Leshoure vs. Kevin Smith.... (1 Viewer)

[jvdesigns2002]

I've been replying to posts in the assistant coach section of this site--and I'm shocked about the hype surrounding Leshoure. Also, I read blogs and articles of various football sites--and it seems that almost everybody thinks the Leshoure is going to be some sort of savior for the Lions running game. I own Smith in a couple of leagues (I drafted him in the mid-late rounds--so I wasn't expecting much there--just thought he was good value)--and it surprises me that people are so against this guy. For the season, he's rushed 29 times for 115 yards, and has 6 receptions for 46 yards, with no fumbles, and a touchdown (a clutch touchdown against the Rams that had a lot to do with the Lions getting the win). If you look at this, he's averaging 4.6 yards per touch (receptions included)--and this includes one game against the 49ers. If you compare that to Darren Mcfadden so far (26 rushes for 54 yards, and 15 receptions for 105 yards)-he is only averaging 3.88 yards per touch. I won't even compare Kevin Smith's numbers to chris johnsons. Reading what I have read--one would think that the lions running game is what is killing that team--and this is not the case. The thing that is hurting the Lions so far this year has been Stafford's turnovers. Not only that--what has leshoure shown to deserve all of this hype. He's coming off an achilles injury--which historically has been brutal for rb's. He's also coming off a suspension for marijuana possession--so he is also an off of the field risk, and he had a horrid preseason (44 yards on 20 carries). My question is this-- based on this--why is there any reason to believe that Leshoure is going to be a better play than Kevin Smith? Don't get me wrong--Leshoure could end up being a great player---but why is there any reason to believe that now? Why the rush to assume that he's going to be better than Smith. The only thing negative about smith is that he is injury prone (but so is leshoure) and that he tends to slip and leave yards on the field (he's averaging 4.6 yards per touch even including these slips). Based on this, I'm thinking about trying to get Smith for cheap in my other leagues--is this a bad move?

 

[jvdesigns2002]

thoughts or opinions anybody?

 

[duaneok66]

This has been covered in other threads but basically people think

1) Smith is injury prone

and

2) Leshoure was a 2nd round pick that was highly touted and he still has that "new player" sheen

Time will tell.

 

[Purple_King]

The Lion's staff wants Leshoure to be the starter/immediate impact now. The staff has been quoted saying they want to give Leshoure some reps as soon as possible. That's basically all you need to know to understand the Leshoure hype right now.

 

[menobrown]

This has been covered in other threads but basically people think1) Smith is injury prone

I don't think that's it so much as people think he just is not very good.

 

[jvdesigns2002]

These replies are exactly what my point is. Yes, he is injury prone- but his potential replacement is coming off of a major achilles injury- so the same argument can be made about leshoure. The other post about him "just not being that good" is not supported by his numbers. In fact- look at leshores preseason numbers- 2.2 yards per carry- and this is against 2nd and 3rd stringers. Im not saying kevin smith is a stud- but doesn't anybody think it's foolish to flat out assume that he's inferior to leshoure?

 

[duaneok66]

it's a partisan argument. Throw out the preseason numbers - I don't even like Leshoure but my argument has nothing to do with those numbers - preseason is preseason for numerous reasons. You are right about Leshoure's injury - his track record for health is no better than Smith's. But again, people like the "new guy" until he fails. Add that to the fact that Smith was unemployed at (about) this time last year. That's a valid concern.

 

[flapgreen]

Leshoure is the next Joe Montana.

 

[austinball]

Ive wondered the same thing. I own Smith this year and have been trying to add Leshoure but the hype has inflated his value to ridiculous levels.

I agree with the above posters that its a combination of:

1) Detroit coaches and local press speaking highly of MLeshoure and talk of playing him a lot

2) MLeshoure being the shiny new guy

3) Smith having a history of injuries

4) Smith having been cut previously by the team

I think that Smith is actually a decent RB. He has speed, good balance, good hands, plays pretty smart, and has a good attitude. I wouldn't say he's a world beater but he has put up strong stats in the past three years depending on the opponent. He is not a workhorse back and that's probably why Leshoure is gonna get every chance to displace him.

I'm not moving Smith mostly because of his value ($0) although Im not convinced Leshoure will take over right away. Its possible, but I think its more likely that it takes him half a season to get into a consistent groove if he gets there. Theres a good chance of injury with ML as well. So I think acquiring Smith for cheap is not a bad idea. You'll know ALOT more in 3 days.

 

[menobrown]

These replies are exactly what my point is. Yes, he is injury prone- but his potential replacement is coming off of a major achilles injury- so the same argument can be made about leshoure. The other post about him "just not being that good" is not supported by his numbers. In fact- look at leshores preseason numbers- 2.2 yards per carry- and this is against 2nd and 3rd stringers. Im not saying kevin smith is a stud- but doesn't anybody think it's foolish to flat out assume that he's inferior to leshoure?

I'm the one who said Kevin Smith is not very good and your counter reeks of a guy studying box scores and not watching games.Kevin Smith's YPC is often decent because the defense is conceding the run. They understand Kevin Smith won't beat you but Stafford or Stafford to Calvin will. The defenses can sell out to stop the pass because Kevin Smith won't make you pay because he can't get past the second level.Now take out my argument that Kevin Smith is not very good and just assume I'm another idiot with an opinion and don't know what I'm talking about. Last year Kevin Smith sat unemployed all year. Got a tryout or two and no one wanted him. Eventually the Lions signed him out of desperation and he put up decent YPC numbers. Did that translate to a multi year deal or even a solid one year deal like Hillis got with the Chiefs? No. Again no one wanted him and the best job he could land was a one year vet minimum type deal back with only team in the NFL who wants him to serve as Best/Leshoure insurance. Now you have an unproven player returning that is trying to come back from a major injury and let the team down with his off the field actions and not only do the Lions seem to be in a rush to give him a good amount of carries but the opposing head coach this week said stopping Leshoure was the key to the game. So forget what I think about Kevin Smith, this should tell you all you need to know about his talent level.I don't even want to get into the absurdity of using Leshoures YPC pre-season average as a future indicator. That's as silly as saying he's going to average about 20 yards a catch like he did in the preseason.I still think Kevin Smith might be the better fantasy play this weekend. Figure he has a better chance of working on passing downs and he does a good job on the dumpoffs. Lions bye is in two weeks. I'm just guessing here but I'm thinking we see a healthy dose of both Leshoure and Smith these next two weeks and if Leshoure looks up to he part they will use the bye week to install Leshoure as their new feature back going forward.

 

[Slider]

Smith has been counted out for 2 years and keeps holding off challengers. I'm holding on til he gets hurt bad or retires. He's easily the most undervalued RB in the league. I mean he's outscoring Alfred Morris in most leagues. STUD!!!

 

[menobrown]

Smith has been counted out for 2 years and keeps holding off challengers.

I'll give him credit for one thing. For a back labeled "injury prone" he seems to consistently be the last man standing for the Lions.

