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Is Texas on it's way to Independence? (1 Viewer)

I was just reading about this, along with Texas including a plank about a stolen election and Biden is only "acting" President.

The short answer is no, Texas can not secede per SCOTUS. Scalia put it to rest. Doesn't mean they won't keep trying though. 

"If there was any constitutional issue resolved by the Civil War, it is that there is no right to secede," the late Justice Antonin Scalia once wrote.

 
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I recall looking into this previously in that I believe they have the ability to split into up to five separate states but they do not have the right to secede from the US.

Sorry Charlie. 

 
No, they are not. 

I grew up in Texas and I understand the psyche. I'd say there's no more independent minded state in the Union. It's more common in Texas to see a US Flag flown with a separate Texas Flag along side it on another flagpole (usually exactly the same height or often an inch taller depending on where you are in the state) than to see a US Flag flown with a Texas Flag underneath it. 

And with California, they'd certainly stand the best chance of seceding meaning they have the natural resources, people, businesses and ports. Particularly energy. 

But being the most likely of the bunch to succeed does not mean they'd have much of a chance of succeeding in my opinion.

 
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The General said:
We'll keep Austin and Big Bend. Bad guys can have the Cowboys and cheating Astros.
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Well imagine if this plays out like 1860 (it won’t, but stay with me.)

The standing U.S. Army was very small. About 16,000 troops, widely dispersed. Many on frontier lands protecting settlers & killing Native Americans. 

Every state had large armories. Each one would have dozens/scores or cannons and 10-50K small arms. Before each of the 7 original secession states went out, they seized the armories within their state.

Anyway, Fort Hood is 340 square miles. There’s a lot of active armor units and sekf-propelled artillery in Texas. Sure, we’ve got 3-4K tanks mothballed in CA but that’s gonna take time to make operational.

This might not be a cakewalk. We should just let them walk. They can repay us for the lost gear in the peace treaty.

 
Joe Bryant said:
No, they are not. 

I grew up in Texas and I understand the psyche. I'd say there's no more independent minded state in the Union. It's more common in Texas to see a US Flag flown with a separate Texas Flag along side it on another flagpole (usually exactly the same height or often an inch taller depending on where you are in the state) than to see a US Flag flown with a Texas Flag underneath it. 

And with California, they'd certainly stand the best chance of seceding meaning they have the natural resources, people, businesses and ports. Particularly energy. 

But being the most likely of the bunch to succeed does not mean they'd have much of a chance of succeeding in my opinion.
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I don’t know who’s more likely to succeed if they secede, but HI also has plenty who would opt out of our ties to the continental US.

There are a bunch of other states who have active petitions as well. This  is a few years old (and a questionable source), but includes a poll, where support for succession was highest in WY.

 
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Amused to Death said:
I was just reading about this, along with Texas including a plank about a stolen election and Biden is only "acting" President.

The short answer is no, Texas can not secede per SCOTUS. Scalia put it to rest. Doesn't mean they won't keep trying though. 

"If there was any constitutional issue resolved by the Civil War, it is that there is no right to secede," the late Justice Antonin Scalia once wrote.
Click to expand...


It wouldn't just be Texas alone, it would be the entire Southern Border.

Because a large share of the Strategic Oil Reserve is housed in Texas,  that would be used as a talking point to declare war on the breakoff states. Except it won't happen. American servicemen will not start killing each other on US soil. It just won't happen.

California won't go Blue, it would split in half. Tons of Republicans in CA.

Before the pandemic, I would split time in California, Texas and New York. I can say the complexities of running businesses in CA is exponentially more difficult. I would compare it to being subjected to primitive dentistry. Gavin Newsom aka Dollar Store Obama is a complete and total idiot. London Breed is an imbecile. I've never seen widespread public policy that worked like some kind of medieval torture chamber before.

Texans believe they live in the greatest state in the entire union.  When I'm there, it's true. When I'm not there, it's conflicting.

