Off the cuff ranking (1 Viewer)

[Chase Stuart]

Four disclaimers:

1) I'm not interested in a Brady/Manning discussion.

2) This is *very* off the cuff. So I'm more than open to feedback/responses, and will likely be swayed. Especially guys in the middle.

3) I'm not going to use any of the rookies (Russell, Colb, Beck, Quinn) or the college guys.

4) This isn't redraft, but this isn't dynasty. Injuries matter, a bit. Here are the assumptions: You are the coach of a pretty good team. You now have to rank the QBs you'd want to be on your team for the 2008 season. The entire season, and the playoffs. 2009 does not matter. Assume no one retires or gets injured between now and then. THESE ARE NFL, AND NOT FF RANKINGS.

3. Tony Romo

4. Carson Palmer

5. Ben Roethlisberger

6. Drew Brees

7. Brett Favre

8. Donovan McNabb

9. Marc Bulger

10. Eli Manning

11. Philip Rivers

12. Matt Hasselbeck

13. Vince Young

14. Derek Anderson

15. Jon Kitna

16. Jay Cutler

17. David Garrard

18. Matt Schaub

19. Kellen Clemens

20. Jeff Garcia

21. Jason Campbell

22. J.P. Losman

23. Chad Pennington

24. Jake Delhomme

25. Joey Harrington

26. Damon Huard

27. Brian Griese

28. Matt Leinart

29. Daunte Culpepper

30. Kurt Warner

31. Byron Leftwich

32. Kyle Boller

33. Trent Edwards

34. Charlie Batch

35. Steve McNair

36. Rex Grossman

37. David Carr

38. Alex Smith

39. Cleo Lemon

40. Brooks Bollinger

 

[kd1]

jesus....and i thought i had to find something better to do with my time.

 

[timintey]

Interesting. I'd probably move Rivers way down and bump Garrard up a few.

 

[Fear & Loathing]

Interesting. I'd probably move Rivers way down and bump Garrard up a few.

Nice list overall, but I can't understand why anybody would rather have Rivers or especially Eli Manning over Hasselbeck, Cutler, Kitna, or even Derek Anderson....and I'm not sold on Anderson yet.

 

[Sidewinder16]

If the exercise includes assuming a return to full health, I think you have Delhomme way too low. Personally, I'd take him above McNabb, Bulger and Eli.

 

[Chase Stuart]

If the exercise includes assuming a return to full health, I think you have Delhomme way too low. Personally, I'd take him above McNabb, Bulger and Eli.

I can't stand Delhomme and think Steve Smith makes him who he is, but you're right. I do have him a good bit too low (but I'd still put him behind the three you named).

 

[Chase Stuart]

Interesting. I'd probably move Rivers way down and bump Garrard up a few.

Nice list overall, but I can't understand why anybody would rather have Rivers or especially Eli Manning over Hasselbeck, Cutler, Kitna, or even Derek Anderson....and I'm not sold on Anderson yet.

Rivers will be a 27 year old QB entering his prime, and he's thrown 13 more TDs than INTs in his career, and averaged over 7.0 yards per pass. He was a Pro Bowler last year, and could see him having a breakout season in '08 once Turner is gone.

 

[Modog814]

I think you have Bulger too high. Also Rivers, Pennington, Clemens and Griese are too high. Young is too high IMO, I think Tennessee is winning in spite of him, not because.

Delhomme is way too low. You may not like him and think that S. Smith make hims, but S. Smith is making D. Carr anyone or even Testeverde?

Leinart is a little low, and I'd definitely take him over Clemens.

 

[Sidewinder16]

If the exercise includes assuming a return to full health, I think you have Delhomme way too low. Personally, I'd take him above McNabb, Bulger and Eli.

I can't stand Delhomme and think Steve Smith makes him who he is, but you're right. I do have him a good bit too low (but I'd still put him behind the three you named).

Does being "the coach of a pretty good team" include a Steve Smith-esque WR? I have a thing against McNabb and have never been overly impressed with Bulger or Eli, so the differences between the 4 would be slight in my rankings.