 

[FF Ninja]

These replies are exactly what my point is. Yes, he is injury prone- but his potential replacement is coming off of a major achilles injury- so the same argument can be made about leshoure. The other post about him "just not being that good" is not supported by his numbers. In fact- look at leshores preseason numbers- 2.2 yards per carry- and this is against 2nd and 3rd stringers. Im not saying kevin smith is a stud- but doesn't anybody think it's foolish to flat out assume that he's inferior to leshoure?

I don't think this can be emphasized enough. Most players don't even come back from these injuries. And this is a guy who was a 2nd round pick, so it's not like he was a sure fire stud to begin with. It is possible that he's legit, but far, far from probable. My money is on Smith. I'd be trying to buy low like crazy if I needed a RB in any leagues.

 

[Bayhawks]

These replies are exactly what my point is. Yes, he is injury prone- but his potential replacement is coming off of a major achilles injury- so the same argument can be made about leshoure. The other post about him "just not being that good" is not supported by his numbers. In fact- look at leshores preseason numbers- 2.2 yards per carry- and this is against 2nd and 3rd stringers. Im not saying kevin smith is a stud- but doesn't anybody think it's foolish to flat out assume that he's inferior to leshoure?

I'm the one who said Kevin Smith is not very good and your counter reeks of a guy studying box scores and not watching games.

Kevin Smith's YPC is often decent because the defense is conceding the run. They understand Kevin Smith won't beat you but Stafford or Stafford to Calvin will. The defenses can sell out to stop the pass because Kevin Smith won't make you pay because he can't get past the second level.

Now take out my argument that Kevin Smith is not very good and just assume I'm another idiot with an opinion and don't know what I'm talking about. Last year Kevin Smith sat unemployed all year. Got a tryout or two and no one wanted him. Eventually the Lions signed him out of desperation and he put up decent YPC numbers. Did that translate to a multi year deal or even a solid one year deal like Hillis got with the Chiefs? No. Again no one wanted him and the best job he could land was a one year vet minimum type deal back with only team in the NFL who wants him to serve as Best/Leshoure insurance. Now you have an unproven player returning that is trying to come back from a major injury and let the team down with his off the field actions and not only do the Lions seem to be in a rush to give him a good amount of carries but the opposing head coach this week said stopping Leshoure was the key to the game. So forget what I think about Kevin Smith, this should tell you all you need to know about his talent level.

I don't even want to get into the absurdity of using Leshoures YPC pre-season average as a future indicator. That's as silly as saying he's going to average about 20 yards a catch like he did in the preseason.

I still think Kevin Smith might be the better fantasy play this weekend. Figure he has a better chance of working on passing downs and he does a good job on the dumpoffs. Lions bye is in two weeks. I'm just guessing here but I'm thinking we see a healthy dose of both Leshoure and Smith these next two weeks and if Leshoure looks up to he part they will use the bye week to install Leshoure as their new feature back going forward.

This is the big "IF." Right now, we know that Smith fits with the Lion's offense. He is a decent runner, good pass-blocker, and good receiver. Leshoure "might" fit with the Lion's offense. He WAS a good runner (we have ABSOLUTELY no idea what kind of runner he is now, post-injury), he is a good receiver, and he was a poor pass-blocker in college. Could Leshoure have improved his pass-blocking during his rehab? I suppose. Could he return to his pre-injury running ability? Possibly, but definitely not a given. Personally, I haven't seen anything special out of Leshoure since his injury, and I doubt that we will see that in the next two weeks.

 

[hines]

very simple the coaches keep talking up LeShoure and even gave J Bell a shot last week and the beat writers keep saying LeShoure should take over when he comes back. that, coupled with Smith's uninspiring career 4.0 ypc makes it pretty obvious he will need LeShoure to fail in some way to have any fantasy value

 

[FF Ninja]

very simple the coaches keep talking up LeShoure and even gave J Bell a shot last week and the beat writers keep saying LeShoure should take over when he comes back. that, coupled with Smith's uninspiring career 4.0 ypc makes it pretty obvious he will need LeShoure to fail in some way to have any fantasy value

Even if your post was true, I'd say LeShoure is more likely to fail than succeed, so...

 

[jvdesigns2002]

Yes- I hate looking at preseason stats too- but in this case-thats ALL we have to look at when it comes to Leshoure post achilles injury. The fact of the matter is that he looked very average to below average even against NFL second and third units. The fact that Smith was unemployed for a season is completely ludacris too. Kurt Warner was stocking shelves in a grocery store for petes sake. Using this as an argument for discrediting his production is in itself a joke. Also, the notion that the Lions want Leshoure to pan out into a legit running back is also invalid. Of course they want him to be a stud- they obviously don't want him to suck. The question here is are people giving up on Smith waaay too prematurely and jumping into Leshoure. My thoughts on this are a big yes- I'm just waiting for somebody to give me rational thoughts otherwise.

 

[⚡DEADHEAD⚡]

I like Smith a lot. Thinks he's a solid back. Coaches are said to get on him a bit for leaving yards on the field. I look at it as if he saves himself for another play. Maybe he's spooked about the next injury, maybe he sees more value in stepping out 12 yards downfield instead of taking some hits to get 14. I have no problem with his style. It's effective for fantasy and for the Lions. But if the coaches believe he's leaving yards out there that Leshoure will otherwise get, then the writing is on the wall. Guess I'm not convinced that's the case though.

 

[duaneok66]

Yes- I hate looking at preseason stats too- but in this case-thats ALL we have to look at when it comes to Leshoure post achilles injury. The fact of the matter is that he looked very average to below average even against NFL second and third units. The fact that Smith was unemployed for a season is completely ludacris too. Kurt Warner was stocking shelves in a grocery store for petes sake. Using this as an argument for discrediting his production is in itself a joke. Also, the notion that the Lions want Leshoure to pan out into a legit running back is also invalid. Of course they want him to be a stud- they obviously don't want him to suck. The question here is are people giving up on Smith waaay too prematurely and jumping into Leshoure. My thoughts on this are a big yes- I'm just waiting for somebody to give me rational thoughts otherwise.

Valid points. But again, people that have Leshoure rostered are defending him, and the same goes for those who have Smith rostered.I fall in the latter group, but I know this screams RBBC, which is fairly common in today's NFL. I don't know why it has to be a discussion of one vs. the other.

 

[menobrown]

These replies are exactly what my point is. Yes, he is injury prone- but his potential replacement is coming off of a major achilles injury- so the same argument can be made about leshoure. The other post about him "just not being that good" is not supported by his numbers. In fact- look at leshores preseason numbers- 2.2 yards per carry- and this is against 2nd and 3rd stringers. Im not saying kevin smith is a stud- but doesn't anybody think it's foolish to flat out assume that he's inferior to leshoure?

I'm the one who said Kevin Smith is not very good and your counter reeks of a guy studying box scores and not watching games.

Kevin Smith's YPC is often decent because the defense is conceding the run. They understand Kevin Smith won't beat you but Stafford or Stafford to Calvin will. The defenses can sell out to stop the pass because Kevin Smith won't make you pay because he can't get past the second level.

