Mark Ingram (1 Viewer)

[cobalt_27]

if they want to replace 2 RBs with knee problems with a bellcow; then why trade back into the 1st round for an RB with knee problems...

It was a bad move IMO, they could of gotten just as good as an RB with their 2nd.

And if your going to Rate a player based on the trade a team made for them than Julio Jones is 1.01 by a wide margin.

I much rather Green and Jones before Ingram

Who did that?

 

[Go deep]

As much as it pains me to say. McAllister was just not in Sean Paytons plans. He was one of Jim Haslett's guys. Payton drafted Bush to replace Deuce IMO not to share the backfield with him. I think Deuce won him over however. But Payton pretty much turned over most of that Jim Haslett team from the year before. Guys like Joe horn, Stallworth, Aaron Brooks all shown the door. (Justified) Deuce was not such an easy out because he was a fan favorite. Even though Payton accepted him in the end I still think if Deuce had remained healthy in the following years he would have been traded or allowed to walk as a FA.

Not only that, Deuce was a 27 yo old RB coming off of a torn ACL the season before.

 

[shader]

Lol at the original post. Chris Ivory is not very talented. Ingram has far more talent. It's not close.

What Saints fans think is irrelevant.

 

[saintfool]

As much as it pains me to say. McAllister was just not in Sean Paytons plans. He was one of Jim Haslett's guys. Payton drafted Bush to replace Deuce IMO not to share the backfield with him. I think Deuce won him over however. But Payton pretty much turned over most of that Jim Haslett team from the year before. Guys like Joe horn, Stallworth, Aaron Brooks all shown the door. (Justified) Deuce was not such an easy out because he was a fan favorite. Even though Payton accepted him in the end I still think if Deuce had remained healthy in the following years he would have been traded or allowed to walk as a FA.

to be fair, no one in their right mind expect houston to pick mario over reggie. payton never expected to get reggie. whatever the plan for deuce was headed into that season, it was changed with that draft.

 

[Go deep]

As much as it pains me to say. McAllister was just not in Sean Paytons plans. He was one of Jim Haslett's guys. Payton drafted Bush to replace Deuce IMO not to share the backfield with him. I think Deuce won him over however. But Payton pretty much turned over most of that Jim Haslett team from the year before. Guys like Joe horn, Stallworth, Aaron Brooks all shown the door. (Justified) Deuce was not such an easy out because he was a fan favorite. Even though Payton accepted him in the end I still think if Deuce had remained healthy in the following years he would have been traded or allowed to walk as a FA.

to be fair, no one in their right mind expect houston to pick mario over reggie. payton never expected to get reggie. whatever the plan for deuce was headed into that season, it was changed with that draft.

Mario Williams was signed the day before the draft.

 

[Hoodoo]

Anybody who thinks Ingram will come in and automatically play the "bellcow" role is living in a fantasy world and hasn't paid enough attention to how Sean Payton handles the RB position in his offense. It's all just wishful thinking from fantasy owners.

 

[Go deep]

Anybody who thinks Ingram will come in and automatically play the "bellcow" role is living in a fantasy world and hasn't paid enough attention to how Sean Payton handles the RB position in his offense. It's all just wishful thinking from fantasy owners.

Do you think coaches just decide they are going to be rbbc coaches no matter who their rbs are? If Peyton had Adrian Peterson, Lynell Hamilton and Toby Gerhart as his RBs do you think there would be a full blown RBBC?

 

[shader]

Some of you guys are totally over-analyzing Payton's history with running backs.

First of all, he had Reggie Bush, who he probably envisioned in a role similar to Jamaal Charles. Get 8-10 carries, catch the ball 4 or 5 times and be totally electric.

Well Bush failed in that role from day one. He just couldn't run inside. What would Payton have done if Bush had dominated from day one? We can only imagine. But he didn't.

Pierre Thomas began getting into the rotation in 2008 and 2009. He ran at a high level, averaging close to 5.0 ypc. He did this even though he was an undrafted free agent.

Same thing with Chris Ivory. He came in as an undrafted free agent and averaged about 5.0 ypc.

I think the fact that these two guys could average 5 ypc on this explosive Saints offense is what excites Ingram fans.

Ingram is head and shoulders above either guy. Ingram has been compared to Emmitt Smith constantly, and I feel the comparison is legit.

Now will Ingram go in and get 90% of the carries? Probably not.

But here is why Ingram will be on the field the majority of the time: He will make the team MUCH better.

Running backs don't average 6 and 7 ypc. Why? Because defenses won't allow it. If Ingram steps in there game 1 and starts shredding defenses left and right, defenses will adjust and focus more on Ingram. With Brees and that offense, that is suicide.

Ingram is going to make that offense practically unstoppable. Pierre Thomas and Chris Ivory were nice players. But defenses didn't try and figure out how to stop them. Defenses were worried about the passing game.

You throw a running back in there that will destroy you if you don't focus on him, and that Saints offense will be a nightmare.

