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Percy Harvin: #1 WR in Dynasty Leagues? (1 Viewer)

traderallenpoe

Footballguy
This guy does it all and is doing it with CONSISTENCY which is what some of the other premiere WRs (Julio/Calvin) have lacked this year.. I guess only one you could argue to is AJ Green but even so, Percy has to be Top 3 going forward, no? He is both dynamic and explosive, and think a lot of people were sleeping on him this year when they were thinking about WRs to build around

Disclosure: I drafted Julio 2nd rd and Percy 3rd round in my inaugural Dynasty draft this year :banned:

 
Not #1, he just doesn't have the size of the guys ahead of him Imo. Could see a very definite case of #4 behind Calvin, Green and Julio though.

 
Lack of TD makes me say no and makes me think you are overreacting a bit (since he had 2 this week). JMO, though.

 
In ppr it's close. Standard give me AJG and Calvin. Julio has White for another couple years so he and Harvin are close.

 
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His value depends a lot on whether you get individual return yds/TDs. Those really push his value up since they make it almost impossible for him to have a bad game.

 
It all depends. If you are in ppr and get points for ret yards too then yes. Right now he is #1 wr in my league.

But if you are in standard league I would say probably top 5

 
Lack of TD makes me say no and makes me think you are overreacting a bit (since he had 2 this week). JMO, though.
TDs follow yards. Coming into this season, Harvin averaged a score for every 12.5 catches. For his career, Andre Johnson averages a score for every 13.4 catches. Roddy averages one per 11.8. Brandon Marshall averages one for every 14.4 grabs. Unless you're Larry Fitzgerald or Calvin Johnson, you just don't average a TD per 10 grabs or less. That's fine, though- there are plenty of other paths to fantasy stardom. Huge rushing totals are certainly a nice trump card. I wouldn't put him at #1, but I think he's a no-brainer top-5.
 
I still have Calvin/AJG/Julio ahead of him in Tier 1, but he's at the top of Tier 2 with Cruz and DemThom. If my league had return yardage, he'd be in Tier 1.

 
He isn't number 1 but he is top 5 for sure. Right now I would say in no order the top 5 are Megatron, Cruz, Green, Jones, and Harvin. They are all 27 and under, they are all on very pass happy teams except for Harvin but he catches so many passes so close to the line of scrimmage that he is hard to stop, and Green but he is their only true receiving weapon.

 
Lack of TD makes me say no and makes me think you are overreacting a bit (since he had 2 this week). JMO, though.
TDs follow yards. Coming into this season, Harvin averaged a score for every 12.5 catches. For his career, Andre Johnson averages a score for every 13.4 catches. Roddy averages one per 11.8. Brandon Marshall averages one for every 14.4 grabs. Unless you're Larry Fitzgerald or Calvin Johnson, you just don't average a TD per 10 grabs or less. That's fine, though- there are plenty of other paths to fantasy stardom. Huge rushing totals are certainly a nice trump card. I wouldn't put him at #1, but I think he's a no-brainer top-5.
Absolutely agree with this. Just don't see the guy as #1 and don't think he is really (for me) in the conversation for #1. He is certainly top 5, but he is no Calvin.
 
At best, he is the new Welker in comparison to the others, but not the #1.

What was that old thread? Dominant vs. ....something?. he falls into that other category. These other guys mentioned can do things in terms of TDs in multiples in games, across large spanses of time, that Harvin won't do (not saying Can't, just not in the situation to do every week).

 
1. Green2. Calvin3. Cruz4. Juio5. ?Maybe top 5; not #1.
MarshallNicksBoweDemaryiusFitzgeraldWallaceI take these guys over him.He is outside top 10 for me.Having a good year so far and would be a great sell high candidate for my taste.Having played Jax,Ind, SF, Det, and Ten have helped his cause.1 rec TD thus far is also worrisome, considering last year he didn't catch his 1st TD until week 11.
 
As a Harvin owner, there is a 0% chance I would ever trade him for Cruz. Cruz isn't even the best WR on his own team. He's the Anquan Boldin to Nicks's Larry Fitzgerald. I also probably wouldn't trade him for Julio right now, but I sure would think about it. I'd swap him for Green or Calvin, so I guess that means I have him at #3.

I do think some people are focusing far too much on his TDs and not enough on his rushing, though. Those rushing totals are not a fluke or a gimmick. He played RB in college. A lot of people around here were predicting these rushing totals in the NFL. Just like having a QB who rushed for 300 dramatically increases his value, having a WR who rushed for 300 gives a hefty boost. If Harvin goes for 1200/6 receiving, his rushing totals turn him into an in-his-prime Andre Johnson.

