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Ran a 10k in June (2 Viewers)

When you guys are running your tempo runs, are you trying to run approximately the same route each time so you can judge the results against your previous efforts?

I know in my neighborhood, I have a lot of inclines and declines, so it's hard to work in a really long stretch where I'm on flat ground. So I know my heart rates relative to pace will change dramatically depending on if I am going flat, up, or down.

I'm worried if I run a tempo run this week and the route is different, I may see drastically different results of my HR relative to my pace if I just happen to be heading uphill when I'm running that portion of the tempo run.

The last time I ran it, I was on relatively flat ground at the point where I was hitting my higher heart rate and holding it for a few minutes before I ramped it back down for the rest of the way home. How do you guys typically do it?
Stop thinking so much! :) I seem to remember you stressing about the little things when you tried training by HR and spun yourself right out of it. Just do your thing and collect the data. I don't care what you do, your HR is going up when running hills. Don't get too wrapped up in nailing things perfectly. The Higdon tempo is more a fartlek run than a tempo run IIRC, so I wouldn't sweat it much. His race pace runs are more of a true tempo. :nerd: I think most of us equate the tempo run to the Pfitz tempo run which is usually 8-12mi with 4-7 of those being at 15K to HM race pace. I've long said that besides racing, these tempo runs are your best gauge of fitness. I always run my tempo runs on the same route just so I can compare them over time.

 
When I run my tempos outside, I often run them at a nearby park which is relatively flat. It's a 1.2 mile loop so that also helps not to be running into the wind for too long.

Really, though, you should be more concerned with a relatively consistent effort and heart rate than the pace. Thus, anticipate slowing on the uphills. I know this is easier said than done.
this, at least for me. I know for some of you it's more about dialing in a pace on tempo runs, but I'm all about HR or PrE because I tend to do my tempos on hilly trails. In fact about the only tempo run I do isn't very fast, but it's a steady 1.7 mile climb so the HR is in the zone I want it (around 165) and I don't worry about the pace. That being said, I do like running that one every week now so that I can track progress.
and this is why I rarely, if ever, have pace showing on my watch. PE is what I struggle with - I can go uphill with the same PE and my HR will spike 5-10 bpm.

I care about pace, only at the end of the run. I might look at it on the lap (the TomTom displays your pace every lap for 3-5 seconds) but it's virtually irrelevant.

ETA: I have a few go-to routes but I like variety. Helps that we don't really have monster hills here, some rolling hills but nothing Duck-worthy.
I actually don't have pace showing on the watch at all. I'm running strictly by HR.

When you guys are running your tempo runs, are you trying to run approximately the same route each time so you can judge the results against your previous efforts?

I know in my neighborhood, I have a lot of inclines and declines, so it's hard to work in a really long stretch where I'm on flat ground. So I know my heart rates relative to pace will change dramatically depending on if I am going flat, up, or down.

I'm worried if I run a tempo run this week and the route is different, I may see drastically different results of my HR relative to my pace if I just happen to be heading uphill when I'm running that portion of the tempo run.

The last time I ran it, I was on relatively flat ground at the point where I was hitting my higher heart rate and holding it for a few minutes before I ramped it back down for the rest of the way home. How do you guys typically do it?
Stop thinking so much! :) I seem to remember you stressing about the little things when you tried training by HR and spun yourself right out of it. Just do your thing and collect the data. I don't care what you do, your HR is going up when running hills. Don't get too wrapped up in nailing things perfectly.The Higdon tempo is more a fartlek run than a tempo run IIRC, so I wouldn't sweat it much. His race pace runs are more of a true tempo. :nerd: I think most of us equate the tempo run to the Pfitz tempo run which is usually 8-12mi with 4-7 of those being at 15K to HM race pace. I've long said that besides racing, these tempo runs are your best gauge of fitness. I always run my tempo runs on the same route just so I can compare them over time.
:lol:

Honestly, the only reason I asked was so I could report info on here once a week in a way so the data was something I could measure against. The best thing about committing to this is for once I'm NOT thinking. Going by heart rate only and pace ends up where it ends up.

 
Chief, you stress over the impact of hills on HR/tempo pace. I stress over heat. The difference for me beween a run in 70 degrees and humid and 40 degrees and dry is enormous. Sometimes you can't compare the results.

My calf is still not right. Going on two weeks with essentially no running except for two very brief tests. I doubt I will be able to run the marathon in March.

Crap, half my posts on here are about an injury. Hope everybody is doing well.

 
Got back to the 40 mpw level this past week after work and vacation threw me off a few weeks.

Capped off by 10 on Sunday with avg 7:07 pace with a little tempoish run during the long run - Mile 6-9 were 6:57, 6:53, 6:37, 6:31 - a little 26:58 4 mile within a 10 miler. I'm feeling close to rolling some good 10K-HM times this spring.

