LT takes a pay cut...what if the Jets can't run the ball this year (1 Viewer)

[Ministry of Pain]

Tomlinson took a pay cut and it seems the Jets are content to roll with Green as their RB1. I am not as optimistic about Green just like I wasn't high on him last year. I think he is OK but noting special.

Bigger question for me...what if they can't run the football? Things were not that great last year but what if Sanchez has to throw the ball lot for them to compete...what happens then?

 

[Ministry of Pain]

Sanchez threw it 507 times last year...OK what if he has to trow it 550+ times?

 

[Mister CIA]

I think you are wrong about Shonn Greene. Maybe he's not that special, but I think he's good for 1200-1400 yards and 8 TDs minimum. Throw in 150-200 touches to be split between LT and Powell and I don't think the Jets' running game ranks high on anyone's list of concerns.

 

[Ministry of Pain]

I think you are wrong about Shonn Greene. Maybe he's not that special, but I think he's good for 1200-1400 yards and 8 TDs minimum. Throw in 150-200 touches to be split between LT and Powell and I don't think the Jets' running game ranks high on anyone's list of concerns.

Hi CIA, what's changed from 2010 to 2011 for Greene?

 

[Mister CIA]

Time marches on. LT is 32; Greene is going on 26 and entering his third season; Powell is a rookie.

ETA: Greene averaged 5.0 ypc as a rookie and 4.1 as a sophomore. I think 4.1 is his floor. I'll ask you, what changed between 2009 and 2010? My answer, LT looked like a spring chicken the first half of the season in 2010.

 

[Ministry of Pain]

Time marches on. LT is 32; Greene is going on 26 and entering his third season; Powell is a rookie.ETA: Greene averaged 5.0 ypc as a rookie and 4.1 as a sophomore. I think 4.1 is his floor. I'll ask you, what changed between 2009 and 2010? My answer, LT looked like a spring chicken the first half of the season in 2010.

OK, I'll buy the LT was good the 1st half of the season but what about once it was obvious that LT needs to be limited no matter how great he looks in limited touches? But your 1st point is something I am learning the hard way and I call it the ole process of elimination...player A is injured, player B stinks, so Player C has to do well...unfortunately that theory does not mean the last man standing is alwas a good option. You said he isn't that special so I'm certainly not ging to fire back across for that. Good stuff, ty

 

[baconisgood]

As long as the Jets have a solid O-line their running game will be OK.

 

[jon_mx]

I think you are wrong about Shonn Greene. Maybe he's not that special, but I think he's good for 1200-1400 yards and 8 TDs minimum. Throw in 150-200 touches to be split between LT and Powell and I don't think the Jets' running game ranks high on anyone's list of concerns.

So Greene's floor is a top 10 performance? I am skeptical. If he gets 1000 yards he will have had a good year.

 

[Mister CIA]

Time marches on. LT is 32; Greene is going on 26 and entering his third season; Powell is a rookie.ETA: Greene averaged 5.0 ypc as a rookie and 4.1 as a sophomore. I think 4.1 is his floor. I'll ask you, what changed between 2009 and 2010? My answer, LT looked like a spring chicken the first half of the season in 2010.

OK, I'll buy the LT was good the 1st half of the season but what about once it was obvious that LT needs to be limited no matter how great he looks in limited touches? But your 1st point is something I am learning the hard way and I call it the ole process of elimination...player A is injured, player B stinks, so Player C has to do well...unfortunately that theory does not mean the last man standing is alwas a good option. You said he isn't that special so I'm certainly not ging to fire back across for that. Good stuff, ty

As a casual observer I'm hard pressed to describe the Jets 2010 offense with any term but "growing pains." Sanchez = sophomore QB; Holmes misses first four games; coaching staff puts Greene on back burner while LT is tearing it up first half of the season. If I'm coaching the offense, I start Greene out with a bang and sunset LT, hoping he is fresh for playoffs.Bottom line is I think Greene's stats will increase in proportion with the maturity gains of the coaching staff and Sanchez's game.

