Patriots being investigated after Colts game (3 Viewers)

[Ojaays]

lol, the NFLPA's forensics expert was able to review the cell phone Brady used between spring of 2014 and nov 5, 2014 (pg 11) ... if that's true, how is it Brady's habit to destroy his old phones?

It was new habit, you know, after he got caught with his hand in the cookie jar...

 

[pantherclub]

I am not going to sit here and make an argument that deciding not to let the NFL view your phone after you already did previously doesn't look bad. Sure, it could be painted that he was hiding something. Point given.

But voluntarily doing something doesn't preclude you from revoking permission at a later date.

After the NFL has basically handled numerous high profile issues in the past...I would not feel confident or comfortable giving stuff voluntarily out to an organization that is looking to screw me over. Or are we under the pretense that Goodell was only motivated to find the truth and to do the right thing?

could be painted?

 

[The Duff Man]

Either Brady has a god complex or his handlers are morons. They bluffed big at the NFL and lost, now he sits 4. They probably could have got it reduced and even got the language changed that it was solely for obstruction so his legacy is intact.

Now they release the phone news, and even if it goes to court (may not, AP couldnt) then the NFL only has to prove they acted in accordance with the collective agreement.

They dont have to prove he did it.

Dumb play by Brady. He kills his own legacy. Priceless....

 

[matttyl]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but can't you still get texts that someone was sending/received without the actual cell phone?

Without that sending or receiving phone themselves, I think all you can see is that texts were sent and received - but you wouldn't know what that texts said.

 

[pantherclub]

Sho nuff....

Just a few months ago...people were speculating that Goodell would not survive and be fired. People were hollering and demanding to know when the league knew about the videotape. The league claimed they heard there was a tape but didn't see it or have possession of it.

Are you honestly going to sit here and say that you don't think there is any hypocrisy in the league demanding Brady's personal cell phone while not turning over personal cell phones of higher ups in the league?

what in the hell are you talking about?

 

[SIDA!]

It is really funny looking at some of the comments here.

This is as open and shut as it can possibly be.

1. Brady has NO standing in a court. The players agreement essentially signs over all authority to the Commissioner.

2. Brady SHOULD NOT have any standing, bc this report gives any reasonable person the view that he is actively lying and actively obstructing an investigation. No one can defend destroying a cell phone when it has been asked for legitimately, and valid protections are offered for how it will be interrogated.

3. Anyone offering the opinion that "of course Brady should be a.lowed to destroy his phone" needs to come up with a good explanation for why the phones in use immediately before and after the time period in question were still available, ie were NOT destroyed. Brady is clearly lying.

I am surmised they did not increase the suspension actually. This is a s bad as it can possibly be for Brady's case. The coverup is always worse than the crime.

I am not a lawyer. But I am pretty sure that when it comes to court cases...nothing is ever open and shut for the NFL.

I don't need to come up with an explanation for why someone should be allowed to destroy personal property that contains sensitive information and is not legally required to turn it over. Btw, wouldn't it make more sense to destroy the phone right after the incident itself and not months after?

 

[moleculo]

justification for 4 games: that's what they give for PED infractions.

"The four game suspension imposed on Mr. Brady is fully consistent with, if not more lenient than, the discipline ordinarily imposed for the most comparable effort by a player to secure an improper competitive advantage..."

pg 16

 

[sho nuff]

Sho nuff....

Just a few months ago...people were speculating that Goodell would not survive and be fired. People were hollering and demanding to know when the league knew about the videotape. The league claimed they heard there was a tape but didn't see it or have possession of it.

Are you honestly going to sit here and say that you don't think there is any hypocrisy in the league demanding Brady's personal cell phone while not turning over personal cell phones of higher ups in the league?

That speculation was pretty weak too.

I don't think they were asked about their personal cell phones...were they?

Not sure you understand the word hypocrisy very well.

 

[Shutout]

ProFootballTalk ‏@ProFootballTalk 20m20 minutes ago

Habit or not, if Brady destroyed the phone with awareness of the pending request to review its contents, that's a problem.

Can someone find out something about the "habit" bit? Not seeing anything...

if I were a celebrity and had his kind of money, I would absolutely destroy my old phone when I was done with it.

This is a no-brainer. If you have the money he does and the wife he does, believe me...NOBODY is going to get within ten feet of your phone cause you know what kinda stuff is on that thing. TMZ would have ALL kinds of pics by tomorrow.

Think about it, none of us are Tom Brady, probably don't have his wealth or a wife and lifestyle like he does and still, how many of us would want to let a stranger look through our phone all they want?

Elaborate. Are you saying that you know that there is very incriminating evidence (or was) on that phone?

I guess that's what I have an issue with. If there is nothing to hide, why not show that? I don't have anything to hide, I wouldn't have an issue with a professional (not a "stranger") looking through my phone and giving it back to me. They're going to see pictures of my pets and kid, and that I called my wife. Maybe I'm boring....

No, I know nothing that is on his phone but I know that any shred of information belonging to high-profile people that can be manipulated in any way to drum up a news buzz and spun negatively often is. And I know that a high profile person combined with out of context and circumstantial information combined with the NFL that seemingly can't protect an ounce of information that is supposed to be confidential is a bad recipe.