 
Lehigh98 said:
Looks like the HR strap on my 7 year old Garmin 305 finally died on me. Decided to look and see what new watches are out there nowadays. Would use for running and biking. Might wait a month or so for the Garmin Vivoactive to come out. What are you guys using and what would you buy if you were in the market?
The growing trend here is for the strapless HR monitoring, but I'm not there yet, so I'll let others give you the rundown.

 
Pretty nice run for me this evening. I was going to run a tempo at the gym but when I got there I realized I forgot my underwear and wasn't going to run in boxers. When I got home I didn't feel like driving back so I braved the temps in the 20s (yeah, I know) and ran around the neighborhood. After a warm up mile I ran a 6:19 then decided I'd pick it up and ran a 6:07 and a 6:03. Finished off a 5K with a 19:07. The good thing about this is I certainly felt like I wasn't putting in a race effort. Also HR averaged only 163 those last two miles with a max of 167. IIRC, I usually race 5Ks in the 170s.

I'd really like to race soon but there aren't any close 5K this time of year. I'll probably have to wait until March.

 
Pretty nice run for me this evening. I was going to run a tempo at the gym but when I got there I realized I forgot my underwear and wasn't going to run in boxers. When I got home I didn't feel like driving back so I braved the temps in the 20s (yeah, I know) and ran around the neighborhood. After a warm up mile I ran a 6:19 then decided I'd pick it up and ran a 6:07 and a 6:03. Finished off a 5K with a 19:07. The good thing about this is I certainly felt like I wasn't putting in a race effort. Also HR averaged only 163 those last two miles with a max of 167. IIRC, I usually race 5Ks in the 170s.

I'd really like to race soon but there aren't any close 5K this time of year. I'll probably have to wait until March.
Nice job.

It's funny, I had 6x400 tonight at 5k pace. So I ran it based on the HR Ned laid out for me. Thought I was gonna die. Lol. Haven't looked at the data to see what my actual pace was.

 
When you guys are running your tempo runs, are you trying to run approximately the same route each time so you can judge the results against your previous efforts?

I know in my neighborhood, I have a lot of inclines and declines, so it's hard to work in a really long stretch where I'm on flat ground. So I know my heart rates relative to pace will change dramatically depending on if I am going flat, up, or down.

I'm worried if I run a tempo run this week and the route is different, I may see drastically different results of my HR relative to my pace if I just happen to be heading uphill when I'm running that portion of the tempo run.

The last time I ran it, I was on relatively flat ground at the point where I was hitting my higher heart rate and holding it for a few minutes before I ramped it back down for the rest of the way home. How do you guys typically do it?
Stop thinking so much! :) I seem to remember you stressing about the little things when you tried training by HR and spun yourself right out of it. Just do your thing and collect the data. I don't care what you do, your HR is going up when running hills. Don't get too wrapped up in nailing things perfectly.The Higdon tempo is more a fartlek run than a tempo run IIRC, so I wouldn't sweat it much. His race pace runs are more of a true tempo. :nerd: I think most of us equate the tempo run to the Pfitz tempo run which is usually 8-12mi with 4-7 of those being at 15K to HM race pace. I've long said that besides racing, these tempo runs are your best gauge of fitness. I always run my tempo runs on the same route just so I can compare them over time.
I agree with Ned, you don't need to stress about the little things, just want to put in the effort and let your fitness build from session to session. Once every month or two I'll do a 5-6 mile tempo on my treadmill though (usually somewhat due to weather) so I can compare efforts. Otherwise I try to switch things up a little bit to give myself a slightly different type of stimulus. (my tempo sessions can range from a straight 5-8 mile run, 2x3mi, 3-4x2mi, etc...)

 
2015 Houston Marathon -

12 times before today I have toed the starting line of a marathon, 12 times I dreamed of running a perfect race where I come through the halfway point feeling great before putting my foot down on the gas pedal and closing the race with a strong negative split the second half. All 12 times I was served humble pie, sometimes a small gentle slice tempered with a side of the sweet taste of victory, and sometimes I got served an extra large helping (or the entire pie). A quick history of my marathons below:

2006 Chicago Marathon - 3:07:47 (1:26:33 / 1:41:14) - 1493rd overall - 1316th male
2009 Flying Pig Marathon - 3:05:26 (1:21:43 / 1:43:43) - 67th overall - 64th male
2009 Foot Traffic Flat Marathon -2:52:29 (1:25:14 / 1:27:15) - 7th overall - 6th male
2010 Boston Marathon - 2:46:31 (1:16:54 / 1:29:37) - 381st overall - 352nd male
2011 Portland Marathon - 2:42:49 (1:17:40 / 1:25:09) - 15th overall
2012 Rock n' Roll Arizona Marathon - 2:37:22 (1:15:57 / 1:21:25) - 15th overall
2012 Omaha Marathon - 2:37:26 (1:16:26 / 1:21:00) - 1st overall
2012 Rock n' Roll Las Vegas Marathon - DNF - (dropped out at 16 miles, sick)
2013 Boston Marathon - 2:54:31 (1:17:19 / 1:37:12) - 1198th overall - 1131st male
2014 Rock n' Roll New Orleans Marathon -2:28:43 (1:13:15 / 1:15:28) - 3rd overall
2014 Boston Marathon - 2:30:32 (1:13:40 / 1:16:52) -102nd overall / 90th male
2014 Air Force Marathon - 2:28:15 (1:12:59 - 1:15:16) - 1st overall
2015 Houston Marathon ???