 
1. Green2. Calvin3. Cruz4. Juio5. ?Maybe top 5; not #1.
MarshallNicksBoweDemaryiusFitzgeraldWallaceI take these guys over him.He is outside top 10 for me.Having a good year so far and would be a great sell high candidate for my taste.Having played Jax,Ind, SF, Det, and Ten have helped his cause.1 rec TD thus far is also worrisome, considering last year he didn't catch his 1st TD until week 11.
Harvin didn't catch his first TD until week 11, and he still wound up with 8 on the season. He finished as the #7 fantasy WR last year. He's currently a top5 fantasy receiver this year. He's the same age as AJ Green.So... 24 years old (as young or younger than everyone but Julio). Top 10 finish under his belt. Currently putting together another top 5 finish. Electrifying talent. Supplements his production through sick rushing totals. And somehow you add all this together and wind up with a ranking outside the top 10? I dunno, man, I'm not really seeing it.
 
1. Green2. Calvin3. Cruz4. Juio5. ?Maybe top 5; not #1.
MarshallNicksBoweDemaryiusFitzgeraldWallaceI take these guys over him.He is outside top 10 for me.Having a good year so far and would be a great sell high candidate for my taste.Having played Jax,Ind, SF, Det, and Ten have helped his cause.1 rec TD thus far is also worrisome, considering last year he didn't catch his 1st TD until week 11.
Harvin didn't catch his first TD until week 11, and he still wound up with 8 on the season. He finished as the #7 fantasy WR last year. He's currently a top5 fantasy receiver this year. He's the same age as AJ Green.So... 24 years old (as young or younger than everyone but Julio). Top 10 finish under his belt. Currently putting together another top 5 finish. Electrifying talent. Supplements his production through sick rushing totals. And somehow you add all this together and wind up with a ranking outside the top 10? I dunno, man, I'm not really seeing it.
The more cats your league counts the higher Percy gets to #1 WR status. In PPR + return yards league, he is top 3, prob #1. Without those stats, I agree he is not #1, but he's still top 5. I think he is the most targeted receiver on the Vikings.
 
Cruz isn't even the best WR on his own team.
Even if we ignored production, and accepted this as fact, why does it matter? The days of one elite WR per team are long gone. As a Cruz owner, I can't wait for Nicks to get back - Cruz has more room to work.He is top 5 in receptions, yards and touchdowns. In the last 19 games, he has been the #1 scoring WR.
 
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As a Harvin owner, there is a 0% chance I would ever trade him for Cruz.
I wouldn't either. I would trade Percy for Megatron or Green, though. I'd also trade him for Julio Jones in Dynasty formats. But that may be it. He's electrifying and the Vikings have finally figured out how to use him effectively.
 
This guy does it all and is doing it with CONSISTENCY which is what some of the other premiere WRs (Julio/Calvin) have lacked this year.. I guess only one you could argue to is AJ Green but even so, Percy has to be Top 3 going forward, no? He is both dynamic and explosive, and think a lot of people were sleeping on him this year when they were thinking about WRs to build aroundDisclosure: I drafted Julio 2nd rd and Percy 3rd round in my inaugural Dynasty draft this year :banned:
With you...I drafted Calvin 1st, Julio 2nd, Percy 4th. Pretty excited about the future of wr corps. Back-patting session now over.
 
Percy Harvin was a goal line RB and scored a TD from that formation with a healthy Adrian Peterson, Toby Gerhardt and a QB who can run the ball. He is the best player on the team and Adrian Peterson is certainly elite. Harvin is just that good.

If you are in a PPR I think Harvin is a solid choice for #1 tied with Calvin Johnson. In standard leagues I might value him more closely to Steve Smith in his prime. Except that Harvin will likely get 50 or so rushing attempts a year also. 40 more than Steve Smith or any other WR I can think of honestly. Harvin had 52 rushing attempts last season and that continues into this season. Right now he is on pace for 42 rushing attempts but I think come play off time or big games that they may run Harvin a bit more. He breaks down the defense and they play games with motion and just really keep the defense wondering where Harvin will be and if he is getting the ball at all times. Which of course frees up some things where the defense does not have enough people in the box and helps the run game. Harvin may not have the high TD potential of Calvin Johnson and perhaps some of the other young WR that have been mentioned, but that I would still like to see a longer track record with, which is something Harvin has that they do not.