 

[sjdogs]

Some backs need 20 carries a game to excel. Greene looked strong second half of games which he played as rookie, i think. Im interested to see what he can do and believe it will

Impress

 

[Dr. Awesome]

Why wouldn't they be able to run the football?

 

[Captain Hook]

Bilal Powell to the white courtesy telephone.......

 

[sihaokills]

I think you are wrong about Shonn Greene. Maybe he's not that special, but I think he's good for 1200-1400 yards and 8 TDs minimum. Throw in 150-200 touches to be split between LT and Powell and I don't think the Jets' running game ranks high on anyone's list of concerns.

That's a little overrated

 

[Ministry of Pain]

Why wouldn't they be able to run the football?

Good question. LT diminishing stamina for an entire season, Greene not always delivering, and a lot of vets on defense that won't tolerate the offense not producing at least 20 points a game.I'm asking the question, what if the Jets struggle to run the football? In Pittsburgh they can lean on Ben.

 

[Mister CIA]

I think you are wrong about Shonn Greene. Maybe he's not that special, but I think he's good for 1200-1400 yards and 8 TDs minimum. Throw in 150-200 touches to be split between LT and Powell and I don't think the Jets' running game ranks high on anyone's list of concerns.

That's a little overrated

I think I understate the situation. Last year, very few people wanted to jump on the LeSean McCoy bandwagon despite the handwriting on the wall. Same thing, next year. The only downside to Greene is that he has not proven himself as a receiver out of the backfield (hence the low 1200-1400, 8 TD projection). Shonn Greene is a legit starting NFL running back on a top-shelf team built to run the ball and should contend to be a top 10 FF RB. I'm all ears if somebody has a convincing argument otherwise.

 

[We Tigers]

If they do have trouble running, I expect Keller to get rolled into the offense much more significantly. Same for Cotchery. With Cotchery and Keller, they have two players who are solid 8-12 yard possession receivers. More 3-wide sets, more LT in just to block. If the Jets get stymied (which I don't expect to happen--it's still a very good line and I'm higher on Greene than MOP), Sanchez can dink it and dunk it well enough to let the defense keep them in games. An effective running game is probably the difference between playoffs and not, though, as this is still a bottom-third-of-the-league passing offense.

 

[Ministry of Pain]

If they do have trouble running, I expect Keller to get rolled into the offense much more significantly. Same for Cotchery. With Cotchery and Keller, they have two players who are solid 8-12 yard possession receivers. More 3-wide sets, more LT in just to block. If the Jets get stymied (which I don't expect to happen--it's still a very good line and I'm higher on Greene than MOP), Sanchez can dink it and dunk it well enough to let the defense keep them in games. An effective running game is probably the difference between playoffs and not, though, as this is still a bottom-third-of-the-league passing offense.

Some really good stuff in there, ty

 

[offdee]

Bilal Powell to the white courtesy telephone.......

Joe McKnight time.

 

[njherdfan]

The Jets will be able to run the ball because they have one of the best OL in the game. LT wasn't particularly explosive last year, and Shonn Greene fell to the third round, but as long as your line is consistently opening holes there's no reason to think that the Jets won't have success on the ground.

 

[smackdaddies]

Hard to have a great run game when your QB has such a marginal arm.

 

[Ghost Rider]

Hard to have a great run game when your QB has such a marginal arm.

Then how do you explain the Jets leading the league in rushing in 2009, Sanchez's rookie season?

 

[Ministry of Pain]

Hard to have a great run game when your QB has such a marginal arm.

Then how do you explain the Jets leading the league in rushing in 2009, Sanchez's rookie season?

That OL had Alan Faneca(Pro Bowl 2009) and Damien Woody run blocking like there was no tomorrow. I'm not sure I put the Jets OL as a shoe in for top5 this year.

 

[Ghost Rider]

Hard to have a great run game when your QB has such a marginal arm.

Then how do you explain the Jets leading the league in rushing in 2009, Sanchez's rookie season?

