Mass shooting at AME church in Charleston, SC. State Senator is dead (1 Viewer)

[General Tso]

Last night Clinton told host John Ralston, We have to have a candid national conversation about race, and about discrimination, prejudice, hatred. The people who do this kind of dastardly, horrible act are a very small percentage. But unfortunately public discourse is sometimes hotter and more negative than it should be, which can, in my opinion, trigger people who is less than stable to do something like this.

Clinton continued, I think we have to speak out against it. Like, for example, a recent entry into the Republican presidential campaign said some very inflammatory things about Mexicans. Everybody should stand up and say thats not acceptable. You know you dont talk like that on talk radio. You dont talk like that on the kind of political campaigns. I think he is emblematic. So I want people to understand, its not just him, its about everybody. The second thing is guns. Lets just cut to the chase its guns.

That's Hillary, not Bill, just in case to avoid confusion.

I said basically the same thing in the Police thread last week, only in my post I was speaking to the bad behaviors on the Left, particularly the overplaying of the race card. This type of violence was exactly what I was afraid of. And as we heard yesterday from one of Roof's friends, the race baiting that went on with Trayvon Martin and Walter Scott were specifically mentioned as having incited Roof.

Such utter and complete bull####.

Yeah, you said that last week. You were wrong then, and when proven this week you were wrong, you persist in doubling down on your idiocy. Here is the quote and a link to the article: http://abcnews.go.com/US/friend-accused-sc-shooter-claims-wanted-start-race/story?id=31874063

A friend of accused Charleston church shooter claims that the suspect had spoken about how he was angered by the uproar over the Trayvon Martin shooting and wanted something to spark up the race war again.

It's pretty much an undeniable fact that my statement was and is correct. It sounds like you don't like the reality of the statement, which is a different matter entirely, and open for debate - if only you could find the right words to express yourself.

 

[mcintyre1]

Last night Clinton told host John Ralston, We have to have a candid national conversation about race, and about discrimination, prejudice, hatred. The people who do this kind of dastardly, horrible act are a very small percentage. But unfortunately public discourse is sometimes hotter and more negative than it should be, which can, in my opinion, trigger people who is less than stable to do something like this.

Clinton continued, I think we have to speak out against it. Like, for example, a recent entry into the Republican presidential campaign said some very inflammatory things about Mexicans. Everybody should stand up and say thats not acceptable. You know you dont talk like that on talk radio. You dont talk like that on the kind of political campaigns. I think he is emblematic. So I want people to understand, its not just him, its about everybody. The second thing is guns. Lets just cut to the chase its guns.

That's Hillary, not Bill, just in case to avoid confusion.

I said basically the same thing in the Police thread last week, only in my post I was speaking to the bad behaviors on the Left, particularly the overplaying of the race card. This type of violence was exactly what I was afraid of. And as we heard yesterday from one of Roof's friends, the race baiting that went on with Trayvon Martin and Walter Scott were specifically mentioned as having incited Roof.

Such utter and complete bull####.

Yeah, you said that last week. You were wrong then, and when proven this week you were wrong, you persist in doubling down on your idiocy. Here is the quote and a link to the article: http://abcnews.go.com/US/friend-accused-sc-shooter-claims-wanted-start-race/story?id=31874063

A friend of accused Charleston church shooter claims that the suspect had spoken about how he was angered by the uproar over the Trayvon Martin shooting and wanted something to spark up the race war again.

It's pretty much an undeniable fact that my statement was and is correct. It sounds like you don't like the reality of the statement, which is a different matter entirely, and open for debate - if only you could find the right words to express yourself.

So its the fault of the "Left" and African-Americans "playing the race card" for this guy shooting up a church? Yeah, alright buddy.

 

[urbanhack]

Last night Clinton told host John Ralston, We have to have a candid national conversation about race, and about discrimination, prejudice, hatred. The people who do this kind of dastardly, horrible act are a very small percentage. But unfortunately public discourse is sometimes hotter and more negative than it should be, which can, in my opinion, trigger people who is less than stable to do something like this.

Clinton continued, I think we have to speak out against it. Like, for example, a recent entry into the Republican presidential campaign said some very inflammatory things about Mexicans. Everybody should stand up and say thats not acceptable. You know you dont talk like that on talk radio. You dont talk like that on the kind of political campaigns. I think he is emblematic. So I want people to understand, its not just him, its about everybody. The second thing is guns. Lets just cut to the chase its guns.

That's Hillary, not Bill, just in case to avoid confusion.

I said basically the same thing in the Police thread last week, only in my post I was speaking to the bad behaviors on the Left, particularly the overplaying of the race card. This type of violence was exactly what I was afraid of. And as we heard yesterday from one of Roof's friends, the race baiting that went on with Trayvon Martin and Walter Scott were specifically mentioned as having incited Roof.

Such utter and complete bull####.

Yeah, you said that last week. You were wrong then, and when proven this week you were wrong, you persist in doubling down on your idiocy. Here is the quote and a link to the article: http://abcnews.go.com/US/friend-accused-sc-shooter-claims-wanted-start-race/story?id=31874063

A friend of accused Charleston church shooter claims that the suspect had spoken about how he was angered by the uproar over the Trayvon Martin shooting and wanted something to spark up the race war again.