Think about your phone. Maybe some of us are boring and nothing EVER happens. But for many people, there are texts that you'd prefer others not know about. There might be pics. There may be unsolicited information (but you still got it). I'm not saying he cheats on his wife. I'm not saying he did or didn't do the deflate. But I CAN have an open enough mind to understand that in a person's phone, aside from many private items (financial, photographic, messages), there might be something as simple as a few conversations he had with other players about his real thoughts on Aaron Hernandez and what he knew...or a game plan..or a business venture...or any of a number of things that might make a man say "I can't let the entire world see this". It doesn't have to be something sinister..It could be anything. Maybe his wife cheated on HIM and they are reconciling and want to keep it on the down low and he doesn't want info with his marriage counselor out there.

You just never know but I find it completely reasonable that the vast majority of people in life that don't have a fraction of Tom Brady's lifestyle, might be reluctant to turn over their private information, on the principle of privacy and on the principle of not trusting it won't get leaked.

 

[Bossman]

Yes, Brady moved all of his personal photos from his phone to his cloud ... where it is much safer.

Then melt the phone to a liquid and drink it ... every 4 months.

 

[Ojaays]

The NFL is not messing around. They've already preempted Brady and the NfLPA by filing a pleading with the federal court to confirm the NFL's decision.

Yup, pretty telling.

Rog is taking this one to the mat.

I'm making my call now, this never goes to court.

If it does, the NFL subpoena's all the cell phone records and then who knows what shows up on those, calls, texts with Hoodie?...

At the end of the day, Brady will take his smacks and say thank you may I have another, because right now, Brady can't look any worse, unless the phone records are revealed.

 

[moleculo]

I am not going to sit here and make an argument that deciding not to let the NFL view your phone after you already did previously doesn't look bad. Sure, it could be painted that he was hiding something. Point given.

But voluntarily doing something doesn't preclude you from revoking permission at a later date.

After the NFL has basically handled numerous high profile issues in the past...I would not feel confident or comfortable giving stuff voluntarily out to an organization that is looking to screw me over. Or are we under the pretense that Goodell was only motivated to find the truth and to do the right thing?

huh?

What part of giving or allowing something voluntarily and then revoking that is hard to understand.

I might give access to my property to someone and then revoke that access (assuming there isn't a permanent easement). I might allow someone to borrow my car and then tell them they can no longer borrow my car, etc.

If I do X today...I am not required to do X in the future or forever.

the part where Brady allowed something voluntarily and then revoked that. I don't know what you are talking about.

 

[SIDA!]

Sho nuff....

Just a few months ago...people were speculating that Goodell would not survive and be fired. People were hollering and demanding to know when the league knew about the videotape. The league claimed they heard there was a tape but didn't see it or have possession of it.

Are you honestly going to sit here and say that you don't think there is any hypocrisy in the league demanding Brady's personal cell phone while not turning over personal cell phones of higher ups in the league?

what in the hell are you talking about?

I am not sure what part you are having trouble understanding.

I was discussing earlier that I would never turn over my personal cell phone to others, especially if I had the socio/economic status of a guy like Brady. I then drew comparison to the people who were asking for Goodell to turn over his cell phone during the Ray Rice scandal because there was speculation that the NFL and Goodell had possession of the tape and saw it before they handed out the original punishment.

Did Goodell turn over his phone, no? Brady was not required to turn over his phone. This was the comparison I was making.

 

[GoBirds]

• November 6, 2014: Brady got a new phone.
• mid Febuary - the Wells team requested electronic information from Brady.
• Feb 28: request was renewed.
• March 3: Brady interview date confirmed.
• March 6th (or 5th): phone destroyed, Brady gets new phone.
• March 6: Brady inverviewed by Wells.

During interview, Brady testified that he was personally aware of the request for info from his phone. Brady did not mention during the interview that his phone was (or will be) destroyed.

pg 12, 13

HOLY ####BALLS!

Cheaters

 

[SIDA!]

Sho nuff....

Just a few months ago...people were speculating that Goodell would not survive and be fired. People were hollering and demanding to know when the league knew about the videotape. The league claimed they heard there was a tape but didn't see it or have possession of it.

Are you honestly going to sit here and say that you don't think there is any hypocrisy in the league demanding Brady's personal cell phone while not turning over personal cell phones of higher ups in the league?

That speculation was pretty weak too.

I don't think they were asked about their personal cell phones...were they?

Not sure you understand the word hypocrisy very well.

Were you even paying attention to the Ray Rice scandal? It wasn't weak speculation. Many people thought Goodell wasn't long for the job.

 

[moleculo]

ProFootballTalk ‏@ProFootballTalk 20m20 minutes ago

Habit or not, if Brady destroyed the phone with awareness of the pending request to review its contents, that's a problem.

Can someone find out something about the "habit" bit? Not seeing anything...

if I were a celebrity and had his kind of money, I would absolutely destroy my old phone when I was done with it.

This is a no-brainer. If you have the money he does and the wife he does, believe me...NOBODY is going to get within ten feet of your phone cause you know what kinda stuff is on that thing. TMZ would have ALL kinds of pics by tomorrow.

Think about it, none of us are Tom Brady, probably don't have his wealth or a wife and lifestyle like he does and still, how many of us would want to let a stranger look through our phone all they want?

Elaborate. Are you saying that you know that there is very incriminating evidence (or was) on that phone?

I guess that's what I have an issue with. If there is nothing to hide, why not show that? I don't have anything to hide, I wouldn't have an issue with a professional (not a "stranger") looking through my phone and giving it back to me. They're going to see pictures of my pets and kid, and that I called my wife. Maybe I'm boring....