That OL had Alan Faneca(Pro Bowl 2009) and Damien Woody run blocking like there was no tomorrow. I'm not sure I put the Jets OL as a shoe in for top5 this year.

That's fine, but this idea that you can't have a great running game with a QB with a marginal arm (or one who is average) is nonsense. The top 4 rushing attacks in the NFL last year were teams that had QBs who were Matt Cassel, Jason Campbell, David Garrard and Mark Sanchez. Need I say more? The Jets running game will be fine.

 

[njherdfan]

Hard to have a great run game when your QB has such a marginal arm.

Then how do you explain the Jets leading the league in rushing in 2009, Sanchez's rookie season?

That OL had Alan Faneca(Pro Bowl 2009) and Damien Woody run blocking like there was no tomorrow. I'm not sure I put the Jets OL as a shoe in for top5 this year.

Alan Faneca was terrible that year, which is why the Jets released him right after and he retired one year later. Woody was an excellent player but Hunter stepped in with no major ill-effects last year. Not too mention, the leading rushers for the Jets the past 2 years were both over 30. Having someone with any semblance of explosiveness will more than offset any downgrade in the Woody --> Hunter transaction.

 

[smackdaddies]

Hard to have a great run game when your QB has such a marginal arm.

Then how do you explain the Jets leading the league in rushing in 2009, Sanchez's rookie season?

Thomas Jones, shonn greenes rookie year, better O line. Teams also now know how to game plan for Sanchez better.

 

[Ministry of Pain]

Hard to have a great run game when your QB has such a marginal arm.

Then how do you explain the Jets leading the league in rushing in 2009, Sanchez's rookie season?

That OL had Alan Faneca(Pro Bowl 2009) and Damien Woody run blocking like there was no tomorrow. I'm not sure I put the Jets OL as a shoe in for top5 this year.

Alan Faneca was terrible that year, which is why the Jets released him right after and he retired one year later. Woody was an excellent player but Hunter stepped in with no major ill-effects last year. Not too mention, the leading rushers for the Jets the past 2 years were both over 30. Having someone with any semblance of explosiveness will more than offset any downgrade in the Woody --> Hunter transaction.

I was gonna post because I knew someone would try and frame it that way. Faneca was not a liability in the running game, in fact he was a beast. He was a liability at pass blocking and was called a turnstile in pass protection. I know there will be Jets fans and posters here that will back that and also I think if you look at FFocus where they rank the OL individually over the past 4 years that the statement I made pans out. I do appreciate what you are saying but Faneca was no slouch in run blocking in 2009.

 

[Mark Wimer]

Let's take a look at the Jet's rushing offense since Sanchez took over as QB:

2009: First in the NFL in rushing with 2,756 yards, third in TDs with 21

2010: Fourth in the NFL in rushing with 2,374 yards rushing, ninth in rushing TDs with 14

Bottom line - the Jets field a top-ten rushing attack since Sanchez has arrived, despite the fantasy dropoff in rushing TDs from 21 to 14.

This is a run-first team. They have a respectable core of receivers with Holmes, Burress (if he can still play), Jerricho Cotchery and Keller at TE. Oh, and they have one of the best TD scoring RBs in the history of the league in Tomlinson (159 total TDs over 10 seasons!). Greene is surrounded by talent at the other skill positions, and mentored by one of the best, ever.

I'm not afraid to draft Greene as a mid-RB2-range RB, and he has upside potential from there. If the Jets aren't a top-ten rushing team this year, I'll be shocked.

 

[Dr. Awesome]

Why wouldn't they be able to run the football?

Good question. LT diminishing stamina for an entire season, Greene not always delivering, and a lot of vets on defense that won't tolerate the offense not producing at least 20 points a game.I'm asking the question, what if the Jets struggle to run the football? In Pittsburgh they can lean on Ben.

They still have a good o-line and a coach who seems bent on running. Plus a great defense and I really can't imagine they won't be able to run. What if the Colts can't pass the ball this year?