It's pretty much an undeniable fact that my statement was and is correct. It sounds like you don't like the reality of the statement, which is a different matter entirely, and open for debate - if only you could find the right words to express yourself.

So its the fault of the "Left" and African-Americans "playing the race card" for this guy shooting up a church? Yeah, alright buddy.

It's race baiting bro....get it straight!

 

[timschochet]

I think maybe Ronald Reagan and other dead Republicans joined forces with race baiters on the left and conspired to make this happen.

 

[General Tso]

Last night Clinton told host John Ralston, We have to have a candid national conversation about race, and about discrimination, prejudice, hatred. The people who do this kind of dastardly, horrible act are a very small percentage. But unfortunately public discourse is sometimes hotter and more negative than it should be, which can, in my opinion, trigger people who is less than stable to do something like this.

Clinton continued, I think we have to speak out against it. Like, for example, a recent entry into the Republican presidential campaign said some very inflammatory things about Mexicans. Everybody should stand up and say thats not acceptable. You know you dont talk like that on talk radio. You dont talk like that on the kind of political campaigns. I think he is emblematic. So I want people to understand, its not just him, its about everybody. The second thing is guns. Lets just cut to the chase its guns.

That's Hillary, not Bill, just in case to avoid confusion.

I said basically the same thing in the Police thread last week, only in my post I was speaking to the bad behaviors on the Left, particularly the overplaying of the race card. This type of violence was exactly what I was afraid of. And as we heard yesterday from one of Roof's friends, the race baiting that went on with Trayvon Martin and Walter Scott were specifically mentioned as having incited Roof.

Such utter and complete bull####.

Yeah, you said that last week. You were wrong then, and when proven this week you were wrong, you persist in doubling down on your idiocy. Here is the quote and a link to the article: http://abcnews.go.com/US/friend-accused-sc-shooter-claims-wanted-start-race/story?id=31874063

A friend of accused Charleston church shooter claims that the suspect had spoken about how he was angered by the uproar over the Trayvon Martin shooting and wanted something to spark up the race war again.

It's pretty much an undeniable fact that my statement was and is correct. It sounds like you don't like the reality of the statement, which is a different matter entirely, and open for debate - if only you could find the right words to express yourself.

So its the fault of the "Left" and African-Americans "playing the race card" for this guy shooting up a church? Yeah, alright buddy.

It's pretty much an undeniable truth that the race baiting that's been going on is fueling a lot of the passions. How do you explain race relations being at a 25 year low? What are whites upset about that is being reflected in the polls? There aren't any racial killings of whites by blacks. Whites aren't getting abused by police. So what is it? Where is the anger coming from? I think it's pretty obvious that t's coming from the incessant race baiting, especially in all the recent incidents where race wasn't proven to be a factor (ie - all the cop brutality cases). Any other ideas where it's coming from, buddy?This is exactly what I was talking about earlier. The Left is full of #### when they say it's time for an honest dialogue about racial relations in this country. I see a lot of Conservatives in here today (myself included) willing to make concessions in the areas of gun control and the Confederate flag issue. But when you try to call the Left in the incessant race baiting that is causing just as big a rift between the races, all you get us the same old snyde remarks and insinuations of racism.

 

[General Tso]

I think maybe Ronald Reagan and other dead Republicans joined forces with race baiters on the left and conspired to make this happen.

Fair point about the old school Repubucans race baiting as well, especially in the 80's. Which is one of the main reasons I was a Liberal during that decade.

 

[jonessed]

At least least it's not Bush's fault anymore. That's a step in the right direction.

 

[Widbil83]

I'm kind of surprised Hillary would rush to the microphone to politicize this event.

Just kidding. We all knew this would happen.

That whole statement is like a laundry list of political talking points all thrown on the back of one event.

She is one of the most influential Americans...of course she is going to speak to this.

WTF is wrong with people.

Well there is a difference between commenting on the matter and completely politicizing it. Blaming freaking Donald Trump (who has literally been a candidate for 3 days) for what his roommate says was in the works for 6 months is stupid. So is blaming talk radio and the "guns." Not once does she blame the piece of ####.

 

[QuizGuy66]

While I'm sure if I read through the thread I will see a lot of uplifting takes, I come back with a basic question for any lawyerguys.

The families of the victims were afforded the change to speak (via video) to the (murdering piece of garbage) 'suspect' during his first court appearance. Is this a common occurrence in trials or a relatively new phenomenon. Just curious as I can't recall seeing this occur before.

Thx.

-QG

 

[George Jefferson Airplane]

There aren't any racial killings of whites by blacks.

There are plenty. They just don't get national media attention.

:X

 

[Fennis]

http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/charleston-church-shooting/hate-wont-win-kin-victims-address-church-shooter-dylann-roof-n378641

Is it me or does the guard standing behind the shooter look like his brother?

why do families of victims make statements at bond hearings?

 

[General Tso]

There aren't any racial killings of whites by blacks.

There are plenty. They just don't get national media attention.