No, I know nothing that is on his phone but I know that any shred of information belonging to high-profile people that can be manipulated in any way to drum up a news buzz and spun negatively often is. And I know that a high profile person combined with out of context and circumstantial information combined with the NFL that seemingly can't protect an ounce of information that is supposed to be confidential is a bad recipe.

Think about your phone. Maybe some of us are boring and nothing EVER happens. But for many people, there are texts that you'd prefer others not know about. There might be pics. There may be unsolicited information (but you still got it). I'm not saying he cheats on his wife. I'm not saying he did or didn't do the deflate. But I CAN have an open enough mind to understand that in a person's phone, aside from many private items (financial, photographic, messages), there might be something as simple as a few conversations he had with other players about his real thoughts on Aaron Hernandez and what he knew...or a game plan..or a business venture...or any of a number of things that might make a man say "I can't let the entire world see this". It doesn't have to be something sinister..It could be anything. Maybe his wife cheated on HIM and they are reconciling and want to keep it on the down low and he doesn't want info with his marriage counselor out there.

You just never know but I find it completely reasonable that the vast majority of people in life that don't have a fraction of Tom Brady's lifestyle, might be reluctant to turn over their private information, on the principle of privacy and on the principle of not trusting it won't get leaked.

would you be ok with giving it to your lawyer and letting him peruse it? Brady wasn't.

What about the phone you used last year, or maybe your brand new one (to replace the one you just destroyed)...because both of those were examined.

The only phone not examined was the one in use prior to, and just after, the AFCCG. That phone was destroyed the day Brady met with the Wells staff. I'm not asking you to extrapolate too much to consider that maybe, just maybe, that phone had something on it that Brady didn't want his lawyer to give to Wells.

 

[Shutout]

The NFL is not messing around. They've already preempted Brady and the NfLPA by filing a pleading with the federal court to confirm the NFL's decision.

They are afraid of Doty's track record with them.

 

[Ojaays]

Against all odds, or maybe even impossibly, this story just keeps getting better.

The destroyed cell phone is just the kind of unexpected plot twist that this story needed.

All we need now is 12punch and runitup's spin on this....

When are they back from vaca?

 

[SIDA!]

ProFootballTalk ‏@ProFootballTalk 20m20 minutes ago

Habit or not, if Brady destroyed the phone with awareness of the pending request to review its contents, that's a problem.

Can someone find out something about the "habit" bit? Not seeing anything...

if I were a celebrity and had his kind of money, I would absolutely destroy my old phone when I was done with it.

This is a no-brainer. If you have the money he does and the wife he does, believe me...NOBODY is going to get within ten feet of your phone cause you know what kinda stuff is on that thing. TMZ would have ALL kinds of pics by tomorrow.

Think about it, none of us are Tom Brady, probably don't have his wealth or a wife and lifestyle like he does and still, how many of us would want to let a stranger look through our phone all they want?

Elaborate. Are you saying that you know that there is very incriminating evidence (or was) on that phone?

I guess that's what I have an issue with. If there is nothing to hide, why not show that? I don't have anything to hide, I wouldn't have an issue with a professional (not a "stranger") looking through my phone and giving it back to me. They're going to see pictures of my pets and kid, and that I called my wife. Maybe I'm boring....

No, I know nothing that is on his phone but I know that any shred of information belonging to high-profile people that can be manipulated in any way to drum up a news buzz and spun negatively often is. And I know that a high profile person combined with out of context and circumstantial information combined with the NFL that seemingly can't protect an ounce of information that is supposed to be confidential is a bad recipe.

Think about your phone. Maybe some of us are boring and nothing EVER happens. But for many people, there are texts that you'd prefer others not know about. There might be pics. There may be unsolicited information (but you still got it). I'm not saying he cheats on his wife. I'm not saying he did or didn't do the deflate. But I CAN have an open enough mind to understand that in a person's phone, aside from many private items (financial, photographic, messages), there might be something as simple as a few conversations he had with other players about his real thoughts on Aaron Hernandez and what he knew...or a game plan..or a business venture...or any of a number of things that might make a man say "I can't let the entire world see this". It doesn't have to be something sinister..It could be anything. Maybe his wife cheated on HIM and they are reconciling and want to keep it on the down low and he doesn't want info with his marriage counselor out there.

You just never know but I find it completely reasonable that the vast majority of people in life that don't have a fraction of Tom Brady's lifestyle, might be reluctant to turn over their private information, on the principle of privacy and on the principle of not trusting it won't get leaked.

Amen.

####. We have people's work email (e.g. Sony Pictures) getting released to the public that causes careers to end and relationships to be ruined. Emails that had some expectation of privacy and were sent in a "more open" format than a personal cell phone.

 

[GroveDiesel]

The NFL is not messing around. They've already preempted Brady and the NfLPA by filing a pleading with the federal court to confirm the NFL's decision.

Yup, pretty telling.

Rog is taking this one to the mat.

I'm making my call now, this never goes to court.

If it does, the NFL subpoena's all the cell phone records and then who knows what shows up on those, calls, texts with Hoodie?...

At the end of the day, Brady will take his smacks and say thank you may I have another, because right now, Brady can't look any worse, unless the phone records are revealed.

Pretty clear that the NFL is pissed now. They're going nuclear on Brady. I bet he suddenly doesn't get so many calls his way on the field now either.

