Patriots being investigated after Colts game (2 Viewers)

[ChuckLiddell]

Pats fans.... Im looking for a YES or NO response.

Is deflating game balls to get a competitive advantage cheating?

YES or NO?

Note: I am not accusing the Patriots of doing this or asking about their specific situation. Im just asking if it is by rule a cheating offense.

Just as much cheating as a roughing the passer penalty, hitting a defenseless receiver in the head, stretching the truth on an injury report, having a coach on the field of play to disrupt a kick returner, messing with the salary cap, or stealing another team's signals, having the clock operator run off some extra time, having too many practices in pads, spying on another team's practice, faking an injury to slow down a hurry up offense, or taking steroids. They are all forms of cheating, and the list and examples could go on and on and the team's that have done stuff could go on and on. Yahoos like us on a public forum could be outraged, but most of current and former players accept that stuff like that goes on. All. The. Time.

fair enough.

Now answer this, if a person cheats and roughs the passer or holds, does that play stand?

No the play does not stand, they get punished for cheating. The play doesn't count and the cheating team loses yards. So if that is the case then that game should not count if they get caught cheating.

Now you say "oh it didn't effect the game". Also true, but I have seen plenty of holding calls on the backside of the play that had zero effect on the play and it still got called a holding.

So if they get caught, then does that game not count cause they cheated?

We could do this all day long, but I will bite at least for now. You can't regulate everything. If guys are found to have used PEDs, the team doesn't forfeit. If a guy is found to have a non-compliant contract per the CBA or salary cap, they don't make the player sit out. If a stadium puts blowers on for a long FG attempt to try to get an extra yard or two on the kick they don't forfeit the game.

Again as I have outlined a ton of examples at the pro or youth levels, teams will do whatever they can to try to win, whether it is considered cheating or not. For youth leagues with weight restrictions, I have seen coaches intentionally make the scale add 3-4 pounds to kids' weights so they couldn't play. I have seen kids weigh in without their required equipment on to make weight. I have seen clock operators "accidently" pull the plug on the scoreboard and change everything that was on it but the score to gain an advantage (down and distance, add a timeout, change the time), etc. Coaches would put guys in the trees at other team's practices to tape their practices. I even heard of a team bugging the opponent's locker room to listen in on what they were playing and what some of their audibles would be.

Bottom line, cheating is so prevalent in sports that if you aren't doing it you really aren't trying. Sad but true.

So sure, to the letter of the law the Patriots are "cheaters." I can see how that would offend people and thing that that alone should cause NE to be stripped of their titles and have to vacate their victories. And I can see that perspective. I personally don't agree with it, but people can have that opinion. But when guys like Jimmy Johnson and Bill Cower literally laugh at people that are offended by what the Pats have done and launch into stories about all the things that have been done over the year, that tells me that it really isn't that big a deal.

I put everything in my theory of relativity model. Is 60 degrees hot or cold? It depends if you live in Alaska or the Equator. To some what the Patriots have done is cheating at the highest order. To others it's driving 56 in a 55 mph speed zone.

This post casts a very dark cloud over sports at every level. Not that these things are happening (which I agree that they are), but that your point seems to be that its perfectly OK for them to happen, and we should all turn a blind eye to it since it is so prevalent. Cannot disagree with that more. If you are brought up properly, you learn at a young age the difference between wrong and right. Most of what you describe here is inarguably wrong, and I would hope and imagine unacceptable to most people. You seem fine with it though, and that is your right. I just wouldnt expect the majority of people to agree with you, or get offended when they dont. I suspect you are in the minority. Maybe not in this thread, but in society as a whole.

 

[[icon]]

Indy tears. Yum yum.

Perhaps second only to Baltimore tears.

This is awesome

 

[Devine Intervention]

Pats fans.... Im looking for a YES or NO response.

Is deflating game balls to get a competitive advantage cheating?

YES or NO?

Note: I am not accusing the Patriots of doing this or asking about their specific situation. Im just asking if it is by rule a cheating offense.