Ingram will be a touchdown machine in a wide open offense. I expect 1300-1500 yards and 15 td's. Easy. Thomas will probably get 500-600 yards and 300 yards receiving, and Ivory will be firmly on the bench until mop-up duty (which may come early a lot this year).

 

[Scooby1974]

Anybody who thinks Ingram will come in and automatically play the "bellcow" role is living in a fantasy world and hasn't paid enough attention to how Sean Payton handles the RB position in his offense. It's all just wishful thinking from fantasy owners.

Do you think coaches just decide they are going to be rbbc coaches no matter who their rbs are? If Peyton had Adrian Peterson, Lynell Hamilton and Toby Gerhart as his RBs do you think there would be a full blown RBBC?

The cream will rise to the top in NO. With FA RB's out there to be had and a relatively deep RB class in the draft, NO could have waited on a RB if they were just looking for another guy to add to the mix and run between the tackles. Not only did they not wait, but they made a rather bold and costly move to secure Ingram. Why not wait and go after a cheap Veteran FA guy like Ronnie Brown or MaGahee who could back up PT? These guys have proven they can get the job done. Or if they feel so comfortable with Ivory and PT, just draft a guy like Devine to replace Reggie's pass catching abilities for a fraction of the cost? There were and are MANY more, cheaper options than moving up to draft Ingram. That doesn't mean Ingram is instantly going to get ADP or CJ3 type carries, but even 2/3 of the carries in NO would put him in a great spot statistically speaking with NO's ability to move the ball down the field. As for history, did Payton do the drafting for his previous teams? Were the guys he was using "his guys" that fit "his system"? I don't know, just curious. I do know that NO has not had a RB similar to Ingram since Deuce's injury free days. Bush, despite all the skill to bounce it outside in the world, could not translate to an inside, power runner. Despite big money and an effort to get him to change, Payton has been unable to reshape his game and mentality to run inside. PT is above average and able to do a few things well. Ivory is a bull moose and everyone knew when he came in what was about to happen, limiting the offense. Ingram has proven in the College game to be FAR superior in skill set to both guys. In much the same way ADP, CJ3, SJax, Gore, Mendy, Turner, and Foster types didn't share the rock, I believe Ingram will prove and position himself in a similar situation given his skills and all-around abilities.

 

[Go deep]

Some of you guys are totally over-analyzing Payton's history with running backs.

First of all, he had Reggie Bush, who he probably envisioned in a role similar to Jamaal Charles. Get 8-10 carries, catch the ball 4 or 5 times and be totally electric.

Well Bush failed in that role from day one. He just couldn't run inside. What would Payton have done if Bush had dominated from day one? We can only imagine. But he didn't.

Pierre Thomas began getting into the rotation in 2008 and 2009. He ran at a high level, averaging close to 5.0 ypc. He did this even though he was an undrafted free agent.

Same thing with Chris Ivory. He came in as an undrafted free agent and averaged about 5.0 ypc.

I think the fact that these two guys could average 5 ypc on this explosive Saints offense is what excites Ingram fans.

Ingram is head and shoulders above either guy. Ingram has been compared to Emmitt Smith constantly, and I feel the comparison is legit.

Now will Ingram go in and get 90% of the carries? Probably not.

But here is why Ingram will be on the field the majority of the time: He will make the team MUCH better.

Running backs don't average 6 and 7 ypc. Why? Because defenses won't allow it. If Ingram steps in there game 1 and starts shredding defenses left and right, defenses will adjust and focus more on Ingram. With Brees and that offense, that is suicide.

Ingram is going to make that offense practically unstoppable. Pierre Thomas and Chris Ivory were nice players. But defenses didn't try and figure out how to stop them. Defenses were worried about the passing game.

You throw a running back in there that will destroy you if you don't focus on him, and that Saints offense will be a nightmare.

Ingram will be a touchdown machine in a wide open offense. I expect 1300-1500 yards and 15 td's. Easy. Thomas will probably get 500-600 yards and 300 yards receiving, and Ivory will be firmly on the bench until mop-up duty (which may come early a lot this year).

Im not sure about that, but i like your enthusiasm.

 

[Hoodoo]

Anybody who thinks Ingram will come in and automatically play the "bellcow" role is living in a fantasy world and hasn't paid enough attention to how Sean Payton handles the RB position in his offense. It's all just wishful thinking from fantasy owners.

Do you think coaches just decide they are going to be rbbc coaches no matter who their rbs are? If Peyton had Adrian Peterson, Lynell Hamilton and Toby Gerhart as his RBs do you think there would be a full blown RBBC?

Are you seriously comparing Mark Ingram to Adrian Peterson?The Saints didn't pay Pierre Thomas $12 million just to be a 3rd down back & I believe coach Payton & Mickey Loomis when they both said that they still plan on Bush being a part of the offense. Ivory may be questionable & I imagine they would entertain any trade offer, but yes, I firmly believe that the Saints will still incorporate a RBBC approach.

 

[Go deep]

Anybody who thinks Ingram will come in and automatically play the "bellcow" role is living in a fantasy world and hasn't paid enough attention to how Sean Payton handles the RB position in his offense. It's all just wishful thinking from fantasy owners.