I think all leagues should give return yardage to skill players. I do not see any good reason to not score this when it is such a huge part of the game. But I guess some leagues still play team defense and do not want to double reward? I don't see the problem there as you would be using the starting slot for both players anyhow. I can't think of a good reason for FF leagues to not award skill players for special teams yardage and TDs.

 
'Biabreakable said:
I think all leagues should give return yardage to skill players. I do not see any good reason to not score this when it is such a huge part of the game. But I guess some leagues still play team defense and do not want to double reward? I don't see the problem there as you would be using the starting slot for both players anyhow. I can't think of a good reason for FF leagues to not award skill players for special teams yardage and TDs.
My league didn't want to reward kickoff return yardage too heavily, because you get it just by showing up. An NFL scrub could field a kickoff, run it out of the end zone, and get 15 yards without getting touched. No way should he be rewarded for costing his team 5 yards of field position. We compromised, and we decided to reward kickoff returners for every yard they get after the first 20, which are basically just "gimme" yards, anyway. It's a nice system which gives good kickoff returners a small but noticeable bonus- maybe equivalent to an extra 100-200 yards a year.
 
'Biabreakable said:
I think all leagues should give return yardage to skill players. I do not see any good reason to not score this when it is such a huge part of the game. But I guess some leagues still play team defense and do not want to double reward? I don't see the problem there as you would be using the starting slot for both players anyhow. I can't think of a good reason for FF leagues to not award skill players for special teams yardage and TDs.
My league didn't want to reward kickoff return yardage too heavily, because you get it just by showing up. An NFL scrub could field a kickoff, run it out of the end zone, and get 15 yards without getting touched. No way should he be rewarded for costing his team 5 yards of field position. We compromised, and we decided to reward kickoff returners for every yard they get after the first 20, which are basically just "gimme" yards, anyway. It's a nice system which gives good kickoff returners a small but noticeable bonus- maybe equivalent to an extra 100-200 yards a year.
I could see doing it that way I guess giving more reward for longer returns/impact plays. There is a lot of garbage yardage on offense however. Kind of hard to qualify that to one instance while not others.Most systems I have seen do not reward equal points for return yards as other yards though. Some give .5/10 yards while normal offense gets 1/10
 
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I put him 3rd after Calvin and Green. If Nicks could stay healthy, he'd be 3rd bumping Harvin to 4th. I think Marshall would round out my top 5. He's significantly older than Julio and Cruz, but Cutler has tunnel vision for him and I could easily see him as a top 5 WR (with the potential to finish as WR1) for the next 4 or 5 years as long as he keeps his head on straight.

 
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Great replies. I think one of the things I was thinking in my reasoning was just how damn consistent he has been since Ponder took over the helm. The guy is an absolute machine, and my dynasty league is PPR so that obviously plays a factor as well.

 
Great replies. I think one of the things I was thinking in my reasoning was just how damn consistent he has been since Ponder took over the helm. The guy is an absolute machine, and my dynasty league is PPR so that obviously plays a factor as well.
The consistency is valuable because it is so rare from the WR position to have a player who hardly ever puts up dud weeks. Harvin may not have the big game upside of some of the other WR but he will not put up duds that they will as often either.With the right mix of complimentary players Harvin can really anchor your scoring with his consistency is a way similar to having a high touch RB2 that you can play at the WR position. I do think that has value that may be under-appreciated.
 
