Kiper or Mayock? (1 Viewer)

[Liquid Tension]

Mayock has a built in advantage...I don't think the comparison speaks much to what each brings to the table.

Regardless if there is or isn't some advantage, the question is who was more accurate. Mayock hardly missed in the first round....very impressive. The other guys sitting at the table with Mayock weren't getting him correctly like he was, they were looking to him and they worked for the NFL Network.

The guy gets insider information...nothing impressive about that. I like him, but I'm not going to go crazy because he gets the inside scoop.

I don't care where or how he gets the information, but if one person does get the correct answers/information that IS valuable.

I guess if you have a dynasty draft the two weeks before the draft...which is kind of dumb.

C'mon LHucks you know better than that. What about trading? I also think Mayock is stronger in his analysis of the players attributes

 

[delusional]

Guess i am one of the few that likes Kiper.

The guy knows what kind of food the 7th round 5th pick eats.

 

[Liquid Tension]

I agree Mayock is the best source for learning about a player's play on the field. He doesn't just tell you what he thinks. He breaks it down and shows you. But I want to comment on something that really surprised me about the coverage over the weekend. On Saturday NFLN owned ESPN. It was no contest. I had both on separate TVs in the same room (yes, I'm sick), and after a couple hours I tuned out ESPN. NFLN was faster, more concise, more focused on each pick and provided better commentary throughout. But on Sunday as both networks started to slip, well, more accurately NFLN started falling behind like ESPN, I really started enjoying the ESPN coverage much more. And here's the thing that really surprised me. It wasn't Mort and Jaws, who were both solid, but tired by the end. And it wasn't sniveling McShay. It was Cris Carter and Mel Kiper. How much criticism have those two endured? Honestly, they carried the show. The commentary and back and forth got better and better and the insights were solid, better than anything offered by the others from either network. I Never thought I would say it, but I was very thankful for both from the 5th round on. At one point they replayed an edited piece of Cris Carter being very opinionated several times. Run together it was comedy, and Carter's response was to blame them for being such fools he had to be a little abrasive to make his points. Then he said, he really wasn't like that and he seemed sad about being featured in such a funny light. I guess you had to see it, but it was good TV because Carter was right. Kiper carried that show for the last hour and a half. He did a nice job. I tuned out NFLN.

 

[doog]

I'd like to see how they graded out prospects from 3 years ago, then compare where they are now.

I've been pretty skeptical of Kiper for years now. His post-draft grades are always heavily weighted towards teams that have more draft picks, and regardless, nearly every grade falls within a range of C- to B+ (with the occasional A). Anyhow, I saved his top 25 draft board from 2002 through 2005... here it is:2002 Mel Kiper's Final Top 25 draft board:

1. Julius Peppers

2. David Carr

3. Joey Harrington

4. Ryan Sims

5. Mike Williams (OT)

6. Roy Williams (S)

7. Bryant McKinnie

8. Quentin Jammer

9. Albert Haynesworth

10. Phillip Buchanon

11. Wendell Bryant

12. Jeremy Shockey

13. Ashley Lelie

14. Donte Stallworth

15. John Henderson

16. Daniel Graham

17. Levi Jones

18. Napoleon Harris

19. Dwight Freeney

20. Edward Reed

21. William Green

22. TJ Duckett

23. Lito Shepherd

24. Andre Gurode

25. Kalimba Edwards

And here's his overview of each pick:

http://espn.go.com/melkiper/s/2002/0420/1371357.html

Highlights include his assessment of Joey Harrington, "Harrington is the third highest player on my draft board and deserved to go in this area." He really was only negative about a couple of picks, Levi Jones (who has been pretty decent for the Bengals) and Grant (who Kiper says carries "some value" as the 25th pick).

In my opinion Kiper spends most of his time trying to evaluate what NFL scouts think of a player, and then ranks accordingly. He doesn't seem to have the ability to spot the busts any better than NFL scouts do (see both Mike Williams, Gallery, Harrington, and others in his top 10). As such I'd rather have a guy who is a guy with inside connection to the NFL than a supposed "draft expert".

Here are his top 25 rankings for the drafts from 2003-2005.

2003 Mel Kiper's Final Top 25 draft board:

1. Carson Palmer

2. Charles Rogers

3. Byron Leftwich

4. Dewayne Robertson

5. Terence Newman

6. Terrell Suggs

7. Andrew Johnson

8. Jimmy Kennedy

9. Marcus Trufant

10. Jordan Gross

11. Rex Grossman

12. Eric Steinbach

13. Jeff Faine

14. Troy Polamalu

15. Michael Haynes

16. Kevin Williams

17. Taylor Jacobs

18. Bryant Johnson

19. Jonathan Sullivan

20. Kelley Washington

21. Ty Warren

22. William Joseph

23. Larry Johnson

24. Jerome McDougle

25. Boss Bailey

2004 Mel Kiper's Final Top 25 draft board:

1. Larry Fitzgerald

2. Eli Manning

3. Roy Williams

4. Sean Taylor

5. Robert Gallery

6. Ben Roethlisberger

7. Kellen Winslow

8. Mike Williams

9. Will Smith

10. Steven Jackson

11. Tommie Harris

12. Vince Wilfork

13. Kenechi Udeze

14. Dunta Robinson

15. DeAngelo Hall

16. Philip Rivers

17. Shawn Andrews

18. Reggie Williams

19. Michael Clayton

20. Jonathan Vilma

21. Chris Gamble

22. Michael Jenkins

23. Jason Babin

24. Sean Jones

25. D.J. Williams

2005 Mel Kiper's Final Top 25 draft board:

1. Mike Williams

2. Ronnie Brown

3. Braylon Edwards

4. Carnell "Cadillac" Williams

5. Cedric Benson

6. Alex Smith

7. Aaron Rodgers

8. Derrick Johnson

9. Adam "Pac-Man" Jones

10. Antrel Rolle

11. Alex Barron

12. Carlos Rogers

13. Troy Williamson

14. Dan Cody

15. Shawne Merriman

16. DeMarcus Ware

17. Travis Johnson

18. Marcus Spears

19. Roddy White

20. Mark Clayton

21. Marlin Jackson

22. Khalif Barnes

23. Jammal Brown

24. Heath Miller

25. Erasmus James