Do you think coaches just decide they are going to be rbbc coaches no matter who their rbs are? If Peyton had Adrian Peterson, Lynell Hamilton and Toby Gerhart as his RBs do you think there would be a full blown RBBC?

Are you seriously comparing Mark Ingram to Adrian Peterson?The Saints didn't pay Pierre Thomas $12 million just to be a 3rd down back & I believe coach Payton & Mickey Loomis when they both said that they still plan on Bush being a part of the offense. Ivory may be questionable & I imagine they would entertain any trade offer, but yes, I firmly believe that the Saints will still incorporate a RBBC approach.

No, i didnt compare anyone, i didnt even mention Ingram in my post. I asked do you think Payton would still run a full blown RBBC with those 3 RB's?

 

[saintfool]

The cream will rise to the top in NO. With FA RB's out there to be had and a relatively deep RB class in the draft, NO could have waited on a RB if they were just looking for another guy to add to the mix and run between the tackles. Not only did they not wait, but they made a rather bold and costly move to secure Ingram. Why not wait and go after a cheap Veteran FA guy like Ronnie Brown or MaGahee who could back up PT? These guys have proven they can get the job done. Or if they feel so comfortable with Ivory and PT, just draft a guy like Devine to replace Reggie's pass catching abilities for a fraction of the cost? There were and are MANY more, cheaper options than moving up to draft Ingram. That doesn't mean Ingram is instantly going to get ADP or CJ3 type carries, but even 2/3 of the carries in NO would put him in a great spot statistically speaking with NO's ability to move the ball down the field.

As for history, did Payton do the drafting for his previous teams? Were the guys he was using "his guys" that fit "his system"? I don't know, just curious. I do know that NO has not had a RB similar to Ingram since Deuce's injury free days. Bush, despite all the skill to bounce it outside in the world, could not translate to an inside, power runner. Despite big money and an effort to get him to change, Payton has been unable to reshape his game and mentality to run inside. PT is above average and able to do a few things well. Ivory is a bull moose and everyone knew when he came in what was about to happen, limiting the offense. Ingram has proven in the College game to be FAR superior in skill set to both guys. In much the same way ADP, CJ3, SJax, Gore, Mendy, Turner, and Foster types didn't share the rock, I believe Ingram will prove and position himself in a similar situation given his skills and all-around abilities.

um, Pierre and Mendenhall shared RB duties at Illinois.And, as I recall, Thomas started over Mendenhall and put up better numbers when they were running on the same team.

 

[Donnybrook]

Payton ultimate plan is to keep one or two RBs healthy so he is not to be forced to start Julius Jones come playoff time. Beyond that I have no idea.

 

[gandalas]

um, Pierre and Mendenhall shared RB duties at Illinois.And, as I recall, Thomas started over Mendenhall and put up better numbers when they were running on the same team.

You recall incorrectly.In 2006, when Mendenhall was a true Sophomore and Pierre Thomas was a Senior, Here were their stats:

Thomas: 131 carries for 755 yards, 5.8 YPC, 5 TD. 12 rec for 79 yards, 1 TD.

Mendenhall: 78 carries for 640 yards, 8.2 YPC, 5 TD. 12 rec for 164 yards, 1 TD.

Mendenhall had almost as many yards in barely more than half the carries, the same number of TDs, and had more yards on the same number of receptions.

2005 is hardly fair to compare, as Mendenhall was a true freshman that season, so this is the only season which they were both on the field, and Mendy as a true Sophomore stole all that work from a 4th year Senior.

 

[Hoodoo]

Anybody who thinks Ingram will come in and automatically play the "bellcow" role is living in a fantasy world and hasn't paid enough attention to how Sean Payton handles the RB position in his offense. It's all just wishful thinking from fantasy owners.

Do you think coaches just decide they are going to be rbbc coaches no matter who their rbs are? If Peyton had Adrian Peterson, Lynell Hamilton and Toby Gerhart as his RBs do you think there would be a full blown RBBC?

Are you seriously comparing Mark Ingram to Adrian Peterson?The Saints didn't pay Pierre Thomas $12 million just to be a 3rd down back & I believe coach Payton & Mickey Loomis when they both said that they still plan on Bush being a part of the offense. Ivory may be questionable & I imagine they would entertain any trade offer, but yes, I firmly believe that the Saints will still incorporate a RBBC approach.

No, i didnt compare anyone, i didnt even mention Ingram in my post. I asked do you think Payton would still run a full blown RBBC with those 3 RB's?

Who cares what he would do if he had Peterson, Hamilton & Gerhart? If Payton had AD & two garbage pail kids then he'd start AD and run him into the ground. That's clearly nowhere near the actual situation and is completely pointless.

 

[Go deep]

Anybody who thinks Ingram will come in and automatically play the "bellcow" role is living in a fantasy world and hasn't paid enough attention to how Sean Payton handles the RB position in his offense. It's all just wishful thinking from fantasy owners.