EDEN PRAIRIE, Minn. (AP) - Percy Harvin took his place in the slot position, 2 yards behind the line of scrimmage and just off the right tackle. The Minnesota Vikings faced third-and-5 from the Tennessee 10, looking to put the game away late in the third quarter.The Titans knew exactly what play they needed to be ready for, but Harvin still made it work for his second touchdown of the afternoon to further demoralize a struggling defense."They did a good job of trying to take it away, but he's Percy Harvin,'' Vikings quarterback Christian Ponder said.The "bubble'' screen pass to the elusive, powerful Harvin is a favorite way for the Vikings to use their most versatile player. It also creates other opportunities for the offense, forcing opponents to brace for the "bubble'' at the risk of ignoring another player. It's another example, too, of how an effective passing game in today's NFL doesn't necessarily mean a steady stream of long downfield throws to tall, traditional-size wide receivers.According to research by STATS, Harvin leads the NFL with 329 yards after the catch, more than 80 percent of his receiving total of 407. The next closest player is Denver's Demaryius Thomas with 270. New England's Wes Welker is third with 264. Of Harvin's 38 receptions this season, 22 have been at or behind the line of scrimmage.New England has been especially good at this, with one of the true stars of the slot in nine-year veteran Welker."You get the ball to your guys in space, and you see if they can make guys miss,'' Patriots quarterback Tom Brady said, adding: "You can throw really a low-risk pass for sometimes a significant reward. Those are always good plays in the offense where you're not trying to squeeze it in to four defenders for a 7-yard gain. You throw it to a guy who's open. He makes a guy miss and gains 14.''That's what happened last Sunday, when Ponder pivoted right and threw perfectly parallel to the line so Harvin could catch it with a running start and avoid the risk of a fumble if he was too deep. Harvin ran four yards backward in a half-circle - hence the "bubble'' descriptor - before planting and accelerating forward to grab the ball in the air.He made four Titans miss badly, the first one with a slick stop-start cut at the 12 and the second one with a similar hesitation move at the 10 before banging off a third defender at the 7. The last one who had a chance, cornerback Jason McCourty, whiffed at the 3."He runs the ball just as hard as Adrian Peterson. He's not worried about getting tackled. He's running through arm tackles. That makes him very dangerous for the fact that usually you don't see a guy out there at receiver that has that type of power and strength to stay up,'' McCourty said.The Vikings sure aren't ambushing anyone when they call the play."You hear all the defenders calling out `bubble, bubble, bubble!''' Harvin said. "It gets a little nervous, but actually I have full confidence in my blockers.''The widest receiver, in Sunday's case Michael Jenkins, has to clear the man covering him out of the way. Tight end Kyle Rudolph, who lined up outside of Harvin and has the most important job on this play, has to stay square in front of the defender he's trying to block to give Harvin the option of darting to either side. Also, the tackle on the side of the throw has to keep the defensive end from reaching too high so he can bat down the ball. Detroit did that with Cliff Avril the week before. The Lions were all over Harvin, actually, holding him to three catches for 22 yards. One of them went for a 2-yard loss."Rudolph, he comes to me repeatedly before the game or during practice, letting me know that I shouldn't have anything to worry about,'' Harvin said. "Just run my bubble as fast as I can, and he's going to handle it.''Offensive coordinator Bill Musgrave said he only called the "bubble'' screen pass once against Tennessee, though the Vikings practice it often. They can run the ball out of the same formation or, if the defense overcommits to take the sideways throw away, use an underneath shovel pass to Harvin instead. The Titans were in a zone coverage for that play on Sunday, a scenario in which Ponder is not supposed to send the ball Harvin's way."Rudolph was so confident that he could dominate that block that he wanted Christian to throw it no matter what,'' Harvin said.These days, at 4-1, the Vikings are confident in a lot of plays. Especially the ones involving Harvin."He makes big plays even when you have the numbers from a defensive standpoint to make the play,'' coach Leslie Frazier said, adding: "They had the numbers and an individual as talented as he is makes a play out of nothing.''
http://www.vikings.com/news/article-1/Vikings-Bursting-Bubbles-On-Screen-Passes-To-Harvin/1ac796cb-3a8c-4512-92b5-1a392f0f839dI think these numbers speak well for how talented Harvin is. So to me the questions becomes more about how you see Ponder and the Viking offense developing over the next few years?As a Viking fan I do not really think Ponder has an arm like Eli Manning. I think Harvin will get a big contract after this season with the Vikings and will be a focal point of the offense for the next few years. How good do you think the Viking offense will be over the next few years is the question as to if Harvin could be the #1 WR in dynansty. I certainly think he has a chance to be in PPR leagues. I am pretty optimistic that the Viking offense will be improving over the next few years with key players now in place such as Kalil, Rudolph, Ponder, Harvin and Peterson to build around. They are really only missing one major piece, the long ball WR, but at this point I am not sure how much advantage Ponder can of that type of player. I think plays to Harvin is going to be a staple for Ponder even if the Vikings get another star WR. If that happened I see it helping Harvin but maybe hurting Rudolphs targets, maybe not.
 
At best, he is the new Welker in comparison to the others, but not the #1.What was that old thread? Dominant vs. ....something?. he falls into that other category. These other guys mentioned can do things in terms of TDs in multiples in games, across large spanses of time, that Harvin won't do (not saying Can't, just not in the situation to do every week).
This make no sense at all. In ppr leagues that are 16 weeks long (most are) Welker was the number 1 scoring receiver in the league last year, yes even higher than Calvin. So if he is the new Welker minus 7 years, faster, and he isn't competing for targets how the hell isn't he top 5?
 