:X

Why the disgust with a simple truthful statement? Honestly, that kind of reaction is what helps fuel people like Roof because they feel that nobody is listening to their concerns, the system is rigged against them, and they become even more extreme as a result.

Here's an example of a horrific murder where black killer was very frank about why he targeted white women. The matter didn't get national media attention:

"I shot her in the back of the neck and she dropped to the ground," said Thandiwe. "I didn't touch her."

Thandiwe said he stole Watts' car and likely drove over her body while leaving. His rage didn't stop with Watts.

Thandiwe admitted to shooting Tiffany Ferenczy in the calf and shooting and paralyzing Lauren Garcia as they walked across Crescent Avenue.

"It was almost like watching myself in action not being able to control what happened, not being consciously connected to my body," said Thandiwe.

All of Thandiwe's victims are white. He said during his last few years in college, his history studies changed his thoughts about how some white people treated black people.

"In terms of slavery and race, it was something that needed to be answered for. I saw it as something that the black community hasn't recovered from so my initial way to handle that was to spread information to help combat some of the ignorance that was in the black community about our history," said Thandiwe.

"Correct me if I'm wrong, but you were trying to spread the message of making white people the enemy," asked Assistant District Attorney Linda Dunikoski.

"Yes," replied Thandiwe.

Thandiwe told jurors the night before the killed Watts some white people attended a meeting he felt was only for black people. He said part of that anger was with him the day of the shootings.

http://www.cbs46.com/story/20816605/man-accused-of-murder-in-midtown-atlanta-parking-garage-takes-the-stand#ixzz3dYADAPcu

Narry a mention of it on CNN, which is based in the hometown where this hate crime occurred.But you know who does publish stuff like this? And the hypocrisy of the Liberal press? The skinhead sites that cater to these disaffected, sick people.

 

[Sammy3469]

http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/charleston-church-shooting/hate-wont-win-kin-victims-address-church-shooter-dylann-roof-n378641

Is it me or does the guard standing behind the shooter look like his brother?

why do families of victims make statements at bond hearings?

Why to idiotic judges make idiotic statements (and I'm paraphrasing here) about having sympathy for the shooters family?

The whole thing was completely odd.

 

[timschochet]

Yes Olaf nobody is listening to Roof's concerns. The system is rigged against him. No wonder he killed those 9 people.

JFC

 

[General Tso]

Yes Olaf nobody is listening to Roof's concerns. The system is rigged against him. No wonder he killed those 9 people.

JFC

You are subtlety implying that he is justifying the actions. Further evidence that Liberals have no interest whatsoever in having on honest discussion about understanding some of the root causes for these types of incidents. Your dismissal of these disaffected people doesn't make the problem go away Tim. There are plenty of people out there who feel as disaffected and angry as Dylan Storm Roof, and they have a whole lot of weapons.

 

[Maurile Tremblay]

Jon Stewart pretty much hits the nail on the head.

That was powerful. Not quite David Letterman after 9/11, but somewhat reminiscent.

Larry Wilcox is worthwhile as well.

 

[jonessed]

Yes Olaf nobody is listening to Roof's concerns. The system is rigged against him. No wonder he killed those 9 people.

JFC

What is wrong with you?

 

[Sammy3469]

Lol...blame the liberals for looks like Roof...that's the ticket.

 

[timschochet]

Yes Olaf nobody is listening to Roof's concerns. The system is rigged against him. No wonder he killed those 9 people.

JFC

Stop being your typical self, and at least try to be fair.

You know full well that I didn't I didn't suggest, "No wonder he killed those nine people.'

Nor did I say the sytem is actually rigged against Roof. I said, "that kind of reaction is what helps fuel people like Roof because they feel that nobody is listening to their concerns, the system is rigged against them." Can you understand the difference between reality and perception, Timmy? Are blacks on the whole out to get white people? No. Did Roof perceive that blacks on the whole were out to get white people? Yes. Perception, not reality. motivated Roof.

You're always harping about the prevalence of white racism. Is white racism as widespread and all encompassing as you believe? No. But that perception shapes your views, as well as millions like you. Perception is often stronger than reality in shaping views.

And you'll criticize Roof, but you're doing the very thing that helps make people like Roof. You'll write endlessly (and I do mean endlessly) about how we need to listen the concerns of this minority group or that minority group, but when it comes to listening to the concerns of a white person before they become more extreme, "Sorry, we can't listen you. And, well, we'll mock you." Of course, they'll then turn to an audience they feel hears and shares their concerns.

This isn't rocket science, Tim, but I'm not surprised you can't figure it out.

Oh I figured it out the first time. If only me and other people would stop and really LISTEN to the whiny victimhood complaints of white racists like Roof, perhaps they wouldn't go around killing people.

 

[Leviathan]

Yeah...I don't think "race baiting" is the root cause of Roof's anger.

I'm guessing he's a psychopathic racist who more than likely had a terrible upbringing. The latter is pure speculation on my part.

 

[Doctor Detroit]

Yes Olaf nobody is listening to Roof's concerns. The system is rigged against him. No wonder he killed those 9 people.

JFC

Stop being your typical self, and at least try to be fair.

