Reality Football
Footballguy
What say you? This is a tough one. He, like Mussina and Smoltz, will have their supporters and detractors.
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Is Curt Schilling a HOFer? (1 Viewer)
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Darth Cheney
Footballguy
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Never a Cy Young winner...never an MVP. I'm sure Schill thinks they should change the name of the HOF to Curt Schillings House but the only way he gets in is if there are an overwhelming number of voters who feel strongly about a "bloody" sock.
Compare Stats
Kevin Brown (923)
Orel Hershiser (887)
David Cone (886)
Freddie Fitzsimmons (878)
Lew Burdette (877)
John Smoltz (875)
Charley Root (866)
Luis Tiant (861)
John Candelaria (854)
David Wells (852)
Never a Cy Young winner...never an MVP. I'm sure Schill thinks they should change the name of the HOF to Curt Schillings House but the only way he gets in is if there are an overwhelming number of voters who feel strongly about a "bloody" sock.
ThisGuy
Ignored by Nipsey
It's interesting. He has been a post-season force, but has he been healthy enough in the regular season to collect great #'s?
Mussina has the best #'s of the 3, especially when you consider he has played his entire career in the AL. Schilling has pitched well in both, and Smoltz has been an NL lifer.
Smoltz was the #3 on some great teams with 2 sure-fire HOFers in front of him. It will be interesting to see how the voters take his closing years into consideration. Smoltz still has a few years left in him.
Schilling has his Postseason achievements to bolster his case, and led the league in wins a few times, but never won a Cy Young award. I'm not sure he has the few years left in him to help cement his case.
Mussina has won 6 gold gloves and has 15 straight seasons with 11+ wins. He has never won 20 games, but has won at least 17 games 7 times (compared to Schilling (4) and Smoltz (2).) He might have the shortest career left of these 3 and that could hurt. 275 wins may have put him in.
All 3 are very good pitchers, but I don't know if they are HOF material.
Mussina has the best #'s of the 3, especially when you consider he has played his entire career in the AL. Schilling has pitched well in both, and Smoltz has been an NL lifer.
Smoltz was the #3 on some great teams with 2 sure-fire HOFers in front of him. It will be interesting to see how the voters take his closing years into consideration. Smoltz still has a few years left in him.
Schilling has his Postseason achievements to bolster his case, and led the league in wins a few times, but never won a Cy Young award. I'm not sure he has the few years left in him to help cement his case.
Mussina has won 6 gold gloves and has 15 straight seasons with 11+ wins. He has never won 20 games, but has won at least 17 games 7 times (compared to Schilling (4) and Smoltz (2).) He might have the shortest career left of these 3 and that could hurt. 275 wins may have put him in.
All 3 are very good pitchers, but I don't know if they are HOF material.
Domination
Footballguy
I think he needs 15 wins this year and solid years (about 15 wins) the next 2 years to get in. That being said, I think that the Wins stat is overrated for pitchers. The pitchers that he is being compared to in Mussina adn Smoltz have played for championship team during most of their career. Schilling was stuck on the Phillies to begin his career and suffered because of it. IMO Mussina isn't even in consideration for the HOF and Smoltz also needs another good year or two.
NY/NJMFDIVER
Footballguy
Smoltz is a lock. He might have been the number 3 on paper, but on all those Brave teams, he was horse in post-season, and the only one who really came up big with any consistency.
David Yudkin
Footballguy
HOF Monitor: Pitching - 167.0 (36) (Likely HOFer > 100)
And that's not counting this year and his score should climb a bit higher if he stays healthy and the Red Sox do well in the post season. He could go up 5-10 points this year. In in my book.
By comparison, Smoltz has a 143.0 HOF Monitor score.
And that's not counting this year and his score should climb a bit higher if he stays healthy and the Red Sox do well in the post season. He could go up 5-10 points this year. In in my book.
By comparison, Smoltz has a 143.0 HOF Monitor score.