Kraft was smart. Goodell probably shared the cellphone tidbit with him earlier and Kraft realized just how guilty Brady really is and that he has to think about the Patriots post-Brady as well. If the Patriots had fought this thing and all this stuff came out, suddenly they take a huge hit in general. The Pats have received pretty warm treatment by the NFL for a while now; my guess is that Kraft decide it wasn't worth chancing being on the other side of that when they no longer have Brady.

 

[sho nuff]

Sho nuff....

Just a few months ago...people were speculating that Goodell would not survive and be fired. People were hollering and demanding to know when the league knew about the videotape. The league claimed they heard there was a tape but didn't see it or have possession of it.

Are you honestly going to sit here and say that you don't think there is any hypocrisy in the league demanding Brady's personal cell phone while not turning over personal cell phones of higher ups in the league?

That speculation was pretty weak too.I don't think they were asked about their personal cell phones...were they?

Not sure you understand the word hypocrisy very well.

Were you even paying attention to the Ray Rice scandal? It wasn't weak speculation. Many people thought Goodell wasn't long for the job.

And most thought he would be fine.

The cries of message bored pwole isn't exactly how the NFL handles business.

He was never being investigated or asked to turn over cell records.

 

[SIDA!]

I am not going to sit here and make an argument that deciding not to let the NFL view your phone after you already did previously doesn't look bad. Sure, it could be painted that he was hiding something. Point given.

But voluntarily doing something doesn't preclude you from revoking permission at a later date.

After the NFL has basically handled numerous high profile issues in the past...I would not feel confident or comfortable giving stuff voluntarily out to an organization that is looking to screw me over. Or are we under the pretense that Goodell was only motivated to find the truth and to do the right thing?

huh?

What part of giving or allowing something voluntarily and then revoking that is hard to understand.

I might give access to my property to someone and then revoke that access (assuming there isn't a permanent easement). I might allow someone to borrow my car and then tell them they can no longer borrow my car, etc.

If I do X today...I am not required to do X in the future or forever.

the part where Brady allowed something voluntarily and then revoked that. I don't know what you are talking about.

If you give me permission to look at your phone today, that doesn't mean I automatically have permission to look at your phone tomorrow or a year from now. That doesn't mean that you are hiding anything tomorrow or next year.

Not sure why this is a difficult concept to understand. Regardless, I am done discussing this aspect of the issue. My phone is my phone. Unless a court of law demands it...I say #### off.

 

[Franknbeans]

Just a few months ago...people were speculating that Goodell would not survive and be fired. People were hollering and demanding to know when the league knew about the videotape. The league claimed they heard there was a tape but didn't see it or have possession of it.

those people were wrong and likely, Pats fans

 

[moleculo]

I am not going to sit here and make an argument that deciding not to let the NFL view your phone after you already did previously doesn't look bad. Sure, it could be painted that he was hiding something. Point given.

But voluntarily doing something doesn't preclude you from revoking permission at a later date.

After the NFL has basically handled numerous high profile issues in the past...I would not feel confident or comfortable giving stuff voluntarily out to an organization that is looking to screw me over. Or are we under the pretense that Goodell was only motivated to find the truth and to do the right thing?

huh?

What part of giving or allowing something voluntarily and then revoking that is hard to understand.

I might give access to my property to someone and then revoke that access (assuming there isn't a permanent easement). I might allow someone to borrow my car and then tell them they can no longer borrow my car, etc.

If I do X today...I am not required to do X in the future or forever.

the part where Brady allowed something voluntarily and then revoked that. I don't know what you are talking about.

If you give me permission to look at your phone today, that doesn't mean I automatically have permission to look at your phone tomorrow or a year from now. That doesn't mean that you are hiding anything tomorrow or next year.

Not sure why this is a difficult concept to understand. Regardless, I am done discussing this aspect of the issue. My phone is my phone. Unless a court of law demands it...I say #### off.

Brady never gave anyone permission to look at his phone until he was in the appeals phase. By then, the critical phone had been destroyed. This isn't that hard.

 

[SIDA!]

Sho nuff....

Just a few months ago...people were speculating that Goodell would not survive and be fired. People were hollering and demanding to know when the league knew about the videotape. The league claimed they heard there was a tape but didn't see it or have possession of it.

Are you honestly going to sit here and say that you don't think there is any hypocrisy in the league demanding Brady's personal cell phone while not turning over personal cell phones of higher ups in the league?

That speculation was pretty weak too.I don't think they were asked about their personal cell phones...were they?

Not sure you understand the word hypocrisy very well.

Were you even paying attention to the Ray Rice scandal? It wasn't weak speculation. Many people thought Goodell wasn't long for the job.

And most thought he would be fine.

The cries of message bored pwole isn't exactly how the NFL handles business.

He was never being investigated or asked to turn over cell records.

Most thinking Roger Goodell would survive a scandal is not the same as suggesting that there wasn't calls for his resignation or investigation into the scandal.

One of the dominant themes of this story immediately after TMZ released the tape was whether or not the league knew about it and when they knew about it. There were reports that the league was contacted about the tape, etc. And then discussions about cover ups being worse than crimes...etc.

There were elected officials, media folks and activists calling for Goodell's head.

I am not interested in helping you re-write history. If you remember things differently...then that is fine.

 

[Shutout]

ProFootballTalk ‏@ProFootballTalk 20m20 minutes ago

Habit or not, if Brady destroyed the phone with awareness of the pending request to review its contents, that's a problem.

