ramses barden getting PT? (1 Viewer)

[flc735]

the snap count at football outsiders has barden playing 56% of the snaps vs hixons 6%

is this accurate or a mistake? did anyone notice hixon or barden in the game more often?

 

[Pigskin Fanatic]

the snap count at football outsiders has barden playing 56% of the snaps vs hixons 6%

is this accurate or a mistake? did anyone notice hixon or barden in the game more often?

Hixon got hurt and didn't return to the game IIRC.

 

[macknova]

No Hixon AND no Nicks.

How high is Barden this week? Big red zone target with Eli Manning and not a ton of other weapons.

 

[flc735]

im picking him up. i can always drop and replace him on friday if he doesn't do anything. i dont think hixon has the slot job locked up and bennet is inconsistent (i think), so there is opportunity. on the other hand, i don't know why barden is playing the slot. isn't he too big for that?

 

[netnalp]

Barden is a polarizing figure on Giants boards. Some people love him and say injuries have limited his development and chances to show what he can do. Others, like me, feel he's a roster bubble guy and can't stay healthy.

There's even disagreement over how he does in camp. His fans say he dominates in camp. The other group says he's a big player that doesn't use his size to his advantage. Instead he tries to be a finesse WR and juke the DB. It doesn't work so he has trouble getting separation. He's tall 6'6" but has never been used as a redzone threat when healthy.

Respected Giants blogger Patricia Traina listed Barden in her Hit & Miss section of her weekly game review:

Misses:

Ramses Barden: Given a big opportunity after Domenik Hixon left the game with a concussion, Barden came up short. While he had one reception for 24 yards, he seemed to have trouble getting open. He also had a drop late in the second quarter after getting open and having a good pass thrown his way.

------------------------------

I expect Barden and Randle to get snaps and they'll go with the one who seems the most effective. I don't think Eli has greater confidence in Barden over Randle. Jernigan is Cruz's back up mainly, though he did compete for the outside spot in camp and preseason.

One possible hint is beat writer Ebenezer Samuel says Randle told him he'd been getting many more snaps in practice and that Nicks told him to be ready to get a lot of playtime in the Carolina game.

However, that is the same writer that said Nicks would be fine this morning.

I think Randle will get more work. But as a warning, I didn't forsee Cruz's breakout coming last year till it happened in the Philly game.

 

[netnalp]

im picking him up. i can always drop and replace him on friday if he doesn't do anything. i dont think hixon has the slot job locked up and bennet is inconsistent (i think), so there is opportunity. on the other hand, i don't know why barden is playing the slot. isn't he too big for that?

Cruz goes to the slot when they play 3WRs and Hixon/Barden/Randle play the outside.

 

[flc735]

im picking him up. i can always drop and replace him on friday if he doesn't do anything. i dont think hixon has the slot job locked up and bennet is inconsistent (i think), so there is opportunity. on the other hand, i don't know why barden is playing the slot. isn't he too big for that?

Cruz goes to the slot when they play 3WRs and Hixon/Barden/Randle play the outside.

ah that's right. thanks

 

[atcdav]

Barden is a polarizing figure on Giants boards. Some people love him and say injuries have limited his development and chances to show what he can do. Others, like me, feel he's a roster bubble guy and can't stay healthy.

There's even disagreement over how he does in camp. His fans say he dominates in camp. The other group says he's a big player that doesn't use his size to his advantage. Instead he tries to be a finesse WR and juke the DB. It doesn't work so he has trouble getting separation. He's tall 6'6" but has never been used as a redzone threat when healthy.

Respected Giants blogger Patricia Traina listed Barden in her Hit & Miss section of her weekly game review:

Misses:

Ramses Barden: Given a big opportunity after Domenik Hixon left the game with a concussion, Barden came up short. While he had one reception for 24 yards, he seemed to have trouble getting open. He also had a drop late in the second quarter after getting open and having a good pass thrown his way.

