Patriots being investigated after Colts game (4 Viewers)

[SIDA!]

Got to hop for the day, but I will sum up the brilliance of those who hate Brady and the Pats.

Haters: Why did Brady destroy his phone?

Logical Thinkers: It was his phone and his right to protect his privacy.

Haters: Nobody was asking for his phone. He just had to turn over texts/documents related to the incident. Why are you not understanding this?

Logical Thinkers: If he didn't need to turn over his phone, why does it matter that he destroyed it?

Haters: Because...him destroying it is a sign that he is guilty.

Logical Thinkers:

 

[moleculo]

Got to hop for the day, but I will sum up the brilliance of those who hate Brady and the Pats.

Haters: Why did Brady destroy his phone?

Logical Thinkers: It was his phone and his right to protect his privacy.

Haters: Nobody was asking for his phone. He just had to turn over texts/documents related to the incident. Why are you not understanding this?

Logical Thinkers: If he didn't need to turn over his phone, why does it matter that he destroyed it?

Haters: Because...him destroying it is a sign that he is guilty.

Logical Thinkers:

Don't be dense. Destroying the phone also destroys the electronic records Wells requested Yee review and produce.

 

[sho nuff]

Got to hop for the day, but I will sum up the brilliance of those who hate Brady and the Pats.

Haters: Why did Brady destroy his phone?

Logical Thinkers: It was his phone and his right to protect his privacy.

Haters: Nobody was asking for his phone. He just had to turn over texts/documents related to the incident. Why are you not understanding this?

Logical Thinkers: If he didn't need to turn over his phone, why does it matter that he destroyed it?

Haters: Because...him destroying it is a sign that he is guilty.

Logical Thinkers:

If by logical, you mean people excusing what reasonable people see as the action of a guilty man.

Also, nothing logical in labeling the amount of people disagreeing with you as haters.

 

[moleculo]

Got to hop for the day, but I will sum up the brilliance of those who hate Brady and the Pats.

Haters: Why did Brady destroy his phone?

Logical Thinkers: It was his phone and his right to protect his privacy.

Haters: Nobody was asking for his phone. He just had to turn over texts/documents related to the incident. Why are you not understanding this?

Logical Thinkers: If he didn't need to turn over his phone, why does it matter that he destroyed it?

Haters: Because...him destroying it is a sign that he is guilty.

Logical Thinkers:

If by logical, you mean people excusing what reasonable people see as the action of a guilty man.Also, nothing logical in labeling the amount of people disagreeing with you as haters.

When did we lose the 'salty' part?

 

[Anarchy99]

There needs to be a go to, boilerplate response by Brady lovers as to why Brady destroyed the phone.

What is it so we can begin that circular argument?

Not a Brady lover, but would like to see the reverse as well from those who hate Brady.Why does it matter if he destroyed his phone if he didn't have to turn it over and only had to submit documents/texts pertaining to the incident?

I dont hate him.

He destroyed it because he was scared of what may be on it and he knows he was guilty.

Who knows what was on the phone. I happen to thing that is was something potentially extremely incriminating that he could not risk getting out. Probably something unrelated to Deflategate. People can use their imaginations on what it could be. But it would have to be something pretty big if he didn't even want his legal team scanning his phone to find what was on it.

If nothing else, Brady is guilty of no legal counsel or poor legal counsel (not sure what happened when in all of this). He should have said from jump street that he was not going to entertain handing over his phone as that is not contained in the CBA. He should have shut that down right away and thus not let the league ask him multiple times for multiple things. When the league only asked for small things, by then it was too late and Brady looked guilty. If he said the first time he was approached that no way would the league be getting any personal communications so don't ask, he would have been way better off.

So IMO, cooperating as much as he did only hurt him in the long run because it got him rung up on failure to cooperate. Funny how that worked out. If he had cooperated less, he might not have been cited for failure to cooperate. Things may have gone different and then Brady could have deferred things to focus more on the CBA and legal language instead of what he actually did or requested to be done to the footballs.

Then HE could have been the one saying "if the league wanted that in the CBA, they should have negotiated it into the CBA in 2011." Instead, he got behind things instead of in front of things, so he now gets a serving of "the NFLPA agreed to the commissioner as someone that could hear appeals, they should have taken care of that last time, can't change it now."

And for the 500th time, I AM NOT suggesting that Brady and the Patriots didn't do anything. I do feel, however, that the Wells Report didn't prove it and the penalties invoked were too harsh given the infractions that the team was charged with.

 

[Bayhawks]

Got to hop for the day, but I will sum up the brilliance of those who hate Brady and the Pats.

Haters: Why did Brady destroy his phone?

Logical Thinkers: It was his phone and his right to protect his privacy.

Haters: Nobody was asking for his phone. He just had to turn over texts/documents related to the incident. Why are you not understanding this?

Logical Thinkers: If he didn't need to turn over his phone, why does it matter that he destroyed it?

Haters: Because...him destroying it is a sign that he is guilty.

Logical Thinkers:

Don't be dense. Destroying the phone also destroys the electronic records Wells requested Yee review and produce.

Exactly. If this goes to court & Brady challenges the findings & not just whether the NFL correctly followed their own rules, those records are unable to be retrieved , even if the NFL subpoenas them.

 

[sho nuff]

He should have said from the beginning that he liked the footballs on the low side and instructed people that. But not going below legal limits.