Now take out my argument that Kevin Smith is not very good and just assume I'm another idiot with an opinion and don't know what I'm talking about. Last year Kevin Smith sat unemployed all year. Got a tryout or two and no one wanted him. Eventually the Lions signed him out of desperation and he put up decent YPC numbers. Did that translate to a multi year deal or even a solid one year deal like Hillis got with the Chiefs? No. Again no one wanted him and the best job he could land was a one year vet minimum type deal back with only team in the NFL who wants him to serve as Best/Leshoure insurance. Now you have an unproven player returning that is trying to come back from a major injury and let the team down with his off the field actions and not only do the Lions seem to be in a rush to give him a good amount of carries but the opposing head coach this week said stopping Leshoure was the key to the game. So forget what I think about Kevin Smith, this should tell you all you need to know about his talent level.

I don't even want to get into the absurdity of using Leshoures YPC pre-season average as a future indicator. That's as silly as saying he's going to average about 20 yards a catch like he did in the preseason.

I still think Kevin Smith might be the better fantasy play this weekend. Figure he has a better chance of working on passing downs and he does a good job on the dumpoffs. Lions bye is in two weeks. I'm just guessing here but I'm thinking we see a healthy dose of both Leshoure and Smith these next two weeks and if Leshoure looks up to he part they will use the bye week to install Leshoure as their new feature back going forward.

This is the big "IF." Right now, we know that Smith fits with the Lion's offense. He is a decent runner, good pass-blocker, and good receiver. Leshoure "might" fit with the Lion's offense. He WAS a good runner (we have ABSOLUTELY no idea what kind of runner he is now, post-injury), he is a good receiver, and he was a poor pass-blocker in college. Could Leshoure have improved his pass-blocking during his rehab? I suppose. Could he return to his pre-injury running ability? Possibly, but definitely not a given. Personally, I haven't seen anything special out of Leshoure since his injury, and I doubt that we will see that in the next two weeks.

I think you and several others are looking at this backwards. The issue here is not the "if" Leshoure is up to the task. The issue is the Lions have seen enough of Smith to know he's not. Personally if I had to choose I'm going to take my chances on the guy that has yet to show he can do the job as opposed to the guy that showed he was not up to the task.

I think this is why the Lions just worked out Grant and Slaton. If Leshoure fails they are prepping themselves to move to another plan. The actions of the Lions indicate they are a team constantly trying to look for an upgrade over Kevin Smith.

I'll add I give Kevin Smith credit were it's due and despite the Lions trying for 3 years now to replace him he's still the guy getting most of the snaps. I own Kevin Smith on one team and I'm certainly not looking to cut him right now as it's possible he'll emerge yet again. Just know it's not what the Lions want to see happen. They are going to give Leshoure every chance they can to take his job and I do believe that chance will begin with Leshoure seeing more carries possibly as soon as this week.

 

[SameSongNDance]

I love these debates, I really do. No one really knows what's going to happen and I can't wait to watch it play out tomorrow.

As for Smith being an underwhelming runner, he indeed is. He is not, however, an underwhelming RB. He's still an above-average pass blocker and has soft hands. What he lacks in pure running ability he makes up in other aspects of his game. There might be numerous better RBs in the league, but he's also one of the best fits for the DET offense. Counting him out now is absurd. In good match ups (like tomorrow) he still hold legit flex value.

I've said it a bunch, but optimally, DET doesn't want to phase out K.Smith. Even if Leshoure does somehow exceed expectations tomorrow, we are more than likely looking at a full blown RBBC here until one of them gets hurt.

 

[Bayhawks]

These replies are exactly what my point is. Yes, he is injury prone- but his potential replacement is coming off of a major achilles injury- so the same argument can be made about leshoure. The other post about him "just not being that good" is not supported by his numbers. In fact- look at leshores preseason numbers- 2.2 yards per carry- and this is against 2nd and 3rd stringers. Im not saying kevin smith is a stud- but doesn't anybody think it's foolish to flat out assume that he's inferior to leshoure?

I'm the one who said Kevin Smith is not very good and your counter reeks of a guy studying box scores and not watching games.

Kevin Smith's YPC is often decent because the defense is conceding the run. They understand Kevin Smith won't beat you but Stafford or Stafford to Calvin will. The defenses can sell out to stop the pass because Kevin Smith won't make you pay because he can't get past the second level.

Now take out my argument that Kevin Smith is not very good and just assume I'm another idiot with an opinion and don't know what I'm talking about. Last year Kevin Smith sat unemployed all year. Got a tryout or two and no one wanted him. Eventually the Lions signed him out of desperation and he put up decent YPC numbers. Did that translate to a multi year deal or even a solid one year deal like Hillis got with the Chiefs? No. Again no one wanted him and the best job he could land was a one year vet minimum type deal back with only team in the NFL who wants him to serve as Best/Leshoure insurance. Now you have an unproven player returning that is trying to come back from a major injury and let the team down with his off the field actions and not only do the Lions seem to be in a rush to give him a good amount of carries but the opposing head coach this week said stopping Leshoure was the key to the game. So forget what I think about Kevin Smith, this should tell you all you need to know about his talent level.

I don't even want to get into the absurdity of using Leshoures YPC pre-season average as a future indicator. That's as silly as saying he's going to average about 20 yards a catch like he did in the preseason.

I still think Kevin Smith might be the better fantasy play this weekend. Figure he has a better chance of working on passing downs and he does a good job on the dumpoffs. Lions bye is in two weeks. I'm just guessing here but I'm thinking we see a healthy dose of both Leshoure and Smith these next two weeks and if Leshoure looks up to he part they will use the bye week to install Leshoure as their new feature back going forward.

This is the big "IF." Right now, we know that Smith fits with the Lion's offense. He is a decent runner, good pass-blocker, and good receiver. Leshoure "might" fit with the Lion's offense. He WAS a good runner (we have ABSOLUTELY no idea what kind of runner he is now, post-injury), he is a good receiver, and he was a poor pass-blocker in college. Could Leshoure have improved his pass-blocking during his rehab? I suppose. Could he return to his pre-injury running ability? Possibly, but definitely not a given. Personally, I haven't seen anything special out of Leshoure since his injury, and I doubt that we will see that in the next two weeks.

I think you and several others are looking at this backwards. The issue here is not the "if" Leshoure is up to the task. The issue is the Lions have seen enough of Smith to know he's not. Personally if I had to choose I'm going to take my chances on the guy that has yet to show he can do the job as opposed to the guy that showed he was not up to the task.

I think this is why the Lions just worked out Grant and Slaton. If Leshoure fails they are prepping themselves to move to another plan. The actions of the Lions indicate they are a team constantly trying to look for an upgrade over Kevin Smith.

I'll add I give Kevin Smith credit were it's due and despite the Lions trying for 3 years now to replace him he's still the guy getting most of the snaps. I own Kevin Smith on one team and I'm certainly not looking to cut him right now as it's possible he'll emerge yet again. Just know it's not what the Lions want to see happen. They are going to give Leshoure every chance they can to take his job and I do believe that chance will begin with Leshoure seeing more carries possibly as soon as this week.

Your Leshoure bias is showing in several places. 1-You suggest that the Lions have seen enough of Smith to know he's not up to the task. Based on what? The fact that they knew well before the season started that Best and Leshoure wouldn't be available the first 2 weeks, yet did nothing to add a RB?

