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Majority of Public School Kids are Low Income (1 Viewer)

Clifford

Footballguy
http://www.southerneducation.org/Our-Strategies/Research-and-Publications/New-Majority-Diverse-Majority-Report-Series/A-New-Majority-2015-Update-Low-Income-Students-Now

Really sad statistic on state of our public schools. Report does not go into demographics but the Southern and western states are affected the most. I can't help but wonder how much of this is being driven by immigration. Other side to the coin is obviously white flight from public schools to private.

Obviously Obama made a strong case for a populist agenda last night and education is likely to be the primary focus.

 
http://marginalrevolution.com/marginalrevolution/2015/01/no-a-majority-of-us-public-school-students-are-not-in-poverty.html?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+marginalrevolution%2Ffeed+%28Marginal+Revolution%29

No, A Majority of US Public School Students are Not In Poverty

by Alex Tabarrok on January 17, 2015 at 10:49 am in Economics, Education | Permalink

In widely reported article the Washington Post says a Majority of U.S. public school students are in poverty. The article cites the Southern Education Foundation:

The Southern Education Foundation reports that 51 percent of students in pre-kindergarten through 12th grade in the 2012-2013 school year were eligible for the federal program that provides free and reduced-price lunches.

Eligibility for free and reduced-price lunches, however, depends on eligibility rules and not just income levels let alone poverty rates. The New York Times article on the study is much better:

Children who are eligible for such lunches do not necessarily live in poverty. Subsidized lunches are available to children from families that earn up to $43,568, for a family of four, which is about 185 percent of the federal poverty level.

The number of children eligible for subsidized lunches has probably increased in part because the federal Agriculture Department now allows schools with a majority of low-income students to offer free lunches to all students, regardless of whether they qualify on an individual basis or not.

Frankly I suspect that this study was intended to confuse the media by conflating “low-income” with “below the poverty line”. Indeed, why did this study grab headlines except for the greater than 50% statistic? It is very easy to find official numbers of the number of students in poverty according to the federal poverty standard. Here is what the National Center for Education Statistics says about school-age children and poverty (most recent data):

In 2012, approximately 21 percent of school-age children in the United States were in families living in poverty.

The number of school-age children living in poverty today is relatively high and not surprisingly did increase with the 2008 recession and its aftermath (green line in figure below – the numbers here differ slightly from NCES but the time line is longer). But recent numbers do not look like especially remarkable compared to the history.

It’s certainly worthwhile discussing why poverty has increased. The economy is one possible reason as are issues to do with family formation and marriage rates. Another possibility is immigration. A higher poverty rate caused by the immigration of more low-income children is compatible with everyone becoming better off over time and not necessarily a bad thing. Those are just a few possible topics worthy of investigation. I don’t claim that any of them are correct.

I do claim, however, that we won’t get very far understanding the issue by shifting definitions and muddying the waters with misleading but attention grabbing statistics.

 
Clifford said:
http://www.southerneducation.org/Our-Strategies/Research-and-Publications/New-Majority-Diverse-Majority-Report-Series/A-New-Majority-2015-Update-Low-Income-Students-Now

Really sad statistic on state of our public schools. Report does not go into demographics but the Southern and western states are affected the most. I can't help but wonder how much of this is being driven by immigration. Other side to the coin is obviously white flight from public schools to private.

Obviously Obama made a strong case for a populist agenda last night and education is likely to be the primary focus.
The education system isn't what needs fixing, it's the people. Have you ever been to a school that is majority at risk? I work at one of the nicest ones. It's safe and there's a lot of great opportunities for the high school kids. However there just aren't enough kids with basic skills. By basic skills, I'm not talking reading or math, I am talking attendance, organization, effort, attitude, etc. For example (venting right now), I just got an angry email from a parent wondering why their daughter is failing math. In the 6 weeks since the class started, she has 8 absences, 2 days missed for suspension, 7 tardies and has completed 3/9 homework assignments. She has never asked for help. She rarely brings her things to class. These are all issues noted on her progress report 3 weeks ago that I guess mom never looked at. This stuff is everyday, all day.
 