Sammy3469
Footballguy
I honestly don't see a way he doesn't get in. He'll finish his career with north of 230 wins and 3400 Ks. Coupled with his postseason exploits and I think he's pretty much a lock.
I also think Smoltz gets in fairly easily with his recent performance. If you prorate his bully work over those 4 years, you can make the case that he'd have 250-60 wins, plus he won a Cy Young and is 15-4 in the postseason.
Mussina has the worst case especially since it looks like he's declining the fastest, however, he's also the youngest, so he could concievably pull a Maddux and go to the NL and pitch 5 more years and get to 300 wins which would get him into the HOF especially since that scenario would have hime become eligible 3-4 years after all those guys, Clemens, Glavine, and Johnson. With no other viable SP candidates besides Pedro on the horizon (there's a huge gap there), I think he would eventually get in.
Put it this way 10 years from now a lot of these careers will look a lot better and HOF worthy in comparison to contemporaries.
I also think Smoltz gets in fairly easily with his recent performance. If you prorate his bully work over those 4 years, you can make the case that he'd have 250-60 wins, plus he won a Cy Young and is 15-4 in the postseason.
Mussina has the worst case especially since it looks like he's declining the fastest, however, he's also the youngest, so he could concievably pull a Maddux and go to the NL and pitch 5 more years and get to 300 wins which would get him into the HOF especially since that scenario would have hime become eligible 3-4 years after all those guys, Clemens, Glavine, and Johnson. With no other viable SP candidates besides Pedro on the horizon (there's a huge gap there), I think he would eventually get in.
Put it this way 10 years from now a lot of these careers will look a lot better and HOF worthy in comparison to contemporaries.
NY/NJMFDIVER
Footballguy
If Schilling goes in, David Cone and Jack Morris should both go in. Both very solid regular season performers, with exceptional post season moments. They all feel just short to me, but by comparison to guys like Tommy John, Kaat or Byleven, who get support, I'd rather see any one of these guys go in.
Mussina just feels short to me, but I think he's got great mechanics, and if you put him in the NL West right now, I think he'd pitch long enough to pick up 300 wins. I guess some consideration has to be given a pitching life in the always tough AL East, where teams won titles 7 of the 14 world series winners in his career came from.
Mussina just feels short to me, but I think he's got great mechanics, and if you put him in the NL West right now, I think he'd pitch long enough to pick up 300 wins. I guess some consideration has to be given a pitching life in the always tough AL East, where teams won titles 7 of the 14 world series winners in his career came from.
David Yudkin
Footballguy
HOF Monitor scores . . .Cone 103Morris 122.5John 111Kaat 129.5Blyleven 120.5Mussina 109
dparker713
Footballguy
Jack Morris should definitely be in the HOF.
I'd say Schill and Smoltz are close to locks, and getting closer every year.
Mussina will have a harder time. He's always been good-very good, but I don't think he's great. If he's able to pitch for several more years, he could compile the stats to get in, but I doubt it.
I'd say Schill and Smoltz are close to locks, and getting closer every year.
Mussina will have a harder time. He's always been good-very good, but I don't think he's great. If he's able to pitch for several more years, he could compile the stats to get in, but I doubt it.
Reality Football
Footballguy
The "300 win" plateau is fast becoming less relevant in terms of establishing HOF criteria. Jack Morris definitely belong in this same classification with Mussina, Smoltz and Schilling. Unless there is a weak crop one year, I think all these guys have a chance, but none will be first-ballot HOFs. Maybe Smoltz. His win/save totals make him an interesting case.
Doctor Detroit
Please remove your headgear
Jack Morris down?Also John Smoltz should not be in the category with Schilling and Mussina who are on the outside looking in. Smoltz is on the inside, waiving to them.
Sammy3469
Footballguy
I'm sorry, but there's no way Jack Morris should be in the same discussion with Schilling and Smoltz. Mussina I can see, but those other two were much more dominating at their heights than Morris ever was.
