Is it fair for Raider fans to be bitter about Randy Moss? (1 Viewer)

[Gr00vus]

The think the biggest difference in his performances from Oakland to NE is the difference in the offensive lines. When he was in Oakland, it didn’t matter if he got open because the QB rarely had time to get him the ball, so he gave up; not condoning it just saying. In NE, he knows that the Brady will have all day to throw the ball.

The first season he was doing o.k. until he got hurt, they'd run a variety of patterns for him.Last year was ridiculous. They'd be running 5 and 7 step drops, with all the receivers running down field patterns pretty much exclusively behind a line that couldn't give a qb more than 2 seconds to throw. And they stuck with it all year. It was some of the worst coaching I've ever seen. Moss never had a chance to get the ball, even when he was trying. You could see the frustration build week to week, as when he would beat coverage he'd turn around to see the QB on the ground. Eventually he did quit, which was unforgivable.Now in NE, he's getting the ball on 5-10 yard slants along with the long patterns, on top of playing with at team that can give a QB time to throw and he's productive again. I thought the injuries he'd had the last couple of years had slowed him down, and I honestly don't see him getting the same kind of separation he used to get in his early days with the Vikings, but the Pats have found ways to get him the ball, and he certainly still gets enough separation to make it pay. The Pats are using Moss expertly.Sharp contrast between a team that had no clue and one that does.

 

[toxicbees]

Wait till next year when he demands a huge contract and threatens to disrupt the Patriots. Or worse he goes out on the field and hurts the team. With the Raiders there were several plays that he just didn't fight for the ball and it ended up an interception. Those same plays from last week that he caught for miracle jump ball catches he was bailing on and letting them go for interceptions.

 

[Delusions Of Adequacy]

Am I off base here, or would you be pissed if he did this to YOUR team?

The team did this to themselves.Moss' problems in Oakland were nothing new. They knew what they were getting. They knew he wouldn't be happy and perform unless the team was good.

Ah, so it's ok for a player to take millions of dollars from a team and not give full effort, as long as the team knows in advance that 'this is the way he is'. Got it.

 

[massraider]

I wonder if guys would be so bitter if NE were 4-3 and Moss had 14 catches for 170yds and 1 score. A hypothetical we dont have the answer to, but let it go. Jim Plunkett was an absolute dog in NE, but he moved on to Oakland and won a couple of rings. He was the the 1st overall draft pick long ago, and amounted to SQUAT for the Patriots. I didnt spend the rest of my days hating the guy. Not saying I dont understand, but let it go.

Bad comparison. Chuck Fairbanks was running the dang QB option up in New England, and Plunkett was so shell-shocked after a few years there, he would wet his pants every time a door slammed. Fairbanks almost ruined his career before it even started. Plunkett's performance wasn't from lack of effort, which Moss' clearly was.As to the first point: if Moss was dragging butt up and down the field, showing little effort, and was showing he had lost a step, no one would be bitter, because it would be the same Moss we had in Oakland.The fact that he is playing SO well, makes his Oakland swan dive even more upsetting.I love the "Let it go" routine. Like it's been 5 years or something. It's been 7 games!! Seriously, just because you don't want to hear it? Maybe we should take a page from New England fans, right? They're so good at letting things go......(Give Ben Dreith a big hug for me next time you see him).

 

[massraider]

Last year was ridiculous. They'd be running 5 and 7 step drops, with all the receivers running down field patterns pretty much exclusively behind a line that couldn't give a qb more than 2 seconds to throw. And they stuck with it all year. It was some of the worst coaching I've ever seen. Moss never had a chance to get the ball, even when he was trying. You could see the frustration build week to week, as when he would beat coverage he'd turn around to see the QB on the ground. Eventually he did quit, which was unforgivable.

He quit early, and often. Balls were hitting him in the hands in week 2, and he was dropping them. Don't polish a turd.

 

[twitch]

I wonder if guys would be so bitter if NE were 4-3 and Moss had 14 catches for 170yds and 1 score. A hypothetical we dont have the answer to, but let it go. Jim Plunkett was an absolute dog in NE, but he moved on to Oakland and won a couple of rings. He was the the 1st overall draft pick long ago, and amounted to SQUAT for the Patriots. I didnt spend the rest of my days hating the guy. Not saying I dont understand, but let it go.