He would have likely gotten off with a fine.

Instead, he lied, obstructed, and dragged his feet fighting and crying.

And a bunch of his fans have followed suit.

 

[Bayhawks]

There needs to be a go to, boilerplate response by Brady lovers as to why Brady destroyed the phone.

What is it so we can begin that circular argument?

Not a Brady lover, but would like to see the reverse as well from those who hate Brady.Why does it matter if he destroyed his phone if he didn't have to turn it over and only had to submit documents/texts pertaining to the incident?

I dont hate him.He destroyed it because he was scared of what may be on it and he knows he was guilty.

Who knows what was on the phone. I happen to thing that is was something potentially extremely incriminating that he could not risk getting out. Probably something unrelated to Deflategate. People can use their imaginations on what it could be. But it would have to be something pretty big if he didn't even want his legal team scanning his phone to find what was on it.If nothing else, Brady is guilty of no legal counsel or poor legal counsel (not sure what happened when in all of this). He should have said from jump street that he was not going to entertain handing over his phone as that is not contained in the CBA. He should have shut that down right away and thus not let the league ask him multiple times for multiple things. When the league only asked for small things, by then it was too late and Brady looked guilty. If he said the first time he was approached that no way would the league be getting any personal communications so don't ask, he would have been way better off.

So IMO, cooperating as much as he did only hurt him in the long run because it got him rung up on failure to cooperate. Funny how that worked out. If he had cooperated less, he might not have been cited for failure to cooperate. Things may have gone different and then Brady could have deferred things to focus more on the CBA and legal language instead of what he actually did or requested to be done to the footballs.

Then HE could have been the one saying "if the league wanted that in the CBA, they should have negotiated it into the CBA in 2011." Instead, he got behind things instead of in front of things, so he now gets a serving of "the NFLPA agreed to the commissioner as someone that could hear appeals, they should have taken care of that last time, can't change it now."

And for the 500th time, I AM NOT suggesting that Brady and the Patriots didn't do anything. I do feel, however, that the Wells Report didn't prove it and the penalties invoked were too harsh given the infractions that the team was charged with.

When you say incriminating, are you being literal? You think there was evidence of a crime on his cell?

 

[JIslander]

Got to hop for the day, but I will sum up the brilliance of those who hate Brady and the Pats.

Haters: Why did Brady destroy his phone?

Logical Thinkers: It was his phone and his right to protect his privacy.

Haters: Nobody was asking for his phone. He just had to turn over texts/documents related to the incident. Why are you not understanding this?

Logical Thinkers: If he didn't need to turn over his phone, why does it matter that he destroyed it?

Haters: Because...him destroying it is a sign that he is guilty.

Logical Thinkers:

If by logical, you mean people excusing what reasonable people see as the action of a guilty man.Also, nothing logical in labeling the amount of people disagreeing with you as haters.

When did we lose the 'salty' part?

Dat salt now in Pats camp.

 

[dickey moe]

Does anybody believe Brady didn't have anything to do with this?

 

[David Dodds]

Does anybody believe Brady didn't have anything to do with this?

He smashed his phone to proclaim his innocence, silly

 

[Uncle Grandpa]

I don't care how this plays out, as long as the story extends throughout the season.

 

[Anarchy99]

There needs to be a go to, boilerplate response by Brady lovers as to why Brady destroyed the phone.

What is it so we can begin that circular argument?

Not a Brady lover, but would like to see the reverse as well from those who hate Brady.Why does it matter if he destroyed his phone if he didn't have to turn it over and only had to submit documents/texts pertaining to the incident?

I dont hate him.He destroyed it because he was scared of what may be on it and he knows he was guilty.

Who knows what was on the phone. I happen to thing that is was something potentially extremely incriminating that he could not risk getting out. Probably something unrelated to Deflategate. People can use their imaginations on what it could be. But it would have to be something pretty big if he didn't even want his legal team scanning his phone to find what was on it.If nothing else, Brady is guilty of no legal counsel or poor legal counsel (not sure what happened when in all of this). He should have said from jump street that he was not going to entertain handing over his phone as that is not contained in the CBA. He should have shut that down right away and thus not let the league ask him multiple times for multiple things. When the league only asked for small things, by then it was too late and Brady looked guilty. If he said the first time he was approached that no way would the league be getting any personal communications so don't ask, he would have been way better off.

So IMO, cooperating as much as he did only hurt him in the long run because it got him rung up on failure to cooperate. Funny how that worked out. If he had cooperated less, he might not have been cited for failure to cooperate. Things may have gone different and then Brady could have deferred things to focus more on the CBA and legal language instead of what he actually did or requested to be done to the footballs.

Then HE could have been the one saying "if the league wanted that in the CBA, they should have negotiated it into the CBA in 2011." Instead, he got behind things instead of in front of things, so he now gets a serving of "the NFLPA agreed to the commissioner as someone that could hear appeals, they should have taken care of that last time, can't change it now."

And for the 500th time, I AM NOT suggesting that Brady and the Patriots didn't do anything. I do feel, however, that the Wells Report didn't prove it and the penalties invoked were too harsh given the infractions that the team was charged with.

When you say incriminating, are you being literal? You think there was evidence of a crime on his cell?