Just as much cheating as a roughing the passer penalty, hitting a defenseless receiver in the head, stretching the truth on an injury report, having a coach on the field of play to disrupt a kick returner, messing with the salary cap, or stealing another team's signals, having the clock operator run off some extra time, having too many practices in pads, spying on another team's practice, faking an injury to slow down a hurry up offense, or taking steroids. They are all forms of cheating, and the list and examples could go on and on and the team's that have done stuff could go on and on. Yahoos like us on a public forum could be outraged, but most of current and former players accept that stuff like that goes on. All. The. Time.

fair enough.

Now answer this, if a person cheats and roughs the passer or holds, does that play stand?

No the play does not stand, they get punished for cheating. The play doesn't count and the cheating team loses yards. So if that is the case then that game should not count if they get caught cheating.

Now you say "oh it didn't effect the game". Also true, but I have seen plenty of holding calls on the backside of the play that had zero effect on the play and it still got called a holding.

So if they get caught, then does that game not count cause they cheated?

We could do this all day long, but I will bite at least for now. You can't regulate everything. If guys are found to have used PEDs, the team doesn't forfeit. If a guy is found to have a non-compliant contract per the CBA or salary cap, they don't make the player sit out. If a stadium puts blowers on for a long FG attempt to try to get an extra yard or two on the kick they don't forfeit the game.

Again as I have outlined a ton of examples at the pro or youth levels, teams will do whatever they can to try to win, whether it is considered cheating or not. For youth leagues with weight restrictions, I have seen coaches intentionally make the scale add 3-4 pounds to kids' weights so they couldn't play. I have seen kids weigh in without their required equipment on to make weight. I have seen clock operators "accidently" pull the plug on the scoreboard and change everything that was on it but the score to gain an advantage (down and distance, add a timeout, change the time), etc. Coaches would put guys in the trees at other team's practices to tape their practices. I even heard of a team bugging the opponent's locker room to listen in on what they were playing and what some of their audibles would be.

Bottom line, cheating is so prevalent in sports that if you aren't doing it you really aren't trying. Sad but true.

So sure, to the letter of the law the Patriots are "cheaters." I can see how that would offend people and thing that that alone should cause NE to be stripped of their titles and have to vacate their victories. And I can see that perspective. I personally don't agree with it, but people can have that opinion. But when guys like Jimmy Johnson and Bill Cower literally laugh at people that are offended by what the Pats have done and launch into stories about all the things that have been done over the year, that tells me that it really isn't that big a deal.

I put everything in my theory of relativity model. Is 60 degrees hot or cold? It depends if you live in Alaska or the Equator. To some what the Patriots have done is cheating at the highest order. To others it's driving 56 in a 55 mph speed zone.

This post casts a very dark cloud over sports at every level. Not that these things are happening (which I agree that they are), but that your point seems to be that its perfectly OK for them to happen, and we should all turn a blind eye to it since it is so prevalent. Cannot disagree with that more. If you are brought up properly, you learn at a young age the difference between wrong and right. Most of what you describe here is inarguably wrong, and I would hope and imagine unacceptable to most people. You seem fine with it though, and that is your right. I just wouldnt expect the majority of people to agree with you, or get offended when they dont. I suspect you are in the minority. Maybe not in this thread, but in society as a whole.

Exactly

 

[JohnnyU]

Pats fans.... Im looking for a YES or NO response.

Is deflating game balls to get a competitive advantage cheating?

YES or NO?

Note: I am not accusing the Patriots of doing this or asking about their specific situation. Im just asking if it is by rule a cheating offense.

Just as much cheating as a roughing the passer penalty, hitting a defenseless receiver in the head, stretching the truth on an injury report, having a coach on the field of play to disrupt a kick returner, messing with the salary cap, or stealing another team's signals, having the clock operator run off some extra time, having too many practices in pads, spying on another team's practice, faking an injury to slow down a hurry up offense, or taking steroids. They are all forms of cheating, and the list and examples could go on and on and the team's that have done stuff could go on and on. Yahoos like us on a public forum could be outraged, but most of current and former players accept that stuff like that goes on. All. The. Time.

fair enough.