Do you think coaches just decide they are going to be rbbc coaches no matter who their rbs are? If Peyton had Adrian Peterson, Lynell Hamilton and Toby Gerhart as his RBs do you think there would be a full blown RBBC?

Are you seriously comparing Mark Ingram to Adrian Peterson?The Saints didn't pay Pierre Thomas $12 million just to be a 3rd down back & I believe coach Payton & Mickey Loomis when they both said that they still plan on Bush being a part of the offense. Ivory may be questionable & I imagine they would entertain any trade offer, but yes, I firmly believe that the Saints will still incorporate a RBBC approach.

No, i didnt compare anyone, i didnt even mention Ingram in my post. I asked do you think Payton would still run a full blown RBBC with those 3 RB's?

Who cares what he would do if he had Peterson, Hamilton & Gerhart? If Payton had AD & two garbage pail kids then he'd start AD and run him into the ground. That's clearly nowhere near the actual situation and is completely pointless.

It may or may not be similar to the situation, point being is just bcause Payton has used a full RBBC over the last several years doesnt mean he will do it under any circumstance. Like i said before, if Ingram is as good as advertised he will be the workhorse.

 

[Scooby1974]

um, Pierre and Mendenhall shared RB duties at Illinois.And, as I recall, Thomas started over Mendenhall and put up better numbers when they were running on the same team.

You recall incorrectly.In 2006, when Mendenhall was a true Sophomore and Pierre Thomas was a Senior, Here were their stats:

Thomas: 131 carries for 755 yards, 5.8 YPC, 5 TD. 12 rec for 79 yards, 1 TD.

Mendenhall: 78 carries for 640 yards, 8.2 YPC, 5 TD. 12 rec for 164 yards, 1 TD.

Mendenhall had almost as many yards in barely more than half the carries, the same number of TDs, and had more yards on the same number of receptions.

2005 is hardly fair to compare, as Mendenhall was a true freshman that season, so this is the only season which they were both on the field, and Mendy as a true Sophomore stole all that work from a 4th year Senior.

Please, don't confuse us with the facts. This only goes toward proving that PT is merely pedestrian in his abilities. At least he's used to having his job stolen away from him by younger talent, should be a fairly easy transition to Ingram and his heisman award winning talent when the time comes.

 

[guderian]

I am amazed at how many people actually think there is going to be a full blown RBBC in NO this season.

The only way it happens is if Ingram is not as good as advertised(which is possible) or he gets hurt. Assuming he is the back that NO hoped when they drafted him in the first round, he will get at least 60% of the RB touches.

The only reason the NO backfield seems deep is because they havnt had anyone good enough to take the starting job. Does anyone think if Adrian Peterson or even Rashard Mendehall were in NO last year there would have been a full RBBC?

Reggie Bush averaged 4.5 carries a game last year, and that was without Ingram there and injuries to their other backs. Ivory didnt have a carry until Thomas got hurt in week 3. Thomas averaged 3.2 YPC last year. How anyone thinks this team is deep at RB is beyond me. It seems pretty clear that NO is/was in desperate need for a starting RB and they addressed it by selecting the best RB in the draft.

Ivory averaged 5.2 yards per carry last year and Pierre Thomas averaged 5.4 the year before and is a career 4.7. It's not often that rookies come in and put up those kinds of numbers--even on a mature offensively oriented team like the Saints.

 

[Hoodoo]

It may or may not be similar to the situation, point being is just because Payton has used a full RBBC over the last several years doesnt mean he will do it under any circumstance. Like i said before, if Ingram is as good as advertised he will be the workhorse.

Then you are in fact comparing Ingram to Peterson and in turn comparing PT to Hamilton & Bush to Gerhart. Otherwise your argument is ridiculous... Well, it's ridiculous anyway to compare any one of those three players. I never said there was no circumstance that he wouldn't make Ingram the workhorse back many fantasy owners hope he'll be. If PT, Bush & Ivory all get injured again then of course that's a very likely scenario, but honestly, that makes him no better than Julius Jones.

 

[saintfool]

um, Pierre and Mendenhall shared RB duties at Illinois.And, as I recall, Thomas started over Mendenhall and put up better numbers when they were running on the same team.

You recall incorrectly.In 2006, when Mendenhall was a true Sophomore and Pierre Thomas was a Senior, Here were their stats:

Thomas: 131 carries for 755 yards, 5.8 YPC, 5 TD. 12 rec for 79 yards, 1 TD.

Mendenhall: 78 carries for 640 yards, 8.2 YPC, 5 TD. 12 rec for 164 yards, 1 TD.

Mendenhall had almost as many yards in barely more than half the carries, the same number of TDs, and had more yards on the same number of receptions.

2005 is hardly fair to compare, as Mendenhall was a true freshman that season, so this is the only season which they were both on the field, and Mendy as a true Sophomore stole all that work from a 4th year Senior.