Who knows? Maybe he had sexy pics of someone other than his wife? Maybe he has texts from a clandestine girlfriend . . . or boyfriend? Maybe he was involved in shady business dealings? Maybe there was evidence of worse examples of Patriots cheating? Maybe he was the trigger man in the Hernandez case? I certainly have no idea, but it kind of begs the question as to what was on the phone. If it were only the texts he sent to tweedle dee and tweedle dum, that really wouldn't be all that incriminating. I am not a multi, multi millionaire with a wife worth three times what I am, so I can't really thing like someone in that strata.

Again, we do't know the full extent of what he knew and when. By that I mean, he was probably paranoid and destroyed the phone. Wells may have asked for only certain texts and not the actual phone (or a limited request for information) AFTER Brady already ditched the phone. So he may have destroyed it for nothing. Again, it makes him look guilty, but it doesn't prove he's guilty. And if his attorneys do their jobs, they may be able to get the phone and its contents excluded.

 

[Old Smiley]

Does anybody believe Brady didn't have anything to do with this?

Sure. I believe Brady freaked out at the ball boys during or after the Jets game, and they took it upon themselves to make sure it didn't happen again. And further, I think it's possible, even likely, that the intent of the post-inspection tampering was not to under inflate the balls, but just to be sure there were no 16 pounders and incur the wrath of Tom again.

And I don't even like admitting that and throwing the ball boys under the bus based on the evidence we have. But the texts stink.

 

[[icon]]

Are the Patriot's Lombardi trophies made by Tiffany's of the same sterling silver as the others that have been awarded, because they sure seem to be suffering a lot of tarnishing. Oh, through homergoggles they look about the same, but the tarnish is evident to those whose vision is not so impeded.

Dodds just ripped this for Facebook without crediting DW. Edit: credited now.

To be fair, it's quite clever

 

[IvanKaramazov]

Does anybody believe Brady didn't have anything to do with this?

I think even dead-ender Patriot fans now have to concede -- if only to themselves -- that Brady is guilty as charged. Now they have to fall back on process arguments like the punishment being too severe and whatnot.:

 

[CoolHandLukeB]

Apologies if this has been discussed since today's ruling, haven't had time to skim the thread:

Why would Brady hand a copy of the rules to the refs if he was planning on breaking the rules? It makes no sense.

Goodell going with the "science" of Exponent, the same firm that said tobacco wasn't bad for your health, over the true third-parties who said the science explained the drop is laughable.

Still don't understand the big deal re: Brady's phone. If all they wanted was correspondence between McNally and Jastremski, why did they need Brady's phone if they already the two ball boys' phones? Wouldn't they already have record of all correspondence.

 

[Bayhawks]

There needs to be a go to, boilerplate response by Brady lovers as to why Brady destroyed the phone.

What is it so we can begin that circular argument?

Not a Brady lover, but would like to see the reverse as well from those who hate Brady.Why does it matter if he destroyed his phone if he didn't have to turn it over and only had to submit documents/texts pertaining to the incident?

I dont hate him.He destroyed it because he was scared of what may be on it and he knows he was guilty.

Who knows what was on the phone. I happen to thing that is was something potentially extremely incriminating that he could not risk getting out. Probably something unrelated to Deflategate. People can use their imaginations on what it could be. But it would have to be something pretty big if he didn't even want his legal team scanning his phone to find what was on it.If nothing else, Brady is guilty of no legal counsel or poor legal counsel (not sure what happened when in all of this). He should have said from jump street that he was not going to entertain handing over his phone as that is not contained in the CBA. He should have shut that down right away and thus not let the league ask him multiple times for multiple things. When the league only asked for small things, by then it was too late and Brady looked guilty. If he said the first time he was approached that no way would the league be getting any personal communications so don't ask, he would have been way better off.

So IMO, cooperating as much as he did only hurt him in the long run because it got him rung up on failure to cooperate. Funny how that worked out. If he had cooperated less, he might not have been cited for failure to cooperate. Things may have gone different and then Brady could have deferred things to focus more on the CBA and legal language instead of what he actually did or requested to be done to the footballs.

Then HE could have been the one saying "if the league wanted that in the CBA, they should have negotiated it into the CBA in 2011." Instead, he got behind things instead of in front of things, so he now gets a serving of "the NFLPA agreed to the commissioner as someone that could hear appeals, they should have taken care of that last time, can't change it now."

And for the 500th time, I AM NOT suggesting that Brady and the Patriots didn't do anything. I do feel, however, that the Wells Report didn't prove it and the penalties invoked were too harsh given the infractions that the team was charged with.

When you say incriminating, are you being literal? You think there was evidence of a crime on his cell?

Who knows? Maybe he had sexy pics of someone other than his wife? Maybe he has texts from a clandestine girlfriend . . . or boyfriend? Maybe he was involved in shady business dealings? Maybe there was evidence of worse examples of Patriots cheating? Maybe he was the trigger man in the Hernandez case? I certainly have no idea, but it kind of begs the question as to what was on the phone. If it were only the texts he sent to tweedle dee and tweedle dum, that really wouldn't be all that incriminating. I am not a multi, multi millionaire with a wife worth three times what I am, so I can't really thing like someone in that strata.