------------------------------

I expect Barden and Randle to get snaps and they'll go with the one who seems the most effective. I don't think Eli has greater confidence in Barden over Randle. Jernigan is Cruz's back up mainly, though he did compete for the outside spot in camp and preseason.

One possible hint is beat writer Ebenezer Samuel says Randle told him he'd been getting many more snaps in practice and that Nicks told him to be ready to get a lot of playtime in the Carolina game.

However, that is the same writer that said Nicks would be fine this morning.

I think Randle will get more work. But as a warning, I didn't forsee Cruz's breakout coming last year till it happened in the Philly game.

Not saying he is Cruz because he is not. But preseason last year Cruz was a roster bubble guy....:grainofsalt:

 

[Bri]

Barden was a red zone player a while back, then he got hurt, and...been waiting.

His college career and highlights were interesting.

He's huge and has awesome hands but he has struggled to get open in the NFL.

He's so very well liked amongst his teammates.

Defenses have to cover and respect his size. Eli can certainly lob it up and expect him to come down with it. He's 6-6 with a nice vertical.

He's not fast, takes those tall guy big strides, and will never get huge separation. He's one Eli will have to trust and fire it to him.

He really struggles between the 20s but even if he doesn't catch it, he greatly concerns a D inside the 20.

Few players have done so little and received so much respect. He was a later pick, I assume every team thought he was worth a shot and drooled over the idea of him as a project. Attitude, smarts, ability, size...he's a prototype project that seemed to catch everyone's attention that draft. Maybe that's why ...you watch and he'll be jammed with a safety coming to help.

The debate is if he's developed or is still the same project he was on draft day. I suppose if he has any success between the 20s, he's improving.

Again, he's enormous with awesome hands...one finger tip grab on the day a fan visited camp will have him talking about Ramses for a long time. Plax was 6-5 and Barden seems a lot bigger although listed at 6-6. Supposedly one runs upright the other put his head down...not sure, but he seems a good amount taller than Plax.

 

[Bri]

im picking him up. i can always drop and replace him on friday if he doesn't do anything. i dont think hixon has the slot job locked up and bennet is inconsistent (i think), so there is opportunity. on the other hand, i don't know why barden is playing the slot. isn't he too big for that?

Cruz goes to the slot when they play 3WRs and Hixon/Barden/Randle play the outside.

Barden is not a good route runner. Maybe maybe he could pretend he's a TE for a play but I doubt he's in the slot. This should be good for Cruz' catch totals

 

[Hipple Long Ware & Peete]

I'm a sucker for athletic 6'6 guys with nice verticals. That his name is Ramses only adds to the in. In and starting in. My big $ league over hankerson and Holmes (dropped DHBust for him.

 

[netnalp]

He was a 3rd round pick. #85 overall in the 2009 draft. The Giants moved up to get him, trading their 3rd(91st overall pick) and a 5th to the Eagles to select him.

 

[macknova]

I'm not sold on Barden, but he's never gotten big playing time. The Giants aren't a great running team. They'll try to run against Carolina with Brown and Wilson, but at the very least, Barden will be on the field a lot and a legitimate red zone target.

That's a good place to start in fantasy. Debating between him, Stephen Hill and Justin Blackmon. Kind of want to say screw it and roll the dice with Barden.

 

[Yenrub]

Barden has nice hands but he really struggles with press coverage and doesn't get much separation

 

[Hipple Long Ware & Peete]

Someone's gotta catch Elis 500 yards.

 

[Hipple Long Ware & Peete]

With Nicks out, Barden's time is now

By Ohm Youngmisuk | Sep 19, 2012 5:13 PM

CHARLOTTE, N.C. -- The Giants downgraded Hakeem Nicks to out in somewhat of a surprising move after he was listed as questionable earlier in the day.

But when Nicks didn't do much in the morning walk-through, the team opted to play it safe, keep him out of the game and give him two weeks of rest before next week's game against Philadelphia on Sept. 30.

This is the right move for the long term. Nicks still feels pain in his surgically-repaired right foot. He limped badly twice late during Sunday's win vs. Tampa Bay and the Giants won't risk their star receiver by having him play twice in five days. It doesn't sound as if he has had a major setback but we'll have to see how he is feeling next week.

