Dexter Manley
Footballguy
Kiper may have botched BMW's ranking, but in his defense he did have Jeff George ranked like #80 on his big board when several NFL teams had him #1 on their boards.
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Mayock v. Kiper (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter LHUCKS
- Start date
B-Deep
Footballguy
well, what is their verdict?
LHUCKS
Footballguy
It's silly to take a look at one call and then come to a conclusion regarding an evaluator's ability.
Chaos Commish
Footballguy
it isn't accurate either.
eta iirc all they do is rank mocks by number of first rounders correctly tabbed as first rounders. It's a lousy gauge of accuracy.
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B-Deep
Footballguy
it is like trying to catch smoke in a bottle.....it isn't accurate either.
Leroy Hoard
Footballguy
I like the fact that Mel Kiper looks like Dracula. He even sleeps in a coffin 10 months a year until it's draft time.
Aaronstory
Footballguy
Mayock.....and it isn't even close.
Jack Burton
Footballguy
Mayock is the better of the two
chook
Footballguy
massraider
Footballguy
I stopped at 7:05 a.m. Did it get funnier?
chook
Footballguy
Not really. Worse actually. But it poked fun at Kiper, and not being his biggest fan it at least made me smile to think that there are others out there unimpressed with him enough to publish some satire about the man, however rubbish it may be.
Ramblin Wreck
Footballguy
I like both Mayock and Kiper. Problem with Kiper is that ESPN doesn't have enough Kiper during the draft. It's too much Berman and some other schmucks like him. I'll be 80% NFL-N and 20% ESPN most likely because Berman is so awful.
Guinis72
Footballguy
Kiper is the "OG" of draft analysis, I"ll stick with my roots on draft day. 
I'll probably give them both a little airtime though and see which one I'm enjoying more. While I agree that Mayock is a little more knowledgable, I do like Kiper's delivery more.
HD could also be a factor, anyone know if NFLN can do HD on DirecTv?
I'll probably give them both a little airtime though and see which one I'm enjoying more. While I agree that Mayock is a little more knowledgable, I do like Kiper's delivery more.HD could also be a factor, anyone know if NFLN can do HD on DirecTv?
Mahoney
Footballguy
Personally I like Kiper because I love his schtick. It's like tradition. It's the only time a year you really see him. He's a loud passionate character that seems suited to be announcing WWE pay-per-views. And I think for the most part he has excellent information. So he's not right all the time? Nobody is.
I do like Mayock as well. He is excellent but in my mind when I think of watching the NFL draft there is only one person who comes to mind, Mel Kiper. He's the Godfather of Draft prognosticators.
You know what would make for a great sohw?
Kiper, Mayock, Zimmerman and Gosselin. Sitting around a table. Maybe toss a Rich Eisen in to mediate. Now that would be fun. It would border on magical.
I do like Mayock as well. He is excellent but in my mind when I think of watching the NFL draft there is only one person who comes to mind, Mel Kiper. He's the Godfather of Draft prognosticators.
You know what would make for a great sohw?
Kiper, Mayock, Zimmerman and Gosselin. Sitting around a table. Maybe toss a Rich Eisen in to mediate. Now that would be fun. It would border on magical.
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Chaos Commish
Footballguy
I really want to like Kiper. He is the mainstream media face of the NFL DRaft, and I appreciate that. I will watch both networks and go with the one that is less annoying, switching back and forth as I get annoyed.
Mayock is a much better source in the run up to the draft because he is as or more connected, and he knows the game much better and enjoys educating us
by breaking down tape.
On draft day they are pretty equal, Berman being the biggest problem. But on a more personal level, Mayock is the kind most of us can better relate to. Mayock talks to his audience. Kiper lectures it.
Mayock is a much better source in the run up to the draft because he is as or more connected, and he knows the game much better and enjoys educating us
by breaking down tape.On draft day they are pretty equal, Berman being the biggest problem. But on a more personal level, Mayock is the kind most of us can better relate to. Mayock talks to his audience. Kiper lectures it.
NorrisB
Footballguy
It's silly to take a look at one call and then come to a conclusion regarding an evaluator's ability.
Not to mention BMW is only 23
massraider
Footballguy
Hey, I agree with this, but doesn't it seem like there's less Kiper than recent years? Heck, he got more coverage years ago, when he and Bob Ley would be sitting in front of his big board. Now, he's finally at the adults table, and Tom Jackson has more face time. That's inexcusable.I love Kiper's rat-a-tat-tat delivery, but I'm just not going to sit through the rest of those jerkys to hear him.
LHUCKS
Footballguy
Agreed, Jackson and Berman detract from the event IMHO which is why I'll watch both. Any time Mayock or Kiper are talking that's the Television I'll be listening to.
Chaos Commish
Footballguy
Another big mistake by Espn is Todd McShay. I know he hails from Scouts Inc and all, but he's a mistake. He is uninfomed way too often. He doesn't make sense. And he has no business taking air time from Jaws, Mort or Mel.ESPN will roll with the following crew for Draft Saturday.Berman - Host
Kiper - Prospect Commentary 
Mort - Franchise Commentary McShay - Prospect Commentary 
Keyshawn - Unintentional Comic Releif 
Mahoney
Footballguy
Agreed. It's weird....almost like they almost try to bottle him up. Everytime everyone breaks into the "Lockeroom" attittude where they all start yelling over each other and laughing, Mel just sits there. With the look of a boy who doesn't want to jump in because he'll get scolded. Maybe it's just him trying to stay out of that schtick. They have definitely cut his time too much. And the player round tables are dreadful.
massraider
Footballguy
An article from USA Today regarding the two networks coverage.
http://www.usatoday.com/sports/columnist/h...d-weekend_N.htm
The relevant portion:
The NFL Network is planning things you won't see on ESPN. It will mount a camera on a boat Wisconsin lineman Joe Thomas, expected to be a high first-round pick, will be fishing in on a Wisconsin lake Saturday.