Again, we do't know the full extent of what he knew and when. By that I mean, he was probably paranoid and destroyed the phone. Wells may have asked for only certain texts and not the actual phone (or a limited request for information) AFTER Brady already ditched the phone. So he may have destroyed it for nothing. Again, it makes him look guilty, but it doesn't prove he's guilty. And if his attorneys do their jobs, they may be able to get the phone and its contents excluded.

OK-I was just curious if you were suggesting something literally ciminal, a la Aaron Hernandez.

What you've suggested is possible. However, paraphrasing Occam's razor "the simplest explanation is usually correct." The simplest explanation for Brady destroying his phone AFTER Wells has requested information off of it, is that he was hiding something from Wells. This becomes even more likely when his "I destroy my phones when I get a new one" explanation rings false because there was at least one old phone that he was able to share with the NFL.

 

[Bayhawks]

Does anybody believe Brady didn't have anything to do with this?

I think even dead-ender Patriot fans now have to concede -- if only to themselves -- that Brady is guilty as charged. Now they have to fall back on process arguments like the punishment being too severe and whatnot.:

The punishment IS too severe (and I've been branded a "salty hater" more times that I can count in this thread), but Brady refusing to take even the smallest ounce of responsibility for the situation played a part in that.

 

[Anarchy99]

There needs to be a go to, boilerplate response by Brady lovers as to why Brady destroyed the phone.

What is it so we can begin that circular argument?

Not a Brady lover, but would like to see the reverse as well from those who hate Brady.Why does it matter if he destroyed his phone if he didn't have to turn it over and only had to submit documents/texts pertaining to the incident?

I dont hate him.He destroyed it because he was scared of what may be on it and he knows he was guilty.

Who knows what was on the phone. I happen to thing that is was something potentially extremely incriminating that he could not risk getting out. Probably something unrelated to Deflategate. People can use their imaginations on what it could be. But it would have to be something pretty big if he didn't even want his legal team scanning his phone to find what was on it.If nothing else, Brady is guilty of no legal counsel or poor legal counsel (not sure what happened when in all of this). He should have said from jump street that he was not going to entertain handing over his phone as that is not contained in the CBA. He should have shut that down right away and thus not let the league ask him multiple times for multiple things. When the league only asked for small things, by then it was too late and Brady looked guilty. If he said the first time he was approached that no way would the league be getting any personal communications so don't ask, he would have been way better off.

So IMO, cooperating as much as he did only hurt him in the long run because it got him rung up on failure to cooperate. Funny how that worked out. If he had cooperated less, he might not have been cited for failure to cooperate. Things may have gone different and then Brady could have deferred things to focus more on the CBA and legal language instead of what he actually did or requested to be done to the footballs.

Then HE could have been the one saying "if the league wanted that in the CBA, they should have negotiated it into the CBA in 2011." Instead, he got behind things instead of in front of things, so he now gets a serving of "the NFLPA agreed to the commissioner as someone that could hear appeals, they should have taken care of that last time, can't change it now."

And for the 500th time, I AM NOT suggesting that Brady and the Patriots didn't do anything. I do feel, however, that the Wells Report didn't prove it and the penalties invoked were too harsh given the infractions that the team was charged with.

When you say incriminating, are you being literal? You think there was evidence of a crime on his cell?

Who knows? Maybe he had sexy pics of someone other than his wife? Maybe he has texts from a clandestine girlfriend . . . or boyfriend? Maybe he was involved in shady business dealings? Maybe there was evidence of worse examples of Patriots cheating? Maybe he was the trigger man in the Hernandez case? I certainly have no idea, but it kind of begs the question as to what was on the phone. If it were only the texts he sent to tweedle dee and tweedle dum, that really wouldn't be all that incriminating. I am not a multi, multi millionaire with a wife worth three times what I am, so I can't really thing like someone in that strata.

Again, we do't know the full extent of what he knew and when. By that I mean, he was probably paranoid and destroyed the phone. Wells may have asked for only certain texts and not the actual phone (or a limited request for information) AFTER Brady already ditched the phone. So he may have destroyed it for nothing. Again, it makes him look guilty, but it doesn't prove he's guilty. And if his attorneys do their jobs, they may be able to get the phone and its contents excluded.

OK-I was just curious if you were suggesting something literally ciminal, a la Aaron Hernandez.

What you've suggested is possible. However, paraphrasing Occam's razor "the simplest explanation is usually correct." The simplest explanation for Brady destroying his phone AFTER Wells has requested information off of it, is that he was hiding something from Wells. This becomes even more likely when his "I destroy my phones when I get a new one" explanation rings false because there was at least one old phone that he was able to share with the NFL.

If I really felt compelled (and I don't), I could conduct my own back channel investigation into what potentially was going on by contacting some of the people that I know, but that would likely produce only rumors and innuendo that would be nothing more than conjecture. Plus I doubt FBG's would want to get involved with rumors eminating from their website and risk being sued.

 

[David Dodds]

to destroy the phone, Brady had to figure what was on the phone was worthy of a longer suspension. I mean if you think it's only worth a hand slap, you at least preserve the phone, right?

 

[Bayhawks]

There needs to be a go to, boilerplate response by Brady lovers as to why Brady destroyed the phone.

What is it so we can begin that circular argument?

Not a Brady lover, but would like to see the reverse as well from those who hate Brady.Why does it matter if he destroyed his phone if he didn't have to turn it over and only had to submit documents/texts pertaining to the incident?