For my money, I'd have Romo, Favre, Roethlisberger and maybe Brees in a tier behind Brady/Manning. I guess Palmer would be pretty close to that tier for me, but I don't see many Bengals games, so I've never "gotten in to" Palmer. I've seen a good bit of Romo/Favre/Roethlisberger though and I just really enjoy watching them play the game. They have the "it" factor I'd want in my QB.

 

[numberSE7EN]

Everything else the Same I would put Favre at #3, given the same team to work with I think Favre out of all the qbs is still top notch.

 

[Jeff Pasquino]

Interesting. I'd probably move Rivers way down and bump Garrard up a few.

Nice list overall, but I can't understand why anybody would rather have Rivers or especially Eli Manning over Hasselbeck, Cutler, Kitna, or even Derek Anderson....and I'm not sold on Anderson yet.

Rivers will be a 27 year old QB entering his prime, and he's thrown 13 more TDs than INTs in his career, and averaged over 7.0 yards per pass. He was a Pro Bowler last year, and could see him having a breakout season in '08 once Turner is gone.

Have I taught you NOTHING?

 

[texasbirdfan]

no love for the aging Campbell Soup guy- McNabb a bit too high all things considered

 

[Craig_MiamiFL]

Leinart a bit low. I really believe if he spends time learning Whiz's offense, he'll be Top 15.

He just didn't look like he knew where to go with the ball this year.

 

[Frenchy Fuqua]

Your 3 & 4 QBs have an 0-2 career playoff record. #5 Roethlisberger is 5-1 with a Super Bowl win. Ben also has similar if not better regular season numbers. Ben and Romo also have the ability to make plays outside of the pocket, Palmer does not.

 

[awesomeness]

i dont understand how Clemens can be ranked so high. How many games has he started in his career 2-3? What has he proven in those games that makes you think he is better then Garcia, Leftwich, Losman, or Campbell. I would also take David Carr off the list completely. I wouldn't want to pay him to play for me. I would also drop Rivers way down, eli down a bit, and increase Garrard.

 

[Limp Ditka]

I can only imagine Grossman got a 5 spot boost in the rankings based on yesterday's heroics.

 

[Chase Stuart]

i dont understand how Clemens can be ranked so high. How many games has he started in his career 2-3? What has he proven in those games that makes you think he is better then Garcia, Leftwich, Losman, or Campbell. I would also take David Carr off the list completely. I wouldn't want to pay him to play for me. I would also drop Rivers way down, eli down a bit, and increase Garrard.

Garcia will be way too old by next year. Leftwich isn't any good. Losman, Campbell and Clemens are in the same tier for me. Clemens has a bit more upside though entering his first full season as a starter. I'm dissapointed with how Campbell and Losman have played this year, although both have had their moments.

 

[Chase Stuart]

Your 3 & 4 QBs have an 0-2 career playoff record. #5 Roethlisberger is 5-1 with a Super Bowl win. Ben also has similar if not better regular season numbers. Ben and Romo also have the ability to make plays outside of the pocket, Palmer does not.

When did Carson Palmer lose a playoff game, or when did Tony Romo lose a second playoff game?

 

[Chase Stuart]

Everything else the Same I would put Favre at #3, given the same team to work with I think Favre out of all the qbs is still top notch.

Like Garcia, he gets a drop due to age.

 

[Frenchy Fuqua]

Your 3 & 4 QBs have an 0-2 career playoff record. #5 Roethlisberger is 5-1 with a Super Bowl win. Ben also has similar if not better regular season numbers. Ben and Romo also have the ability to make plays outside of the pocket, Palmer does not.

When did Carson Palmer lose a playoff game, or when did Tony Romo lose a second playoff game?

Palmer started and "lost" against the Steelers in 2005, his only playoff appearance.Romo started and lost to Seattle last year.= 0-2 collectively.Point being, these guys haven't won big games....a factor that should be considered when ranking three similarly talented QBs.

 

[Chase Stuart]

Your 3 & 4 QBs have an 0-2 career playoff record. #5 Roethlisberger is 5-1 with a Super Bowl win. Ben also has similar if not better regular season numbers. Ben and Romo also have the ability to make plays outside of the pocket, Palmer does not.

When did Carson Palmer lose a playoff game, or when did Tony Romo lose a second playoff game?