Morris is a guy that had a career ERA of 3.90 and a WHIP of 1.296. Schilling's career ERA is 3.44 and he has a WHIP of 1.136. His stretch from 2001-04 is much better than anything Morris ever did. Smoltz's Cy Young season trumps anything Morris ever did and he's been a much better pitcher since 1994 when he turned the corner.
I've really never understood the Morris love, but in my mind both Schilling and Smoltz are equal today (both at 40) than Morris ever was at his peak.
Morris is a guy that had a career ERA of 3.90 and a WHIP of 1.296. Schilling's career ERA is 3.44 and he has a WHIP of 1.136. His stretch from 2001-04 is much better than anything Morris ever did. Smoltz's Cy Young season trumps anything Morris ever did and he's been a much better pitcher since 1994 when he turned the corner.
I've really never understood the Morris love, but in my mind both Schilling and Smoltz are equal today (both at 40) than Morris ever was at his peak.
shadyridr
Footballguy
David Yudkin
Footballguy
Doctor Detroit
Please remove your headgear
Schilling and Smoltz are close in career stats in wins, ERA+, and WHIP but I think Smoltz over his career has been better and in this case it's enough to put him in the HOF and just get Schilling close. Schilling although dominate in 2001, 2002, 2004 and 1992 has been hurt alot and has never been consistent. He was also dominate in the playoffs in 2001 and 2004 and that will go a long way into him getting into the HOF and I think he'll be a borderline candidate like Jack Morris.
John Smoltz on the other hand has dominated not only as a starter in 1996 and 1998 but he also had one of the best seasons a closer has ever had in 2003 and two very good ones in 2002 (55 saves) and 2004. smoltz also has 15 playoff wins, four saves, and has to be considered the best playoff pitcher of his era. He has consistently been above average and has been extremely unique in his flexibility. He also might have a whole lot more wins if he had gotten the run support Maddux and Glavine got in Atlanta as his 89, 92, and 95 seasons could have been a whole lot better.
Mussina has just been very good in an era with quite a few great pitchers. He has also pitched for some really good teams yet still is just 7-8 in the postseason. He's going to need to win 300 games to get in the hall.
John Smoltz on the other hand has dominated not only as a starter in 1996 and 1998 but he also had one of the best seasons a closer has ever had in 2003 and two very good ones in 2002 (55 saves) and 2004. smoltz also has 15 playoff wins, four saves, and has to be considered the best playoff pitcher of his era. He has consistently been above average and has been extremely unique in his flexibility. He also might have a whole lot more wins if he had gotten the run support Maddux and Glavine got in Atlanta as his 89, 92, and 95 seasons could have been a whole lot better.
Mussina has just been very good in an era with quite a few great pitchers. He has also pitched for some really good teams yet still is just 7-8 in the postseason. He's going to need to win 300 games to get in the hall.
RedRaiders
Mr. +EV
Don't forget about his performance in 1993 either. NLCS MVP and a game 5 shutout of Toronto in the WS.
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David Yudkin
Footballguy
Schilling has put up better numbers than people give him credit for . . .
3 times 20+ wins
5 other times 15+ wins
10 years with WHIP of 1.1 or less (including 2 under 1.0)
1.13 career WHIP
6 All Star appearances
3 times 300+ strikeouts
9 times ERA+ score of 130 or more
3 time Cy Young runner up
8-2, 2.06 postseason with 0.92 WHIP and 8.6 K/9
NLCS and WS MVPs
1 Bloody Sock
3 times 20+ wins
5 other times 15+ wins
10 years with WHIP of 1.1 or less (including 2 under 1.0)
1.13 career WHIP
6 All Star appearances
3 times 300+ strikeouts
9 times ERA+ score of 130 or more
3 time Cy Young runner up
8-2, 2.06 postseason with 0.92 WHIP and 8.6 K/9
NLCS and WS MVPs
1 Bloody Sock
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RedRaiders
Mr. +EV
This is really impressive when you look at some of the recent leaders at season's end. Randy Johnson is the other pitcher of late that could easily attain this (372 in 2001 - wow). We've seen his HOF score already.