You know full well that I didn't I didn't suggest, "No wonder he killed those nine people.'

Nor did I say the sytem is actually rigged against Roof. I said, "that kind of reaction is what helps fuel people like Roof because they feel that nobody is listening to their concerns, the system is rigged against them." Can you understand the difference between reality and perception, Timmy? Are blacks on the whole out to get white people? No. Did Roof perceive that blacks on the whole were out to get white people? Yes. Perception, not reality. motivated Roof.

You're always harping about the prevalence of white racism. Is white racism as widespread and all encompassing as you believe? No. But that perception shapes your views, as well as millions like you. Perception is often stronger than reality in shaping views.

And you'll criticize Roof, but you're doing the very thing that helps make people like Roof. You'll write endlessly (and I do mean endlessly) about how we need to listen the concerns of this minority group or that minority group, but when it comes to listening to the concerns of a white person before they become more extreme, "Sorry, we can't listen you. And, well, we'll mock you." Of course, they'll then turn to an audience they feel hears and shares their concerns.

This isn't rocket science, Tim, but I'm not surprised you can't figure it out.

Oh I figured it out the first time. If only me and other people would stop and really LISTEN to the whiny victimhood complaints of white racists like Roof, perhaps they wouldn't go around killing people.

Strikes2Olaf gonna strikes2olaf. You should get a Jonessed/Strikes2k IP alert meter so you know when they are following you around. Then again, you really just have to post and they arrive live a fart at a burrito shop.

 

[jonessed]

Yes Olaf nobody is listening to Roof's concerns. The system is rigged against him. No wonder he killed those 9 people.

JFC

Stop being your typical self, and at least try to be fair.

You know full well that I didn't I didn't suggest, "No wonder he killed those nine people.'

Nor did I say the sytem is actually rigged against Roof. I said, "that kind of reaction is what helps fuel people like Roof because they feel that nobody is listening to their concerns, the system is rigged against them." Can you understand the difference between reality and perception, Timmy? Are blacks on the whole out to get white people? No. Did Roof perceive that blacks on the whole were out to get white people? Yes. Perception, not reality. motivated Roof.

You're always harping about the prevalence of white racism. Is white racism as widespread and all encompassing as you believe? No. But that perception shapes your views, as well as millions like you. Perception is often stronger than reality in shaping views.

And you'll criticize Roof, but you're doing the very thing that helps make people like Roof. You'll write endlessly (and I do mean endlessly) about how we need to listen the concerns of this minority group or that minority group, but when it comes to listening to the concerns of a white person before they become more extreme, "Sorry, we can't listen you. And, well, we'll mock you." Of course, they'll then turn to an audience they feel hears and shares their concerns.

This isn't rocket science, Tim, but I'm not surprised you can't figure it out.

Oh I figured it out the first time. If only me and other people would stop and really LISTEN to the whiny victimhood complaints of white racists like Roof, perhaps they wouldn't go around killing people.

Strikes2Olaf gonna strikes2olaf. You should get a Jonessed/Strikes2k IP alert meter so you know when they are following you around. Then again, you really just have to post and they arrive live a fart at a burrito shop.

It's so sweet you keep track of my posts

 

[Doctor Detroit]

Yes Olaf nobody is listening to Roof's concerns. The system is rigged against him. No wonder he killed those 9 people.

JFC

Stop being your typical self, and at least try to be fair.

You know full well that I didn't I didn't suggest, "No wonder he killed those nine people.'

Nor did I say the sytem is actually rigged against Roof. I said, "that kind of reaction is what helps fuel people like Roof because they feel that nobody is listening to their concerns, the system is rigged against them." Can you understand the difference between reality and perception, Timmy? Are blacks on the whole out to get white people? No. Did Roof perceive that blacks on the whole were out to get white people? Yes. Perception, not reality. motivated Roof.

You're always harping about the prevalence of white racism. Is white racism as widespread and all encompassing as you believe? No. But that perception shapes your views, as well as millions like you. Perception is often stronger than reality in shaping views.

And you'll criticize Roof, but you're doing the very thing that helps make people like Roof. You'll write endlessly (and I do mean endlessly) about how we need to listen the concerns of this minority group or that minority group, but when it comes to listening to the concerns of a white person before they become more extreme, "Sorry, we can't listen you. And, well, we'll mock you." Of course, they'll then turn to an audience they feel hears and shares their concerns.

This isn't rocket science, Tim, but I'm not surprised you can't figure it out.

Oh I figured it out the first time. If only me and other people would stop and really LISTEN to the whiny victimhood complaints of white racists like Roof, perhaps they wouldn't go around killing people.

Strikes2Olaf gonna strikes2olaf. You should get a Jonessed/Strikes2k IP alert meter so you know when they are following you around. Then again, you really just have to post and they arrive live a fart at a burrito shop.

It's so sweet you keep track of my posts

I just go to Tim's posts and *POOF*, there you are. Instant dip####.

 

[timschochet]

Yes Olaf nobody is listening to Roof's concerns. The system is rigged against him. No wonder he killed those 9 people.

JFC

Stop being your typical self, and at least try to be fair.