Palmer started and "lost" against the Steelers in 2005, his only playoff appearance.Romo started and lost to Seattle last year.= 0-2 collectively.Point being, these guys haven't won big games....a factor that should be considered when ranking three similarly talented QBs.

It's difficult to value your opinion when you claim that Carson Palmer lost to the Steelers in the playoffs.

 

[EBF]

I'd move up Schaub, Cutler, and Edwards. To me Cutler and Schaub are roughly on par with Hasselbeck. IMO those two are going to become winning franchise QBs in the NFL. Edwards with a full year of practice under his belt probably belongs in the low 20s.

I'd move down Rivers, Anderson, and Kitna. Rivers doesn't appear to be any better than guys like Schaub, Cutler, and Garrard. Schaub and Cutler seem to have more of the "it" factor. I'm not really sold on Anderson at the moment and I don't think Kitna is anything special.

I'd probably take Roethlisberger over Palmer and maybe over Romo. From what I've seen he's a little bit better with the game on the line than Palmer is. In that sense he reminds of some of the great ones like Brady and Favre.

Otherwise I mostly agree with your list.

 

[pollardsvision]

vince young is about 6 spots too high. i'd put him at 19 for next year.

 

[Rogi]

Favre next year? I think he'll be focusing on deer hunting in Wranglers and cashing in on Prilosec ads next year.

Bollinger 40 and Tarvaris Jackson absent from the list? Interesting but I guess I can't really argue against it. Although I'd take either of them over David Carr.

I would bump Jason Campbell up a few spots. He looks pretty good for having a subpar set of WRs. If he starts chucking the ball more to some good WRs, he might be dangerous.

 

[Fear & Loathing]

Favre next year? I think he'll be focusing on deer hunting in Wranglers and cashing in on Prilosec ads next year.

Why? He's playing great, so he still has plenty left in the tank. Green Bay has as much young talent as any team in the NFC, so they should be a serious playoff contender again. I can't see him walking away when he's playing this well and is finally surrounded by good talent again.

 

[Rogi]

Favre next year? I think he'll be focusing on deer hunting in Wranglers and cashing in on Prilosec ads next year.

Why? He's playing great, so he still has plenty left in the tank. Green Bay has as much young talent as any team in the NFC, so they should be a serious playoff contender again. I can't see him walking away when he's playing this well and is finally surrounded by good talent again.

Who knows what he'll do, but maybe he'll want to leave on a good note.

 

[Assani Fisher]

1. Brady

2. Manning

3. Roethlisberger

4. Romo

5. McNabb(assuming full health)

6. Palmer

7. Brees

8. Favre

9. E Manning

10. V Young

11. Anderson

12. Hasselbeck

13. Kitna

14. Bulger

15. Campbell

16. Garrard

17. Garcia

18. Schaub

19. Cutler

20. Rivers

Edit: Forgot about Delhomme....put him in at #14

 

[Fear & Loathing]

Favre next year? I think he'll be focusing on deer hunting in Wranglers and cashing in on Prilosec ads next year.

Why? He's playing great, so he still has plenty left in the tank. Green Bay has as much young talent as any team in the NFC, so they should be a serious playoff contender again. I can't see him walking away when he's playing this well and is finally surrounded by good talent again.

Who knows what he'll do, but maybe he'll want to leave on a good note.

Why leave on a good note when you have a chance to leave on the best note? He's playing well, he's having fun, and he's surrounded by more talent than he's had in a long time. If he hasn't walked away by now, I can't see him walking away next year.

 

[drdgreenlove]

so the top 40 will be nearly identical next year.. wow!!!! that is BOLD

weak rankings

mcnair will be retired

brody croyle should be on the list

take a stab on the rookies... russell and probably quinn start next year (unless cleveland retains anderson which is doubtful)

you rank culpepper 28th.. where is he playing? not minnesota

who is qb for minnesota? pennngton? if not chad, then whom? if you say mcnabb who is qb for philly?

 

[BigSteelThrill]

Interesting. I'd probably move Rivers way down and bump Garrard up a few.

Nice list overall, but I can't understand why anybody would rather have Rivers or especially Eli Manning over Hasselbeck, Cutler, Kitna, or even Derek Anderson....and I'm not sold on Anderson yet.