Now answer this, if a person cheats and roughs the passer or holds, does that play stand?

No the play does not stand, they get punished for cheating. The play doesn't count and the cheating team loses yards. So if that is the case then that game should not count if they get caught cheating.

Now you say "oh it didn't effect the game". Also true, but I have seen plenty of holding calls on the backside of the play that had zero effect on the play and it still got called a holding.

So if they get caught, then does that game not count cause they cheated?

We could do this all day long, but I will bite at least for now. You can't regulate everything. If guys are found to have used PEDs, the team doesn't forfeit. If a guy is found to have a non-compliant contract per the CBA or salary cap, they don't make the player sit out. If a stadium puts blowers on for a long FG attempt to try to get an extra yard or two on the kick they don't forfeit the game.

Again as I have outlined a ton of examples at the pro or youth levels, teams will do whatever they can to try to win, whether it is considered cheating or not. For youth leagues with weight restrictions, I have seen coaches intentionally make the scale add 3-4 pounds to kids' weights so they couldn't play. I have seen kids weigh in without their required equipment on to make weight. I have seen clock operators "accidently" pull the plug on the scoreboard and change everything that was on it but the score to gain an advantage (down and distance, add a timeout, change the time), etc. Coaches would put guys in the trees at other team's practices to tape their practices. I even heard of a team bugging the opponent's locker room to listen in on what they were playing and what some of their audibles would be.

Bottom line, cheating is so prevalent in sports that if you aren't doing it you really aren't trying. Sad but true.

So sure, to the letter of the law the Patriots are "cheaters." I can see how that would offend people and thing that that alone should cause NE to be stripped of their titles and have to vacate their victories. And I can see that perspective. I personally don't agree with it, but people can have that opinion. But when guys like Jimmy Johnson and Bill Cower literally laugh at people that are offended by what the Pats have done and launch into stories about all the things that have been done over the year, that tells me that it really isn't that big a deal.

I put everything in my theory of relativity model. Is 60 degrees hot or cold? It depends if you live in Alaska or the Equator. To some what the Patriots have done is cheating at the highest order. To others it's driving 56 in a 55 mph speed zone.

This post casts a very dark cloud over sports at every level. Not that these things are happening (which I agree that they are), but that your point seems to be that its perfectly OK for them to happen, and we should all turn a blind eye to it since it is so prevalent. Cannot disagree with that more. If you are brought up properly, you learn at a young age the difference between wrong and right. Most of what you describe here is inarguably wrong, and I would hope and imagine unacceptable to most people. You seem fine with it though, and that is your right. I just wouldnt expect the majority of people to agree with you, or get offended when they dont. I suspect you are in the minority. Maybe not in this thread, but in society as a whole.

Oh, he's in the minority on that, both in this forum (minus pats fans) and anywhere else.

 

[Baloney Sandwich]

BB will be on WEEI in a few minutes for his weekly radio gig.

 

[jon_mx]

Seems to be a culture of cheating.

 

[devouredbychaos]

Pats fans, please don't feed the trolls, do a search on DI's posts and you can see he is likely using an alias (all you see is infrequent pats hater pro manning posts), likely a bitter Colts\Manning fan. He becomes only the 3rd poster\alias (in 14 years) to make it to my ignore list and I urge everyone else does likewise.

Sorry to say, not a Colts fan. I do think Manning is the best but that's just out of pure opinion of his skill.

Lol. His skill of choking in the playoffs? I'm not trying to feed the trolls..but I couldn't resist

 

[the moops]

Seems to be a culture of cheating.

Welcome to the world of sports

 

[General Tso]

The other element here is the paranoia in sports over potential cheating. For years and years, I covered youth sports for local newspapers and web sites. I walked the sidelines of football games with rosters of the teams and a notebook, and I jotted down the particulars of the big plays. I also kept a tally of individual plays to add up the stats at the end of the game. On many occasions coaches were CONVINCED I was spying and relaying information to the other sideline. Several times coaches tried to have me removed and called security or the cops. A couple times they made me empty my pockets, checked my ID, and went through everything I had written down and my texts.