What would lucky #13 have in store for me?
_______________________________________________________________

My wife and I got to Houston late on Friday and after realizing everything is pretty much closed in town we grabbed some dinner from the deli across the street and then went to sleep.

The next day I ran the 5K with my wife as my shakeout run. I don't want to brag about my pace job, but let's just say despite not getting a GPS signal in time due to being downtown and with all the buildings around I hit her goal pace for the first 2 miles within a second at each mile marker. Afterwards, we pretty much relaxed the whole day and I met up with a couple of friends I in the afternoon before my 2nd lunch. (or 1st dinner?). It's always fun to meet other similar-minded runners and chat about running Shortly after a second dinner and lounging around some more I went to sleep around 9 or 10.

Unlike almost every marathon before this, I actually managed to sleep a decent amount the night before. (I don't think I slept more than 4-5 hours before my last 4 marathons, but this time I slept for a good 6-7 hours). I got up a little bit before 5, got my stuff ready (well, most of it was ready the night before), used the bathroom, ate a banana, and then headed out around 6 since I had to be in the subelite corral by 6:30.

When I got into the corral, there were about 20-25 of us in there and we had about a block of the street about 200 meters away from the start line blocked off for us to warm up in as well as 6 porta potties for us. It sure beat having to share about 30-40 with 5000 other people in corral A last year!

I warmed up for half a mile, then switched into my racing flats and used the bathroom one more time before jogging another couple of minutes. Then they brought us up to the start line so we could line up right behind the elites. I found my friend Jon a minute before the race started and quickly wished him good luck before lining up right behind him. Someone right behind me shouted "Go Steve Chu!" about 10 seconds before the gun started, which made me laugh and relax a little. (I was guessing it was my friend Chris, and he confirmed it after the race when we went out and grabbed brunch)

The gun goes off and unlike the last 3-4 marathons I ran where it took 2-3 miles to loosen up the early pace felt like a joke. About a quarter mile into the race I feel like I am jogging but I was 2 steps behind Jon and the 2:18 pack and knew I better back off. A couple of minutes later some half-marathoners catch up to me and I figure I would just sit on these guys for awhile before the half and full marathon course splits at 7 miles. These guys were all wearing the Skechers racing team outfit so I figured they could hold 5:25 pace no problem, apparently not. They would surge to get in front of me and then slow down the pace to about 5:30-5:35s, and then I would feel like they were running too slow and pick the pace back up again. Then they would surge and slow the pace down again. Finally around 6 miles or so I had enough of this and threw in a quick mile to try to get some separation, mistake #1.

First 7 mile splits: 5:30, 5:27, 5:22, 5:26, 5:26, 5:20, 5:23.

Shortly after mile 7 the course for the half and full marathons split and I am all by myself for a few minutes. Then one of the weirdest things that ever happened to me in a marathon occurred, I hit a bad patch before mile 8. This was the earliest I have ever felt terrible in a marathon since my 2nd. A few minutes a pack of about 5-6 guys caught me and I momentarily debated dropping out, but they weren't pulling away that quick so I changed my mind and decided to try to latch on and see if I can at least salvage a small PR. I wasn't happy to see my mile splits in the 5:30s for the next few miles since I was doing my marathon pace/(effort) workouts at 6000+ feet altitude at that pace for the last few weeks, but I was hanging in there hoping that I would snap out of it or at least can hold that pace and maybe finish with a 2:25-2:26.

Miles 8-13: 5:32, 5:37, 5:34, 5:36, 5:34, 5:40. (halfway = 71:55).

I saw Jon at the halfway point where there was an out-and-back section and was a little worried about him because I thought he was around 1:10 at halfway. (little did I know that not was he about 30 seconds faster than my estimate at the half, but he was an ace at negative splitting and would run the 2nd half of his race a minute faster than the first to come within 12 seconds of his goal). Shortly after we turned around my worries turned to myself as I saw the lead vehicle for the women on the other side of the road about a minute behind us. One of the guys in the pack asked what everyone was shooting for and I quipped that I am just trying to make sure that truck (and the accompanying female runners) doesn't catch me in the next 13.1 miles.

Shortly after we went up the biggest hill on the entire course, an overpass. We covered this mile in 5:29, and the fact that we did it with a significant hill buoyed my spirit quite a bit and I found myself coming out of the bad patch. My thinking shifted from hanging on for a 2:25-2:26 to maybe running a negative split for a 2:23-high finish. Over the next few miles I started feeling pretty good but was still trying to be smart. Finally around 16 I felt like I was feeling stronger than most others in my pack so I moved to the front to do some more of the work. At this point our pack was down to about 5, with 2 others sharing / trading off the lead with me and 2 others hanging on as we slowly dropped the pace down.