 

[TLEF316]

Faneca's run blocking in 09-10 was very good.

But Slausen, to my surprise, was no slouch in that department last year. He's no Faneca, but he's far from a liability (especially since he's playing between two in-their-prime pro-bowlers). The loss of Woody hurts, but Hunter played well in the playoffs and Ducasse still has massive potential in the run game. (was obviously a project when they drafted him)

Sanchez does not have "marginal arm". He can make all the throws.(not saying he's favre, but he has a strong arm) Good thrower on the run as well. His weakness has been turnovers, where he improved a lot last season (1 fumble lost as opposed to 3, 7 fewer INT's despite 143 more attempts)

I'm not sure Greene has the talent to be a 1400 yard bell cow type of back. But to be honest, I don't really care about that. I think his ceiling (barring injury to he or LT)is ~1000 yards and 8-9 TD's. Solid RB2. I think those numbers are very attainable

 

[Ministry of Pain]

Faneca's run blocking in 09-10 was very good.But Slausen, to my surprise, was no slouch in that department last year. He's no Faneca, but he's far from a liability (especially since he's playing between two in-their-prime pro-bowlers). The loss of Woody hurts, but Hunter played well in the playoffs and Ducasse still has massive potential in the run game. (was obviously a project when they drafted him)Sanchez does not have "marginal arm". He can make all the throws.(not saying he's favre, but he has a strong arm) Good thrower on the run as well. His weakness has been turnovers, where he improved a lot last season (1 fumble lost as opposed to 3, 7 fewer INT's despite 143 more attempts)I'm not sure Greene has the talent to be a 1400 yard bell cow type of back. But to be honest, I don't really care about that. I think his ceiling (barring injury to he or LT)is ~1000 yards and 8-9 TD's. Solid RB2. I think those numbers are very attainable

Nice TLEF

 

[Reaper]

Let's take a look at the Jet's rushing offense since Sanchez took over as QB:

2009: First in the NFL in rushing with 2,756 yards, third in TDs with 21

2010: Fourth in the NFL in rushing with 2,374 yards rushing, ninth in rushing TDs with 14

Bottom line - the Jets field a top-ten rushing attack since Sanchez has arrived, despite the fantasy dropoff in rushing TDs from 21 to 14.

This is a run-first team. They have a respectable core of receivers with Holmes, Burress (if he can still play), Jerricho Cotchery and Keller at TE. Oh, and they have one of the best TD scoring RBs in the history of the league in Tomlinson (159 total TDs over 10 seasons!). Greene is surrounded by talent at the other skill positions, and mentored by one of the best, ever.

I'm not afraid to draft Greene as a mid-RB2-range RB, and he has upside potential from there. If the Jets aren't a top-ten rushing team this year, I'll be shocked.

The only way IMO, I come back to this thread with my head down is if Mangold or Brick go down for significant time....

Tough to replace a Center like Mangold and keep things churning.

If everyone on the OL is healthy, I think they continue their success..

Bill Callahan is one of the best OL coaches in the league and they have decent depth now, I also have a feeling Woody might be waiting in the wings just in case something does happen and they need him.

 

[Ministry of Pain]

Just 1 week but as I thought, Shonn Greene is a disaster again. Maybe the OLine is not as good as we thought but LT was finding some room at times to run.

Jetsfans, you all won the game but what is your impression of the running game now?

 

[renesauz]

Just 1 week but as I thought, Shonn Greene is a disaster again. Maybe the OLine is not as good as we thought but LT was finding some room at times to run. Jetsfans, you all won the game but what is your impression of the running game now?

What game did you watch? LT went for all of 16 yards on 5 carries. Greene 26 on 10. It wasn't Greene...it was the complete lack of anything remotely resembling a push from the Jets O-line. Late in the game Greene had his FIRST cary of the game where he didn't get met face up by at least two defenders at or behind the LOS, and he busted through a tiny crease for a nice 6 yard gain.Greene may NOT be a good RB, but he's not a bad one either. Average Rbs need SOME semblance of blocking, and he didnt get it last night.