 

[BigSteelThrill]

Your 3 & 4 QBs have an 0-2 career playoff record. #5 Roethlisberger is 5-1 with a Super Bowl win. Ben also has similar if not better regular season numbers. Ben and Romo also have the ability to make plays outside of the pocket, Palmer does not.

When did Carson Palmer lose a playoff game, or when did Tony Romo lose a second playoff game?

Palmer started and "lost" against the Steelers in 2005, his only playoff appearance.Romo started and lost to Seattle last year.= 0-2 collectively.Point being, these guys haven't won big games....a factor that should be considered when ranking three similarly talented QBs.

It's difficult to value your opinion when you claim that Carson Palmer lost to the Steelers in the playoffs.

Then, at the very least, he has no real playoff experience. Which hurts badly in a 2008-only set up.

 

[az_prof]

I would include Beck and not Lemon. No way Lemon is starting next year.

 

[Sidewinder16]

so the top 40 will be nearly identical next year.. wow!!!! that is BOLD

weak rankings

mcnair will be retired

brody croyle should be on the list

take a stab on the rookies... russell and probably quinn start next year (unless cleveland retains anderson which is doubtful)

you rank culpepper 28th.. where is he playing? not minnesota

who is qb for minnesota? pennngton? if not chad, then whom? if you say mcnabb who is qb for philly?

I think you're missing what Chase is trying to do here.

Here are the assumptions: You are the coach of a pretty good team. You now have to rank the QBs you'd want to be on your team for the 2008 season. The entire season, and the playoffs. 2009 does not matter. Assume no one retires or gets injured between now and then. THESE ARE NFL, AND NOT FF RANKINGS.

He's asking, what current NFL QB would you want as your QB, on your hypothetical team. It doesn't matter who might be playing somewhere different, or not at all, in the NFL. It matters who you would want running your offense. Consider it a "Greatest Current QB" ranking, from your POV.

 

[Jayrod]

Your 3 & 4 QBs have an 0-2 career playoff record. #5 Roethlisberger is 5-1 with a Super Bowl win. Ben also has similar if not better regular season numbers. Ben and Romo also have the ability to make plays outside of the pocket, Palmer does not.

When did Carson Palmer lose a playoff game, or when did Tony Romo lose a second playoff game?

Palmer started and "lost" against the Steelers in 2005, his only playoff appearance.Romo started and lost to Seattle last year.= 0-2 collectively.Point being, these guys haven't won big games....a factor that should be considered when ranking three similarly talented QBs.

It's difficult to value your opinion when you claim that Carson Palmer lost to the Steelers in the playoffs.

He was 1/1 for 66 yards and a QB rating of 118.8. I think he did all he could have possibly done to win that game.

 

[Frenchy Fuqua]

Your 3 & 4 QBs have an 0-2 career playoff record. #5 Roethlisberger is 5-1 with a Super Bowl win. Ben also has similar if not better regular season numbers. Ben and Romo also have the ability to make plays outside of the pocket, Palmer does not.

When did Carson Palmer lose a playoff game, or when did Tony Romo lose a second playoff game?

Palmer started and "lost" against the Steelers in 2005, his only playoff appearance.Romo started and lost to Seattle last year.= 0-2 collectively.Point being, these guys haven't won big games....a factor that should be considered when ranking three similarly talented QBs.

It's difficult to value your opinion when you claim that Carson Palmer lost to the Steelers in the playoffs.

Let me slow this down so you follow me...the issue is not whether Palmer lost to the Steelers in the playoffs...it is that he has never won a big game.

 

[Jayrod]

Your 3 & 4 QBs have an 0-2 career playoff record. #5 Roethlisberger is 5-1 with a Super Bowl win. Ben also has similar if not better regular season numbers. Ben and Romo also have the ability to make plays outside of the pocket, Palmer does not.

When did Carson Palmer lose a playoff game, or when did Tony Romo lose a second playoff game?

Palmer started and "lost" against the Steelers in 2005, his only playoff appearance.Romo started and lost to Seattle last year.= 0-2 collectively.Point being, these guys haven't won big games....a factor that should be considered when ranking three similarly talented QBs.

It's difficult to value your opinion when you claim that Carson Palmer lost to the Steelers in the playoffs.