Miles 13-20: 5:29, 5:26, 5:32, 5:26, 5:28, 5:27, 5:23.

When we hit the 20 mile mark in 1:49:40, I did some quick math in my head and knew I had to average about 5:20-5:22 or faster the last 10K to break 2:23. I decided to kick up the pace a little and see how my body would respond. Miles 21 and 22 were covered in 5:23 and 5:26, so at this point I thought 2:22:xx was out the window. However, I also began pulling away from the group I had been running with and as I rounded the next turn I was able to get a glimpse of a figure about 200-300 meters ahead of me. It took me a second to recognize him, but there was no mistaking the runner with long flowing hair and form, it was ultra running stud and former Olympic marathon trials qualifier Michael Wardian. My focus shifted from gunning for a time to collecting the scalp of a runner I have a tremendous amount of respect for and looked up to for the past few years.

Shortly after 23 miles, with about 5K to go, a thought crossed my mind that I was finally RACING a marathon, not surviving it at this point. I was running as hard as I can, breathing hard and having the legs to handle the pounding and match my cardiovascular efforts unlike in the past where I would have completely controlled breathing and equally completely trashed legs at this point, the 140-150 mile weeks I ran in December has finally prepared my body for the 2+ hours of pounding on the pavement a marathon demanded!

Shortly before mile 25 I finally catch Michael, and uttered a quick "come on Mike, almost there". I knew he wasn't having a good day, and probably raced a marathon or two the previous weekend, but I sure wasn't going to let up and give up my chance to finish ahead of one of the top ultra runners in the world.

Miles 20-25: 5:23, 5:26, 5:26, 5:17, 5:22.

At 25 miles I saw the clock read around 2:16:30-2:16:35, and a little bit more quick math tells me 5:20 pace for the last 1.22 miles would put me right around 2:23:00-2:23:05. While a 2:23 would be a significant PR, running 2:Anything:01 would piss me off to no end. I tap into my last gear, but careful not to overdo it and cause my legs to cramp. Just like a year ago, I was running down the streets of downtown Houston passing a tons of other runners from other races. (last year I was chasing down the women in the USA half marathon championships that had a head start, this year I was blowing by 2:20-2:25 half marathoners). Finally I hit the 26th mile marker and hit my watch and could not believe my eyes - 5:00.7!!! I had about 80-85 to cover the last quarter mile but I also saw a runner in a Saucony singlet so I give it everything I had to try to run him down. Alas, I ran out of real estate and finished 6 seconds behind that runner. Final time - 2:22:43! With a 1:10:48 2nd half and my first negative split marathon race!

I quickly shuffled my way through the finishers area and grabbed my shirt as well as the finishers glass that all marathon runners received. The best part of this experience was some old guy that was volunteering for the race yelled at another volunteer for handing me the glass "He doesn't get one! That's for full marathoners only!" and I just pointed at my bib to him, and he responded by looking down at his watch. After I got out onto the streets I jogged the quarter mile or so back to my hotel and got back to the room to a dozen congratulatory text messages from friends and family.

Out of the 13 marathons I have run I think this is the first one I would rate an "A". I still don't think I raced up to my fitness level, but this was the first time I have come within a minute of my pre race goal and most importantly this race was a great lesson in adjusting my expectations during the race and hanging in there through a bad patch while not being (too) effected by negative thoughts during the bad times.

Next up, a summary of my past training cycle as I have promised a few people. Hopefully in the next 2-3 days, or by the end of the week at the latest.

 
SteveC702 said:
2015 Houston Marathon -

Shortly before mile 25 I finally catch Michael, and uttered a quick "come on Mike, almost there". I knew he wasn't having a good day, and probably raced a marathon or two the previous weekend, but I sure wasn't going to let up and give up my chance to finish ahead of one of the top ultra runners in the world.
Awesome! 8th American in a big race, amazing. Great race, great report. Such a beastly effort!

And to beat Wardian....impressive. For those of you that aren't familiar, he's one of the most prolific racers across multiple distances out there. Good interview from last week on irunfar.com: "In fact, last year when he turned 40 years old and became a masters runner, he finished over 40 races—54 to be exact—and finished top 10 in all but 10 of them. He capped off his 2014 campaign by resetting his own indoor track 50k world record."

 
Wow, Steve.........just wow. You absolutely demolished that final 10K. :shock:

:lol: :headbang: "I still don't think I raced up to my fitness level, "

 
That's probably something that could have been left out, and somewhat arguable. I think everyone who has run a good breakthrough race always feel like they could have run faster, but I made a few mistakes here and there that I think may have cost me some time. Also, despite the fact that I feel like I am at the point where negative splitting is the correct strategy I think doing so by over a minute (with most of it coming in the last 4-6 miles) showed I could have pushed the pace a bit earlier. However, a few more things would have had to go right for me to run sub-2:22 last Sunday, such as if there was a pack that came through the half in about 71:15-71:30 and I held back a bit more earlier. Then again, I thought I WAS in 2:21-2:22 shape with a small shot at a sub-2:20 so I had to take a small chance earlier on to see how low-5:20s (2:20 pace) felt early on and if that was a pace I could sustain for another 2+ hours.