 

[Ministry of Pain]

Just 1 week but as I thought, Shonn Greene is a disaster again. Maybe the OLine is not as good as we thought but LT was finding some room at times to run. Jetsfans, you all won the game but what is your impression of the running game now?

What game did you watch? LT went for all of 16 yards on 5 carries. Greene 26 on 10. It wasn't Greene...it was the complete lack of anything remotely resembling a push from the Jets O-line. Late in the game Greene had his FIRST cary of the game where he didn't get met face up by at least two defenders at or behind the LOS, and he busted through a tiny crease for a nice 6 yard gain.Greene may NOT be a good RB, but he's not a bad one either. Average Rbs need SOME semblance of blocking, and he didnt get it last night.

You're right Rene, I am thinking of all the receptions LT had and also his big pep talk in the locker room after the game as he looked like the leader. NFLN was showing that today so I had the impression he was a lot better on the ground. Still, Greene didn't look good and the OL is not a good as many thought at run blocking.

 

[renesauz]

Just 1 week but as I thought, Shonn Greene is a disaster again. Maybe the OLine is not as good as we thought but LT was finding some room at times to run. Jetsfans, you all won the game but what is your impression of the running game now?

What game did you watch? LT went for all of 16 yards on 5 carries. Greene 26 on 10. It wasn't Greene...it was the complete lack of anything remotely resembling a push from the Jets O-line. Late in the game Greene had his FIRST cary of the game where he didn't get met face up by at least two defenders at or behind the LOS, and he busted through a tiny crease for a nice 6 yard gain.Greene may NOT be a good RB, but he's not a bad one either. Average Rbs need SOME semblance of blocking, and he didnt get it last night.

You're right Rene, I am thinking of all the receptions LT had and also his big pep talk in the locker room after the game as he looked like the leader. NFLN was showing that today so I had the impression he was a lot better on the ground. Still, Greene didn't look good and the OL is not a good as many thought at run blocking.

No biggie. Anyone expecting big numbers for Greene is going to be dissapointed, but I do think he's an OK NFL RB. He doesn't have much wiggle but he does have a little bit of power and consistantly falls forward. Classic 4.0 ypc RB once they get that line to gel a little. His PPR upside is very limited as LT is a much better reciever out of the backfield, but Greene should prove to be an adequate flex or even low end RB2 (in non-ppr) this year. The line will have much better days, as their whole gamplan revolved around attacking an injury riddled Cowboys secondary.It really depends on what you expect...kinda like the "Reggie Bush is a bust" talk...it really depnds on what you expected and what you define as a bust.

 

[Ministry of Pain]

They still haven't gotten this running game figured out. I know Mangold is out but its bigger than just that.

 

[Banger]

The lines not as good but Greene's not helping.

 

[TLEF316]

absolute disaster of a team. They've totally lost it.

 

[Ministry of Pain]

absolute disaster of a team. They've totally lost it.

2-2 after this game, @NE next week, then Miami off a bye week, SD after that...4-3 at that point maybe? Schedule is softer the 2nd half of the season depending on your POV, but what good is it if they don't win the division and not have to go on the road for 3 weeks in the playoffs?

 

[TLEF316]

absolute disaster of a team. They've totally lost it.

2-2 after this game, @NE next week, then Miami off a bye week, SD after that...4-3 at that point maybe? Schedule is softer the 2nd half of the season depending on your POV, but what good is it if they don't win the division and not have to go on the road for 3 weeks in the playoffs?

It doesn't matter at this point. They can't run the ball and Sanchez has regressed. Had Romo not #### his pants 3 weeks ago, we'd be staring 1-4 right in the face after the inevitable beatdown by Brady nexy week. The Jets are not going to make the playoffs.

 

[SlevinKelevra]

David Clowney on twitter

What's sad is I swear I'm sitting here calling out plays before they run them and I haven't been with the #Jets in a year come tomorrow

lol

 

[rickyg]

Can anyone say bilal Powell?