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Sammy3469
Footballguy
His ERA+ scores are also pretty amazing when you look back...his average statistical profile is in some cases better than the best seasons of some of the other names being thrown out in this thread.
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NY/NJMFDIVER
Footballguy
He was a clear number 1 in Baltimore
I agree that Smoltz is a lock.
I would say I'm 80% sure Schilling gets in. He's had a fine, lengthy career and pretty decent stats. Someone compared him to Cone and Jack Morris earlier. I'd have to look their stats up, but I believe this is a pretty decent comparison. If I had a vote, I'd vote Morris in....Cone would be real close, but I'd vote Schilling in over both of them.
It's hard for me to justify Mussina being in the hall of fame, considering he has never won 20 games, never won a cy young....but hell, he should finish with 270 or so wins, and 2,700 or so strikeouts. Just shy of the hall in my opinion, but they've let in less worthy starters too
I would say I'm 80% sure Schilling gets in. He's had a fine, lengthy career and pretty decent stats. Someone compared him to Cone and Jack Morris earlier. I'd have to look their stats up, but I believe this is a pretty decent comparison. If I had a vote, I'd vote Morris in....Cone would be real close, but I'd vote Schilling in over both of them.
It's hard for me to justify Mussina being in the hall of fame, considering he has never won 20 games, never won a cy young....but hell, he should finish with 270 or so wins, and 2,700 or so strikeouts. Just shy of the hall in my opinion, but they've let in less worthy starters too
David Yudkin
Footballguy
Smoltz199-139 .589154 saves3.27 ERA1.26 ERA+2833 strikeouts7.9 K/91.17 WHIPPost season 15-4, 2.65 ERASchilling211-139 .6033.44 ERA127 ERA+3062 strikeouts8.7 K/91.136 WHIPPost season 8-2, 2.06 ERACone194-126 .6063.46 ERA120 ERA+2668 strikeouts8.3 K/91.256 WHIPPost season 8-3, 3.80Morris254-186 .5773.90 ERA105 ERA+2478 strikeouts5.8 K/91.296 WHIPPost season 7-4, 3.80Mussina241-137 .6383.66 ERA124 ERA+2584 strikeouts7.2 K/91.179 WHIPPost season 7-8, 3.40Compare that to Pedro206-92 .6912.81 ERA160 ERA+2998 strikeouts10.2 K/91.026 WHIPPost season 6-2, 3.40I agree that Smoltz is a lock.I would say I'm 80% sure Schilling gets in. He's had a fine, lengthy career and pretty decent stats. Someone compared him to Cone and Jack Morris earlier. I'd have to look their stats up, but I believe this is a pretty decent comparison. If I had a vote, I'd vote Morris in....Cone would be real close, but I'd vote Schilling in over both of them.It's hard for me to justify Mussina being in the hall of fame, considering he has never won 20 games, never won a cy young....but hell, he should finish with 270 or so wins, and 2,700 or so strikeouts. Just shy of the hall in my opinion, but they've let in less worthy starters too
Doctor Detroit
Please remove your headgear
Schilling needs more to get to the HOF and honestly he's washed up. Absolute trash. Big mouth should just retire and hope for the Veteran's committee at this point; he's embarrassing himself.