You know full well that I didn't I didn't suggest, "No wonder he killed those nine people.'

Nor did I say the sytem is actually rigged against Roof. I said, "that kind of reaction is what helps fuel people like Roof because they feel that nobody is listening to their concerns, the system is rigged against them." Can you understand the difference between reality and perception, Timmy? Are blacks on the whole out to get white people? No. Did Roof perceive that blacks on the whole were out to get white people? Yes. Perception, not reality. motivated Roof.

You're always harping about the prevalence of white racism. Is white racism as widespread and all encompassing as you believe? No. But that perception shapes your views, as well as millions like you. Perception is often stronger than reality in shaping views.

And you'll criticize Roof, but you're doing the very thing that helps make people like Roof. You'll write endlessly (and I do mean endlessly) about how we need to listen the concerns of this minority group or that minority group, but when it comes to listening to the concerns of a white person before they become more extreme, "Sorry, we can't listen you. And, well, we'll mock you." Of course, they'll then turn to an audience they feel hears and shares their concerns.

This isn't rocket science, Tim, but I'm not surprised you can't figure it out.

Oh I figured it out the first time. If only me and other people would stop and really LISTEN to the whiny victimhood complaints of white racists like Roof, perhaps they wouldn't go around killing people.

Strikes2Olaf gonna strikes2olaf. You should get a Jonessed/Strikes2k IP alert meter so you know when they are following you around. Then again, you really just have to post and they arrive live a fart at a burrito shop.

Look up the page, bro. It was Tim who popped in to take the cheap shot at me, not the other way around. Kind of like you popping into a thread last night to take a cheap shot at me; and, poof, you just appear here again for the same purpose. So, really, who has the personal obsession here, Doc?

If you're going to just make stuff up, it helps to be smart enough to wait a few pages so that people can't just look up and know that you're wrong.

Anyway, feel free to post another stalking response. I have to run out on this beautiful Friday night. Have a good one.

Don't forget your hood!

 

[Doctor Detroit]

 

[rockaction]

Yes Olaf nobody is listening to Roof's concerns. The system is rigged against him. No wonder he killed those 9 people.

JFC

Stop being your typical self, and at least try to be fair.

You know full well that I didn't I didn't suggest, "No wonder he killed those nine people.'

Nor did I say the sytem is actually rigged against Roof. I said, "that kind of reaction is what helps fuel people like Roof because they feel that nobody is listening to their concerns, the system is rigged against them." Can you understand the difference between reality and perception, Timmy? Are blacks on the whole out to get white people? No. Did Roof perceive that blacks on the whole were out to get white people? Yes. Perception, not reality. motivated Roof.

You're always harping about the prevalence of white racism. Is white racism as widespread and all encompassing as you believe? No. But that perception shapes your views, as well as millions like you. Perception is often stronger than reality in shaping views.

And you'll criticize Roof, but you're doing the very thing that helps make people like Roof. You'll write endlessly (and I do mean endlessly) about how we need to listen the concerns of this minority group or that minority group, but when it comes to listening to the concerns of a white person before they become more extreme, "Sorry, we can't listen you. And, well, we'll mock you." Of course, they'll then turn to an audience they feel hears and shares their concerns.

This isn't rocket science, Tim, but I'm not surprised you can't figure it out.

Oh I figured it out the first time. If only me and other people would stop and really LISTEN to the whiny victimhood complaints of white racists like Roof, perhaps they wouldn't go around killing people.

Strikes2Olaf gonna strikes2olaf. You should get a Jonessed/Strikes2k IP alert meter so you know when they are following you around. Then again, you really just have to post and they arrive live a fart at a burrito shop.

Look up the page, bro. It was Tim who popped in to take the cheap shot at me, not the other way around. Kind of like you popping into a thread last night to take a cheap shot at me; and, poof, you just appear here again for the same purpose. So, really, who has the personal obsession here, Doc?

If you're going to just make stuff up, it helps to be smart enough to wait a few pages so that people can't just look up and know that you're wrong.

Anyway, feel free to post another stalking response. I have to run out on this beautiful Friday night. Have a good one.

Don't forget your hood!

You know, one apostrophe could change that whole dynamic. It's kind of amazing how that works.

 

[The Football Freak]

Yes Olaf nobody is listening to Roof's concerns. The system is rigged against him. No wonder he killed those 9 people.

JFC

Stop being your typical self, and at least try to be fair.

You know full well that I didn't I didn't suggest, "No wonder he killed those nine people.'

Nor did I say the sytem is actually rigged against Roof. I said, "that kind of reaction is what helps fuel people like Roof because they feel that nobody is listening to their concerns, the system is rigged against them." Can you understand the difference between reality and perception, Timmy? Are blacks on the whole out to get white people? No. Did Roof perceive that blacks on the whole were out to get white people? Yes. Perception, not reality. motivated Roof.

You're always harping about the prevalence of white racism. Is white racism as widespread and all encompassing as you believe? No. But that perception shapes your views, as well as millions like you. Perception is often stronger than reality in shaping views.