Unfortunately for Eli Manning, he will be without two of his top three receivers with Domenik Hixon (concussion) also out. So that means Ramses Barden's big moment has arrived. Barden should move up to the second receiver opposite Victor Cruz. And then second-round pick Rueben Randle and Jerrel Jernigan are options as the third receiver. Cruz should still be able to play out of the slot in three-wide sets.

Barden has one catch for 24 yards this season. The other main beneficiary is tight end Martellus Bennett. Manning has targeted him a total of 16 times in the previous two games and Bennett has scored in two straight games. Got to figure he will be a big part of the passing attack now. And perhaps there are passes to Andre Brown, David Wilson and fullback Henry Hynoski out of the backfield.

But the Giants offense loses major punch not having the dual big-play threat of Nicks and Cruz.

Tell us how you feel about Nicks sitting this one out below and who needs to step up.

 

[massraider]

No Hixon AND no Nicks. How high is Barden this week? Big red zone target with Eli Manning and not a ton of other weapons.

Red Zone target? Are we sure about that?

 

[macknova]

No Hixon AND no Nicks. How high is Barden this week? Big red zone target with Eli Manning and not a ton of other weapons.

Red Zone target? Are we sure about that?

Well, he should be on the field in red zone plays, and with his size at receiver, if he's not a red zone target, who is? He's never had an NFL touchdown, so I can't be 100% SURE about that, but it's not a hard stretch to make. Especially with Nicks and Bradshaw out.

 

[MAC_32]

No Hixon AND no Nicks. How high is Barden this week? Big red zone target with Eli Manning and not a ton of other weapons.

Red Zone target? Are we sure about that?

Well, he should be on the field in red zone plays, and with his size at receiver, if he's not a red zone target, who is? He's never had an NFL touchdown, so I can't be 100% SURE about that, but it's not a hard stretch to make. Especially with Nicks and Bradshaw out.

FWIW, I'm not trusting either one this week even in the deepest of leagues. At best, they're the 4th option on the field at all times. Since Nicks would have played if it were a full week I'm not picking either of them up since Nicks gets the job back next week. That said, I'm thinking the Giants want Randle to step up, so I think if one gets favored in the 1st half more than the other it's Randle. Barden could be a product of halftime adjustments, but I don't see him as a focal point early. Either way Carolina's defense vs. WR's is stout, so their gameplan will be to attack the middle of the field, not outside.

 

[atcdav]

After reading the scouting write up in the sharkpool on Randle I am considering grabbing him. I hane Nicks and I thinkit will be a long season will getting dinged up. I dont think I will trust him this week but if he goes off, I wount have a shot at him next week. Sounds like a talented kid and I think I saw on CBS he is actually starting opposite CRuz instead of Barden, not ur eof the accuracy of that though

 

[massraider]

No Hixon AND no Nicks. How high is Barden this week? Big red zone target with Eli Manning and not a ton of other weapons.

Red Zone target? Are we sure about that?

Well, he should be on the field in red zone plays, and with his size at receiver, if he's not a red zone target, who is? He's never had an NFL touchdown, so I can't be 100% SURE about that, but it's not a hard stretch to make. Especially with Nicks and Bradshaw out.

I don't think we can be 50% sure about that. Or 25%. There's more to being a red zone target than size. Otherwise, every team would have a failed NBA power forward on the field at the goalline. Don't mean to sound as toolish as I am sure I do, but Ramses Barden interests me. He's 26 years old. 2009 was his rookie year. 16 career catches? No career TDs? Why is he still on anyone's radar?He has shown nothing. He's tall. Too bad he wasn't only 6'4", and named Lawrence Finklebean, we wouldn't have to keep reading about him.

 

[macknova]

No Hixon AND no Nicks. How high is Barden this week? Big red zone target with Eli Manning and not a ton of other weapons.

Red Zone target? Are we sure about that?