David Yudkin
Footballguy
The best evaluation tool I have seen to compare pitchers is ERA+. That measures a pitcher's ERA compared to the league average on a percentage basis. The higher the score the better. So Pedro's career ERA has been 60% better than the league average over his career.+ = HOFerPedro Martinez 160 Lefty Grove+ 148 Walter Johnson+ 146 Dan Quisenberry 146 Hoyt Wilhelm+ 146 Joe Wood 146 Ed Walsh+ 145 Roger Clemens 144 Jim Devlin 143 Johan Santana 143 Addie Joss+ 142 Roy Oswalt 142 Al Spalding+ 142 Kid Nichols+ 139 Mordecai Brown+ 138 Cy Young+ 138 John Franco 137 Randy Johnson 137 Bruce Sutter+ 136 Pete Alexander+ 135 Roberto Hernandez 135 Greg Maddux 135 Christy Mathewson+ 135 John Clarkson+ 134 John Hiller 134 Rube Waddell+ 134
Pedro also won the Cy Young 3 times, runner up 2x, one third place and one fourth place finish.Pretty sure Pedro is a lock for the HOF....even if his win total doesn't top 250 for his career. Sandy Koufax got in with 165 wins....Pedro was just as dominant for 6-7 years as Koufax was for his 4 great years.David Yudkin said:Smoltz199-139 .589154 saves3.27 ERA1.26 ERA+2833 strikeouts7.9 K/91.17 WHIPPost season 15-4, 2.65 ERASchilling211-139 .6033.44 ERA127 ERA+3062 strikeouts8.7 K/91.136 WHIPPost season 8-2, 2.06 ERACone194-126 .6063.46 ERA120 ERA+2668 strikeouts8.3 K/91.256 WHIPPost season 8-3, 3.80Morris254-186 .5773.90 ERA105 ERA+2478 strikeouts5.8 K/91.296 WHIPPost season 7-4, 3.80Mussina241-137 .6383.66 ERA124 ERA+2584 strikeouts7.2 K/91.179 WHIPPost season 7-8, 3.40Compare that to Pedro206-92 .6912.81 ERA160 ERA+2998 strikeouts10.2 K/91.026 WHIPPost season 6-2, 3.40I agree that Smoltz is a lock.I would say I'm 80% sure Schilling gets in. He's had a fine, lengthy career and pretty decent stats. Someone compared him to Cone and Jack Morris earlier. I'd have to look their stats up, but I believe this is a pretty decent comparison. If I had a vote, I'd vote Morris in....Cone would be real close, but I'd vote Schilling in over both of them.It's hard for me to justify Mussina being in the hall of fame, considering he has never won 20 games, never won a cy young....but hell, he should finish with 270 or so wins, and 2,700 or so strikeouts. Just shy of the hall in my opinion, but they've let in less worthy starters too
Doctor Detroit
Please remove your headgear
Pedro from 1997-2000 and 2002 years compare quite well to Koufax 1963-1966 and is a fine observation. I crunched these and they are very similiar:Pedro also won the Cy Young 3 times, runner up 2x, one third place and one fourth place finish.Pretty sure Pedro is a lock for the HOF....even if his win total doesn't top 250 for his career. Sandy Koufax got in with 165 wins....Pedro was just as dominant for 6-7 years as Koufax was for his 4 great years.David Yudkin said:Smoltz199-139 .589154 saves3.27 ERA1.26 ERA+2833 strikeouts7.9 K/91.17 WHIPPost season 15-4, 2.65 ERASchilling211-139 .6033.44 ERA127 ERA+3062 strikeouts8.7 K/91.136 WHIPPost season 8-2, 2.06 ERACone194-126 .6063.46 ERA120 ERA+2668 strikeouts8.3 K/91.256 WHIPPost season 8-3, 3.80Morris254-186 .5773.90 ERA105 ERA+2478 strikeouts5.8 K/91.296 WHIPPost season 7-4, 3.80Mussina241-137 .6383.66 ERA124 ERA+2584 strikeouts7.2 K/91.179 WHIPPost season 7-8, 3.40Compare that to Pedro206-92 .6912.81 ERA160 ERA+2998 strikeouts10.2 K/91.026 WHIPPost season 6-2, 3.40I agree that Smoltz is a lock.I would say I'm 80% sure Schilling gets in. He's had a fine, lengthy career and pretty decent stats. Someone compared him to Cone and Jack Morris earlier. I'd have to look their stats up, but I believe this is a pretty decent comparison. If I had a vote, I'd vote Morris in....Cone would be real close, but I'd vote Schilling in over both of them.It's hard for me to justify Mussina being in the hall of fame, considering he has never won 20 games, never won a cy young....but hell, he should finish with 270 or so wins, and 2,700 or so strikeouts. Just shy of the hall in my opinion, but they've let in less worthy starters too
Code:
Wins: Koufax 107 Pedro 97IP: Koufax 1192 Pedro 1103K's: Koufax 1228 Pedro 1392H+BB: Koufax 1084 Pedro 1021WHIP: Koufax .910 Pedro .925Combined ERA+: Koufax 175 Pedro 221
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So why is Koufax's first 6 or 7 years of his career always forgotten? Yeah his first two seasons he pitched under 100 innings, but those numbers were horrible...