EDEN PRAIRIE, Minn. (AP) - Percy Harvin took his place in the slot position, 2 yards behind the line of scrimmage and just off the right tackle. The Minnesota Vikings faced third-and-5 from the Tennessee 10, looking to put the game away late in the third quarter.The Titans knew exactly what play they needed to be ready for, but Harvin still made it work for his second touchdown of the afternoon to further demoralize a struggling defense."They did a good job of trying to take it away, but he's Percy Harvin,'' Vikings quarterback Christian Ponder said.The "bubble'' screen pass to the elusive, powerful Harvin is a favorite way for the Vikings to use their most versatile player. It also creates other opportunities for the offense, forcing opponents to brace for the "bubble'' at the risk of ignoring another player. It's another example, too, of how an effective passing game in today's NFL doesn't necessarily mean a steady stream of long downfield throws to tall, traditional-size wide receivers.According to research by STATS, Harvin leads the NFL with 329 yards after the catch, more than 80 percent of his receiving total of 407. The next closest player is Denver's Demaryius Thomas with 270. New England's Wes Welker is third with 264. Of Harvin's 38 receptions this season, 22 have been at or behind the line of scrimmage.New England has been especially good at this, with one of the true stars of the slot in nine-year veteran Welker."You get the ball to your guys in space, and you see if they can make guys miss,'' Patriots quarterback Tom Brady said, adding: "You can throw really a low-risk pass for sometimes a significant reward. Those are always good plays in the offense where you're not trying to squeeze it in to four defenders for a 7-yard gain. You throw it to a guy who's open. He makes a guy miss and gains 14.''That's what happened last Sunday, when Ponder pivoted right and threw perfectly parallel to the line so Harvin could catch it with a running start and avoid the risk of a fumble if he was too deep. Harvin ran four yards backward in a half-circle - hence the "bubble'' descriptor - before planting and accelerating forward to grab the ball in the air.He made four Titans miss badly, the first one with a slick stop-start cut at the 12 and the second one with a similar hesitation move at the 10 before banging off a third defender at the 7. The last one who had a chance, cornerback Jason McCourty, whiffed at the 3."He runs the ball just as hard as Adrian Peterson. He's not worried about getting tackled. He's running through arm tackles. That makes him very dangerous for the fact that usually you don't see a guy out there at receiver that has that type of power and strength to stay up,'' McCourty said.The Vikings sure aren't ambushing anyone when they call the play."You hear all the defenders calling out `bubble, bubble, bubble!''' Harvin said. "It gets a little nervous, but actually I have full confidence in my blockers.''The widest receiver, in Sunday's case Michael Jenkins, has to clear the man covering him out of the way. Tight end Kyle Rudolph, who lined up outside of Harvin and has the most important job on this play, has to stay square in front of the defender he's trying to block to give Harvin the option of darting to either side. Also, the tackle on the side of the throw has to keep the defensive end from reaching too high so he can bat down the ball. Detroit did that with Cliff Avril the week before. The Lions were all over Harvin, actually, holding him to three catches for 22 yards. One of them went for a 2-yard loss."Rudolph, he comes to me repeatedly before the game or during practice, letting me know that I shouldn't have anything to worry about,'' Harvin said. "Just run my bubble as fast as I can, and he's going to handle it.''Offensive coordinator Bill Musgrave said he only called the "bubble'' screen pass once against Tennessee, though the Vikings practice it often. They can run the ball out of the same formation or, if the defense overcommits to take the sideways throw away, use an underneath shovel pass to Harvin instead. The Titans were in a zone coverage for that play on Sunday, a scenario in which Ponder is not supposed to send the ball Harvin's way."Rudolph was so confident that he could dominate that block that he wanted Christian to throw it no matter what,'' Harvin said.These days, at 4-1, the Vikings are confident in a lot of plays. Especially the ones involving Harvin."He makes big plays even when you have the numbers from a defensive standpoint to make the play,'' coach Leslie Frazier said, adding: "They had the numbers and an individual as talented as he is makes a play out of nothing.''
http://www.vikings.com/news/article-1/Vikings-Bursting-Bubbles-On-Screen-Passes-To-Harvin/1ac796cb-3a8c-4512-92b5-1a392f0f839dI think these numbers speak well for how talented Harvin is. So to me the questions becomes more about how you see Ponder and the Viking offense developing over the next few years?As a Viking fan I do not really think Ponder has an arm like Eli Manning. I think Harvin will get a big contract after this season with the Vikings and will be a focal point of the offense for the next few years. How good do you think the Viking offense will be over the next few years is the question as to if Harvin could be the #1 WR in dynansty. I certainly think he has a chance to be in PPR leagues. I am pretty optimistic that the Viking offense will be improving over the next few years with key players now in place such as Kalil, Rudolph, Ponder, Harvin and Peterson to build around. They are really only missing one major piece, the long ball WR, but at this point I am not sure how much advantage Ponder can of that type of player. I think plays to Harvin is going to be a staple for Ponder even if the Vikings get another star WR. If that happened I see it helping Harvin but maybe hurting Rudolphs targets, maybe not.
Simpson MAY be that deep threat. Certainly has the wheels. Maybe not. I'm thinking not for now. I'm waiting till I see Ponder allowed to chuck a few that far.
 