Well, he should be on the field in red zone plays, and with his size at receiver, if he's not a red zone target, who is? He's never had an NFL touchdown, so I can't be 100% SURE about that, but it's not a hard stretch to make. Especially with Nicks and Bradshaw out.

I don't think we can be 50% sure about that. Or 25%. There's more to being a red zone target than size. Otherwise, every team would have a failed NBA power forward on the field at the goalline. Don't mean to sound as toolish as I am sure I do, but Ramses Barden interests me. He's 26 years old. 2009 was his rookie year. 16 career catches? No career TDs? Why is he still on anyone's radar?He has shown nothing. He's tall. Too bad he wasn't only 6'4", and named Lawrence Finklebean, we wouldn't have to keep reading about him.

If Lawrence Finklebean was Eli Manning's #2 receiver, we would read about him. This is more about opportunity than anything else. I've never been a huge believer in Barden, but his size/opportunity combination is very appealing, when you're looking at starting guys like Hartline, Hill, DHB, Blackmon, etc over Barden.

 

[Yenrub]

He has been injured a good amount of his career thus far

As a Giants fan I just hope the kid shows something tonight

 

[Sweet Love]

Personally, I find people like Barden much more intriguing than the guy who "grew up in the ghetto sharing a can of beans for dinner with his 5 brothers and sisters and now makes $10 million/yr.". It is not a knock on what those people have accomplished, but as someone who became a football fan starting in the mid 90s through FF, I am just really interested in the guy who manages to carve out a 7+ year career, while constantly being on the roster bubble. Back in the 80s and earlier, this was the norm; but given the salary cap restrictions and the vet minimum (double that of the UDFA minny), they not only have to be better than the UDFA, they have to be a good amount better. Barden is literally at a crossroad this week; if he gets 5 targets, drops 2 and catches one for 15 yards, he is likely off the Giants roster in 2013. If he gets 5 targets catches 3-4 for 25+ yards, he likely cemented himself on the 2013 roster. The gray area actually comes into play if he does well...say he get 6 targets for 5 catches and 77 yards and a TD...now he is on their radar, and if he fails to follow it up when called into duty again, he could be in real trouble. Sounds dumb, but for his career's sake, he (1) better play well and (2) if he plays really well, he better be able to follow it up.

 

[netnalp]

Barden was on IR early one season and the next one was on PUP.

I don't expect much but would be happy to eat crow if he proves me wrong about him. He's a FA after this season so he needs to make the most of his opportunities.

 

[massraider]

No Hixon AND no Nicks. How high is Barden this week? Big red zone target with Eli Manning and not a ton of other weapons.

Red Zone target? Are we sure about that?

Well, he should be on the field in red zone plays, and with his size at receiver, if he's not a red zone target, who is? He's never had an NFL touchdown, so I can't be 100% SURE about that, but it's not a hard stretch to make. Especially with Nicks and Bradshaw out.

I don't think we can be 50% sure about that. Or 25%. There's more to being a red zone target than size. Otherwise, every team would have a failed NBA power forward on the field at the goalline. Don't mean to sound as toolish as I am sure I do, but Ramses Barden interests me. He's 26 years old. 2009 was his rookie year. 16 career catches? No career TDs? Why is he still on anyone's radar?He has shown nothing. He's tall. Too bad he wasn't only 6'4", and named Lawrence Finklebean, we wouldn't have to keep reading about him.

If Lawrence Finklebean was Eli Manning's #2 receiver, we would read about him. This is more about opportunity than anything else. I've never been a huge believer in Barden, but his size/opportunity combination is very appealing, when you're looking at starting guys like Hartline, Hill, DHB, Blackmon, etc over Barden.

The above names cannot match Barden in SIZE/opportunity combo, but they sure smoke him in the opportunity/PRODUCTION combo, don't they?Since Barden has been with the Giants, three different WRs have emerged there, and they drafted a 4th in the 1st round. And people are discussing if he'll be the focal point of the offense? He either sucks out loud, or has been cleverly biding his time. Start every single other WR you listed above over him.

