Julius Jones (1 Viewer)

[broker3d]

Excuse my Notre Dame homerism and my logic may not be strong enough to race Julius up the draft boards. But looking back at history, Mike Holmgren has a history of making a very good RB out of another displaced RB who is almost an identical type of back as Julius Jones, Ahman Green. I'm just thinking out loud here and see if anyone has any thoughts as to the possibility of Julius Jones being a pretty good dark horse @ RB. I base this on what Holmgren did with Ahman Green in Green Bay. Julius and Ahman are both somewhat smaller types of backs with big time speed.

By the way, I am somewhat new here so please let me know if I put this in the wrong forum. Thanks.

 

[sholditch]

Don't see the similarity.

 

[treat88]

I like Jones this season, but also don't see the similarity to Green.

 

[IM666]

Excuse my Notre Dame homerism and my logic may not be strong enough to race Julius up the draft boards. But looking back at history, Mike Holmgren has a history of making a very good RB out of another displaced RB who is almost an identical type of back as Julius Jones, Ahman Green. I'm just thinking out loud here and see if anyone has any thoughts as to the possibility of Julius Jones being a pretty good dark horse @ RB. I base this on what Holmgren did with Ahman Green in Green Bay. Julius and Ahman are both somewhat smaller types of backs with big time speed.By the way, I am somewhat new here so please let me know if I put this in the wrong forum. Thanks.

I looked Green up in Wikipedia, it seems Holmgren only coached him one year then shipped him off to Green Bay.

[edit] Seattle SeahawksAhman Green was drafted in the 3rd round (76th overall) of the 1998 NFL Draft by the Seattle Seahawks. Although Green produced a high rushing average (6.0 in 1998 and 4.6 in 1999) he had difficulty earning significant playing time behind established veteran Ricky Watters. He also earned the displeasure of Seahawks head coach Mike Holmgren for his frequent fumbling.[2]

I would like to see how much of an improvement Jones is to the running game however.

 

[Phurfur]

Excuse my Notre Dame homerism and my logic may not be strong enough to race Julius up the draft boards. But looking back at history, Mike Holmgren has a history of making a very good RB out of another displaced RB who is almost an identical type of back as Julius Jones, Ahman Green. I'm just thinking out loud here and see if anyone has any thoughts as to the possibility of Julius Jones being a pretty good dark horse @ RB. I base this on what Holmgren did with Ahman Green in Green Bay. Julius and Ahman are both somewhat smaller types of backs with big time speed.By the way, I am somewhat new here so please let me know if I put this in the wrong forum. Thanks.

The Walrus traded Green he did not develop him. If you remember Green was that sleeper RB everyone loved similar to Turner, Jordan, C. Taylor, etc. Green's problem was he could never beat out Ricky Waters. When Holmgren came to Seattle he drafted Alexander which made Green expendable in Holmgrens eyes. The fact that he drafted Alexander and traded Green shows he didn't think much of Green. This actually works against your theory.

 

[Captain_Apocalypse]

Yeah, pretty sure he didn't coach Ahman in GB, coached him in seattle, where I'm pretty sure he underpreformed and then they traded him to GB in part for Hass. Have to say though that I don't rememeber Holmgren ever really using a comittee approach. Seems like he has a philosophy of getting one guy into the rhythm of the game. (mostly). Anyway, I don't see much difference between Jones and Dorsey Leavens, whom Holmgren did coach into a pretty good fantasy back in GB. Thing is now he has a glut of weapons in the backfield so I fully expect him to try them all out. Sad thing is I really liked the way Weaver was working out and now they have Duckett too. Terrible. We'll just have to keep an eye on things in the preseason.

 

[zdaddy]

Excuse my Notre Dame homerism and my logic may not be strong enough to race Julius up the draft boards. But looking back at history, Mike Holmgren has a history of making a very good RB out of another displaced RB who is almost an identical type of back as Julius Jones, Ahman Green. I'm just thinking out loud here and see if anyone has any thoughts as to the possibility of Julius Jones being a pretty good dark horse @ RB. I base this on what Holmgren did with Ahman Green in Green Bay. Julius and Ahman are both somewhat smaller types of backs with big time speed.By the way, I am somewhat new here so please let me know if I put this in the wrong forum. Thanks.

I looked Green up in Wikipedia, it seems Holmgren only coached him one year then shipped him off to Green Bay.

[edit] Seattle SeahawksAhman Green was drafted in the 3rd round (76th overall) of the 1998 NFL Draft by the Seattle Seahawks. Although Green produced a high rushing average (6.0 in 1998 and 4.6 in 1999) he had difficulty earning significant playing time behind established veteran Ricky Watters. He also earned the displeasure of Seahawks head coach Mike Holmgren for his frequent fumbling.[2]

I would like to see how much of an improvement Jones is to the running game however.

Didn't Holmgren coach him in Green Bay?