 
SteveC702 said:
2015 Houston Marathon -

Shortly before mile 25 I finally catch Michael, and uttered a quick "come on Mike, almost there". I knew he wasn't having a good day, and probably raced a marathon or two the previous weekend, but I sure wasn't going to let up and give up my chance to finish ahead of one of the top ultra runners in the world.
Awesome! 8th American in a big race, amazing. Great race, great report. Such a beastly effort!

And to beat Wardian....impressive. For those of you that aren't familiar, he's one of the most prolific racers across multiple distances out there. Good interview from last week on irunfar.com: "In fact, last year when he turned 40 years old and became a masters runner, he finished over 40 races—54 to be exact—and finished top 10 in all but 10 of them. He capped off his 2014 campaign by resetting his own indoor track 50k world record."
He was a silver medalist at the world 100K championships a few years ago (the same race Max King won last year), but I guess my connection to him was a bit earlier than that since he hit every race in MD/VA/DC in the early 2000s and he whopped one of my good friends at local 5Ks almost every weekend when we were still living on the east coast. (I was still hurt during that period so I actually don't think I have ever raced him until 2 years ago).

To be fair, I DID get to race him at Houston 6 weeks after he did the North Face 50 / CIM Marathon double so that's probably as fresh a MIchael Wardian as I'll ever get to race probably.

 
That's probably something that could have been left out, and somewhat arguable. I think everyone who has run a good breakthrough race always feel like they could have run faster, but I made a few mistakes here and there.
You didn't punch that old guy who thought you ran the half marathon?

 
That's probably something that could have been left out, and somewhat arguable. I think everyone who has run a good breakthrough race always feel like they could have run faster, but I made a few mistakes here and there that I think may have cost me some time. Also, despite the fact that I feel like I am at the point where negative splitting is the correct strategy I think doing so by over a minute (with most of it coming in the last 4-6 miles) showed I could have pushed the pace a bit earlier. However, a few more things would have had to go right for me to run sub-2:22 last Sunday, such as if there was a pack that came through the half in about 71:15-71:30 and I held back a bit more earlier. Then again, I thought I WAS in 2:21-2:22 shape with a small shot at a sub-2:20 so I had to take a small chance earlier on to see how low-5:20s (2:20 pace) felt early on and if that was a pace I could sustain for another 2+ hours.
Oh no, I completely understand and am glad you're being honest. It's just amazing to see a 2:22 marathoner say something like that. Blows my mind!!

Tell us how you feel, don't tell us what you think we want to hear...

 
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Looks like the HR strap on my 7 year old Garmin 305 finally died on me. Decided to look and see what new watches are out there nowadays. Would use for running and biking. Might wait a month or so for the Garmin Vivoactive to come out. What are you guys using and what would you buy if you were in the market?
My 305 battery is about toast. I may just follow some of the videos out there and try replacing it...but have been looking at that new Garmin too.

Just like all the stuff it can do besides just be a running watch (pair with my phone...turn GPS off and just be a watch...the golf function too).

Also looked at the Samsung stuff to pair with my S5...but I don't run with my phone ever (not sure if I need to with some of the watches).

And the TomTom that seems to get good reviews on here too.

 
Juxtatarot said:
Pretty nice run for me this evening. I was going to run a tempo at the gym but when I got there I realized I forgot my underwear and wasn't going to run in boxers. When I got home I didn't feel like driving back so I braved the temps in the 20s (yeah, I know) and ran around the neighborhood. After a warm up mile I ran a 6:19 then decided I'd pick it up and ran a 6:07 and a 6:03. Finished off a 5K with a 19:07. The good thing about this is I certainly felt like I wasn't putting in a race effort. Also HR averaged only 163 those last two miles with a max of 167. IIRC, I usually race 5Ks in the 170s.

I'd really like to race soon but there aren't any close 5K this time of year. I'll probably have to wait until March.
I'm coming to the dark side - bought a treadmill because of the blizzard (and then it didn't snow). It's nice to have this option and even nicer to run with no shirt on! Mentally though, its a tough nut to crack. 4mi yesterday felt like 10. :loco:

That HR diff is massive.... You've got sub 18 written all over you.... :whistle:

 
Juxtatarot said:
Pretty nice run for me this evening. I was going to run a tempo at the gym but when I got there I realized I forgot my underwear and wasn't going to run in boxers. When I got home I didn't feel like driving back so I braved the temps in the 20s (yeah, I know) and ran around the neighborhood. After a warm up mile I ran a 6:19 then decided I'd pick it up and ran a 6:07 and a 6:03. Finished off a 5K with a 19:07. The good thing about this is I certainly felt like I wasn't putting in a race effort. Also HR averaged only 163 those last two miles with a max of 167. IIRC, I usually race 5Ks in the 170s.

