jchapman70
Footballguy
I was thinking today about what a beast Patrick Willis is. Does anyone know the rookie record for most tackles in a season? He has to be getting close.
Fantasy Football - Footballguys Forums
This is a sample guest message. Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!
Patrick Willis (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter jchapman70
- Start date
Ozymandias
Footballguy
Don't know the record, but Demeco Ryans had 126 solos last year. Willis has 107 to date.
JMJ
Footballguy
2nd round pick rookie MLB David Harris from the NY Jets is more of a beast then Willis is.
Willis started all 13 games for SF this year and has 136 tackles, 1 sack, 1 FF, and 3 passes defended.
Harris in only 6 starts since Vilma went down has 100 tackles, 3 sacks, 1 FF, 1 FR, and 1 pass defended.
In Harris' 6 starts here are his tackle numbers:
17
24
11
6
8
9
Also, all 3 of his sacks came as a starter since he wasn't playing much at all until Vilma went down. So in Harris' 6 starts only his averages are:
12.5 tackles per game and 1 sack every other game.
Multiply those averages by the 13 games Willis has started and Harris' numbers would look as follows:
162.5 tackles and 6.5 sacks!!!!!!!!
Kind of makes Willis' 136 tackles and 1 sack not so impressive, huh?
Willis started all 13 games for SF this year and has 136 tackles, 1 sack, 1 FF, and 3 passes defended.
Harris in only 6 starts since Vilma went down has 100 tackles, 3 sacks, 1 FF, 1 FR, and 1 pass defended.
In Harris' 6 starts here are his tackle numbers:
17
24
11
6
8
9
Also, all 3 of his sacks came as a starter since he wasn't playing much at all until Vilma went down. So in Harris' 6 starts only his averages are:
12.5 tackles per game and 1 sack every other game.
Multiply those averages by the 13 games Willis has started and Harris' numbers would look as follows:
162.5 tackles and 6.5 sacks!!!!!!!!
Kind of makes Willis' 136 tackles and 1 sack not so impressive, huh?
Phlash
Footballguy
Patrick Willis - 22 years oldDavid Harris - 23 years old2nd round pick rookie MLB David Harris from the NY Jets is more of a beast then Willis is.
Willis started all 13 games for SF this year and has 136 tackles, 1 sack, 1 FF, and 3 passes defended.
Harris in only 6 starts since Vilma went down has 100 tackles, 3 sacks, 1 FF, 1 FR, and 1 pass defended.
In Harris' 6 starts here are his tackle numbers:
17
24
11
6
8
9
Also, all 3 of his sacks came as a starter since he wasn't playing much at all until Vilma went down. So in Harris' 6 starts only his averages are:
12.5 tackles per game and 1 sack every other game.
Multiply those averages by the 13 games Willis has started and Harris' numbers would look as follows:
162.5 tackles and 6.5 sacks!!!!!!!!
Kind of makes Willis' 136 tackles and 1 sack not so impressive, huh?
Patrick Willis is not only younger but this year has been a rock for the 49ers. David Harris is good but Willis is a stud right now.
JMJ
Footballguy
Please explain this further. Harris' numbers are DESTROYING Willis'. And, the Jets defense was a laughing stock (still is I guess) when the undersized Vilma was being tossed around in the middle. Harris is the revival of the unit as the Jets' defense has been night and day with him in there. Check Kerry Rhodes' production alone from the time Harris was put in to the time prior. Harris has totally changed the Jets front 7 by himself. They still stink compared to the great defenses in the league due to a lack of overall talent but Harris has changed everything. Gone are the days of running lanes the size a truck could fit through up the middle. Harris doesn't just compile tackle numbes .... he hits the ever living snot out of people.Patrick Willis - 22 years oldDavid Harris - 23 years old2nd round pick rookie MLB David Harris from the NY Jets is more of a beast then Willis is.
Willis started all 13 games for SF this year and has 136 tackles, 1 sack, 1 FF, and 3 passes defended.
Harris in only 6 starts since Vilma went down has 100 tackles, 3 sacks, 1 FF, 1 FR, and 1 pass defended.
In Harris' 6 starts here are his tackle numbers:
17
24
11
6
8
9
Also, all 3 of his sacks came as a starter since he wasn't playing much at all until Vilma went down. So in Harris' 6 starts only his averages are:
12.5 tackles per game and 1 sack every other game.
Multiply those averages by the 13 games Willis has started and Harris' numbers would look as follows:
162.5 tackles and 6.5 sacks!!!!!!!!
Kind of makes Willis' 136 tackles and 1 sack not so impressive, huh?
Patrick Willis is not only younger but this year has been a rock for the 49ers. David Harris is good but Willis is a stud right now.
Last edited by a moderator:
Phlash
Footballguy
Davis had a hot start (17, 24, 11) but has tapered off. Willis has been getting better all year (18, 18, 8 last 3 games). Also, how can you pro-rate Harris's stats but not Willis? Willis is on pace for 167 tackles, which is better than your man Harris's prorated tackles at 162.5. But we're splitting hairs at this point - Willis has played all year and Harris has just jumped in during the middle of the year as teams are getting beat up, so he's more fresh. Doesn't seem like a fair comparison, but Willis still managed to be better despite playing all year. HTH.