 

[unpossible]

Excuse my Notre Dame homerism and my logic may not be strong enough to race Julius up the draft boards. But looking back at history, Mike Holmgren has a history of making a very good RB out of another displaced RB who is almost an identical type of back as Julius Jones, Ahman Green. I'm just thinking out loud here and see if anyone has any thoughts as to the possibility of Julius Jones being a pretty good dark horse @ RB. I base this on what Holmgren did with Ahman Green in Green Bay. Julius and Ahman are both somewhat smaller types of backs with big time speed.By the way, I am somewhat new here so please let me know if I put this in the wrong forum. Thanks.

I looked Green up in Wikipedia, it seems Holmgren only coached him one year then shipped him off to Green Bay.

[edit] Seattle SeahawksAhman Green was drafted in the 3rd round (76th overall) of the 1998 NFL Draft by the Seattle Seahawks. Although Green produced a high rushing average (6.0 in 1998 and 4.6 in 1999) he had difficulty earning significant playing time behind established veteran Ricky Watters. He also earned the displeasure of Seahawks head coach Mike Holmgren for his frequent fumbling.[2]

I would like to see how much of an improvement Jones is to the running game however.

Didn't Holmgren coach him in Green Bay?

Unpossible. Holmgren was already in SEA when he traded Green to GBTraded prior to the 2000 season (only had 61 attempts at that point because he was behind Watters). SA was drafted that same offseason and sat behind Watters as well before starting in 2001

 

[Phurfur]

Yeah, pretty sure he didn't coach Ahman in GB, coached him in seattle, where I'm pretty sure he underpreformed and then they traded him to GB in part for Hass. Have to say though that I don't rememeber Holmgren ever really using a comittee approach. Seems like he has a philosophy of getting one guy into the rhythm of the game. (mostly). Anyway, I don't see much difference between Jones and Dorsey Leavens, whom Holmgren did coach into a pretty good fantasy back in GB. Thing is now he has a glut of weapons in the backfield so I fully expect him to try them all out. Sad thing is I really liked the way Weaver was working out and now they have Duckett too. Terrible. We'll just have to keep an eye on things in the preseason.

Actually that wasn't the Hass trade. Green Bay gave up 1st round bust, backup DB Fred Vinson for him. He was one of Holmgren's picks when he was with GB.

 

[Garts]

He was traded out of Seattle because he fumbled all the time.

 

[unpossible]

He was traded out of Seattle because he fumbled all the time.

3 fumbles in 2 years.Just saying

 

[bicycle_seat_sniffer]

While I like JJ's prospects with a change of scenerythis season, there is a lot of miss-information in this thread

 

[unpossible]

Prior to being named the sixth coach of the Seahawks in January, 1999

 

[unpossible]

While I like JJ's prospects with a change of scenerythis season, there is a lot of miss-information in this thread

I agree about the change of scenery. I think the mis-information is unintentional

 

[Interseptopus]

Yeah, pretty sure he didn't coach Ahman in GB, coached him in seattle, where I'm pretty sure he underpreformed and then they traded him to GB in part for Hass. Have to say though that I don't rememeber Holmgren ever really using a comittee approach. Seems like he has a philosophy of getting one guy into the rhythm of the game. (mostly). Anyway, I don't see much difference between Jones and Dorsey Leavens, whom Holmgren did coach into a pretty good fantasy back in GB. Thing is now he has a glut of weapons in the backfield so I fully expect him to try them all out. Sad thing is I really liked the way Weaver was working out and now they have Duckett too. Terrible. We'll just have to keep an eye on things in the preseason.

Dorsey Levens wasn't that successful. Two years with 1000+ yards. Above 4 yards per carry only 2 years. I think it's rather unfair to compare the successes had by a RB 10 years ago and try to make an accurate assumption of what kind of success a similar RB would have with that same coach. How many of you actually think Holmgren does the exact same thing with the same style of players that he did 10 years ago? The game has changed, I'm sure his coaching philosphy has changed...

He was traded out of Seattle because he fumbled all the time.

3 fumbles in 2 years.Just saying

But that really IS the reason why he was traded. Holmgren couldn't trust him to carry the ball. 3 fumbles in 2 years is an unfair statistic. 3 fumbles in 60 carries. That's 1 fumble every 20 carries. Give a guy 250-300 carries and that average has him fumbling 12.5-15 times in a season. Granted, the most he ever did was 7, but I remember that year and that was ridiculous! Imagine one fumble every other game... not real trustworththyI do not like Julius Jones. Enough time has gone by to successfully label him a bust. He's 27 years old, he's got maybe 3 years of shelf life left before he goes to Ron Dayne-type duty. His YPC is 0.1 greater than Cedric Benson. He has to compete with TJ Duckett and Maurice Morris (who has made a good case for himself).