I'd really like to race soon but there aren't any close 5K this time of year. I'll probably have to wait until March.
I'm coming to the dark side - bought a treadmill because of the blizzard (and then it didn't snow). It's nice to have this option and even nicer to run with no shirt on! Mentally though, its a tough nut to crack. 4mi yesterday felt like 10. :loco:

That HR diff is massive.... You've got sub 18 written all over you.... :whistle:
A treadmill at home would be tough. I guess you have to focus on music or TV. At least at the gym I can get some motivation from pretending that I'm impressing the pretty girls!

 
Certain parts of your race report are unfathomable to me Steve. Like the part about jogging back to the hotel.

Awesome. Wish I had been there. Congrats again.

 
Great report Steve!

I'm in Week 8 of my marathon plan and feeling pretty good about where I'm at. IT band has calmed down thanks largely to the two months of PT and some strengthening exercises I've worked in to my routine. Still have some inner knee pain but I've been wearing a neoprene sleeve that's been working great, holds everything together and keeps the kneecap tracking properly. Tempted to wear it all the time as the knee hurts most now when I'm not running/wearing it...

One of the benefits of running with the MGH team is getting some direction from our trainer. He's always available to call or email with questions or to bounce ideas off, and also sends an email at the beginning of each week. Here's part of what he sent on Monday, as the forecast here in Boston was for tons of snow. I particularly like his comments around mental preparation and feeling like he sometimes has "five bodies" on long runs:

Here we are at the start of week 8! This is one of my most favorite parts of the program. We begin to challenge ourselves with true long runs: 13, 16, and up.

Looks like we also have some messy weather coming our way too. Look on the bright side: we got some practice in the snow on Saturday. I’m often asked how to approach the slippery streets. Here are 3 options:

1) Don’t. Run on the treadmill, it’s a good sub.
2) Use it as a running form exercise. When the ground is slick, your foot strike needs to be on point - whole foot, up tempo cadence, good posture. This is my favorite approach. Take it slow if needed. Be careful.
3) Get some Yak Trax (Pro version) or a go DIY with this tip from Runner’s World: http://t.co/r3Pzz7KUWV

Be smart out there this week.

Hopefully, you took advantage of the recovery week last week. As the miles march back up, I want you to take this week to use the power of your mind. Our physical body does all of the running, yes, I know. However, the way that we mentally prepare ourselves for the task makes a HUGE difference in how we feel. So this week, whether you are running 13 or 16, remind yourself of the following in the days leading up to the long run:

This is going to be hard.
I will be running for a long time.
The body with which I start is not the body with which I finish.
I am prepared for this.

When I start a long run, I tell myself these things because over the course of the run, my body warms up, aches come and go, tightness moves around, energy wavers, I feel fast, I feel slow, I feel strong, I feel unprepared, I get hungry (I fuel up - water/GU), I finish, I stretch. This is all normal. I feel as though I have 5 different bodies sometimes over the course of 16-20 miler. Learn to find comfort in these changes.

You're getting stronger.
Your next long run will be better and more familiar.

Most importantly always: listen to your body. If something really hurts and doesn't change or evolve over your run or over a day or two - STOP. Pull back on the training. We'll work on changes to the program together.
 
Interval training today:

30 seconds running

4:30 walking

Repeat 6 times
It's a start to your recovery!

Nigel, I use the 3/8" hex screws trick ...it works well. I'll need 'em now since Chicago had some overnight icing on the sidewalks and now it's getting colder with some snow coming - I hate the hidden ice.

 
Pretty nice run for me this evening. I was going to run a tempo at the gym but when I got there I realized I forgot my underwear and wasn't going to run in boxers. When I got home I didn't feel like driving back so I braved the temps in the 20s (yeah, I know) and ran around the neighborhood. After a warm up mile I ran a 6:19 then decided I'd pick it up and ran a 6:07 and a 6:03. Finished off a 5K with a 19:07. The good thing about this is I certainly felt like I wasn't putting in a race effort. Also HR averaged only 163 those last two miles with a max of 167. IIRC, I usually race 5Ks in the 170s.

I'd really like to race soon but there aren't any close 5K this time of year. I'll probably have to wait until March.
I'm coming to the dark side - bought a treadmill because of the blizzard (and then it didn't snow). It's nice to have this option and even nicer to run with no shirt on! Mentally though, its a tough nut to crack. 4mi yesterday felt like 10. :loco:

That HR diff is massive.... You've got sub 18 written all over you.... :whistle:
A treadmill at home would be tough. I guess you have to focus on music or TV. At least at the gym I can get some motivation from pretending that I'm impressing the pretty girls!
it's funny, I hate the treadmill no matter where it is, though we do have an elliptical I'll use if it's just nasty outside and I don't want to jump on my bike trainer. But I actually enjoy using the bike trainer - probably because sufferfest makes it fun.

Schedule today won't allow for a run but I jumped on the trainer this morning for 24 minutes of light intervals. Not sure whether to rest or go really light tomorrow, maybe just a slow jog.

 
This was... fun?

30 day plank challenge
who's with me for another round this winter?