Can someone find out something about the "habit" bit? Not seeing anything...

if I were a celebrity and had his kind of money, I would absolutely destroy my old phone when I was done with it.

This is a no-brainer. If you have the money he does and the wife he does, believe me...NOBODY is going to get within ten feet of your phone cause you know what kinda stuff is on that thing. TMZ would have ALL kinds of pics by tomorrow.

Think about it, none of us are Tom Brady, probably don't have his wealth or a wife and lifestyle like he does and still, how many of us would want to let a stranger look through our phone all they want?

Elaborate. Are you saying that you know that there is very incriminating evidence (or was) on that phone?

I guess that's what I have an issue with. If there is nothing to hide, why not show that? I don't have anything to hide, I wouldn't have an issue with a professional (not a "stranger") looking through my phone and giving it back to me. They're going to see pictures of my pets and kid, and that I called my wife. Maybe I'm boring....

No, I know nothing that is on his phone but I know that any shred of information belonging to high-profile people that can be manipulated in any way to drum up a news buzz and spun negatively often is. And I know that a high profile person combined with out of context and circumstantial information combined with the NFL that seemingly can't protect an ounce of information that is supposed to be confidential is a bad recipe.

Think about your phone. Maybe some of us are boring and nothing EVER happens. But for many people, there are texts that you'd prefer others not know about. There might be pics. There may be unsolicited information (but you still got it). I'm not saying he cheats on his wife. I'm not saying he did or didn't do the deflate. But I CAN have an open enough mind to understand that in a person's phone, aside from many private items (financial, photographic, messages), there might be something as simple as a few conversations he had with other players about his real thoughts on Aaron Hernandez and what he knew...or a game plan..or a business venture...or any of a number of things that might make a man say "I can't let the entire world see this". It doesn't have to be something sinister..It could be anything. Maybe his wife cheated on HIM and they are reconciling and want to keep it on the down low and he doesn't want info with his marriage counselor out there.

You just never know but I find it completely reasonable that the vast majority of people in life that don't have a fraction of Tom Brady's lifestyle, might be reluctant to turn over their private information, on the principle of privacy and on the principle of not trusting it won't get leaked.

would you be ok with giving it to your lawyer and letting him peruse it? Brady wasn't.

What about the phone you used last year, or maybe your brand new one (to replace the one you just destroyed)...because both of those were examined.

The only phone not examined was the one in use prior to, and just after, the AFCCG. That phone was destroyed the day Brady met with the Wells staff. I'm not asking you to extrapolate too much to consider that maybe, just maybe, that phone had something on it that Brady didn't want his lawyer to give to Wells.

My lawyer or somebody else's. It doesn't matter much. There is just something naturally unnerving to many people (especially people with particular controlling personalities) that just simply are adverse to turning over control/info/power to others. On some level, no matter whether it is something directly related to this or something totally unrelated (but just something you don't want out there to possibly be seen), there is just that knowledge that the second it is out of your sight and in somebody else's hands, you no longer have control and there is a CHANCE that it can get out.

People are complex and people make various decisions in their processes. unless it is just on the principle of privacy or the offhand chance that Brady was denying access because, hey, he's a guy that hate the hypocrisy of having to turn over his phone when the league officials didn't have to when they were asked in the Ray Rice issue, then, yeah, there was something he didn't want to give away. But perhaps you can maybe, just maybe consider that "that" something wasn't what a lot of people want to assume it was.

 

[Alkahsu]

I am not going to sit here and make an argument that deciding not to let the NFL view your phone after you already did previously doesn't look bad. Sure, it could be painted that he was hiding something. Point given.

But voluntarily doing something doesn't preclude you from revoking permission at a later date.

After the NFL has basically handled numerous high profile issues in the past...I would not feel confident or comfortable giving stuff voluntarily out to an organization that is looking to screw me over. Or are we under the pretense that Goodell was only motivated to find the truth and to do the right thing?

huh?

What part of giving or allowing something voluntarily and then revoking that is hard to understand.

I might give access to my property to someone and then revoke that access (assuming there isn't a permanent easement). I might allow someone to borrow my car and then tell them they can no longer borrow my car, etc.

If I do X today...I am not required to do X in the future or forever.

the part where Brady allowed something voluntarily and then revoked that. I don't know what you are talking about.

If you give me permission to look at your phone today, that doesn't mean I automatically have permission to look at your phone tomorrow or a year from now. That doesn't mean that you are hiding anything tomorrow or next year.

Not sure why this is a difficult concept to understand. Regardless, I am done discussing this aspect of the issue. My phone is my phone. Unless a court of law demands it...I say #### off.

I don't think anyone is arguing that Brady has the right to say no until he's legally obliged to hand over the phone. The fact is he had no problem letting them look at his phones that they weren't particularly interested in and when they ask for one that would be of interest he says no and destroys it. Super sketchy.

 

[The General]

HOW DOES THIS KEEP GETTING BETTER?

Amazing.

 

[Evilgrin 72]

(Morgan Freeman narrates)

The suspension....was upheld.

Brady stood valiant and said he'd have his day in court, but we all knew. When Goodell mentioned the destroyed phone.....it was over.

And so it was that on the 28th of July, year of our Lord two thousand and fifteen.....the salty haters won.

 

[The General]

Love that they reduced Bell's at the same time.

 

[RUSF18]

This is really simple...

