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***Official 2024 Pro Cycling Thread*** - The road ends in Spain. Guaranteed Crazy Ending. (1 Viewer)

 
Nick Vermeil said:
Jonas a little timid on the decent.
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Once he cracked, he was going to lose time all the way in if he didn't get back to him in the first km. That being said Tadej's corners were a tad more aggressive.

The Jumbo squad isn't good. Wout and Jonas are still getting their fitness, Wilco was already in a crash, Sepp is at home, and Matteo can't do it all. Meanwhile the UAE guys were playing possum the first three days and 2 climbs today.
 
Velogames rankings:
  • BL Overall Rank: 2528 of 29808
  • BNB Overall Rank: 2840 of 29808
  • CP Overall Rank: 3655 of 29808
STAGE 4 RANKINGS:
  • Cheeseyproof 242 of 29808 (99.2 percentile)
  • Sand 9187 of 29808
  • Stage 4 Rank: sammy3469 9522 of 29808
Awesome finish today for our Stage Winner
 
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BobbyLayne said:
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I object to losing my first place at the bottom finish. There must be some mistake here.

TURN THE MACHINES BACK ON!!!
 
Nick Vermeil said:
Jonas a little timid on the decent.
Click to expand...
Funny how the numskulls in the booth boned this again. They were adamant that Pogacar would gain time at the top but that Jonas was more aero and would gain it back on the bottom. Actually just the opposite. Jonas gained time at the top (a few seconds). When the roads straightened out Pogacar got a lot more aero and was tucked on the hoods. Jonas was coming off the hoods to the drops on most of the gentle corners at speed.
 
I'm even more convinced Jonas will win after today.

1. On a longer battle between the two, Jonas wins.
2. No doubt Jonas will crush the TT and has better recovery pharma.
 
Hard to argue against UAE's results, but personally rather than swapping guys pacemaking at the front, I would have the second rider create a false tempo and let gaps open to the lead rider and force someone else to close the gap.
 
BassNBrew said:
I'm even more convinced Jonas will win after today.

1. On a longer battle between the two, Jonas wins.
2. No doubt Jonas will crush the TT and has better recovery pharma.
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He’ll gain time on the hilly Stage 21 TT. But Patrick Broe (Lanterne Rouge Cycling Podcast + Jumbo Race Strategy consultant) said on today’s post-race recap Stage 7 favors Pogi. He predicted the gap will increase 30 seconds in the first TT.

I still think Vingegaard has a good chance but Jorgenson & WvA will need to perform well to chip away in Stages 14, 16, 19 & 20. The final week is a beast.

Tadej will be getting an hour plus less recovery time than Jonas every race day bc of media commitments associated with wearing the yellow jersey. That’s a grind.

But he has the strongest team and that counts for a lot.


Next two stages are flat, won’t watch the live feed again until Friday’s TT.
 
BassNBrew said:
Hard to argue against UAE's results, but personally rather than swapping guys pacemaking at the front, I would have the second rider create a false tempo and let gaps open to the lead rider and force someone else to close the gap.
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I'm pretty sure Tadej waited until he had the short way and Jonas had to go around Ayuso/Almeida the other way. To your point though, it wasn't clear why they either didn't start tempo harder earlier. The first half of the the climb seemed too controlled if you're going to try to put Jonas into serious difficulty, but UAE also know their numbers.

Short of the TT's, given the status of the teams, I'm not sure where Jumbo necessarily think they'll shed Tadej. Three of the final 4 MTF finishes are fairly "easy" for MTFish and I won't be shocked if Tadej goes with Alpecin when they try to blow up stage 9 (gravel) for Van Der Poel and Phillipsen. Those three and Van Aert are the 4 best hard classics riders right now and while that stage isn't classics "hard", it should be plenty hard enough that Jumbo will need Van Aert to ride Jonas home. I also think we're far more likely to see Jonas do a 2023 Tadej and fade at the end off an injury than any real drama. The only thing keeping this close is how sick Tadej was with COVID.
 
Sammy3469 said:
The first half of the the climb seemed too controlled if you're going to try to put Jonas into serious difficulty, but UAE also know their numbers.
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One thing I’ve noticed is UAE is using three guys rotating to pull the peloton. Whereas in past years they’d have one guy pull until he was in the red.

Now if they could just convince Ayusoto be slightly less ambitious…
 
Most top-10 results since last victory for the sprinters.

#RIDER#TOP-10SDATE OF LAST VICTORY
1VAN POPPEL Danny132023-09-08
2THIJSSEN Gerben122024-02-14
3GAVIRIA Fernando112024-02-06
4VAN DEN BERG Marijn72024-04-05
5VAN AERT Wout52024-02-25
6PHILIPSEN Jasper42024-06-14
7PEDERSEN Mads32024-06-02
8BENNETT Sam32024-05-19
9JAKOBSEN Fabio32024-04-21
10KRISTOFF Alexander22024-06-01
11GROENEWEGEN Dylan12024-06-23
12BAUHAUS Phil12024-06-13
13DE LIE Arnaud12024-06-23
14COQUARD Bryan12024-06-10
15GIRMAY Biniam02024-07-01
 
BobbyLayne said:
Sammy3469 said:
The first half of the the climb seemed too controlled if you're going to try to put Jonas into serious difficulty, but UAE also know their numbers.
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One thing I’ve noticed is UAE is using three guys rotating to pull the peloton. Whereas in past years they’d have one guy pull until he was in the red.