Please, don't confuse us with the facts. This only goes toward proving that PT is merely pedestrian in his abilities. At least he's used to having his job stolen away from him by younger talent, should be a fairly easy transition to Ingram and his heisman award winning talent when the time comes.

seriously? as good as mendenhall was, pierre still had twice as many attempts. once pierre left and mendenhall started, that gaudy 8.2 YPC didn't last. ingram is clearly the future. pierre might be cut, traded or kept. if he is kept then there is a good chance that he's the #2 in a RBBC. why? because he knows the offense and is proven effective in it. this 1-2 RB punch was a superbowl winning formula after all.

 

[Hoodoo]

seriously? as good as mendenhall was, pierre still had twice as many attempts. once pierre left and mendenhall started, that gaudy 8.2 YPC didn't last. ingram is clearly the future. pierre might be cut, traded or kept. if he is kept then there is a good chance that he's the #2 in a RBBC. why? because he knows the offense and is proven effective in it. this 1-2 RB punch was a superbowl winning formula after all.

He won't be cut with that new contract unless they play with no CBA & there's no cap impact.

 

[Scooby1974]

Anybody who thinks Ingram will come in and automatically play the "bellcow" role is living in a fantasy world and hasn't paid enough attention to how Sean Payton handles the RB position in his offense. It's all just wishful thinking from fantasy owners.

Do you think coaches just decide they are going to be rbbc coaches no matter who their rbs are? If Peyton had Adrian Peterson, Lynell Hamilton and Toby Gerhart as his RBs do you think there would be a full blown RBBC?

Are you seriously comparing Mark Ingram to Adrian Peterson?The Saints didn't pay Pierre Thomas $12 million just to be a 3rd down back & I believe coach Payton & Mickey Loomis when they both said that they still plan on Bush being a part of the offense. Ivory may be questionable & I imagine they would entertain any trade offer, but yes, I firmly believe that the Saints will still incorporate a RBBC approach.

So paying PT means they will sit a more talented RB on the bench(see Reggie Bush, the multi-million dollar 3rd down back)? Ingram stands a better chance of making more money than PT will if that is how you want to gauge who gets minutes. I'm not saying, nor am I reading anyone else saying that Ingram will get 90% of the carries. But Payton would be a FOOL to keep Ingram on the bench if (and I believe we will) we see a situation similar to what happened at Illinois with the younger, more talented guy coming in and taking over due to being much more effective in the system.

 

[Jeff Haseley]

This is going to make a great Faceoff debate.

 

[Scooby1974]

um, Pierre and Mendenhall shared RB duties at Illinois.And, as I recall, Thomas started over Mendenhall and put up better numbers when they were running on the same team.

You recall incorrectly.In 2006, when Mendenhall was a true Sophomore and Pierre Thomas was a Senior, Here were their stats:

Thomas: 131 carries for 755 yards, 5.8 YPC, 5 TD. 12 rec for 79 yards, 1 TD.

Mendenhall: 78 carries for 640 yards, 8.2 YPC, 5 TD. 12 rec for 164 yards, 1 TD.

Mendenhall had almost as many yards in barely more than half the carries, the same number of TDs, and had more yards on the same number of receptions.

2005 is hardly fair to compare, as Mendenhall was a true freshman that season, so this is the only season which they were both on the field, and Mendy as a true Sophomore stole all that work from a 4th year Senior.

Please, don't confuse us with the facts. This only goes toward proving that PT is merely pedestrian in his abilities. At least he's used to having his job stolen away from him by younger talent, should be a fairly easy transition to Ingram and his heisman award winning talent when the time comes.

seriously? as good as mendenhall was, pierre still had twice as many attempts. once pierre left and mendenhall started, that gaudy 8.2 YPC didn't last. ingram is clearly the future. pierre might be cut, traded or kept. if he is kept then there is a good chance that he's the #2 in a RBBC. why? because he knows the offense and is proven effective in it. this 1-2 RB punch was a superbowl winning formula after all.

So you are saying that it took PT twice as many attempts as a Senior to do what an inexperienced but more talented Sophomore Mendy did behind the same line? You have to look at context as well here and I have no idea what was happening at Illinois after PT left and Mendy's numbers dropped. My guess is that Mendy didn't have as good of a grasp of the playbook as well, so he limited what plays could be called. Who was QBing after PT left? Was there any threat of a passing game? How was the line? The only thing we know is that behind the same line, a younger, less experienced RB out shown PT...the odds are decent that the heisman trophy winner will win out to the tune of 60%+ of the carries despite PT's paycheck, that's all most of us are saying.

 

[saintfool]

So paying PT means they will sit a more talented RB on the bench(see Reggie Bush, the multi-million dollar 3rd down back)? Ingram stands a better chance of making more money than PT will if that is how you want to gauge who gets minutes. I'm not saying, nor am I reading anyone else saying that Ingram will get 90% of the carries. But Payton would be a FOOL to keep Ingram on the bench if (and I believe we will) we see a situation similar to what happened at Illinois with the younger, more talented guy coming in and taking over due to being much more effective in the system.

i don't think anyone believes that ingram will be playing behind pierre, ivory or reggie. however, i do think that ingram will be eased into the starter role. he needs to learn the offense, especially the blocking - which almost every rookie struggles with - as well as the passing. he's got to put time in with brees because it's drew's show out there. brees needs to feel the confidence in a player because he can make you a star in the league with this offense.