I dont hate him.He destroyed it because he was scared of what may be on it and he knows he was guilty.

Who knows what was on the phone. I happen to thing that is was something potentially extremely incriminating that he could not risk getting out. Probably something unrelated to Deflategate. People can use their imaginations on what it could be. But it would have to be something pretty big if he didn't even want his legal team scanning his phone to find what was on it.If nothing else, Brady is guilty of no legal counsel or poor legal counsel (not sure what happened when in all of this). He should have said from jump street that he was not going to entertain handing over his phone as that is not contained in the CBA. He should have shut that down right away and thus not let the league ask him multiple times for multiple things. When the league only asked for small things, by then it was too late and Brady looked guilty. If he said the first time he was approached that no way would the league be getting any personal communications so don't ask, he would have been way better off.

So IMO, cooperating as much as he did only hurt him in the long run because it got him rung up on failure to cooperate. Funny how that worked out. If he had cooperated less, he might not have been cited for failure to cooperate. Things may have gone different and then Brady could have deferred things to focus more on the CBA and legal language instead of what he actually did or requested to be done to the footballs.

Then HE could have been the one saying "if the league wanted that in the CBA, they should have negotiated it into the CBA in 2011." Instead, he got behind things instead of in front of things, so he now gets a serving of "the NFLPA agreed to the commissioner as someone that could hear appeals, they should have taken care of that last time, can't change it now."

And for the 500th time, I AM NOT suggesting that Brady and the Patriots didn't do anything. I do feel, however, that the Wells Report didn't prove it and the penalties invoked were too harsh given the infractions that the team was charged with.

When you say incriminating, are you being literal? You think there was evidence of a crime on his cell?

Who knows? Maybe he had sexy pics of someone other than his wife? Maybe he has texts from a clandestine girlfriend . . . or boyfriend? Maybe he was involved in shady business dealings? Maybe there was evidence of worse examples of Patriots cheating? Maybe he was the trigger man in the Hernandez case? I certainly have no idea, but it kind of begs the question as to what was on the phone. If it were only the texts he sent to tweedle dee and tweedle dum, that really wouldn't be all that incriminating. I am not a multi, multi millionaire with a wife worth three times what I am, so I can't really thing like someone in that strata.

Again, we do't know the full extent of what he knew and when. By that I mean, he was probably paranoid and destroyed the phone. Wells may have asked for only certain texts and not the actual phone (or a limited request for information) AFTER Brady already ditched the phone. So he may have destroyed it for nothing. Again, it makes him look guilty, but it doesn't prove he's guilty. And if his attorneys do their jobs, they may be able to get the phone and its contents excluded.

OK-I was just curious if you were suggesting something literally ciminal, a la Aaron Hernandez.

What you've suggested is possible. However, paraphrasing Occam's razor "the simplest explanation is usually correct." The simplest explanation for Brady destroying his phone AFTER Wells has requested information off of it, is that he was hiding something from Wells. This becomes even more likely when his "I destroy my phones when I get a new one" explanation rings false because there was at least one old phone that he was able to share with the NFL.

If I really felt compelled (and I don't), I could conduct my own back channel investigation into what potentially was going on by contacting some of the people that I know, but that would likely produce only rumors and innuendo that would be nothing more than conjecture. Plus I doubt FBG's would want to get involved with rumors eminating from their website and risk being sued.

I'm not going to trash your contacts, because you've always provided good information about NE, but I doubt that you'd be able to find anything new out. I'd imagine that NE & Brady have this sealed up pretty tight. I can't imagine that IF there was something else going on, or IF someone knew exactly what happened with this whole deflategate situation, that they'd spill it to you or anyone else.

 

[Bayhawks]

to destroy the phone, Brady had to figure what was on the phone was worthy of a longer suspension. I mean if you think it's only worth a hand slap, you at least preserve the phone, right?

No.

Evidently, according to some in this thread, Brady must have had a pre-determined date where he would destroy the phone, and even if the NFL was asking for information from that phone (that would obviously exonerate him, because these same posters insist he's innocent), he ALWAYS destroys his phone when he gets a new one, except for, you know that previous one.

 

[squistion]

Got to hop for the day, but I will sum up the brilliance of those who hate Brady and the Pats.

Haters: Why did Brady destroy his phone?

Logical Thinkers: It was his phone and his right to protect his privacy.

Haters: Nobody was asking for his phone. He just had to turn over texts/documents related to the incident. Why are you not understanding this?

Logical Thinkers: If he didn't need to turn over his phone, why does it matter that he destroyed it?

Haters: Because...him destroying it is a sign that he is guilty.

Logical Thinkers:

Don't be dense. Destroying the phone also destroys the electronic records Wells requested Yee review and produce.

Thanks, I was hoping someone would raise this rather obvious point that seems to be obtusely overlooked (was too busy to post in the thread before this).

 

[Old Smiley]

"The fact that the NFL would resort to basing a suspension on a smoke screen of irrelevant text messages instead of admitting that they have all of the phone records they asked for is a new low, even for them, but it does nothing to correct their errors."

 

[bostonfred]

to destroy the phone, Brady had to figure what was on the phone was worthy of a longer suspension. I mean if you think it's only worth a hand slap, you at least preserve the phone, right?