Now if they could just convince Ayusoto be slightly less ambitious…
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Some of that was that it was that they had a pretty vicious headwind there as well and you can’t sit on the front as long in those conditions.
 
Sammy3469 said:
BobbyLayne said:
Sammy3469 said:
The first half of the the climb seemed too controlled if you're going to try to put Jonas into serious difficulty, but UAE also know their numbers.
Click to expand...

One thing I’ve noticed is UAE is using three guys rotating to pull the peloton. Whereas in past years they’d have one guy pull until he was in the red.

Now if they could just convince Ayusoto be slightly less ambitious…
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Some of that was that it was that they had a pretty vicious headwind there as well and you can’t sit on the front as long in those conditions.
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True - the headwind was why Pogi delayed his attack until they were 0.7 km from the summit.

The parcour sets up pretty well for Jonas IMO. Tadej has a much stronger team. No threat to win IMO but Landa is a tremendous asset for Remco. Gonna be fun to watch it play out.
 
BassNBrew said:
Pogacar just wiped out 10 guys with his carelessness.
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Yet again the TdF doesn't put a flag guy there to warn of traffic furniture. Granted Tadej and UAE should have been more alert, but if your mid pack, you're not going to see that until its too late.
 
Congrats to Cav!

 
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Sammy3469 said:
BassNBrew said:
Pogacar just wiped out 10 guys with his carelessness.
Click to expand...
Yet again the TdF doesn't put a flag guy there to warn of traffic furniture. Granted Tadej and UAE should have been more alert, but if your mid pack, you're not going to see that until its too late.
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They put [a] yellow square down low. So silly. If it’s below the height of the rider [then] you have to have a flag man there.

Wasn’t Pogi’s fault - very few GC riders could make that save. Obviously a hard break is going to have a ripple affect behind, but careless is something we should assign to ASO - not the rider in the middle of the peloton.

Sounds like there was a bit too much road furniture today?
 
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BobbyLayne said:
Sammy3469 said:
BassNBrew said:
Pogacar just wiped out 10 guys with his carelessness.
Click to expand...
Yet again the TdF doesn't put a flag guy there to warn of traffic furniture. Granted Tadej and UAE should have been more alert, but if your mid pack, you're not going to see that until its too late.
Click to expand...

They put [a] yellow square down low. So silly. If it’s below the height of the rider [then] you have to have a flag man there.

Wasn’t Pogi’s fault - very few GC riders could make that save. Obviously a hard break is going to have a ripple affect behind, but careless is something we should assign to ASO - not the rider in the middle of the peloton.

Sounds like there was a bit too much road furniture today?
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There was a second piece where there was a piece of road furniture in the middle of a turn that caused another accident after the Pogi one. Even more dangerous with only the yellow square down low and no flag man.

I hope Mads is ok. Cav's movement in the bubble during the last km was exquisite.
 
4 out of 5 stages won by small teams

Arkéa - B&B Hotels first win ever

EF Education - EasyPost first time in yellow

39 year old sprinter breaks Merckx record for TDF stage wins

Pretty, pretty, pretty good first week
 
Sammy3469 said:

I hope Mads is ok. Cav's movement in the bubble during the last km was exquisite.
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No joke. The way he skipped around was absolute mastery.

And at the end he was flat out faster than Phillipsen. I dare to say it, but there may be more. He looks as fast as anyone in the peloton.
 
Sand said:
Sammy3469 said:

I hope Mads is ok. Cav's movement in the bubble during the last km was exquisite.
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No joke. The way he skipped around was absolute mastery.

And at the end he was flat out faster than Phillipsen. I dare to say it, but there may be more. He looks as fast as anyone in the peloton.
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Just heard Johan Bruyneel say Cav’s chain came off. Went back and looked - it sure did, right after the finish line.

Loved how so many in the peloton congratulated & hugged him as he made his way back to the podium presentation area. So much reverence - greatest sprinter ever?

When Cavendish garnered his first 4 Stage wins back in the 2008 TdF, he beat some legendary sprinters: Óscar Freire, Thor Hushvod, 6x Green Jersey winner Eric Zabel. How long has Cav been winning stages? Zabel’s son just retired in May after an 11-year career.
 
BobbyLayne said:

Just heard Johan Bruyneel say Cav’s chain came off. Went back and looked - it sure did, right after the finish line.

Loved how so many in the peloton congratulated & hugged him as he made his way back to the podium presentation area. So much reverence - greatest sprinter ever?