Percy Harvin is the most electric player in the NFL with the ball in his hands. The only thing conceivably holding him back is getting the ball in his hands. The coaches in Minnesota have figured out that if they want to keep their jobs, they will give Percy Harvin the ball as much as possible.

Ponder knows where his bread is buttered. Percy will touch the ball, guaranteed, 10+ times a game every single game. There is a high probability given his speed, elusiveness, shiftiness, and maneuverability that he will take one to the house.

Percy Harvin is the #1 WR in PPR leagues, and hands down #1 in return yardage leagues. In non-PPR and non-return yardage leagues, he is unquestionably top 5.

 
Percy Harvin is the most electric player in the NFL with the ball in his hands. The only thing conceivably holding him back is getting the ball in his hands. The coaches in Minnesota have figured out that if they want to keep their jobs, they will give Percy Harvin the ball as much as possible.

Ponder knows where his bread is buttered. Percy will touch the ball, guaranteed, 10+ times a game every single game. There is a high probability given his speed, elusiveness, shiftiness, and maneuverability that he will take one to the house.

Percy Harvin is the #1 WR in PPR leagues, and hands down #1 in return yardage leagues. In non-PPR and non-return yardage leagues, he is unquestionably top 5.
All of what you say above is reasonable other than the bolded. He has had 2 TD's this year, all in this last game against TEN. Last year, Harvin did not have a TD until week 8 (where he ran one in) and from that point on he had a very solid 8 TD's. If we want to assume that the last 9 games of last year, plus this last game are all that matters then yes there is a high probability that he will take it to the house. But to me that is discounting a lot of history (2010 where he had 6 TD's, the first half of 2011 where he had none and the first 4 games of this year where he had none) including very recent history. I am a big Harvin fan, but I have a tough time seeing that he has a "high probability" of taking it to the house, unless this last game was indicative that he has turned a corner that he had not turned in the first 4 games of this year. Top 5 WR for sure, #1? Not so much, at least not to me.
 
'MDSkinner said:
'Mash said:
Percy Harvin is the most electric player in the NFL with the ball in his hands. The only thing conceivably holding him back is getting the ball in his hands. The coaches in Minnesota have figured out that if they want to keep their jobs, they will give Percy Harvin the ball as much as possible.

Ponder knows where his bread is buttered. Percy will touch the ball, guaranteed, 10+ times a game every single game. There is a high probability given his speed, elusiveness, shiftiness, and maneuverability that he will take one to the house.

Percy Harvin is the #1 WR in PPR leagues, and hands down #1 in return yardage leagues. In non-PPR and non-return yardage leagues, he is unquestionably top 5.
All of what you say above is reasonable other than the bolded. He has had 2 TD's this year, all in this last game against TEN. Last year, Harvin did not have a TD until week 8 (where he ran one in) and from that point on he had a very solid 8 TD's. If we want to assume that the last 9 games of last year, plus this last game are all that matters then yes there is a high probability that he will take it to the house. But to me that is discounting a lot of history (2010 where he had 6 TD's, the first half of 2011 where he had none and the first 4 games of this year where he had none) including very recent history. I am a big Harvin fan, but I have a tough time seeing that he has a "high probability" of taking it to the house, unless this last game was indicative that he has turned a corner that he had not turned in the first 4 games of this year. Top 5 WR for sure, #1? Not so much, at least not to me.
What's with this focus on the first half of 2011? Did the second half never happen? You keep saying "he didn't score in the first half", when it'd be just as accurate to say he averaged a TD a game in the second half, which is more relevant because it's more recent. Or you could say he's posted 10 TDs in 16 games with Ponder, or that he historically has caught TDs at roughly the same rate as Andre Johnson- both true statements. Or you could mention that they gave him an inside handoff at the goal line last week, and suggest that he's the only WR in the league who will also occasionally moonlight as a goal-line back.
 