2-You also suggest that because they worked out Smith and Grant, that means they are preparing to move on/upgrade from Smith. Perhaps it indicates that they are worried that Best won't be back, or that Leshoure isn't going to be back from his injury enough to help them?

3-You suggest that they are going to give Leshoure every chance. Again, I ask based on what? Their coaches say they want to get him carries. Duh, he's back from suspension, and they haven't seen what he can do; of course they want to get him carries.

You think Leshoure is going to be great, and that's all well and good; but you are, (IMO) letting your Leshoure love cloud your analysis of this situation.

 

[Bayhawks]

very simple the coaches keep talking up LeShoure and even gave J Bell a shot last week and the beat writers keep saying LeShoure should take over when he comes back. that, coupled with Smith's uninspiring career 4.0 ypc makes it pretty obvious he will need LeShoure to fail in some way to have any fantasy value

They gave him 6 carries. This is some damning evidence of the Lions hating Smith

 

[menobrown]

In answer to your questions:

1-You suggest that the Lions have seen enough of Smith to know he's not up to the task. Based on what? The fact that they knew well before the season started that Best and Leshoure wouldn't be available the first 2 weeks, yet did nothing to add a RB?/ They drafted Kevin Smith in 2008. After two years of watching him they used a #1 in 2010 on another RB who took his job. In 2011 they than used a premium second round pick on another RB. Pure speculation but most assumed it was to form a thunder and lighting type of duo. What can't be disputed is once they had these two they cut Kevin Smith. Kevin Smith than sat unemployed. As far as I know only got a tryout with the Dolphins. They only brought him back due to injuries to Leshoure and Best. When the season was over they were in no rush to sign Smith and for that matter no other team was in a rush to sign him either. Meanwhile a guy like Peyton Hillis who was an absolute train wreck last year got a $3million one year deal. Best Smith could get was what I think was the vet minimium one year deal. At that time and during the draft they could not know Leshoure would be suspended the first two games or that Best would still not be medically cleared. Once they found out both of those items the pickings of RB's were slim which is why they entered the season with Smith as their starter. Other than what the Lions have done I also have eyeballs and can see this guy is a middling talent. He's a solid professional but defenses don't fear him and don't respect the running game when he's playing.

2-You also suggest that because they worked out Smith and Grant, that means they are preparing to move on/upgrade from Smith. Perhaps it indicates that they are worried that Best won't be back, or that Leshoure isn't going to be back from his injury enough to help them? Possible but if they had those concerns why wait until now? What happened to make those pressing issues right now? On the other hand they've got to see 2 games out of Smith before deciding to work out these two.

3-You suggest that they are going to give Leshoure every chance. Again, I ask based on what? Their coaches say they want to get him carries. Duh, he's back from suspension, and they haven't seen what he can do; of course they want to get him carries./ Besides Schwartz saying he's excited to see give him the ball I'd add based on 1. Lions beat writer who so far seems pretty reliable saying he thinks Leshoure gets 12-15 carries, 2. Comments from often reliable Chris Mortenson indicating he thinks hes going to get around 12 carries this week- keep in mind on this and point 1 the Lions RB's are only averaging 19 carries a game with Smith getting 16 a game. Unless this beat writer and Mort are just clueless were are Smiths carries coming from? 3. Comments from opposing head coach Mike Munchak who said stopping Leshoure was key to the game but hey maybe he was just trying to motivate Kevin Smith because that makes sense.

You think Leshoure is going to be great, and that's all well and good; but you are, (IMO) letting your Leshoure love cloud your analysis of this situation.This just makes you looks petty. Where did I say Leshoure would be great? What's a shame is people like you in these forums who think every time someone has an opinion about a player it's because they have some fantasy angle for their team. The thought process behind this is so ignorant to me I don't know were to begin. If I like a player or have him on my fantasy team what does it for for me or my team to start offering up one sided sunny opinions about said player? I mean really. Sometimes people just have opinions.

 

[jon_mx]

very simple the coaches keep talking up LeShoure and even gave J Bell a shot last week and the beat writers keep saying LeShoure should take over when he comes back. that, coupled with Smith's uninspiring career 4.0 ypc makes it pretty obvious he will need LeShoure to fail in some way to have any fantasy value

They gave him 6 carries. This is some damning evidence of the Lions hating Smith

Top 5 Signs Detroit Management hates Kevin Smith:1. They cut him last year.

2. They drafted Best first round in 2010 despite having huge needs on secondary, LB and OL.

3. They moved up and Drafted LeShoure in second round of 2011, again with more pressing needs elsewhere

4. When LeShoure got hurt, Detroit madly started hitting the free agent market evaluating everyone and picking up guys like James Davis and Keiland Williams.

5. The Lions staff never talk up Smith. They do talk up Best and LeShoure.

Time after time after time after time, the Detroit staff has shown no confidence in having Kevin Smith as their starter. Smith is only playing due to attrition. The Lions have made so many moves to not have Kevin Smith as their starting back it is almost ridiculous.

 

[SameSongNDance]

Lions OC Scott Linehan caught trying to poison running back Kevin Smith.

It was uncovered early Saturday morning that Detroit Lions OC Scott Linehan had been caught in the act of trying to poison first string running back Kevin Smith in preparation for the week 3 return Mikel Leshoure. Linehan, who was caught standing over Kevin Smith's plate of food with a dropper in one hand and a substance labeled arsenic in the other, was quoted saying "but Leshoure made some fabulous one-yard runs". Smith (arsenic poisoning) is questionable for this weeks tussle with the Tennessee Titans.

 

[Addai's Adidas]

I'm a long time Lions Fan. They haven't had had a running game since James Stewart, that's how bad and for how long. Kevin Smith isn't the answer but he did pretty well last week against a SF defense that has only allowed ONE one hundred yards rusher in like 20 games or something. He looks completely serviceable to me if Stafford would stop turning the ball over.

 

[wsig]

It's all up in the air, with people siding probably based on ownership of either player. Leshoure's pre-season numbers don't really mean anything. How he looked means something. If he looked healthy or not means something. But the stats are wholly irrelevant. He's a complete unknown at this point. Smith is a known commodity, and therefore a safe bet. Even if Leshoure runs hard, Smith is still the 3rd down back at worst, and even better if Leshoure still leaves much to be desired in the pass pro department. Smith is also a known commodity in the run game. He's averaging 3.9 this year, in line with his career average. He's not a threat to beat defenses on the ground, despite teams' safeties being pre-occupied with CJ or Pettigrew. There's opportunity there for Leshoure to carve a niche as someone who can beat defenses on the ground. He showed the talent to be able to before injury, regardless of not playing a meaningful down yet. The question is health and transition. No one knows these things yet, and anyone who says differently is selling something.

 

[Sudoku_in_the_Bathtub]

vs. Jahvid Best

I think Best will get cleared after a calendar year off & this backfield turns into Saints 2.0. Only makes sense given their injury histories.