And you'll criticize Roof, but you're doing the very thing that helps make people like Roof. You'll write endlessly (and I do mean endlessly) about how we need to listen the concerns of this minority group or that minority group, but when it comes to listening to the concerns of a white person before they become more extreme, "Sorry, we can't listen you. And, well, we'll mock you." Of course, they'll then turn to an audience they feel hears and shares their concerns.

This isn't rocket science, Tim, but I'm not surprised you can't figure it out.

Oh I figured it out the first time. If only me and other people would stop and really LISTEN to the whiny victimhood complaints of white racists like Roof, perhaps they wouldn't go around killing people.

Strikes2Olaf gonna strikes2olaf. You should get a Jonessed/Strikes2k IP alert meter so you know when they are following you around. Then again, you really just have to post and they arrive live a fart at a burrito shop.

Look up the page, bro. It was Tim who popped in to take the cheap shot at me, not the other way around. Kind of like you popping into a thread last night to take a cheap shot at me; and, poof, you just appear here again for the same purpose. So, really, who has the personal obsession here, Doc?

If you're going to just make stuff up, it helps to be smart enough to wait a few pages so that people can't just look up and know that you're wrong.

Anyway, feel free to post another stalking response. I have to run out on this beautiful Friday night. Have a good one.

Don't forget your hood!

 

[SeveredHorseHeads]

Yes Olaf nobody is listening to Roof's concerns. The system is rigged against him. No wonder he killed those 9 people.

JFC

Stop being your typical self, and at least try to be fair.

You know full well that I didn't I didn't suggest, "No wonder he killed those nine people.'

Nor did I say the sytem is actually rigged against Roof. I said, "that kind of reaction is what helps fuel people like Roof because they feel that nobody is listening to their concerns, the system is rigged against them." Can you understand the difference between reality and perception, Timmy? Are blacks on the whole out to get white people? No. Did Roof perceive that blacks on the whole were out to get white people? Yes. Perception, not reality. motivated Roof.

You're always harping about the prevalence of white racism. Is white racism as widespread and all encompassing as you believe? No. But that perception shapes your views, as well as millions like you. Perception is often stronger than reality in shaping views.

And you'll criticize Roof, but you're doing the very thing that helps make people like Roof. You'll write endlessly (and I do mean endlessly) about how we need to listen the concerns of this minority group or that minority group, but when it comes to listening to the concerns of a white person before they become more extreme, "Sorry, we can't listen you. And, well, we'll mock you." Of course, they'll then turn to an audience they feel hears and shares their concerns.

This isn't rocket science, Tim, but I'm not surprised you can't figure it out.

Oh I figured it out the first time. If only me and other people would stop and really LISTEN to the whiny victimhood complaints of white racists like Roof, perhaps they wouldn't go around killing people.

Strikes2Olaf gonna strikes2olaf. You should get a Jonessed/Strikes2k IP alert meter so you know when they are following you around. Then again, you really just have to post and they arrive live a fart at a burrito shop.

Look up the page, bro. It was Tim who popped in to take the cheap shot at me, not the other way around. Kind of like you popping into a thread last night to take a cheap shot at me; and, poof, you just appear here again for the same purpose. So, really, who has the personal obsession here, Doc?

If you're going to just make stuff up, it helps to be smart enough to wait a few pages so that people can't just look up and know that you're wrong.

Anyway, feel free to post another stalking response. I have to run out on this beautiful Friday night. Have a good one.

Don't forget your hood!

 

[pollardsvision]

Jon Stewart pretty much hits the nail on the head.

That was powerful. Not quite David Letterman after 9/11, but somewhat reminiscent.

Larry Wilcox is worthwhile as well.

I appreciated Stewart;s words from the sheer anger and frustration they conveyed, but I'm not sure it made a lot of sense and certainly didn't offer any solutions. He made sure to point out, in various ways, that he was sure "nothing would be done about it" or that there wouldn't be the proper level of outrage (I think he's off base with the latter). But again, no solutions. I think that describes most of us. Outraged, but clueless on what to do about it.

I'm mostly a liberal and I love Stewart, but the words seemed to miss the mark here, even if the tone was spot on. Though, I just don't think anyone can find the words to make any sense of this.

 

[SacramentoBob]

If only the media would report more on stories about violent crimes against white people this country would be a better place to live.

 

[pollardsvision]

On Stewart's point though, I agree we should look at anything we can that might help stop fostering and encouraging these sort of racist nutjobs. I just have no clue how you do that. Changing street names and taking down flags over state capitols (while fine ideas for other reasons) probably doesn't do this. He was clearly throwing shots at FOX, but I don't think we can do much to change FOX (though I'd love to see it). He didn't offer any solutions for it, and I can't imagine what any might be.

To risk falling into the "whadya gonna do?" trap, I'm not sure how you stop downtrodden white trash from seeing others as the enemy holding them down and acting out on it.

 

[chauncey]

The statements by the families of the victims in court was pretty powerful. Hopefully their message of peace, love, forgiveness, and justice will be heard by the angry (justifiably) black folks, the racist and hate filled white sociopaths, and the blood thirsty media and their sheep.

It is sad that so much of the racism in this country is fueled by liberal media, extreme hateful conspiracy websites, social media, and the influence of backwards family members. When two people of different races can sit down with no agenda and share a meal, drink, conversation, or even bible study they usually find that people are generally good and have more in common than not.