What's with this focus on the first half of 2011? Did the second half never happen? You keep saying "he didn't score in the first half", when it'd be just as accurate to say he averaged a TD a game in the second half, which is more relevant because it's more recent. Or you could say he's posted 10 TDs in 16 games with Ponder, or that he historically has caught TDs at roughly the same rate as Andre Johnson- both true statements. Or you could mention that they gave him an inside handoff at the goal line last week, and suggest that he's the only WR in the league who will also occasionally moonlight as a goal-line back.
I am pretty sure that was the first time I have ever mentioned that myself since I just looked it up as I was posting that message (others very possibly might have said it though). That said, I am comfortable with the idea that he turned the corner with Ponder during the latter part of last year. And I also agree that he is the only WR in the league who will occasionally moonlight as a goal-line back, and that he has historically caught TD's at roughly the same rate as Andre Johnson. Heck, I even think he is a no-brainer top 5 WR (Dynasty, redraft), I just don't think that he is #1 and I think that his lack of TD's is a part of that reason. Correct me if I am wrong, but Harvin is not a guy who will ever get thrown the jump ball in the way that a Calvin or a Julio or a Green will? Is it possible that the looks that he gets running the ball will account for that? Sure. But from my personal perspective, it seems unlikely. He is the clear best weapon on his team, and I won't even deny that it is possible he could end up as the #1 WR (anything is possible, right?), but if I am choosing the first WR off the board, he is not the guy I am picking. You seem like a guy who is smarter than me in these things, so you are probably dead on, but I just am not seeing it that way.
 
#4, even in PPR. He's not going to get the TD opportunities of the other three (Calvin, Green, Julio). Still a beast tho!

 
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As a Harvin owner, there is a 0% chance I would ever trade him for Cruz. Cruz isn't even the best WR on his own team. He's the Anquan Boldin to Nicks's Larry Fitzgerald. I also probably wouldn't trade him for Julio right now, but I sure would think about it. I'd swap him for Green or Calvin, so I guess that means I have him at #3.

I do think some people are focusing far too much on his TDs and not enough on his rushing, though. Those rushing totals are not a fluke or a gimmick. He played RB in college. A lot of people around here were predicting these rushing totals in the NFL. Just like having a QB who rushed for 300 dramatically increases his value, having a WR who rushed for 300 gives a hefty boost. If Harvin goes for 1200/6 receiving, his rushing totals turn him into an in-his-prime Andre Johnson.
Cruz is already better than Boldin ever was..
 
Or you could mention that they gave him an inside handoff at the goal line last week, and suggest that he's the only WR in the league who will also occasionally moonlight as a goal-line back.
A little premature to make this claim. It has happened once, that I know of, and Peterson isn't 100%. The hope is that they did it becuase they hope to run other plays off of it, likely something getting Harvin on the edge. But, again, a bit premature even for that, until we see it happen.
 
Or you could mention that they gave him an inside handoff at the goal line last week, and suggest that he's the only WR in the league who will also occasionally moonlight as a goal-line back.
A little premature to make this claim. It has happened once, that I know of, and Peterson isn't 100%. The hope is that they did it becuase they hope to run other plays off of it, likely something getting Harvin on the edge. But, again, a bit premature even for that, until we see it happen.
Since Week 8 of last year, Harvin has rushing touchdowns of 10, 5 and 4 yards (all while lined up in the backfield). He was also robbed of a 2 yard score against Atlanta on a poor call by the officials. Using Harvin at the goal-line last week wasn't a one-time gimmick by the Vikings.
 