PPR: (With Best)

Best

Leshoure

Smith

PPR: (W/o Best)

Smith

Leshoure

 

[Banger]

I think leshoure will be given every chance to succeed but I have no idea if leshoure will be successful. I hope he is as I sought him out in several drafts. I don't hate k smith but I think mgmt has given a number of signals they aren't satisfied with him.

I can't wait to see how this plays out over the next few weeks.

 

[Run It Up]

Smith has been counted out for 2 years and keeps holding off challengers. I'm holding on til he gets hurt bad or retires. He's easily the most undervalued RB in the league. I mean he's outscoring Alfred Morris in most leagues. STUD!!!

Except he didnt.Best started when healthy. Smith took over and Leshoure and Best havent had a chance to play since.

 

[Bayhawks]

In answer to your questions:

1-You suggest that the Lions have seen enough of Smith to know he's not up to the task. Based on what? The fact that they knew well before the season started that Best and Leshoure wouldn't be available the first 2 weeks, yet did nothing to add a RB?/ They drafted Kevin Smith in 2008. After two years of watching him they used a #1 in 2010 on another RB who took his job. In 2011 they than used a premium second round pick on another RB. Pure speculation but most assumed it was to form a thunder and lighting type of duo. What can't be disputed is once they had these two they cut Kevin Smith. Kevin Smith than sat unemployed. As far as I know only got a tryout with the Dolphins. They only brought him back due to injuries to Leshoure and Best. When the season was over they were in no rush to sign Smith and for that matter no other team was in a rush to sign him either. Meanwhile a guy like Peyton Hillis who was an absolute train wreck last year got a $3million one year deal. Best Smith could get was what I think was the vet minimium one year deal. At that time and during the draft they could not know Leshoure would be suspended the first two games or that Best would still not be medically cleared. Once they found out both of those items the pickings of RB's were slim which is why they entered the season with Smith as their starter. Other than what the Lions have done I also have eyeballs and can see this guy is a middling talent. He's a solid professional but defenses don't fear him and don't respect the running game when he's playing.

You're assuming you know what was happening behind the scenes in Detroit, AND you are conveniently ignoring facts that don't support your argument. Kevin Smith was hurt in 2010, and Best was hampered by injuries, as well. THAT is most likely why they drafted another RB. It makes sense, doesn't it, if both your RBs are hurt, to acquire another one? And, BTW, they didn't cut Smith. His contract was up, and since he was coming off of an injury, they chose not to re-sign (especially since they had two "healthy" RBs on their roster. And you're right they didn't know Best would start on the PUP, or that Leshoure would be suspended, but they DID know in June that Leshoure would be suspended for 2 games, and they placed Best on the PUP on 8/27 (and probably knew he was going there earlier, since he was never cleared for practice). And, despite knowing these things, how many RBs did they bring in? None. As for your eyeballs, I don't think anyone is arguing that Smith is a HOFer, but he fits (very well) the Lions' offense. He is an adequate runner, good pass-blocker, and good receiver. BTW, I have eyeballs too, and they have seen Leshoure look VERY BAD against NFL competition since he blew out his achilles.

2-You also suggest that because they worked out Smith and Grant, that means they are preparing to move on/upgrade from Smith. Perhaps it indicates that they are worried that Best won't be back, or that Leshoure isn't going to be back from his injury enough to help them? Possible but if they had those concerns why wait until now? What happened to make those pressing issues right now? On the other hand they've got to see 2 games out of Smith before deciding to work out these two.

Maybe their has been some information about Best that has them worried? Maybe there has been some information about Leshoure that has them worried. We don't know that his happened, but we don't know that the workouts were b/c they were worried about Smith, yet you choose to believe that is the case, because of your Leshoure bias.

3-You suggest that they are going to give Leshoure every chance. Again, I ask based on what? Their coaches say they want to get him carries. Duh, he's back from suspension, and they haven't seen what he can do; of course they want to get him carries./ Besides Schwartz saying he's excited to see give him the ball I'd add based on 1. Lions beat writer who so far seems pretty reliable saying he thinks Leshoure gets 12-15 carries, 2. Comments from often reliable Chris Mortenson indicating he thinks hes going to get around 12 carries this week- keep in mind on this and point 1 the Lions RB's are only averaging 19 carries a game with Smith getting 16 a game. Unless this beat writer and Mort are just clueless were are Smiths carries coming from? 3. Comments from opposing head coach Mike Munchak who said stopping Leshoure was key to the game but hey maybe he was just trying to motivate Kevin Smith because that makes sense.

I've posted this before, but you have ABSOLUTELY NO IDEA what context those quotes were given. The coaches were asked about Leshoure, and they gave their responses. Munchak's comments were in response to being asked how they were going to prepare for Leshoure without much NFL film to go on. You can interpret that as him saying "Leshoure is great, we're very scared," but that isn't what he said. And (as far as I can find) Schwartz didn't say he was exited to give him the ball, but that "We’ve been waiting to get him on the field for a long time." Those are two very different quotes. As for the Lions beat writer, you say he's reliable, but he's still just guessing. Most SD beat writers said Gates was a go for last week, and until a day or so ago, most GB beat writers were saying Jennings was good for MNF. And Jaws isn't all that reliable when it comes to "scoops," check his record the last few years. Don't you think if the 15 carries was a lock, others would also be reporting it?

You think Leshoure is going to be great, and that's all well and good; but you are, (IMO) letting your Leshoure love cloud your analysis of this situation.This just makes you looks petty. Where did I say Leshoure would be great? What's a shame is people like you in these forums who think every time someone has an opinion about a player it's because they have some fantasy angle for their team. The thought process behind this is so ignorant to me I don't know were to begin. If I like a player or have him on my fantasy team what does it for for me or my team to start offering up one sided sunny opinions about said player? I mean really. Sometimes people just have opinions.

Sorry if I hurt your feelings. If the word "love" causes you to rant like that, however, you have very thin skin. Your "opinions" are very biased, and your analysis often is a result of you assuming facts not in evidence, and those "facts" are always either positive for Leshoure or negative for Smith.

 

[jon_mx]

I think leshoure will be given every chance to succeed but I have no idea if leshoure will be successful. I hope he is as I sought him out in several drafts. I don't hate k smith but I think mgmt has given a number of signals they aren't satisfied with him.I can't wait to see how this plays out over the next few weeks.

The only way K Smith gets more than spot time is if LeShoure stinks up the joint. The job is his if he performs. The Lions are dying for someone with burst. Kevin Smith is adequate, but is not the player they want. Period. Sorry Smith owners.

 

[CrazyFox]

I guess we'll find out more tomorrow. I'm not sure I'd be comfortable starting either of them tomorrow until getting a feel for how things shake out. Hopefully if you're a Smith owner you made a move for Leshoure a couple of weeks ago.

 

[Papa Georgio]

Personally if I could get Smith cheap right now I would do it. I think talking up Leshoure this week is more "gamesmanship" (man I hate that word) than it is anything else. I do think he will be used some but not taking over. Bump this tomorrow if you want when he gets 20 carries but in today's NFL no one tips their hand and everyone likes to use mis-direction so that is all I am basing it on.

65-35 split for Smith is my call but who knows...none of us do.

 

[Run It Up]

Chances are both get hurt tomorrow.

