keep looking for a firearms trainer. 

You won't find that person. 

 

[Harry Manback]

I installed a rail and a $800 scope and tried to zero it at 50 yards from a bench. Moa of human being? Sure, but otherwise not so much. I've always heard good things about it. I had a Ruger ranch rifle I loved for years. The fit finish, quality or hardware, etc. is all better than budget 22s, but if you read about the accuracy you'll find plenty of shooters agreeing with me. The ranch rifles were very individual. Some great, some awful. Maybe the 10/22 is the same?

It's probably more likely your version of accurate is more strict than mine, and you are correct.

 

[Chaos Commish]

It's probably more likely your version of accurate is more strict than mine, and you are correct.

Agreed. It came in trade for a 6mm benchrest rifle.

 

[opensourcebeer]

You won't find that person. 

Disagree.  I can refer you to a good instructor/trainer in the midwest if needed.

 

[Chaos Commish]

Disagree.  I can refer you to a good instructor/trainer in the midwest if needed.

That is surprising. I like the conversation and likely agree with him, but very few do. The two instructors in my little town and the local LE weapons instructor all hate the idea, as do the Front Sight folks and on and on.

 

[opensourcebeer]

That is surprising. I like the conversation and likely agree with him, but very few do. The two instructors in my little town and the local LE weapons instructor all hate the idea, as do the Front Sight folks and on and on.

I think I'm being unclear.   Sorry about that.

Warning shots are a terrible idea and the firearms self defense instructors I've trained with would agree that warning shots are a terrible idea.

 

[Chaos Commish]

I think I'm being unclear.   Sorry about that.

Warning shots are a terrible idea and the firearms self defense instructors I've trained with would agree that warning shots are a terrible idea.

Yeah, I thought you were referring me to a "good" trainer who recommended warning shots. There are none.

 

[bigbottom]

How about this: when looking for someone to give you firearms self defense training, tell them your warning shot idea.  If they think that's a good idea, keep looking for a firearms self defense trainer. 

Can you elaborate?  I'm not talking about firing a warning shot when you are engaged with an armed intruder. I'm talking about firing a shot in another room when there is an intruder trying to break into your house through your front door.  Do you think the intruder is more likely to take off when there is gunfire, or to continue to break through your front door, search your house to find you, and then kill you?  

 

[bigbottom]

Also I'm surprised those of you with training didn't or haven't engaged the warning shot topic.  Big Bottom, Otis and I lose that one every time. That's why I pointed out my opinion is contrary. It's a pretty good conversation. Educational on the law at least. So for the record - BB and Oat - you attorneys - read up a little on warning shots before being certain of the idea. You are sacrificing some important legal ground by introducing the firearm to the situation. If you're shot, the shooter was clearly acting in self defense. Anyway... had the conversation developed I would include the necessity to always shout verbal warnings before sending the warning. "Get out of my house, I am armed, I've called the police..." And the baseboard is probably a bad idea - ricochet surface angle and all. 

Yeah, perhaps the mattress is better. But those are expensive. 

As for the self-defense angle, I'm not sure that comes into play if he doesn't see me or know where I am. I wouldn't think that just hearing a gunshot would provide a defense for you to search the house you are robbing so that you can find and then kill the occupant. 

But I'm open to being convinced otherwise. For the record, I live in Texas and this is not a place where criminals have a whole lot of rights when they break into your home. 

 

[Chaos Commish]

Yeah, perhaps the mattress is better. But those are expensive. 

As for the self-defense angle, I'm not sure that comes into play if he doesn't see me or know where I am. I wouldn't think that just hearing a gunshot would provide a defense for you to search the house you are robbing so that you can find and then kill the occupant. 

But I'm open to being convinced otherwise. For the record, I live in Texas and this is not a place where criminals have a whole lot of rights when they break into your home. 

Some reading:

http://dailycaller.com/2016/08/27/ccw-weekend-why-you-should-never-fire-warning-shots/

http://www.secondcalldefense.org/brandishing-and-warning-shots

I'm interested to see resident lawyers consider this stuff.

 

[Chaos Commish]

Covers the same ground but starts leaning a little.

 

[Chaos Commish]

Covers a few different states addressing warning shots and still a bad idea

 

[bigbottom]

Skimmed two of the articles. I'll give them a closer read but I'm not yet convinced on the legal aspect in the jurisdiction in which I live and in the circumstances to which I'm referring. No property owner is getting charged for discharging a firearm in his own home to scare off an intruder in the county where I live. Of that I am sure. 

 

[bigbottom]

Moreover, the entire point of firing the gun in the situation to which I'm referring is to altogether avoid a confrontation with the intruder. 

 

[Chaos Commish]

Skimmed two of the articles. I'll give them a closer read but I'm not yet convinced on the legal aspect in the jurisdiction in which I live and in the circumstances to which I'm referring. No property owner is getting charged for discharging a firearm in his own home to scare off an intruder in the county where I live. Of that I am sure. 

This one's specific to home defense while the others are mostly about confrontation in general. It provides examples of various approaches and they worked out in real life.

Short video commentary specific to Texas. You might be surprised at how the law reads.

 

[Otis]

Moreover, the entire point of firing the gun in the situation to which I'm referring is to altogether avoid a confrontation with the intruder. 

You don't sound so tough. Wuss!

 

[Otis]

I want to buy an 8mm so I can claim to have the smallest peener. 

 

[bigbottom]

This one's specific to home defense while the others are mostly about confrontation in general. It provides examples of various approaches and they worked out in real life.

Short video commentary specific to Texas. You might be surprised at how the law reads.

You're talking Texas law, while I'm talking about getting indicted in my rural county. Ain't gonna happen. 

 

[Chaos Commish]

You're talking Texas law, while I'm talking about getting indicted in my rural county. Ain't gonna happen. 

Right. I am trying to frame the topic and provide information why there are NO firearms instructors in this country who will approve of warning shots. Just remember I came out contrary to that thinking knowing this debate was out there. 

 

[Chaos Commish]

You don't sound so tough. Wuss!

For years on these forums I've been pretty much the only gun nerd openly willing to abandon my house before killing a burgler. Justifiable homicide cases are gross. When my sick mom was here, I'd be forced to defend the property. But if I can flee, flee I will. 

 

[bigbottom]

Right. I am trying to frame the topic and provide information why there are NO firearms instructors in this country who will approve of warning shots. Just remember I came out contrary to that thinking knowing this debate was out there. 

Understood. And I appreciate your efforts. I'm open to hearing contrary arguments and will give these a read. I'm a novice with no training so it's not like I'm informed on the topic or anything.