Or you could mention that they gave him an inside handoff at the goal line last week, and suggest that he's the only WR in the league who will also occasionally moonlight as a goal-line back.
A little premature to make this claim. It has happened once, that I know of, and Peterson isn't 100%. The hope is that they did it becuase they hope to run other plays off of it, likely something getting Harvin on the edge. But, again, a bit premature even for that, until we see it happen.
Since Week 8 of last year, Harvin has rushing touchdowns of 10, 5 and 4 yards (all while lined up in the backfield). He was also robbed of a 2 yard score against Atlanta on a poor call by the officials. Using Harvin at the goal-line last week wasn't a one-time gimmick by the Vikings.
And how many of those games did he have a healhty Adrian Peterson playing?EDIT: FBG shows 2 TD in his career, bewteen the opp 5 yard line, and the opp GL. 5 total carries.Unfortunately, it is not going to tell me how Harvin lined up, or what the play was.
 
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Or you could mention that they gave him an inside handoff at the goal line last week, and suggest that he's the only WR in the league who will also occasionally moonlight as a goal-line back.
A little premature to make this claim. It has happened once, that I know of, and Peterson isn't 100%. The hope is that they did it becuase they hope to run other plays off of it, likely something getting Harvin on the edge. But, again, a bit premature even for that, until we see it happen.
Since Week 8 of last year, Harvin has rushing touchdowns of 10, 5 and 4 yards (all while lined up in the backfield). He was also robbed of a 2 yard score against Atlanta on a poor call by the officials. Using Harvin at the goal-line last week wasn't a one-time gimmick by the Vikings.
And how many of those games did he have a healhty Adrian Peterson playing?EDIT: FBG shows 2 TD in his career, bewteen the opp 5 yard line, and the opp GL. 5 total carries.Unfortunately, it is not going to tell me how Harvin lined up, or what the play was.
Peterson played in Carolina and Tennessee games and did not play in the Chicago and Atlanta games.Harvin lined up the backfield on every carry.
 
Peterson played in Carolina and Tennessee games and did not play in the Chicago and Atlanta games.Harvin lined up the backfield on every carry.
Not that I don't believe you. But where are you getting this info? Game logs?
I watched the games (and Game Rewind confirmed it). I'm sure you could find the highlights of the TDs on NFL.com as well if you don't have GR.
If I get a chance, I'll do that. Thanks for the info! I usually only get the off-season GR, since I pay for the Sunday Ticket, too. Thanks, again.
 
As a Harvin owner, there is a 0% chance I would ever trade him for Cruz. Cruz isn't even the best WR on his own team. He's the Anquan Boldin to Nicks's Larry Fitzgerald. I also probably wouldn't trade him for Julio right now, but I sure would think about it. I'd swap him for Green or Calvin, so I guess that means I have him at #3.

I do think some people are focusing far too much on his TDs and not enough on his rushing, though. Those rushing totals are not a fluke or a gimmick. He played RB in college. A lot of people around here were predicting these rushing totals in the NFL. Just like having a QB who rushed for 300 dramatically increases his value, having a WR who rushed for 300 gives a hefty boost. If Harvin goes for 1200/6 receiving, his rushing totals turn him into an in-his-prime Andre Johnson.
Cruz is already better than Boldin ever was..
:no:
 
Or you could mention that they gave him an inside handoff at the goal line last week, and suggest that he's the only WR in the league who will also occasionally moonlight as a goal-line back.
A little premature to make this claim. It has happened once, that I know of, and Peterson isn't 100%. The hope is that they did it becuase they hope to run other plays off of it, likely something getting Harvin on the edge. But, again, a bit premature even for that, until we see it happen.
Since Week 8 of last year, Harvin has rushing touchdowns of 10, 5 and 4 yards (all while lined up in the backfield). He was also robbed of a 2 yard score against Atlanta on a poor call by the officials. Using Harvin at the goal-line last week wasn't a one-time gimmick by the Vikings.
The rush TD last week he looked like an RB getting low and breaking a tackle for the endzone. :popcorn:
 
As a Harvin owner, there is a 0% chance I would ever trade him for Cruz. Cruz isn't even the best WR on his own team. He's the Anquan Boldin to Nicks's Larry Fitzgerald. I also probably wouldn't trade him for Julio right now, but I sure would think about it. I'd swap him for Green or Calvin, so I guess that means I have him at #3.

I do think some people are focusing far too much on his TDs and not enough on his rushing, though. Those rushing totals are not a fluke or a gimmick. He played RB in college. A lot of people around here were predicting these rushing totals in the NFL. Just like having a QB who rushed for 300 dramatically increases his value, having a WR who rushed for 300 gives a hefty boost. If Harvin goes for 1200/6 receiving, his rushing totals turn him into an in-his-prime Andre Johnson.
Cruz is already better than Boldin ever was..
:no:
YES! :thumbup:
 

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