Sad isn't it? I used to videotape a local high school's football games for the Booster Club for an end of year highlight video. I was harassed all the time, to the point where one night the AD of Berlin, CT tried to have me arrested on the field. The cops didn't quite know what to make of the lunatic.

 

[PatsWillWin]

How's the investigation going? I haven't heard anything. The story isn't even on the front page of PFT.

Can I get an update?

 

[Anarchy99]

I am not condoning the way things are, but at a certain point you have to come to grips with what goes on.

I have coached a lot of different sports and have not encouraged or engaged in some of the crap that goes on. For a lot of sports there are all types of rules . . . weights of the players, how many innings you can pitch, how many minutes kids can play, minimum plays, the age of players, etc. All of those are UNIVERSALLY abused at the youth level. I always adhered to those types of rules and even started instituting ways to mandate that they were followed. And even following the rules I was accused of cheating. (I developed spreadsheets and printed out sheets with player rotations, log in times for kids going in and out of games, and even had score keepers initial when players were substituted.) I didn't even care if other teams broke the rules, as I game planned to win within the rules of the league.

That being said, there are rules of the game and tendencies of the refs that you can exploit. For example, in basketball you can set illegal screens on inbound plays that will yield a lay up every time. Except they rarely call it, and even if they did they will call it 1 out of 100 times. Other coaches would instruct their players to punch or elbow kids behind the play that refs couldn't see or told players to intentionally foul players so hard they wouldn't be able to play. To the letter of the law it was cheating, so call me a cheater, but that was on an entirely different level then coaching kids to injure another player.

To be honest, there is so much rule breaking going on that a lot of times it takes the fun out of the game for anyone involved. My son's basketball team played in a tournament this year for 13 year olds and lost because the other team played a 16 year old and was like 6'4". Congrats on having a kid that shouldn't have played score 35 points and making our team look bad.

 

[Dinsy Ejotuz]

How's the investigation going? I haven't heard anything. The story isn't even on the front page of PFT.

Can I get an update?

Don't know either, but it's interesting that the NFL hasn't addressed it yet after acknowledging they were investigating and indicating they'd say something about it first thing today.

 

[Devine Intervention]

I am not condoning the way things are, but at a certain point you have to come to grips with what goes on.

I have coached a lot of different sports and have not encouraged or engaged in some of the crap that goes on. For a lot of sports there are all types of rules . . . weights of the players, how many innings you can pitch, how many minutes kids can play, minimum plays, the age of players, etc. All of those are UNIVERSALLY abused at the youth level. I always adhered to those types of rules and even started instituting ways to mandate that they were followed. And even following the rules I was accused of cheating. (I developed spreadsheets and printed out sheets with player rotations, log in times for kids going in and out of games, and even had score keepers initial when players were substituted.) I didn't even care if other teams broke the rules, as I game planned to win within the rules of the league.

That being said, there are rules of the game and tendencies of the refs that you can exploit. For example, in basketball you can set illegal screens on inbound plays that will yield a lay up every time. Except they rarely call it, and even if they did they will call it 1 out of 100 times. Other coaches would instruct their players to punch or elbow kids behind the play that refs couldn't see or told players to intentionally foul players so hard they wouldn't be able to play. To the letter of the law it was cheating, so call me a cheater, but that was on an entirely different level then coaching kids to injure another player.

To be honest, there is so much rule breaking going on that a lot of times it takes the fun out of the game for anyone involved. My son's basketball team played in a tournament this year for 13 year olds and lost because the other team played a 16 year old and was like 6'4". Congrats on having a kid that shouldn't have played score 35 points and making our team look bad.

Well that is sad for the kids on your teams who play within the rules that feel less than a team that cheats to win. And with that I have a problem. I don't care how often it happens. Doesn't make it right

 

[Baloney Sandwich]

BB will be on WEEI in a few minutes for his weekly radio gig.

He said they did it and he is surprised they got caught. He said if they lose a pick it will most likely be a 6th or 7th round one and that was well worth the price of making another SB. Hopefully this ends the debate.

