No Holding Calls Against A Steelers Opponent in 23 Quarters (1 Viewer)

[Steel Dillo]

This is pulled from the Steelers 2008 thread, but I thought it deserved its on topic.

There hasn't been a holding penalty called against a Steelers opponent in 23 quarters – a span of nearly six games.

I can't count the number of times I've watched a Left Tackle wrap his arm around Harrison's neck and basically tackle him to keep him off the QB and no flag is thrown.

What's the Shark Pool's thoughts on this?

 

[Dinsy Ejotuz]

IMO it's part of the long-running refs' conspiracy against the Steelers that started in the Superbowl vs the Seahawks.

There's just no other explanation that makes any sense.

 

[Thunderlips]

I'm not a Steelers fan...nor have I watched all of their games (about 1/2 dozen)....but that seems a bit off.

 

[Tecumseh]

Would you rather have holding calls against your opponents or phantom touchdowns against your division rival? Let's keep things in context here...

 

[treat88]

Die hard Steeler fan and not given to conspiracy theories.

With Woodley and Harrison coming off the edge as often and as hard as they do it's hard for me to believe that the refs simply aren't seeing the calls. They are obvious.

This team has caught it's share of breaks, but this has been blatant and easily seen by even a routine spectator.

Casey Hampton has more holding calls against him in the last 6 games than all the RT/LT/TE that have faced Woodley/Harrison/Smith/Farrior/Timmons combined.

Sample size is getting large enough that I'm having trouble sticking with the statistical anomaly explanation.

I'll take the W's, but damn.....

 

[Steel Dillo]

IMO it's part of the long-running refs' conspiracy against the Steelers that started in the Superbowl vs the Seahawks.There's just no other explanation that makes any sense.

Part of my reason for posting this was to provide a reponse to the people who have been claiming that the refs always favor the Steelers.Granted they have gotten some breaks in the last couple of years, but there's plenty of things that haven't gone their way also.

 

[Steel Dillo]

Would you rather have holding calls against your opponents or phantom touchdowns against your division rival? Let's keep things in context here...

See post above.

 

[ScoobyDoo]

That's the NFL. Holding is the great equalizer. It happens on every play and refs only call it when they want to to control the game.

 

[gman74]

Would you rather have holding calls against your opponents or phantom touchdowns against your division rival? Let's keep things in context here...

The honks don't like to mention all the great breaks they have had from the Superbowl run till now. I have seen a ton of Steeler games and if it is anything more than 99-1 against them they get the call

 

[mcintyre1]

I remember screaming at the TV on one of Baltimore's long pass completions after their LT put a choke hold on Harrison to keep him off the QB during a long drop back. I am surprised its been that big a stretch, though.

That said, I don't think there is any kind of conspiracy about this.

 

[Steel Dillo]

Would you rather have holding calls against your opponents or phantom touchdowns against your division rival? Let's keep things in context here...

The honks don't like to mention all the great breaks they have had from the Superbowl run till now. I have seen a ton of Steeler games and if it is anything more than 99-1 against them they get the call

This team has caught it's share of breaks

Granted they have gotten some breaks in the last couple of years

Read much? Looks like a couple of "honks" have already mentioned that we've gotten the breaks over the last few years.

 

[gman74]

Would you rather have holding calls against your opponents or phantom touchdowns against your division rival? Let's keep things in context here...

The honks don't like to mention all the great breaks they have had from the Superbowl run till now. I have seen a ton of Steeler games and if it is anything more than 99-1 against them they get the call

This team has caught it's share of breaks

Granted they have gotten some breaks in the last couple of years

Read much? Looks like a couple of "honks" have already mentioned that we've gotten the breaks over the last few years.

A couple honks do not represent the majority

 

[treat88]

Read much? Looks like a couple of "honks" have already mentioned that we've gotten the breaks over the last few years.

Since I seem to be falling in to the "honk" category in this thread, I will say I understand the sentiments that are being expressed. I don't believe they are accurate, but they are understandable.It's going to be real tough to separate emotion and logic in this discussion.However, looking at the lack of holding calls in isolation from any other "breaks", any reasonable person would admit it is a very noteworthy stat particularly given the pressure and talent this defense brings to the table.

 

[Workhorse]

Is this ACCEPTED holding calls? Or just when the refs throw the flag? I'd bet its the former and there have been some holding penalties called but denied by the Steelers. Just a guess....