Do you think Texas is going to worry about what SCOTUS says? Separation will be about survival, not formal policy and law. I feel badly for honest hard working good decent every day working class people stuck in Big Blue Cities and majorly Blue strongholds. But Texans will hold fast to the belief that other states made their own messes, they can soak in their own filth, and the Lone Star State comes first.

So the first thing that would happen is people like myself who own property in multiple states, including Texas, the ham fisted overlords that control Biden and the rest will try to seize my non Texas property. If you want to be part of the "New Texas and Southern Border", then we are going to take the rest of your s--t from you. That's exactly what would happen.

If you can't enforce it with a bunch of guns, then you can't enforce it. SCOTUS can say whatever it wants, Americans in the military and law enforcement are not going to go to war with against Texans and the Southern Border states. This is not the Handmaid's Tale. You can't compel humans to shoot at their neighbors. There is no law, no mandate, no speech you could give, no policy, no SCOTUS ruling, that is going to change the current human condition in America today.

 
GordonGekko said:
If you can't enforce it with a bunch of guns, then you can't enforce it. SCOTUS can say whatever it wants, Americans in the military and law enforcement are not going to go to war with against Texans and the Southern Border states. This is not the Handmaid's Tale. You can't compel humans to shoot at their neighbors. There is no law, no mandate, no speech you could give, no policy, no SCOTUS ruling, that is going to change the current human condition in America today.
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So next year Texas takes a vote to secede and it passes. Then what?

 
Witz said:
I recall looking into this previously in that I believe they have the ability to split into up to five separate states but they do not have the right to secede from the US.

Sorry Charlie. 
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What was the Revolutionary War about?

A smaller group with their own interests and needs believed the larger collective around them and the leadership above them behaved in a tyrannical and punitive way. They wanted freedom from that. So they detached and were wiling to fight and die for that belief.

King George said the Colonies had no right to break off from good old Great Britain as well. He believed that so much, he hired Hessian mercenaries to come kill our Founders. That's the key point, you think everyday Americans are going to kill everyday Americans for politicians clearly bought and controlled by corporate donor overlords?

Saying "Bye Felicia" while holding a rifle in your hands is very very very American at it's core.

 
Joe Mammy said:
Texas Could Vote to Secede From U.S. in 2023 as GOP Pushes for Referendum

I hope DeSantis doesn't get any ideas from this. It's right up his alley.

In the possible future you're driving I-10 W from LA to NM.

"Stop. You pay toll."

"How much?"

"How much you got?"
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No worries....the most aggressive Ron would get on this is to announce the secession from the union......and it takes effect 5 years from now.  If you are looking for a single state that would be a guaranteed 180 status wise by secession it would be Florida.  It would quickly become Mississippi/West Virginia Junior.  

 
Amused to Death said:
So next year Texas takes a vote to secede and it passes. Then what?
Click to expand...


Three things need to happen

1) Texas and the Southern Border states must be completely "self reliant" from the rest of the US.

2) Texas and the Southern Border states need something of critical value to "trade" to the rest of the states to ensure enough give and take to cease long term formal hostilities.

3) The "trade" can only be enforced on equal terms if Texas and the Southern Border states are a nuclear capable power.

If I take tactical command of Upper East Texas, then it's smooth sailing. If I don't, it's a coin flip. Give me ten thousand good men and I'll hold the line. There has to be hard picket on the perimeter, legitimate air power, an enforced no fly zone and the rest of the world believing Texans are truly outcome independent.

I'll send @bigbottom to hear Susan Rice's terms. She can keep him. Literally, just keep him. He can do filing for her or dusting or scrapbooking or something as such.  It's OK. He's not one of my ten thousand.

Susan Rice: "The entire Rwandan genocide is not my fault, I don't know why people keep saying I enabled that....Your talking points are not on my itinerary!"

Old Man Gekko: “I don't read the script. The script reads me!”

 
GordonGekko said:
Three things need to happen

1) Texas and the Southern Border states must be completely "self reliant" from the rest of the US.

2) Texas and the Southern Border states need something of critical value to "trade" to the rest of the states to ensure enough give and take to cease long term formal hostilities.

3) The "trade" can only be enforced on equal terms if Texas and the Southern Border states are a nuclear capable power.