JMJ
Footballguy
Harris' 162.5 wasn't pro-rated over the entire season .... just 13 games like Willis'.Harris would be at 162.5 right now! Not after 16 games like what you did for Willis.
Harris is pro-rated for an even 200 tackles after 16 games.
HTH.
Last edited by a moderator:
Jeff Pasquino
Footballguy
Both are very good, but it really is dependent upon the other teams' game plans. If the opposition decides to throw 75+% of the time (as NE might this Sunday) a LB's numbers will suffer (I'm saying look elsewhere if you can rather than going with Harris). Willis and Harris are both benefitting from their teams being miserable. RBs consistently get past the front D-line and to the LBs, allowing both to make plays. That plus the fact that the defense is on the field way too much for both adds more chances.
Not saying both are not good - both of these guys are - but circumstances can dictate performances.
I'd take Willis over Harris long term, but that could also change if Singletary leaves the 49ers. Right now I think he's the engine driving that defense. He also shows better sideline-to-sideline and recovery speed than Harris.
Jeff - not sure how many Jet games you've seen, but Harris is an absolute monster. He is ALWAYS in on the play - he's just a fantastic football player. With that being said, I haven't seen much of the 9ers this year to compare to Willis, but Harris is an absolute force in the middle. I do not think this will dwindle long-term either.
JMJ
Footballguy
+1.I always used to joke about Troy Polamalu and say that it looked like there was more then one of him out there. If there is a play made behind the line of scrimmage .... Troy was there. Sideline .... Troy was there. Secondary .... Troy was there. Etc, etc.
I swear to you all who unlike Patoons and I have never put yourself through the misery and torture that it is to watch an entire 2007 NY Jets game but that is exactly what you can say of Harris. Its uncanny that this kid is anywhere and everywhere the ball and play is every single time. Truely amazing.
Jeff Pasquino
Footballguy
More like I haven't "endured" many Jets games. I will give you both the benefit of the doubt as I'm sure you've seen more than I have - but I have seen him (I try to erase as many Jets memories as I can). He's good. I just think Willis is better. Both have played at elite levels though so it's not much of an argument against either one.+1.I always used to joke about Troy Polamalu and say that it looked like there was more then one of him out there. If there is a play made behind the line of scrimmage .... Troy was there. Sideline .... Troy was there. Secondary .... Troy was there. Etc, etc.I swear to you all who unlike Patoons and I have never put yourself through the misery and torture that it is to watch an entire 2007 NY Jets game but that is exactly what you can say of Harris. Its uncanny that this kid is anywhere and everywhere the ball and play is every single time. Truely amazing.
JMJ
Footballguy
As a Jets fan for over 20 years ..... so do I.More like I haven't "endured" many Jets games. I will give you both the benefit of the doubt as I'm sure you've seen more than I have - but I have seen him (I try to erase as many Jets memories as I can). He's good. I just think Willis is better. Both have played at elite levels though so it's not much of an argument against either one.+1.I always used to joke about Troy Polamalu and say that it looked like there was more then one of him out there. If there is a play made behind the line of scrimmage .... Troy was there. Sideline .... Troy was there. Secondary .... Troy was there. Etc, etc.
I swear to you all who unlike Patoons and I have never put yourself through the misery and torture that it is to watch an entire 2007 NY Jets game but that is exactly what you can say of Harris. Its uncanny that this kid is anywhere and everywhere the ball and play is every single time. Truely amazing.
I think most Jets fans (including me) have a little chip on their shoulder when it comes to Patrick Willis. He is the toast of the league right now when it comes to "IT" young LBs, he's on magazine covers, he's forever talked about, etc, etc. However, we watch Harris week-in and week-out. The guy is flat out a STUD and his average numbers since becoming a starter flat out destroy Willis' numbers.I can admit that this is the driving force that led me to this thread. Harris is doing all this with ZERO mainstream fan fair and it does annoy Jets' fans because the kid is unreal.
David Harris is the truth.
yetiknight
Footballguy
Harris is good enough that with only six starts he will likely garner many DROY votes. Willis should still win easily though.
Edited to add: Both of these guys are doing it from the 3-4 base defense. Vilma was considered a stud until he was put in the same position. He struggled mightily for the a season and a half.
Edited to add: Both of these guys are doing it from the 3-4 base defense. Vilma was considered a stud until he was put in the same position. He struggled mightily for the a season and a half.
Last edited by a moderator:
Jeff Pasquino
Footballguy
Harris will be a steal next year in IDP guppy leagues (redraft).
But - the SOD will be Poz.
But - the SOD will be Poz.
Jene Bramel
Footballguy
It's too early to say whether Willis or Harris is better. Tackle numbers don't tell the story.