 

[Scooby1974]

So paying PT means they will sit a more talented RB on the bench(see Reggie Bush, the multi-million dollar 3rd down back)? Ingram stands a better chance of making more money than PT will if that is how you want to gauge who gets minutes. I'm not saying, nor am I reading anyone else saying that Ingram will get 90% of the carries. But Payton would be a FOOL to keep Ingram on the bench if (and I believe we will) we see a situation similar to what happened at Illinois with the younger, more talented guy coming in and taking over due to being much more effective in the system.

i don't think anyone believes that ingram will be playing behind pierre, ivory or reggie. however, i do think that ingram will be eased into the starter role. he needs to learn the offense, especially the blocking - which almost every rookie struggles with - as well as the passing. he's got to put time in with brees because it's drew's show out there. brees needs to feel the confidence in a player because he can make you a star in the league with this offense.

 

[Hoodoo]

i don't think anyone believes that ingram will be playing behind pierre, ivory or reggie. however, i do think that ingram will be eased into the starter role. he needs to learn the offense, especially the blocking - which almost every rookie struggles with - as well as the passing. he's got to put time in with brees because it's drew's show out there. brees needs to feel the confidence in a player because he can make you a star in the league with this offense.

ThisI could certainly see it being a 40-40-20 split.

 

[Clifford]

http://www.saintsreport.com/forums/showthread.php?t=197057Many Saints fans are thinking various things as far as what Mark Ingram's selection means to the team as this recent poll shows. Some really do not think Ingram is the best back on the Saints roster and the guy that started the Poll thinks Chris Ivory is the best back. As of now Ingram and PT are tied for the best back followed by Chris Ivory and then Bush. As for the posts in the thread, many fans see a yet another RBBC in the Saints future and are not buying the fact that Mark Ingram was drafted to be the man in New Orleans. Its quite a different take reading that board than reading Blooms column about Mark Ingram. Maybe it takes a while for Mark to separate himself from the other backs but I kind of doubt it.

Should take about 1.5 practices. He's going to make Saints fans forget they even have other running backs. I predict 1500 on the ground and 10 TDs. Most likely will not see too much work on passing downs but he will be their workhorse (barring injury) on the ground. I wouldn't be surprised if he is already better at pass protection than all their other backs though, so staying in on third downs could emerge later in the season. He's got good hands and run screen routes very well.

 

[Late225]

I still don't understand the move considering there were no RBs taken at that point. Maybe the Saints really think Ingram's the second coming of Emmitt Smith. I would have waited for my next selection to take the best rb on the board.

 

[Mister CIA]

This discussion sounds a lot like the discussion about Adrian Peterson coming into his rookie season. I'm not saying that Ingram is AP good, but the situations are similar.

 

[Scooby1974]

This discussion sounds a lot like the discussion about Adrian Peterson coming into his rookie season. I'm not saying that Ingram is AP good, but the situations are similar.

Just when the pot starts to settle down, you come in to stir it up again.You know you are going to have to explain yourself now, right?

 

[ThePittbully]

I still don't understand the move considering there were no RBs taken at that point. Maybe the Saints really think Ingram's the second coming of Emmitt Smith. I would have waited for my next selection to take the best rb on the board.

The rumor is they had Cam Jordan #1 on their board and right behind him Ingram at #2. They got to know him and really liked who he was, not just what he could do, but I think they were very impressed with that as well obviously. IMO there were no other backs in this draft with the talent level of Ingram, but we'll see

 

[Mister CIA]

This discussion sounds a lot like the discussion about Adrian Peterson coming into his rookie season. I'm not saying that Ingram is AP good, but the situations are similar.

Just when the pot starts to settle down, you come in to stir it up again.You know you are going to have to explain yourself now, right?

Link

 

[Breesisdaman]

I still don't understand the move considering there were no RBs taken at that point. Maybe the Saints really think Ingram's the second coming of Emmitt Smith. I would have waited for my next selection to take the best rb on the board.

The rumor is they had Cam Jordan #1 on their board and right behind him Ingram at #2. They got to know him and really liked who he was, not just what he could do, but I think they were very impressed with that as well obviously. IMO there were no other backs in this draft with the talent level of Ingram, but we'll see

I remember Ingram has been living and training in New Orleans in his offseason. I wonder how well he got to know the Saints during that time. All I need to know about him is he won the Heisman as a RB in the SEC conference and broke Shaun Alexanders single season rushing record in the process. Only 5 RB's have won the Heisman while running in the SEC. Guys like George Rogers (Also drafted by the Saints), Herschel Walker and Bo Jackson,Ingram the most recent RB inductee (Unless you count Cam Newton as a RB) has already faced defenses like LSU who are damn near NFL caliber. RB is one of the easiest positions (playbook wise) to learn in Sean Paytons offense. I give Ingram 3-4 games before his role is solidified as the starter with a 60% chunk of the carries.