This terrible tragedy could cause a paradigm shift in race relations if politicians, media, and we the people focused on these families responses rather than bicker about mental illness, gun control, terrorism, flags, which race kills more of the other race, etc.

Unfortunately messages of love and peace do not increase votes, bank rolls, or web clicks.

 

[General Tso]

Jon Stewart pretty much hits the nail on the head.

That was powerful. Not quite David Letterman after 9/11, but somewhat reminiscent.

Larry Wilcox is worthwhile as well.

I appreciated Stewart;s words from the sheer anger and frustration they conveyed, but I'm not sure it made a lot of sense and certainly didn't offer any solutions. He made sure to point out, in various ways, that he was sure "nothing would be done about it" or that there wouldn't be the proper level of outrage (I think he's off base with the latter). But again, no solutions. I think that describes most of us. Outraged, but clueless on what to do about it.

I'm mostly a liberal and I love Stewart, but the words seemed to miss the mark here, even if the tone was spot on. Though, I just don't think anyone can find the words to make any sense of this.

There are some things we can do about it. Most of them wouldn't cost a damn thing either.1. Take all Confederate flags off of public land.

2. Call all the major news networks into the Oval Office and tell them to knock it off with the race baiting. On both sides. Report the news and stop creating the news. Don't attribute racism to an incident unless there is proof of it.

3. Institute a police reform bill that calls for mandatory training on spotting and counteracting implicit bias; national best practices with a revised look at how and when to use leathal and non lethal force; mandatory use of body cameras; national oversight of all police investigations involving use of deadly force to insure consistency and a non-biased approach; and incentives to local police forces that have a police racial profile that is within 10% of the community's racial makeup.

4. Start having an open discussion on returning some semblance of family to the inner city cultures. 72% of all black kids being born out of wedlock is unacceptable. Incentivize black men to be more local and more involved with the children they father. The kids need it, and the fathers need it too (More so than they probably realize)

5. More private school voucher programs in places like Baltimore where the public school systems have failed. Give the parents a check for $17,000. That will buy a pretty damn good private school education.

That's just off the top of my head. There's a lot more we can do. We choose not to. We'd rather live in the problem than live in the solution.

 

[tri-man 47]

I agree we need to address the root causes, which include a focus on the family structure and the importance of education.

(I'd personally tack on serious gun control, but that's just me. I saw a meme on Facebook noting we recall Tylenol over 7 deaths; Pintos over 20-some deaths; but for tens of thousands of shooting deaths we do nothing.)

 

[BigSteelThrill]

It is sad that so much of the racism in this country is fueled by liberal media,

Orwellian.

 

[rockaction]

Nothing is more Orwellian than the leftist that doesn't understand America in any sort of historical context.

 

[urbanhack]

Nothing is more Orwellian than the leftist that doesn't understand America in any sort of historical context.

How so? Which parts as they relate to race, racism, etc? How is that Orwellian?? Do tell.

 

[rockaction]

Nothing is more Orwellian than the leftist that doesn't understand America in any sort of historical context.

How so? Which parts as they relate to race, racism, etc? How is that Orwellian?? Do tell.

Oh, I don't know, that maybe it's the first and foremost radically democratic experiment known to man that succeeded and that other countries, who were either totalitarian or aristocratic-totalitarian, mostly fell into line with. It has warts, of course. But it would seem Orwellian to state that America is the enemy of the good. Especially considering that Orwell was a socialist, and that socialists consider history.

How's that? Am I making sense? Do you know what history means to Orwell, or how he would view Newspeak and doubleplusungood and why he would view it this way?

To jump in and judge America outside of its historical context is to simply ignore history, both as a philosophical construct and as an absolute one, which Orwell would never do.

Would you like more? People from every country in the world, at every turn, have come to study the United States of America. Its human rights recognitions are staggering when history is considered, its democracy is legend, its rights are self-evident, its wisdom possibly providential.

Carry on, urbanhack.

 

[rockaction]

“The most effective way to destroy people is to deny and obliterate their own understanding of their history.”
― George Orwell

That's why removing historical context from America's radically democratic experiment and replacing it with self-flagellating guilt is Orwellian. But all that took was an understanding of Hegel, Marx, the concept of socialist conceptions of dialectic and history, and the understanding that Orwell was a socialist who took history seriously.

 

[Sammy3469]

Yup...I'm sure racists in South Carolina are influenced by the liberal media when they switch the channel from Fox News. What a flat out stupid red herring.

 

[timschochet]

What liberal media?

 

[Leviathan]

What liberal media?

I'm a gun owner. I live in the same state as you do, Tim. We have the strictest gun control laws in the country; and frankly, I'm sorta begrudgingly OK with that. Has it helped? Maybe, I don't know. When the Colorado theater shooting happened, I was disgusted with "the shooter may be a registered Tea Party member" narrative.

Unnecessary and inflammatory, IMO.

There are better ways to report the "news".

 

[BigSteelThrill]

Yup...I'm sure racists in South Carolina are influenced by the liberal media when they switch the channel from Fox News. What a flat out stupid red herring.