 

[Yenrub]

No Hixon AND no Nicks. How high is Barden this week? Big red zone target with Eli Manning and not a ton of other weapons.

Red Zone target? Are we sure about that?

Well, he should be on the field in red zone plays, and with his size at receiver, if he's not a red zone target, who is? He's never had an NFL touchdown, so I can't be 100% SURE about that, but it's not a hard stretch to make. Especially with Nicks and Bradshaw out.

I don't think we can be 50% sure about that. Or 25%. There's more to being a red zone target than size. Otherwise, every team would have a failed NBA power forward on the field at the goalline. Don't mean to sound as toolish as I am sure I do, but Ramses Barden interests me. He's 26 years old. 2009 was his rookie year. 16 career catches? No career TDs? Why is he still on anyone's radar?He has shown nothing. He's tall. Too bad he wasn't only 6'4", and named Lawrence Finklebean, we wouldn't have to keep reading about him.

If Lawrence Finklebean was Eli Manning's #2 receiver, we would read about him. This is more about opportunity than anything else. I've never been a huge believer in Barden, but his size/opportunity combination is very appealing, when you're looking at starting guys like Hartline, Hill, DHB, Blackmon, etc over Barden.

The above names cannot match Barden in SIZE/opportunity combo, but they sure smoke him in the opportunity/PRODUCTION combo, don't they?Since Barden has been with the Giants, three different WRs have emerged there, and they drafted a 4th in the 1st round. And people are discussing if he'll be the focal point of the offense? He either sucks out loud, or has been cleverly biding his time. Start every single other WR you listed above over him.

I don't think Barden is going to be the focal point of the offense but your information about the Giants WR is incorrect2009 the Giants drafted Nicks and Barden2010 No WR was drafted but they picked up Cruz as an undrafted free agent2011 Giants drafted Jernigan in the 3rd (he hasn't done anything yet either)2012 Giants drafted Randle in the 2ndBarden was drafted in 2009 Did nothing as a rookieWas put on IR sometime in 2010Started 2011 on PUP

 

[massraider]

I don't think Barden is going to be the focal point of the offense but your information about the Giants WR is incorrect2009 the Giants drafted Nicks and Barden2010 No WR was drafted but they picked up Cruz as an undrafted free agent2011 Giants drafted Jernigan in the 3rd (he hasn't done anything yet either)2012 Giants drafted Randle in the 2ndBarden was drafted in 2009 Did nothing as a rookieWas put on IR sometime in 2010Started 2011 on PUP

Since Barden has been there, Manningham, Nicks and Cruz have all emerged, and they drafted Randle (oops, not the first round, tho). I didn't say he was there before the others. Mario was there the year before. Although the same age as Barden. With other healthy WRs, and a TE that Manning seems to think is a nice target, I fail to see the optimism for Barden to suddenly light it up in an offense he couldn't get a sniff in since he has entered the league.

 

[Yenrub]

I don't think Barden is going to be the focal point of the offense but your information about the Giants WR is incorrect

2009 the Giants drafted Nicks and Barden

2010 No WR was drafted but they picked up Cruz as an undrafted free agent

2011 Giants drafted Jernigan in the 3rd (he hasn't done anything yet either)

2012 Giants drafted Randle in the 2nd

Barden was drafted in 2009

Did nothing as a rookie

Was put on IR sometime in 2010

Started 2011 on PUP

Since Barden has been there, Manningham, Nicks and Cruz have all emerged, and they drafted Randle (oops, not the first round, tho). I didn't say he was there before the others. Mario was there the year before. Although the same age as Barden.

With other healthy WRs, and a TE that Manning seems to think is a nice target, I fail to see the optimism for Barden to suddenly light it up in an offense he couldn't get a sniff in since he has entered the league.