Bad comparison. Chuck Fairbanks was running the dang QB option up in New England, and Plunkett was so shell-shocked after a few years there, he would wet his pants every time a door slammed. Fairbanks almost ruined his career before it even started. Plunkett's performance wasn't from lack of effort, which Moss' clearly was.As to the first point: if Moss was dragging butt up and down the field, showing little effort, and was showing he had lost a step, no one would be bitter, because it would be the same Moss we had in Oakland.The fact that he is playing SO well, makes his Oakland swan dive even more upsetting.I love the "Let it go" routine. Like it's been 5 years or something. It's been 7 games!! Seriously, just because you don't want to hear it? Maybe we should take a page from New England fans, right? They're so good at letting things go......(Give Ben Dreith a big hug for me next time you see him).

That'll do. Hearing it doesnt affect any of us Pats fans in the least. Just trying to help. But that's of no use here. Good luck with the season. Oh, and Dreith isnt around, so a crisp "howyadoin'" from Walt Coleman will have to do.

 

[Craig_MiamiFL]

Hard to be bitter. It was time for him to go.

It would of been great to get performance incentives tied to any deal, but then I don't know that anyone would of been interested.

 

[ScoobyDoo]

Am I off base here, or would you be pissed if he did this to YOUR team?

The team did this to themselves.Moss' problems in Oakland were nothing new. They knew what they were getting. They knew he wouldn't be happy and perform unless the team was good.

Ah, so it's ok for a player to take millions of dollars from a team and not give full effort, as long as the team knows in advance that 'this is the way he is'. Got it.

Seriously. Did you expect any different? Minnesota fans knew better, why didn't you?

 

[KoolKat]

I don't think Raiders fans should be bitter. Randy Moss should be bitter that the Raiders took 1 1/2 years of his productive football life and squandered it by putting him in one of the worst offenses in NFL history. I would have given up too with Walter's errant passes threatening my heatlh.

 

[redman]

I don't think Raiders fans should be bitter. Randy Moss should be bitter that the Raiders took 1 1/2 years of his productive football life and squandered it by putting him in one of the worst offenses in NFL history. I would have given up too with Walter's errant passes threatening my heatlh.

He was very handsomely paid. We should all have so much of our lives "squandered".

 

[jonessed]

Of course they should be. He's paid to play not loaf around the football field and whine. He obviously had the ability to be significantly better than he demonstrated. For the money they paid him the Raiders deserved at least a marginal effort on his part.

 

[TommyGilmore]

Of course they should be. He's paid to play not loaf around the football field and whine.

Pretty sure that wasn't in his contract, or else he wouldn't have signed it.

 

[eom]

Moss is a fair weather friend. He's a coward when there's adversity. I don't respect that, and it's amusing to me that the Pats players and fans are trying to spin his successful season this year as arising from him being a good teammate as opposed to a fair weather friend on a good team.

you can spin it like that if it makes you feel superior, or maybe he was a professional stuck w/an amateur organization.he gave them a couple years of his life to get #### straight, but when they wouldn't he quit and took a huge pay cut to play w/a pro operation that wanted to win instead of just #### around.people quit jobs every day.if you're the kind of person who tolerates that bs and cons yourself into sticking around then you're just part of the problem.

 

[eom]

Wait till next year when he demands a huge contract and threatens to disrupt the Patriots. Or worse he goes out on the field and hurts the team. With the Raiders there were several plays that he just didn't fight for the ball and it ended up an interception. Those same plays from last week that he caught for miracle jump ball catches he was bailing on and letting them go for interceptions.

would that be the year after the pats win the superbowl?personally, I couldn't give a crap if he's back or not, and don't wait around for the pats to throw the bank at him.if you really think we need randy moss to win then you have no comprehension of what's goin' on in new england.

 

[KoolKat]

I don't think Raiders fans should be bitter. Randy Moss should be bitter that the Raiders took 1 1/2 years of his productive football life and squandered it by putting him in one of the worst offenses in NFL history. I would have given up too with Walter's errant passes threatening my heatlh.

He was very handsomely paid. We should all have so much of our lives "squandered".

Sorry, I am just a bitter Randy Moss dynasty owner. I guess I should Moss owners should be bitter. It was a terrible day as a Randy Moss/Denver Fan when he was traded to Oakland. I am really happy to have weathered the storm.

 

[Raider Nation]

fyi -- moss is mentoring chad.

and if anybody thinks moss is going to produce on that sorryass oakland team, which may be the worst offense in modern history, like he produces on what may be the best, needs to pull their head out of their...sand.

LOL @ "produce". Production was not the issue. Effort was.

And that is the ONLY relevant point in this discussion. Period.It's amazing to me how many people keep spewing the "Al Davis is a blah blah blah".... and "The Raiders are a sorry organization, blah blah blah"... Kick the Raiders and their front office while they are down all you want. There is no excuse for a player to QUIT on his team, and anyone who now roots for such a player is even worse than Moss is.