Yeah I know everyone remembers his last 4 seasons and walking away at 30, but should those 4 seasons outweigh his entire career?
What if those were the first 4 years of his career and then had the other 8 seasons? Would he be in the hall then?
Yeah I know everyone remembers his last 4 seasons and walking away at 30, but should those 4 seasons outweigh his entire career?
What if those were the first 4 years of his career and then had the other 8 seasons? Would he be in the hall then?
David Yudkin
Footballguy
The main difference in Koufax vs Pedro is the lack of pitching in today's game vs the 60s. By comparison . . .In 2000, Pedro had an ERA+ score of 285, second highest in a season all time next to Tim Keefe in 1880 with 294. Keefe had an ERA of 0.86 vs a League ERA of 2.52 (but only pitched in 12 games).Anyway, Pedro had an ERA+ score of 285. Clemens was #2 that year . . . at 137. Pedro also had a WHIP of 0.737 (the best season in baseball history) vs 1.187 for the #2 pitcher. (How he only went 18-6 is a mystery of epic proportions.)By comparison, Koufax's best ERA+ score was 190 (vs 165 for the #2 guy) and his best WHIP was 0.855 (vs 0.914 for the runner-up).I can't see how Pedro misses out on the HOF barring any disparaging photographs with him in compromising situations.
RonnieLott
Footballguy
Pedro Martinez is probably the greatest pitcher of all-time. Like many have shown, it's not only his raw statistics that astound, it's how they stack up against the rest of the league he's playing in. He's a men among boys. The only argument against Pedro is the longevity discussion. Clearly Clemens has been dominant for an insane number of years.
Schilling is a likely Hall of Famer as his win total will move towards 250 wins. As someone said, 300 is no longer a fair barometer. His other stats, especially 3000+K's will get him in.
Smoltz is also in. Dominant starter. Dominant closer. Dominant in the postseason. No doubt about it.
Mussina is a tricky one. There's nothing about him that screams #1 starter. There are no statistics justifying his inclusion. No Cy Youngs. Not even one season with 20+ wins. The only argument in favor of Mussina is longevity as he'll likely be north of 250 wins. He's no Hall of Famer in my book, but then again, neither are Niekro, Sutton and a bunch of others.
As for Koufax, his 6 year run was remarkable. The reason some of his seasons prior to that weren't great were because Alston jerked him around. Look at the stats. In 1958 he made 26 starts but appeared in 40 games. When you don't have a secure role, the constant changing of dynamics only serves to screw you up. Ask most hitters who played during that era and they'll likely say Koufax and Gibson were two guys they never wanted to face.
Schilling is a likely Hall of Famer as his win total will move towards 250 wins. As someone said, 300 is no longer a fair barometer. His other stats, especially 3000+K's will get him in.
Smoltz is also in. Dominant starter. Dominant closer. Dominant in the postseason. No doubt about it.
Mussina is a tricky one. There's nothing about him that screams #1 starter. There are no statistics justifying his inclusion. No Cy Youngs. Not even one season with 20+ wins. The only argument in favor of Mussina is longevity as he'll likely be north of 250 wins. He's no Hall of Famer in my book, but then again, neither are Niekro, Sutton and a bunch of others.