Phone from spring 14 to November 14: Handed over to NFLPA forensic expert for analysis and submission to NFL

Phone from March 6 to April 8: Handed over to NFLPA forensic expert for analysis and submission to NFL

Phone in between, containing potential information of the incident in question: Brady not willing to give to his own lawyer for him to submit data to NFL, citing privacy issues.

 

[David Dodds]

Brady never had to give up his phone. His lawyer was suppose to hand over the relevant texts. Instead he destroyed the phone.

I give the chance that Brady gets an injunction at less than 10%. He is sitting out 4 games. And this never gets to court after that.

Brady lied and obstructed multiple times in this. He is sitting out the 4 games. And then what would court satisfy at that point? To win over public opinion? That is a lost cause.

 

[Bayhawks]

ProFootballTalk ‏@ProFootballTalk 20m20 minutes ago

Habit or not, if Brady destroyed the phone with awareness of the pending request to review its contents, that's a problem.

Can someone find out something about the "habit" bit? Not seeing anything...

if I were a celebrity and had his kind of money, I would absolutely destroy my old phone when I was done with it.

This is a no-brainer. If you have the money he does and the wife he does, believe me...NOBODY is going to get within ten feet of your phone cause you know what kinda stuff is on that thing. TMZ would have ALL kinds of pics by tomorrow.Think about it, none of us are Tom Brady, probably don't have his wealth or a wife and lifestyle like he does and still, how many of us would want to let a stranger look through our phone all they want?

Elaborate. Are you saying that you know that there is very incriminating evidence (or was) on that phone? I guess that's what I have an issue with. If there is nothing to hide, why not show that? I don't have anything to hide, I wouldn't have an issue with a professional (not a "stranger") looking through my phone and giving it back to me. They're going to see pictures of my pets and kid, and that I called my wife. Maybe I'm boring....

No, I know nothing that is on his phone but I know that any shred of information belonging to high-profile people that can be manipulated in any way to drum up a news buzz and spun negatively often is. And I know that a high profile person combined with out of context and circumstantial information combined with the NFL that seemingly can't protect an ounce of information that is supposed to be confidential is a bad recipe. Think about your phone. Maybe some of us are boring and nothing EVER happens. But for many people, there are texts that you'd prefer others not know about. There might be pics. There may be unsolicited information (but you still got it). I'm not saying he cheats on his wife. I'm not saying he did or didn't do the deflate. But I CAN have an open enough mind to understand that in a person's phone, aside from many private items (financial, photographic, messages), there might be something as simple as a few conversations he had with other players about his real thoughts on Aaron Hernandez and what he knew...or a game plan..or a business venture...or any of a number of things that might make a man say "I can't let the entire world see this". It doesn't have to be something sinister..It could be anything. Maybe his wife cheated on HIM and they are reconciling and want to keep it on the down low and he doesn't want info with his marriage counselor out there.

You just never know but I find it completely reasonable that the vast majority of people in life that don't have a fraction of Tom Brady's lifestyle, might be reluctant to turn over their private information, on the principle of privacy and on the principle of not trusting it won't get leaked.

I'm being serious: dobyou not understand that Wells did nor ask for physical possession of the phone? He asked for copies of relevant texts. So any pics, game plans discussion about Hernandez, info about his wife's cheating, etc wouldn't have gone public unless he decided to put it our there.

 

[SIDA!]

I am not going to sit here and make an argument that deciding not to let the NFL view your phone after you already did previously doesn't look bad. Sure, it could be painted that he was hiding something. Point given.

But voluntarily doing something doesn't preclude you from revoking permission at a later date.

After the NFL has basically handled numerous high profile issues in the past...I would not feel confident or comfortable giving stuff voluntarily out to an organization that is looking to screw me over. Or are we under the pretense that Goodell was only motivated to find the truth and to do the right thing?

huh?

What part of giving or allowing something voluntarily and then revoking that is hard to understand.

I might give access to my property to someone and then revoke that access (assuming there isn't a permanent easement). I might allow someone to borrow my car and then tell them they can no longer borrow my car, etc.

If I do X today...I am not required to do X in the future or forever.

the part where Brady allowed something voluntarily and then revoked that. I don't know what you are talking about.

If you give me permission to look at your phone today, that doesn't mean I automatically have permission to look at your phone tomorrow or a year from now. That doesn't mean that you are hiding anything tomorrow or next year.

Not sure why this is a difficult concept to understand. Regardless, I am done discussing this aspect of the issue. My phone is my phone. Unless a court of law demands it...I say #### off.

Brady never gave anyone permission to look at his phone until he was in the appeals phase. By then, the critical phone had been destroyed. This isn't that hard.

For the last time. My phone is my property.

I can let Person A or Organization B look at it. My allowing A or B to look at it doesn't mean that I am obligated to let Person X or Organization Z to look at it. It also doesn't mean that Person A or Organization B can look at my phone at any point in the future.

My phone is my phone. My not letting somebody else look at it might be painted as hiding something depending on the context, but not necessarily.

Brady could have hundreds of damaging things on this phone that could cost him immeasurably in some way (personally, financially, reputation, etc.)

It is perfectly fair for people to say that him breaking his phone leads them to think he is guilty. Many people think that if someone takes the 5th and doesn't go on the stand that they are guilty, too. Doesn't mean their right...but they have their right to their opinion.

 

[sho nuff]

Sho nuff....

Just a few months ago...people were speculating that Goodell would not survive and be fired. People were hollering and demanding to know when the league knew about the videotape. The league claimed they heard there was a tape but didn't see it or have possession of it.