"We'll be the only one with him in the middle of the lake," Weinberger said. "I hope he gets cellphone reception" — so the onboard camera can catch Thomas hearing from the team picking him.
The NFL Network will unveil a "fan confessional room" to interview die-hards. And analyst Jamie Dukes will respond to viewer e-mails, Weinberger said, as a "sort of stock analyst, like (CNBC's) Mad Money, on the value of picks."
ESPN, Rothman said, will have what amounts to two-channel coverage. While ESPN looks forward to the next picks, ESPNews — in 55 million households compared with the NFL Network's 41 million — will dissect picks already made.
Rothman sees "an opportunity to put the new Monday night team front and center" — meaning Mike Tirico, Tony Kornheiser and Ron Jaworski, who replaced Joe Theismann— and feature an active player, the Carolina Panthers' Keyshawn Johnson, who probably could get a job at ESPN now.
Said Rothman, "He's the closest thing to Charles Barkley — quick, opinioned, funny, smart, a show-stopping type."
End of article.
Now then, I was unaware that ESPNews was going to be covering the picks already made. Frankly, this might mean I am jumping between NFLN and ESPNews. If I thought ESPN, after the first round, would actually be discussing the upcoming picks, I'd watch that, but you know they won't.
I really, really, don't care about the new MNF team, or Keyshawn's opinion on a process I am sure he couldn't care less about. It's draft day, I'm not interested in Key's audition for life after football.
I like the idea that NFL will interview the draft geeks in attendance. Beano Cook's segments back in the day used to be hysterical. He'd find some angry Jets fan, and just stick a mic in front of them.
http://www.usatoday.com/sports/columnist/h...d-weekend_N.htm
The relevant portion:
The NFL Network is planning things you won't see on ESPN. It will mount a camera on a boat Wisconsin lineman Joe Thomas, expected to be a high first-round pick, will be fishing in on a Wisconsin lake Saturday.
"We'll be the only one with him in the middle of the lake," Weinberger said. "I hope he gets cellphone reception" — so the onboard camera can catch Thomas hearing from the team picking him.
The NFL Network will unveil a "fan confessional room" to interview die-hards. And analyst Jamie Dukes will respond to viewer e-mails, Weinberger said, as a "sort of stock analyst, like (CNBC's) Mad Money, on the value of picks."
ESPN, Rothman said, will have what amounts to two-channel coverage. While ESPN looks forward to the next picks, ESPNews — in 55 million households compared with the NFL Network's 41 million — will dissect picks already made.
Rothman sees "an opportunity to put the new Monday night team front and center" — meaning Mike Tirico, Tony Kornheiser and Ron Jaworski, who replaced Joe Theismann— and feature an active player, the Carolina Panthers' Keyshawn Johnson, who probably could get a job at ESPN now.
Said Rothman, "He's the closest thing to Charles Barkley — quick, opinioned, funny, smart, a show-stopping type."
End of article.
Now then, I was unaware that ESPNews was going to be covering the picks already made. Frankly, this might mean I am jumping between NFLN and ESPNews. If I thought ESPN, after the first round, would actually be discussing the upcoming picks, I'd watch that, but you know they won't.
I really, really, don't care about the new MNF team, or Keyshawn's opinion on a process I am sure he couldn't care less about. It's draft day, I'm not interested in Key's audition for life after football.
I like the idea that NFL will interview the draft geeks in attendance. Beano Cook's segments back in the day used to be hysterical. He'd find some angry Jets fan, and just stick a mic in front of them.
Dexter Manley
Footballguy
I'm a huge Kiper fan. My only criticism of him is that he seems to have lost some of the edge he used to have. I long for the days when the dumb*** Jets drafted Jeff Lageman at #14 overall when he had a 2nd round grade, the fans in attendence went into an immediate uproar, and Kiper viciously ripped the NYJ's front office to shreds! And of course their was the infamous Trent Dilfer - Bill Polian - Kiper incident, one of my favorite draft moments. Over the last several years, it seems like he takes it easier on teams who make draft blunders, with regards to his criticism.
I agree with everyone here that Berman is an abomination, and that Kiper doesn't get enough airtime. This will be my first draft with the NFLN, so I will definitely be watching it along w/ espn, and I'll probably mix in some espnnews too.
I'm going to have to come up with a plan of attack for watching the draft. I'm going to dvr one of the channels, so i can fast forward through stuff i don't want to see. I'm currently trying to decide which channel will be best to dvr.
I agree with everyone here that Berman is an abomination, and that Kiper doesn't get enough airtime. This will be my first draft with the NFLN, so I will definitely be watching it along w/ espn, and I'll probably mix in some espnnews too.
I'm going to have to come up with a plan of attack for watching the draft. I'm going to dvr one of the channels, so i can fast forward through stuff i don't want to see. I'm currently trying to decide which channel will be best to dvr.
LHUCKS
Footballguy
Kiper found out that if he was too critical of NFL people he was going to burn too many bridges...he's walking a fine line with his criticism and I think the NFL has forced his hand a little bit.I agree though...I liked old school Kiper that would straight up insult an entire franchise.(Colts)
Simply awesome.
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