oakland special teams td throw to boss (1 Viewer)

[DaveGrumbles]

I don't question the technicalities, but a fake field goal, to me, falls under the "common sense" umbrella and does indeed belong as a special teams' play.

This is the second time recently that you've claimed a "common sense" position that's neither common nor sensible. You should get that checked out.

It's not a bad tact to take when you can't support your argument.

As I said, I understand all the reasons why it's not considered a special teams play and my take is strictly based on the fantasy footbal aspect.And though I understand my view is not technically accurate, I do look at the personnel on the field at a given time as being what my common sense dictates how I view that play.Another example is when the offense turns it over, the defense (who is now the offense since they posssess the ball), turns the ball back over to the original offense (who is now the defense since they no longer possess the ball) and the ball is returned from there for a TD.TECHNICALLY, that is a defensive TD for the team whose offensive personnel is on the field. My common sense though tells me that for fantasy purposes, a defensive TD should not be awarded.I have no problem being on this side of that argument. You want to turn this into a 6 pager? Bring it. I'd prefer though to just have you accept that I have an opinion rather than be told that my opinion is wrong. You know.... the whole "agree to disagree" thing. Give it a shot.

I think the disconnect is the use of the term 'common sense'. Common sense is basically just the most simple observation of the facts. That's not the way you're viewing this situation. You're experiencing something more like conditioned sense. You think that because you see individuals who generally play on special teams that this makes the play 'special'. That's a conditioned response. It really won't take 6 pages to figure out the difference between the two. No offense (no pun intended) but you're basically Pavlov's dog at this point.

Well... offense taken. And I acknowledged that "common sense" was a poor word choice as I can see how it unfairly dismisses other viewpoints. It sure seems to me that you may be Pavlov's dog here following along like a lemming. I take chances with my thought process and put it out there which I'm pretty sure is the opposite of being trained to offer a conditioned response. I think those that go straight to the NFL Rules book are much more conditioned than I am. Unwilling to embrace anything other than a rigid standard. Fantasy football is NOT the real NFL and doe NOT have to act like it. You can pick and choose where you want to apply the real NFL and where you don't. You bring out the kicker, the holder, etc.. and throw a pass out of a field goal formation, for fantasy purposes, that looks like a special teams play to me. Why do you care what I think - to the extent that you compare me to Pavlov's dog anyway? Get real. I was done with this thread until you felt compelled to chime in on me. For what reason... I have no idea.

You were done with the thread when you finished your post with 'bring it' and let's make it a 6 pager? Really?Look, I apologize for the pavlov's dog reference if it offended you. Your point really makes sense in terms of differentiating between fantasy and reality. However, the reality is that it would be difficult (actually impossible) to apply such a subjective view of scoring to any fantasy league. Every time I think something is special it should score my defense/special teams some points? That doesn't work.

 

[Sea Duck]

You think that because you see individuals who generally play on special teams that this makes the play 'special'.

You're making a pretty bold assumption there. How do you know what he's thinking?I happen to believe that the Boss TD should count toward the Special Teams points, but it has nothing to do with what you stated above.

1) If you read his post, as opposed to just my response, you would find that he clearly cites personnel as the reasoning behind his common sense. So my 'bold assumption' is actually based on...well...common sense.2) If your belief is not based on personnel, please elaborate why you believe a TD or field goal scored on downs 1 thru 4 should be a specials teams score.

My belief is based partly on formation, partly on the fact that the NFL rulebook has no definition for "Special Teams", partly on the fact that I think "D/ST" is an antiquated fantasy concept, and partly on the radical idea that "Fantasy Scoring" does not have to follow "NFL Scoring".I agree that it's not a Special Teams play according to the NFL. So what? The whole point of "fantasy" football is that we get to award points for things that the NFL doesn't count.

Am I the only one who sees the irony of people citing NFL definitions to justify their argument? Yet those same people routinely ignore the NFL definition that a passing TD can only equal 6 points, or that a 50-yard field goal can never score more than 3 points, etc.

It's fantasy football, people. We get to make up our own rules, and nobody is right or wrong.

 

[ldizzle]

You think that because you see individuals who generally play on special teams that this makes the play 'special'.

You're making a pretty bold assumption there. How do you know what he's thinking?I happen to believe that the Boss TD should count toward the Special Teams points, but it has nothing to do with what you stated above.

1) If you read his post, as opposed to just my response, you would find that he clearly cites personnel as the reasoning behind his common sense. So my 'bold assumption' is actually based on...well...common sense.2) If your belief is not based on personnel, please elaborate why you believe a TD or field goal scored on downs 1 thru 4 should be a specials teams score.

My belief is based partly on formation, partly on the fact that the NFL rulebook has no definition for "Special Teams", partly on the fact that I think "D/ST" is an antiquated fantasy concept, and partly on the radical idea that "Fantasy Scoring" does not have to follow "NFL Scoring".I agree that it's not a Special Teams play according to the NFL. So what? The whole point of "fantasy" football is that we get to award points for things that the NFL doesn't count.

Am I the only one who sees the irony of people citing NFL definitions to justify their argument? Yet those same people routinely ignore the NFL definition that a passing TD can only equal 6 points, or that a 50-yard field goal can never score more than 3 points, etc.

It's fantasy football, people. We get to make up our own rules, and nobody is right or wrong.

Just out of curiosity, whats your view on a play like this? If they get a touchdown, you consider it a touchdown for the special teams. BUT if he throws a pick or fumbles is it negative points for the special teams?

 

[T J]

I don't question the technicalities, but a fake field goal, to me, falls under the "common sense" umbrella and does indeed belong as a special teams' play.

This is the second time recently that you've claimed a "common sense" position that's neither common nor sensible. You should get that checked out.

It's not a bad tact to take when you can't support your argument.