 

[Chazzhawk]

The Lions have loved Leshoure since they traded up to draft him last year, he is going to get every chance to be the lead back. The Lions seen him as their Pierre Thomas/Mark Ingram and Best as their Reggie Bush/Darren Sproles. They may have lost their Sproles but they are going to try to let Leshoure be the other guy.

The Lions also understand what they have in Kevin Smith, a high quality back up. Why a back up you ask? I will tell you why, they know what he can and can't do, he can't take the punishment of being an every down back. They aren't going to ruin him for a second time, like the Giants do with Bradshaw by asking him to take that kind of punishment. The kid is talented, no question about that. He is a hard worker, I have been to a couple of the Lions practices that were open to the public and he works harder than anyone on the field, and not many people get injured and are out of the NFL for a over a year and work hard enough to make it back. The mind is willing the body just isn't able, and the Lions would rather have Kevin Smith there for 16 games and maybe 150 to 200 total touches, than have him for 8 games at 20+ touches a game.

 

[jvdesigns2002]

First of all--when I first posted this topic on the board--I never expected this many responses. To everybody who contributed who has replied to this post--thank you and well done. It is amazing to see both sides of a debate put out there in a civil manner. It's really been great. Now let's get down to business. I do despise the comment that implied that I sounded more like a box score troll than actually a guy who watches the games. I have watched both of the Lions regular season games as well as their preseason games this year. Anybody who has seen the Lions in the regular season would know that their issues so far this year have NOT been with their running game. In the first game, the running game had to be abandoned for a while because Stafford threw 3 int's in the first half. They had to pass their way back into the game--and when they were back in the game--who made the key catch for the clutch touchdown? That would be Kevin Smith. If you watched that game--you would concede that if Stafford hadn't thrown those 3 int's in the first half--Smiths rushing numbers would have been much better. The second match-up came against the 49ers in friso. This is the same frisco defense that put up historic numbers against the rushing game at home last year. I believe they didn't give up a rushing touchdown at home all year. I watched this game--and I was pleasantly surprised with how Kevin Smith looked against that defense. Yes, they gave Bell 6 carries that game-- I guess next time vereen gets a touch that means New england is looking for ridleys replacement. Also, Mike goodson is getting some carries too--so watch your back Darren McFadden. I'm not saying Kevin smith is a stud--but he is an average to above average back on a high scoring team. Yes--I agree--it seems like the Lions are counting on Leshoure panning out--but my issue is this: Why are we to believe that he will pan out? He's coming off of a major achilles injury--injuries that running backs don't historically come back strong from. He has not played a single minute of first team NFL regular season football--and in the closest thing he has played in to that (the preseason)--he was below average at best. My entire point is not that Leshoure can't or won't end up being better than Smith--my point is that isn't it risky to believe that Leshoure is guaranteed to be the guy in Detroit? You are telling me that it's safe to bet on a rookie running back coming off a major achilles injury, who has already had off field issues before playing one single minute in the league, who has underperformed in the only NFL exposure he has had--just because the Lions hope he's the guy. Last year the Cowboys gave Felix Jones the keys to their running game. How did that work out? Yes--Detroit has fired and signed Kevin Smith--I guess that means that every unemployed person in the USA can be grouped into a category that would assume that they would all be below average in any potential job they should get. Kurt Warner should have remained stocking shelves--because after all--NFL teams passed on him to begin with. As a fantasy owner (and I hardly own Kevin Smith--I own him in a couple leagues--and I'm contemplating if I should try to get him in my others)-I look for opportunities to capitalize on people's emotions and "jumping to conclusions" to better my team. Even the Leshoure fans on this debate all agree that Smith will only have decent value if Leshoure does not pan out. My opinion is that everything that I have seen from Leshoure does NOT support him being the savior that the fantasy world is crowning him to be just yet. One of the most savvy things that good fantasy owners look for in a player is high upside at a low cost. If you look at detroits running back situation-- Kevin Smith is the exact definition of low cost with extremely high upside. The alleged guy to own is a rookie coming off of a major achilles injury--and Javid Best is one concussion away from retirement. What is there not to like here?

 

[SameSongNDance]

I think leshoure will be given every chance to succeed but I have no idea if leshoure will be successful. I hope he is as I sought him out in several drafts. I don't hate k smith but I think mgmt has given a number of signals they aren't satisfied with him.

I can't wait to see how this plays out over the next few weeks.

The only way K Smith gets more than spot time is if LeShoure stinks up the joint. The job is his if he performs. The Lions are dying for someone with burst. Kevin Smith is adequate, but is not the player they want. Period. Sorry Smith owners.

Oh this is ironic. What do you think the first and realistically only thing a ruptured Achilles effects? Burst lol.

 

[SteelerMurf]

I noticed last week that Bell got a ton of playing time on first and second down. I just think now with a 3rd back, Smith's going to be relegated to 3rd down back.

 

[SameSongNDance]

I noticed last week that Bell got a ton of playing time on first and second down. I just think now with a 3rd back, Smith's going to be relegated to 3rd down back.

Bell touched the ball 8 times to Smith's 18. That's more than a 2:1 ratio and is not "a ton of playing time on first and second down".

 

[jvdesigns2002]

I noticed last week that Bell got a ton of playing time on first and second down. I just think now with a 3rd back, Smith's going to be relegated to 3rd down back.

A ton of playing time? He had a total of 6 carries. He basically was used as Smith's backup against one of the best rushing defenses in NFL history. I watched that game and Bell didn't do anything to show me why he should cut into Smith's playing time at all. That's just my opinion--not that my opinion counts for much. lol

 

[gsmayes]

the only value any lions RB has is in scoring touchdowns. The Lions can't run the football, and won't be able to as long as Raiola is center. He's undersized and gets manhandled.

 

[SameSongNDance]

the only value any lions RB has is in scoring touchdowns. The Lions can't run the football, and won't be able to as long as Raiola is center. He's undersized and gets manhandled.

This is false. The value that DET RBs hold is in PPR formats. Stafford loves checking down to his RBs, more so than many other QBs.

 

[jon_mx]

I think leshoure will be given every chance to succeed but I have no idea if leshoure will be successful. I hope he is as I sought him out in several drafts. I don't hate k smith but I think mgmt has given a number of signals they aren't satisfied with him.

I can't wait to see how this plays out over the next few weeks.

The only way K Smith gets more than spot time is if LeShoure stinks up the joint. The job is his if he performs. The Lions are dying for someone with burst. Kevin Smith is adequate, but is not the player they want. Period. Sorry Smith owners.

Oh this is ironic. What do you think the first and realistically only thing a ruptured Achilles effects? Burst lol.

Perhaps, but that is what Detroit is looking for. If LeShoure does not have it, they will continue looking. Smith is absolutely not the guy this staff wants running the ball. It has been the team's #1 priority since coming here is to find a back better than Smith.