 

[eom]

randy moss walked away from something like 7 million dollars to quit a bush league situation and play for a winner.

that's more man than all raiders fans put together will ever become.

as long as you tolerate that mess you get what you deserve.

 

[Raider Nation]

randy moss walked away from something like 7 million dollars to quit a bush league situation and play for a winner.that's more man than all raiders fans put together will ever become.as long as you tolerate that mess you get what you deserve.

 

[Daisuke Matsuzaka]

randy moss walked away from something like 7 million dollars to quit a bush league situation and play for a winner.that's more man than all raiders fans put together will ever become.as long as you tolerate that mess you get what you deserve.

It's posts like this that give us Patriot fans a bad name.So, thanks.

 

[Raider Nation]

randy moss walked away from something like 7 million dollars to quit a bush league situation and play for a winner.that's more man than all raiders fans put together will ever become.as long as you tolerate that mess you get what you deserve.

It's posts like this that give us Patriot fans a bad name.So, thanks.

He's a one-trick pony. RAIDERS SUCK... PATS ARE GREAT. It's hard to deal with heckling from someone who's been a Pats fan WAAAAY back since 2001.

 

[eom]

RAIDERS SUCK... PATS ARE GREAT.

thx for the news bulletin.

 

[Raider Nation]

RAIDERS SUCK... PATS ARE GREAT.

thx for the news bulletin.

Still boring. Try harder.

 

[redman]

RAIDERS SUCK... PATS ARE GREAT.

thx for the news bulletin.

Still boring. Try harder.

eom consistently impresses me with his capacity for Shark Pool blather. It's a talent really.

 

[Christo]

fyi -- moss is mentoring chad.

and if anybody thinks moss is going to produce on that sorryass oakland team, which may be the worst offense in modern history, like he produces on what may be the best, needs to pull their head out of their...sand.

LOL @ "produce". Production was not the issue. Effort was.

And that is the ONLY relevant point in this discussion. Period.

Are you sure? I could have sworn I read this in your OP:

instead of sticking around to TRY to make things better

What does that have to do with effort?

 

[Sonny Lubick Blowup Doll]

Yes.

 

[Pai Mei]

In Oakland, the offense was putrid. No argument. The line didn't give the QB enough time to get Moss the ball. He was frustrated. Can't blame him there. But instead of sticking around to TRY to make things better (you know, maybe living up to the "captain" billing he was given... and what a complete joke that was), he sulks and whines and regularly quits on plays and asks for a trade.

Now that he is with a great team, Randy is all of a sudden a team player and a role model and a mentor to the young players and a terrific citizen. Chris Mortensen yesterday opined that Moss "has finally grown up and matured."

To me, he's nothing but a frontrunner. Anyone can be an awesome teammate on an all-time-great squad.

I'm pissed that clowns like this get to dictate where they play, and how hard they play, and I don't care who knows it.

Am I off base here, or would you be pissed if he did this to YOUR team?

To be fair, even most "experts" thought that Randy Moss was past his prime and was not worth it. We saw it written by staff at FBGs. We saw it implied throughout the league as no-one would offer more than a 4th. Makes you stop and think about how little the supposed experts understand the game. Belichick basically embarrassed the entire NFL and just about all the pundits that write about it with that trade.

 

[Dino]

YES

I was arguing this point at work today.

 

[[scooter]]

Tom Brady has said at least three of those four things repeatedly. Most notably that he's a model teammate and mentor.

Cool. I'm sure you'll have no problem providing some links and quotes to back up those claims.

Let me call up SportsCenter and get their tapes. You can eat popcorn all you want, Brady said it on TV in post game interviews more than once.

You can either back up your claims with facts, or you can be a whiny tool.

 

[Raider Nation]

Tom Brady has said at least three of those four things repeatedly. Most notably that he's a model teammate and mentor.

Cool. I'm sure you'll have no problem providing some links and quotes to back up those claims.

Let me call up SportsCenter and get their tapes. You can eat popcorn all you want, Brady said it on TV in post game interviews more than once.

You can either back up your claims with facts, or you can be a whiny tool.

Are you really this ignorant?Everything I heard and everything Mad heard are things we heard... either on TV or the radio or in my case on Sirius NFL radio, which I have on about 12 hours a day. We cannot provide you a link when there is no link to provide. Clear?

You can choose to believe me, or don't. If you choose the latter option, I'll still try to sleep at night against all odds.

 

[Raider Nation]

My butcher, my mailman and I...

...have the same number of Super Bowl rings as this PoS! Karma, baby!!!

I'm gonna have a huge watermelon smile on my face for the next 12 months.

 

[Bruno Tataglia]