 

[randall146]

We have to deflate the balls so they'll be easier for our ineligible receivers to catch.

NE Patriots 2015 Super Bowl run: Deception + Deflation = Domination

 

[the moops]

For example, in basketball you can set illegal screens on inbound plays that will yield a lay up every time.

That must be some screen you are setting. Does it involve the decapitation of the defensive player?

 

[Evilgrin 72]

I can't wait for the Super Bowl when Belichick will fill one of their balls with helium instead of air. Brady will drop back to pass, arc a towering spiral down the field, which will rise.......rise.......keep rising......... and sail right out of the stadium and up into the afternoon desert sky.

A week later, someone named Ngoc will find the ball on the beach and look to the sky. With a slight nod and a wry smile, he'll softly say "Berrichek," put the ball in his backpack, and his moped will whine off into the jungle.

 

[msudaisy26]

Seems to be a culture of cheating.

Welcome to the world.

Fixed it for you

 

[msudaisy26]

I love this classless angle that Devine is preaching over and over again. We all thank you for being the moral police of the shark pool and on earth. Keep it up!

 

[Anarchy99]

For example, in basketball you can set illegal screens on inbound plays that will yield a lay up every time.

That must be some screen you are setting. Does it involve the decapitation of the defensive player?

It's basically setting a stack play across the court width wise instead of length wise and setting screens behind the defenders so they can't go backwards to defend the pass. Many teams will go into a 2-3 zone to prevent easy baskets. But the offense sets a wall BEHIND the 3 defenders on the baseline. The in bounder lobs over the line of kids to someone who is in perfect position to make a lay up, as the defense is pinned behind the wall. It works because the defense doesn't know that there is a pick behind them (which is the illegal part). It happens so quickly that refs generally don't stop to consider that it is technically illegal.

 

[[icon]]

I can't wait for the Super Bowl when Belichick will fill one of their balls with helium instead of air. Brady will drop back to pass, arc a towering spiral down the field, which will rise.......rise.......keep rising......... and sail right out of the stadium and up into the afternoon desert sky.

A week later, someone named Ngoc will find the ball on the beach and look to the sky. With a slight nod and a wry smile, he'll softly say "Berrichek," put the ball in his backpack, and his moped will whine off into the jungle.

I HAD THIS EXACT SAME DREAM LAST NIGHT!!!1!!

 

[Devine Intervention]

I love this classless angle that Devine is preaching over and over again. We all thank you for being the moral police of the shark pool and on earth. Keep it up!

No problem. You are welcome. Cleary Boston lacks in this department. As does their little league sports too.

I guess if I had to aim for something, having morals in sports or just saying it is what it is, I will push morals every time. Seeing I just had a son of my own, you better believe I will teach him doing right morally is better than a W in the win column.

 

[PatsWillWin]

How's the investigation going? I haven't heard anything. The story isn't even on the front page of PFT.

Can I get an update?

Don't know either, but it's interesting that the NFL hasn't addressed it yet after acknowledging they were investigating and indicating they'd say something about it first thing today.

Is it? Does the NFL always comment on things that unnamed sources say to someone in the media?

 

[Anarchy99]

ESPN had people discussing the deflation issue. In terms of process, both teams supply the refs with a dozen balls 2 hours and 15 minutes before game time. The refs weigh and inspect all of the balls from each team (weight and pressure) and mark them as inspected and whether they are game or kicking balls. Each time a ball goes into the game during the game itself, a ref will examine the ball to make sure it is from the right team, the proper type (game or kicking), and to see if there is anything that would necessitate swapping it out for another ball. At any point, the refs can pull a game out of play if they feel it is not the right, it's dirty, it's too scuffed, it's wet, etc.

It sounds like there was a ball in particular from NE that the refs had an issue with in the second half, which they swapped out for another. Although only a guess at this point, on the surface it does not appear that all the balls did not meet weight or pressure.

They were discussing that only the 12 balls that were marked could get into the game, meaning that if a ball was underinflated it would have to be done manually on the sideline (couldn't sneak in another ball that wasn't marked). The weather might alter the pressure slightly. I would also wonder if a ball could have had a bad seal or seam that led to a leak.