 

[Banger]

First of all--when I first posted this topic on the board--I never expected this many responses. To everybody who contributed who has replied to this post--thank you and well done. It is amazing to see both sides of a debate put out there in a civil manner. It's really been great. Now let's get down to business. I do despise the comment that implied that I sounded more like a box score troll than actually a guy who watches the games. I have watched both of the Lions regular season games as well as their preseason games this year. Anybody who has seen the Lions in the regular season would know that their issues so far this year have NOT been with their running game. In the first game, the running game had to be abandoned for a while because Stafford threw 3 int's in the first half. They had to pass their way back into the game--and when they were back in the game--who made the key catch for the clutch touchdown? That would be Kevin Smith. If you watched that game--you would concede that if Stafford hadn't thrown those 3 int's in the first half--Smiths rushing numbers would have been much better. The second match-up came against the 49ers in friso. This is the same frisco defense that put up historic numbers against the rushing game at home last year. I believe they didn't give up a rushing touchdown at home all year. I watched this game--and I was pleasantly surprised with how Kevin Smith looked against that defense. Yes, they gave Bell 6 carries that game-- I guess next time vereen gets a touch that means New england is looking for ridleys replacement. Also, Mike goodson is getting some carries too--so watch your back Darren McFadden. I'm not saying Kevin smith is a stud--but he is an average to above average back on a high scoring team. Yes--I agree--it seems like the Lions are counting on Leshoure panning out--but my issue is this: Why are we to believe that he will pan out? He's coming off of a major achilles injury--injuries that running backs don't historically come back strong from. He has not played a single minute of first team NFL regular season football--and in the closest thing he has played in to that (the preseason)--he was below average at best. My entire point is not that Leshoure can't or won't end up being better than Smith--my point is that isn't it risky to believe that Leshoure is guaranteed to be the guy in Detroit? You are telling me that it's safe to bet on a rookie running back coming off a major achilles injury, who has already had off field issues before playing one single minute in the league, who has underperformed in the only NFL exposure he has had--just because the Lions hope he's the guy. Last year the Cowboys gave Felix Jones the keys to their running game. How did that work out? Yes--Detroit has fired and signed Kevin Smith--I guess that means that every unemployed person in the USA can be grouped into a category that would assume that they would all be below average in any potential job they should get. Kurt Warner should have remained stocking shelves--because after all--NFL teams passed on him to begin with. As a fantasy owner (and I hardly own Kevin Smith--I own him in a couple leagues--and I'm contemplating if I should try to get him in my others)-I look for opportunities to capitalize on people's emotions and "jumping to conclusions" to better my team. Even the Leshoure fans on this debate all agree that Smith will only have decent value if Leshoure does not pan out. My opinion is that everything that I have seen from Leshoure does NOT support him being the savior that the fantasy world is crowning him to be just yet. One of the most savvy things that good fantasy owners look for in a player is high upside at a low cost. If you look at detroits running back situation-- Kevin Smith is the exact definition of low cost with extremely high upside. The alleged guy to own is a rookie coming off of a major achilles injury--and Javid Best is one concussion away from retirement. What is there not to like here?

Leshoure is not a safe option. He certainly has risk and did so when drafting him. If he didn't he wouldn't have been drafted in the late rounds of drafts. As time has gone on it seems like the table is shifting toward leshoure and he's becoming a safer option. I disagree that smith is avg or above avg or that the run game hasn't been an issue. If you listen to the coaching staff over the last week they've clearly stated that the run game and their ability to move the chains and break tackles is an issue. Teams have been playing back and daring them to run and the staff feels they haven't done it successfully. Smith is near the bottom in the league in breaking tackles and getting yards on his own. Coincidentally, those are attributes the staff has brought up several times when speaking of leshoure. A big part of football is opportunity and having the staff on your side. What you think, what I think about player x is completely irrelevant, what the staff thinks is HUGELY relevant. Read the clips over the last week. Has there been any talk of smith being the guy, that they are happy with him, anything? All the talk has been about how leshoure will be heavily involved, they'll give him all he can handle, his type of running is what they've been missing, etc.. Now all leshoure needs to do is run well which is easier said than done.

 

[Chazzhawk]

First of all--when I first posted this topic on the board--I never expected this many responses. To everybody who contributed who has replied to this post--thank you and well done. It is amazing to see both sides of a debate put out there in a civil manner. It's really been great. Now let's get down to business. I do despise the comment that implied that I sounded more like a box score troll than actually a guy who watches the games. I have watched both of the Lions regular season games as well as their preseason games this year. Anybody who has seen the Lions in the regular season would know that their issues so far this year have NOT been with their running game. In the first game, the running game had to be abandoned for a while because Stafford threw 3 int's in the first half. They had to pass their way back into the game--and when they were back in the game--who made the key catch for the clutch touchdown? That would be Kevin Smith. If you watched that game--you would concede that if Stafford hadn't thrown those 3 int's in the first half--Smiths rushing numbers would have been much better. The second match-up came against the 49ers in friso. This is the same frisco defense that put up historic numbers against the rushing game at home last year. I believe they didn't give up a rushing touchdown at home all year. I watched this game--and I was pleasantly surprised with how Kevin Smith looked against that defense. Yes, they gave Bell 6 carries that game-- I guess next time vereen gets a touch that means New england is looking for ridleys replacement. Also, Mike goodson is getting some carries too--so watch your back Darren McFadden. I'm not saying Kevin smith is a stud--but he is an average to above average back on a high scoring team. Yes--I agree--it seems like the Lions are counting on Leshoure panning out--but my issue is this: Why are we to believe that he will pan out? He's coming off of a major achilles injury--injuries that running backs don't historically come back strong from. He has not played a single minute of first team NFL regular season football--and in the closest thing he has played in to that (the preseason)--he was below average at best. My entire point is not that Leshoure can't or won't end up being better than Smith--my point is that isn't it risky to believe that Leshoure is guaranteed to be the guy in Detroit? You are telling me that it's safe to bet on a rookie running back coming off a major achilles injury, who has already had off field issues before playing one single minute in the league, who has underperformed in the only NFL exposure he has had--just because the Lions hope he's the guy. Last year the Cowboys gave Felix Jones the keys to their running game. How did that work out? Yes--Detroit has fired and signed Kevin Smith--I guess that means that every unemployed person in the USA can be grouped into a category that would assume that they would all be below average in any potential job they should get. Kurt Warner should have remained stocking shelves--because after all--NFL teams passed on him to begin with. As a fantasy owner (and I hardly own Kevin Smith--I own him in a couple leagues--and I'm contemplating if I should try to get him in my others)-I look for opportunities to capitalize on people's emotions and "jumping to conclusions" to better my team. Even the Leshoure fans on this debate all agree that Smith will only have decent value if Leshoure does not pan out. My opinion is that everything that I have seen from Leshoure does NOT support him being the savior that the fantasy world is crowning him to be just yet. One of the most savvy things that good fantasy owners look for in a player is high upside at a low cost. If you look at detroits running back situation-- Kevin Smith is the exact definition of low cost with extremely high upside. The alleged guy to own is a rookie coming off of a major achilles injury--and Javid Best is one concussion away from retirement. What is there not to like here?

