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Isaac Bruce passed Marvin Harrison (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Bri
- Start date
Limp Ditka
Footballguy
Limp Ditka
Footballguy
20 games difference going into tonight195 / 175.Oddly enough, they've both started the same amount of games, 168
that's interesting
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[scooter]
Footballguy
That number hasn't been updated for 2007. Bruce has started 179 games to Harrison's 173.
pizzatyme
Footballguy
In your opinion.
gman8343
What would Lemmy do?
I think it's very, very close. Ike on the Colts would have been a sure HOFer.
Ghost Rider
Footballguy
True, but on the Rams, Bruce has been a HoFer. I am not sure how anyone can say he is not one at this point. He has the numbers across the board, he proved he could produce at a high level before the Rams entire offense turned into a scoring machine, and he had plenty of post-season success, including one of the best catches in Super Bowl history.
I agree, if only Isaac Bruce had played in an elite offense with a ton of weapons and a penchant for putting up cartoon numbers that was being directed by a 2-time league MVP QB. If only he'd spent the bulk of his career in an offense like that, then he'd be a sure-fire HoFer.
pizzatyme
Footballguy
gman8343
What would Lemmy do?
SSOG, I respect your knowledge, but you're kind of an ##### in terms of the sarcasm. Bruce put up great numbers in the greatest show on turf days, but how many seasons did that last? How many truly great seasons did Warner have compared to how consistant Manning has been over his career? Indy has been an elite offense since Manning's 2nd season till now, the Rams haven't had that kind of consistency. Warner had a couple of lights out seasons but then fell off. Bulger is perfectly capable but are you suggesting the Rams have been as potent as the Colts in the last decade consistantly? Would Bruce have more TDs playing with Manning or Warner/Bulger? Would Bruce have better numbers on Indy throughout his entire career or with the Rams?
Snot Bubbler
Footballguy
Iwannabeacowboybaby!
Footballguy
You still got it Lhucks!You're right, I'm off here. Chris Miller and old Mark Rypien, 95.That's hardly a league MVP type QB119 catches 1781 yards, 13 TDs Doug's site doesn't list that as a pro bowl year either. If true and not a typo(getting settled in new setup and all) that's quite the oversight by the pro bowl voters
amazing year for WRs huh?
I am something of a ##### sometimes. I'm sorry about that, sometimes I forget that that doesn't play as well over the internet as it does in person.I don't think most WRs make the HoF based on numbers, or else Monk would be in right now. Bruce has produced such elite numbers that I'd have a hard time expecting much of a difference regardless of WHICH team he played for- it's hard to say that a guy who is 3rd in receiving yardage, had he played for another team, would instead be 2nd in receiving yardage... and even harder still to say that that change would have an appreciable impact on his HoF credentials. At WR more than any other position voting seems to be based entirely on some unfathomable, indecipherable set of rules that only the voters understand (if them). In large part, it's based on pro bowls and all-pro awards, but it's just as much based on style of play and memorable plays. His style of play would have been the same regardless of where he played, and his "memorable plays" quotient was actually HELPED by the fact that he was in St. Louis instead of Indy, since St. Louis won a superbowl and made a run at another while Bruce was still in his prime, while Indy was busy developing a reputation as Choker Central.And no, I don't think Bruce's TD numbers would be appreciably different regardless of where he went. Why not? Because he's never been a stud WR in the red zone. Look at a guy like Terrell Owens. His TD numbers are through the roof regardless of who his QB is. Look at Rod Smith. His TD numbers are mediocre regardless of who his QB is. Scoring in the red zone is a specific talent, one that is far more the result of the WR than the QB.
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pizzatyme
Footballguy
Wow, what an unnecessary cheap shot at the Colts. You must be harboring some frustration from some of these recent ### whoopings the "Choker" Colts have laid upon your beloved Fillies?Respect level reduced until further notice. Enjoy watching the Colts AGAIN in the playoffs, choke or not.
gman8343
What would Lemmy do?
Very cool. I do think Bruce would have significantly more TDs if he was in Indy simply because Manning has hit Marvin in stride so many times for long TDs and Bruce is an excellent route runner and would have taken advantage of that accuracy. I also think Bruce would have been more productive late in his career with Manning by a long shot because St. Louis has struggled the last couple of seasons - Bruce is younger than Harrison and I think he could have put up comparable numbers to Marvin in that system the last few years. No idea if Bruce will get to the HOF though -- Rice, Carter, Brown are gonna be in and were playing at a high level during the start of Bruce's career. Harrison, Owens and Moss are definately in IMO, and Holt is probably in over Bruce when his career is done, so I don't know whether that leaves Bruce in the Jimmy/Rod Smith category of great but not great enough, or perhaps his numbers are gaudy enough to put him on another level and get him in. Be interesting to see what happens.
Manning had a rough time(like many QBs but he brought expectations with his awesome play) getting to the Supe. He has and won, of course, but I believe SSOG is referring to that previous time
Bruce is well above the Smith's IMO.Also, younger Bruce had 200 yard games, most ever by a WR I believe. That brings a wow factor into it. 200 is just so "dominating" or "unstoppable" their hard games to forget. The Supe, the huge career totals. I don't think it's much of a Q if he gets in, but when.
bulger2holt
Footballguy
Having so many weapons for the Rams hurt Bruce also. There is only one ball and were usually 4-5 guys wanting it, and Faulk usually gobbled all the TD's. Holt has been the #1 over the past 6-7 years, and Bruce has still produced. They should both be HOF without a doubt. Their numbers are going to be top 5 in NFL history.
What about that post do you disagree with? Did St. Louis not win a SB while Bruce was in his prime and a key cog? Did St. Louis not make a second SB run while Bruce was in his prime and a key cog? Did Indy not fail to register a single win in the playoffs from 1995 to 2002, the huge bulk of Bruce's prime? Did Indy not fail to make a SB appearance until 2006, when Bruce was well past his prime? Did people not call Tony Dungy and Peyton Manning huge chokers who were incapable of winning the big game? I'm sorry, I never knew that spouting fact was a federal offense around here. From now on, I'll limit my posts to Colt-centric conjecture and uninformed nonsense.I never said that *I* thought Dungy and Manning were chokers. Quite the opposite, I've argued long and loud that it's insane to call such talented players and coaches as Manning, Dungy, Cowher, and even Schottenheimer "chokers" when in reality most of the time they're just victims of the numbers game- 32 teams, only one can win. That doesn't change the fact that the Colts *WERE* viewed as chokers. Do you disagree with my statement that, during Bruce's prime, St. Louis played in more big games than Indy? Do you disagree with the fact that the general opinion of the Colts during the overwhelming bulk of Bruce's career was that they were chokers? If you need me to verify either claim, I could easily do so.Seriously, overreaction down? You might reduce my "respect level" another 7 notches for saying it, but you need to chill out a bit. Not everything is a personal insult.