At this point the league was going to talk to the officiating crew and see if they could determine what happened. "The Patriots accused of cheating" is the media spin, but it doesn't seem like for now the league is doing anything but following up to an incident involving a deflated ball.

 

[Daywalker]

Does NE provide the game balls? And/or did they allegedly deflate them during the game?

 

[Run It Up]

Does NE provide the game balls? And/or did they allegedly deflate them during the game?

To my knowledge, both teams provide the balls. They are inspected before the game and their access is guarded. What is being suggested is ridiculous.

The balls taken to be tested were taken before half time, balls were taken from both teams. Head of officiating said it is common practice.

 

[The Ref]

I have an inside source at both the Patriots and the NFL Officials office. What I'm hearing isn't good for the Patriots. It's being investigated that the Patriots have been using Dark Magic ever since the KC blowout. There are also unconfined rumors of Sith Lord Belicheck using his mind to deflate balls right before they are snapped.

A press conference is scheduled for tomorrow where a stiff penalty will be announced. I'm hearing even if the patriots win the toss at the super bowl they will be forced to defer the option to the second half of the game.

 

[HughHoney]

Pats fans are a lot like Penn State fans. Defend their team no matter what in the face of cheating or horrible criminal activities. Stick your head in the sand and keep waving your teams flag.

 

[The Ref]

Pats fans are a lot like Penn State fans. Defend their team no matter what in the face of cheating or horrible criminal activities. Stick your head in the sand and keep waving your teams flag.

Because enabling a decade long system of child abuse is = to performing scouting tactics that every other team used + completely unsubstantiated rumors in a 100-7 blowout.

Pathetic really.

 

[Baloney Sandwich]

Pats fans are a lot like Penn State fans. Defend their team no matter what in the face of cheating or horrible criminal activities. Stick your head in the sand and keep waving your teams flag.

Deflated footballs, 12 year old balls...almost identical

 

[PatsWillWin]

Pats fans are a lot like Penn State fans. Defend their team no matter what in the face of cheating or horrible criminal activities. Stick your head in the sand and keep waving your teams flag.

I draw a pretty significant line between sports and molesting kids, FWIW.

 

[bostonfred]

To be fair kids have smaller balls

 

[Flying Elvis]

I'm pretty sure drawing a comparison between child abuse and deflated footballs is the sports equivalent of the Hitler Rule.

 

[BustedKnuckles]

Pats fans are a lot like Penn State fans. Defend their team no matter what in the face of cheating or horrible criminal activities. Stick your head in the sand and keep waving your teams flag.

oh no you didnt !!!!!

 

[Thunderlips]

I have an inside source at both the Patriots and the NFL Officials office. What I'm hearing isn't good for the Patriots. It's being investigated that the Patriots have been using Dark Magic ever since the KC blowout. There are also unconfined rumors of Sith Lord Belicheck using his mind to deflate balls right before they are snapped.

A press conference is scheduled for tomorrow where a stiff penalty will be announced. I'm hearing even if the patriots win the toss at the super bowl they will be forced to defer the option to the second half of the game.

I would have went with Voldecheck.

 

[JIslander]

How come no one is bringing up the possibility that the balls may have become deflated from all the touchdown spikes performed by The Pats?

pott

I hate the Pats. But that was funny

 

[parrot]

New Allegation; http://imgur.com/D1NQ91x

 

[msudaisy26]

Jerry Sandusky, Hilter, Bernie Madoff, and the Patriots. I can't be the only one that sees the clear line between them all.

 

[Lutherman2112]

@Tom_Winter

BREAKING: New England Patriots' Vince Wilfork helped pull a woman out of an overturned jeep following yesterday's game - @MassStatePolice

Misdirection, or coverup?

Just carrying the baton from Tedy Bruschi

 

[Kool-Aid Larry]

I love this classless angle that Devine is preaching over and over again. We all thank you for being the moral police of the shark pool and on earth. Keep it up!

No problem. You are welcome. Cleary Boston lacks in this department. As does their little league sports too.