Cruz is the only healthy WR who has done anything playing tonight...thus the optimism tonight for BardenNicks is out

Manningham is in San Fran

Hixon is out

So Barden is going to get the start...this is his best chance to prove something

Now I assume the Randle and Jernagin will also get a chance to prove something tonight as well

 

[flc735]

i like the situation he is in a lot ff wise. he's not in a situation where you will have to hold him for a while before we get our answer. we will know in a few hours if he is worth anything or not. also, this thursday game helps a lot. if he plays well, everyone will see it which will only increase his value. if he plays bad, then you drop him and pick someone else up tomorrow.

i dropped aldrick robinson and picked up barden for $1 in my deep dyno league. if barden stinks it up, ill just pick up robinson for $1 tomorrow.

i'd say the same for randle but he is rostered in my leagues

 

[netnalp]

Don't forget the FAs that saw time over Barden, Devin Thomas, Clayton, Stokely. Though none are still with the team and Barden is. Might be some others that aren't coming to mind.

 

[tsarc888]

announced as the starter. Let's see what he can do.

 

[flc735]

oh boy

 

[two_dollars]

He's a great spot start tonight!

 

[towney]

He's a great spot start tonight!

Yep, another Olgertree. Week 4 WW fodder.

 

[two_dollars]

He's a great spot start tonight!

Yep, another Olgertree. Week 4 WW fodder.

Similar, I agree, but not quite the same. I hate handcuffing WR's, but looks like he can step in when one gets hurt. Ogletree is usually on the field even when the starters are healthy. If you have a deep bench in your league, this is a guy who you may want on it! Wish I could have gotten him, he looks "qualified."

 

[flc735]

He's a great spot start tonight!

Yep, another Olgertree. Week 4 WW fodder.

i agree. not worth a $33 bid or whatever next week but the point of this thread turned into pick him up pregame for $1 in case this happensbut i think he did enough tonight to secure the wr3 job; the mario role which makes him a wr4 with upside

 

[Sup_Yo]

After one half: 7/100

Ballin'

 

[johnnyboy8102]

After one half: 7/100Ballin'

It will be more yards than that when it is corrected. The stat keeper accidentally gave Barden -7 yards on that last catch before the half.

 

[johnnyboy8102]

7/124 at half now that it is corrected.

 

[johnnyboy8102]

Now it says 8/139

 

[Sup_Yo]

7/124 at half now that it is corrected.

8/139

 

[donkshow]

Not bad.

 

[MAC_32]

Very reminiscent of the Ogletree breakout - coverage rolls elsewhere, QB takes advantage of mismatch. Liked what I saw from Ramses tonight and was much more consistent than I've read he is, supposedly big issue, lets see him do it again.

 

[flc735]

i got a redzone fade target. i think thats significant

 

[ISUDESTROYERS]

How much is he worth on the Waiver in a PPR League with $1000 waiver budget for everyone at the start of the season?



Thoughts?

 

[netnalp]

Good to see Barden prove me wrong.

 

[Avery]

Very reminiscent of the Ogletree breakout - coverage rolls elsewhere, QB takes advantage of mismatch. Liked what I saw from Ramses tonight and was much more consistent than I've read he is, supposedly big issue, lets see him do it again.

Seems very little like Ogletree except that Barden will likely not repeat the performance, without repeated injury to Nicks or Cruz.Ogletree was the third WR who made his hay on pretty much one route, the slant, against the third DB.Barden was the starter who did well with a variety of routes.Honestly, I don't see many similarities here.

 

[Bri]

Huge night for the Giants brass for sticking with Brown(and bringing him back) and Barden all these years.

Good luck ranking em' next week

 

[Bri]

How much is he worth on the Waiver in a PPR League with $1000 waiver budget for everyone at the start of the season?



Thoughts?

Gut callNothing in his career shows you should spend anything on him but ya gotta risk it in FF sometimes when you see a spark.

If I had a deep team that was weak at WR and I wasn't going to be spending all that WW $ because I only lacked a WR, I'd throw 150-200 at Barden.

I'm not sure a poor team can risk that much $ if he just becomes a red zone target when Nicks returns

ETA if not redraft, but dynasty-

he's the flavor of the week for sure and too great measurables to not spend a lot on him in dynasty. It doesn't seem the wait to develop, wait til he gets PT, will be too much longer now