 

[shader]

Anybody who thinks Ingram will come in and automatically play the "bellcow" role is living in a fantasy world and hasn't paid enough attention to how Sean Payton handles the RB position in his offense. It's all just wishful thinking from fantasy owners.

Do you think coaches just decide they are going to be rbbc coaches no matter who their rbs are? If Peyton had Adrian Peterson, Lynell Hamilton and Toby Gerhart as his RBs do you think there would be a full blown RBBC?

Are you seriously comparing Mark Ingram to Adrian Peterson?The Saints didn't pay Pierre Thomas $12 million just to be a 3rd down back & I believe coach Payton & Mickey Loomis when they both said that they still plan on Bush being a part of the offense. Ivory may be questionable & I imagine they would entertain any trade offer, but yes, I firmly believe that the Saints will still incorporate a RBBC approach.

I am. In no way will Ingram ever be as dynamic as Peterson. They are different runners. But Ingram has a chance to be a HOF type of RB.

He could easily finish his career with more yards and TD's than Peterson, though he'll never be universally considered to be the superstar ADP is.

Now I'm not saying Ingram might not bust, because I suppose anything is possible. But at this point in his career, I am just as high on Ingram's future as I was on Peterson.

 

[Breesisdaman]

This topic now has a poll.

 

[Clifford]

I still don't understand the move considering there were no RBs taken at that point. Maybe the Saints really think Ingram's the second coming of Emmitt Smith. I would have waited for my next selection to take the best rb on the board.

The rumor is they had Cam Jordan #1 on their board and right behind him Ingram at #2. They got to know him and really liked who he was, not just what he could do, but I think they were very impressed with that as well obviously. IMO there were no other backs in this draft with the talent level of Ingram, but we'll see

Ingram is without a doubt one of the most high-character guys in this years draft if not the most. There's a lot to like about him, especially playing for the Saints.I think the fact that they did move up and not wait shows that they want him to end their RBBC mess, even though it did manage to win them a Superbowl.Wouldn't be surprised to see one of PT or Ivory traded before regular season starts, if that's possible.

 

[Chicago Hooligan]

~200 carries

there guys i won the thread

 

[cvnpoka]

Should take about 1.5 practices. He's going to make Saints fans forget they even have other running backs. I predict 1500 on the ground and 10 TDs. Most likely will not see too much work on passing downs but he will be their workhorse (barring injury) on the ground. I wouldn't be surprised if he is already better at pass protection than all their other backs though, so staying in on third downs could emerge later in the season. He's got good hands and run screen routes very well.

so you are drafting him top 10 in redraft?

 

[SayWhat?]

Should take about 1.5 practices. He's going to make Saints fans forget they even have other running backs. I predict 1500 on the ground and 10 TDs. Most likely will not see too much work on passing downs but he will be their workhorse (barring injury) on the ground. I wouldn't be surprised if he is already better at pass protection than all their other backs though, so staying in on third downs could emerge later in the season. He's got good hands and run screen routes very well.

so you are drafting him top 10 in redraft?

Is that relevant? Just because you feel that someone may finish as a top 10 fantasy player, doesn't mean that you should take them as a top 10 draft pick if their ADP doesn't warrant it and you can get that player a round or two later.

 

[Donnybrook]

I am going under 60%. Adrian Peterson received 57% of the running back carries in his rookie season but had less than 50% of the teams total carries.

 

[saintfool]

Wouldn't be surprised to see one of PT or Ivory traded before regular season starts, if that's possible.

i don't see that happening really. ivory is recovering from lisfranc. pierre is recovering from HAS. the thing is, both contracts are still manageable. the saints can afford to keep them both and ingram. they'll get a chance to showcase them, sure, but no one is buying them without seeing how well they recovered. more importantly, payton learned just how important quality depth is at the position. i don't think he wants to resort to julius jones or some other schlub every again. the saints have options.

 

[Hoodoo]

I am. In no way will Ingram ever be as dynamic as Peterson. They are different runners. But Ingram has a chance to be a HOF type of RB. He could easily finish his career with more yards and TD's than Peterson, though he'll never be universally considered to be the superstar ADP is.Now I'm not saying Ingram might not bust, because I suppose anything is possible. But at this point in his career, I am just as high on Ingram's future as I was on Peterson.

You're being a bit contradictory. Ingram won't be as dynamic a player & won't be considered the superstar that Peterson is, but could easily end up with better numbers & be a HOFer? Stardom doesn't equate wins & losses, nobody here is arguing whether he'll be a "star" or not. Either say you think Ingram will be every bit as good as Peterson (or Emmitt Smith for that matter) or don't say it. Either say you think PT & Bush will be no more productive than Lynell Hamilton & Toby Gerhart or don't. Personally, I think Ingram be more of a Deuce McAllister in terms of healthy production than an Emmitt Smith and until I see otherwise I see no reason to believe that he will see a larger percentage of carries/snaps.

 

[cvnpoka]

Should take about 1.5 practices. He's going to make Saints fans forget they even have other running backs. I predict 1500 on the ground and 10 TDs. Most likely will not see too much work on passing downs but he will be their workhorse (barring injury) on the ground. I wouldn't be surprised if he is already better at pass protection than all their other backs though, so staying in on third downs could emerge later in the season. He's got good hands and run screen routes very well.

so you are drafting him top 10 in redraft?