I'll probably start Sunday.

Modified:

1 [SIZE=medium]35[/SIZE]

[SIZE=medium]2[/SIZE] [SIZE=medium]40[/SIZE]

[SIZE=medium]3[/SIZE] 45

4 REST

5 55

6 60

7 65

8 REST

9 75

10 80

11 85

12 REST

13 95

14 100

15 105

16 REST

17 115

18 120

19 125

20 REST

21 135

22 140

23 145

24 REST

25 155

26 160

27 165

28 REST

29 175

30 180
I've been doing a 30 day plank challenge followng a simple app. I'm on day 22 and it's at 210 seconds and will peak at 300 seconds on day 30. I made it to 180 seconds yesterday and today was the first day I had to crap out... couldn't make it to 210. Now searching the thread, it's interesting that your program peaked at 180. Doing 180 is not easy at all.

 
This was... fun?

30 day plank challenge
who's with me for another round this winter?

I'll probably start Sunday.

Modified:

1 [SIZE=medium]35[/SIZE]

[SIZE=medium]2[/SIZE] [SIZE=medium]40[/SIZE]

[SIZE=medium]3[/SIZE] 45

4 REST

5 55

6 60

7 65

8 REST

9 75

10 80

11 85

12 REST

13 95

14 100

15 105

16 REST

17 115

18 120

19 125

20 REST

21 135

22 140

23 145

24 REST

25 155

26 160

27 165

28 REST

29 175

30 180
I've been doing a 30 day plank challenge followng a simple app. I'm on day 22 and it's at 210 seconds and will peak at 300 seconds on day 30. I made it to 180 seconds yesterday and today was the first day I had to crap out... couldn't make it to 210. Now searching the thread, it's interesting that your program peaked at 180. Doing 180 is not easy at all.
I crapped out on this. But I have been doing planks for 2-3 minutes after runs 3x / week.

 
This was... fun?

30 day plank challenge
who's with me for another round this winter?

I'll probably start Sunday.

Modified:

1 [SIZE=medium]35[/SIZE]

[SIZE=medium]2[/SIZE] [SIZE=medium]40[/SIZE]

[SIZE=medium]3[/SIZE] 45

4 REST

5 55

6 60

7 65

8 REST

9 75

10 80

11 85

12 REST

13 95

14 100

15 105

16 REST

17 115

18 120

19 125

20 REST

21 135

22 140

23 145

24 REST

25 155

26 160

27 165

28 REST

29 175

30 180
I've been doing a 30 day plank challenge followng a simple app. I'm on day 22 and it's at 210 seconds and will peak at 300 seconds on day 30. I made it to 180 seconds yesterday and today was the first day I had to crap out... couldn't make it to 210. Now searching the thread, it's interesting that your program peaked at 180. Doing 180 is not easy at all.
We started doing this at work. Today is day 24, so we are at the first day of 210. I've been hanging ok at 180, but damn it's hard. Kills my lower back.

 
We started doing this at work. Today is day 24, so we are at the first day of 210. I've been hanging ok at 180, but damn it's hard. Kills my lower back.
the toughest part is keeping good form. be sure to watch others, understand young females have the hardest time keeping good form.

 
We started doing this at work. Today is day 24, so we are at the first day of 210. I've been hanging ok at 180, but damn it's hard. Kills my lower back.
the toughest part is keeping good form. be sure to watch others, understand young females have the hardest time keeping good form.
Yes, I am blessed my office has several ladies in their 20's who like to wear loose shirts every day.

 
We started doing this at work. Today is day 24, so we are at the first day of 210. I've been hanging ok at 180, but damn it's hard. Kills my lower back.
the toughest part is keeping good form. be sure to watch others, understand young females have the hardest time keeping good form.
Yes, I am blessed my office has several ladies in their 20's who like to wear loose shirts every day.
I chose the wrong profession.

 
Ned said:
ChiefD said:
FUBAR said:
ChiefD said:
We started doing this at work. Today is day 24, so we are at the first day of 210. I've been hanging ok at 180, but damn it's hard. Kills my lower back.
the toughest part is keeping good form. be sure to watch others, understand young females have the hardest time keeping good form.
Yes, I am blessed my office has several ladies in their 20's who like to wear loose shirts every day.
I chose the wrong profession.
Seriously....it's not often I'm bummed that I work from home.

 
If anyone likes Mizuno wave runners, Amazon is having a great sale on a pair I just ordered:

http://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B00CSI03I6/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
That's the shoe I wear. Thanks for the link.

You know who else sells this one on clearance from time to time is Academy Sports. I don't know if they have one in your area, but I've seen them advertised for $59.99. My local running store always seems to have a pair of these in my size at the runners expos before a big race. I've picked them up for $49 before.

Edit to add: Here's a link. Looks like they are on sale as we speak.