There is no income verification on the free or reduced lunch program. Many schools try and get as many families as they can to sign up to receive the additional money. It's a meaningless metric.

 
Who is the bigger fool? The fool that prints the BS? Or the fool that has no BS detector and rebroadcasts it on a message board?

 
There is no income verification on the free or reduced lunch program. Many schools try and get as many families as they can to sign up to receive the additional money. It's a meaningless metric.
This is completely true in the schools my daughters attended in Miami-Dade County from 1995-2010. It happened at the magnet schools in low-income areas and at the magnet schools on expensive Key Biscayne. The schools made us aware that there was no income verification. I never applied for reduced lunch but many middle class kids got a free lunch. The percentages are inflated.

Upper class parents usually don't send their kids to public schools in Miami, even those with great reputations. The exceptions were parents who attended good public schools up north when they were kids, usually NYC schools. Overall,the percentage of kids in private schools is about 10% and declining. We need to improve public education in this country for everybody. Based on recent reports from the field in Miami, I think charter schools are having a positive impact.

 
There is no income verification on the free or reduced lunch program. Many schools try and get as many families as they can to sign up to receive the additional money. It's a meaningless metric.
This is completely true in the schools my daughters attended in Miami-Dade County from 1995-2010. It happened at the magnet schools in low-income areas and at the magnet schools on expensive Key Biscayne. The schools made us aware that there was no income verification. I never applied for reduced lunch but many middle class kids got a free lunch. The percentages are inflated.

Upper class parents usually don't send their kids to public schools in Miami, even those with great reputations. The exceptions were parents who attended good public schools up north when they were kids, usually NYC schools. Overall,the percentage of kids in private schools is about 10% and declining. We need to improve public education in this country for everybody. Based on recent reports from the field in Miami, I think charter schools are having a positive impact.
positive impact in what way? graduation rates? overall area college accepance? overall academic performance? miami-dade schools improving vs just charter?

 
There is no income verification on the free or reduced lunch program. Many schools try and get as many families as they can to sign up to receive the additional money. It's a meaningless metric.
This is completely true in the schools my daughters attended in Miami-Dade County from 1995-2010. It happened at the magnet schools in low-income areas and at the magnet schools on expensive Key Biscayne. The schools made us aware that there was no income verification. I never applied for reduced lunch but many middle class kids got a free lunch. The percentages are inflated.

Upper class parents usually don't send their kids to public schools in Miami, even those with great reputations. The exceptions were parents who attended good public schools up north when they were kids, usually NYC schools. Overall,the percentage of kids in private schools is about 10% and declining. We need to improve public education in this country for everybody. Based on recent reports from the field in Miami, I think charter schools are having a positive impact.
positive impact in what way? graduation rates? overall area college accepance? overall academic performance? miami-dade schools improving vs just charter?
No hard evidence, just talking to several parents about their perceptions of their kids' experiences. The growth in charter schools has been recent, so it may take time to get good data - the metrics are always controversial and the students attending charter & magnet schools are a very biased population. Many of the schools emphasize foreign language (at a much higher level than decades ago), some have technology themes, most have high academic expectations and require parental involvement. They tend to be smaller than most public schools. FWIW, 3 new charter schools from Miami made the Newsweek top 100 list. These rankings are based on graduation rates, AP/IB participation, SAT scores, counselor/student ratio. etc.

 
We're the poor family in my son's public school class here in NYC. I think we're the only ones out of 30 families who don't own our home and don't own a second home.

But here in NYC, it's all about the neighborhood in which the school is located and if it's a Gifted&Talented school. Combine the two and *whammo*- very few poor folk.

 
Slapdash said:
Children who are eligible for such lunches do not necessarily live in poverty. Subsidized lunches are available to children from families that earn up to $43,568, for a family of four, which is about 185 percent of the federal poverty level.
Yep. I know a family locally that has two kids that get free breakfast and lunch. Dad owns a Heating & AC business, they live in a 3 story house and mom and dad drive Hummers. Dad flies to gamble in Atlantic City on a regular basis.
 

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