Are you honestly going to sit here and say that you don't think there is any hypocrisy in the league demanding Brady's personal cell phone while not turning over personal cell phones of higher ups in the league?

That speculation was pretty weak too.I don't think they were asked about their personal cell phones...were they?

Not sure you understand the word hypocrisy very well.

Were you even paying attention to the Ray Rice scandal? It wasn't weak speculation. Many people thought Goodell wasn't long for the job.

And most thought he would be fine.The cries of message bored pwole isn't exactly how the NFL handles business.

He was never being investigated or asked to turn over cell records.

Most thinking Roger Goodell would survive a scandal is not the same as suggesting that there wasn't calls for his resignation or investigation into the scandal.One of the dominant themes of this story immediately after TMZ released the tape was whether or not the league knew about it and when they knew about it. There were reports that the league was contacted about the tape, etc. And then discussions about cover ups being worse than crimes...etc.

There were elected officials, media folks and activists calling for Goodell's head.

I am not interested in helping you re-write history. If you remember things differently...then that is fine.

Investigation of what...if they had the tape? Other than PR...so what if they did.

They were not legally inclined to even comment on it.

You are reaching.

 

[jonessed]

They should fight it. The more eyes on this the better. It wasn't long ago that Kraft was demanding an apology. Keep digging!

 

[The General]

You see, Roger, I guess I would turn over my phone...but, well funny thing I just destroyed it. Isn't that funny!

 

[HellToupee]

The phone is a red herring

 

[[icon]]

Sup fantasy dorks! How's that lather you're all worked into?



NFLPA now going to bat for Brady in Federal Court.... lawyer up, yo!

 

[BigSteelThrill]

HOW DOES THIS KEEP GETTING BETTER?

Amazing.

It does indeed!

Could always enjoy a couple threads over at a patriots forum...

http://www.patsfans.com/new-england-patriots/messageboard/threads/stephen-a-smith-bradys-suspension-to-be-upheld-brady-destroyed-cell-phone.1121612/

http://www.patsfans.com/new-england-patriots/messageboard/threads/i-hate-the-national-football-league.1121620/

http://www.patsfans.com/new-england-patriots/messageboard/threads/how-i-feel-merged-by-accident-ian-brady-suspension-upheld.1121500/

When news of the destroyed cell phone first leaks, they find it to be game-over.

 

[Stealthycat]

Bill Clinton lied under oath.

Hillary Clinton destroyed millions of emails and their servers

remember come election time the kind of demands you're placing on people I guess

BTW QB Luck was just as guilty as Brady, they just for some reason never looked at Luck

 

[Shutout]

This is really simple...

Phone from spring 14 to November 14: Handed over to NFLPA forensic expert for analysis and submission to NFL

Phone from March 6 to April 8: Handed over to NFLPA forensic expert for analysis and submission to NFL

Phone in between, containing potential information of the incident in question: Brady not willing to give to his own lawyer for him to submit data to NFL, citing privacy issues.

It is not that simple at all.

Let's say, just to make an extreme example in an extreme case as this is turning out to be, that on November 25th, there is info on his phone that confirms his wife is divorcing him and suing him and cheated on him, etc. Or let's say that on January 17th, he found out he has lung cancer.

There are many things that could happen that makes a particular time line of info something he very much would not want to risk one iota of coming out. So, yeah, look at my info. But don't look at this particular date because something very private went down there (not deflate gate).

If nothing else, does it seem likely that this entire scandal only came to be, from the first mention of it ever, to fruition, after November 14th? Never thought of or mentioned ever before? Again, I'm not saying he isn't guilty. I don't know. I don't know him. I'm just saying there ARE reasons why any person might want to protect a specific section of information from others and be willing to release others and it does not have to automatically mean that it is because of a story people want to think is the reason.

My boss once missed work for a week and didn't tell anyone. Secretary got a call from a doctor's office and the rumor mill spread and everyone thought he was terminally ill. Came out two years later and said he got snipped that day and took a few days off to recover and just didn't want people to know. Thought it was embarrassing (besides the fact it was none of our business). People have personal, private reasons for things.

 

[Anarchy99]

Brady never had to give up his phone. His lawyer was suppose to hand over the relevant texts. Instead he destroyed the phone.

I give the chance that Brady gets an injunction at less than 10%. He is sitting out 4 games. And this never gets to court after that.

Brady lied and obstructed multiple times in this. He is sitting out the 4 games. And then what would court satisfy at that point? To win over public opinion? That is a lost cause.

Not sure I agree with this. Brady's argument was that the investigation and process was flawed, that Goodell was not impartial, that the league broke labor laws, and the penalty was not consistent with prior provident. None of that changes cell phone or no cell phone.

The league came out with the destroyed cell phone information to gain traction in the court of public opinion. I don't think that will play a big roll in receiving or not receiving an injunction.

 

[Old Smiley]

ProFootballTalk ‏@ProFootballTalk 11m11 minutes ago

NFL goes forum shopping with pre-emptive Brady lawsuit http://wp.me/p14QSB-9Oq3

Still, there’s something that feels a bit unseemly about the NFL’s effort, creating a clear sense of coordination between Goodell the supposedly independent arbitrator and Goodell the chief executive at 345 Park Avenue. The ruling, which is required to be made “as soon as practicable” by Goodell the arbitrator undoubtedly was delayed long enough for Goodell the executive to ensure that his lawyers would be able to file immediately a lawsuit calling “shotgun” on the resolution of the legal rights.