 

[rockaction]

So accidental, so awesome. Orwell and the postmodern fight over history, which Jon Stewart just exemplified and embodied last night. Thank you, New Left and urbanhack and BST for wandering into Orwell-land.

[SIZE=11pt]‘Comrade Ogilvy, unimagined an hour ago, was now a fact. Comrade Ogilvy, who had never existed in the present, now existed in the past, and when once the act of forgery was forgotten, he would exist just as authentically, and upon the same evidence, as Charlemagne or Julius Caesar’ (Orwell, pp.47-48). ‘It might very well be that literally every word in the history books, even the things that one accepted without question, was pure fantasy. For all he knew there might never have been any such law as the [/SIZE][SIZE=11pt]jus primae noctis, [/SIZE][SIZE=11pt]or any such creature as a capitalist, or any such garment as a top hat. Everything faded into mist. The past was erased, the erasure was forgotten, the lie became truth’ (Orwell, pp.74-75). ‘It was always difficult to determine the age of a London building. Anything large and impressive, if it was reasonably new in appearance, was automatically claimed as having been built since the Revolution, while anything that was obviously of earlier date was ascribed to some dim period called the Middle Ages. The centuries of capitalism were held to have produced nothing of any value. One could not learn history from architecture any more than one could learn it from books. Statues, inscriptions, memorial stones, the names of streets – anything that might throw light upon the past had been systematically altered’ (Orwell, p. 98). ‘Just once in his life he had possessed – [/SIZE][SIZE=11pt]after [/SIZE][SIZE=11pt]the event: that was what counted – concrete, unmistakable evidence of an act of falsification’ (Orwell, pp.74-75). [/SIZE]

 

[joffer]

this thread should be moved to the "posters that can comprehend a rockaction post" forum. TIA

 

[rockaction]

Yeah.

 

[mr roboto]

this thread should be moved to the "posters that can comprehend a rockaction post" forum. TIA

I agree that at first blush it's tough. But if you read enough of them you sorta get the rhythm and your mind starts filling in the gaps. I feel like I'm almost there and sometimes know exactly what he's trying to say.Kinda like those 3D pictures you have to focus just right to see.

 

[timschochet]

I understood it. It's a terrible analogy though. Just awful.

People shouldn't bring up Orwell as a comparison. It's like bringing up the Nazis. It has nothing to do with our culture, nothing to do with our media. We don't live in a dictatorship or anything close to it. The media is not out to get you.

 

[rockaction]

this thread should be moved to the "posters that can comprehend a rockaction post" forum. TIA

I agree that at first blush it's tough. But if you read enough of them you sorta get the rhythm and your mind starts filling in the gaps. I feel like I'm almost there and sometimes know exactly what he's trying to say.Kinda like those 3D pictures you have to focus just right to see.

I appreciate this post more than you can imagine. Heh. Ah, thanks.

I also would recommend that on more serious issues people put me on ignore rather than say I'm confusing. I read everybody else's posts and try to infer general themes and concentrate on exact wording. I generally am a logical guy, I just can't explain every premise that goes into my posts, nor every emotion. I'd be posting walls of text, which are totally unreadable.

 

[rockaction]

I understood it. It's a terrible analogy though. Just awful.

People shouldn't bring up Orwell as a comparison. It's like bringing up the Nazis. It has nothing to do with our culture, nothing to do with our media. We don't live in a dictatorship or anything close to it. The media is not out to get you.

How so? It wasn't my bidding to bring up Orwell, but now that it's brought up by somebody other than me, the postmodern fight over American history seems relevant. Are we going to recreate objective history by wiping away street names, architecture, monuments, inscriptions? Isn't that passage saying that if you lose the historical written narrative, and even the replications of historical images and their inscriptions, you're losing history? If it comes at the hands of the academicians or the government, what's the difference?

Stewart came close to advocating this the other night. He specifically mentioned street names and symbols.

eta* Also, thanks for understanding what I'm saying. To fight against people that are painting you as "sad," "flabbergasting," "confused," "[difficult to understand even though I can read]" is weird, and off-putting, especially when you've followed every post and its logical implications since Page Nine.

eta2* From the same paper I cited above. (Italics and emphasis mine.)

[SIZE=11pt]As Marc Ferro (Ferro, 2002 and 2003) and Margaret Macmillan have shown, one does not have to live in a totalitarian society or under an authoritarian government to witness the kind of ‘use and abuse’ of history depicted above. In France, the [/SIZE][SIZE=11pt]lois mémorielles [/SIZE][SIZE=11pt]try to impose the official position of the state, in this case the French one, regarding some historical facts, and in 2005 a group of prominent historians and other intellectuals formed [/SIZE][SIZE=11pt]Liberté pour l’Histoire [/SIZE][SIZE=11pt]to fight against political pressures on the work of historians, who are facing a growing mingling between politics, ideology and history. In Australia, the United States or Canada, the pressure is on those historians who want to talk about the fate of the Aboriginals, or what happened in Hiroshima and Nagasaki, or the role in Second World War (Macmillan, pp. 122-128). [/SIZE]