If I take tactical command of Upper East Texas, then it's smooth sailing. If I don't, it's a coin flip. Give me ten thousand good men and I'll hold the line. There has to be hard picket on the perimeter, legitimate air power, an enforced no fly zone and the rest of the world believing Texans are truly outcome independent.

I'll send @bigbottom to hear Susan Rice's terms. She can keep him. Literally, just keep him. He can do filing for her or dusting or scrapbooking or something as such.  It's OK. He's not one of my ten thousand.

Susan Rice: "The entire Rwandan genocide is not my fault, I don't know why people keep saying I enabled that....Your talking points are not on my itinerary!"

Old Man Gekko: “I don't read the script. The script reads me!”
Click to expand...
🤣 You’re a gem. 

 
GordonGekko said:
Three things need to happen

1) Texas and the Southern Border states must be completely "self reliant" from the rest of the US.

2) Texas and the Southern Border states need something of critical value to "trade" to the rest of the states to ensure enough give and take to cease long term formal hostilities.

3) The "trade" can only be enforced on equal terms if Texas and the Southern Border states are a nuclear capable power.

If I take tactical command of Upper East Texas, then it's smooth sailing. If I don't, it's a coin flip. Give me ten thousand good men and I'll hold the line. There has to be hard picket on the perimeter, legitimate air power, an enforced no fly zone and the rest of the world believing Texans are truly outcome independent.

I'll send @bigbottom to hear Susan Rice's terms. She can keep him. Literally, just keep him. He can do filing for her or dusting or scrapbooking or something as such.  It's OK. He's not one of my ten thousand.

Susan Rice: "The entire Rwandan genocide is not my fault, I don't know why people keep saying I enabled that....Your talking points are not on my itinerary!"

Old Man Gekko: “I don't read the script. The script reads me!”
Click to expand...
I love you GG, but no bueno disrespecting @bigbottom.  Never met the guy, but I'm convinced he's one of the best human beings I've ever interacted with.

Back on topic - if any state were to ever secede from the Union, it would be Texas.  And it would suck for us Conservatives in the rest of America.

 
Texas is the only state that joined the Confederacy that doesn't have a clause to never secede again in their state constitution. Such a clause was required for states to rejoin the Union. Texas drafted a constitution with the clause but it was never ratified. The following constitution that was ratified was absent the clause. 

Is it possible Texas never actually fulfilled all the terms needed to rejoin the Union?

 
ekbeats said:
I love you GG, but no bueno disrespecting @bigbottom.  Never met the guy, but I'm convinced he's one of the best human beings I've ever interacted with.

Back on topic - if any state were to ever secede from the Union, it would be Texas.  And it would suck for us Conservatives in the rest of America.
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Thanks ek!  That is super kind of you to say. But it’s all in good fun. Besides, it’s precisely my good nature that disqualifies me from serving in GG’s post-apocalyptic brigade.

 
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bigbottom said:
Thanks ek!  That is super kind of you to say. But it’s all in good fun. Besides, it’s precisely my good nature that disqualifies me from serving in GG’s post-apocalyptic brigade.
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I know BB.  But some things are more important than politics.  🤙

For better or for worse that's the way that I am.  Peace everyone.

 
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Texas secession is good joke material until you take a closer look at what the secessionists are proposing in their new constitution.

It won't be a good state for progressives. You can have 75% of the voters and you still won't ever control the Texas senate.

 
Amused to Death said:
I was just reading about this, along with Texas including a plank about a stolen election and Biden is only "acting" President.

The short answer is no, Texas can not secede per SCOTUS. Scalia put it to rest. Doesn't mean they won't keep trying though. 

"If there was any constitutional issue resolved by the Civil War, it is that there is no right to secede," the late Justice Antonin Scalia once wrote.
Click to expand...
There is no right to secede from the Union. See Texas vs White 1869. 

https://www.oyez.org/cases/1850-1900/74us700

The Court further held that individual states could not unilaterally secede from the Union and that the acts of the insurgent Texas legislature--even if ratified by a majority of Texans--were "absolutely null." 

 
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