Is that relevant? Just because you feel that someone may finish as a top 10 fantasy player, doesn't mean that you should take them as a top 10 draft pick if their ADP doesn't warrant it and you can get that player a round or two later.

when i "predict" a player will produce so gaudy of numbers as 200+ fantasy points, i dont gamble that he will be around 10-30 picks later. i feel that its "relevant" to illustrate that some ppl are recklessly tossing numbers around.

 

[SayWhat?]

Should take about 1.5 practices. He's going to make Saints fans forget they even have other running backs. I predict 1500 on the ground and 10 TDs. Most likely will not see too much work on passing downs but he will be their workhorse (barring injury) on the ground. I wouldn't be surprised if he is already better at pass protection than all their other backs though, so staying in on third downs could emerge later in the season. He's got good hands and run screen routes very well.

so you are drafting him top 10 in redraft?

Is that relevant? Just because you feel that someone may finish as a top 10 fantasy player, doesn't mean that you should take them as a top 10 draft pick if their ADP doesn't warrant it and you can get that player a round or two later.

when i "predict" a player will produce so gaudy of numbers as 200+ fantasy points, i dont gamble that he will be around 10-30 picks later. i feel that its "relevant" to illustrate that some ppl are recklessly tossing numbers around.

So you're saying that owners should draft based purely on how you think players will finish come the end of the year, and not factor in ADP and utilize that to your advantage? That doesn't make a whole lot of of sense IMO. I would think it's safe to assume that the above poster doesn't only like Ingram as the only fantasy player to have a big year come next season. So if he can get another player in the top 10 picks that he predicts to get 200+ fantasy points during the season yet has an ADP in the 1st, why would he take Ingram in that spot when there's a chance that he could ultimately land both players? Regardless of what he's "predicting" or how "reckless" you deem it, his prediction isn't justification for where he will nor should draft a player.

 

[cr8f]

Both the Saints and Falcons are gearing up to beat the World Champion Green Bay Packers (still don't believe they won it)

But I agree-Ingram is the only safe bet they have for a healthy RB. I think they will ease him in but will get 60% or more of the carries.

 

[Clifford]

Should take about 1.5 practices. He's going to make Saints fans forget they even have other running backs. I predict 1500 on the ground and 10 TDs. Most likely will not see too much work on passing downs but he will be their workhorse (barring injury) on the ground. I wouldn't be surprised if he is already better at pass protection than all their other backs though, so staying in on third downs could emerge later in the season. He's got good hands and run screen routes very well.

so you are drafting him top 10 in redraft?

Gladly...but with all the knee and PT/Ivory talk I should be able to grab him in the second-third depending on league tendencies.

 

[cvnpoka]

So you're saying that owners should draft based purely on how you think players will finish come the end of the year, and not factor in ADP and utilize that to your advantage? That doesn't make a whole lot of of sense IMO. I would think it's safe to assume that the above poster doesn't only like Ingram as the only fantasy player to have a big year come next season. So if he can get another player in the top 10 picks that he predicts to get 200+ fantasy points during the season yet has an ADP in the 1st, why would he take Ingram in that spot when there's a chance that he could ultimately land both players? Regardless of what he's "predicting" or how "reckless" you deem it, his prediction isn't justification for where he will nor should draft a player.

well that doesnt make much sense bc i didnt say that. this conversation is too hypothetical at this point, making it far too easy to misrepresent points.ill just generalize, 1500 and 10 is a really good year and will very likely finish in the top 10 or rbs. if i felt as strongly about his likelihood of producing such numbers as many in this thread assert, i would be inclined to take him at the end of the first round.

and for my prediction, i will take the under on 210 fantasy points for ingram this year.

 

[Hoodoo]

So you're saying that owners should draft based purely on how you think players will finish come the end of the year, and not factor in ADP and utilize that to your advantage? That doesn't make a whole lot of of sense IMO. I would think it's safe to assume that the above poster doesn't only like Ingram as the only fantasy player to have a big year come next season. So if he can get another player in the top 10 picks that he predicts to get 200+ fantasy points during the season yet has an ADP in the 1st, why would he take Ingram in that spot when there's a chance that he could ultimately land both players? Regardless of what he's "predicting" or how "reckless" you deem it, his prediction isn't justification for where he will nor should draft a player.

well that doesnt make much sense bc i didnt say that. this conversation is too hypothetical at this point, making it far too easy to misrepresent points.ill just generalize, 1500 and 10 is a really good year and will very likely finish in the top 10 or rbs. if i felt as strongly about his likelihood of producing such numbers as many in this thread assert, i would be inclined to take him at the end of the first round.

and for my prediction, i will take the under on 210 fantasy points for ingram this year.

Personally, I think he hints at 1000 yds, but doesn't quite make it. Combined 1,200 and 5-7 TDs is more plausible IMO.Edited, even 1,500 combined seems a little too optimistic to me.