Leshoure is not a safe option. He certainly has risk and did so when drafting him. If he didn't he wouldn't have been drafted in the late rounds of drafts. As time has gone on it seems like the table is shifting toward leshoure and he's becoming a safer option. I disagree that smith is avg or above avg or that the run game hasn't been an issue. If you listen to the coaching staff over the last week they've clearly stated that the run game and their ability to move the chains and break tackles is an issue. Teams have been playing back and daring them to run and the staff feels they haven't done it successfully. Smith is near the bottom in the league in breaking tackles and getting yards on his own. Coincidentally, those are attributes the staff has brought up several times when speaking of leshoure. A big part of football is opportunity and having the staff on your side. What you think, what I think about player x is completely irrelevant, what the staff thinks is HUGELY relevant. Read the clips over the last week. Has there been any talk of smith being the guy, that they are happy with him, anything? All the talk has been about how leshoure will be heavily involved, they'll give him all he can handle, his type of running is what they've been missing, etc.. Now all leshoure needs to do is run well which is easier said than done.

Are you saying late pick in fantasy or NFL, because he is was a second round pick in the NFL.

 

[wsig]

Jvdesigns, saying that the running game hasn't been the problem is a half-truth. It hasn't been a problem or a strength or anything other than an after-thought really. To both the Lions and opposing defenses. The Lions picked up right where they left off last year it seems. They were 28th in yards and 31st in attempts last year, and 26th in yards and 27th in attempts this year I believe. Regardless of accuracy, they are a bottom team in rushing attempts and yards. I think anyone among them would want a chance at a spark, ala Arizona or GB. Whether Leshoure can be that is anywhere from debatable to doubtful, but it would be downright crazy to think they are in some way content with the current state of their running game.

Also, the Warner comparison is a little off. Warner burst onto the scene with the Rams and never looked back. Smith was a starter for Detroit, then completely out of the NFL years later. I don't agree with the idea that NFL teams are infallible, and so Smith must be garbage. But I don't think it's the same as an unknown commodity who was passed over and eventually got a shot and blew up. You could compare him to Cruz, which I think is equally inaccurate. Mike Williams' career path is much more comparable. I do think the lack of faith in Smith by the Lions' lack of faith or Smith's lack of job security. He's a stop-gap. Leshoure could be more, or he could be less. No one knows. But I do know that if Smith stays as the feature back in Detroit, they're likely to remain a bottom ranked rushing team. The opportunity, from a strictly rushing standpoint, appears to be there. From a non-fantasy standpoint, Detroit is in a bad spot. Their most talented backs have huge health question marks. Their healthy RBs, meanwhile, have big talent concerns. Smith seems like a good change of pace back, very solid all-around. But from a rushing standpoint, there's few guys I'd want to face more than Smith. If my team could face a Smith-led backfield 16 times a year, I'd be all for that.

 

[Banger]

First of all--when I first posted this topic on the board--I never expected this many responses. To everybody who contributed who has replied to this post--thank you and well done. It is amazing to see both sides of a debate put out there in a civil manner. It's really been great. Now let's get down to business. I do despise the comment that implied that I sounded more like a box score troll than actually a guy who watches the games. I have watched both of the Lions regular season games as well as their preseason games this year. Anybody who has seen the Lions in the regular season would know that their issues so far this year have NOT been with their running game. In the first game, the running game had to be abandoned for a while because Stafford threw 3 int's in the first half. They had to pass their way back into the game--and when they were back in the game--who made the key catch for the clutch touchdown? That would be Kevin Smith. If you watched that game--you would concede that if Stafford hadn't thrown those 3 int's in the first half--Smiths rushing numbers would have been much better. The second match-up came against the 49ers in friso. This is the same frisco defense that put up historic numbers against the rushing game at home last year. I believe they didn't give up a rushing touchdown at home all year. I watched this game--and I was pleasantly surprised with how Kevin Smith looked against that defense. Yes, they gave Bell 6 carries that game-- I guess next time vereen gets a touch that means New england is looking for ridleys replacement. Also, Mike goodson is getting some carries too--so watch your back Darren McFadden. I'm not saying Kevin smith is a stud--but he is an average to above average back on a high scoring team. Yes--I agree--it seems like the Lions are counting on Leshoure panning out--but my issue is this: Why are we to believe that he will pan out? He's coming off of a major achilles injury--injuries that running backs don't historically come back strong from. He has not played a single minute of first team NFL regular season football--and in the closest thing he has played in to that (the preseason)--he was below average at best. My entire point is not that Leshoure can't or won't end up being better than Smith--my point is that isn't it risky to believe that Leshoure is guaranteed to be the guy in Detroit? You are telling me that it's safe to bet on a rookie running back coming off a major achilles injury, who has already had off field issues before playing one single minute in the league, who has underperformed in the only NFL exposure he has had--just because the Lions hope he's the guy. Last year the Cowboys gave Felix Jones the keys to their running game. How did that work out? Yes--Detroit has fired and signed Kevin Smith--I guess that means that every unemployed person in the USA can be grouped into a category that would assume that they would all be below average in any potential job they should get. Kurt Warner should have remained stocking shelves--because after all--NFL teams passed on him to begin with. As a fantasy owner (and I hardly own Kevin Smith--I own him in a couple leagues--and I'm contemplating if I should try to get him in my others)-I look for opportunities to capitalize on people's emotions and "jumping to conclusions" to better my team. Even the Leshoure fans on this debate all agree that Smith will only have decent value if Leshoure does not pan out. My opinion is that everything that I have seen from Leshoure does NOT support him being the savior that the fantasy world is crowning him to be just yet. One of the most savvy things that good fantasy owners look for in a player is high upside at a low cost. If you look at detroits running back situation-- Kevin Smith is the exact definition of low cost with extremely high upside. The alleged guy to own is a rookie coming off of a major achilles injury--and Javid Best is one concussion away from retirement. What is there not to like here?

Leshoure is not a safe option. He certainly has risk and did so when drafting him. If he didn't he wouldn't have been drafted in the late rounds of drafts. As time has gone on it seems like the table is shifting toward leshoure and he's becoming a safer option. I disagree that smith is avg or above avg or that the run game hasn't been an issue. If you listen to the coaching staff over the last week they've clearly stated that the run game and their ability to move the chains and break tackles is an issue. Teams have been playing back and daring them to run and the staff feels they haven't done it successfully. Smith is near the bottom in the league in breaking tackles and getting yards on his own. Coincidentally, those are attributes the staff has brought up several times when speaking of leshoure. A big part of football is opportunity and having the staff on your side. What you think, what I think about player x is completely irrelevant, what the staff thinks is HUGELY relevant. Read the clips over the last week. Has there been any talk of smith being the guy, that they are happy with him, anything? All the talk has been about how leshoure will be heavily involved, they'll give him all he can handle, his type of running is what they've been missing, etc.. Now all leshoure needs to do is run well which is easier said than done.

Are you saying late pick in fantasy or NFL, because he is was a second round pick in the NFL.

Fantasy. They loved him and moved up to get him.

 

[Yenrub]

I see a lot of post referencing the Lions cutting Kevin Smith

I’m not a Lions fan so I don’t know this for sure but I was under the impression that Smith was cut because of injury and not because of lack of talent. Can any Lions fans let us know if that was the case.