I guess if I had to aim for something, having morals in sports or just saying it is what it is, I will push morals every time. Seeing I just had a son of my own, you better believe I will teach him doing right morally is better than a W in the win column.

you going to teach him to troll messageboards all day, too?

 

[Lutherman2112]

@Tom_Winter

BREAKING: New England Patriots' Vince Wilfork helped pull a woman out of an overturned jeep following yesterday's game - @MassStatePolice

Misdirection, or coverup?

Jokes aside...cool of him to stop and help.

 

[JIslander]

@Tom_Winter

BREAKING: New England Patriots' Vince Wilfork helped pull a woman out of an overturned jeep following yesterday's game - @MassStatePolice

Misdirection, or coverup?

Jokes aside...cool of him to stop and help.

Are they sure Wilfork wasn't the one driving?

 

[Anarchy99]

Now that I think about it, even this thread's title is misleading. "Under inflated footballs from the NE/IND game are being reviewed" is a better title, as a ball from each sideline got pulled. Certainly not as provocative as PATRIOTS BEING INVESTIGATED AFTER COLTS GAME.

 

[Devine Intervention]

I love this classless angle that Devine is preaching over and over again. We all thank you for being the moral police of the shark pool and on earth. Keep it up!

No problem. You are welcome. Cleary Boston lacks in this department. As does their little league sports too.

I guess if I had to aim for something, having morals in sports or just saying it is what it is, I will push morals every time. Seeing I just had a son of my own, you better believe I will teach him doing right morally is better than a W in the win column.

you going to teach him to troll messageboards all day, too?

Look at the amount of post I have compared to yours. I don't waste much time on here. But if trolling this message board means being against a team for cheating, sure. I must be setting a bad example.

Teaching our kids its ok to cheat as long as you win and everyone else does it...... come on man. Be better. Just be better.

 

[Gandalf the Grey]

I love this classless angle that Devine is preaching over and over again. We all thank you for being the moral police of the shark pool and on earth. Keep it up!

No problem. You are welcome. Cleary Boston lacks in this department. As does their little league sports too. I guess if I had to aim for something, having morals in sports or just saying it is what it is, I will push morals every time. Seeing I just had a son of my own, you better believe I will teach him doing right morally is better than a W in the win column.

you going to teach him to troll messageboards all day, too?

This is funny. Kool-Aid Larry calling someone else a troll.

 

[ROCKET]

She was drunk. Now the headlines will read Pats player aiding and abettng drunk driver. Apparently Wilfork was trying to help her escape and cover up the evidence.

 

[Boston]

She was drunk. Now the headlines will read Pats player aiding and abettng drunk driver. Apparently Wilfork was trying to help her escape and cover up the evidence.

Another bad message being sent to the children of New England...

 

[PhD]

Lmao the amount of salt in this thread is ####### hilarious. The amount of "OMGZ THEY CHEATED" posts is even more hilarious. Gotta love how jealous the best franchise of the past 15 years makes people. I also find it funny that half of you guys are 40 and over, and yet you act like you're 12. Lets accuse someone of cheating even though there's no proof!

There has been plenty of proof that they cheated in the past. Once you are known as a cheater you do not get that benefit of the doubt.

If one of Greg Williams defense gets accused of targeting I bet he doesn't get the benefit of the doubt either.

Its not immature to dislike a team that has cheated and has had success. Look at A-rod, Barry Bonds, etc. No one likes a cheater. Its more immature to try to ignore their sketchy ways as long as it means winning. That's classless.

Embrace the stupidity and let us Pats fans know how it turns out. We'll be here, busy making plans for the Super Bowl

No one can take away your enjoyment as a classless organization. That is really awesome for your city. In all honesty I would take it if it were my city. But own it man. You have a sketchy team. So enjoy this time but 20 years from now when they compare dynasties lets see how it all plays out and what people actually give them credit for.

well, I think what you're forgetting is that time leads to a lot of hazy and incomplete memories.

people will tend to remember the glory days of these dynasties and forget the details.

like with san fran --- how often do you hear people writing off that dynasty because they had to outspend the league to buy championships?

or the steroids that paved the way for pittsburgh's short lived domination?

how about the salary cap cheating the broncos used to practice to get that unfair edge which led to titles?

most of that stuff is long forgotten

Interesting thought.