 

[Modog814]

Is this ACCEPTED holding calls? Or just when the refs throw the flag? I'd bet its the former and there have been some holding penalties called but denied by the Steelers. Just a guess....

Good question....also just as a comparison, how many holding calls have been made against the Steelers in the same time span (i think there were 2 in the baltimore game, but not sure about the other 5 games)

 

[treat88]

I don't know about holding calls being declined. That is a good point.

Steelers have been called for 9 holding calls over the 6 game span in question.

 

[Godsbrother]

Is this ACCEPTED holding calls? Or just when the refs throw the flag? I'd bet its the former and there have been some holding penalties called but denied by the Steelers. Just a guess....

Good question....also just as a comparison, how many holding calls have been made against the Steelers in the same time span (i think there were 2 in the baltimore game, but not sure about the other 5 games)

I dunno but Steelers o-line makes sure they have at least a couple per game ... and usually at very inopportune times.I don't think there is a great conspiracy with refs, either for the Steelers or against. Sometimes you get calls and sometimes you don't.People that whine about a call (or noncall) need to realize there are a 100+ other plays in a game. Execute better in those plays and you don't have to worry about a play or two when an official's call (or non call) doesn't go your way.

 

[Steeler]

Good teams overcome bad (or non) calls... so far the Steelers have managed to do it more than not.

 

[Godsbrother]

I don't know about holding calls being declined. That is a good point.Steelers have been called for 9 holding calls over the 6 game span in question.

Only 9 times over the past 6 games? Damn, they ARE getting better!!!

 

[Modog814]

To answer my own question:

Over the last 6 games, Pittsburgh has been called for offensive holding a total of 10 times. 1 was declines, 1 was on a KO. 3 were called on H. Ward, 1 on H. Miller.

By Game:

Indy 1

SD 3 + KO (2 by Ward in this game)

Cincy 1 + 1 decline

NE 1

Dallas 0

Balt 2

In the 6 game, Opponents have been called for holding 3 times, 1 vs Indy (1st quarter thus the 23 Quarters), 2 vs NE but one was a punt return and the other a KO return.

None were called and declined.

Not sure if this really means anything or proves anything though. Anyone know how common offensive holding calls are made?

 

[steelcityman]

Yeah, we got a couple calls, jealous?

1, 2, 3, 4, 5 time Super Bowl Champs....another one on the way???...

As far as the Ravens, I think the ball touched the gaol line, it was close, but just about everyone seems to think it was a correct call, eventhough the refs explained it like 4 year olds. You guys got a great defense, make sure you win one more game this year to get in the dance, and I hope we dont play you again, 3 times in a season... I'd rather see Ravens win a super bowl before the Patriots win another game, or Colts.

 

[Jercules]

Does anyone have any idea how many holding calls a team should get in 23 quarters?

I love how this stat was presented as if its the most outrageous thing ever, and yet nobody has any basis for comparison. I'm sure teams routinely go 3-4 games without drawing a holding call; the Steelers happen to have gone almost 6 now. Who cares?

And as for these "obvious" holding calls that have been missed, "obvious" holding calls are ignored constantly. Holding nowadays is basically tackling a defender, anything less usually gets a pass.

Unless you're prepared to come out and say the refs are blatantly biased, which is a pretty bold statement, complaining about these things is pointless.

 

[Tybeeman]

Would you rather have holding calls against your opponents or phantom touchdowns against your division rival? Let's keep things in context here...

The honks don't like to mention all the great breaks they have had from the Superbowl run till now. I have seen a ton of Steeler games and if it is anything more than 99-1 against them they get the call

This is just silly.Every team gets good and bad breaks.

 

[Modog814]

Does anyone have any idea how many holding calls a team should get in 23 quarters?I love how this stat was presented as if its the most outrageous thing ever, and yet nobody has any basis for comparison. I'm sure teams routinely go 3-4 games without drawing a holding call; the Steelers happen to have gone almost 6 now. Who cares?And as for these "obvious" holding calls that have been missed, "obvious" holding calls are ignored constantly. Holding nowadays is basically tackling a defender, anything less usually gets a pass. Unless you're prepared to come out and say the refs are blatantly biased, which is a pretty bold statement, complaining about these things is pointless.