As I said, I understand all the reasons why it's not considered a special teams play and my take is strictly based on the fantasy footbal aspect.And though I understand my view is not technically accurate, I do look at the personnel on the field at a given time as being what my common sense dictates how I view that play.Another example is when the offense turns it over, the defense (who is now the offense since they posssess the ball), turns the ball back over to the original offense (who is now the defense since they no longer possess the ball) and the ball is returned from there for a TD.TECHNICALLY, that is a defensive TD for the team whose offensive personnel is on the field. My common sense though tells me that for fantasy purposes, a defensive TD should not be awarded.I have no problem being on this side of that argument. You want to turn this into a 6 pager? Bring it. I'd prefer though to just have you accept that I have an opinion rather than be told that my opinion is wrong. You know.... the whole "agree to disagree" thing. Give it a shot.

I think the disconnect is the use of the term 'common sense'. Common sense is basically just the most simple observation of the facts. That's not the way you're viewing this situation. You're experiencing something more like conditioned sense. You think that because you see individuals who generally play on special teams that this makes the play 'special'. That's a conditioned response. It really won't take 6 pages to figure out the difference between the two. No offense (no pun intended) but you're basically Pavlov's dog at this point.

Well... offense taken. And I acknowledged that "common sense" was a poor word choice as I can see how it unfairly dismisses other viewpoints. It sure seems to me that you may be Pavlov's dog here following along like a lemming. I take chances with my thought process and put it out there which I'm pretty sure is the opposite of being trained to offer a conditioned response. I think those that go straight to the NFL Rules book are much more conditioned than I am. Unwilling to embrace anything other than a rigid standard. Fantasy football is NOT the real NFL and doe NOT have to act like it. You can pick and choose where you want to apply the real NFL and where you don't. You bring out the kicker, the holder, etc.. and throw a pass out of a field goal formation, for fantasy purposes, that looks like a special teams play to me. Why do you care what I think - to the extent that you compare me to Pavlov's dog anyway? Get real. I was done with this thread until you felt compelled to chime in on me. For what reason... I have no idea.

You were done with the thread when you finished your post with 'bring it' and let's make it a 6 pager? Really?

In my defense, that's NOT how I finished that post. I said we could turn it into that but I followed that immediately with:"I'd prefer though to just have you accept that I have an opinion rather than be told that my opinion is wrong". I enjoy a good discussion/debate, what have you, but I don't love it. It's when people come at me and not my ideas that I take issue.It's all good though. I personally think that was a special teams play for purposes of fantasy football. And ya know, probably the funniest thing of all is that my league doesn't even award special teams' points - just team defense.

 

[ldizzle]

You think that because you see individuals who generally play on special teams that this makes the play 'special'.

You're making a pretty bold assumption there. How do you know what he's thinking?I happen to believe that the Boss TD should count toward the Special Teams points, but it has nothing to do with what you stated above.

1) If you read his post, as opposed to just my response, you would find that he clearly cites personnel as the reasoning behind his common sense. So my 'bold assumption' is actually based on...well...common sense.2) If your belief is not based on personnel, please elaborate why you believe a TD or field goal scored on downs 1 thru 4 should be a specials teams score.

My belief is based partly on formation, partly on the fact that the NFL rulebook has no definition for "Special Teams", partly on the fact that I think "D/ST" is an antiquated fantasy concept, and partly on the radical idea that "Fantasy Scoring" does not have to follow "NFL Scoring".I agree that it's not a Special Teams play according to the NFL. So what? The whole point of "fantasy" football is that we get to award points for things that the NFL doesn't count.

Am I the only one who sees the irony of people citing NFL definitions to justify their argument? Yet those same people routinely ignore the NFL definition that a passing TD can only equal 6 points, or that a 50-yard field goal can never score more than 3 points, etc.

It's fantasy football, people. We get to make up our own rules, and nobody is right or wrong.

Just out of curiosity, whats your view on a play like this? If they get a touchdown, you consider it a touchdown for the special teams. BUT if he throws a pick or fumbles is it negative points for the special teams?

i also forgot to ask if you think the special teams unit should be awarded passing yard and rushing yard points as well...

 

[Sea Duck]

Just out of curiosity, whats your view on a play like this? If they get a touchdown, you consider it a touchdown for the special teams. BUT if he throws a pick or fumbles is it negative points for the special teams?

The TD would count for the "D/ST/Etc." as well as for the individual players who scored -- much in the same way that most fantasy leagues give dual points for kick return TDs. The INT would count against the individual player only -- much in the same way that most fantasy leagues DON'T penalize the D/ST when a kick returner fumbles.Passing and rushing yards would count for the individual player only.

I realize that there is a certain amount of subjectivity involved, and some people can't get past that. That's cool.

 

[ldizzle]

Just out of curiosity, whats your view on a play like this? If they get a touchdown, you consider it a touchdown for the special teams. BUT if he throws a pick or fumbles is it negative points for the special teams?

The TD would count for the "D/ST/Etc." as well as for the individual players who scored -- much in the same way that most fantasy leagues give dual points for kick return TDs. The INT would count against the individual player only -- much in the same way that most fantasy leagues DON'T penalize the D/ST when a kick returner fumbles.Passing and rushing yards would count for the individual player only.

I realize that there is a certain amount of subjectivity involved, and some people can't get past that. That's cool.

ok that makes sense. to each their own. every fantasy league is different and however you and your leaguemates want to have it set up is your choice. this thread is pointless because not every fantasy league is the same. Its like ppr vs non ppr, 1 qb vs 2b, IDP vs team def/st. there is no right or wrong way as long as you have enough people that agree with you to make a league that has those rules. ETA: if anyone wants to set it up that way, they should have a rule that any play that involves a kicker or a punter is a special teams play.