When Cavendish garnered his first 4 Stage wins back in the 2008 TdF, he beat some legendary sprinters: Óscar Freire, Thor Hushvod, 6x Green Jersey winner Eric Zabel. How long has Cav been winning stages? Zabel’s son just retired in May after an 11-year career.
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I didn't notice the chain. Did you notice the best bunny hop ever?

I'd go so far to say he's the best cyclist ever. As much as Mercx is revered what Cav has done with the fields he has done them in makes him the GOAT. At least until Pogacar wins 15 Grand Tours.
 
Sand said:
I'd go so far to say he's the best cyclist ever. As much as Mercx is revered what Cav has done with the fields he has done them in makes him the GOAT. At least until Pogacar wins 15 Grand Tours.
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Hard to compare different eras. There’s always going to strong sentiment for the greats we only know from stories, black & white photos and limited film.

You can make case for Cav though:

Ranking​


Pos.RiderTotal wins
1MERCKX Eddy276
2CAVENDISH Mark165
3CIPOLLINI Mario163
4DE VLAEMINCK Roger161
5VAN LOOY Rik161
6KELLY Sean159
7GREIPEL André158
8PETACCHI Alessandro150
9ZABEL Erik150
10MAERTENS Freddy148
11HINAULT Bernard146
12MOSER Francesco146
13SARONNI Giuseppe141
14JALABERT Laurent140
15VALVERDE Alejandro133
16POBLET Miguel128
17PERURENA Domingo124
18BOONEN Tom122
19SAGAN Peter121
20ANQUETIL Jacques120
21RODRÍGUEZ Delio117
22MCEWEN Robbie116
23KIRSIPUU Jaan116
24GIRARDENGO Costante99
25LUDWIG Olaf98
26BITOSSI Franco98
27DÉMARE Arnaud95
28ZOETEMELK Joop95
29VANDERAERDEN Eric94
30KRISTOFF Alexander92
31INDURAIN Miguel91
32ROMINGER Tony90
33BINDA Alfredo90
34VIVIANI Elia89
35KITTEL Marcel89
36CANCELLARA Fabian88
37COPPI Fausto87
38BARTALI Gino87
39ROGLIČ Primož84
40BOASSON HAGEN Edvald81
41GILBERT Philippe80
42POGAČAR Tadej78
43GROENEWEGEN Dylan73
44PLANCKAERT Eddy73
45POULIDOR Raymond73
46FREIRE Óscar72
47GIMONDI Felice72
48ANDERSON Phil71
49BOUHANNI Nacer70
50KÜBLER Ferdinand70
 
(continued)

51CAÑARDO Mariano70
52BONTEMPI Guido69
53BOBET Louison69
54CONTADOR Alberto68
55BARBOSA Cândido68
56VAN POPPEL Jean-Paul68
57KNETEMANN Gerrie68
58BENNETT Sam67
59MARTIN Tony67
60SVORADA Ján67
61MUSEEUW Johan67
62ARGENTIN Moreno67
63RAAS Jan67
64HUSHOVD Thor66
65STEELS Tom65
66WÜST Marcel65
67NIJDAM Jelle65
68VERBEECK Frans65
69ZÜLLE Alex64
70GUTIÉRREZ Alfonso64
71ALTIG Rudi64
72REBELLIN Davide62
73VAN STEENBERGEN Rik62
74GUERRA Learco62
75EWAN Caleb61
76BETTINI Paolo61
77GODEFROOT Walter61
78OCAÑA Luis60
79VAN SPRINGEL Herman60
80AGOSTINHO Joaquim60
81BUGNO Gianni59
82DEJONCKHEERE Noël59
83DARRIGADE André59
84VOIGT Jens58
85FRANTZ Nicolas58
86MOTTET Charly57
87SERCU Patrick57
88BLIJLEVENS Jeroen56
89FONDRIEST Maurizio56
90VANDENBROUCKE Jean-Luc56

IDK, the credible all-time lists I have found have Cav ranked around 25th. I can understand the reasoning, and that’s no slight - everyone ranked 20th-29th is an absolute legend.

But those lists are also dominated by guys who rode manual shifters (heavy 5 speed steel bikes with clanged shifters won theTdF up until 1957.) Clipless pedals have only been around for ~ 35 years, carbon frames 25 years. Everything today is superlight (min weight has been 6.8 kg since 2000), super aero, skin suits, wireless electronic shifters.

Trying to rank today’s riders vs Anquetil, Merckx, or Hinault is like trying to say Don Hutson was better than Jerry Rice. Or that Mel Blount would blanket Justin Jefferson.

PCS All Time Rankings

(the above list only accounts for Grand Tour Top Tens and Top 3s in GT stages; does not evaluate one-day classics or all the great one-week tours)
 
When we camped at the tourmalet, cav was dead last coming up the hill. Directly in front of the broom wagon. He was suffering mightily but had a great attitude. Engaging the crowd. Everyone was running behind him and giving him a push.
 
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