Let me slow this down so you follow me...the issue is not whether or not Palmer lost to the Steelers in the playoffs...it is that he has never won a big game. Pretty simple really.

But the support for your arguement is that he lost his only playoff game. A game in which he only threw one pass.Is that too complicated for you? It's pretty simple really. You make an arguement with supporting proof/thoughts and then someone with a disagreeing viewpoint discusses your supporting arguements. It's called a debate and usually doesn't involve personal attacks.

 

[Frenchy Fuqua]

Your 3 & 4 QBs have an 0-2 career playoff record. #5 Roethlisberger is 5-1 with a Super Bowl win. Ben also has similar if not better regular season numbers. Ben and Romo also have the ability to make plays outside of the pocket, Palmer does not.

When did Carson Palmer lose a playoff game, or when did Tony Romo lose a second playoff game?

Palmer started and "lost" against the Steelers in 2005, his only playoff appearance.Romo started and lost to Seattle last year.= 0-2 collectively.Point being, these guys haven't won big games....a factor that should be considered when ranking three similarly talented QBs.

It's difficult to value your opinion when you claim that Carson Palmer lost to the Steelers in the playoffs.

Let me slow this down so you follow me...the issue is not whether or not Palmer lost to the Steelers in the playoffs...it is that he has never won a big game. Pretty simple really.

But the support for your arguement is that he lost his only playoff game. A game in which he only threw one pass.Is that too complicated for you? It's pretty simple really. You make an arguement with supporting proof/thoughts and then someone with a disagreeing viewpoint discusses your supporting arguements. It's called a debate and usually doesn't involve personal attacks.

The support for my argument is that Carson Palmer and Ben Roethlisberger have similar career numbers except one has gone 5-1 in the playoffs including a Super Bowl win. The other has taken one playoff snap since he entered the league in 2003. When ranking two very similar QB I view that as an important point. My apologies if I offended anyone in making that point. We'll agree to disagree and I'll move on to the next thread.

 

[Jayrod]

Your 3 & 4 QBs have an 0-2 career playoff record. #5 Roethlisberger is 5-1 with a Super Bowl win. Ben also has similar if not better regular season numbers. Ben and Romo also have the ability to make plays outside of the pocket, Palmer does not.

When did Carson Palmer lose a playoff game, or when did Tony Romo lose a second playoff game?

Palmer started and "lost" against the Steelers in 2005, his only playoff appearance.Romo started and lost to Seattle last year.= 0-2 collectively.Point being, these guys haven't won big games....a factor that should be considered when ranking three similarly talented QBs.

It's difficult to value your opinion when you claim that Carson Palmer lost to the Steelers in the playoffs.

Let me slow this down so you follow me...the issue is not whether or not Palmer lost to the Steelers in the playoffs...it is that he has never won a big game. Pretty simple really.

But the support for your arguement is that he lost his only playoff game. A game in which he only threw one pass.Is that too complicated for you? It's pretty simple really. You make an arguement with supporting proof/thoughts and then someone with a disagreeing viewpoint discusses your supporting arguements. It's called a debate and usually doesn't involve personal attacks.

The support for my argument is that Carson Palmer and Ben Roethlisberger have similar career numbers except one has gone 5-1 in the playoffs including a Super Bowl win. The other has taken one playoff snap since he entered the league in 2003. When ranking two very similar QB I view that as an important point. My apologies if I offended anyone in making that point. We'll agree to disagree and I'll move on to the next thread.

You need to apologize to Chase for being a jerk with the "Let me slow this down" and "Pretty simple really" comments, not for making an invalid point, which you have now changed from your original point.You said "Palmer started and "lost" against the Steelers in 2005, his only playoff appearance", but in this last post tried to spin with, "The other has taken one playoff snap since he entered the league in 2003."Big difference between "taken one snap" and "started and lost".If you wanted to make the point that Palmer isn't as good because he hasn't made the playoffs as many times a Ben, that would be a legit point, but claiming that Palmer's playoff record is 0-1 is a completely different (and weak) arguement.

 

[fatness]

19. Kellen Clemens

20. Jeff Garcia

21. Jason Campbell

At the very least the 2 bolded QB's should be reversed.