I would add that along with the details most fans forget the win-loss records of the years. Heck, people don't even remember the playoff teams. Not even the SB losers. We are a culture of championships. We remember Green Bay as an old school dominant team of the 60's because they won 6 titles in that time. Now they are good again but without the SB titles these more recent Packer teams of the last decade will go down as "good" but not elite or dominant. The Steelers were the elite, dominant team of the 70's because of their 4 SB titles in that era. Their more recent teams reflect a clear comeback but with only two SB titles in the last decade their recent teams will go down as good but not elite/dominant. Same is true with the Patriots. They will be remembered as the dominant team 10-12 years ago because of those 3 titles, but these last 10 years without SB titles will be remembered as good but not great teams.

Of course the fans of those teams will all argue about their greatness, but truth is, no one ever remembers the losers. Even the losers of the Superbowls.

 

[Green and Gold]

Jerry Sandusky, Hilter, Bernie Madoff, and the Patriots. I can't be the only one that sees the clear line between them all.

You have just redlined the Timsochet signal.

 

[Kool-Aid Larry]

Lmao the amount of salt in this thread is ####### hilarious. The amount of "OMGZ THEY CHEATED" posts is even more hilarious. Gotta love how jealous the best franchise of the past 15 years makes people. I also find it funny that half of you guys are 40 and over, and yet you act like you're 12. Lets accuse someone of cheating even though there's no proof!

There has been plenty of proof that they cheated in the past. Once you are known as a cheater you do not get that benefit of the doubt.

If one of Greg Williams defense gets accused of targeting I bet he doesn't get the benefit of the doubt either.

Its not immature to dislike a team that has cheated and has had success. Look at A-rod, Barry Bonds, etc. No one likes a cheater. Its more immature to try to ignore their sketchy ways as long as it means winning. That's classless.

Embrace the stupidity and let us Pats fans know how it turns out. We'll be here, busy making plans for the Super Bowl

No one can take away your enjoyment as a classless organization. That is really awesome for your city. In all honesty I would take it if it were my city. But own it man. You have a sketchy team. So enjoy this time but 20 years from now when they compare dynasties lets see how it all plays out and what people actually give them credit for.

well, I think what you're forgetting is that time leads to a lot of hazy and incomplete memories.

people will tend to remember the glory days of these dynasties and forget the details.

like with san fran --- how often do you hear people writing off that dynasty because they had to outspend the league to buy championships?

or the steroids that paved the way for pittsburgh's short lived domination?

how about the salary cap cheating the broncos used to practice to get that unfair edge which led to titles?

most of that stuff is long forgotten

Interesting thought.

I would add that along with the details most fans forget the win-loss records of the years. Heck, people don't even remember the playoff teams. Not even the SB losers. We are a culture of championships. We remember Green Bay as an old school dominant team of the 60's because they won 6 titles in that time. Now they are good again but without the SB titles these more recent Packer teams of the last decade will go down as "good" but not elite or dominant. The Steelers were the elite, dominant team of the 70's because of their 4 SB titles in that era. Their more recent teams reflect a clear comeback but with only two SB titles in the last decade their recent teams will go down as good but not elite/dominant. Same is true with the Patriots. They will be remembered as the dominant team 10-12 years ago because of those 3 titles, but these last 10 years without SB titles will be remembered as good but not great teams.

Of course the fans of those teams will all argue about their greatness, but truth is, no one ever remembers the losers. Even the losers of the Superbowls.

nobody outside yourself thinks that way.

there's nobody calling the niners dynasty a 4 championship run.

there were 3 consecutive years montana spit the bit and threw up jamarcian numbers in the 3 playoff losses but those years get folded in with the rest because it was a long time ago.

the pats dynasty will most likely comprise belichick's tenure with the team, unless they keep rolling even after his departure.

the single greatest dynasty in the history of football, and possibly all sports.