No.Evidently, according to some in this thread, Brady must have had a pre-determined date where he would destroy the phone, and even if the NFL was asking for information from that phone (that would obviously exonerate him, because these same posters insist he's innocent), he ALWAYS destroys his phone when he gets a new one, except for, you know that previous one.

I'm not really reading this thread and as fast as people are posting i probably won't notice if you reply but what evidence do you think could possibly have exonerated him? He could literally have texted "don't deflate those footballs below the legal psi" and people would have said it was obviously code for deflate them.

 

[JIslander]

to destroy the phone, Brady had to figure what was on the phone was worthy of a longer suspension. I mean if you think it's only worth a hand slap, you at least preserve the phone, right?

No.Evidently, according to some in this thread, Brady must have had a pre-determined date where he would destroy the phone, and even if the NFL was asking for information from that phone (that would obviously exonerate him, because these same posters insist he's innocent), he ALWAYS destroys his phone when he gets a new one, except for, you know that previous one.

I'm not really reading this thread and as fast as people are posting i probably won't notice if you reply but what evidence do you think could possibly have exonerated him? He could literally have texted "don't deflate those footballs below the legal psi" and people would have said it was obviously code for deflate them.

:salt: Sleep on it, then maybe things will get easier for you...

 

[squistion]

http://www.indystar.com/story/sports/columnists/gregg-doyel/2015/07/28/doyel-tom-brady-deflategate-villain/30804985/

Doyel: Tom Brady, DeflateGate villain

It's worse than we thought. Well, not it. Him. Tom Brady. He's worse than we thought.

And we thought he was bad. Nah, we knew it. The Ted Wells report on DeflateGate made it clear the Patriots deflated footballs for the AFC title game against the Colts, made it clear which team employees did it, and left just about no doubt for anyone outside of New England that quarterback Tom Brady was ultimately responsible.

Tom Brady, cheater.

Then he appealed his four-game suspension on the grounds that he was innocent.

Tom Brady, liar.

Bad, right? But it's worse. No, not it. Him. Tom Brady. He's worse than a liar, worse than a cheat. Hes a man of low integrity.

Before Tuesday, he was merely a garden variety cheater. But the revelation that Brady had destroyed his cell phone before his interview with Ted Wells makes it clear what species, what kind of cretin, were looking at.

Tom Brady, shameless.

Brady has left Rafael Palmeiro territory, wagging his figurative finger at the camera and saying, I don't believe so, when asked if hes a cheater, and entered the more nefarious neighborhood of Ryan Braun and Lance Armstrong. Rigged muscles, rigged footballs its rigging the contest. Gaming the system. Cheating the other team from the fair game it deserves.

Before Tuesday, Brady was a basic cheater. He was Mark McGwire. Sammy Sosa. Ben Johnson. Floyd Landis. Just another jerk in a sports landscape that has revealed so many of them. But now we see the depths of Brady's desperation.

In an effort to save himself, baseball star Ryan Braun threw the innocent specimen collector under the bus. Cyclist Lance Armstrong threw pretty much everybody under the bus.

Brady threw Roger Goodell under the bus.

The way Brady did it was more subtle than the scumbag moves of Braun and Armstrong, but it was devastating nonetheless. By appealing his suspension based on the argument that the Wells Report hadnt definitively proved a thing a calculation Brady was making based on the phone only he knew he had destroyed he knew he had an army of millions willing to do his bidding in his holy war with the unpopular Goodell.

Fans in New England. Fans in other cities who have come to distrust the admittedly distasteful Goodell. Stooges in the media, especially at ESPN, where Brady's guilt hasn't been debated so much as the absurdity of suspending a player four games for doing what Brady did.

Makes you wonder what people are missing. What they want to miss, in their desire to attack the dislikable NFL commissioner while absolving the more likeable Patriots quarterback.

It takes some ferocious mental gymnastics to get here, but this is where people got: They decided the periphery stuff Goodell, Ted Wells, even Ray Rice and Greg Hardy had more bearing on Bradys punishment than one fairly clear fact:

Brady rigged the AFC championship game.

He didn't need to rig it. The Patriots have owned the Colts for years and would have owned them on Jan. 18, maybe even by a score of 45-7, had the football been made of Havarti. But Brady rigged the game before the Super Bowl. Put that in italics. Stress what happened, because this wasnt just any game Tom Brady rigged. He rigged the game before the Super Bowl.

Brady tried, and he succeeded whether he needed to or not in deflating the football. He tried, he succeeded, in giving the Patriots an unfair competitive advantage in the biggest game of the season not just for his team, but for the team he was playing.

This cheating involved a needle, which supplies some symmetry. Brady was playing with a football on Nandrolone.

That alone deserves the four-game suspension. The latest revelation, that Brady didnt merely fail to cooperate with the investigation but actively hindered it by destroying evidence?

Bradys lucky Goodell didnt increase the suspension to five games. If not more.

And maybe Goodell would have done that if it werent for the NFL commissioners genius at making money. The Patriots fifth game, Bradys first, will be Oct. 18 at Lucas Oil Stadium against the Colts. In prime time. National television commercial spots are for sale as we speak.

And the people said: Cha-ching.

Brady went for it, though. Knowing what nobody, not even the NFL knew that he had destroyed his cell phone Brady appealed his suspension and sat back while his thugs in the media (social and mainstream) bullied Roger Goodell for him.