Based on the little information available without actually digging through all the play by plays, it looks like this year its slightly over 1 per team per game (remember that offensive holding occurs on kick returns and punt returns are counted here), which it's been mentioned would be an all time low for the NFL. Based on this it looks like going 23 quarters without a holding call against seems more like an anomoly than a bias, especially when you consider NE had 2 called against them on kick returns.

 

[Steel Dillo]

Does anyone have any idea how many holding calls a team should get in 23 quarters?I love how this stat was presented as if its the most outrageous thing ever, and yet nobody has any basis for comparison. I'm sure teams routinely go 3-4 games without drawing a holding call; the Steelers happen to have gone almost 6 now. Who cares?And as for these "obvious" holding calls that have been missed, "obvious" holding calls are ignored constantly. Holding nowadays is basically tackling a defender, anything less usually gets a pass. Unless you're prepared to come out and say the refs are blatantly biased, which is a pretty bold statement, complaining about these things is pointless.

Thanks for your reply Jerc ules.

 

[Jercules]

Does anyone have any idea how many holding calls a team should get in 23 quarters?I love how this stat was presented as if its the most outrageous thing ever, and yet nobody has any basis for comparison. I'm sure teams routinely go 3-4 games without drawing a holding call; the Steelers happen to have gone almost 6 now. Who cares?And as for these "obvious" holding calls that have been missed, "obvious" holding calls are ignored constantly. Holding nowadays is basically tackling a defender, anything less usually gets a pass. Unless you're prepared to come out and say the refs are blatantly biased, which is a pretty bold statement, complaining about these things is pointless.

Thanks for your reply Jerc ules.

That's some pretty shameful, cringe-inducing humor there Dillo. You must be someone's Dad. In fact, I'd say you were actually Peter King if you could write a little better.

 

[CrossEyed]

Conspiracy?

Lousy refs?

 

[Ghost Rider]

People that whine about a call (or noncall) need to realize there are a 100+ other plays in a game. Execute better in those plays and you don't have to worry about a play or two when an official's call (or non call) doesn't go your way.

I hate this line of thinking. It is basically saying that you have no right to ever complain about a bad call that goes against you unless you play a perfect game. Every team makes mistakes in every game. It happens. But if a bad call at a crucial time screws you, then it is understandable to be frustrated with it. For example, I am a Broncos fan, but I understand Chargers fans being aggravated over the bad call that helped Denver win the game in week 2 this year. Had the right call been made, the Chargers would have had a very, very good chance of winning that game, but the wrong call was made, and it potentially cost them the game. The fact that the Chargers had played an error-filled game was irrelevant, but according to your line of thinking, the Chargers had 100 other plays in which to execute better and win the game, so the bad call that went against them was no big deal.

 

[Steel Dillo]

Does anyone have any idea how many holding calls a team should get in 23 quarters?I love how this stat was presented as if its the most outrageous thing ever, and yet nobody has any basis for comparison. I'm sure teams routinely go 3-4 games without drawing a holding call; the Steelers happen to have gone almost 6 now. Who cares?And as for these "obvious" holding calls that have been missed, "obvious" holding calls are ignored constantly. Holding nowadays is basically tackling a defender, anything less usually gets a pass. Unless you're prepared to come out and say the refs are blatantly biased, which is a pretty bold statement, complaining about these things is pointless.

Thanks for your reply Jerc ules.

That's some pretty shameful, cringe-inducing humor there Dillo. You must be someone's Dad. In fact, I'd say you were actually Peter King if you could write a little better.

1. I'm slightly less portly than King2. C'mon man, anyone that goes by "Jercules" on an internet message board has got to expect that. Toss me a softball...

 

[encaitar]

I haven't read all the responses in here, but to reply to the OP's concern I'll say this. Holding calls have been way down this year. It seems like the refs have made a concerted effort to not call holding unless it unbelievably obvious, or it directly affects a huge play. (As in, if the hold hadn't occured then the big play wouldn't have happened.)

This isn't just esoteric to the Steelers, it has been this way in every game. Now, obviously going 6 games without a holding call is pretty amazing, but it isn't because of some secret conispiracy.

 

[Tau837]

People that whine about a call (or noncall) need to realize there are a 100+ other plays in a game. Execute better in those plays and you don't have to worry about a play or two when an official's call (or non call) doesn't go your way.