Let's assume Jones wins the #1 spot, which I really doubt he will, but I will play along. He still will lose carries to Duckett at the goal line and be in an EXACT situation that he was in DAL if not worse. This will truly be a RBBC with Jones and Morris each getting roughly 12 carries and Duckett about 6-8. Morris is just 2 years older than Jones, but more proven with a career 4.3 ypc, ran for 4.5 last season

Bottom Line- unless an injury occurs to both Duckett and Morris, Jones is not worth owning or even considering owning. In fact, I think Morris is still the RB to own in SEA, followed second by Duckett if he gets goal line carries, and THEN Jones

 

[Iron_Far]

Yeah, pretty sure he didn't coach Ahman in GB, coached him in seattle, where I'm pretty sure he underpreformed and then they traded him to GB in part for Hass. Have to say though that I don't rememeber Holmgren ever really using a comittee approach. Seems like he has a philosophy of getting one guy into the rhythm of the game. (mostly). Anyway, I don't see much difference between Jones and Dorsey Leavens, whom Holmgren did coach into a pretty good fantasy back in GB. Thing is now he has a glut of weapons in the backfield so I fully expect him to try them all out. Sad thing is I really liked the way Weaver was working out and now they have Duckett too. Terrible. We'll just have to keep an eye on things in the preseason.

Dorsey Levens wasn't that successful. Two years with 1000+ yards. Above 4 yards per carry only 2 years. I think it's rather unfair to compare the successes had by a RB 10 years ago and try to make an accurate assumption of what kind of success a similar RB would have with that same coach. How many of you actually think Holmgren does the exact same thing with the same style of players that he did 10 years ago? The game has changed, I'm sure his coaching philosphy has changed...

He was traded out of Seattle because he fumbled all the time.

3 fumbles in 2 years.Just saying

But that really IS the reason why he was traded. Holmgren couldn't trust him to carry the ball. 3 fumbles in 2 years is an unfair statistic. 3 fumbles in 60 carries. That's 1 fumble every 20 carries. Give a guy 250-300 carries and that average has him fumbling 12.5-15 times in a season. Granted, the most he ever did was 7, but I remember that year and that was ridiculous! Imagine one fumble every other game... not real trustworththyI do not like Julius Jones. Enough time has gone by to successfully label him a bust. He's 27 years old, he's got maybe 3 years of shelf life left before he goes to Ron Dayne-type duty. His YPC is 0.1 greater than Cedric Benson. He has to compete with TJ Duckett and Maurice Morris (who has made a good case for himself).

Let's assume Jones wins the #1 spot, which I really doubt he will, but I will play along. He still will lose carries to Duckett at the goal line and be in an EXACT situation that he was in DAL if not worse. This will truly be a RBBC with Jones and Morris each getting roughly 12 carries and Duckett about 6-8. Morris is just 2 years older than Jones, but more proven with a career 4.3 ypc, ran for 4.5 last season

Bottom Line- unless an injury occurs to both Duckett and Morris, Jones is not worth owning or even considering owning. In fact, I think Morris is still the RB to own in SEA, followed second by Duckett if he gets goal line carries, and THEN Jones

 

[broker3d]

While I like JJ's prospects with a change of scenerythis season, there is a lot of miss-information in this thread

Beginning with my original question. Oops.

 

[Interseptopus]

Prior to being named the sixth coach of the Seahawks in January, 1999

Man alive, must be idiot hour in here...Holmgren did NOT coach Green in GB!!!! He coached him in SEATTLE for ONE season

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mike_Holmgren

Seattle Seahawks, 1999-Present

Mike Holmgren resigned from the Green Bay Packers after the 1998 season to accept an eight year head coach contract offered by the Seattle Seahawks. Originally, Holmgren was the Executive Vice President/General Manager and Head Coach of the Seahawks. Following the 2002 season, Holmgren relinquished his duties as general manager to focus exclusively on coaching.

http://www.nfl.com/players/ahmangreen/profile?id=GRE035797

Green fumbled twice in 26 carries in 1999, which was enough for Holmgren to trade him to GB where he broke out under MIKE SHERMAN in 2000:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mike_Sherman

Green Bay Packers

In his six-year head coaching career with the Packers from 2000–05, Sherman compiled a 57-39 regular season record and a 2-4 postseason record. Sherman had used the West Coast Offense offensive strategy at Green Bay

 

[Dr. Octopus]

Julius and Ahman are both somewhat smaller types of backs with big time speed.

link?

 

[Steady Mooobin]

Julius and Ahman are both somewhat smaller types of backs with big time speed.

link?

I was thinking the same thing. Julius is fast, but definitely doesn't have that "extra gear". I also don't see him as the same type of player. (A.Green 6ft / 218 - J.Jones 5-10 / 208) Prior to his injury, A.Green was able to break arm tackles and didn't lean forward and fall over himself.

 

[Craig_MiamiFL]

Jones proved he sucks. Outside of Alexander, he was the sofest RB in the league last year.

Just awful. And he was running behind a great line, with a great QB to prevent stacking the line, in a contract year. Where's this big time speed at?