Goodell refused to cave. He upheld the suspension. Now the ball is back in Bradys court, only this ball hasn't been rigged and this game will be fairly contested. Lets call it Brady vs. The Truth, and if Brady does in fact sue the NFL as has been reported, well, we already know the truth.

Tom Brady, guilty.

 

[Jercules]

I just can't believe Tom Brady is this stupid.

If you know you're guilty, and you destroyed your phone to eliminate the evidence, why the hell would you volunteer:

A) that you intentionally destroyed your phone (didn't lose it, didn't drop it in the bathtub, didn't just say "F you, my phone is my business", etc.)?

B) the exact date you intentionally destroyed your phone, which just so happened to correspond with your interview with Ted Wells?

 

[The General]

Same thinking that says a guy being called "The Deflator" was actually just a nickname for losing weight.

 

[dschuler]

Brady is going to be playing week four against the Cowboys which is what I really care about :(

 

[Run It Up]

Since my last question went unanswered, anyone wanna tell me the difference between Brady intending to never turn over his phone records and not destroying his phone, as opposed to intending to never turn over his phone records and destroying his phone?

 

[Mile High]

I like him more then before just for not giving up his phone.

 

[Run It Up]

Also, anyone that has even been casually following deflategate from the beginning can see that this is a PR ploy by the shield.

From Brady's Agent earlier:

Finally, as to the issue of cooperation, we presented the Commissioner with an unprecedented amount of electronic data, all of which is incontrovertible. I do not think that any private citizen would have agreed to provide anyone with the amount of information Tom was willing to reveal to the Commissioner. Tom was completely transparent. All of the electronic information was ignored; we don't know why. The extent to which Tom opened up his private life to the commissioner will become clear in the coming days.

NFLPA is all set to file tomorrow, in Minnesota.

 

[Old Smiley]

It could have been defiance. I'm never going to give you this phone, in fact, here's how much I'm never going to give you this phone.

Still stupid. But the act of an angry, innocent man.

 

[JIslander]

Since my last question went unanswered, anyone wanna tell me the difference between Brady intending to never turn over his phone records and not destroying his phone, as opposed to intending to never turn over his phone records and destroying his phone?

whoah. RunitUp is mad. We must be complicit in this decision. Somebody please answer his question.

 

[Slider]

He destroyed his phone. Game over.

 

[The General]

Also, anyone that has even been casually following deflategate from the beginning can see that this is a PR ploy by the shield.

From Brady's Agent earlier:

Finally, as to the issue of cooperation, we presented the Commissioner with an unprecedented amount of electronic data, all of which is incontrovertible. I do not think that any private citizen would have agreed to provide anyone with the amount of information Tom was willing to reveal to the Commissioner. Tom was completely transparent. All of the electronic information was ignored; we don't know why. The extent to which Tom opened up his private life to the commissioner will become clear in the coming days.

NFLPA is all set to file tomorrow, in Minnesota.

I thought he never intended to turn over any info from the phone?

 

[renesauz]

See ya in court...

This should be fun... Goodell is trashing what little value his legacy had left here. It's entertaining to watch.

Disagree. Standing firm on confirmed cheating is the only right answer here.

 

[The General]

Since my last question went unanswered, anyone wanna tell me the difference between Brady intending to never turn over his phone records and not destroying his phone, as opposed to intending to never turn over his phone records and destroying his phone?

Those both seem like ways to not assist in an investigation.

 

[Run It Up]

Also, anyone that has even been casually following deflategate from the beginning can see that this is a PR ploy by the shield.

From Brady's Agent earlier:

Finally, as to the issue of cooperation, we presented the Commissioner with an unprecedented amount of electronic data, all of which is incontrovertible. I do not think that any private citizen would have agreed to provide anyone with the amount of information Tom was willing to reveal to the Commissioner. Tom was completely transparent. All of the electronic information was ignored; we don't know why. The extent to which Tom opened up his private life to the commissioner will become clear in the coming days.

NFLPA is all set to file tomorrow, in Minnesota.

I thought he never intended to turn over any info from the phone?

First time hearing of any such thing, till I had read this it was more of the same. The details of what Don Yee is talking about here are still unclear.

 

[renesauz]

And there are still those that will defend him m and think the NFL would lose in court.

Make no mistake. The NFL WILL lose in court. In terms of reputation, for sure, and in terms of losing the case, likely.

Not really.Brady is guilty as #### and likely too gutless to take it that far.

Sure he will. He's hiring out the muscle to do the heavy lifting from here on out. It all runs through a middle man. He is 10 times more removed from it now than when he sat in the office across a desk from the commissioner.

There are people who love Brady and there are people who hate him (and the Pats).

People who want to see the evil empire get their come uppance will have their view on it for that reason alone. People who are blind loyalists will too. But their is that group of casual observers who are interested in the process that will be pragmatic enough to watch this and will see and voice that this was a circumstantial witch hunt. Sure, If my boss suspects I am stealing clients for personal gain and asks for my phone, I may break my phone...but there is reasonable doubt that I did it for many reasons other than what is accused. The smoking gun is not a smoking gun in this case and people outside the NFL fanzone will see that on the logical level.

True enough....but it's enough grounds to get fired. Brady was just suspended, not fired.

 

[The General]

It could have been defiance. I'm never going to give you this phone, in fact, here's how much I'm never going to give you this phone.