If you're interested, let me know your size and I can be on the lookout here and just ship 'em to you.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
I know to most of you not steeped in following the ultra world this won't mean a lot, but I had a really cool opportunity last night. My friend Erika, who paced me in my first 50 miler two years ago, has been dating the Publisher of Ultrarunning Magazine for several years now. I've gotten to know Karl a bit and consider him a mentor and friend as well. He's turning 50, so she put out the word to a few people asking them to record a happy birthday video clip that she would put together and give to him in a longer video. So I recorded a quick 15 second clip during my long run last weekend and sent it to her.

She set up the surprise as a showing at the local running shop of the The Long Haul, a movie about Hal Koerner and Mike Wolfe's FKT on the John Muir Trail. So about forty people settle in including Karl, and instead of The Long Haul, Erika's video comes on. It started off with Dean Karnazes sitting fireside talking about sending Karl an AARP card (Dean was there last night). It then rolled through a series of clips including Gordy Ainsleigh (WS100 original) singing in the shower; Steve's buddy Mike Wardian talking about getting dropped by Karl at WS100 one year; other ultra elites like Meghan Arbogast, Dave Mackey, and Brett Rivers; the Race Directors of WS100 and Hurt 100; and a few "regular folks" including me!

Afterward they brought out a bunch of pizza and beers and we hung out for about an hour talking with people about upcoming races, how many 100s we ran last year, training, etc. Pretty fun experience for me.

 
If anyone likes Mizuno wave runners, Amazon is having a great sale on a pair I just ordered:

http://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B00CSI03I6/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
That's the shoe I wear. Thanks for the link.

You know who else sells this one on clearance from time to time is Academy Sports. I don't know if they have one in your area, but I've seen them advertised for $59.99. My local running store always seems to have a pair of these in my size at the runners expos before a big race. I've picked them up for $49 before.

Edit to add: Here's a link. Looks like they are on sale as we speak.

If you're interested, let me know your size and I can be on the lookout here and just ship 'em to you.
I couldn't pass on the $29.99 price.

Now I have a few pairs of shoes to rotate through. These will be my weekend warriors.

 
I know to most of you not steeped in following the ultra world this won't mean a lot, but I had a really cool opportunity last night. My friend Erika, who paced me in my first 50 miler two years ago, has been dating the Publisher of Ultrarunning Magazine for several years now. I've gotten to know Karl a bit and consider him a mentor and friend as well. He's turning 50, so she put out the word to a few people asking them to record a happy birthday video clip that she would put together and give to him in a longer video. So I recorded a quick 15 second clip during my long run last weekend and sent it to her.

She set up the surprise as a showing at the local running shop of the The Long Haul, a movie about Hal Koerner and Mike Wolfe's FKT on the John Muir Trail. So about forty people settle in including Karl, and instead of The Long Haul, Erika's video comes on. It started off with Dean Karnazes sitting fireside talking about sending Karl an AARP card (Dean was there last night). It then rolled through a series of clips including Gordy Ainsleigh (WS100 original) singing in the shower; Steve's buddy Mike Wardian talking about getting dropped by Karl at WS100 one year; other ultra elites like Meghan Arbogast, Dave Mackey, and Brett Rivers; the Race Directors of WS100 and Hurt 100; and a few "regular folks" including me!

Afterward they brought out a bunch of pizza and beers and we hung out for about an hour talking with people about upcoming races, how many 100s we ran last year, training, etc. Pretty fun experience for me.
That's very cool, Duck! Just don't get too much ultra-envy hanging around a crowd like that. It can be a distorted view of one's accomplishments. Remember, to common folk like this FBG group, you're doing a lot of amazing things!

 
That's very cool, Duck! Just don't get too much ultra-envy hanging around a crowd like that. It can be a distorted view of one's accomplishments. Remember, to common folk like this FBG group, you're doing a lot of amazing things!
I totally was getting ultra-envy last night. I was talking to one "normal" guy who is planning eight 100K-100M races this year, to a couple of other people about their experiences at UTMB last year, and to a 60+ year old woman about her 7th Western States. And this dude who in 2014 ran 100Ks on back to back weekends (in identical 13:01 times) along with six hundreds while finishing 18 ultras. It's easy to feel like "damn, I haven't done anything."

But most people in this crowd are super humble and inclusive. Dean Karnazes walks up and says, "Hi, I'm Dean." My friend Tony introduced me to one of his friends saying about me, "this guy also picked a super-tough 100 for his first," and Erika called me "an old veteran now". Now her emphasis was probably on the "old" part, but still....

 
Yesterday I ran the 15 miler leg of a distance series leading up to my marathon in March. The distance series are sorta training races. Originally going in I was going to start easy for the first 3 and then progressively speed up to marathon pace for the last 6. Well, conditions were a nightmare. Wind and temp both in the mid 20's and the course is right off the ocean. I think the cold caused us to start a little quicker than normal (7:29 first mile). I also had a friend pushing the pace a bit so I just tried to hang with him and maintain. Before I knew it we were clicking off 7:05, 7:04, 7:00 etc. Finished in 1:47:12 (7:08 pace). Overall I'm pretty pleased with the result but I've got plenty of work to do before a can maintain a similar pace for another 11.2 miles.

 

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