Earlier in the season, before the hand injury and any proverbial "rookie wall" issues, Willis was proving himself among the elite linebackers in the league. He's been extremely sudden in the role, active but erratic in pass rush and a little better than adequate in coverage. His range and speed were tremendous. Some of that has dropped off in recent games, though he looked as solid as ever against Arizona.
Harris has been the better plugger, though not as sudden to the hole as Willis was earlier in the year. That's pretty nitpickish, as Harris has been very good. Harris has been a little better in coverage and pass rush than Willis, which bodes well for his future as those were two of his minor blemishes before his solid predraft workouts. It's nice to see that his "improved" speed and athleticism during those workouts continued into the regular season.
Both are joining the previous two seasons of very, very good young linebackers. Enjoy them, because I'm not seeing an obvious group to join them in 2008.
And Jeff is absolutely right. Posluszny was looking every bit the player before his arm injury. Don't forget about Jon Beason either. He doesn't get much pimping outside the IDP forum, but I still maintain that he could become the best of the bunch.
Tatupu, Morrison, Ruud, Ryans, Beason, Harris, Willis and Posluszny are going to be a great core of inside backers over the next half decade. The OLB group over the past three seasons have been just as impressive.
Earlier in the season, before the hand injury and any proverbial "rookie wall" issues, Willis was proving himself among the elite linebackers in the league. He's been extremely sudden in the role, active but erratic in pass rush and a little better than adequate in coverage. His range and speed were tremendous. Some of that has dropped off in recent games, though he looked as solid as ever against Arizona.
Harris has been the better plugger, though not as sudden to the hole as Willis was earlier in the year. That's pretty nitpickish, as Harris has been very good. Harris has been a little better in coverage and pass rush than Willis, which bodes well for his future as those were two of his minor blemishes before his solid predraft workouts. It's nice to see that his "improved" speed and athleticism during those workouts continued into the regular season.
Both are joining the previous two seasons of very, very good young linebackers. Enjoy them, because I'm not seeing an obvious group to join them in 2008.
And Jeff is absolutely right. Posluszny was looking every bit the player before his arm injury. Don't forget about Jon Beason either. He doesn't get much pimping outside the IDP forum, but I still maintain that he could become the best of the bunch.
Tatupu, Morrison, Ruud, Ryans, Beason, Harris, Willis and Posluszny are going to be a great core of inside backers over the next half decade. The OLB group over the past three seasons have been just as impressive.
Jene Bramel
Footballguy
Bengals WR Chad Johnson on Patrick Willis in a conference call with SF beat writers this week.
Leave it to Chatty Chad Johnson to turn a routine conference call into high hilarity when the subject turned to Patrick Willis, the 49ers' sensational rookie linebacker.
The Bengals' animated wide receiver fairly exploded in praise when asked a seemingly innocuous question about San Francisco's defense.
"Who in the (expletive) is 52? Oh, my (expletive) God! I done seen a lot of linebackers in a seven-year period. ... You guys can laugh all you want, he is the real deal! He's playing with a cast on his hand, right? All during film, I'm calling him Bam-Bam."
Johnson wasn't finished.
"He's the truth. You just tell him 85 said you're the truth. I stopped watching the DBs to watch him. I don't know anything about playing the position but I know when someone is doing something right, because he is making every damn play."
Referring to the play in which Willis ran down Arizona wide receiver Sean Morey after 60 yards Nov. 25, Johnson said, "That's unheard of."
Leave it to Chatty Chad Johnson to turn a routine conference call into high hilarity when the subject turned to Patrick Willis, the 49ers' sensational rookie linebacker.
The Bengals' animated wide receiver fairly exploded in praise when asked a seemingly innocuous question about San Francisco's defense.
"Who in the (expletive) is 52? Oh, my (expletive) God! I done seen a lot of linebackers in a seven-year period. ... You guys can laugh all you want, he is the real deal! He's playing with a cast on his hand, right? All during film, I'm calling him Bam-Bam."
Johnson wasn't finished.
"He's the truth. You just tell him 85 said you're the truth. I stopped watching the DBs to watch him. I don't know anything about playing the position but I know when someone is doing something right, because he is making every damn play."
Referring to the play in which Willis ran down Arizona wide receiver Sean Morey after 60 yards Nov. 25, Johnson said, "That's unheard of."
Jeff Pasquino
Footballguy
The kid from UDel (Eric Johnson IIRC) looked pretty good last night.
Limp Dogg Bizkits
Footballguy
I am just giddy to have both Willis and Harris in my startup dynasty where you get 2 points per solo and 1 per ast.
I have an offer out of my 2nd round pick (last 4 picks) for Poz.
I have an offer out of my 2nd round pick (last 4 picks) for Poz.
Mr. Know-It-All
Footballguy
Check this out (and I was luaghed at on draft day for going young) -We start 2 LBs and one flex. In addition to 2 DBs and 2 DLs.My LBs -Willis, Beason, DiGiorgio, HarrisThe one guy I missed was Poz, and he went one round ahead of where I targeted him.