I hate this line of thinking. It is basically saying that you have no right to ever complain about a bad call that goes against you unless you play a perfect game. Every team makes mistakes in every game. It happens. But if a bad call at a crucial time screws you, then it is understandable to be frustrated with it. For example, I am a Broncos fan, but I understand Chargers fans being aggravated over the bad call that helped Denver win the game in week 2 this year. Had the right call been made, the Chargers would have had a very, very good chance of winning won that game, but the wrong call was made, and it potentially cost them the game. The fact that the Chargers had played an error-filled game was irrelevant, but according to your line of thinking, the Chargers had 100 other plays in which to execute better and win the game, so the bad call that went against them was no big deal.

Fixed. Had that call not been blown, the Chargers and Broncos would be tied at 7-7, and the Chargers would have the tiebreaker (a head to head win). That is one big effing blown call.

 

[Godsbrother]

The fact that the Chargers had played an error-filled game was irrelevant, but according to your line of thinking, the Chargers had 100 other plays in which to execute better and win the game, so the bad call that went against them was no big deal.

I didn't say it wasn't a big deal. Go ahead and complain all you want. However I don't buy using it as an excuse for losing. Take the Ravens/Steelers game. The Ravens were repeatedly in great field position and only managed three field goals even though they had first downs in the redzone several times. On the final drive their defense allowed the Steelers to march 93 yards to, at the very least, the 1 inch line and the Steelers still had a down to either win the game in regulation or tie the game and send it to OT.Yet you hear all of this nonsense that the refs cost the Ravens the game, the NFL wants the Steelers to win, etc. It is ridiculous just as it is to suggest that the refs are purposely not calling holding on Steelers opponents.Personally I think the refs do a pretty good job but they are human and sometimes they make mistakes or miss stuff. Complain if you must but they aren't singling out one team or favoring another.

 

[Ghost Rider]

People that whine about a call (or noncall) need to realize there are a 100+ other plays in a game. Execute better in those plays and you don't have to worry about a play or two when an official's call (or non call) doesn't go your way.

I hate this line of thinking. It is basically saying that you have no right to ever complain about a bad call that goes against you unless you play a perfect game. Every team makes mistakes in every game. It happens. But if a bad call at a crucial time screws you, then it is understandable to be frustrated with it. For example, I am a Broncos fan, but I understand Chargers fans being aggravated over the bad call that helped Denver win the game in week 2 this year. Had the right call been made, the Chargers would have had a very, very good chance of winning won that game, but the wrong call was made, and it potentially cost them the game. The fact that the Chargers had played an error-filled game was irrelevant, but according to your line of thinking, the Chargers had 100 other plays in which to execute better and win the game, so the bad call that went against them was no big deal.

Fixed. Had that call not been blown, the Chargers and Broncos would be tied at 7-7, and the Chargers would have the tiebreaker (a head to head win). That is one big effing blown call.

Not correct. It has been demonstrated quite clearly that the Broncos COULD HAVE gotten the ball. They had two timeouts left and there would have been around 1:20 left (if my memory is correct on the time), so they theoretically could have gotten the ball back around midfield with around 20-25 seconds left. Odds are, the Chargers would have won, but you cannot say with 100% certainty that they would have won. That is a fact. I just hope the Broncos win this weekend and the Chargers lose, so there will be no #####ing about their division title being tainted (what happens in the week 17 will then be meaningless, since the Broncos will be playing for nothing, and we will never know what would have happened in that game if it had been for the division).

The fact that the Chargers had played an error-filled game was irrelevant, but according to your line of thinking, the Chargers had 100 other plays in which to execute better and win the game, so the bad call that went against them was no big deal.

I didn't say it wasn't a big deal. Go ahead and complain all you want. However I don't buy using it as an excuse for losing. Take the Ravens/Steelers game. The Ravens were repeatedly in great field position and only managed three field goals even though they had first downs in the redzone several times. On the final drive their defense allowed the Steelers to march 93 yards to, at the very least, the 1 inch line and the Steelers still had a down to either win the game in regulation or tie the game and send it to OT.

Yet you hear all of this nonsense that the refs cost the Ravens the game, the NFL wants the Steelers to win, etc. It is ridiculous just as it is to suggest that the refs are purposely not calling holding on Steelers opponents.

Personally I think the refs do a pretty good job but they are human and sometimes they make mistakes or miss stuff. Complain if you must but they aren't singling out one team or favoring another.