 

[JuSt CuZ]

Mark Sanchez is one of, if not the worse, starting QB in the NFL. You are not gonna run if your passing game scares no one.

 

[RhymesMcJuice]

Can anyone say bilal Powell?

Should've been the starter week one.

 

[Kree]

Thought Powell looked terrible in preseason reps. Looked like he was always running through mud. Albeit it was preseason and if Greene keeps it up he might be able to work in some reps, but I doubt he would do any better at the moment, especially with the oline looking decidedly average.

 

[JuSt CuZ]

Can anyone say bilal Powell?

Should've been the starter week one.

lol, ok.So he can be the one who looks bad because of Sanchez and that OLine? The running game is the least of the Jets worries. They need to come to terms with the fact that Sanchez is not a good QB.

 

[Ministry of Pain]

Can anyone say bilal Powell?

Inactive

 

[JuSt CuZ]

David Clowney on twitter

What's sad is I swear I'm sitting here calling out plays before they run them and I haven't been with the #Jets in a year come tomorrow

lol

They are pretty predictable.

 

[Tanner9919]

Mark Sanchez is one of, if not the worse, starting QB in the NFL. You are not gonna run if your passing game scares no one.

you obviously have no idea what you're talking about, and it's painfully obvious: you watch little or no football..quick: give me the names of any QB in the history of the NFL to win MORE road playoff games than Mark Sanchez..

also, give me the names of any rookie QB to start his career 3-0.

summing up the playoff victory @ NE last season:

Wikipedia:

With the win, Sanchez tied Len Dawson, Roger Staubach, Jake Delhomme, and Joe Flacco for most post-season road victories by a quarterback in NFL history..

I know Delhomme is on the list, but curiously, I do not see Peyton Manning, Dan Marino, Elway, Young, Montana..

and he's just a third-year starter..

do you realize just how hard it is to win road playoff games?!

give the Jets time, the line needs to get healthy ( see Pittsburgh,they're in the same boat).

also, wait for 2012 when the Jets find themselves a new OC, after firing Shottenheimer..

come on now, you think this is all Sanchez' fault?!

 

[Ministry of Pain]

Mark Sanchez is one of, if not the worse, starting QB in the NFL. You are not gonna run if your passing game scares no one.

you obviously have no idea what you're talking about, and it's painfully obvious: you watch little or no football..quick: give me the names of any QB in the history of the NFL to win MORE road playoff games than Mark Sanchez..

also, give me the names of any rookie QB to start his career 3-0.

summing up the playoff victory @ NE last season:

Wikipedia:

With the win, Sanchez tied Len Dawson, Roger Staubach, Jake Delhomme, and Joe Flacco for most post-season road victories by a quarterback in NFL history..

I know Delhomme is on the list, but curiously, I do not see Peyton Manning, Dan Marino, Elway, Young, Montana..

and he's just a third-year starter..

do you realize just how hard it is to win road playoff games?!

give the Jets time, the line needs to get healthy ( see Pittsburgh,they're in the same boat).

also, wait for 2012 when the Jets find themselves a new OC, after firing Shottenheimer..

come on now, you think this is all Sanchez' fault?!

Tanner when you see Ed Reed at the LOS it ain't for run support my friend. Then he turns his back on him, of course he's going to come and strip the ball, THAT'S WHAT HE DOES!!! Sanchez needs to have more awareness than that. What do road playoff wins have to do with him having a terrible game last night? He wasn't alone, Flacco blew chunks too but Sanchez is not to be trusted. I have a thread asking what happens is Sanchez has to throw the ball a lot because I anticipated problems in the running game. They are in serious trouble right now with NE, Mia, and SD the next 3 weeks, maybe they get to 4-3. but they are going to fall off and be a wildcard team at best again. It's very hard to win 3 playoff road games to get to the Super Bowl.

I'm not siding with JC, but Sanchez deserves criticism.