Your league in action. Enjoy.

(But, jesus Tom. Why? Why destroy the phone?)

 

[[icon]]

I'm being serious: dobyou not understand that Wells did nor ask for physical possession of the phone? He asked for copies of relevant texts. So any pics, game plans discussion about Hernandez, info about his wife's cheating, etc wouldn't have gone public unless he decided to put it our there.

at having faith in the NFL to be airtight with information like that.

What day of the month does your boy scout troop meet up, little jimmy?

 

[BigSteelThrill]

(But, jesus Tom. Why? Why destroy the phone?)

Everyone knows why.

 

[Shutout]

ProFootballTalk ‏@ProFootballTalk 20m20 minutes ago

Habit or not, if Brady destroyed the phone with awareness of the pending request to review its contents, that's a problem.

Can someone find out something about the "habit" bit? Not seeing anything...

if I were a celebrity and had his kind of money, I would absolutely destroy my old phone when I was done with it.

This is a no-brainer. If you have the money he does and the wife he does, believe me...NOBODY is going to get within ten feet of your phone cause you know what kinda stuff is on that thing. TMZ would have ALL kinds of pics by tomorrow.Think about it, none of us are Tom Brady, probably don't have his wealth or a wife and lifestyle like he does and still, how many of us would want to let a stranger look through our phone all they want?

Elaborate. Are you saying that you know that there is very incriminating evidence (or was) on that phone? I guess that's what I have an issue with. If there is nothing to hide, why not show that? I don't have anything to hide, I wouldn't have an issue with a professional (not a "stranger") looking through my phone and giving it back to me. They're going to see pictures of my pets and kid, and that I called my wife. Maybe I'm boring....

No, I know nothing that is on his phone but I know that any shred of information belonging to high-profile people that can be manipulated in any way to drum up a news buzz and spun negatively often is. And I know that a high profile person combined with out of context and circumstantial information combined with the NFL that seemingly can't protect an ounce of information that is supposed to be confidential is a bad recipe. Think about your phone. Maybe some of us are boring and nothing EVER happens. But for many people, there are texts that you'd prefer others not know about. There might be pics. There may be unsolicited information (but you still got it). I'm not saying he cheats on his wife. I'm not saying he did or didn't do the deflate. But I CAN have an open enough mind to understand that in a person's phone, aside from many private items (financial, photographic, messages), there might be something as simple as a few conversations he had with other players about his real thoughts on Aaron Hernandez and what he knew...or a game plan..or a business venture...or any of a number of things that might make a man say "I can't let the entire world see this". It doesn't have to be something sinister..It could be anything. Maybe his wife cheated on HIM and they are reconciling and want to keep it on the down low and he doesn't want info with his marriage counselor out there.

You just never know but I find it completely reasonable that the vast majority of people in life that don't have a fraction of Tom Brady's lifestyle, might be reluctant to turn over their private information, on the principle of privacy and on the principle of not trusting it won't get leaked.

I'm being serious: dobyou not understand that Wells did nor ask for physical possession of the phone? He asked for copies of relevant texts. So any pics, game plans discussion about Hernandez, info about his wife's cheating, etc wouldn't have gone public unless he decided to put it our there.

Understood completely. I'm asking you to understand that people have trust issues and the NFL has a record of letting things get out. Bad things. Drug test things. Things that are not supposed to get out.. But the fact is they do and once they are, you can't take them back. And we don't know the nature of the Gooodell office/Tom Brady relationship. Brady might jus tbe a buyer of conspiracy theory enough to think "I'll give this to them and they won't find crap. But then next week, somehow, lo and behold, all those pics of Gisele on the beach or all those texts of me ragging on Peyton will surface on TMZ...mysteriously."

This is about trust and its obvious the NFL deserves little in how they have handled and reacted to sensitive information.

 

[SIDA!]

Shutout - Thank you for being far more articulate than I have been in this thread. Good stuff.

 

[moleculo]

Brady never had to give up his phone. His lawyer was suppose to hand over the relevant texts. Instead he destroyed the phone.

I give the chance that Brady gets an injunction at less than 10%. He is sitting out 4 games. And this never gets to court after that.

Brady lied and obstructed multiple times in this. He is sitting out the 4 games. And then what would court satisfy at that point? To win over public opinion? That is a lost cause.

Not sure I agree with this. Brady's argument was that the investigation and process was flawed, that Goodell was not impartial, that the league broke labor laws, and the penalty was not consistent with prior provident. None of that changes cell phone or no cell phone.

The league came out with the destroyed cell phone information to gain traction in the court of public opinion. I don't think that will play a big roll in receiving or not receiving an injunction.

brady fought everything. He even had the AEI economist (that wrote the paper that got everyone all spun up about) in to testify. It wasn't just process that was reviewed.

 

[Shutout]

I'm being serious: dobyou not understand that Wells did nor ask for physical possession of the phone? He asked for copies of relevant texts. So any pics, game plans discussion about Hernandez, info about his wife's cheating, etc wouldn't have gone public unless he decided to put it our there.

at having faith in the NFL to be airtight with information like that.

What day of the month does your boy scout troop meet up, little jimmy?

That's a lot of it in a nutshell. It's not trust on this one thing. It's trust on EVERYTHING. Think of how much info is in your phone and how damaging that is to let it all out.