Agreed that refs are gonna miss some calls, but in a close game, a bad call CAN make a difference (not referring to any game in general). For example, say a team is down 20-16 with less than a minute to go, and the losing team throws a 25-yard TD on 3rd and 10, but the ref incorrectly calls offensive pass interference (and replays show that there was no contact). The losing team, now with a 3rd and 20 from the 35, then fails to score and loses. I think it would be fair to say that a bad call make a huge difference. Is it an excuse for losing? Maybe, maybe not, but bad calls can affect games in huge ways. Expecting a team to overcome a detrimental bad call at a critical moment is not always fair.

 

[Tau837]

People that whine about a call (or noncall) need to realize there are a 100+ other plays in a game. Execute better in those plays and you don't have to worry about a play or two when an official's call (or non call) doesn't go your way.

I hate this line of thinking. It is basically saying that you have no right to ever complain about a bad call that goes against you unless you play a perfect game. Every team makes mistakes in every game. It happens. But if a bad call at a crucial time screws you, then it is understandable to be frustrated with it. For example, I am a Broncos fan, but I understand Chargers fans being aggravated over the bad call that helped Denver win the game in week 2 this year. Had the right call been made, the Chargers would have had a very, very good chance of winning won that game, but the wrong call was made, and it potentially cost them the game. The fact that the Chargers had played an error-filled game was irrelevant, but according to your line of thinking, the Chargers had 100 other plays in which to execute better and win the game, so the bad call that went against them was no big deal.

Fixed. Had that call not been blown, the Chargers and Broncos would be tied at 7-7, and the Chargers would have the tiebreaker (a head to head win). That is one big effing blown call.

Not correct. It has been demonstrated quite clearly that the Broncos COULD HAVE gotten the ball. They had two timeouts left and there would have been around 1:20 left (if my memory is correct on the time), so they theoretically could have gotten the ball back around midfield with around 20-25 seconds left. Odds are, the Chargers would have won, but you cannot say with 100% certainty that they would have won. That is a fact. I just hope the Broncos win this weekend and the Chargers lose, so there will be no #####ing about their division title being tainted (what happens in the week 17 will then be meaningless, since the Broncos will be playing for nothing, and we will never know what would have happened in that game if it had been for the division).

You are a bit too optimistic about the Broncos' chances to win that game without Hochuli. Old post:

Second there was still time left on the clock and Denver still had timeouts. So for everyone saying SD would of won that is not a fact. Denver could of made the stop (not very likely since they were not stopping anyone) but it could of happened.

It is theoretically possible they could have won. But San Diego would have had the ball with 1:17 remaining. If Denver held them without a first down and used its 2 remaining timeouts after first and second down, the Chargers would have punted, and Denver would probably have taken possession on the other side of midfield with about 10 seconds and no timeouts remaining. The odds of them scoring a TD if the fumble was ruled correctly are about as low as it gets.

 

[Ghost Rider]

Yes, the odds were low, but it WAS possible, which is why you cannot say with 100% certainty that the Chargers would have won that game had the right call been made. How do we know that Denver wouldn't have run the punt back for a TD? Or that they completed a Hail Mary at the buzzer? Crazy or not, those things do happen sometimes. Just ask the 1999 Buffalo Bills or the 1994 Wolverines.

 

[ratbast]

Are they calling other penalties that preclude a hold? I'll bet they've made the Olines quite jittery.

 

[Manster]

oh the poor steelers.

when you started this thread you had to think about how fans of other teams would respond, right?

let me put it this way, if the Cowboys, Pats, Eagles, etc. had the same stat, and one of their fans posted this, how would you respond?

 

[mad sweeney]

This is pulled from the Steelers 2008 thread, but I thought it deserved its on topic.

There hasn't been a holding penalty called against a Steelers opponent in 23 quarters – a span of nearly six games.

I can't count the number of times I've watched a Left Tackle wrap his arm around Harrison's neck and basically tackle him to keep him off the QB and no flag is thrown.

What's the Shark Pool's thoughts on this?

I think the RT for the Steelers had the same headlock on Bryce Fisher the whole Superbowl and never got a flag either.

 

[The_Man]

I remember screaming at the TV on one of Baltimore's long pass completions after their LT put a choke hold on Harrison to keep him off the QB during a long drop back. I am surprised its been that big a stretch, though.

As a Ravens fan, I say this post is total BS.Baltimore didn't have any long pass completions vs. the Steelers.