As for Koufax, his 6 year run was remarkable. The reason some of his seasons prior to that weren't great were because Alston jerked him around. Look at the stats. In 1958 he made 26 starts but appeared in 40 games. When you don't have a secure role, the constant changing of dynamics only serves to screw you up. Ask most hitters who played during that era and they'll likely say Koufax and Gibson were two guys they never wanted to face.
Doctor Detroit
Please remove your headgear
RonnieLott
Footballguy
Thanks Doc. Great forum you've guys got here.
David Yudkin
Footballguy
Bump now that Schilling has called it quits.
216-146 (.597)
22 saves
3261 IP
2998 hits allowed
3116 strikeouts
711 base on balls
3.46 ERA
127 ERA+
1.137 WHIP
Top 10 ERA 9 times
Top 10 WHIP 11 times
Top 10 Strikeouts 10 times
Top 10 Strikeout to Walk Ratio 11 times
Top 10 ERA+ 11 times
6-time All Star
0 Cy Youngs (Runner Up three times)
0 MVPs (finished 10th twice)
3 World Series rings
11-2, 2.23 ERA in the post season
1 bloody sock
216-146 (.597)
22 saves
3261 IP
2998 hits allowed
3116 strikeouts
711 base on balls
3.46 ERA
127 ERA+
1.137 WHIP
Top 10 ERA 9 times
Top 10 WHIP 11 times
Top 10 Strikeouts 10 times
Top 10 Strikeout to Walk Ratio 11 times
Top 10 ERA+ 11 times
6-time All Star
0 Cy Youngs (Runner Up three times)
0 MVPs (finished 10th twice)
3 World Series rings
11-2, 2.23 ERA in the post season
1 bloody sock
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cobalt_27
Footballguy
Definite first-ballot lock for the Hall of Very Good.Tweener, otherwise, and I have a feeling he'll be on the ballot for many years.
just running quickly over recent hof inductee's - it looks to me like Nolan Ryan was the last starting pitcher inducted to the hof in the past 10 years (Dennis Eckersley's part time starting gig excluded). I'm not sure this bodes well for Schilling as he has a number of contemporaries much more deserving to get in (Maddux, Johnson, Clemens, probably Smoltz, Pedro, Glavine). Going to bump down his chances from 80% to 60%
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dparker713
Footballguy
I really dont understand why its so much harder to get in as a pitcher than a hitter these days. Yes, his wins total is a bit low, but he also played entirely in the days of the 5 man rotation - 300 wins just is too high a bar. He's the best big game pitcher I've ever seen, and he had the most dominant post season I can think of in 2001.
There is a whole slew of pitchers that should be in the hall starting with Blyleven, hopefully the backlog will be improved some before Curt becomes Hall eligible.
There is a whole slew of pitchers that should be in the hall starting with Blyleven, hopefully the backlog will be improved some before Curt becomes Hall eligible.
dparker713
Footballguy
Career 127 ERA+ isnt very good, its excellent.
Limp Ditka
Footballguy
The guy has a pretty stellar regular season resume. What he did in the post season has to put him in.
David Yudkin
Footballguy
Interesting that today ESPN has been talking to their baseball experts and all of them said they would vote for him . . . yet they all said they didn't think he would make it in.
ETA: Forgot to mention the reason they felt Schilling wouldn't make it had nothing at all to do with his pitching. They felt he went over the top in broadcasting his opinions and alienated the media, so they felt his constant attacks on members of the media would cost him votes and being a borderline candidate in the first place that could kill his chances.
ETA: Forgot to mention the reason they felt Schilling wouldn't make it had nothing at all to do with his pitching. They felt he went over the top in broadcasting his opinions and alienated the media, so they felt his constant attacks on members of the media would cost him votes and being a borderline candidate in the first place that could kill his chances.
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Mr. Pickles
Footballguy
I think that's the sort of crap that gets us into these messes. No they don't.
Eephus
Footballguy
OK, how about this: they want to vote for somebody so they can feel important and write lousy columns about it.