Still stupid. But the act of an angry, innocent man.

That's good.

 

[Stinkin Ref]

some people are acting like this is a criminal case....wtf

unless I may go to jail, nobody is getting my phone and I'm a nobody with nothing to hide......

I might break it just to show you how crazy it is that you even asked me.... just cause I can.......it's my phone....

the league says he wasn't cooperating.....

what is "not cooperating"...?....if not giving up your cell phone for something not crime related is not cooperating than we would all probably be uncooperative if put in the same situation....

how many times do you think the league has probably had some indication that a player has done something worthy of being suspendeed but hasn't had the proof to suspend them.....you think they went to all those guys and asked them to provide the proof of their guilt or asked them to help prove they did something wrong....

Rog: hey Pacman, we have some indication you drove home drunk last night from the script club......but you didn't get pulled over and we can't say for sure....but we are investigating it.....can we have your phone so we can see that selfie video you took of you driving home while doing tequilla shots and running into all kinds of stuff and endangering people.....

Pac: yeah you bet Rog.....here you go.....if need anything else just let me know......could probably get you my bar receipts if you really need them....and the video from the script club of me doing shots all night and then getting in the drivers seat and driving away....

 

[squistion]

Since my last question went unanswered, anyone wanna tell me the difference between Brady intending to never turn over his phone records and not destroying his phone, as opposed to intending to never turn over his phone records and destroying his phone?

http://www.bostonglobe.com/sports/2015/07/28/nfl-upholds-tom-brady-four-game-suspension/fhOdVIaay3E0lPOIyt4A1J/story.html?event=event25

"Rather than simply failing to cooperate, Mr. Brady made a deliberate effort to ensure that investigators would never have access to information that he had been asked to produce," Goodell wrote in a 20-page decision denying Bradys appeal of his suspension.

Bradys action "leads me to conclude that he was attempting to conceal evidence of his personal involvement in the tampering scheme," Goodell ruled.

 

[The General]

Also, anyone that has even been casually following deflategate from the beginning can see that this is a PR ploy by the shield.

From Brady's Agent earlier:

Finally, as to the issue of cooperation, we presented the Commissioner with an unprecedented amount of electronic data, all of which is incontrovertible. I do not think that any private citizen would have agreed to provide anyone with the amount of information Tom was willing to reveal to the Commissioner. Tom was completely transparent. All of the electronic information was ignored; we don't know why. The extent to which Tom opened up his private life to the commissioner will become clear in the coming days.

NFLPA is all set to file tomorrow, in Minnesota.

I thought he never intended to turn over any info from the phone?

First time hearing of any such thing, till I had read this it was more of the same. The details of what Don Yee is talking about here are still unclear.

Did you read Goodell's statement today? It lays things out pretty clearly.

 

[renesauz]

But I do think the NFL is arbitrary in how it handles situations and think the commissioner is more of a tyrannical dictator than an impartial arbiter.

Even if that's true, what motivation does Goodell have to unfairly lean in the way of guilt? The owner of the Patriots is one of his good friends. His brand doesn't want to see arguably its most popular and golden player stained with allegations of cheating, nor see its champion accused of the same.

Even if Goodell has way too much power in this to push his own motives, his own motives would point him in the direction of shoving this under the rug as much as possible. He only hurts himself by punishing Brady and the Pats, so to do so he must find the evidence very convincing. If it weren't, motives would dictate that he err on the side of Brady/New England being let off the hook, not on the side of them being punished.

Great point that is being missed or ignored far too much.

 

[Bayhawks]

to destroy the phone, Brady had to figure what was on the phone was worthy of a longer suspension. I mean if you think it's only worth a hand slap, you at least preserve the phone, right?

No.Evidently, according to some in this thread, Brady must have had a pre-determined date where he would destroy the phone, and even if the NFL was asking for information from that phone (that would obviously exonerate him, because these same posters insist he's innocent), he ALWAYS destroys his phone when he gets a new one, except for, you know that previous one.

I'm not really reading this thread and as fast as people are posting i probably won't notice if you reply but what evidence do you think could possibly have exonerated him? He could literally have texted "don't deflate those footballs below the legal psi" and people would have said it was obviously code for deflate them.

It was sarcasm.

 

[Ghost Rider]

Reading up more on it, Brady is apparently adamant about the suspension being for not cooperating, as opposed to cheating, which leads me to believe that his lawyer telling the NFL about his cell phone destruction is a means to that end. In Brady's mind, he doesn't want the cheating stain on his permanent record, but he'd be okay with the not cooperating tag. Well, maybe not okay, but it's far preferable, in his mind. However, I doubt he thought the NFL would go all in like they have (did anyone?), and he's past the point of no return now, to where he can't back down without looking guilty on all accounts.

I'll bet if he had to do it all over again, he'd admit to having the ball boys lower the balls to where he likes it, back in that press conference in January, which most people would have gotten over in a day or two, especially given the lopsided score of the AFCCG.

 

[Football Jones]

The federal lawsuit and all that stuff is about Brady trying to protect his image. That said, I don't believe his image is tarnished too much even though the evidence is overwhelmingly against him. Time will likely soften this quite a bit, if not almost totally.

I'm sure Brady figured destroying his phone and playing innocent was the much lesser of two evils.